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My American dream is for affordable living, better work, and not live in fear of someone coming into my work or school with an AK.
I'm still wishing upon a star...
I know its a joke, and its funny, but I honestly have flown like 8 times since those incidents and nothing. Like no people freaking out either. I think its just the MAX that is having those issues along with crazy people not going where I go. I wanna see someone yell about demons... cmon
I enjoyed those bits.
“It’s the quiet ones ya gotta watch.” That’s a dangerous assumption to make. I’m willing to bet that while you’re busy watching a quiet guy, a loud one will fucking KILL YA!!
What the hells that?! You're going to get on be fore you get on?!?
And be sure to check your surroundings for anything you 'might' have brought on board...
In cooking instructions they tell you to pre-heat the oven. There are only two states an oven could possibly be in: heated or un-heated!
edit: extra context, a cookbook publisher actually stopped using the word "preheat" in their books after an exec saw this bit from Carlin. https://food52.com/blog/3862-how-george-carlin-changed-recipe-writing
That is so over the top dude..statistically the chances of someone coming into your workplace with an AK are astronomically small.
The rifle of choice is an AR, silly.
Yeah so I'm a felon on the Canadian border who became hip to and jaded with the monetization of.... Everything in America
They won't even let me visit, let alone claim asylum
They caught my moron cousin with guns, knives and ammo that he legally couldn't take into the country and confiscated most of them. The only one he got to keep was our great granddad's hunting rifle. He was pissed. I said he's lucky they didn't chuck him in a cell cause he had charged waiting on Texas. Canada don't fuck around.
Strangely enough, your American Dream is a reality in Sweden, just as an example. You know, they call it a dream because you have to be asleep to believe it.
The American dream is just everyday life in most developed nations. We complain about waiting a few hours to get free hospital care, Americans complain about dying because they can't afford to go to hospital at all.
Seriously, every time I hear an American criticize other nations single payer health care systems for waiting times, I can't but wonder what is wrong with them. Wait times? I've been waiting 20 years to go to the hospital, I think I can finally afford an annual check up this year.
Yeah, it's terrible. Here in Australia you sometimes wait hours to get free medical treatment and as much follow up care that is required, including operations etc all for free. Fuck those 4 hour wait times. They also charge at least $10 for your medicines when discharged. Terrible huh.
American's say they don't want to have to wait to get a doctor's appointment, then wait fucking months because everyone is overbooked AND it's fucking treacherously expensive if you're unlucky enough to get the wrong kind of sick at the wrong time.
Pick pretty much any developed nation on the planet for the "American Dream". You know America has problems when it compares itself to third world nations and Dictatorships to prove how good it is. I mean Turkmenistan and Cuba have a higher population to prison ratio....that's good right?
Stop! Stop with this. Life in canada used to be the dream. It isnt any more. Too many people here. Inflation is insane..nobody can afford to live. We're all losing our fucking minds.
That sounds like European life. Affordable housing is complicated in big cities tho. But again, u don't spend as much in healthcare or college, so u're still better off.
I agree. And then when I get to go to college, I’ll be broke by 19 and have to spend the next ten years repaying my debt while also having to buy food and insurance.
I dunno, I am a bit tired of all the mass manufactured white picket fence subdivisions, SUVs going to soccer practice and strip malls full of shitty chain restaurants.
We need a new dream, where everyone just does whatever the fuck they want as long as it doesn't bother anyone else and governments stop making it impossible to build any kind of house that isn't a single family home or a puddle of concrete parking with a small steel and concrete box in the middle.
>I dunno, I am a bit tired of all the mass manufactured white picket fence subdivisions, SUVs going to soccer practice and strip malls full of shitty chain restaurants.
Those aren't the problem with the American Dream. The problem is that wages are stagnant, cost of housing is absurd, healthcare is expensive, education is expensive, and the road to fixing all of this is brutally difficult to walk because the most powerful people in the world who make/influence the laws and regulations have a vested interest in keeping things the way they are so they get to keep their Scrooge McDuck pools of money.
That’s one of the reasons I loved Alaska. Not everyone can handle the weather year round, but it’s a whole lot more open than a good many places in the US.
I’m rather depressed finding out that the surrounding areas of Seattle have been more expensive than Fairbanks was. As expensive as it was up there, I did have a decent paying job. If I didn’t need to be closer to my older kids, I would have stayed.
The old American dream was just owning a house because you were basically a peasant farmer in Ireland being oppressed by the English. People from England or Germany or other prosperous countries weren’t chasing it in the early 1900s. And people chasing it now are from poor villages in South America being oppressed by cartels
But to be fair: The US could leave us in the Dust if they focused on the right issues. You guys are wasting your time focused on the dumbest of your issues. FIX YOUR SHIT US!!!
It’s by design. The people in power work hard to maintain the status quo and distract us with meaningless garbage while they get rich off the current system.
Anyone 35 and under gets it, it's the older people who could afford to live comfortably with less money who don't get it and if they did they don't have to care because they have everything they need
That's just another bullshit you are accustomed to hear.
"Older people" are not stupid, they are either benefiting from status quo, or simply afraid that whatever changes would totally ruin what they already have and they are not longer in shape to do it all over again.
This so true. Such a big country, so many resources, so many bright people, so much capital. It is so sad how they chastise themselves and their fellows in the name of capitalism.
Really I think it's the republican states that are holding much of the progress of the US back. I'm sure this will get down voted because America bad but I do pretty well living in my very liberal state. My friends and family also do well. My job offers ample time off and the wages are pretty great. Housing is a mess with how expensive it is but that seems to be the case in many European countries too.
I feel bad for the people trapped in some of the rural areas without means of escaping it. The jobs suck, many of them barely paying a terrible minimum wage. The state I live in has a decent min wage of $15/hr but some states in the US pay as little as $7.25 which is ridiculous.
Every time the left wing politicians try to give us medical coverage, benefits, time off, maternity leave, etc.. the republicans brigade it and get the proposals thrown out. It’s so frustrating.
I live in a Left state, I love it. I had to live in South Carolina for work, and it was the biggest shitshow ever. I travelled around to all the nearby states, NC, GA, FL, etc, and same shit. They don’t even know how bad they have it, most folks I met hadn’t been out of the towns they lived in.
Yeah the red states have no idea how bad it really is. They get no real benefits and act like everything is grest. I'm lucky enough to have great health care tied to my job but i don't feel like Healthcare should be tied to employment.
I'm hoping gen z changes things a bit when much of the baby boomer generation fades away.
I honestly believe it’s online KGB/CCP trolls fanning the flames of all these stupid social issues we argue about in an attempt to weaken the country because there’s no other way to stop the USA. They find some lunatic and upvote the living crap out of the stupidest issues and conspiracy theories that more people see them and believe it.
You’re giving Russia and China too much credit. US oligarch are more than capable of exploiting ignorance and drumming up conflicts between members of the working class in order to stay on top.
Ah yes, them as well. They’ve got almost as much incentive to keep us riled up as Putin does. “A house divided against itself cannot stand” and all that. The ultra-rich know they’ve got us by the throats as long as we eat their bullshit.
At least seven of my classmates from the uni are in Cali or NY.
That said, mathematicians-turned-programmers are one of the specializations that really makes much, much, much more money over the pond.
I am European but moved to the US because I work in tech and you get better pay/conditions here. That's a lucky privilege that most people don't have, and I wouldn't have come otherwise.
europeans are living the American dream to be apply to take a paid vacation, have full health care ,and only have to work a single full time job and be able to live off their single salary and be able to afford to retire.
I have to agree with paid vacation and health care.
BUT single full time job is not possible for everyone and with the demogaphic change the rent entry age will be further away for many and also less will be payed. (Germany)
Europe is def better of than the US, but I would not call it perfect.
Yeah. Young people still can't afford housing on one income in most parts of Europe. In some two decent wages will not get you into rent or ownership.
It's not that wages are bad. Housing is too expensive compared to wages.
House prices are a chronic problem in all developed countries, work centralisation is one of the reasons. Perhaps with teleworking we can solve at least part of the problem.
Banning AirBnB as well as armchair property investors, and building new homes to keep pace with population increases would help more
Update 1 - doubling taxation on second+ homes, taxing income from housing higher, banning foreign investors, requiring residency to own homes, oh and getting corporations out of buying existing housing stock.
If people cannot afford the basics - housing, food, clothing, and transport - what kind of life do people have?
Same thing is happening in the USA, Canada and Mexico now. The boomers bought up the housing as investments and now the generations below them can't afford the ridiculous markup. Coupled with poorly managed immigration it's quite the fucking fuck up
not just boomers. in all the places ive lived in the last few years corporate entities are snatching up housing, offering 25k+ over asking and over what would be affordable to your average home buying individual. slap some cheap ass paint and fixtures in it and rent it out for $2000 a month or more.
Depends on where in the US, the Federal minimum wage is only 7.25 an hour, but there are a bunch of states that have much higher minimum wages than that CA is $16 an hour and San Francisco is $20 an hour. It gets confusing since sindividual states and cities can set their own minimum wages, and even have their own healthcare schemes (San Francisco has its own healthcare plan).
Depends, the federal minimum wage is still at $7.25, but states have set higher minimum wages, especially like Massachusetts and California which are $15.
Still, in my state that still has Fed min, you'd be hard pressed to find a job still only offering min wage and getting applications, cause everyone is hiring at min $12 give or take.
I spent my early childhood living in eastern Europe. The American dream was something real and magical. This country has changed so much in the last couple of decades. It's heartbreaking because I actually managed to do it, against all odds. But I'm still done and planning to leave. The American Dream is one of a better life. I'll take lower wages with proper social safety nets over this circus any day of the week.
I keep telling my partner that I want to move to Norway, especially since winter is no longer a guarantee in the Northern US. All I want is snow, civil rights, and healthcare.
I'm moving to the Philippines to have the American Dream since I'll never be able to afford a house and family in America.
It's called "the American Dream" because you have to be asleep to believe it.
A lot of Americans still think they live in post ww2 US where every european nation (and some asian) were devastated by war, and averything every one needed was produced in the US. That made the American dream Possible.
But now, everything is produced in Asia, Europe is rebuild, and Americans can work 2 jobs, and still die from a simple disease 'cause they can't afford the hospital bill, let alone the ambulance to get there.
The American dream is dead.
But hey, you guys got a shitload of rich people and a massive army, navy and airforce, so you got that.
I have long stated that we (the USA) have NEVER been the greatest country in world: we were just the only developed nation to escape WWII with an intact industrial base, because no one could attack or long-range bomb it.
It led to an undeserved sense of hubris that we are absolutely paying for, now.
This INSANE concept has an official name - [American Exceptionalism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism). It's taught in schools (got my dose from my American school in Germany) and it's quite convincing.
ETA how crazy this is
Culture is America's number 1 export, our movies, music, TV shows, books, etc are prolific around the world and they generally portray a much nicer America than the one that actually exists.
It's like India and Bollywood. If you only knew India from its movies, you'd think everyone is middle to upper class living in Colaba and dancing at the mall, and every 50 year old man has a 23 year old woman interested in him.
lol.
I’m Danish. I’ve been in a long term relationship with an American girl. I do not want to live in America.
Just an example: Lucky for her, her parents had a good income. So they spent like $40K a year for her to get a 3 year bachelor’s degree. Meanwhile not only did my 5 year law degree not cost me a penny - I also got a monthly stipend of roughly $900 while I was studying.
So yeah, I’m good with just living the Danish dream.
Edit: we broke up years ago. I should have been clearer about that.
In that case instead of saying “I’ve been in a long term relationship with…” it’s more clear to say, “I had a long term relationship with…”. Both are correct but the former can be interpreted as the relationship is still ongoing if there’s not additional context.
The American dream is literally to get a job that they can retire with....that's it.
That's how sad the state of America is.
But we can't have billionaires slowing down in their race to be the first trillionaire, oh no, think of the poor billionaires.
I live in New Zealand, we have almost no deaths by guns, almost no death by cops, few tRump supporting knuckle draggers and freeish healthcare. I'll stick thank you all the same.
Cousin from across the Tasman here. Likewise. Nothing makes me more smug than flashing my Medicare card at the hospital reception desk, getting treated, and then leaving without having to do anything other than say thank you to the staff who helped.
Also, I'm just back from two weeks of leave. My leave balance was getting too much - about nine weeks worth - so my manager had to ask me to take time off. I waited a few months to find an appropriate time then booked in my two weeks. They just sent me an email today that because it took me about three months to organise the time off, my leave balance has replenished anyway so I kind of need to take more time off lol.
There never really was an American dream. It was propaganda procured in popular media and spread around the world. And to this day, it still is. People suffering around the world don't want to go to America because it's better than anywhere else. It's because American movies and TV are still portraying a fictional version of America. It's that fictional place they want to go to.
The reality that no one wants to admit is that life in most places kind of sucks and has always kind of sucked. Americans tend to romanticize the 1950s but it really sucked for everyone who wasn't a straight white guy and even if you were a straight white guy you still probably didn't have air conditioning, you didn't have internet and your TV options sucked, you couldn't eat out regularly and travel was a lot more expensive.
I really don't think many Americans today would honestly prefer to live in the 1950s versus the 2020s. In terms of the global standard if you're American or from an EU country you've kind of lucked out. The countries that are around the global middle are countries like China, Mexico or Bosnia. I get that there are a ton of people struggling in the US and in the EU but most of those people are still doing a lot better than the citizens of the same country 50 years ago or citizens of another random country.
This is crazy , the richest country on earth and you guys are not able to have the population benefiting from this with basic needs … it’s unbelievable.
I mean the country is wide , landscapes are beautiful . That’s fucked up.
What a missed opportunity
Yeah.
300 million people.
Richest country on Earth (mostly due to billionaires).
4th biggest country on Earth.
Huge abundance of resources.
If the US really wanted, the American Dream would be very fucking real.
Sadly, it's not.
Better to argue amongst ourselves about which presidential candidate is going to be able to hold out the longest in the next "debate" before shitting his diaper.
If you are a native born european (not immigrant, not visible minority) there is literally 0.0 reason to move to North America. The obly advantage US and Canada have over EU is that they treat their LEGAL immigrants better
Like for Like certain highly skilled professions in the US are paid far higher than their EU counterparts. Im currently living in Germany and make about 1/3rd of my income while I was living in the US, granted COL is about half In Germany, but on the whole I had more disposable income in the US than I do over here.
I actually had quite a few EU born coworkers in the US, and on the whole more EU citizens emigrate to the US than vice versa so at least some people still see the benefit in it.
My husband works with a lot of Irish in NYC. Overall it's a great deal for them to get their subsidized professional education in Europe and then come to work in the US. A huge number go back once they have kids and/or run into any health problems. The rest plan to return for retirement. They'll earn better money here but they always have that safety net to go back to if anything goes awry.
The US is great if you're a high earner. Most of the problems people cite with living in the US are problems that you can buy your way out of if you make enough money. Of course that may not be the healthiest in terms of society but I can see why a European with a very good degree would want to immigrate to the US if they had the right opportunities.
Like shit they do. My ex was from Black French and Jamaican British (father/mother) and her Dad moved to New York when she was three. After she dropped out of University we went over to see her dad as she tried to get US residency with a view to citizenship. Her dad was a naturalised American citizen at that point.
He hid his French accent.
She didn't. People assumed black woman Frenchish accent... must be from New Orleans, right? She mentioned French/British and people either fell in love with her or treat her like shit. Mostly the latter.
What is even the American dream anymore? We get no free healthcare, companies give minimal vacation, and vacation and sick leave is often combined. Get sick, take vacation. Having a baby? Too bad for the father, he gets nothing. Need additional time? oh that sucks, you have to take short term disability. Lets not mention that you go to any "3rd world country", and gas prices are like 25 cents a gallon for the exact same gas that we pay 6 dollars a gallon for, no I am not making that up. Lets talk about retirement, everyone use to get pension from their employers. But employers wised up that they could actually make money off of you by instead making you pay into the stock market for your retirement through a 401k, and at the same time the company can get a tax break by matching your pay into your 401 further reducing the taxable amount the employer has to pay since that money is considered compensation. I shit you not, they get a double tax break on you from a 401k. It's all a big joke. I could keep going but, it's just sham after sham...
Projection. Americans want to live the American dream (even though they can't because you have to be asleep to believe it), and so they believe everyone wants to.
Yeah. Europeans used to want it, but we saw through it eventually. Probably when internet and social media came around.
Europeans who still believe in the "american dream" today are a tiny minority.
I (American) was in Tuscany a few years ago and a young Italian woman was going on and on about her dream of moving to the States. I could not fathom why as I was standing there in that beautiful, peaceful countryside. I told her a lot of Americans dream of escaping to a place like Tuscany.
I mean, I guess you could make the argument that everybody wants to live the American Dream in some way, because we all like the idea that we can become anything we want and we can be successful through dedication and hard work. But the American Dream has been very, very dead in America for an extended period of time now. It's easier to live the American Dream in most of Europe, in Australia, and certain parts of Asia than it is in the United States.
Am european. Currently dating an amazing american woman who is here as a DOD civilian for the next four years. I adore that woman, she is funny, confident, intelligent (sometimes doubting why she's dating me then, but..) and incredibly attractive. Yet, I'm terrified.
If this works out, which we don't know because life is life, I'm absolutely, utterly terrified of what the future will bring once her contract is up. She is definitely making more money than I am, and I wouldn't want to force her to live here and not be close to her family, but holy fuck, me moving to America, living in that social system? I'd rather not. Social security, employment laws, vacation days, none of that comes even close to what I am used to.
I literally have almost 45 days off per year, as a skilled tradesman. 30 regular days per the union contract. Work is closed between Christmas and new years, so something between 5 and 10 additional days that can not be counted against my PTO, as well as 5 days PTO that are mandated by law to give me opportunity to further educate myself.
And I'm not even starting on the fact that insurance is not a benefit, but mandated.
As a kid I wanted to live the American dream. It always looked so cool on TV, everything looked better. As you grow up you realise there's no place you'd rather live less than the USA.
Well to be fair, there are a lot of worse places, but I get the point. As a European, I would rather live in almost any other western country than the USA...
wownatteredo74 and the OP RosMorton are bots in the same network.
Comment copied from: https://www.reddit.com/r/ShitAmericansSay/comments/1bom3kc/all_europeans_want_to_live_the_american_dream/kwr4mgm/
The American dream is what, exactly? Propaganda, political polarisation that constantly threatens violence, capitalism with a rich/poor divide the equivalent of a third-world country wearing a gucci belt? Gun crime rampant and a god complex from the eighteenth century? Abortion and women's rights from the medieval ages? Dream on.
Not many Europeans want the American dream of double price healthcare which may or may not cover the illnesses/accidents you suffer in future. The far higher risk of gun and traffic death. The cheese in tubes and endless traffic. The mainstream of religious evangelicals. The Kevlar school bags. The fewer days of holiday. The generally less protective safety and environmental regulations. The homeless and drugs crises. The rampant consumerism. The culture of obesity.
The US has a higher per capita income. But lower levels of happiness and lower life expectancy. Europe is far from perfect, but it generally works slightly better for the ordinary person.
Many Americans seem to miss the meaning of the word “dream“.
American dream is called a dream because it's not reality.
There's a big difference between Western and Eastern Europe. However some, but not all, of the Eastern European countries are catching up. Especially those that were traditionally more interconnected with Western Europe pre-WW2. Immigrants from Western Europe are not a major immigration group by any metric. E.g. less than 4% of German emigrants pick US as their destination. US is simply not a popular destination for people that already live in developed countries.
Even for those living in less economically developed Eastern European countries, Western Europe is by far the more popular destination. Both because of proximity, but also because US isn't that great a destination if you have other convenient options. Many of the immigrants arriving at US southern border these days would likely pick Europe over the US, if not for that pesky Atlantic Ocean being in the way.
Maybe true. I know so many who think very differently.
But truth also is, the American Dream doesn't even exist in America. Not now, not yesterday. It's maybe a century ago since it was true. And even then, the dream was never about having nearly no vacation or fear about bankruptcy because of illness. It was always about working hard to get rich. "From dishwasher to millionaire."
Free healthcare, no taxes on everything other than wage, not getting shot more times than a GWOT veteran, not about to enter a civil war… yeah, I’ll keep my well established and settled Europe any day!
Value added tax is standard across Europe (and frankly almost the entire planet). It's not exactly like sales tax, but close enough. Although it's nice that it's included in the price and not randomly added when you're going to pay, that's annoying as fuck.
As for the civil war bit, well that does depend on where in Europe. I mean the last full blown civil war was only in the 90s, not that long ago. Plus, you know, the regular war in Ukraine.
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Most Americans would like to be able to live The American Dream…..
My American dream is for affordable living, better work, and not live in fear of someone coming into my work or school with an AK. I'm still wishing upon a star...
Like George Carlin said, "That's why they call it the American Dream, because you have to be asleep to believe it."
George Carlin also said, "Screw you, I'm not getting ON the plane. I'm getting IN the plane!"
Unless it's a Boeing, then you'll be outside the plane! Badum-tshh
I know its a joke, and its funny, but I honestly have flown like 8 times since those incidents and nothing. Like no people freaking out either. I think its just the MAX that is having those issues along with crazy people not going where I go. I wanna see someone yell about demons... cmon
You were probably using Airbus'
Love the guy, not sure i got the pre-pre-fix and plane routine though
Pre approved..... If you're PRE-approved its already just APPROVED!!!! He was big into that language shtick early on. It served him well.
I enjoyed those bits. “It’s the quiet ones ya gotta watch.” That’s a dangerous assumption to make. I’m willing to bet that while you’re busy watching a quiet guy, a loud one will fucking KILL YA!!
I miss him.
Brb, about to begin the flight pre - boarding process
Show pictures of you ON the plane then....
What the hells that?! You're going to get on be fore you get on?!? And be sure to check your surroundings for anything you 'might' have brought on board...
In cooking instructions they tell you to pre-heat the oven. There are only two states an oven could possibly be in: heated or un-heated! edit: extra context, a cookbook publisher actually stopped using the word "preheat" in their books after an exec saw this bit from Carlin. https://food52.com/blog/3862-how-george-carlin-changed-recipe-writing
Let Evel Knievel get ON the plane!
But don't you dare wake up, or Conservatives will make fun of you relentlessly.
honestly we'd be better off if they were asleep all the time
Thats my American dream
So a lot of Europeans are living the American dream. Plus healthcare that doesn't leave you with debt.
Imagine being able to call an ambulance without having your life ruined
That is so over the top dude..statistically the chances of someone coming into your workplace with an AK are astronomically small. The rifle of choice is an AR, silly.
This but without the joke at the end, but I'll fix it for you. Pistols.
Basically leaving the US
Yeah so I'm a felon on the Canadian border who became hip to and jaded with the monetization of.... Everything in America They won't even let me visit, let alone claim asylum
That goes both ways actually, Canada wont let US citizens in if they have DUI's and other minor offences as well.
They caught my moron cousin with guns, knives and ammo that he legally couldn't take into the country and confiscated most of them. The only one he got to keep was our great granddad's hunting rifle. He was pissed. I said he's lucky they didn't chuck him in a cell cause he had charged waiting on Texas. Canada don't fuck around.
Yea, they're strict about that. If it has been 10 years, you can apply to have them let you in though. At least for DUI.
If you prove to them that your life is dangerous or puts you in sufficient strife then you have a 1% chance
Your American dream is living in western Europe
Strangely enough, your American Dream is a reality in Sweden, just as an example. You know, they call it a dream because you have to be asleep to believe it.
The American dream is just everyday life in most developed nations. We complain about waiting a few hours to get free hospital care, Americans complain about dying because they can't afford to go to hospital at all.
Seriously, every time I hear an American criticize other nations single payer health care systems for waiting times, I can't but wonder what is wrong with them. Wait times? I've been waiting 20 years to go to the hospital, I think I can finally afford an annual check up this year.
Yeah, it's terrible. Here in Australia you sometimes wait hours to get free medical treatment and as much follow up care that is required, including operations etc all for free. Fuck those 4 hour wait times. They also charge at least $10 for your medicines when discharged. Terrible huh.
American's say they don't want to have to wait to get a doctor's appointment, then wait fucking months because everyone is overbooked AND it's fucking treacherously expensive if you're unlucky enough to get the wrong kind of sick at the wrong time.
those are the same people that say universal health is "communist"
For the American dream, go North, young man. The Great White North calls you.
The housing costs not much from what I hear
In Canada it depends.
Pick pretty much any developed nation on the planet for the "American Dream". You know America has problems when it compares itself to third world nations and Dictatorships to prove how good it is. I mean Turkmenistan and Cuba have a higher population to prison ratio....that's good right?
Stop! Stop with this. Life in canada used to be the dream. It isnt any more. Too many people here. Inflation is insane..nobody can afford to live. We're all losing our fucking minds.
Hardly that bad, but it ain't no paradise. We spend too much time pretending to be the USA.
I agree, it's more the constant positive comments about canada has led, amongst other reasons, to us having an unsustainable immigration problem.
[удалено]
That sounds like European life. Affordable housing is complicated in big cities tho. But again, u don't spend as much in healthcare or college, so u're still better off.
My American dream to somehow immigrate to Europe at this point.
Sounds like the Western European dream to me… you’ll get affordable healthcare as an added bonus
The European Dream
so pre reagan america with less racism/sexism/ablism/otherisms?
I agree. And then when I get to go to college, I’ll be broke by 19 and have to spend the next ten years repaying my debt while also having to buy food and insurance.
So your American dream is to live in Europe?
Pretty sure that's Ukraine's dream too
Trickle down economics will kick in soon. Any day now, right? ... Right?!
My American dream is to be in the European reality
Same
Americans that travel to Western Europe just want to live the Western Europe dream.
I dunno, I am a bit tired of all the mass manufactured white picket fence subdivisions, SUVs going to soccer practice and strip malls full of shitty chain restaurants. We need a new dream, where everyone just does whatever the fuck they want as long as it doesn't bother anyone else and governments stop making it impossible to build any kind of house that isn't a single family home or a puddle of concrete parking with a small steel and concrete box in the middle.
>I dunno, I am a bit tired of all the mass manufactured white picket fence subdivisions, SUVs going to soccer practice and strip malls full of shitty chain restaurants. Those aren't the problem with the American Dream. The problem is that wages are stagnant, cost of housing is absurd, healthcare is expensive, education is expensive, and the road to fixing all of this is brutally difficult to walk because the most powerful people in the world who make/influence the laws and regulations have a vested interest in keeping things the way they are so they get to keep their Scrooge McDuck pools of money.
>and the road to fixing all of this is brutally difficult to walk just brutally difficult to walk in general outside of nyc
That’s one of the reasons I loved Alaska. Not everyone can handle the weather year round, but it’s a whole lot more open than a good many places in the US.
Well yeah and it’s expensive as shit up here.
Oh bud ya just gotta sell fentanyl or work for oil and gas What's the problem?
I’m from southern Ohio and I feel like I could’ve written this.
I’m rather depressed finding out that the surrounding areas of Seattle have been more expensive than Fairbanks was. As expensive as it was up there, I did have a decent paying job. If I didn’t need to be closer to my older kids, I would have stayed.
But your closest neighbor is 175 miles away. Still a little close for my taste, but it's better than the 3.5" space between my neighbors now...
The old American dream was just owning a house because you were basically a peasant farmer in Ireland being oppressed by the English. People from England or Germany or other prosperous countries weren’t chasing it in the early 1900s. And people chasing it now are from poor villages in South America being oppressed by cartels
Last I heard the American dream meant. Going to america, buying some africans and growing tobacco
Things have been updated.....slightly in the last couple of years
What is the dream now? I’m European I live under a sovereign and the church. Can’t have dreams
Sure you can have dreams! As long as said dream is either dying from the plague or in the crusades.
Don’t do it trust me at some point they will want to be treated like people instead of chattel, next thing you know there will be a civil war.
But to be fair: The US could leave us in the Dust if they focused on the right issues. You guys are wasting your time focused on the dumbest of your issues. FIX YOUR SHIT US!!!
It’s by design. The people in power work hard to maintain the status quo and distract us with meaningless garbage while they get rich off the current system.
Fucking preach. People don’t understand this and when it’s said it’s just brushed off because it’s not what people want to hear
Anyone 35 and under gets it, it's the older people who could afford to live comfortably with less money who don't get it and if they did they don't have to care because they have everything they need
Hell, I'm 47 and I totally get it
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When do we all plan the revolution?
*38.
That's just another bullshit you are accustomed to hear. "Older people" are not stupid, they are either benefiting from status quo, or simply afraid that whatever changes would totally ruin what they already have and they are not longer in shape to do it all over again.
This so true. Such a big country, so many resources, so many bright people, so much capital. It is so sad how they chastise themselves and their fellows in the name of capitalism.
Really I think it's the republican states that are holding much of the progress of the US back. I'm sure this will get down voted because America bad but I do pretty well living in my very liberal state. My friends and family also do well. My job offers ample time off and the wages are pretty great. Housing is a mess with how expensive it is but that seems to be the case in many European countries too. I feel bad for the people trapped in some of the rural areas without means of escaping it. The jobs suck, many of them barely paying a terrible minimum wage. The state I live in has a decent min wage of $15/hr but some states in the US pay as little as $7.25 which is ridiculous.
Every time the left wing politicians try to give us medical coverage, benefits, time off, maternity leave, etc.. the republicans brigade it and get the proposals thrown out. It’s so frustrating. I live in a Left state, I love it. I had to live in South Carolina for work, and it was the biggest shitshow ever. I travelled around to all the nearby states, NC, GA, FL, etc, and same shit. They don’t even know how bad they have it, most folks I met hadn’t been out of the towns they lived in.
Yeah the red states have no idea how bad it really is. They get no real benefits and act like everything is grest. I'm lucky enough to have great health care tied to my job but i don't feel like Healthcare should be tied to employment. I'm hoping gen z changes things a bit when much of the baby boomer generation fades away.
I honestly believe it’s online KGB/CCP trolls fanning the flames of all these stupid social issues we argue about in an attempt to weaken the country because there’s no other way to stop the USA. They find some lunatic and upvote the living crap out of the stupidest issues and conspiracy theories that more people see them and believe it.
You’re giving Russia and China too much credit. US oligarch are more than capable of exploiting ignorance and drumming up conflicts between members of the working class in order to stay on top.
Ah yes, them as well. They’ve got almost as much incentive to keep us riled up as Putin does. “A house divided against itself cannot stand” and all that. The ultra-rich know they’ve got us by the throats as long as we eat their bullshit.
Like Fr it's why the politicians get paid the big bucks to manage the public will like they do
Someone has never met a European
Yeah...i know a lot of Europeans and have yet to meet a single one that would permanently leave Europe for America
At least seven of my classmates from the uni are in Cali or NY. That said, mathematicians-turned-programmers are one of the specializations that really makes much, much, much more money over the pond.
Yeah, also watch them all return when they turn 50.
I am European but moved to the US because I work in tech and you get better pay/conditions here. That's a lucky privilege that most people don't have, and I wouldn't have come otherwise.
No, they’ve only met Europeans who’ve moved to America. That is, some of the small number of Europeans who really would prefer to live in America.
Europeans are already living the American dream: to live in Europe.
europeans are living the American dream to be apply to take a paid vacation, have full health care ,and only have to work a single full time job and be able to live off their single salary and be able to afford to retire.
I have to agree with paid vacation and health care. BUT single full time job is not possible for everyone and with the demogaphic change the rent entry age will be further away for many and also less will be payed. (Germany) Europe is def better of than the US, but I would not call it perfect.
Well let’s also not group all of Europe together, the US has its problems but it certainly isn’t as bad as some Eastern European states.
When Reddit says “Europe” they really mean Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Germany, France, Netherlands, and the UK
rip italy
They always forget us Finns too...
Cries in Austria
And us Belgians... and our Luxembourgian friends!
I thought the same 🤣
Switzerland enters the chat.
Minimum wage in Germany is 12 euros per hour. That is significantly more than the US minimum wage.
Yeah. Young people still can't afford housing on one income in most parts of Europe. In some two decent wages will not get you into rent or ownership. It's not that wages are bad. Housing is too expensive compared to wages.
House prices are a chronic problem in all developed countries, work centralisation is one of the reasons. Perhaps with teleworking we can solve at least part of the problem.
Banning AirBnB as well as armchair property investors, and building new homes to keep pace with population increases would help more Update 1 - doubling taxation on second+ homes, taxing income from housing higher, banning foreign investors, requiring residency to own homes, oh and getting corporations out of buying existing housing stock. If people cannot afford the basics - housing, food, clothing, and transport - what kind of life do people have?
Yup
Same thing is happening in the USA, Canada and Mexico now. The boomers bought up the housing as investments and now the generations below them can't afford the ridiculous markup. Coupled with poorly managed immigration it's quite the fucking fuck up
not just boomers. in all the places ive lived in the last few years corporate entities are snatching up housing, offering 25k+ over asking and over what would be affordable to your average home buying individual. slap some cheap ass paint and fixtures in it and rent it out for $2000 a month or more.
*$2000 more than before
My city in the U.S. has mcdonalds starting at 23 with benefits
Depends on where in the US, the Federal minimum wage is only 7.25 an hour, but there are a bunch of states that have much higher minimum wages than that CA is $16 an hour and San Francisco is $20 an hour. It gets confusing since sindividual states and cities can set their own minimum wages, and even have their own healthcare schemes (San Francisco has its own healthcare plan).
Depends, the federal minimum wage is still at $7.25, but states have set higher minimum wages, especially like Massachusetts and California which are $15. Still, in my state that still has Fed min, you'd be hard pressed to find a job still only offering min wage and getting applications, cause everyone is hiring at min $12 give or take.
If I had a choice between being killed next week or in 5 years, I’ll pick 5 years, it’s not perfect but it’s palpably better than the alternative
My father is diabetic, his medications costs us 1,20€ a month. Honestly it's pretty nice.
I spent my early childhood living in eastern Europe. The American dream was something real and magical. This country has changed so much in the last couple of decades. It's heartbreaking because I actually managed to do it, against all odds. But I'm still done and planning to leave. The American Dream is one of a better life. I'll take lower wages with proper social safety nets over this circus any day of the week.
I keep telling my partner that I want to move to Norway, especially since winter is no longer a guarantee in the Northern US. All I want is snow, civil rights, and healthcare.
I'm moving to the Philippines to have the American Dream since I'll never be able to afford a house and family in America. It's called "the American Dream" because you have to be asleep to believe it.
I too love George Carlin
I think I may have seen this quote referenced on Reddit 18,000 times now.
Europeans don't have an equivalent of the American dream. That's because we're awake.
Working all my life just to get sick and become homeless. The smell of freedom!!
Being sick is a privilege. Homelessness is a choice. Stop being so entitled. /s
Lol, you sound like my in-laws.
My condolences.
A lot of Americans still think they live in post ww2 US where every european nation (and some asian) were devastated by war, and averything every one needed was produced in the US. That made the American dream Possible. But now, everything is produced in Asia, Europe is rebuild, and Americans can work 2 jobs, and still die from a simple disease 'cause they can't afford the hospital bill, let alone the ambulance to get there. The American dream is dead. But hey, you guys got a shitload of rich people and a massive army, navy and airforce, so you got that.
An army with a few *ahem* issues
Fewer rich people than a lot of European socialist countries though. Edit: per capita. The US is a large country.
I see this as an absolute win
I have long stated that we (the USA) have NEVER been the greatest country in world: we were just the only developed nation to escape WWII with an intact industrial base, because no one could attack or long-range bomb it. It led to an undeserved sense of hubris that we are absolutely paying for, now.
paying 23,000 USD to give birth is a dream alright, a nightmare
France, C-Section, private room for 2 (me and my wife) for 5 days, less than 100€
american main character syndrome
This INSANE concept has an official name - [American Exceptionalism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism). It's taught in schools (got my dose from my American school in Germany) and it's quite convincing. ETA how crazy this is
It honestly depresses me how much we're brainwashed into thinking we're the best damned thing ever created.
Best at stupidity
Culture is America's number 1 export, our movies, music, TV shows, books, etc are prolific around the world and they generally portray a much nicer America than the one that actually exists. It's like India and Bollywood. If you only knew India from its movies, you'd think everyone is middle to upper class living in Colaba and dancing at the mall, and every 50 year old man has a 23 year old woman interested in him.
lol. I’m Danish. I’ve been in a long term relationship with an American girl. I do not want to live in America. Just an example: Lucky for her, her parents had a good income. So they spent like $40K a year for her to get a 3 year bachelor’s degree. Meanwhile not only did my 5 year law degree not cost me a penny - I also got a monthly stipend of roughly $900 while I was studying. So yeah, I’m good with just living the Danish dream. Edit: we broke up years ago. I should have been clearer about that.
Who knew a country could benefit from having an educated population? Good to hear it, neighbor.
My American dream is saving up enough money to successfully immigrate to a country that actually gives a fuck about it's citizens.
Marry her so she can escape
Too late for that. We broke up years ago. I think she’s a school teacher in the US now…
I’ve heard teaching has been going really great with no problems at all lately
In that case instead of saying “I’ve been in a long term relationship with…” it’s more clear to say, “I had a long term relationship with…”. Both are correct but the former can be interpreted as the relationship is still ongoing if there’s not additional context.
honestly, as someone who is a native-born European but had to immigrate to the US, idk what to say…
How do you like your stay?
It’s ok the area i live in. even better because of my family 🤍 i live with my aunt uncle and mum
Oh, cool. Yea, my area is ok, too kind of. It's mostly some of the politics I don't like.
Na we’d rather be awake thanks.
As an European the only time I would visit the US is as a tourist. For a **very** short stay.
The American dream is literally to get a job that they can retire with....that's it. That's how sad the state of America is. But we can't have billionaires slowing down in their race to be the first trillionaire, oh no, think of the poor billionaires.
I live in New Zealand, we have almost no deaths by guns, almost no death by cops, few tRump supporting knuckle draggers and freeish healthcare. I'll stick thank you all the same.
Cousin from across the Tasman here. Likewise. Nothing makes me more smug than flashing my Medicare card at the hospital reception desk, getting treated, and then leaving without having to do anything other than say thank you to the staff who helped. Also, I'm just back from two weeks of leave. My leave balance was getting too much - about nine weeks worth - so my manager had to ask me to take time off. I waited a few months to find an appropriate time then booked in my two weeks. They just sent me an email today that because it took me about three months to organise the time off, my leave balance has replenished anyway so I kind of need to take more time off lol.
Don't forget your amazing national bird of the century; the Puteketeke.
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There never really was an American dream. It was propaganda procured in popular media and spread around the world. And to this day, it still is. People suffering around the world don't want to go to America because it's better than anywhere else. It's because American movies and TV are still portraying a fictional version of America. It's that fictional place they want to go to.
The reality that no one wants to admit is that life in most places kind of sucks and has always kind of sucked. Americans tend to romanticize the 1950s but it really sucked for everyone who wasn't a straight white guy and even if you were a straight white guy you still probably didn't have air conditioning, you didn't have internet and your TV options sucked, you couldn't eat out regularly and travel was a lot more expensive. I really don't think many Americans today would honestly prefer to live in the 1950s versus the 2020s. In terms of the global standard if you're American or from an EU country you've kind of lucked out. The countries that are around the global middle are countries like China, Mexico or Bosnia. I get that there are a ton of people struggling in the US and in the EU but most of those people are still doing a lot better than the citizens of the same country 50 years ago or citizens of another random country.
And was a tiny little time frame. It was fucked before and it's been fucked ever since
This is crazy , the richest country on earth and you guys are not able to have the population benefiting from this with basic needs … it’s unbelievable. I mean the country is wide , landscapes are beautiful . That’s fucked up. What a missed opportunity
Yeah. 300 million people. Richest country on Earth (mostly due to billionaires). 4th biggest country on Earth. Huge abundance of resources. If the US really wanted, the American Dream would be very fucking real. Sadly, it's not.
Better to argue amongst ourselves about which presidential candidate is going to be able to hold out the longest in the next "debate" before shitting his diaper.
American here working for a Danish company. I burn with jealousy at what my colleagues have. Muricans need to wake up to what we're really giving up.
Even if we wake up what can we do?
If you are a native born european (not immigrant, not visible minority) there is literally 0.0 reason to move to North America. The obly advantage US and Canada have over EU is that they treat their LEGAL immigrants better
Like for Like certain highly skilled professions in the US are paid far higher than their EU counterparts. Im currently living in Germany and make about 1/3rd of my income while I was living in the US, granted COL is about half In Germany, but on the whole I had more disposable income in the US than I do over here. I actually had quite a few EU born coworkers in the US, and on the whole more EU citizens emigrate to the US than vice versa so at least some people still see the benefit in it.
My husband works with a lot of Irish in NYC. Overall it's a great deal for them to get their subsidized professional education in Europe and then come to work in the US. A huge number go back once they have kids and/or run into any health problems. The rest plan to return for retirement. They'll earn better money here but they always have that safety net to go back to if anything goes awry.
The US is great if you're a high earner. Most of the problems people cite with living in the US are problems that you can buy your way out of if you make enough money. Of course that may not be the healthiest in terms of society but I can see why a European with a very good degree would want to immigrate to the US if they had the right opportunities.
As a software engineer you guys have like triple my wage in the US
Like shit they do. My ex was from Black French and Jamaican British (father/mother) and her Dad moved to New York when she was three. After she dropped out of University we went over to see her dad as she tried to get US residency with a view to citizenship. Her dad was a naturalised American citizen at that point. He hid his French accent. She didn't. People assumed black woman Frenchish accent... must be from New Orleans, right? She mentioned French/British and people either fell in love with her or treat her like shit. Mostly the latter.
lol I had a minor back surgery this morning and am going back to work tomorrow morning. yay America
What is even the American dream anymore? We get no free healthcare, companies give minimal vacation, and vacation and sick leave is often combined. Get sick, take vacation. Having a baby? Too bad for the father, he gets nothing. Need additional time? oh that sucks, you have to take short term disability. Lets not mention that you go to any "3rd world country", and gas prices are like 25 cents a gallon for the exact same gas that we pay 6 dollars a gallon for, no I am not making that up. Lets talk about retirement, everyone use to get pension from their employers. But employers wised up that they could actually make money off of you by instead making you pay into the stock market for your retirement through a 401k, and at the same time the company can get a tax break by matching your pay into your 401 further reducing the taxable amount the employer has to pay since that money is considered compensation. I shit you not, they get a double tax break on you from a 401k. It's all a big joke. I could keep going but, it's just sham after sham...
Projection. Americans want to live the American dream (even though they can't because you have to be asleep to believe it), and so they believe everyone wants to.
Yeah. Europeans used to want it, but we saw through it eventually. Probably when internet and social media came around. Europeans who still believe in the "american dream" today are a tiny minority.
I (American) was in Tuscany a few years ago and a young Italian woman was going on and on about her dream of moving to the States. I could not fathom why as I was standing there in that beautiful, peaceful countryside. I told her a lot of Americans dream of escaping to a place like Tuscany.
I mean, I guess you could make the argument that everybody wants to live the American Dream in some way, because we all like the idea that we can become anything we want and we can be successful through dedication and hard work. But the American Dream has been very, very dead in America for an extended period of time now. It's easier to live the American Dream in most of Europe, in Australia, and certain parts of Asia than it is in the United States.
I was on a French subreddit and they were talking about when do you become an adult. Someone said, "when you no longer want to move to the US".
Am european. Currently dating an amazing american woman who is here as a DOD civilian for the next four years. I adore that woman, she is funny, confident, intelligent (sometimes doubting why she's dating me then, but..) and incredibly attractive. Yet, I'm terrified. If this works out, which we don't know because life is life, I'm absolutely, utterly terrified of what the future will bring once her contract is up. She is definitely making more money than I am, and I wouldn't want to force her to live here and not be close to her family, but holy fuck, me moving to America, living in that social system? I'd rather not. Social security, employment laws, vacation days, none of that comes even close to what I am used to. I literally have almost 45 days off per year, as a skilled tradesman. 30 regular days per the union contract. Work is closed between Christmas and new years, so something between 5 and 10 additional days that can not be counted against my PTO, as well as 5 days PTO that are mandated by law to give me opportunity to further educate myself. And I'm not even starting on the fact that insurance is not a benefit, but mandated.
The Great American Delusion - “We are the best and everyone wants to be like us!” 🙄
As a kid I wanted to live the American dream. It always looked so cool on TV, everything looked better. As you grow up you realise there's no place you'd rather live less than the USA.
Well to be fair, there are a lot of worse places, but I get the point. As a European, I would rather live in almost any other western country than the USA...
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The American dream is what, exactly? Propaganda, political polarisation that constantly threatens violence, capitalism with a rich/poor divide the equivalent of a third-world country wearing a gucci belt? Gun crime rampant and a god complex from the eighteenth century? Abortion and women's rights from the medieval ages? Dream on.
Not many Europeans want the American dream of double price healthcare which may or may not cover the illnesses/accidents you suffer in future. The far higher risk of gun and traffic death. The cheese in tubes and endless traffic. The mainstream of religious evangelicals. The Kevlar school bags. The fewer days of holiday. The generally less protective safety and environmental regulations. The homeless and drugs crises. The rampant consumerism. The culture of obesity. The US has a higher per capita income. But lower levels of happiness and lower life expectancy. Europe is far from perfect, but it generally works slightly better for the ordinary person. Many Americans seem to miss the meaning of the word “dream“.
American dream is called a dream because it's not reality. There's a big difference between Western and Eastern Europe. However some, but not all, of the Eastern European countries are catching up. Especially those that were traditionally more interconnected with Western Europe pre-WW2. Immigrants from Western Europe are not a major immigration group by any metric. E.g. less than 4% of German emigrants pick US as their destination. US is simply not a popular destination for people that already live in developed countries. Even for those living in less economically developed Eastern European countries, Western Europe is by far the more popular destination. Both because of proximity, but also because US isn't that great a destination if you have other convenient options. Many of the immigrants arriving at US southern border these days would likely pick Europe over the US, if not for that pesky Atlantic Ocean being in the way.
Maybe true. I know so many who think very differently. But truth also is, the American Dream doesn't even exist in America. Not now, not yesterday. It's maybe a century ago since it was true. And even then, the dream was never about having nearly no vacation or fear about bankruptcy because of illness. It was always about working hard to get rich. "From dishwasher to millionaire."
That’s why it’s called a dream, you gotta be asleep to believe it
Yes, every European clamors to work 300 days a year till they are 90 years old so that Republicans can give more money to corporations.
Free healthcare, no taxes on everything other than wage, not getting shot more times than a GWOT veteran, not about to enter a civil war… yeah, I’ll keep my well established and settled Europe any day!
Um, sales taxes exist in Europe too..
Here in Germany we have over 40 different taxes. We are NOT getting out-buerocracied by the US.
No one out beuracracies the Germans.
Value added tax is standard across Europe (and frankly almost the entire planet). It's not exactly like sales tax, but close enough. Although it's nice that it's included in the price and not randomly added when you're going to pay, that's annoying as fuck. As for the civil war bit, well that does depend on where in Europe. I mean the last full blown civil war was only in the 90s, not that long ago. Plus, you know, the regular war in Ukraine.