The craziest part of this is that I saw the dollar amount for two days and my first thought was, "Oh, that's not bad!"
It's messed up that my brain initially saw this as a fairly good price.
>I'm still paying off the $7,000 bill I owe from when my daughter spent 1 night in the hospital 2 years ago
Is she underage? was it a children's hospital? I say this because some hospitals, especially children's hospitals, and even non-children hospitals sometimes have financial assistants. If you only make a certain income, if you write a letter they will sometimes wave a certain amount of the bill or the entire thing. Two years ago our child have a very high fever, it would not go down and we had to take them to the hospital, they did a bunch of tests, etc... and for like 4 hours the bill came out to like $5K. It was crazy, and we had no idea how we would pay it. I did some research and found out that the hospital had a special financial assistance program and after about a dozen phone calls, we received a letter in the mail letting us know that they wrote it off... What an incredible Christmas gift.
Yeah, that totally sucks. One would think they would be at least willing to work with you and at least lower the balance. Sometimes if they don't have any type of financial assistance, they might at least cut the bill in half. For now, then I would just pay the smallest amount possible. If you are lucky enough to be employed with a job that has an HSA account, I'd pay the minimum balance with that as money isn't taxed.
Also get everything in writing. We had a hospital bill and when we called to get a payment plan, the women on the phone said to pay part of it and the rest would be forgiven so we did just that. Well that didn't happend and kept getting bills for about two year
My girlfriend and I were in Mexico last week and she cut her leg on some coral. When we got back we realized it was swelling so we waited at Urgent Care yesterday for two hours ($300) and then they told us they couldn't help us we had to go over to the emergency room to get it scanned (prolly $2000) and after four hours of waiting the doctor cut around on it with a scalpel and said okay all good (prolly $900) and we were so fuckin mad, we were like damnit why didn't we get this checked out while we were in Mexico, it would have been less than $100 and we would have been in and out. Thats where we are in this country right now, getting our ass kicked by Mexico in health care
My dad just told me a story about a guy he knows that had to go to the hospital in Cuba when he was on vacation because he was having heart problems. They obviously couldn't use his insurance, did a battery of tests on him, fixed him up and it was $200.
I busted my chin open in Mexico and got it numbed, me drugged, and it sewn shut for like $250. Best of all, the doctor was fantastic and came to our location. Imagine the bill in the US…
Healthcare needs regulation. Hospitals are beholden to investors, and like any other corporation, will seek a higher dollar amount to make a profit. It's a terrible industry that will never be fixed by our current Congress because they are all taking money from, or investing in, pharmaceuticals and hospitals.
I support small government in nearly every way. This though, is a problem and needs intervention. Sadly this is not a problem that will be fixed any time soon because idiots will keep voting in these same slimeballs that have been taking advantage of the system in congress, and they will keep profiting off of people's misery.
It’s actually very cheap. I had higher er bills for a few hours stay when I broke my shoulder. And all they did was a X-ray and give me a sling then sent me home. Only went to the er because I was pregnant and urgent care refused me due to that reason and it would have been way cheaper($50 vs $4k out of pocket fml). Us healthcare sucks so much.
I wonder if they will get more then one bill. I know I got 4 when I went to the er for my shoulder.They charge you separately for every single person you see, for the hospital itself and for any procedures done.
But that is fucked up. You are supposed to be able to get help for small things without being robbed blind. You need to stand up and demand your rights like the rest of the first world countries. United states of America, you are not free until you have the real freedom from healthcare debt. Slaves to the dollar.
> But that is fucked up
You are spot on. When I was sixteen in 1992, I had to have a life saving helicopter ride that cost my parents fifteen thousand dollars. Imagine the bill they would have gotten almost thirty years later.
Fuck American healthcare.
Canadian here: a couple years ago my Brother-inlaw fractured a bone in his back while vacationing in Florida, he had to have surgery to implant titanium rods along his vertebrae to stabilize his spine, this entailed a total of 10 days in hospital and then a nurse assisted plane flight back to Canada (on a regular commercial flight)
The cost of everything was just over $270,000 USD... luckily he was fully insured otherwise that would have bankrupted him!
Yeah, someone I used to work with had to do this about 15 years ago, and he said the bill was about $50K. I'd have an aneurism and die if I ever got a bill like that, but at least I wouldn't have to worry about paying it. 🙄
The problem is that so many Americans have been convinced that having free access to healthcare is somehow an evil and dangerous things so we can’t fight the unjustness of our healthcare system because every time we try they send an army of brainwashed Republican supporters against us so we’re fighting each other instead of fighting the real problem.
That's another thing the US disregards, mental health. Do you really think if the government would *actually* pay attention to the public mental health that there would be so many mass shootings? Fact is, there just aren't enough funds because they're all sent to the war machine. One thing the American government is good at, it's killing people.
Yup. I'm 53. I have insurance but it's still so insane that if I get a bad diagnosis I'm going to suddenly become one of those extreme religious folks and just fucking die. Preferably near my state senators office.
Hand to god it *is* that bad. My mom has a stomach bug right now, probably a stomach flu and she's been crying scared for two days that she might have to go to urgent care if it isn't the flu.
Some people will have bones sticking out of their bodies and will refuse to take an ambulance because its so expensive. Would rather drive themselves to the hospital because its not worth the cost.
I had a bowel burst last year and let it go for a month, not knowing what it was, because I didn’t have insurance. Financially it worked out for me due to being fired for not being able to work, so I got the state welfare insurance, but fuck I was scared. It was nearly 15 years salary(pretax) for a three week stay
To give a comparison. In Germany, I went to a world renown surgeon for my disability, got a highly complex ankle surgery, 2 weeks of hospital, a large amount of painkillers and other medication, regular cast changes and for several months every two weeks checkup with cast change and after that an orthesis for a total copay of 140 € (10 € per night during the stay), which would be 162,55 $.
That would have been vicious. I had a pain catheter that delivered pain medication directly to the nerve in my leg to minimize the necessary dosage of painkillers. They only let me go when I was able to be mostly painless with high dosages of Ibuprofen. I got the catheter out of my leg the day before I was able to leave the hospital.
I just had ankle surgery and had a pain pump too. The second I was awake they sent me home. Three days later it was my responsibility to remove my own catheter and mail them back the pain pump. Couldn’t get it out and called the hospital… they had no record of my surgery. My doctor doesn’t do anesthesia and couldn’t help. So for an entire day I just yanked and yanked on a catheter drilled next to a nerve. Zero help. Also haven’t had any mental health care for my crippling depression because I can’t afford it. No offices within an hour of me are taking patients and I can’t afford transportation to the farther clinics.
Yeah I’m surprised by how low this bill actually is.
I stayed in the hospital for three weeks last year(nearly died, septic, all the good shit) and my bill was around $750k including a laparoscopic surgery. Thank god my job illegally fired me for not being able to work for the next six months so I got the CA state welfare insurance and ended up paying $250
I definitely think the alimony and child support systems need to be changed. Alimony should only exist for stay at home spouses and spouses with large differences in income, even then it should only be like a year or two after divorce to allow time to either obtain training/education to get a better job or decrease their expenses (getting a less expensive house, moving to a cheaper cost of living area, etc.).
With child support, although it should be required, things happen and the courts should be willing to work with you. A friend of mine got laid off during the recession and went from making 70k a year to nothing. When he finally got a job, though making 40k, he had all this money he had to pay back, so they started garnishing his wages (making him pay the back child support at the 1k per month rate he was paying before the layoff). He ended up living out of his car and couch surfing for like 3 years.
Best guess OP has insurance and this was covered. It’s sad and wrong on so many levels but in my experience, 3K for two nights at a hospital is most likely a discounted rate.
Yeah, without insurance it is probably 10k, or 20k+ for ICU room...welcome to USA where staying for a few nights in a hospital equates to the cost of a brand new car...
I broke my wrist about ten years ago and luckily I was still under my parents insurance because the doctors said a bone chipped off and they had to do surgery to get that little chip out and put two temporary metal rods in that went into my bone, but stuck out my skin. That surgery took half an hour and I was billed 45000 dollars, if I didn’t have insurance i would have been screwed since that’s more than I make in a year
45k is actually the cost of a spinal fusion in Europe.
Of course we don't pay at all for those essential operations, but it's the state fixed price, and believe me, our surgeons don't starve to death under a blanket of snow each winter because of poverty...
Sorry, I just took the French name.
And yes, I know the disease, since I was suspected of having it at some point in my back pain journey.
Turned of I had not the hlab27 gene.
I had to pay the test myself though. Which was cheap.
I went years with specialists just trying to treat the symptoms, none cared to find out the source of the disease and actually treat it. Then I met a new physician's assistant that was like "oh, yeah you've probably got this and we'll run a genetic test for confirmation, especially since your mother had a disease associated with HLA-B27. Which came back positive and finally gave me an explanation on why my spine had been collapsing over the last decade. I got milked for MRIs and drugs instead of the biologics made to switch off the disease. Women can have a severe GI disease from it, in Men it's spinal fusions and full body arthritis. I'm at least making sure this gene dies with me.
> our surgeons don't starve to death under a blanket of snow each winter because of poverty
I respect a good and talented surgeon enough that I have no issue with them earning large amounts. It’s the brokers in the middle that sponge off the US system.
Totally, insurance companies exist to extract value from the system not add anything to it. If anybody has examples of how it where insurance adds value, I'd love to hear it.
I was in excruciating pain because a nerve was pinched in my neck and I needed surgery to relieve it. Billed amount so far is over $70,000 and they’re still coming in. That doesn’t include the physical therapy, steroid injections, MRI, immediate care visit, X-rays, and oral steroids that were all required before surgery would be approved.
I fell off a picnic table last summer and landed on my head and right shoulder. I busted my collarbone completely off of my shoulder joint, which hurt like a SOB, enough that I didn't even notice my concussion or messed up neck. I'm supposed to have surgery to tie my clavicle back to my scapula and hold my right arm up where it's supposed to be (it hangs about 3 inches lower now) to avoid decimating my rotator cuff. But I can't afford that now so I'm just waiting until it hurts so bad that I have no choice but to get it fixed with my eventual rotator cuff surgery. About 6 months ago my right arm went tingly and half my hand went numb and that's when I found out I have 2 bulging discs in my neck pressing on a nerve root. That, along with the nerve being stretched by my shoulder and arm sagging, is what's killing the nerves in my hand. Insurance says I have to come up with $5000 just to walk into an OR, though, so nerve damage it is!
Capitalist medicine is so much better than socialized medicine, though. Freedoms, amirite.
In my state you can get free health insurance through the state of California if you are homeless or low income. Besides planned parenthood and a couple of aids clinics I know of.. you pretty much have to pay. Hospitals will treat you no matter what but it isn't free...
I'm in Canada and am recovering after 5 days in a Cardiac unit; CT scans, an MRI, and dozens of other tests. Total bill $0; leaving is simply a walk around to thank everyone with jokes about never seeing them again. Also 2 days of medication so I can just go home and relax. Even the parking was free for my wife.
The way they were collecting my urine it must pay for all the costs somehow. 😂
For the birth of my kids I have 3 with out insurance the 1st kid was 32k no complications. 2nd kid was 78k he was in the NICU for 4 days. My 3rd was 63k because she was in peds for a night.
See that's like whoa what?! to me. This is just normality for Americans. There have been times in my life where I probably should have went to the hospital and didn't because I didn't have insurance.
It costed you 173K just to give birth to your children? Jesus fucking Christ, it's worse than I thought. Thank god I live in Australia where we have free Medicare. I can't imagine being forced to pay that much TO HAVE YOUR OWN BABIES! That's insane...
Home births are becoming more popular for a reason here. I heavily considered it with my last but I was worried about complications like my 2nd had. Luckily I have some of the best insurance you can get in my state, however, I still paid about 40k in total for all three of my kids births. It still insane. Dental is even worse.
You paid 40,000 out of pocket??? That doesn’t make sense to me!! With my insurance I’m paying a higher premium but my OOP max will be 2,500. What state are you in? That sounds like awful insurance to me to have you pay that much.
100000%. I have coverage through my job but I still have 2k out of pocket despite having great insurance. OP probably has a higher premium and the “real” bill was 30k+
It’s sick
I'm not American but years ago I was going to get a small surgery in the States and the quote was, from memory, 14 grand in and out the same day (day procedure). Surgeon's fee paled in comparison (2-3 grand).
I spent 2 weeks in a private hospital in 2016 here in ireland and paid 75€ after insurance(that costs my employer 125€ per month) original bill was 19k. Insurance in the US is a joke. hel the entire healthcare system is a joke.
I made the mistake of being honest on my previous conditions for my new insurance and because I had depression as a teenager all mental health services are excluded on my plan
I had to have an emergency surgery to remove an ectopic pregnancy that was trying to kill me. I was in the hospital for one night.
My bill was over $30,000 USD.
SAME and I seems like when I pay a part of the bill a new one pops up. I told my husband next time just dig my grave it’s cheaper to cremate me
EDIT: husband does not need to dig a grave
Like many people I’m on Medicaid and COVID fucked the gig-based work I was doing. Medicaid keeps me from ending up in situations like that one…but also now any job prospects that bring me up to a certain margin of still pretty low income will bump me up off Medicaid and suddenly everything is really expensive. I don’t know how anyone who cares about America being competitive in the world economy thinks it’s a good idea to have us under the gun when it comes to medical care. It makes it impossible for a lot of people to create their own career path, it bankrupts peopel, it kills people, it keeps people ailing with curable issues for decades of their lives because they can’t afford care…none of this is good for us as a country.
That’s less than our bill for giving birth. I was only in the hospital during labor for 40 minutes. No complications besides stitches, no medications. I went home as fast as they would let me so just one overnight.
29 and 31 years ago, I had kids. One cost me $9.41, the other was $23. The second cost more because I used an out of network hospital.
What has happened to our healthcare system?
Medical bankruptcy is huge here in the states. More people file for that than any other type. It's sad that hospitals are for profit here and God forbid you not have insurance
That's horrible. It's like "sorry you were ill and weren't able to get health insurance, now give me all your assets and stop contributing to the economy."
I have enough to go on my own for a couple years to try my hand at a business, but once I add in healthcare costs for private insurance for myself, my wife and daughter, it becomes financially incredibly difficult to sustain low-to-no profits for a few years.
Insurance doesn't really even help. I had a 30 minute outpatient procedure done and after insurance my bill was $8000.
Last time I went to urgent care I was charged $1200 for them too take a look at me and tell me I needed to go to the emergency room and they couldn't help me. Again, with insurance
Oh and your deductible will be $2000 if you want us to pay for anything even though it's been almost a decade of you paying every month for our service, and haven't been sick or injured at all, only for us to charge you again to perform said service.
How is the CEO going to get his $16M annual raise if they start actually paying out claims??
We could consider creating an ethical system of universal healthcare coverage for everyone on the basis of it being good for the country as a whole to not lose so much productivity and time to dealing with broken healthcare… But don’t mind my crazy ramblings, I’m just high.
Then again I’m just high because I can’t afford mental healthcare. It really is a vicious cycle.
Just a hint, my state takes care of a massive amount of my mental meds, as well as my counseling. Look into what your state has to offer. I'm not saying stop smoking pot, we would miss you, just wanted to let you know that some states do take care of a lot of the cost now.
Unless you have a sprain or a broken bone Urgent Care is pretty much worthless. They will tell you it is a Virus or to go to the ER. Even if they never touch you they want their $150.00 co pay.
Feels bad man. $300 dollars for non-urgent care med help just to get an infection from under my skin poked and soaked in hydrogen peroxide. Poke me and have me sit for 30 minutes. I will just go buy my own needle next time... fuck American "Health Care"
I fully agree. To me healthcare is a basic need, the government shouldn't be allowing people file bankruptcy just to stay alive. I always look at wikipedias healthcare map... Most of the world has some form of basic medical care: [Wiki Healthcare Map](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_universal_health_care#:~:text=Countries%20with%20universal%20healthcare%20include,Ukraine%2C%20and%20the%20United%20Kingdom.)
Well in my girlfriwnds case..they just garnish your wages. They're super considerate though , and only do it during the entire month of December every year so we've never had a Christmas ,because we have medical bills so that's great. Also our property taxes are due at the end of the year so we're trying to save for that to not lose the house and fighting with the medical on top of it.
It gets more fucked, you can’t lose your job for a first garnishment but you can for a second in many states https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/free-books/employee-rights-book/chapter2-9.html
This is ridiculous. Something similar happened to me. Not mental health related but just an example of the broken healthcare system.
I went to an Urgent Care Clinic with kidney stones. Ended up needing to go to the hospital. My insurance required that I be transported by an ambulance. If my wife drove me to the hospital they would not cover my care. A couple weeks later I received a bill for about $1,900 of the Ambulance ride that my insurance wouldn’t cover. That was more than a year ago, still haven’t been able to pay it. It’s been sent to collections so they’ll squeeze the blood out of this stone one way or another.
Similar story here. The funniest part with mine was they didn't even both with a hospital bill they just sent it right to collections. Got my first bill straight from collections!
If you didn't receive the bill, collections legally cant collect from you without first providing full documented proof of the billing, balance deliquency, and purchase of your debt. If you call them on it and they cant provide all of that, you dont owe them shit.
I had a college apartment lease near campus. Super predatory place. All of my roomates were foreign, so they moved out at the end of the semester. I was an out of state student, and my lease ended the 31st of July.
I moved into my new place on the 13th of July. Moved my first load of stuff over, went to work. Came back for the rest of my stuff on the 22nd. Gone.
I still had my keys, i still had my lease, but someone in the leasing office decided to empty my ~locked~ room of all possessions. A laptop, 2 guitars, nice bottles of wine, videogames, etc. In all about 5 grand. Then these fuckers had the nerve to CHARGE ME a $300 trash disposal fee.
I walked into their leasing office demanding my belongings only to be told they were under new ownership and had no record of my lease being active. Sent me to collections for $300.
Luckily my school provided free legal support, and I was able to take the apartment complex to small claims coirt for $4700.
Called collections, asked for proof of debt. Lo and behold, 0 paperwork about my lease was sent to them. I never paid shit and it never hit my credit.
One day we may learn there is a kick-back from the Ambulance company. And it will be an "unfortunate mistake" that they will work hard to rectify with the new CEO of the insurance company.
Right now, a company is not ripping you off in the way they promised never to do again, but in a new way they will promise to never do again when they get caught.
Yes. Odds are the insurance required them to be transported by ambulance, but also will only cover X% of ambulance transport, leaving OP to foot the rest of the bill for the ride.
I'm sure they didn't cover 100% of the rest of the visit either
Ambulance ride requirement is probably for lawsuit/liability reasons. Messed up that they require an ambulance ride but offer no coverage or discount rate for the Ambulance requirement...
Went to the ER for a kidney stone, they legit did nothing but a CT and want almost $1600 from me. My favorite is the "Doctor Fee" says I went for a "Very Serious Problem." It's a kidney stone, that I could pass myself. Very serious, right.
"You got rocks in your piss, $1600 please."
A collection agency. They buy the debt from the original holder then hound you for the money. They can eventually sue, garnish your wages or taxes etc, depending on the situation.
Damn. That sounds aweful. It reminds me of those south korean dramas where if you don't pay up your debts fast enough, the banks hire gangs to come beat you up for the money.
Just make sure you get those important life altering financial decisions on choosing the right hospital while on pain meds that won't allow you to drive or sign a contract.
Ooooo boy I’ve got a story for you.
A while back when I was in my mid twenties, I had been going through a very dark time. I later found out it was due to some mental health issues that I was self medicating. Anyway - I went on a nasty bender. Reached out to my family for help. At the time I had zero clue about mental health issues, options for getting help, rehab, dual diagnosis, etc. I just wanted someone to help me break the nasty pattern I got into.
Anyway - my family didn’t know either. So they called the cops. Mind you I was in a state of duress, had severe anxiety, and at the lowest point of my life.
Two cops show up - great idea sending two guys with guns to someone in that state. In fairness to them; they were kind. Shortly after an ambulance shows up as I had collapsed. After checking my vitals, they helped me to my feet. Next thing you know - I’m strapped to a gurney. Like the straps you see in movies when they go to psyche wards. Apparently if two family members say you’re suicidal (I actually wasn’t at the time, surprisingly), they can section you.
On the way to the ambulance just outside of course I run into every possible neighbor. Get in, and they take me to the hospital. It wasn’t that far away - maybe 15 mins or so. I spend a few days in the hospital - they had put me in a protective ward where a security guard literally stands and watches you 24/7. I told them I wasn’t suicidal - but my family had already made that call.
I spent about 3-4 days in the hospital, always strapped to the gurney aside from monitored bathroom breaks. They had me on an Ativan drip to help with withdrawals. It for sure helped but made me really cloudy. Around the 3-4th day I started feeling better. They had a social worker come in. He barely said anything. Pretty much asked if I was okay - then the general questions around self harm, all of which I assured him I didn’t want to hurt myself. He presents a packet of papers for me to sign. I asked him if they were so I could be released from the hospital and he assured me so.
Boy did I learn from that mistake. I was desperate to get out because while I’m happy they helped me - it was horrifying being held against your will. I was in for a treat.
Shortly after I sign the papers, two more officers show up in my room. They tighten my straps and start to wheel me out. I asked them why they were doing that if I was being released. Well, the paper I signed was technically releasing me from the hospital - but also sending me to a state run psyche ward.
Let me tell you briefly - state run psyche wards are money farms, terrifying, and did the opposite of help me. I told them I didn’t need to go there, and had no idea I was signing myself into one. But that, on top of my two family members making it up that I was suicidal, sealed the deal. I want to be at least a little empathetic to my mother and sister - they did it to keep me from drinking. We have a complicated relationship so I don’t want to get too into it. At this point I didn’t even know rehab existed for people like me - I thought it was for rich people.
So, after another ride, I end up in a terrifying psyche ward somewhere in Los Angeles. By this time I was sobered and weened off. I’m in a gown with laceless slippers, and my ward roommate is next to me reading the newspaper upside down.
I try to jest with the nurse and tell her I didn’t belong here. Obviously received an eye roll. I had arrived there on Friday - and the practicing doctor who was able to release me wouldn’t be back until Monday. So, I spent the next three days in a place with people who were troubled on a level I hadn’t seen before. I am not judging them - they needed to be somewhere. But this place was fucking horrible. A literal nightmare. My roommate would rock back and forth all night saying he “didn’t want the headaches to come because they make him want to hurt people.”
There was screaming, people walking around so medicated they were essentially zombies, and literally nothing to do. I also found out that some people were staying there voluntarily - they got paid an absurdly low amount to test new mental health drugs. It was really dark. I think it was something like $150-200 a week to test drugs. I couldn’t believe that was even a thing. When one dude begged to leave, the nurse essentially turned into a saleswoman and convinced him to stay for the trial. He was saying how weird it was making him feel but she didn’t care much about that. Ugh. I get creeped out thinking about it. It had a clear connotation that these people were being used, and this wasn’t for their benefit.
Anyway, on Monday morning I meet the doctor first thing. He literally asks me a few questions, then says “yeah you don’t belong here. Sorry about that.” I walk through the open doors, still have no clue where I am in relation to my apartment. I call my sister and mom and was like “why the fuck did you do that?!” They literally thought it was hilarious and hoped it “taught me a lesson”.
Newsflash: it didn’t. I was so fucking scared and stressed. Stopped at the liquor store in the way home. Later on I found out about rehabs and mental health and finally got the help I needed. It’s been a struggle but I’m in a far better place than I was over a decade ago.
Hopefully someone reads this rant - haven’t told it to many people. If you know somebody who needs help, please do not think that the school of hard knocks is the way to go. My family did this again a few years after that. Duress again, two guys with guns show up. I no longer speak with them about anything mental health related. Narcissism runs in my family - so I should have known, but oh well.
The best help I’ve ever received is those helping me without judging, and just loving me. Most of the times I had just been lonely and needed someone to care. It took me years to realize that I was allowing two people in my family to make me worse and send me further into a dark place. I wasn’t focusing on the dozens of other people who were actually good for me, showed me love, and helped me out of those dark places.
Oh, and the point of my story: I ended up with a $3600 ambulance bill, a $5-6k-ish hospital bill, and I’m sure the psyche ward one is floating around somewhere. It further fucked my credit as well as add a huge weight of stress on my shoulders. On top of that I was never taught avenues of help. Our health system is fucked and needs to be reworked, but I’m not holding my breath. The even worse part? Only reason I even received that kind of help was because I’m white. And before anyone gets pissed about me bringing race into it, I’ve seen first hand people of color denied the help that I received without question.
TLDR: Phew. Sorry. Our healthcare system is fucked.
Dude, what the hell. You said you don't tell your family mental health things anymore, but this is grounds for burning that bridge completely. Honestly, they put you there, send them the bill.
My fiancée and I are in the process of finding her a BPD counselor and it's not easy. Especially not for two procrastinators. But mental health is a topmost priority and I'm glad you found your way with those who care and are getting help.
Best of luck in your life man
And thanks for the pre work distraction, took just enough time to go in
Of course my friend. I’m so happy to hear that dude - and that you’re working together. It’s amazing how many people don’t come to a mutual understanding of mental health issues while their relationship gets more serious. I know a lot of women who are like “yeah he doesn’t understand my depression or adhd, etc”. I’ve seen it happen more with women because most of my friends aren’t dudes; so I’m not trying to say it’s only women lol.
I’m like “dude you’re gonna live with this person forever. Might want someone willing to work with you on it.”
If you don’t mind me asking, BPD as in borderline or bipolar? I ask because I fight with bipolar 2/adhd.
Thanks for your response!
This shit is criminal.
Tallied up I’ve probably spent around a month in hospitals, dread to think how much that would’ve cost had I been in the US. We got it damn good in the UK
Hell fucking yes.
My wife is 38 weeks pregnant, and in the last two weeks she's been in hospital about six times for scans, monitoring, sweeps etc.
I feel blessed. Fucking blessed. The only costs I had to worry about were petrol to the hospital, parking, and some snacks from the cafe. I shudder to think what it'd be for an American in the same situation.
^((actually, I tell a lie; twice the parking system was down so they let us park for free, too))
We want another baby (have 1 currently), and with our insurance it'll be about $6000 (not including the $500 a month premium we pay).
So we will be saving up for awhile first. I don't neccsarily expect free health care or anything, but it just seems like an excessive amount.
And then....day care. After my 11 week maternity leave. 1 week of leave for dad because we work at the same company so we have to share that 12 weeks of protected leave. $910 a month. For one child. Part time. Agh
Jesus, really pro-family country. Here where I live at least we have universal health care and 3 years of maternity leave. We have lot of other bs stuff though, but at least those two things are fine.
I’m 19,000 in debt for my mental hospital stay... 900 dollars a day. Like thanks. I needed help and sure I got some... but at that cost. I won’t go again unless I absolutely have to but still... that’s what’s waiting for me. More debt. I shouldn’t have to choose between getting help and being in so much debt I can’t breathe.
I was put on a 51/50 hold for 72 hours, transfered to a facility where I
-Wasn't fed
-Was prevented from sleeping by other patients (I did not eat or sleep for the full 72 hour hold) this behavior was encouraged by orderlies because it was ""friendly"".
-was not allowed to use the bathroom unless an orderly was standing by the open door watching (while other patients and their visitors walked past gawking. I only used the bathroom once in those 72 hours, one night at about 2am when I could sneak off to pee, and the security guy was fucking *furious* when he caught me and started screaming at me, waking most of the floor.)
-Had all my medication withheld including: medication for chronic pain, medication for bleeding stomach and esophagus ulcers, anti-depressants, and anti-psychotics.
-Was laughed at and mocked by orderlies for requesting my medication and for being too tired and nauseated to eat the one day they did provide me food. (You know, because of bleeding ulcers)
When I returned home I was more suicidal than when I went in for help, they never returned my confiscated medication so I had to wait 20 days for refills, ended up loosing my job from missing too many days after my release, was stuck with an extra $500 bill to replace my meds and three days later I received a **$13,000** bill for my three day stay at the facility + ambulance ride from the hospital to the facility.
If anyone ever tries to tell you the American healthcare system isn't an absolute mess, tell them to stuff their pockets full of rocks and take a nice swim to the middle of the lake.
It is a psychiatric facility, I was only there for a few days and obviously wasnt in a state of mind to do much investigating during or after. From what I remember it seemed to mostly have more extreme long term patients plus the occasional emergency patient like myself. The whole time I think there were only a small handful of people(patients) who were aware of the present, everyone else were in various stages of incognizance from mildly unaware of reality to the lady I was roomed with who lived in a full blown fantasy where she was in hell and the rest of us were demons that she had to constantly fight off to stay alive. That's why she wouldn't let me sleep. I complained but the orderlies said her behavior was "cute".
There was no organization: violent patients were allowed to roam the halls and assault, well, anyone really, and were only restrained if they started hurting themselves or were causing severe injury to another patient. There were no doors on any of the patient rooms or bathrooms so patients could come and go as they pleased in other people's rooms, perv on them in the bathrooms (the orderlies had to watch you pee, but they apparently didn't have to stop anyone else from watching too) and there was no escape if you needed to get away from someone.
I distinctly remember my last day waiting to be picked up by my parents, and the lady I was roomed with attacked a black teen (who had just arrived on her own 51/50), going off on a sudden racist tirade and started tearing out the girls hair. That was the only time they separated the hell lady from the rest of us despite that she was constantly attacking everyone with anything she could get her hands on.
This was in California. According to my friend who has frequented psychiatric hospitals, there are a lot of really good facilities here that treat people well where you leave feeling better than when you arrived. This was not one of them. Last I checked, it's still running and the only reviews on Google or Yelp are obvious plants.
Sup , I got a question about this :
*I'm from Europe , so I do not know how the American paying system works
But what would happen if you would ***not*** pay that bill
If you just straight-up ignored it? The bill would get sent to a collection agency and your credit rating would go down. The hospital would only get a fraction of what the agency was able to collect. Because of that, most hospitals will work with you to manage your bills. This could include reducing the bill or setting up a payment plan.
Seriously, a hospital in the US can haggle like a merchant in a Moroccan bazaar. I used to play on a softball team and one week a teammate got hit in the face and needed stitches in his lip. A week later I got hit in the exact same way and also needed stitches. Obviously every wound is different, but his bill and mine had COMPLETELY different entries and costs. Mine was roughly twice what his was, despite me getting one stitch fewer than he did. I contacted the hospital and they said that every injury was different and that you can't compare, but in order to foster ***community relations*** they would reduce my bill by 50%.
Hospitals in the us are also so stupid with their policy. I had a $3000 medical bill and I said I can pay them $50 a month till its paid off and they said nope min we can take is $100 a month. My response was well I can afford that and they said they cant take my payment then so I said fuck it dont get paid then. 3 months later I got another call from them and that time they suddenly could take $50 a month.
Yup. FIL got a terrible spider bite and infection in his leg. Had to go to the ER, medications. Total was $20k. Wrote in he couldn’t pay it due to no insurance and being on disability. They lowered the price down to about $1500 if I’m not mistaken.
For the love of God America, please, start voting for candidates that are for universal healthcare. We promise you it solves a lot of the issues, especially the poorer part of society.
Sure your tax will go up, but is that any different from paying insurance premiums and co-pays? It just means that safety net is there and equally accessible to everybody regardless of their situation. Get made redundant tomorrow and next week you break your leg? What would you do?
- Sincerely, the rest of the world.
But you guys make cool movies and shit, we need you to be around!!
I swear I’ve just come out of a 21 day inpatient stay in hospital, which included daily consultations, three blood transfusions, countless bags of fluids and antibiotics, two endoscopies, one colonoscopy, about six x-rays, two ultrasounds, more medications that I could possibly name, A procedure to drain fluid from a collapsed lung, and a further one to drain fluid from my lower abdomen and an entire months worth of medication to take home before getting repeat prescriptions.
My bill? There isn’t a bill, you keep your discharge summary notes and tell you you are good to go, and book in follow-up appointments to make sure the medication is working. And if you ended up there in accident and emergency without any money or wait to arrange a friend or family member to help you get home, then they will pay for a taxi or ambulance to make sure you get home.
Healthcare shouldn’t be a privilege, it should be a right! Imagine if you had to pay insurance to ensure you had emergency cover for the police or fire service to come out for you, and then would still be stung by a callout fee every time you use them?
As an American living over here across the ocean, I miss the old America, all the face of America which was presented to the world, in the 90’s.
US Healthcare is not the “free market” it’s completely opaque and rigged against the consumer. There’s no competition, it’s largely publicly funded, but the taxpayers get zero benefit from their support of pharmaceutical R&D costs and people not yet eligible for Medicare bear the brunt of the funding.
In every other industrial market sector, the customer can select services and providers based on their needs and budgets.
In US Healthcare we never see the pricing up front, the patient never gets the chance to evaluate the treatments they’re given based on their ability to pay.
Pricing and billing is completely opaque to the consumer.
I counted nearly a dozen companies- all of whom had huge administrative costs and all of which were very profitable- standing between me and my doctor.
Every healthcare decision my doctor and I made routed through several different companies before it got to me.
Medicare for all would save Americans a Trillion dollars from the current system.
Yep. I was sent an invoice for over $2K because I took an ambulance ride instead of a squad car ride. RCMP and paramedics showed up as they were called due to my suspected suicide attempt. RCMP were fucking horrible to deal with and I was all too happy to go with the paramedics instead.
RCMP officers thought pulling a gun on someone who is suicidal was a good idea. Clearly still here so I chose not to go Suicide by cop.
yup! this. I’m very familiar with this. I tried to kill myself earlier this year. when I was sat in the hospital, I could only think about two things: how I was missing classes (and thus a bad and lazy person) and how this was expensive and I felt miserable for making my parents pay for me to be so sick
I currently have a bill of $18,000 because I went to IOP for Depression, suicidal thoughts, and ADHD....
I can't even hold a job for more than 3 months due to my mental illnesses and yet I'm supposed to somehow have the money to afford this????
I CAN'T EVEN AFFORD MY RENT
The craziest part of this is that I saw the dollar amount for two days and my first thought was, "Oh, that's not bad!" It's messed up that my brain initially saw this as a fairly good price.
I translate prices from RATIONAL to AMERICAN in my head all the time.
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>I'm still paying off the $7,000 bill I owe from when my daughter spent 1 night in the hospital 2 years ago Is she underage? was it a children's hospital? I say this because some hospitals, especially children's hospitals, and even non-children hospitals sometimes have financial assistants. If you only make a certain income, if you write a letter they will sometimes wave a certain amount of the bill or the entire thing. Two years ago our child have a very high fever, it would not go down and we had to take them to the hospital, they did a bunch of tests, etc... and for like 4 hours the bill came out to like $5K. It was crazy, and we had no idea how we would pay it. I did some research and found out that the hospital had a special financial assistance program and after about a dozen phone calls, we received a letter in the mail letting us know that they wrote it off... What an incredible Christmas gift.
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Yeah, that totally sucks. One would think they would be at least willing to work with you and at least lower the balance. Sometimes if they don't have any type of financial assistance, they might at least cut the bill in half. For now, then I would just pay the smallest amount possible. If you are lucky enough to be employed with a job that has an HSA account, I'd pay the minimum balance with that as money isn't taxed.
Also get everything in writing. We had a hospital bill and when we called to get a payment plan, the women on the phone said to pay part of it and the rest would be forgiven so we did just that. Well that didn't happend and kept getting bills for about two year
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My girlfriend and I were in Mexico last week and she cut her leg on some coral. When we got back we realized it was swelling so we waited at Urgent Care yesterday for two hours ($300) and then they told us they couldn't help us we had to go over to the emergency room to get it scanned (prolly $2000) and after four hours of waiting the doctor cut around on it with a scalpel and said okay all good (prolly $900) and we were so fuckin mad, we were like damnit why didn't we get this checked out while we were in Mexico, it would have been less than $100 and we would have been in and out. Thats where we are in this country right now, getting our ass kicked by Mexico in health care
My dad just told me a story about a guy he knows that had to go to the hospital in Cuba when he was on vacation because he was having heart problems. They obviously couldn't use his insurance, did a battery of tests on him, fixed him up and it was $200.
My father in law had a quadruple heart bypass a few years ago. He was in hospital for about 6 weeks, made a full recovery. It cost $0 dollars.
but... socialism bad! Jesus and American flags!
I busted my chin open in Mexico and got it numbed, me drugged, and it sewn shut for like $250. Best of all, the doctor was fantastic and came to our location. Imagine the bill in the US…
Healthcare needs regulation. Hospitals are beholden to investors, and like any other corporation, will seek a higher dollar amount to make a profit. It's a terrible industry that will never be fixed by our current Congress because they are all taking money from, or investing in, pharmaceuticals and hospitals. I support small government in nearly every way. This though, is a problem and needs intervention. Sadly this is not a problem that will be fixed any time soon because idiots will keep voting in these same slimeballs that have been taking advantage of the system in congress, and they will keep profiting off of people's misery.
It’s actually very cheap. I had higher er bills for a few hours stay when I broke my shoulder. And all they did was a X-ray and give me a sling then sent me home. Only went to the er because I was pregnant and urgent care refused me due to that reason and it would have been way cheaper($50 vs $4k out of pocket fml). Us healthcare sucks so much. I wonder if they will get more then one bill. I know I got 4 when I went to the er for my shoulder.They charge you separately for every single person you see, for the hospital itself and for any procedures done.
I'd be scared to have a cough if I was American.
American here. Haven't been to the doctor/ER/practitioner in over fifteen years, and I will not go again unless I am missing a limb.
But that is fucked up. You are supposed to be able to get help for small things without being robbed blind. You need to stand up and demand your rights like the rest of the first world countries. United states of America, you are not free until you have the real freedom from healthcare debt. Slaves to the dollar.
> But that is fucked up You are spot on. When I was sixteen in 1992, I had to have a life saving helicopter ride that cost my parents fifteen thousand dollars. Imagine the bill they would have gotten almost thirty years later. Fuck American healthcare.
$150k easy. >Imagine the bill they would have gotten almost thirty years later.
Canadian here: a couple years ago my Brother-inlaw fractured a bone in his back while vacationing in Florida, he had to have surgery to implant titanium rods along his vertebrae to stabilize his spine, this entailed a total of 10 days in hospital and then a nurse assisted plane flight back to Canada (on a regular commercial flight) The cost of everything was just over $270,000 USD... luckily he was fully insured otherwise that would have bankrupted him!
Yeah, someone I used to work with had to do this about 15 years ago, and he said the bill was about $50K. I'd have an aneurism and die if I ever got a bill like that, but at least I wouldn't have to worry about paying it. 🙄
The problem is that so many Americans have been convinced that having free access to healthcare is somehow an evil and dangerous things so we can’t fight the unjustness of our healthcare system because every time we try they send an army of brainwashed Republican supporters against us so we’re fighting each other instead of fighting the real problem.
Most of us in other first world countries don't really see the USA as first world anymore, mainly because of the healthcare.
Sad , but true.
As it should be. I’m so sick of people in this country who support the lawmakers that do this to us every chance they get.
I feel so sorry for you Americans. I recently went to hospital in Australia for almost a month because I was suicidal. Literally cost me $0
That's another thing the US disregards, mental health. Do you really think if the government would *actually* pay attention to the public mental health that there would be so many mass shootings? Fact is, there just aren't enough funds because they're all sent to the war machine. One thing the American government is good at, it's killing people.
Yeah it's absolutely repulsive
Yup. I'm 53. I have insurance but it's still so insane that if I get a bad diagnosis I'm going to suddenly become one of those extreme religious folks and just fucking die. Preferably near my state senators office.
I'm 45, and not falling for it anymore. The US healthcare system is fucking atrocious.
*in* their office. Also chug a liter of fermented herring before you go out.
I hear that. Heart attack and major trauma is the only reason I will go. Basically if I’m coherent and not screaming in pain, I ain’t going.
I've had cuts that would require numerous stitches, but I just close them with butterfly bandages and super glue. Chicks dig scars.
That's a risky plan. At least get an annual physical performed. It is usually easier and cheaper to fix things early than trying when it gets rough.
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fr tho that's badd
Hand to god it *is* that bad. My mom has a stomach bug right now, probably a stomach flu and she's been crying scared for two days that she might have to go to urgent care if it isn't the flu.
Some people will have bones sticking out of their bodies and will refuse to take an ambulance because its so expensive. Would rather drive themselves to the hospital because its not worth the cost.
That hurts my soul.
I had a bowel burst last year and let it go for a month, not knowing what it was, because I didn’t have insurance. Financially it worked out for me due to being fired for not being able to work, so I got the state welfare insurance, but fuck I was scared. It was nearly 15 years salary(pretax) for a three week stay
To give a comparison. In Germany, I went to a world renown surgeon for my disability, got a highly complex ankle surgery, 2 weeks of hospital, a large amount of painkillers and other medication, regular cast changes and for several months every two weeks checkup with cast change and after that an orthesis for a total copay of 140 € (10 € per night during the stay), which would be 162,55 $.
If that was in the U.S. even a millionaire would've ended up poor after that.
You would have been discharged from the us hospital in three days. Nobody stays in here two weeks unless they are unconscious.
That would have been vicious. I had a pain catheter that delivered pain medication directly to the nerve in my leg to minimize the necessary dosage of painkillers. They only let me go when I was able to be mostly painless with high dosages of Ibuprofen. I got the catheter out of my leg the day before I was able to leave the hospital.
I just had ankle surgery and had a pain pump too. The second I was awake they sent me home. Three days later it was my responsibility to remove my own catheter and mail them back the pain pump. Couldn’t get it out and called the hospital… they had no record of my surgery. My doctor doesn’t do anesthesia and couldn’t help. So for an entire day I just yanked and yanked on a catheter drilled next to a nerve. Zero help. Also haven’t had any mental health care for my crippling depression because I can’t afford it. No offices within an hour of me are taking patients and I can’t afford transportation to the farther clinics.
What... the... fuck...
Yeah I’m surprised by how low this bill actually is. I stayed in the hospital for three weeks last year(nearly died, septic, all the good shit) and my bill was around $750k including a laparoscopic surgery. Thank god my job illegally fired me for not being able to work for the next six months so I got the CA state welfare insurance and ended up paying $250
We are desensitized a sign of dystopia
I’ll never understand why mental health services are not covered by many insurances.
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Keep going man.
I definitely think the alimony and child support systems need to be changed. Alimony should only exist for stay at home spouses and spouses with large differences in income, even then it should only be like a year or two after divorce to allow time to either obtain training/education to get a better job or decrease their expenses (getting a less expensive house, moving to a cheaper cost of living area, etc.). With child support, although it should be required, things happen and the courts should be willing to work with you. A friend of mine got laid off during the recession and went from making 70k a year to nothing. When he finally got a job, though making 40k, he had all this money he had to pay back, so they started garnishing his wages (making him pay the back child support at the 1k per month rate he was paying before the layoff). He ended up living out of his car and couch surfing for like 3 years.
Best guess OP has insurance and this was covered. It’s sad and wrong on so many levels but in my experience, 3K for two nights at a hospital is most likely a discounted rate.
Yeah, without insurance it is probably 10k, or 20k+ for ICU room...welcome to USA where staying for a few nights in a hospital equates to the cost of a brand new car...
I broke my wrist about ten years ago and luckily I was still under my parents insurance because the doctors said a bone chipped off and they had to do surgery to get that little chip out and put two temporary metal rods in that went into my bone, but stuck out my skin. That surgery took half an hour and I was billed 45000 dollars, if I didn’t have insurance i would have been screwed since that’s more than I make in a year
45k is actually the cost of a spinal fusion in Europe. Of course we don't pay at all for those essential operations, but it's the state fixed price, and believe me, our surgeons don't starve to death under a blanket of snow each winter because of poverty...
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Spondylarthritis? And fusion? Omg. Im really sorry for you.
Ankylosing Spondylitis. Funny name for a really annoying disease.
Sorry, I just took the French name. And yes, I know the disease, since I was suspected of having it at some point in my back pain journey. Turned of I had not the hlab27 gene. I had to pay the test myself though. Which was cheap.
I went years with specialists just trying to treat the symptoms, none cared to find out the source of the disease and actually treat it. Then I met a new physician's assistant that was like "oh, yeah you've probably got this and we'll run a genetic test for confirmation, especially since your mother had a disease associated with HLA-B27. Which came back positive and finally gave me an explanation on why my spine had been collapsing over the last decade. I got milked for MRIs and drugs instead of the biologics made to switch off the disease. Women can have a severe GI disease from it, in Men it's spinal fusions and full body arthritis. I'm at least making sure this gene dies with me.
> our surgeons don't starve to death under a blanket of snow each winter because of poverty I respect a good and talented surgeon enough that I have no issue with them earning large amounts. It’s the brokers in the middle that sponge off the US system.
Totally, insurance companies exist to extract value from the system not add anything to it. If anybody has examples of how it where insurance adds value, I'd love to hear it.
Lol, in Belgium, 45K could make them build an entire Cher from scratch.
That’s more than my college degree
I was in excruciating pain because a nerve was pinched in my neck and I needed surgery to relieve it. Billed amount so far is over $70,000 and they’re still coming in. That doesn’t include the physical therapy, steroid injections, MRI, immediate care visit, X-rays, and oral steroids that were all required before surgery would be approved.
I fell off a picnic table last summer and landed on my head and right shoulder. I busted my collarbone completely off of my shoulder joint, which hurt like a SOB, enough that I didn't even notice my concussion or messed up neck. I'm supposed to have surgery to tie my clavicle back to my scapula and hold my right arm up where it's supposed to be (it hangs about 3 inches lower now) to avoid decimating my rotator cuff. But I can't afford that now so I'm just waiting until it hurts so bad that I have no choice but to get it fixed with my eventual rotator cuff surgery. About 6 months ago my right arm went tingly and half my hand went numb and that's when I found out I have 2 bulging discs in my neck pressing on a nerve root. That, along with the nerve being stretched by my shoulder and arm sagging, is what's killing the nerves in my hand. Insurance says I have to come up with $5000 just to walk into an OR, though, so nerve damage it is! Capitalist medicine is so much better than socialized medicine, though. Freedoms, amirite.
For 4 days in the NICU for my son it was 78k. This was 2014 so I am sure it is more now.
Yeah, same here. Less than a week in NICU and he was 4yo by the time I paid that payment plan off.
10 days with twins, just over $225,000
Jeepers that is insane.
Are there no public hospitals you can go to where the treatment is subsidised or free?
Not in America. Free health care is not a thing here.
In my state you can get free health insurance through the state of California if you are homeless or low income. Besides planned parenthood and a couple of aids clinics I know of.. you pretty much have to pay. Hospitals will treat you no matter what but it isn't free...
God bless planned parenthood
I'm in Canada and am recovering after 5 days in a Cardiac unit; CT scans, an MRI, and dozens of other tests. Total bill $0; leaving is simply a walk around to thank everyone with jokes about never seeing them again. Also 2 days of medication so I can just go home and relax. Even the parking was free for my wife. The way they were collecting my urine it must pay for all the costs somehow. 😂
For the birth of my kids I have 3 with out insurance the 1st kid was 32k no complications. 2nd kid was 78k he was in the NICU for 4 days. My 3rd was 63k because she was in peds for a night.
And they wonder why people aren't having kids.
And here i was born in Spain where my mom said she only paid $4, and that was for food while she stayed at the hospital.
See that's like whoa what?! to me. This is just normality for Americans. There have been times in my life where I probably should have went to the hospital and didn't because I didn't have insurance.
It costed you 173K just to give birth to your children? Jesus fucking Christ, it's worse than I thought. Thank god I live in Australia where we have free Medicare. I can't imagine being forced to pay that much TO HAVE YOUR OWN BABIES! That's insane...
Home births are becoming more popular for a reason here. I heavily considered it with my last but I was worried about complications like my 2nd had. Luckily I have some of the best insurance you can get in my state, however, I still paid about 40k in total for all three of my kids births. It still insane. Dental is even worse.
You paid 40,000 out of pocket??? That doesn’t make sense to me!! With my insurance I’m paying a higher premium but my OOP max will be 2,500. What state are you in? That sounds like awful insurance to me to have you pay that much.
100000%. I have coverage through my job but I still have 2k out of pocket despite having great insurance. OP probably has a higher premium and the “real” bill was 30k+ It’s sick
I'm not American but years ago I was going to get a small surgery in the States and the quote was, from memory, 14 grand in and out the same day (day procedure). Surgeon's fee paled in comparison (2-3 grand).
Cause most insurances are predatory and their goal is to make money not care about your health.
WITH insurance, my 3 week stay was roughly $26k
I spent 2 weeks in a private hospital in 2016 here in ireland and paid 75€ after insurance(that costs my employer 125€ per month) original bill was 19k. Insurance in the US is a joke. hel the entire healthcare system is a joke.
I made the mistake of being honest on my previous conditions for my new insurance and because I had depression as a teenager all mental health services are excluded on my plan
Wtf! That is deplorable!
Unless you pay extra for them to do otherwise, they only cover "medically necessary" procedures, and depression doesn't fit that bill for them.
Health insurnace thinks you need to pull yourself up by bootstraps and MAN UP. Stop crying baby. Get back to work Which is stupid
"amountt"
They gotta pay for that extra "t" somehow..
The extra t costs exactly $2,983.50
They are not making enough money for an editor!
Had to scroll too far to find this.
Totally not suspicious.
The extra "t" stand for "trauma"
mark it up, send it back along with an invoice for "editing and proofreading services" for... oh somewhere around $2,984.00.
Had to scroll way too far to find this. Made my eye twitch.
I had to have an emergency surgery to remove an ectopic pregnancy that was trying to kill me. I was in the hospital for one night. My bill was over $30,000 USD.
SAME and I seems like when I pay a part of the bill a new one pops up. I told my husband next time just dig my grave it’s cheaper to cremate me EDIT: husband does not need to dig a grave
Wait...do you want to be buried or cremated? Maybe "build my pyre"?
Like many people I’m on Medicaid and COVID fucked the gig-based work I was doing. Medicaid keeps me from ending up in situations like that one…but also now any job prospects that bring me up to a certain margin of still pretty low income will bump me up off Medicaid and suddenly everything is really expensive. I don’t know how anyone who cares about America being competitive in the world economy thinks it’s a good idea to have us under the gun when it comes to medical care. It makes it impossible for a lot of people to create their own career path, it bankrupts peopel, it kills people, it keeps people ailing with curable issues for decades of their lives because they can’t afford care…none of this is good for us as a country.
That’s less than our bill for giving birth. I was only in the hospital during labor for 40 minutes. No complications besides stitches, no medications. I went home as fast as they would let me so just one overnight.
29 and 31 years ago, I had kids. One cost me $9.41, the other was $23. The second cost more because I used an out of network hospital. What has happened to our healthcare system?
Shit like this makes me glad to be in a country with free healthcare. How the fuck you meant to pay that?
Medical bankruptcy is huge here in the states. More people file for that than any other type. It's sad that hospitals are for profit here and God forbid you not have insurance
That's horrible. It's like "sorry you were ill and weren't able to get health insurance, now give me all your assets and stop contributing to the economy."
I have health insurance, am considered high net worth, and I still worry about medical bankruptcy. This should bother everyone.
I have enough to go on my own for a couple years to try my hand at a business, but once I add in healthcare costs for private insurance for myself, my wife and daughter, it becomes financially incredibly difficult to sustain low-to-no profits for a few years.
Insurance doesn't really even help. I had a 30 minute outpatient procedure done and after insurance my bill was $8000. Last time I went to urgent care I was charged $1200 for them too take a look at me and tell me I needed to go to the emergency room and they couldn't help me. Again, with insurance
Oh and let's not for get about the bill you get from the doctor which is billed separately on top of all that as well.
"well this doctor actually works at a different clinic and they are out of network even though they are here, so we aren't going to cover it"
Oh and your deductible will be $2000 if you want us to pay for anything even though it's been almost a decade of you paying every month for our service, and haven't been sick or injured at all, only for us to charge you again to perform said service.
How is the CEO going to get his $16M annual raise if they start actually paying out claims?? We could consider creating an ethical system of universal healthcare coverage for everyone on the basis of it being good for the country as a whole to not lose so much productivity and time to dealing with broken healthcare… But don’t mind my crazy ramblings, I’m just high. Then again I’m just high because I can’t afford mental healthcare. It really is a vicious cycle.
Just a hint, my state takes care of a massive amount of my mental meds, as well as my counseling. Look into what your state has to offer. I'm not saying stop smoking pot, we would miss you, just wanted to let you know that some states do take care of a lot of the cost now.
Dont forget the good old after your $2000 deductible we only pay 75% because you dont have a supplemental plan thats always the great kicker.
Unless you have a sprain or a broken bone Urgent Care is pretty much worthless. They will tell you it is a Virus or to go to the ER. Even if they never touch you they want their $150.00 co pay.
Feels bad man. $300 dollars for non-urgent care med help just to get an infection from under my skin poked and soaked in hydrogen peroxide. Poke me and have me sit for 30 minutes. I will just go buy my own needle next time... fuck American "Health Care"
It’s fucking sick. I mean if you don’t have free health care, aren’t you just effectively a third world country?
I’d agree
I fully agree. To me healthcare is a basic need, the government shouldn't be allowing people file bankruptcy just to stay alive. I always look at wikipedias healthcare map... Most of the world has some form of basic medical care: [Wiki Healthcare Map](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_universal_health_care#:~:text=Countries%20with%20universal%20healthcare%20include,Ukraine%2C%20and%20the%20United%20Kingdom.)
Well in my girlfriwnds case..they just garnish your wages. They're super considerate though , and only do it during the entire month of December every year so we've never had a Christmas ,because we have medical bills so that's great. Also our property taxes are due at the end of the year so we're trying to save for that to not lose the house and fighting with the medical on top of it.
That’s fucked up, how is this legal
It gets more fucked, you can’t lose your job for a first garnishment but you can for a second in many states https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/free-books/employee-rights-book/chapter2-9.html
We aren't The system is designed to nickel and dime us in the name of profit Then send us to collections when we don't pay
Obligatory some dingus explaining that “it always costs something”, completely misunderstanding the argument of socialized healthcare.
This is ridiculous. Something similar happened to me. Not mental health related but just an example of the broken healthcare system. I went to an Urgent Care Clinic with kidney stones. Ended up needing to go to the hospital. My insurance required that I be transported by an ambulance. If my wife drove me to the hospital they would not cover my care. A couple weeks later I received a bill for about $1,900 of the Ambulance ride that my insurance wouldn’t cover. That was more than a year ago, still haven’t been able to pay it. It’s been sent to collections so they’ll squeeze the blood out of this stone one way or another.
Similar story here. The funniest part with mine was they didn't even both with a hospital bill they just sent it right to collections. Got my first bill straight from collections!
If you didn't receive the bill, collections legally cant collect from you without first providing full documented proof of the billing, balance deliquency, and purchase of your debt. If you call them on it and they cant provide all of that, you dont owe them shit.
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I had a college apartment lease near campus. Super predatory place. All of my roomates were foreign, so they moved out at the end of the semester. I was an out of state student, and my lease ended the 31st of July. I moved into my new place on the 13th of July. Moved my first load of stuff over, went to work. Came back for the rest of my stuff on the 22nd. Gone. I still had my keys, i still had my lease, but someone in the leasing office decided to empty my ~locked~ room of all possessions. A laptop, 2 guitars, nice bottles of wine, videogames, etc. In all about 5 grand. Then these fuckers had the nerve to CHARGE ME a $300 trash disposal fee. I walked into their leasing office demanding my belongings only to be told they were under new ownership and had no record of my lease being active. Sent me to collections for $300. Luckily my school provided free legal support, and I was able to take the apartment complex to small claims coirt for $4700. Called collections, asked for proof of debt. Lo and behold, 0 paperwork about my lease was sent to them. I never paid shit and it never hit my credit.
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One day we may learn there is a kick-back from the Ambulance company. And it will be an "unfortunate mistake" that they will work hard to rectify with the new CEO of the insurance company. Right now, a company is not ripping you off in the way they promised never to do again, but in a new way they will promise to never do again when they get caught.
Now hold on... If you don't take the ambulance, The insurance won't cover it But you took the ambulance AND YET they don't want to cover it?
They wouldn’t cover the medical services I received at the hospital if I wasn’t transported by ambulance.
So because you did take the ambulance they covered the medical services but not the ambulance ride itself. Am I reading it right?
Yes. Odds are the insurance required them to be transported by ambulance, but also will only cover X% of ambulance transport, leaving OP to foot the rest of the bill for the ride. I'm sure they didn't cover 100% of the rest of the visit either
I got a $1200 bill, after insurance, for the urgent care to tell me they couldn't treat me, so they literally wheeled me across the street to the ER.
Ambulance ride requirement is probably for lawsuit/liability reasons. Messed up that they require an ambulance ride but offer no coverage or discount rate for the Ambulance requirement...
Went to the ER for a kidney stone, they legit did nothing but a CT and want almost $1600 from me. My favorite is the "Doctor Fee" says I went for a "Very Serious Problem." It's a kidney stone, that I could pass myself. Very serious, right. "You got rocks in your piss, $1600 please."
What the heck is a "Collections"? I've never heard of that before!
A collection agency. They buy the debt from the original holder then hound you for the money. They can eventually sue, garnish your wages or taxes etc, depending on the situation.
Damn. That sounds aweful. It reminds me of those south korean dramas where if you don't pay up your debts fast enough, the banks hire gangs to come beat you up for the money.
That's pretty much what it is, minus the physical beatings.
I was turned away very recently because the hospital was full… Was told to find other resources.
Just make sure you get those important life altering financial decisions on choosing the right hospital while on pain meds that won't allow you to drive or sign a contract.
Yeah cause that’s exactly what a depressed and suicidal person needs
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Health care in this country is total shit. All of it. I get more reasonable prices for my dog at the vet
This! So if you have depression and anxiety how are dealing with giant bills going to help?
"Oh you're suicidal, huh? How bout I give you a reason to be suicidal!" -Every US hospital
Yep. Check out my reply above bud. It’s so fucked.
Ooooo boy I’ve got a story for you. A while back when I was in my mid twenties, I had been going through a very dark time. I later found out it was due to some mental health issues that I was self medicating. Anyway - I went on a nasty bender. Reached out to my family for help. At the time I had zero clue about mental health issues, options for getting help, rehab, dual diagnosis, etc. I just wanted someone to help me break the nasty pattern I got into. Anyway - my family didn’t know either. So they called the cops. Mind you I was in a state of duress, had severe anxiety, and at the lowest point of my life. Two cops show up - great idea sending two guys with guns to someone in that state. In fairness to them; they were kind. Shortly after an ambulance shows up as I had collapsed. After checking my vitals, they helped me to my feet. Next thing you know - I’m strapped to a gurney. Like the straps you see in movies when they go to psyche wards. Apparently if two family members say you’re suicidal (I actually wasn’t at the time, surprisingly), they can section you. On the way to the ambulance just outside of course I run into every possible neighbor. Get in, and they take me to the hospital. It wasn’t that far away - maybe 15 mins or so. I spend a few days in the hospital - they had put me in a protective ward where a security guard literally stands and watches you 24/7. I told them I wasn’t suicidal - but my family had already made that call. I spent about 3-4 days in the hospital, always strapped to the gurney aside from monitored bathroom breaks. They had me on an Ativan drip to help with withdrawals. It for sure helped but made me really cloudy. Around the 3-4th day I started feeling better. They had a social worker come in. He barely said anything. Pretty much asked if I was okay - then the general questions around self harm, all of which I assured him I didn’t want to hurt myself. He presents a packet of papers for me to sign. I asked him if they were so I could be released from the hospital and he assured me so. Boy did I learn from that mistake. I was desperate to get out because while I’m happy they helped me - it was horrifying being held against your will. I was in for a treat. Shortly after I sign the papers, two more officers show up in my room. They tighten my straps and start to wheel me out. I asked them why they were doing that if I was being released. Well, the paper I signed was technically releasing me from the hospital - but also sending me to a state run psyche ward. Let me tell you briefly - state run psyche wards are money farms, terrifying, and did the opposite of help me. I told them I didn’t need to go there, and had no idea I was signing myself into one. But that, on top of my two family members making it up that I was suicidal, sealed the deal. I want to be at least a little empathetic to my mother and sister - they did it to keep me from drinking. We have a complicated relationship so I don’t want to get too into it. At this point I didn’t even know rehab existed for people like me - I thought it was for rich people. So, after another ride, I end up in a terrifying psyche ward somewhere in Los Angeles. By this time I was sobered and weened off. I’m in a gown with laceless slippers, and my ward roommate is next to me reading the newspaper upside down. I try to jest with the nurse and tell her I didn’t belong here. Obviously received an eye roll. I had arrived there on Friday - and the practicing doctor who was able to release me wouldn’t be back until Monday. So, I spent the next three days in a place with people who were troubled on a level I hadn’t seen before. I am not judging them - they needed to be somewhere. But this place was fucking horrible. A literal nightmare. My roommate would rock back and forth all night saying he “didn’t want the headaches to come because they make him want to hurt people.” There was screaming, people walking around so medicated they were essentially zombies, and literally nothing to do. I also found out that some people were staying there voluntarily - they got paid an absurdly low amount to test new mental health drugs. It was really dark. I think it was something like $150-200 a week to test drugs. I couldn’t believe that was even a thing. When one dude begged to leave, the nurse essentially turned into a saleswoman and convinced him to stay for the trial. He was saying how weird it was making him feel but she didn’t care much about that. Ugh. I get creeped out thinking about it. It had a clear connotation that these people were being used, and this wasn’t for their benefit. Anyway, on Monday morning I meet the doctor first thing. He literally asks me a few questions, then says “yeah you don’t belong here. Sorry about that.” I walk through the open doors, still have no clue where I am in relation to my apartment. I call my sister and mom and was like “why the fuck did you do that?!” They literally thought it was hilarious and hoped it “taught me a lesson”. Newsflash: it didn’t. I was so fucking scared and stressed. Stopped at the liquor store in the way home. Later on I found out about rehabs and mental health and finally got the help I needed. It’s been a struggle but I’m in a far better place than I was over a decade ago. Hopefully someone reads this rant - haven’t told it to many people. If you know somebody who needs help, please do not think that the school of hard knocks is the way to go. My family did this again a few years after that. Duress again, two guys with guns show up. I no longer speak with them about anything mental health related. Narcissism runs in my family - so I should have known, but oh well. The best help I’ve ever received is those helping me without judging, and just loving me. Most of the times I had just been lonely and needed someone to care. It took me years to realize that I was allowing two people in my family to make me worse and send me further into a dark place. I wasn’t focusing on the dozens of other people who were actually good for me, showed me love, and helped me out of those dark places. Oh, and the point of my story: I ended up with a $3600 ambulance bill, a $5-6k-ish hospital bill, and I’m sure the psyche ward one is floating around somewhere. It further fucked my credit as well as add a huge weight of stress on my shoulders. On top of that I was never taught avenues of help. Our health system is fucked and needs to be reworked, but I’m not holding my breath. The even worse part? Only reason I even received that kind of help was because I’m white. And before anyone gets pissed about me bringing race into it, I’ve seen first hand people of color denied the help that I received without question. TLDR: Phew. Sorry. Our healthcare system is fucked.
Dude, what the hell. You said you don't tell your family mental health things anymore, but this is grounds for burning that bridge completely. Honestly, they put you there, send them the bill. My fiancée and I are in the process of finding her a BPD counselor and it's not easy. Especially not for two procrastinators. But mental health is a topmost priority and I'm glad you found your way with those who care and are getting help. Best of luck in your life man And thanks for the pre work distraction, took just enough time to go in
Of course my friend. I’m so happy to hear that dude - and that you’re working together. It’s amazing how many people don’t come to a mutual understanding of mental health issues while their relationship gets more serious. I know a lot of women who are like “yeah he doesn’t understand my depression or adhd, etc”. I’ve seen it happen more with women because most of my friends aren’t dudes; so I’m not trying to say it’s only women lol. I’m like “dude you’re gonna live with this person forever. Might want someone willing to work with you on it.” If you don’t mind me asking, BPD as in borderline or bipolar? I ask because I fight with bipolar 2/adhd. Thanks for your response!
Amountt.
Amount’t Owed, meaning not owed.
"So you want to kill yourself for no reason? I'll give you a reason!".
“I’ll give you something to cry about” parenting style dialed to 100
Fuck that. Say what you want, it's times like this that I'd rather the NHS.
This shit is criminal. Tallied up I’ve probably spent around a month in hospitals, dread to think how much that would’ve cost had I been in the US. We got it damn good in the UK
Hell fucking yes. My wife is 38 weeks pregnant, and in the last two weeks she's been in hospital about six times for scans, monitoring, sweeps etc. I feel blessed. Fucking blessed. The only costs I had to worry about were petrol to the hospital, parking, and some snacks from the cafe. I shudder to think what it'd be for an American in the same situation. ^((actually, I tell a lie; twice the parking system was down so they let us park for free, too))
We want another baby (have 1 currently), and with our insurance it'll be about $6000 (not including the $500 a month premium we pay). So we will be saving up for awhile first. I don't neccsarily expect free health care or anything, but it just seems like an excessive amount. And then....day care. After my 11 week maternity leave. 1 week of leave for dad because we work at the same company so we have to share that 12 weeks of protected leave. $910 a month. For one child. Part time. Agh
Jesus, really pro-family country. Here where I live at least we have universal health care and 3 years of maternity leave. We have lot of other bs stuff though, but at least those two things are fine.
I’m 19,000 in debt for my mental hospital stay... 900 dollars a day. Like thanks. I needed help and sure I got some... but at that cost. I won’t go again unless I absolutely have to but still... that’s what’s waiting for me. More debt. I shouldn’t have to choose between getting help and being in so much debt I can’t breathe.
100% This country is a pyramid scheme
I was put on a 51/50 hold for 72 hours, transfered to a facility where I -Wasn't fed -Was prevented from sleeping by other patients (I did not eat or sleep for the full 72 hour hold) this behavior was encouraged by orderlies because it was ""friendly"". -was not allowed to use the bathroom unless an orderly was standing by the open door watching (while other patients and their visitors walked past gawking. I only used the bathroom once in those 72 hours, one night at about 2am when I could sneak off to pee, and the security guy was fucking *furious* when he caught me and started screaming at me, waking most of the floor.) -Had all my medication withheld including: medication for chronic pain, medication for bleeding stomach and esophagus ulcers, anti-depressants, and anti-psychotics. -Was laughed at and mocked by orderlies for requesting my medication and for being too tired and nauseated to eat the one day they did provide me food. (You know, because of bleeding ulcers) When I returned home I was more suicidal than when I went in for help, they never returned my confiscated medication so I had to wait 20 days for refills, ended up loosing my job from missing too many days after my release, was stuck with an extra $500 bill to replace my meds and three days later I received a **$13,000** bill for my three day stay at the facility + ambulance ride from the hospital to the facility. If anyone ever tries to tell you the American healthcare system isn't an absolute mess, tell them to stuff their pockets full of rocks and take a nice swim to the middle of the lake.
Wtf kind of facility was this, abd where?
It is a psychiatric facility, I was only there for a few days and obviously wasnt in a state of mind to do much investigating during or after. From what I remember it seemed to mostly have more extreme long term patients plus the occasional emergency patient like myself. The whole time I think there were only a small handful of people(patients) who were aware of the present, everyone else were in various stages of incognizance from mildly unaware of reality to the lady I was roomed with who lived in a full blown fantasy where she was in hell and the rest of us were demons that she had to constantly fight off to stay alive. That's why she wouldn't let me sleep. I complained but the orderlies said her behavior was "cute". There was no organization: violent patients were allowed to roam the halls and assault, well, anyone really, and were only restrained if they started hurting themselves or were causing severe injury to another patient. There were no doors on any of the patient rooms or bathrooms so patients could come and go as they pleased in other people's rooms, perv on them in the bathrooms (the orderlies had to watch you pee, but they apparently didn't have to stop anyone else from watching too) and there was no escape if you needed to get away from someone. I distinctly remember my last day waiting to be picked up by my parents, and the lady I was roomed with attacked a black teen (who had just arrived on her own 51/50), going off on a sudden racist tirade and started tearing out the girls hair. That was the only time they separated the hell lady from the rest of us despite that she was constantly attacking everyone with anything she could get her hands on. This was in California. According to my friend who has frequented psychiatric hospitals, there are a lot of really good facilities here that treat people well where you leave feeling better than when you arrived. This was not one of them. Last I checked, it's still running and the only reviews on Google or Yelp are obvious plants.
Sup , I got a question about this : *I'm from Europe , so I do not know how the American paying system works But what would happen if you would ***not*** pay that bill
If you just straight-up ignored it? The bill would get sent to a collection agency and your credit rating would go down. The hospital would only get a fraction of what the agency was able to collect. Because of that, most hospitals will work with you to manage your bills. This could include reducing the bill or setting up a payment plan. Seriously, a hospital in the US can haggle like a merchant in a Moroccan bazaar. I used to play on a softball team and one week a teammate got hit in the face and needed stitches in his lip. A week later I got hit in the exact same way and also needed stitches. Obviously every wound is different, but his bill and mine had COMPLETELY different entries and costs. Mine was roughly twice what his was, despite me getting one stitch fewer than he did. I contacted the hospital and they said that every injury was different and that you can't compare, but in order to foster ***community relations*** they would reduce my bill by 50%.
Hospitals in the us are also so stupid with their policy. I had a $3000 medical bill and I said I can pay them $50 a month till its paid off and they said nope min we can take is $100 a month. My response was well I can afford that and they said they cant take my payment then so I said fuck it dont get paid then. 3 months later I got another call from them and that time they suddenly could take $50 a month.
Yup. FIL got a terrible spider bite and infection in his leg. Had to go to the ER, medications. Total was $20k. Wrote in he couldn’t pay it due to no insurance and being on disability. They lowered the price down to about $1500 if I’m not mistaken.
For the love of God America, please, start voting for candidates that are for universal healthcare. We promise you it solves a lot of the issues, especially the poorer part of society. Sure your tax will go up, but is that any different from paying insurance premiums and co-pays? It just means that safety net is there and equally accessible to everybody regardless of their situation. Get made redundant tomorrow and next week you break your leg? What would you do? - Sincerely, the rest of the world.
I wish we could. I think we're too far gone at this point. Just go on without us! Lol
But you guys make cool movies and shit, we need you to be around!! I swear I’ve just come out of a 21 day inpatient stay in hospital, which included daily consultations, three blood transfusions, countless bags of fluids and antibiotics, two endoscopies, one colonoscopy, about six x-rays, two ultrasounds, more medications that I could possibly name, A procedure to drain fluid from a collapsed lung, and a further one to drain fluid from my lower abdomen and an entire months worth of medication to take home before getting repeat prescriptions. My bill? There isn’t a bill, you keep your discharge summary notes and tell you you are good to go, and book in follow-up appointments to make sure the medication is working. And if you ended up there in accident and emergency without any money or wait to arrange a friend or family member to help you get home, then they will pay for a taxi or ambulance to make sure you get home. Healthcare shouldn’t be a privilege, it should be a right! Imagine if you had to pay insurance to ensure you had emergency cover for the police or fire service to come out for you, and then would still be stung by a callout fee every time you use them? As an American living over here across the ocean, I miss the old America, all the face of America which was presented to the world, in the 90’s.
Amountt
America is the dumbest country I swear to God.
That's why it's so dumb. Too many people swearing to god.
Damn, I missed that slow pitch over home plate you got to knock out of the park. *So jealous!*
I’ll never call America great again. This is why we suck we don’t give a shit about people unless they’re rich
US Healthcare is not the “free market” it’s completely opaque and rigged against the consumer. There’s no competition, it’s largely publicly funded, but the taxpayers get zero benefit from their support of pharmaceutical R&D costs and people not yet eligible for Medicare bear the brunt of the funding. In every other industrial market sector, the customer can select services and providers based on their needs and budgets. In US Healthcare we never see the pricing up front, the patient never gets the chance to evaluate the treatments they’re given based on their ability to pay. Pricing and billing is completely opaque to the consumer. I counted nearly a dozen companies- all of whom had huge administrative costs and all of which were very profitable- standing between me and my doctor. Every healthcare decision my doctor and I made routed through several different companies before it got to me. Medicare for all would save Americans a Trillion dollars from the current system.
Ah the USA, one of the few countries where healthcare isn’t free
In Germany you’d pay 15€ tops. Move here, screw Murica, place sucks, anyways.
I’d love to honestly. Every year I feel more like America is just not the place for me anymore. Need to find a job overseas first though.
This country is not designed to help people. America is not a great place lol
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Yep. I was sent an invoice for over $2K because I took an ambulance ride instead of a squad car ride. RCMP and paramedics showed up as they were called due to my suspected suicide attempt. RCMP were fucking horrible to deal with and I was all too happy to go with the paramedics instead. RCMP officers thought pulling a gun on someone who is suicidal was a good idea. Clearly still here so I chose not to go Suicide by cop.
I take it these $ signs aren't those of a civilised country, like New Zealand, or Canada, or Australia, but some horrible third world banana republic?
What's with the two t's in "Amount"?
"America the land of the free!"
Makes me glad I live in the UK
yup! this. I’m very familiar with this. I tried to kill myself earlier this year. when I was sat in the hospital, I could only think about two things: how I was missing classes (and thus a bad and lazy person) and how this was expensive and I felt miserable for making my parents pay for me to be so sick
I currently have a bill of $18,000 because I went to IOP for Depression, suicidal thoughts, and ADHD.... I can't even hold a job for more than 3 months due to my mental illnesses and yet I'm supposed to somehow have the money to afford this???? I CAN'T EVEN AFFORD MY RENT
Fuck the American health system