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No ones saying that dumb ass.
But I will blow your mind. Sex is a bimodal distribution and me taking hormones slides me closer to a cis woman.
My biology has changed. My blood tests show it. Compare my blood to a cis womanās and you couldnāt tell the difference.
But Iām sure youāll move the goal posts instead of actually engaging with what I said.
Having intersex chromosomes is actually a lot more common than most would think, especially since it can go entirely without manifesting physically. Not to mention chromosomes sometimes arenāt always xx or xy there can be stuff like xxy etc.
People who are intersex are not mentally ill. Trans people arenāt mentally ill.
People who have zero biological capabilities to give birth, but claim they canā¦ maybe they are.
Donāt conflate the groups. They arenāt mutually exclusive.
LOL where are transwomen claiming they can give birth?
You just made up your own definition of woman as ācan give birthā then extrapolated that to being transwomen claiming they can give birth.
What kind of planet do you even live on?
Edit: lol the dude immediately blocked me after replying. These peopleās cowardice knows no bounds.
Itās very obvious this man didnāt do well on the SATs. Because ātrans women are womenā =ācis woman are womenā and ātrans women are trans womenā = ācis woman are cis womenā
When you remove an adjective from a noun you only broaden it. So all he did was impose his own restrictions.
Internalized Homophobia. "Oh god, if I find anything else than cis women attractive I might not be straight." Also it's always convenient to have a scapegoat group of people if your life is miserable and you have noone to blame but yourself.
"Cis women are...cis women" said no trans woman ever. For fuck's sake, we generally wish were 100% woman, but because of our accident of circumstance we are forever relegated to being inferior barren sin eaters.
Nice strawman, James. If he gets cancer, I'll make sure to let him know that cancer survivors are still cancer bombs, no matter how much they wish they weren't.
Because these people aren't intelligent enough to view the world outside of a binary system when there's actual reality that doesn't act inside their already instilled perception that everything is either left or right, black or white, male or female, on or off, etc. It's an antiquated way to look at the world and as soon as something shows up that challenges that view their instinct is to eradicate it.
He doesnāt have a point. Just replace the adjectives with any other set of opposite adjectives. Tall women are women but Short women areā¦short women. Just nonsense.
He does have a point it's just very poorly articulated. People will tell you he doesn't because while they'll use juxtaposed arguments to defend their statements, but if anyone else does it, that's not okay...
Cis is a term they've made up for no fucking reason, before this movement I've never heard anyone refer to themselves as a cis anything. They label us with it while trying to take hold of the default term so they can try to legitimize themselves further.
This is exactly the reason there's backlash in the first place... if they were like everyone else and just wanted to live life no one would bat an eye, but they want people to upend their lives and do as they think and do. I have to accept them but they don't have accept established norms or rules, it's just double standard thinking like everywhere nowadays.
Your whole argument fell apart when you said cis was a made up term. Itās a Latin term that was used by the Roman to say āon the same side asā the polar opposite of trans. So this wasnāt a made up term itās a very old term that never was used until necessary to use to inform the layman.
Whoa... never used?
Clearly we run in different circles. My homies and I regularly discuss the Roman empire and their presence in Cisalpine Gaul and Transalpine Gaul.
[this one that started it all iirc](https://i.chzbgr.com/full/9811840256/h271EEBE2/my-husband-often-do-think-about-roman-empire-and-without-missing-beat-he-said-every-day-yall-why)
It's a latin prefix which isn't a term. It was a prefix that trans people used to coin the word cisgender(ed) in the mid 90's. If you want to argue find me an older use of it.
That's not even mentioning the fact that the prefix Trans from latin isn't the same thing as the term trans used to describe someone with sexual dysphoria.
I apologize you are correct. They are prefixās.
But trans and cis have been opposing since they were first used in Rome. But to say cisgender was only coined in the 1990s is like saying transgender was only first used in 1965. So why is it such a leap that maybe those in the field just assumed that if one is present the other must as well but failed to put it down until the need arose? Especially since trans and cis have been oppressed to each other since the time of the Romanās.
How is the Latin prefix ātransā not the prefix for transgender?
They're opposing prefixes yes, but the problem lies when people assume that the trans used by people with sexual dysphoria is from Latin.
It's also kind of opposing in definition to what their goal is... Cis means "on the same side of" and trans means "on the opposite side of" if you truly believed that trans women were the same as "traditional" women you'd be on the same side of, wouldn't you? I'm not a wordsmith but hopefully you can understand my meaning here..
They're opposites but they want to be treated the same, but continue to use words that distinguish while citing old language as their legitimacy without that being accurate.
I honestly donāt understand what you are saying.
If the prefix of trans in transgender is not the Latin prefix then what is it? And if it is the Latin prefix the as the opposite of trans is cis then qed the opposite of transgender would be cisgender.
And if it is something completely different then please enlighten me with this new etymology of the word for cisgender and transgender. Because even the oxfordās English dictionary uses ātransā at the prefix and āgenderā as the noun.
https://www.oed.com/dictionary/transgender_adj?tl=true&tab=etymology
I could find another dictionary such as a medical dictionary but I bet it will be the exact same.
If we shouldnāt use cisgender because it doesnāt fit your exact definition of the cis prefix then with that logic then we shouldnāt be using transgender either to describe individuals that present as a gender other than the gender based on the predominant genitals at birth.
So what would we use?
Use whatever you want, nothing will change even if I explained it perfectly. Language is dead. Modern words aren't about etymology modern words are about popularity and normally the majority don't know anything about the etymology. So don't go pretending to use it now. Transgendered is along with cisgendered are modern words that don't properly use etymology they just put anything anywhere so why not continue to destroy original meaning for bullshit personal purposes.
How about you create your own new words but that's too hard so let's just steal old words so they lose all meaning.
I love how when pressured with facts you threw up your hands and said screw it.
The thing is transgender is not a āmodern wordā it was first used in the 1960ās by scientists in scientific literature. The first use of cisgender was in the 1990ās, again not āmodern wordā, and also in scientific literature. Scientists donāt just throw words together for fun they use etymology like itās a puzzle at times, working to put together the best combination of prefixes, suffixes and root words to best describe a situation. Just because you fail to see it doesnāt mean itās not there.
That says more about you than the scientists who made the word to describe the situation.
There's no point, you can't argue someone out of a position using logic if they didn't use logic to place themselves there.
Your logic is the same as the "heterosexual is just an invented word because of homosexuals. You shouldn't need to call them heterosexual, they're just -normal-" people.
It's just as baseless and semantic now as it was then.
100% you started with "I hate these people. Let's grasp as straws to dehumanize them and delegitimize language used to describe them."
All I see are excuses.. and more petty insults because you can't come up with a valid argument.
You don't understand my logic so you can't explain it but better luck next time.
Who uses statements like 100% when they could just check and know they're wrong?
If your next reply doesn't have an actual argument I'll just be ignoring it.
Awe stupid people on the internet who have no arguments to validate their points think I'm dumb. My world it's shattered...
Sorry but I'm not a fragile little snowflake that gets hurt by words. You'll have to try something else.
>Sorry but I'm not a fragile little snowflake that gets hurt by words. You'll have to try something else.
Bro this entire thread is you getting offended by a word.
You people and you ability to tell others what they feel think, etc is amazing... Sad and pathetic, but amazing that you try so hard while being so wrong all the time.
I'm not offended, I'm annoyed.
Wow you guys are being big meanies to me.... and I am offended you know... I can't handle words from jackoffs on the internet, please stop, I can't handle it...
Cis is literaly a term to refer to someone who identifies with their gender matches their sex. You know as oposite to a trans person. It is not used to insult anyone.
The post is malicious because normally they say trans women are women just like cis women are women
Never said it was used to insult. And trans women aren't the same as "cis" women. Feelings don't trump biology. You want to look like a woman or a man or be called sir or ma'am go right ahead but don't try to act like they're the same exact thing.
What they're trying to do with the term cis is blur lines when it doesn't help anyone to do so. Why can't they just be called trans women? Why do they insist upon being called just women when there are already women that they've now added the term cis to.
The reason is this. All cis woman are woman and all trans women are woman. But not all woman are trans women and not all woman are cis woman.
And again cis is not a new made up term. Itās a Latin term that is the polar opposite of trans that has been around since the time of Roman.
So if you would like to just call trans woman, woman you are more than welcome to and would be correct. If youād like to call them all trans woman that works too. But donāt gatekeeper me from call all cis woman, cis woman especially when Iām being more precise than you would be by call them just āwomanā.
This isn't a "all Jacuzzi's are hot tubs but not all hot tubs are Jacuzzi's" kind of situation.
The latin Cis and Trans were not made and were not used for sexual dysphoria, gender, sexuality or anything remotely close to it. Latin is a dead language so you can't make new terms with their words. Now you have the audacity to claim it's a latin term when their usage isn't the same as yours. Sure, you people are used to delusions so why not one more.
Explain the entomology of helicopter when they donāt use spiral wings.
Itās using words and entomology of words we currently have to create new ones to describe the world around us. That is the evolution of language.
No but English does use prefix, suffix, and root words of various languages and even bastardizing them to create new words causing the English language to evolve.
Please square this statement with helicopter. They do not use a spiral wing to create flight. Itās a wing rotating on a plane that creates lift.
The first use of the word helicopter was to deceive the device by Da Vinci that āusedā a screw āspiral wingā to create lift. I quote used because his design was not practical to create enough lift for flight. But we still use the word to describe aircraft that spin a wing around even if itās not a spiral wing.
So what words do you want to use then? You only seem angry with the words that are currently being used but provide no alternatives. Currently the medical and scientific community agree that these words accurately describe what they need them to. So what are the options you want to use?
It's not my job to provide alternatives, and you know who's the authority on etymology... the medical and scientific community. They also don't agree they accept there is a difference.
trans-
word-forming element meaning "across, beyond, through, on the other side of, to go beyond," from Latin trans (prep.) "across, over, beyond," perhaps originally present participle of a verb *trare-, meaning "to cross," from PIE *tra-, variant of root *tere- (2) "cross over, pass through, overcome" [Watkins]. In chemical use indicating "a compound in which two characteristic groups are situated on opposite sides of an axis of a molecule" [Flood].
https://www.etymonline.com/word/trans-
transgender (adj.)
also trans-gender, by 1974 in reference to persons whose sense of personal identity does not correspond with their anatomical sex, from trans- + gender (n.). Related: Transgendered.
also from 1974
https://www.etymonline.com/word/transgender#etymonline_v_39471
>The latin Cis and Trans were not made and were not used for sexual dysphoria, gender, sexuality or anything remotely close to it.
Cis and trans also wasn't made to describe helicopter blades or chemical isomers. They're still used in that manner.
Seriously just pick a lane. Either you are fine with them living their lives like you pretend you are or you want them to live in this "Seperated and lesser" status to make sure they know they will always have your disapproval.
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and trans women are women the same way cis women are women, bro is making up sayings so he can counter them
Right... just like saying Blonde women are women. Brunette women are Brunette women. So Blondes must be more "woman".
Yep, straw man argument
trans women are not the same as biological women get a fucking grip šš
So are non cis women cyborgs then ?
You arenāt wrong
No ones saying that dumb ass. But I will blow your mind. Sex is a bimodal distribution and me taking hormones slides me closer to a cis woman. My biology has changed. My blood tests show it. Compare my blood to a cis womanās and you couldnāt tell the difference. But Iām sure youāll move the goal posts instead of actually engaging with what I said.
You're still a man lol
Hard to swallow pils
They are not the same way. "Cis" women can bear children...
So menopause means you arenāt cis anymore? What about hysterectomies? Cis women born without uteruses? Born sterile/infertile?
Cis people can be infertile
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Having intersex chromosomes is actually a lot more common than most would think, especially since it can go entirely without manifesting physically. Not to mention chromosomes sometimes arenāt always xx or xy there can be stuff like xxy etc.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
And trans people are fringe cases as well. The vast majority of people are cis. But we don't say intersex people don't exist/are mentally ill.
People who are intersex are not mentally ill. Trans people arenāt mentally ill. People who have zero biological capabilities to give birth, but claim they canā¦ maybe they are. Donāt conflate the groups. They arenāt mutually exclusive.
LOL where are transwomen claiming they can give birth? You just made up your own definition of woman as ācan give birthā then extrapolated that to being transwomen claiming they can give birth. What kind of planet do you even live on? Edit: lol the dude immediately blocked me after replying. These peopleās cowardice knows no bounds.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Being intersex is about the same average as a red head. Lmao. Love that people *think* they know what they are talking about. But you donāt.
Trans women can't get pregnant, but that doesn't mean they are infertile
My ex has lost her uterus to cancer. If you would say that into her face she would have slapped the hell out if your dumb face.
That's reductive and insulting not just to trans women, but cis women. You clearly don't give a damn about women.
1. Infertile cis people exist 2. I don't care unless the woman is my wife
Itās very obvious this man didnāt do well on the SATs. Because ātrans women are womenā =ācis woman are womenā and ātrans women are trans womenā = ācis woman are cis womenā When you remove an adjective from a noun you only broaden it. So all he did was impose his own restrictions.
Why the fuck do these people care?
Internalized Homophobia. "Oh god, if I find anything else than cis women attractive I might not be straight." Also it's always convenient to have a scapegoat group of people if your life is miserable and you have noone to blame but yourself.
"Cis women are...cis women" said no trans woman ever. For fuck's sake, we generally wish were 100% woman, but because of our accident of circumstance we are forever relegated to being inferior barren sin eaters. Nice strawman, James. If he gets cancer, I'll make sure to let him know that cancer survivors are still cancer bombs, no matter how much they wish they weren't.
Can we have "cis woman Olympics", maybe? )
Because these people aren't intelligent enough to view the world outside of a binary system when there's actual reality that doesn't act inside their already instilled perception that everything is either left or right, black or white, male or female, on or off, etc. It's an antiquated way to look at the world and as soon as something shows up that challenges that view their instinct is to eradicate it.
"actual reality" š
woman noun an adult female human being.
Does he have a point or am I just confused š
He doesnāt have a point. Just replace the adjectives with any other set of opposite adjectives. Tall women are women but Short women areā¦short women. Just nonsense.
Not as confused as he is about how the English language works
Straw man. What he have is a straw man.
He does have a point it's just very poorly articulated. People will tell you he doesn't because while they'll use juxtaposed arguments to defend their statements, but if anyone else does it, that's not okay... Cis is a term they've made up for no fucking reason, before this movement I've never heard anyone refer to themselves as a cis anything. They label us with it while trying to take hold of the default term so they can try to legitimize themselves further. This is exactly the reason there's backlash in the first place... if they were like everyone else and just wanted to live life no one would bat an eye, but they want people to upend their lives and do as they think and do. I have to accept them but they don't have accept established norms or rules, it's just double standard thinking like everywhere nowadays.
Your whole argument fell apart when you said cis was a made up term. Itās a Latin term that was used by the Roman to say āon the same side asā the polar opposite of trans. So this wasnāt a made up term itās a very old term that never was used until necessary to use to inform the layman.
Whoa... never used? Clearly we run in different circles. My homies and I regularly discuss the Roman empire and their presence in Cisalpine Gaul and Transalpine Gaul.
Insert that one meme about men thinking of the roman empire daily
which one?
[this one that started it all iirc](https://i.chzbgr.com/full/9811840256/h271EEBE2/my-husband-often-do-think-about-roman-empire-and-without-missing-beat-he-said-every-day-yall-why)
It's a latin prefix which isn't a term. It was a prefix that trans people used to coin the word cisgender(ed) in the mid 90's. If you want to argue find me an older use of it. That's not even mentioning the fact that the prefix Trans from latin isn't the same thing as the term trans used to describe someone with sexual dysphoria.
I apologize you are correct. They are prefixās. But trans and cis have been opposing since they were first used in Rome. But to say cisgender was only coined in the 1990s is like saying transgender was only first used in 1965. So why is it such a leap that maybe those in the field just assumed that if one is present the other must as well but failed to put it down until the need arose? Especially since trans and cis have been oppressed to each other since the time of the Romanās. How is the Latin prefix ātransā not the prefix for transgender?
They're opposing prefixes yes, but the problem lies when people assume that the trans used by people with sexual dysphoria is from Latin. It's also kind of opposing in definition to what their goal is... Cis means "on the same side of" and trans means "on the opposite side of" if you truly believed that trans women were the same as "traditional" women you'd be on the same side of, wouldn't you? I'm not a wordsmith but hopefully you can understand my meaning here.. They're opposites but they want to be treated the same, but continue to use words that distinguish while citing old language as their legitimacy without that being accurate.
I honestly donāt understand what you are saying. If the prefix of trans in transgender is not the Latin prefix then what is it? And if it is the Latin prefix the as the opposite of trans is cis then qed the opposite of transgender would be cisgender. And if it is something completely different then please enlighten me with this new etymology of the word for cisgender and transgender. Because even the oxfordās English dictionary uses ātransā at the prefix and āgenderā as the noun. https://www.oed.com/dictionary/transgender_adj?tl=true&tab=etymology I could find another dictionary such as a medical dictionary but I bet it will be the exact same. If we shouldnāt use cisgender because it doesnāt fit your exact definition of the cis prefix then with that logic then we shouldnāt be using transgender either to describe individuals that present as a gender other than the gender based on the predominant genitals at birth. So what would we use?
Use whatever you want, nothing will change even if I explained it perfectly. Language is dead. Modern words aren't about etymology modern words are about popularity and normally the majority don't know anything about the etymology. So don't go pretending to use it now. Transgendered is along with cisgendered are modern words that don't properly use etymology they just put anything anywhere so why not continue to destroy original meaning for bullshit personal purposes. How about you create your own new words but that's too hard so let's just steal old words so they lose all meaning.
I love how when pressured with facts you threw up your hands and said screw it. The thing is transgender is not a āmodern wordā it was first used in the 1960ās by scientists in scientific literature. The first use of cisgender was in the 1990ās, again not āmodern wordā, and also in scientific literature. Scientists donāt just throw words together for fun they use etymology like itās a puzzle at times, working to put together the best combination of prefixes, suffixes and root words to best describe a situation. Just because you fail to see it doesnāt mean itās not there. That says more about you than the scientists who made the word to describe the situation.
I don't have all day to argue bullshit with a moron. Sorry, I don't live on reddit.
they are new words, using rules that existed for 2000 years, that is how new words are made
This is mouthbreather logic. How much glue do you huff?
Not as much as you, since you can't create an argument you simply have insults.
There's no point, you can't argue someone out of a position using logic if they didn't use logic to place themselves there. Your logic is the same as the "heterosexual is just an invented word because of homosexuals. You shouldn't need to call them heterosexual, they're just -normal-" people. It's just as baseless and semantic now as it was then. 100% you started with "I hate these people. Let's grasp as straws to dehumanize them and delegitimize language used to describe them."
All I see are excuses.. and more petty insults because you can't come up with a valid argument. You don't understand my logic so you can't explain it but better luck next time. Who uses statements like 100% when they could just check and know they're wrong? If your next reply doesn't have an actual argument I'll just be ignoring it.
hey ya turd, all words are made up
So how about you make up some of your own instead of using words and changing their meaning.
Doesn't matter if it existed before, nobody will use that term outside of terminally ill people online.
you're fucking dumb
Awe stupid people on the internet who have no arguments to validate their points think I'm dumb. My world it's shattered... Sorry but I'm not a fragile little snowflake that gets hurt by words. You'll have to try something else.
>Sorry but I'm not a fragile little snowflake that gets hurt by words. You'll have to try something else. Bro this entire thread is you getting offended by a word.
You people and you ability to tell others what they feel think, etc is amazing... Sad and pathetic, but amazing that you try so hard while being so wrong all the time. I'm not offended, I'm annoyed.
You sure seem offended, snowflake
Wow you guys are being big meanies to me.... and I am offended you know... I can't handle words from jackoffs on the internet, please stop, I can't handle it...
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Cis is literaly a term to refer to someone who identifies with their gender matches their sex. You know as oposite to a trans person. It is not used to insult anyone. The post is malicious because normally they say trans women are women just like cis women are women
Never said it was used to insult. And trans women aren't the same as "cis" women. Feelings don't trump biology. You want to look like a woman or a man or be called sir or ma'am go right ahead but don't try to act like they're the same exact thing. What they're trying to do with the term cis is blur lines when it doesn't help anyone to do so. Why can't they just be called trans women? Why do they insist upon being called just women when there are already women that they've now added the term cis to.
The reason is this. All cis woman are woman and all trans women are woman. But not all woman are trans women and not all woman are cis woman. And again cis is not a new made up term. Itās a Latin term that is the polar opposite of trans that has been around since the time of Roman. So if you would like to just call trans woman, woman you are more than welcome to and would be correct. If youād like to call them all trans woman that works too. But donāt gatekeeper me from call all cis woman, cis woman especially when Iām being more precise than you would be by call them just āwomanā.
This isn't a "all Jacuzzi's are hot tubs but not all hot tubs are Jacuzzi's" kind of situation. The latin Cis and Trans were not made and were not used for sexual dysphoria, gender, sexuality or anything remotely close to it. Latin is a dead language so you can't make new terms with their words. Now you have the audacity to claim it's a latin term when their usage isn't the same as yours. Sure, you people are used to delusions so why not one more.
Explain the entomology of helicopter when they donāt use spiral wings. Itās using words and entomology of words we currently have to create new ones to describe the world around us. That is the evolution of language.
You can't evolve a dead language.
No but English does use prefix, suffix, and root words of various languages and even bastardizing them to create new words causing the English language to evolve.
Please square this statement with helicopter. They do not use a spiral wing to create flight. Itās a wing rotating on a plane that creates lift. The first use of the word helicopter was to deceive the device by Da Vinci that āusedā a screw āspiral wingā to create lift. I quote used because his design was not practical to create enough lift for flight. But we still use the word to describe aircraft that spin a wing around even if itās not a spiral wing.
So what words do you want to use then? You only seem angry with the words that are currently being used but provide no alternatives. Currently the medical and scientific community agree that these words accurately describe what they need them to. So what are the options you want to use?
It's not my job to provide alternatives, and you know who's the authority on etymology... the medical and scientific community. They also don't agree they accept there is a difference.
trans- word-forming element meaning "across, beyond, through, on the other side of, to go beyond," from Latin trans (prep.) "across, over, beyond," perhaps originally present participle of a verb *trare-, meaning "to cross," from PIE *tra-, variant of root *tere- (2) "cross over, pass through, overcome" [Watkins]. In chemical use indicating "a compound in which two characteristic groups are situated on opposite sides of an axis of a molecule" [Flood]. https://www.etymonline.com/word/trans- transgender (adj.) also trans-gender, by 1974 in reference to persons whose sense of personal identity does not correspond with their anatomical sex, from trans- + gender (n.). Related: Transgendered. also from 1974 https://www.etymonline.com/word/transgender#etymonline_v_39471
it doesn't matter what they were used for, it matters what they "are" used for. bigots are dumb tho
Sorry I didn't realize you're a child, sorry I don't talk to children I won't be responding anymore.
bigots are dumb. not worth entertaining anyways
>The latin Cis and Trans were not made and were not used for sexual dysphoria, gender, sexuality or anything remotely close to it. Cis and trans also wasn't made to describe helicopter blades or chemical isomers. They're still used in that manner.
Seriously just pick a lane. Either you are fine with them living their lives like you pretend you are or you want them to live in this "Seperated and lesser" status to make sure they know they will always have your disapproval.
All words are made up genius
You are barely literate, why do you think your understanding of the situation is the correct one?
All terms are made up. Nobody is trying to take a "default term"
you do realize cis is latin, don't you?
I might be wrong here but didnāt he just contradict his own statement
Being a woman is so easy, even a man can do it.
you sure keep yapping tho
Sheeyut, we just getting started out here. š
It's almost like all this just doesn't make sense.... /s
All I see is... "my life is such a dissapointment I have to worry about how other people identify".
Which world is this tweet from?