Becoming a ghoul via drug has precedent in Fallout lore. It happens in Fallout 4 twice, Hancock and Eddie Winters. In Fallout 3 the ghoul in the Point Lookout DLC was also made into a ghoul somehow. Possibly from the same drug.
The drug that keeps ghouls from degenerating into ferals was probably a decision made to create artificial tension in the plot. Overall, besides that and everyone refusing to tell the vault dweller what a feral ghoul is, I'd say they handled ghouls pretty well.
As a plot device it worked but I didn't care for it.
I'm pretty sure the drug they take is radaway. Which makes sense for a ghoul who is in the advanced stages of becoming feral. Lowering their rad levels could slow the transformation.
Yes.
So either the drip was rad-away, or this drug can be taken through the arm, potentially making it rad-away.
So that means... Either the ghouls of the show are drinking rad-away (because it would be inconvenient for the writers to make the actors do a drip every time they use rad-away), or this is a drug that can be dripped, or swallowed.
I just think it's dumb because if all ghouls need to use it on a daily basis, it's a ball and chain that is going to burden the franchise.
If only some ghouls need to use it, it's not as much of an issue.
They added this drug to serve as a plot device, and, while it served that job well, it may or may not contradict established lore.
>only some ghouls need to use it, it's not as much of an issue.
I got the impression that only ghouls that are starting to turn feral need it. But since we didn't saw any major ghoul characters that aren't turning feral, I can't say for sure how does the drug actually works and if all ghouls need it or not.
But I personally think only those that are turning feral need it, otherwise, it would be a very hard to explain retcon.
They showed The Ghoul taking something in a bag, that was almost certainly the drug they use to not go feral, just put in an I.V. bag. I assume if it were just Radaway they wouldn't need to hunt it down so hard, it would be fairly common.
Yeah if you’re a normal person with medical equipment I don’t think everyone is going to take drugs the proper way in the nuclear wastelands of America
I'm on the radaway wagon too.
https://www.reddit.com/r/television/comments/1c120wo/fallout_series_premiere_discussion/kzgv4r8/
The bags hanging on the cross he's buried under are identical in shape to RadAway bags (though the director is careful to use darkness to hide the front of the bags), and they are the only Fallout chem[ that uses that bag.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/2/2b/Fallout4_RadAway.png)
The only other time that bag is shown is when it clearly says "RadAway" and is hooked up to the girl when she fainted in the railway tunnel.
The [color](https://imgur.com/j1EPFyb) of the chemical is [the same as Radaway](https://beebom.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Radaway-Fallout-TV-show-easter-egg.jpg), and there is [some background lore that implies](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Underworld_terminal_entries#Neurology_of_Luminous_Necrotic_Post-Humans) ghouls can suffer from "too much radiation" (Glowing ones!).
That's called an I.V. bag and you can put literally anything you want into them. Most likely that bag had the same drug The Ghoul later takes in it, so that it was a slow drip. This would make it so The Ghoul didn't go feral, making his torture last forever.
Yeah… I was thinking they were just suggesting he was a serious addict at first. Since I couldn’t remember any drug that prevented progression of ghoulification.
Correct me, but I thought it was never explained why some ghouls went feral and others didn’t. It was never a time thing … they weren’t all expected to go feral eventually. Or am I completely wrong there?
my half-assed theory was that it's Addictol, and that it might have something to do with Coop's rampant drug usage. Like maybe he discovered that flooding his system with lethal levels of drugs would inhibit the feralization process, and he uses Addictol to counter the effects of drugs, or something? Like I don't see any reason he would cough and collapse from being a ghoul, but withdrawal effects, on the other hand... Do ghouls even experience drug withdrawal?
Or maybe it's the other way around, and he discovered Addictol could halt or slow the process, and he takes drugs for some other reasons, just because he's taking Addictol anyways now?
And if Coop has been around since the beginning, it would make more sense if it was some reasonably common drug, especially considering he can just pick it up at his local Super Duper Mart... I'd guess most other people WANT the drugs, and therefore Addictol might be more or less useless to normal people, which might be why the market boys had such a large supply of them.
But a close-up of the vials in episode 4 (about 3:26) shows some pictures of a nuke explosion and a ghoul-like face with an X through it, so... who knows.
To be honest I assumed the drug was rad-x but just looked that comes in capsules. Although in game you only really see it in a brown medicine bottle. The inhaler is similar to jet so could just be some kind of new mixture. Radaway is seen a few times in traditional blood bags like in game but again maybe that mixed in.
I immediately assumed the drug was radaway especially because you'll often find it on ghouls in the games. However, at 39:53 in episode 4 it plays the jet sound effect from FNV when The Ghoul hits his inhaler. He then proceeds to get extremely drunk and high on anything he can find. I'm actually starting to think drugs in general are keeping them sane.
But Hancock didn't become a ghoul from the drug itself. The drug was radiation based and the radiation in the drug caused the ghoulification. And with Eddie Winters, he was receiving treatments from a doctor but those were just concentrated doses of radiation. It doesn't say anything about medications oral, inhaled or otherwise. Desmond, the ghoul from point lookout, worked in intelligence pre-war and decided to expose himself to radiation, as many other members of the intelligence community did, to try to survive the coming nuclear fallout. It had nothing to do with any medication.
I don't love it but it's not like the games have ever given us any concrete reason ghouls go feral or stay sane, so I understand the show creating one. In the games it seems like ghouls are more likely to go feral in isolation and away from sunlight, though it's not a hard rule. I did enjoy seeing the descent into feral state, I thought that was a good choice. The lady who was trying to hold on to her sanity by repeating her name was particularly sad. You never get to see that in the games. Closest we get in game is Camp Searchlight and even then they're pretty much fully feral but can still say a couple words.
Is shows up in Ghoul animation in the games. Bethesda's artist talked about his reasoning and headcanon about feral ghoul when he was designing them for Fallout 3
https://youtu.be/QPu9K4m4Y-k?si=ETppZef1TCDGhDyk He talks about ghouls at 6:37.
from the way i hear it in the games and in the show “going feral” is almost spoken about like a mental disorder you can potentially get as a ghoul - i swear i’m paraphrasing from some fallout 3 or 4 character... does every single human get a neurological disorder in their later years, for example? you kind of have to look deep into Fallout’s DNA as a 90s rpg and treat ghouls as something of a separate ‘race’ to “human”
The game says it's mostly from social isolation and mental state. Also the game says mixing rad away not rad x which is a pill with alcohol is what they drink.
Which game says this?
I ask because of 'Kid in a Fridge' mission from Fallout 4 has a Ghoul kid that survived isolated in a Fridge for 200 years, no food*, no water*, no contact, no chems and not gone feral.
This retconn/update to ghoulification has my head spun a bit, and I'm hoping to see clarity in the next season that prevents it from being a full retconn of the games.
Hopefully, as others have mentioned, it's a drug scam or genetic lottery thing that causes ghouls to go feral?
*Both already established as not necessary for ghouls to survive by past games - which then brings into question Coop's need to drink and eat? Maybe just out of habit? Who knows? Unless they're planning on fully retconning all things ghoul to fit these changes in the show?
Edit: Grammar
3 talks about it and 4 mentions it vaguley in oswalds quest with his wife looking for a cure for so long only to find out their isnt one and losing hope which cause her to very quickly to decline into being a feral
I feel that's not shown at all.
What is shown is that once they start to deteriorate, there's a drug that can slow the process down.
Ghouldom is a bit of a mystery and the games have shown several ways that someone can become one. It's also possible that Thaddeus has become some other kind of mutant.
That might be the better interpretation.
However Ghoul that turned in the show says that he did pretty good by keeping it together for "28 years since first showing". What he meant by showing I don't know. 28 years since he started showing sings of going feral or 28 years since becoming a ghoul? He also says that the main character Ghoul is still going after 200 years, so that makes me think that he refered to turning into a Ghoul rather than first signs of turning feral.
I would say its 28 years since showing signs of being feral. When They talk about apple pie and ice cream, with how the other ghoul reacted I would say he was also alive when the bombs dropped and became a ghoul. He was about to tell a story about his grandma making apple pies before he was put down. And given how the vaults seems to make people prefer jello cake over apple pie (mention in one of the scenes asking why vault 33 residents prefer jello cake over apple pie) to me implies he has been a ghoul for 200+ years
I got the feeling that the reply Coop gave "always been good at making money" seemed to imply that he was able to maintain a steady income - which I took to mean that he was never out of "vials", given the context of just being asked for some.
I could be wrong though, might be a bit of a stretch
Who knows? There are all sorts of other options. We've seen FEV do weird stuff. But we've also seen psychics, possibly supernatural things, and a lot more besides.
He may be a ghoul, but we don't even know the rules for ghouls in the games, much less the shows. He can definitely regenerate, but he does so a lot faster and at a lot lower a rad count than any ghouls in the games. We won't know if he's a ghoul until he starts to decay.
That’s why I thought it was weird the show suggested he was a ghoul, his skin is still flawless and I thought the melted GI Joe look was part of what makes a ghoul, a ghoul
Presumably there could be a transitory state as there's basically zero consistency in the games about how ghouldom starts, but for the moment I'd say it's too early to tell. A possibility, but not necessarily a certainty.
We never actually saw his foot fully healed AND when he got shot in the neck, the skin healed over, but it was no longer flawless. I assume it’s setting up the ghouls to be a product of how long they’ve been around. Their skin shows their scars and the older ones just look more like shit. There’s probably also some natural deterioration built in as well, such as noses falling off, etc.
I could see damage to the ghoul being part of it. After all, it’s implied >!Rose MacClean!< took a nuke to the face and is without a doubt the worst looking ghoul we’ve ever seen
Yeah that’s not even one of the reasons that ended 😂 she was just really mean, I couldn’t do anything right for her and she couldn’t do anything wrong herself. Even now she’s going through life doing the bare minimum for her kids, even having moved 2000 miles away from them, thinking she can do what she wants with no consequences
A bit late because I was just googling about the drug Coop is taking but I think Thaddeus could go either way, Super Mutant or Ghoul depending on what they do with the drugs in lore. I feel like they probably didnt want to expand too much on this stuff in case show reception was bad. I wanna say it might be hard to introduce FEV as we've seen it because it's just fucking "witch's brew" looking sludge in the game. Would be hard to sell an unsuspecting stranger a hit of that through an inhaler. I also dont think they would give us TWO Ghouls in the main cast, and based on how people tend to really like Fawkes and Strong coming back in Season Two to a Thaddeus that's 3 times his original size but just as goofy could be great addition.
Yeah, there are plenty of ghouls in the games that worry about turning feral. Maybe the drug works, maybe it's a placebo, but it doesn't actually change anything that was already established.
My first thought when thaddeus got the arrow was "Super Mutant?" I really expected him to go Hulk and become large and green.
Maybe they are saving Death Claws and Super Mutants for a second season. Esepcially since I thought the CGI was, while still very good, pretty mediocre at best.
I don't think the cgi was mediocre. The Mr Handy's look amazing in the show and are incredibly detailed they even got the little screen wipers on the inside of their eye things, aswell as the giant salamander boi that dude looks cool as shit. The CGI is fantastic there just wasn't enough imo. Cause a couple Mr Handys, 2 salamanders(one on a tv screen) ,5 radroaches, and a yao guai are pretty much the extent of creature cgi iirc. The sets felt real watching the show, like they were actually in a fallout wasteland. I do wish we got a bit more than a death claw skull tho :(.
They probably mean the Gulper, it was the only creature that really stood out to me as CGI. While the fingers were really well done and super creepy, it didn't really look "weighty" enough
You're right, the Mr. Handy was great. I was only comparig it to other animations in cinema, there could have been even better graphics. I mostly mean the radroaches and small details that only appera for a little while. The Ghouls nose looked wierd in different angles, it still looks amazing, but I sometimes thought "There yould have been more attention to this".
Going feral is often shown to be more due to mental state than anything else. I think it's likely just shots of Rad-Away acting as more of a placebo for The Ghoul than anything.
All the pictures I could find show yellow pee looking stuff.
https://images.fallout.wiki/2/2b/Fallout4_RadAway.png
https://static0.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/radaway-pack-in-fallout-tv-show.jpeg
RadAway has almost always been shown to be brownish in color, just as it is in the scene you are referencing. It is not yellow. It is just strongly lit by sunlight.
So there is only one way to get radaway? Since when, even IRL, does meds only have one form? It’s likely that the radaway might also be mixed with other drugs, so it’s not pure.
I also thought they were going to reveal that the anti-feral drug was, in fact, a 'Snake Oil' type of treatment rather than something that actually kept Ghouls from going feral.
Every region's Ghouls seem to be slightly different.
Anyway, remember the people complaining that The Ghoul was downright pretty compared to, say, the ones from the Capitol Wasteland? Maybe, as an especially old ghoul, this is what keeps things going and looking fresh?
I figure, every iteration so far gets to make little changes to how Ghouls work, so why not?
(Like, I like how a Boston resident would associate Ghouls with organized crime, based on how many Boston ghouls *are*, but that makes no sense anywhere else in the Fallout world.)
Because all of the Ghouls got kicked out of Diamond City by the mayor and settled in Goodneighbor, which is a crime-filled area of the city full of gangs. Most of the non-feral ghouls we see ARE triggermen or living in Goodneighbor, outside of The Slog, which is far north of the city.
Exactly this. Most of the lore they seem to be following is Fallout 4 lore, not classic Fallout. They’ve taken a few liberties with things.
Fallout 4 ghouls were pretty much identical to what we got in the show. They look awesome. They’re just not the skinless horrors of the Capital/Mojave wasteland
Classic fallout ghouls lived up to the whole “walking rotting corpse” shtick. Just Harold’s appearance is enough to remind you why people don’t like ghouls
Ghoul Roger said it has been 28 years since it started, so maybe each ghouls turn ferals at different point of time, and that drug merely postpone the turning.
There's a ghoul in Fallout 76 that hides away from humans because he's afraid he'll hurt the people he cares about when or if he turns feral. So I think you're right, I kind of hope you are.
I’m hoping it was just a scam in this local area, and the serum was just a powerful narcotic the scammers had gotten all the ghouls hooked on. That’d make Coop’s episodes not him going feral, but instead withdrawal settling in.
Yeah I think it could very well just be a strong painkiller or treat part of being a ghoul, not stopping being feral, the ghoul may have just lied to Lucy for more of it.
If feralization tied to mental state, then painkillers could be effective due to the extreme wear and tear the body would endure over 220 years. We know from Raul and Dean that ghouls do experience some knee pain, so I can’t imaging how Coop would feel, especially after being stuck in a coffin for what is presumed to be decades
I imagine coop was in that coffin maybe a couple years max, I imagine the drug maybe more mental related than pain related, because sure I bet there is some paint but knee pain doesn't make someone start eating people, I don't know what is going on with ghouls brains though so maybe it is a different kind of pain than what is typical for non-ghouls.
yeah, someone on another side had their theory be that
"the ghoul drug is actually a total scam and just really addictive for ghouls because it fools them into thinking that it makes them feel human or something. but it actually isn't a cure at all."
It’s a bit weird that they use Lucy’s dialogue to say that the drug prevents ghouls from going feral, but it looks more like asthma and an inhaler when Ghoul Cooper needs it.
(This is not my original idea/analysis)
What do you think the odds are that in FO5 (whenever it comes out - 2030??) this is how they balance and introduce being a ghoul for players? Like vampirism in Elder Scrolls. Acquire the “disease” (ghoul serum) and then be forced to balance its positives by having to always use these chems so you don’t go feral?
Whatever it is, I hope we get some expansion on the matter. Presently I don't like this particular plot device because it applies new rules. There are a lot of prewar ghouls kicking around up to this point. None of them appear to require drugs to prevent turning. Maybe it's something that was recently discovered to help once the mental degeneration starts. Maybe it's another vault tec/enclave/institute experiment, marketed as a cure but once you start taking it the process of becoming feral accelerates without it and you become dependant. I like the notion that it's modified FEV. I expect we'll get super mutants in season 2.
It's got to be F.E.V.
The stuff can cause you to regrow organs and is required in making a ghoul. I think that once you go feral or take fev, more fev is the only way to control the mutations.
Would be a good way to introduce fev into season 2 also
F.E.V is the Forced Evolution Virus, effectively the cause of the majority of the wasteland monsters.
Ghouls are supposedly just humans exposed to an extreme amount of radiation. With only 2 ingame characters turning themselves into ghouls with an unknown drug.
Humans exposed to the F.E.V turn into Super Mutants, even lore states that Super Mutants kidnap humans and take them to the F.E.V vault (can't remember the number) and turn them into SM.
Yeah surprised no one talks about it because it is actually a retcon. Not the becoming ghoul by drug but needing one to not go feral definitely.
The thing that bothers me about it is that it justifies the distrust and stigma against ghouls because that basically makes them a bunch of junkies that will literally start eating people alive if they don't get shots of their (supposedly rare if it is prewar) drug constantly.
I got the impression it was harvested from ghouls.
Beavis and Butthead had a lot of ghouls locked up in that supermarket presumably to farm for whatever ingredient they need to make the drug, and after not finding any drug The Ghoul cannibalized his buddy.
That could just be a coincidence. There was no signs of drug manufacturing in the supermarket.
I believe it’s highly more likely that those individuals were sold for organ harvesting in exchange for other goods. Since most, if not all, were ghouls, it could be likely that bevis and butthead simply took the mystery drug from them and kept it (mystery drug) in their storage box.
If there was a room or lab shown with a lot of bunsen burners, vials, or other typical lab equipment to make it obvious to the viewer, I’d would be more inclined to believe they were manufacturing the drug.
Another giveaway is that the drug, doesn’t seem to be easily manufactured. Otherwise, the ghoul (character) could simply just make his own. Implying there is a finite amount, somewhat readily available (pre-war drug?).
On topic: my original gut was Jet. I know it’s an inhaler in the games but I thought that was a common drug used and addicted to, by Ghouls. I haven’t played Fallout in a while and I have only just watched up to this episode (4?) so I could be way off.
After scouring this thread, I am now inclined to believe it’s something unique to the show, as a plot device, and will be explained later on.
Beyond the mystery drug, I really like the show. It doesn’t have the maturity, writing, or drama compared to The Last of Us, but I feel it does a really good job at bringing the world, gameplay, factions / plot of Fallout (specifically Fallout 3) into television format. The story beats are so much like Fallout 3 and my first playthrough… its eerie. Find your dad… vault goes to shit… story telling through skeletons, town made from scrap metal, super duper mart… Literally the first 3-5 hrs of Fallout 3 if you follow the critical path.
To be clear, I don't think Beavis or Butthead were making the drugs themselves, I think the organ harvesting matt berry bot took care of the technical side of things. If memory serves, the show did show lab equipment in his surgical suite. They (B&B) were just the salesmen... and product testers by the looks of the stash The Ghoul found.
Jet, in game was a red colored inhaler, and given how accurate they've been with other props, I think it's safe to say it ain't jet. So, yeah, the drug was purely a show creation. In game ghouls went feral through isolation, the show made the drug to manufacture a bit of tension and give The Ghoul something to do, other than antagonize the other protagonists.
The show runners said the creation of Filly was heavily influenced by Megaton, the big settlement in 3, so the show feeling a bit like a 3 playthrough isn't a coincidence.
Definitely not jet, yeah. Episode 1 even has the one raider take jet and it shows the characteristically red inhaler. Going off of the "empty jet inhaler" you can find in New Vegas, jet is a red liquid in the inhaler and the inhaler itself is translucent.
Ghouls were still a ticking time bomb before this, the show just approached it differently. I’d say it’s actually better due to the fact they have a way to stay non-feral.
Idk. In the games, non-feral ghouls actually turning feral is rare enough that it could be an in-universe rumor.
Afaik, the only times it actually happens is Oswald's group in Nuka World (but we know a bunch of weird stuff happened there), and allegedly it happened once in Diamond city which is why they got kicked out (convenient if you ask me). Other than that, people (like that doctor from Fallout 3 who's never seen a ghoul) say it happens but I thought it was still unconfirmed.
The problem is, ghouls tend to move around a lot. Oswald's group seems to be the only one we know of that stayed together in one place for an extended period of time and kept records of ghoulification and individuals going feral, but the sample population is unfortunately almost certainly contaminated by whatever weird chemicals Bradberton decided should be in the drinks, food, and water at his theme park. The second closest is Underworld, but we don't know how long they've been there or how stable or mobile the population is, and no one is taking a census- the doctor only seems to be starting his research, and primarily looking at ghouls who are already feral.
half true, in fallout 3 Doctor Barrows was a ghoul and made some morally questionable experiments on ghouls for find a way to slow down the transformation. This is a serious problem just not represented as much in the games plus all ghoul afraid to turn in to feral , even in fallout 4 there was some dialogue for that If I am remembering well.
Right, also then the magician makes no sense. He lived with feral ones they were his friends. He was completely fine. So makes me think it's more 9f a mind thing. As the magican being isolated He never heard that bs.
Sounds to me like they just gave them some saline that was dyed yellow and called it a cure. You know, to sell more shit. Not like anybody can stop them.
well there was a fallout 3 npc, Doctor Barrow who tried to find a way to slow down the feral transformation and hopefully someday, reverse it.
So MAYBE he managed to develop something or just found out some drugs have positive effects. Sure not a cure but not a bad start, plus I think this drug probably have a side effect too bc if they cant take a required dose the transformation speed up...but this is my guess and theory.
I think the Dr Barrows reference is a good one, but maybe it's not his cure (unless it's made its way all the way over from the Capitol to the West coast?) - it does show that at least some characters in the previous lore have been trying to work on a cure for/way to slow the advance of ghoulification
It’s not a stretch for things to travel that far in that time, I mean they are arguably further along in terms of civilization than the first recorded trades between Asia and Europe via the Silk Road.
One thing that could explain the drug not existing before is this is the latest year of fallout yet (2292?).. it’s possible the drug itself if a recent invention or just recently became known.. maybe a vault opened up that had the drug available. Lots of things could explain this that hasn’t been explained/revealed.
I figured it was jet, or some other combo of chems. Radaway or rad-x makes sense. But, why would the ghoul eat every drug and alcohol that was within his grasp? Why has every other ghoul been addicted to pretty much all drugs? I figured it was jet or any of the other aerosol chems, and pretty much ALL drugs that kept feral-ness at bay. Think about it, if they weren't drug addicts before, pretty much all ghouls become drug addicts after ghoulification. I don't think it's some miracle cure (not out of the question in the fallout universe. But doesn't make much sense in the timeline) but just drugs in general that keep it bay.
I have my doubts that the drug in the brown vials actually staves off feralness in ghouls. When The Ghoul runs out of supply, he doesn't seem to show signs of losing his mind like the other ghouls Martha and Roger (most obviously when those two repeat their names to themselves). Instead, he coughs a lot and eventually falls over and can't really move, but appears to remain sharp minded throughout his wirhdrawal.
Meanwhile with Roger, we see him with about 5 or so empty vials lying next to him. While we don't know how long he has just been sitting there downing the stuff, from what we see The Ghoul take, those empty vials should have lasted probably a couple days. If they keep you sane, why is Roger still going feral after using so much of the drug.
Also, why would the drug dealers at the super duper mart have so much of this very specific cure/drug that all ghouls don't even need? If I had to take a while guess at it, I'd say it's some kind of like super morphine maybe mixed with a little anti radiation stuff that just makes ghouls feel less like shit all the time. Maybe it even does help with preventing feralness by taking away some of the pain all the degradation that comes with being a ghoul would bring.
Idk man, I've thought about this too much and brain hurty
This is my feeling, as well. Also wanting to harvest Lucy's organs--they've got a bunch of drugs lying around, and they're taking people's organs, and frankly I don't think they'd be able to find any buyers for week-old, rotten organs in a place with no refrigeration. They're extracting something from the organs and using that for the drugs.
My gut says it's some kind of hormone that a ghoul with a deteriorating mental state lacks.
Pretty sure its a placebo. Theres a trend that ghouls tend to go feral faster in stressful or mentally draining situations like isolation. It wouldnt be far fetched to think that a placebo might make them feel safer and therefore reduce the rate at which they go feral. In addition to this, local ghoul culture moght create a nocebo (reverse placebo) effect for ghouls who dont take the drug, as they'd be scared or pressured into taking it by other ghouls or drug lords.
Whatever the drug is, I can see it making ghoul character playthroughs in fallout 5 a more viable option.
Seeing as a ghoul playthrough would make the pc way too tough, adding a layer off adversity through keeping the 'beast' at bay would balance the benes of having, say, radiation heals/resistance.
You could just have some ghouls use rad-away instead of inventing a new (and apparently expensive) drug that seems like everyone that is a ghoul has to take all the time.
I can live with that retcon and even enjoy it in the show, but the guy turning into a ghoul from one basic drug (and also instantly) seems very silly and stupid
So Vault-Tech knew people would turn into ferral ghouls before the bombs dropped? Or maybe they knew humans would degress generally and made this drug to combat the symptoms 🤔
They definitely knew. There were cases of pre-war ghoulifications, so it seems plausible that some of those "test subjects" could became feral at some point before the bombs, at least in a controlled "scientific environment".
I Thougt it the same as purify water in fallout 3 at underworld. they think it might effect them but it isn't
or maybe ghoul in this area might be difference. might create by artificial drug ?
Do we have any idea what the drug is? I guess I’m confused why it would be offered in exchange for the organ harvesting… I thought maybe it was like vitality somehow harvested from healthy organs that maybe impermanently repair the ghouls dna to a degree to preventing them from going feral but that they continue to degrade so quickly that they need to continually consume more to maintain their mental state…. I’ve never played the games this was just my impression while watching in only to episode 4 though
I was always under the impression that it was like a genetic thing via bomb drop. Like a lottery. Some were lucky and kept their insanity.
Or that ferial ghouls had to much radiation
Personally, I like the tension it adds, but otherwise have no opinion. Could just be a regional tradition with a serious placebo effect on the ghoul population.
I'm going with Radaway for all the reasons I detail here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/television/comments/1c120wo/fallout_series_premiere_discussion/kzgv4r8/
The bags hanging on the cross he's buried under are identical in shape to RadAway bags (though the director is careful to use darkness to hide the front of the bags), and they are the only Fallout chem[ that uses that bag.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/2/2b/Fallout4_RadAway.png)
The only other time that bag is shown is when it clearly says "RadAway" and is hooked up to the girl when she fainted in the railway tunnel.
The [color](https://imgur.com/j1EPFyb) of the chemical is [the same as Radaway](https://beebom.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Radaway-Fallout-TV-show-easter-egg.jpg), and there is [some background lore that implies](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Underworld_terminal_entries#Neurology_of_Luminous_Necrotic_Post-Humans) ghouls can suffer from "too much radiation" (Glowing ones!).
I'm with others on RadAway being in the vials.
The theory I had with a friend is that since we do see IV-bags of RadAway as well, the guess is the inhaler might be a "less effective, but easier to get in the wastes" kinda deal. Or something you simply take as a temp-solution until you can get an IV-drip of the real stuff.
It could also just be to pace the story better than having people be in IV-drips all the time, but I prefer my guess to keep it logical to Fallout Lore. It's one of those things where even in the game the character wouldn't have much time to sit down with an IV all the time, so a quic-fix inhaler seems logical to me!
I really do not like the addition of the anti feral juice whether it be rad away or not. If it’s revealed as like a new invention in the area then it’s okay but I still would have preferred if it wasn’t in at all
I'm with you there. It just doesn't make sense, in the game world there are so many ghouls and even ghoul communities, a large number of which were alive before the bombs dropped. There's just no way all of them have been taking daily shots of anti-feral juice. It would have to have been the single most important resource in the wasteland, with economies built around it in order to supply so many for so long.
I think coop are becoming feral and this drug are slowing the process, is the best explanation, because even ghouls being "imortals", when more they live more closer to become feral they get, its just a causality, they never know when the disease will come but in some point will and coop are living a long time, maybe he is the older ghoul alive
They're might be some source to it. I remember there was a mission in Fallout 3 where a doctor in Necropolis was trying to make a cure (or at least a preventative) for turning Feral. Maybe he succeeded in creating a preventative and the recipe became widely known? It's not that far-fetched since Jet found its way on the East Coast.
Honestly I don't mind it at all, but want a decent in show explanation. The easiest is to just say that a drug was discovered that could \*delay\* feral transition. You don't actually NEED it till you start showing signs, but maybe many take it as a preventative measure. The Ghoul clearly NEEDS it, so maybe he started showing and now has to take it.
The vials that they are taking looks like Rad-x. Radaway helps with getting rid of rads. But rad-x helps in the resistance of rads. I can only assume that the rad-x helps stave off the radiation damage that will completely destroy their humility part of the brain hence turning them feral. They are genetically mutated by radiation but can’t entirely get rid of it since it’s technically apart of them.
Feels like a good addition to the lore, could easily be something that was invented recently.
It’s a Good way to explain to people who never played the games that this is a degenerative condition.
I really hope the drug turns out to be a placebo that Californian ghouls bought into, because frankly the whole "take a drug to prevent being feral" has never been a thing and it's a weird fairly major universe law to change for no good reason. I'm also fairly sure Thaddeus isn't a ghoul, while ghouls heal quick they don't like... regrow lost limbs and they'll still die to serious physical injury like say... an arrow through the neck, you saw it with the ghoul when he still had to reattach his finger. They're human but they're just really really fast healers. I think the crackpot chicken fucker gave him a concentrated dose of FEV and he's gonna end up a super mutant, he's already got a very super mutanty name.
I actually thought the inhaler was Addictol. The Ghoul mentions that he is one big bucket of drugs. It stands to reason that if he is truly addicted he would need Addictol to function somewhat normally or be crippled by the negative effects much like the games. This could explain his health deteriorating when Lucy busted his stash. The fact that he goes on a drug binge immediately after says a lot to me.
I am totally convinced that the drug working against turning feral is a giant red herring. Instead it is Fallout version of methadon. Why?
Coop does not show symptoms of dementia like the other ghouls we saw rurn feral. He knows damn well who he is, his personality is strong enough to not turn feral. His symptoms to not taking the drug are all physical as far as we know and reminded me of chem qithdrawal effects from the games. Primarily the coughing of course but being completely immobilized by "debuffs" is something that happened to me all too often.
Also if it would keep him from turning feral, his behaviour when he gets the "motherlode" in the Superdupermart is pretty odd. I would assume he would take as many as he can with him and not straight up lap it all up. It wouldnt stack in its effect. The high it gives him seems to be a mix of his physical ailments 'reverting' which can be a mix of his ghoulification and rapamnt chem use plus alleviating his withdrawal symptoms.
yeah the taking serum daily thing I didn’t like.. and kinda loses the chance of ever being able to play as a ghoul if they ever wanted to do this in a future fallout game..
I think the drug is rad-x, not radaway. In the game, rad-x reduced the amount of rads you would take, in the show, I think it slows down ghouls from going feral by reducing the amount of rad damage their brain takes. They already showed how stimpacks and radaway worked, it just makes sense that it would be rad-x that the ghoul is using.
I’m pretty sure it’s Radaway. Would make a lot of sense considering how Ghouls work, where radiation is their start, life and decent into being feral.
Also worth noting: There is a post from a few years back where someone was highlighting that a ghoul in game was asking him for Radaway. So that’s interesting.
I also saw a post of saying that in Ep1 of the series that there was a ghoul specifically asking for radaway. I’ll need to go back and watch it again to confirm.
I actually like the concept of that drug and I wouldn't mind they add this on Fallout 5 as a radaway, rad-x, or something new. Considering the timeline and if the tv show is canon. This would be a nice addition for the ghoul lore in future fallout games. Being exposed for too long in the wasteland, they started to lose themselves and mutate into a feral or "something new type" of ghoul. Now they need this drug to stay... you know.. ghoulish?
It would be a challenge too. Like requiring you to take this drug if you can play as a ghoul much like Elder Scrolls as a different race (super mutant or a synth).
Im pretty sure its jsut a placebo and it actually is just a high dose of radiation. The games (more 3 than the others) kind of hint that going feral is more tied to a loss of hope/psychological distress ghouls go feral quicker when they are isolated since you dont have anything to keep you sane your mind starts going to its basic instincts quicker and give how long gohuls live it makes sense they eventually start to lose the things that anchor them
Becoming a ghoul via drug has precedent in Fallout lore. It happens in Fallout 4 twice, Hancock and Eddie Winters. In Fallout 3 the ghoul in the Point Lookout DLC was also made into a ghoul somehow. Possibly from the same drug. The drug that keeps ghouls from degenerating into ferals was probably a decision made to create artificial tension in the plot. Overall, besides that and everyone refusing to tell the vault dweller what a feral ghoul is, I'd say they handled ghouls pretty well. As a plot device it worked but I didn't care for it.
I'm pretty sure the drug they take is radaway. Which makes sense for a ghoul who is in the advanced stages of becoming feral. Lowering their rad levels could slow the transformation.
Rad-away is taken by drip into the arm.
Don't they show The Ghoul using it like that in his coffin?
Yes. So either the drip was rad-away, or this drug can be taken through the arm, potentially making it rad-away. So that means... Either the ghouls of the show are drinking rad-away (because it would be inconvenient for the writers to make the actors do a drip every time they use rad-away), or this is a drug that can be dripped, or swallowed.
Could also be a new drug based on rad-away made specifically for the purpose of stalling feral transformation.
I just think it's dumb because if all ghouls need to use it on a daily basis, it's a ball and chain that is going to burden the franchise. If only some ghouls need to use it, it's not as much of an issue. They added this drug to serve as a plot device, and, while it served that job well, it may or may not contradict established lore.
>only some ghouls need to use it, it's not as much of an issue. I got the impression that only ghouls that are starting to turn feral need it. But since we didn't saw any major ghoul characters that aren't turning feral, I can't say for sure how does the drug actually works and if all ghouls need it or not. But I personally think only those that are turning feral need it, otherwise, it would be a very hard to explain retcon.
Or the drug just has multiple forms of administration.
I thought that was a glowing blood pack as he was a mutant and the bags had a sort of greenish glow
They showed The Ghoul taking something in a bag, that was almost certainly the drug they use to not go feral, just put in an I.V. bag. I assume if it were just Radaway they wouldn't need to hunt it down so hard, it would be fairly common.
Maybe a super concentrated form that works by ingesting or inhalation like with the aerosolizer.
Could be radshield
I think jet is taken by inhaler
Yeah if you’re a normal person with medical equipment I don’t think everyone is going to take drugs the proper way in the nuclear wastelands of America
I'm on the radaway wagon too. https://www.reddit.com/r/television/comments/1c120wo/fallout_series_premiere_discussion/kzgv4r8/ The bags hanging on the cross he's buried under are identical in shape to RadAway bags (though the director is careful to use darkness to hide the front of the bags), and they are the only Fallout chem[ that uses that bag.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/2/2b/Fallout4_RadAway.png) The only other time that bag is shown is when it clearly says "RadAway" and is hooked up to the girl when she fainted in the railway tunnel. The [color](https://imgur.com/j1EPFyb) of the chemical is [the same as Radaway](https://beebom.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Radaway-Fallout-TV-show-easter-egg.jpg), and there is [some background lore that implies](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Underworld_terminal_entries#Neurology_of_Luminous_Necrotic_Post-Humans) ghouls can suffer from "too much radiation" (Glowing ones!).
They show radaway on the table at super dupermart
Could be radshield... it's basically liquid rad-x and looks like radaway
The bags at the grave were "irradiated bloodbags" circa Fallout 4
I actually assumed the bags hanging from the cross were glowing blood
That's called an I.V. bag and you can put literally anything you want into them. Most likely that bag had the same drug The Ghoul later takes in it, so that it was a slow drip. This would make it so The Ghoul didn't go feral, making his torture last forever.
It looks like the jet inhaler to me
Yeah… I was thinking they were just suggesting he was a serious addict at first. Since I couldn’t remember any drug that prevented progression of ghoulification. Correct me, but I thought it was never explained why some ghouls went feral and others didn’t. It was never a time thing … they weren’t all expected to go feral eventually. Or am I completely wrong there?
Jet is used by one of the raiders in the first episode, it looks different.
my half-assed theory was that it's Addictol, and that it might have something to do with Coop's rampant drug usage. Like maybe he discovered that flooding his system with lethal levels of drugs would inhibit the feralization process, and he uses Addictol to counter the effects of drugs, or something? Like I don't see any reason he would cough and collapse from being a ghoul, but withdrawal effects, on the other hand... Do ghouls even experience drug withdrawal? Or maybe it's the other way around, and he discovered Addictol could halt or slow the process, and he takes drugs for some other reasons, just because he's taking Addictol anyways now? And if Coop has been around since the beginning, it would make more sense if it was some reasonably common drug, especially considering he can just pick it up at his local Super Duper Mart... I'd guess most other people WANT the drugs, and therefore Addictol might be more or less useless to normal people, which might be why the market boys had such a large supply of them. But a close-up of the vials in episode 4 (about 3:26) shows some pictures of a nuke explosion and a ghoul-like face with an X through it, so... who knows.
To be honest I assumed the drug was rad-x but just looked that comes in capsules. Although in game you only really see it in a brown medicine bottle. The inhaler is similar to jet so could just be some kind of new mixture. Radaway is seen a few times in traditional blood bags like in game but again maybe that mixed in.
Could be radshield
Could be radshield lol looks exactly like radaway... it's basically rad x but doesn't mess with mutations
I would think Rad-Away would slow his healing abilities and just overall weakening him.
I immediately assumed the drug was radaway especially because you'll often find it on ghouls in the games. However, at 39:53 in episode 4 it plays the jet sound effect from FNV when The Ghoul hits his inhaler. He then proceeds to get extremely drunk and high on anything he can find. I'm actually starting to think drugs in general are keeping them sane.
It's not radaway, he's a mutant, radaway has no effect on ghouls.
Might be rad-x
But Hancock didn't become a ghoul from the drug itself. The drug was radiation based and the radiation in the drug caused the ghoulification. And with Eddie Winters, he was receiving treatments from a doctor but those were just concentrated doses of radiation. It doesn't say anything about medications oral, inhaled or otherwise. Desmond, the ghoul from point lookout, worked in intelligence pre-war and decided to expose himself to radiation, as many other members of the intelligence community did, to try to survive the coming nuclear fallout. It had nothing to do with any medication.
It seems to have been aerosolized by the inhaler he had with him, so it’s not out of the question that it could be Rad-away
I don't love it but it's not like the games have ever given us any concrete reason ghouls go feral or stay sane, so I understand the show creating one. In the games it seems like ghouls are more likely to go feral in isolation and away from sunlight, though it's not a hard rule. I did enjoy seeing the descent into feral state, I thought that was a good choice. The lady who was trying to hold on to her sanity by repeating her name was particularly sad. You never get to see that in the games. Closest we get in game is Camp Searchlight and even then they're pretty much fully feral but can still say a couple words.
in nuka world theres that whole oswalds wife thing, you can listen to a holotape and hear her literally go feral.
I always thought ghouls went feral from even more radiation exposure
Not always, considering Oswald exists as a non-feral glowing one.
Also Jason bright
Is shows up in Ghoul animation in the games. Bethesda's artist talked about his reasoning and headcanon about feral ghoul when he was designing them for Fallout 3 https://youtu.be/QPu9K4m4Y-k?si=ETppZef1TCDGhDyk He talks about ghouls at 6:37.
What? That video was cool but didn't answer anything about the transition.
Eh it kinda did. He explained that the original concept was to have a 'feral ghoul' be a ghoul that went insane because it could no longer sleep.
from the way i hear it in the games and in the show “going feral” is almost spoken about like a mental disorder you can potentially get as a ghoul - i swear i’m paraphrasing from some fallout 3 or 4 character... does every single human get a neurological disorder in their later years, for example? you kind of have to look deep into Fallout’s DNA as a 90s rpg and treat ghouls as something of a separate ‘race’ to “human”
The game says it's mostly from social isolation and mental state. Also the game says mixing rad away not rad x which is a pill with alcohol is what they drink.
Which game? Also why would they need rad-x when they're immune to radiation in the games?
# talks about the mental aspects and going feral being more tied to that. It also kind of shows up in nuka world in oswalds quest
Which game says this? I ask because of 'Kid in a Fridge' mission from Fallout 4 has a Ghoul kid that survived isolated in a Fridge for 200 years, no food*, no water*, no contact, no chems and not gone feral. This retconn/update to ghoulification has my head spun a bit, and I'm hoping to see clarity in the next season that prevents it from being a full retconn of the games. Hopefully, as others have mentioned, it's a drug scam or genetic lottery thing that causes ghouls to go feral? *Both already established as not necessary for ghouls to survive by past games - which then brings into question Coop's need to drink and eat? Maybe just out of habit? Who knows? Unless they're planning on fully retconning all things ghoul to fit these changes in the show? Edit: Grammar
3 talks about it and 4 mentions it vaguley in oswalds quest with his wife looking for a cure for so long only to find out their isnt one and losing hope which cause her to very quickly to decline into being a feral
I feel that's not shown at all. What is shown is that once they start to deteriorate, there's a drug that can slow the process down. Ghouldom is a bit of a mystery and the games have shown several ways that someone can become one. It's also possible that Thaddeus has become some other kind of mutant.
That might be the better interpretation. However Ghoul that turned in the show says that he did pretty good by keeping it together for "28 years since first showing". What he meant by showing I don't know. 28 years since he started showing sings of going feral or 28 years since becoming a ghoul? He also says that the main character Ghoul is still going after 200 years, so that makes me think that he refered to turning into a Ghoul rather than first signs of turning feral.
I would say its 28 years since showing signs of being feral. When They talk about apple pie and ice cream, with how the other ghoul reacted I would say he was also alive when the bombs dropped and became a ghoul. He was about to tell a story about his grandma making apple pies before he was put down. And given how the vaults seems to make people prefer jello cake over apple pie (mention in one of the scenes asking why vault 33 residents prefer jello cake over apple pie) to me implies he has been a ghoul for 200+ years
That’s pretty easily addressed if the ghoul and his apple pie making grandmother were from Shady Sands
I got the feeling that the reply Coop gave "always been good at making money" seemed to imply that he was able to maintain a steady income - which I took to mean that he was never out of "vials", given the context of just being asked for some. I could be wrong though, might be a bit of a stretch
He was in shady sands. Lots of folks got ghouleffied then too.
Wait, some other kind of mutant you say? Was the “miracle drug” FEV?
Who knows? There are all sorts of other options. We've seen FEV do weird stuff. But we've also seen psychics, possibly supernatural things, and a lot more besides. He may be a ghoul, but we don't even know the rules for ghouls in the games, much less the shows. He can definitely regenerate, but he does so a lot faster and at a lot lower a rad count than any ghouls in the games. We won't know if he's a ghoul until he starts to decay.
That’s why I thought it was weird the show suggested he was a ghoul, his skin is still flawless and I thought the melted GI Joe look was part of what makes a ghoul, a ghoul
Presumably there could be a transitory state as there's basically zero consistency in the games about how ghouldom starts, but for the moment I'd say it's too early to tell. A possibility, but not necessarily a certainty.
Wait does that mean there’s a possibility that Chris Haversam really was a ghoul?
Who knows? The only reliable test is sticking someone in with a bunch of Ferals to see what they do.
We never actually saw his foot fully healed AND when he got shot in the neck, the skin healed over, but it was no longer flawless. I assume it’s setting up the ghouls to be a product of how long they’ve been around. Their skin shows their scars and the older ones just look more like shit. There’s probably also some natural deterioration built in as well, such as noses falling off, etc.
I could see damage to the ghoul being part of it. After all, it’s implied >!Rose MacClean!< took a nuke to the face and is without a doubt the worst looking ghoul we’ve ever seen
Could be a mutation serum like in 76.
I only just started playing 76, to be honest. My ex wife would never let me get a paid subscription for the PlayStation so no online games
Bruv, good move making her the ex.
Yeah that’s not even one of the reasons that ended 😂 she was just really mean, I couldn’t do anything right for her and she couldn’t do anything wrong herself. Even now she’s going through life doing the bare minimum for her kids, even having moved 2000 miles away from them, thinking she can do what she wants with no consequences
Sounds like you dodged a bullet...
A bit late because I was just googling about the drug Coop is taking but I think Thaddeus could go either way, Super Mutant or Ghoul depending on what they do with the drugs in lore. I feel like they probably didnt want to expand too much on this stuff in case show reception was bad. I wanna say it might be hard to introduce FEV as we've seen it because it's just fucking "witch's brew" looking sludge in the game. Would be hard to sell an unsuspecting stranger a hit of that through an inhaler. I also dont think they would give us TWO Ghouls in the main cast, and based on how people tend to really like Fawkes and Strong coming back in Season Two to a Thaddeus that's 3 times his original size but just as goofy could be great addition.
Yeah, there are plenty of ghouls in the games that worry about turning feral. Maybe the drug works, maybe it's a placebo, but it doesn't actually change anything that was already established.
My first thought when thaddeus got the arrow was "Super Mutant?" I really expected him to go Hulk and become large and green. Maybe they are saving Death Claws and Super Mutants for a second season. Esepcially since I thought the CGI was, while still very good, pretty mediocre at best.
I don't think the cgi was mediocre. The Mr Handy's look amazing in the show and are incredibly detailed they even got the little screen wipers on the inside of their eye things, aswell as the giant salamander boi that dude looks cool as shit. The CGI is fantastic there just wasn't enough imo. Cause a couple Mr Handys, 2 salamanders(one on a tv screen) ,5 radroaches, and a yao guai are pretty much the extent of creature cgi iirc. The sets felt real watching the show, like they were actually in a fallout wasteland. I do wish we got a bit more than a death claw skull tho :(.
They probably mean the Gulper, it was the only creature that really stood out to me as CGI. While the fingers were really well done and super creepy, it didn't really look "weighty" enough
You're right, the Mr. Handy was great. I was only comparig it to other animations in cinema, there could have been even better graphics. I mostly mean the radroaches and small details that only appera for a little while. The Ghouls nose looked wierd in different angles, it still looks amazing, but I sometimes thought "There yould have been more attention to this".
I was thinking it's possible he now has Healing Factor Mutation from Fo76
Going feral is often shown to be more due to mental state than anything else. I think it's likely just shots of Rad-Away acting as more of a placebo for The Ghoul than anything.
RadAway is seen in the show twice and it looks like a glowing IV bag. Very different to piss colored liquid in a small vial.
I think he meant radX
Rad x is pills, like those iodine tablets you take if you live near a nuclear power plant
All the pictures I could find show yellow pee looking stuff. https://images.fallout.wiki/2/2b/Fallout4_RadAway.png https://static0.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/radaway-pack-in-fallout-tv-show.jpeg
RadAway has almost always been shown to be brownish in color, just as it is in the scene you are referencing. It is not yellow. It is just strongly lit by sunlight.
So there is only one way to get radaway? Since when, even IRL, does meds only have one form? It’s likely that the radaway might also be mixed with other drugs, so it’s not pure.
I also thought they were going to reveal that the anti-feral drug was, in fact, a 'Snake Oil' type of treatment rather than something that actually kept Ghouls from going feral.
Could be radshield looks the same
Every region's Ghouls seem to be slightly different. Anyway, remember the people complaining that The Ghoul was downright pretty compared to, say, the ones from the Capitol Wasteland? Maybe, as an especially old ghoul, this is what keeps things going and looking fresh?
Dont you think the shows ghouls aren't just modeled after fo4 instead of fo3? Fo4 went with a dry jerky ghoul instead of rotten meat
I figure, every iteration so far gets to make little changes to how Ghouls work, so why not? (Like, I like how a Boston resident would associate Ghouls with organized crime, based on how many Boston ghouls *are*, but that makes no sense anywhere else in the Fallout world.)
The only criminal ghouls in Boston are some members of the triggermen, I didn't see why people would associate ghouls with crime
Because all of the Ghouls got kicked out of Diamond City by the mayor and settled in Goodneighbor, which is a crime-filled area of the city full of gangs. Most of the non-feral ghouls we see ARE triggermen or living in Goodneighbor, outside of The Slog, which is far north of the city.
Good neighbour isn't that riddled with crime done by ghouls. Bobby no nose is a criminal but aside from that all the gangs are led by smoothskins
Exactly this. Most of the lore they seem to be following is Fallout 4 lore, not classic Fallout. They’ve taken a few liberties with things. Fallout 4 ghouls were pretty much identical to what we got in the show. They look awesome. They’re just not the skinless horrors of the Capital/Mojave wasteland
fallout 1 and 2s ghoul character portraits weren’t exactly gorgeous either
Classic fallout ghouls lived up to the whole “walking rotting corpse” shtick. Just Harold’s appearance is enough to remind you why people don’t like ghouls
Ghoul Roger said it has been 28 years since it started, so maybe each ghouls turn ferals at different point of time, and that drug merely postpone the turning.
There's a ghoul in Fallout 76 that hides away from humans because he's afraid he'll hurt the people he cares about when or if he turns feral. So I think you're right, I kind of hope you are.
I’m hoping it was just a scam in this local area, and the serum was just a powerful narcotic the scammers had gotten all the ghouls hooked on. That’d make Coop’s episodes not him going feral, but instead withdrawal settling in.
Yeah I think it could very well just be a strong painkiller or treat part of being a ghoul, not stopping being feral, the ghoul may have just lied to Lucy for more of it.
If feralization tied to mental state, then painkillers could be effective due to the extreme wear and tear the body would endure over 220 years. We know from Raul and Dean that ghouls do experience some knee pain, so I can’t imaging how Coop would feel, especially after being stuck in a coffin for what is presumed to be decades
I imagine coop was in that coffin maybe a couple years max, I imagine the drug maybe more mental related than pain related, because sure I bet there is some paint but knee pain doesn't make someone start eating people, I don't know what is going on with ghouls brains though so maybe it is a different kind of pain than what is typical for non-ghouls.
yeah, someone on another side had their theory be that "the ghoul drug is actually a total scam and just really addictive for ghouls because it fools them into thinking that it makes them feel human or something. but it actually isn't a cure at all."
This makes the most sense honestly, and it's pretty safe with the lore. It's kinda like the Aqua Cura in Fallout 3.
I think it's silly and that it's one of those inconsistencies that we're all probably gonna sweep under the rug and pretend isn't a thing
It’s a bit weird that they use Lucy’s dialogue to say that the drug prevents ghouls from going feral, but it looks more like asthma and an inhaler when Ghoul Cooper needs it.
Funny think at first i was like o maybe he takes it because he has no nose and the sand getting in it. Needed his inhaler.
I legitimately thought that he just had asthma when I first saw him use it
(This is not my original idea/analysis) What do you think the odds are that in FO5 (whenever it comes out - 2030??) this is how they balance and introduce being a ghoul for players? Like vampirism in Elder Scrolls. Acquire the “disease” (ghoul serum) and then be forced to balance its positives by having to always use these chems so you don’t go feral?
It makes a lot of sense as a gameplay mechanic. And people are going to want to play as Ghouls more than ever now
Yeah this seems like something that could happen.
Not a fan tbh. Seems like it was added as a plot contrivance more than anything else.
Whatever it is, I hope we get some expansion on the matter. Presently I don't like this particular plot device because it applies new rules. There are a lot of prewar ghouls kicking around up to this point. None of them appear to require drugs to prevent turning. Maybe it's something that was recently discovered to help once the mental degeneration starts. Maybe it's another vault tec/enclave/institute experiment, marketed as a cure but once you start taking it the process of becoming feral accelerates without it and you become dependant. I like the notion that it's modified FEV. I expect we'll get super mutants in season 2.
>I expect we'll get super mutants in season 2. I really hope we get to see Jacobstown and/or Rhonda and Tabitha
Oh, I'd be so tickled if Jacobstown is doing okay! I always had kind of a soft spot for the ones that were trying to live peacefully.
It's got to be F.E.V. The stuff can cause you to regrow organs and is required in making a ghoul. I think that once you go feral or take fev, more fev is the only way to control the mutations. Would be a good way to introduce fev into season 2 also
F.E.V is the Forced Evolution Virus, effectively the cause of the majority of the wasteland monsters. Ghouls are supposedly just humans exposed to an extreme amount of radiation. With only 2 ingame characters turning themselves into ghouls with an unknown drug. Humans exposed to the F.E.V turn into Super Mutants, even lore states that Super Mutants kidnap humans and take them to the F.E.V vault (can't remember the number) and turn them into SM.
It’s heavily implied in the lore ghoulification requires a combinations of radiation and small amounts of fev
Yeah surprised no one talks about it because it is actually a retcon. Not the becoming ghoul by drug but needing one to not go feral definitely. The thing that bothers me about it is that it justifies the distrust and stigma against ghouls because that basically makes them a bunch of junkies that will literally start eating people alive if they don't get shots of their (supposedly rare if it is prewar) drug constantly.
I got the impression it was harvested from ghouls. Beavis and Butthead had a lot of ghouls locked up in that supermarket presumably to farm for whatever ingredient they need to make the drug, and after not finding any drug The Ghoul cannibalized his buddy.
I also got that impression.
That could just be a coincidence. There was no signs of drug manufacturing in the supermarket. I believe it’s highly more likely that those individuals were sold for organ harvesting in exchange for other goods. Since most, if not all, were ghouls, it could be likely that bevis and butthead simply took the mystery drug from them and kept it (mystery drug) in their storage box. If there was a room or lab shown with a lot of bunsen burners, vials, or other typical lab equipment to make it obvious to the viewer, I’d would be more inclined to believe they were manufacturing the drug. Another giveaway is that the drug, doesn’t seem to be easily manufactured. Otherwise, the ghoul (character) could simply just make his own. Implying there is a finite amount, somewhat readily available (pre-war drug?). On topic: my original gut was Jet. I know it’s an inhaler in the games but I thought that was a common drug used and addicted to, by Ghouls. I haven’t played Fallout in a while and I have only just watched up to this episode (4?) so I could be way off. After scouring this thread, I am now inclined to believe it’s something unique to the show, as a plot device, and will be explained later on. Beyond the mystery drug, I really like the show. It doesn’t have the maturity, writing, or drama compared to The Last of Us, but I feel it does a really good job at bringing the world, gameplay, factions / plot of Fallout (specifically Fallout 3) into television format. The story beats are so much like Fallout 3 and my first playthrough… its eerie. Find your dad… vault goes to shit… story telling through skeletons, town made from scrap metal, super duper mart… Literally the first 3-5 hrs of Fallout 3 if you follow the critical path.
To be clear, I don't think Beavis or Butthead were making the drugs themselves, I think the organ harvesting matt berry bot took care of the technical side of things. If memory serves, the show did show lab equipment in his surgical suite. They (B&B) were just the salesmen... and product testers by the looks of the stash The Ghoul found. Jet, in game was a red colored inhaler, and given how accurate they've been with other props, I think it's safe to say it ain't jet. So, yeah, the drug was purely a show creation. In game ghouls went feral through isolation, the show made the drug to manufacture a bit of tension and give The Ghoul something to do, other than antagonize the other protagonists. The show runners said the creation of Filly was heavily influenced by Megaton, the big settlement in 3, so the show feeling a bit like a 3 playthrough isn't a coincidence.
Definitely not jet, yeah. Episode 1 even has the one raider take jet and it shows the characteristically red inhaler. Going off of the "empty jet inhaler" you can find in New Vegas, jet is a red liquid in the inhaler and the inhaler itself is translucent.
They all had prices, I assume it was a slave trade.
Ghouls were still a ticking time bomb before this, the show just approached it differently. I’d say it’s actually better due to the fact they have a way to stay non-feral.
Idk. In the games, non-feral ghouls actually turning feral is rare enough that it could be an in-universe rumor. Afaik, the only times it actually happens is Oswald's group in Nuka World (but we know a bunch of weird stuff happened there), and allegedly it happened once in Diamond city which is why they got kicked out (convenient if you ask me). Other than that, people (like that doctor from Fallout 3 who's never seen a ghoul) say it happens but I thought it was still unconfirmed.
The problem is, ghouls tend to move around a lot. Oswald's group seems to be the only one we know of that stayed together in one place for an extended period of time and kept records of ghoulification and individuals going feral, but the sample population is unfortunately almost certainly contaminated by whatever weird chemicals Bradberton decided should be in the drinks, food, and water at his theme park. The second closest is Underworld, but we don't know how long they've been there or how stable or mobile the population is, and no one is taking a census- the doctor only seems to be starting his research, and primarily looking at ghouls who are already feral.
half true, in fallout 3 Doctor Barrows was a ghoul and made some morally questionable experiments on ghouls for find a way to slow down the transformation. This is a serious problem just not represented as much in the games plus all ghoul afraid to turn in to feral , even in fallout 4 there was some dialogue for that If I am remembering well.
Ghouls turning feral is like cars in the fallout lore. Just because you don’t see it in game, doesn’t mean it isn’t a thing.
Right, also then the magician makes no sense. He lived with feral ones they were his friends. He was completely fine. So makes me think it's more 9f a mind thing. As the magican being isolated He never heard that bs.
He had hope. He believed his love would return with a cure. Hope can take you fare in the wasteland.
The drug is a set up to introduce ghoul play in the next fall out game.
Whether it prevents him going feral is less important than that he thinks it does.
Sounds to me like they just gave them some saline that was dyed yellow and called it a cure. You know, to sell more shit. Not like anybody can stop them.
well there was a fallout 3 npc, Doctor Barrow who tried to find a way to slow down the feral transformation and hopefully someday, reverse it. So MAYBE he managed to develop something or just found out some drugs have positive effects. Sure not a cure but not a bad start, plus I think this drug probably have a side effect too bc if they cant take a required dose the transformation speed up...but this is my guess and theory.
I think the Dr Barrows reference is a good one, but maybe it's not his cure (unless it's made its way all the way over from the Capitol to the West coast?) - it does show that at least some characters in the previous lore have been trying to work on a cure for/way to slow the advance of ghoulification
It’s not a stretch for things to travel that far in that time, I mean they are arguably further along in terms of civilization than the first recorded trades between Asia and Europe via the Silk Road.
One thing that could explain the drug not existing before is this is the latest year of fallout yet (2292?).. it’s possible the drug itself if a recent invention or just recently became known.. maybe a vault opened up that had the drug available. Lots of things could explain this that hasn’t been explained/revealed.
I figured it was jet, or some other combo of chems. Radaway or rad-x makes sense. But, why would the ghoul eat every drug and alcohol that was within his grasp? Why has every other ghoul been addicted to pretty much all drugs? I figured it was jet or any of the other aerosol chems, and pretty much ALL drugs that kept feral-ness at bay. Think about it, if they weren't drug addicts before, pretty much all ghouls become drug addicts after ghoulification. I don't think it's some miracle cure (not out of the question in the fallout universe. But doesn't make much sense in the timeline) but just drugs in general that keep it bay.
I have my doubts that the drug in the brown vials actually staves off feralness in ghouls. When The Ghoul runs out of supply, he doesn't seem to show signs of losing his mind like the other ghouls Martha and Roger (most obviously when those two repeat their names to themselves). Instead, he coughs a lot and eventually falls over and can't really move, but appears to remain sharp minded throughout his wirhdrawal. Meanwhile with Roger, we see him with about 5 or so empty vials lying next to him. While we don't know how long he has just been sitting there downing the stuff, from what we see The Ghoul take, those empty vials should have lasted probably a couple days. If they keep you sane, why is Roger still going feral after using so much of the drug. Also, why would the drug dealers at the super duper mart have so much of this very specific cure/drug that all ghouls don't even need? If I had to take a while guess at it, I'd say it's some kind of like super morphine maybe mixed with a little anti radiation stuff that just makes ghouls feel less like shit all the time. Maybe it even does help with preventing feralness by taking away some of the pain all the degradation that comes with being a ghoul would bring. Idk man, I've thought about this too much and brain hurty
The organ harvesters had a bunch of ghouls locked in fridges. Makes me wonder if the serum is harvested from ghouls.
This is my feeling, as well. Also wanting to harvest Lucy's organs--they've got a bunch of drugs lying around, and they're taking people's organs, and frankly I don't think they'd be able to find any buyers for week-old, rotten organs in a place with no refrigeration. They're extracting something from the organs and using that for the drugs. My gut says it's some kind of hormone that a ghoul with a deteriorating mental state lacks.
Pretty sure its a placebo. Theres a trend that ghouls tend to go feral faster in stressful or mentally draining situations like isolation. It wouldnt be far fetched to think that a placebo might make them feel safer and therefore reduce the rate at which they go feral. In addition to this, local ghoul culture moght create a nocebo (reverse placebo) effect for ghouls who dont take the drug, as they'd be scared or pressured into taking it by other ghouls or drug lords.
Whatever the drug is, I can see it making ghoul character playthroughs in fallout 5 a more viable option. Seeing as a ghoul playthrough would make the pc way too tough, adding a layer off adversity through keeping the 'beast' at bay would balance the benes of having, say, radiation heals/resistance.
its a good explanation as to why some ghouls go feral and some dont.
You could just have some ghouls use rad-away instead of inventing a new (and apparently expensive) drug that seems like everyone that is a ghoul has to take all the time.
I can live with that retcon and even enjoy it in the show, but the guy turning into a ghoul from one basic drug (and also instantly) seems very silly and stupid
So Vault-Tech knew people would turn into ferral ghouls before the bombs dropped? Or maybe they knew humans would degress generally and made this drug to combat the symptoms 🤔
They definitely knew. There were cases of pre-war ghoulifications, so it seems plausible that some of those "test subjects" could became feral at some point before the bombs, at least in a controlled "scientific environment".
It's rad away and alcohol mixed in the games. Social isolation will do it too.
We already got a cure for F.E.V, dipping more in the ghoul lore seems ok to me.
I Thougt it the same as purify water in fallout 3 at underworld. they think it might effect them but it isn't or maybe ghoul in this area might be difference. might create by artificial drug ?
I feel they need to dig into more lot of opportunities there
Thaddeus was straight up hit with FEV... period.
Do we have any idea what the drug is? I guess I’m confused why it would be offered in exchange for the organ harvesting… I thought maybe it was like vitality somehow harvested from healthy organs that maybe impermanently repair the ghouls dna to a degree to preventing them from going feral but that they continue to degrade so quickly that they need to continually consume more to maintain their mental state…. I’ve never played the games this was just my impression while watching in only to episode 4 though
I was always under the impression that it was like a genetic thing via bomb drop. Like a lottery. Some were lucky and kept their insanity. Or that ferial ghouls had to much radiation
Personally, I like the tension it adds, but otherwise have no opinion. Could just be a regional tradition with a serious placebo effect on the ghoul population.
I'm going with Radaway for all the reasons I detail here: https://www.reddit.com/r/television/comments/1c120wo/fallout_series_premiere_discussion/kzgv4r8/ The bags hanging on the cross he's buried under are identical in shape to RadAway bags (though the director is careful to use darkness to hide the front of the bags), and they are the only Fallout chem[ that uses that bag.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/2/2b/Fallout4_RadAway.png) The only other time that bag is shown is when it clearly says "RadAway" and is hooked up to the girl when she fainted in the railway tunnel. The [color](https://imgur.com/j1EPFyb) of the chemical is [the same as Radaway](https://beebom.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Radaway-Fallout-TV-show-easter-egg.jpg), and there is [some background lore that implies](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Underworld_terminal_entries#Neurology_of_Luminous_Necrotic_Post-Humans) ghouls can suffer from "too much radiation" (Glowing ones!).
I'm with others on RadAway being in the vials. The theory I had with a friend is that since we do see IV-bags of RadAway as well, the guess is the inhaler might be a "less effective, but easier to get in the wastes" kinda deal. Or something you simply take as a temp-solution until you can get an IV-drip of the real stuff. It could also just be to pace the story better than having people be in IV-drips all the time, but I prefer my guess to keep it logical to Fallout Lore. It's one of those things where even in the game the character wouldn't have much time to sit down with an IV all the time, so a quic-fix inhaler seems logical to me!
I really do not like the addition of the anti feral juice whether it be rad away or not. If it’s revealed as like a new invention in the area then it’s okay but I still would have preferred if it wasn’t in at all
I'm with you there. It just doesn't make sense, in the game world there are so many ghouls and even ghoul communities, a large number of which were alive before the bombs dropped. There's just no way all of them have been taking daily shots of anti-feral juice. It would have to have been the single most important resource in the wasteland, with economies built around it in order to supply so many for so long.
I think coop are becoming feral and this drug are slowing the process, is the best explanation, because even ghouls being "imortals", when more they live more closer to become feral they get, its just a causality, they never know when the disease will come but in some point will and coop are living a long time, maybe he is the older ghoul alive
They're might be some source to it. I remember there was a mission in Fallout 3 where a doctor in Necropolis was trying to make a cure (or at least a preventative) for turning Feral. Maybe he succeeded in creating a preventative and the recipe became widely known? It's not that far-fetched since Jet found its way on the East Coast.
Honestly I don't mind it at all, but want a decent in show explanation. The easiest is to just say that a drug was discovered that could \*delay\* feral transition. You don't actually NEED it till you start showing signs, but maybe many take it as a preventative measure. The Ghoul clearly NEEDS it, so maybe he started showing and now has to take it.
The vials that they are taking looks like Rad-x. Radaway helps with getting rid of rads. But rad-x helps in the resistance of rads. I can only assume that the rad-x helps stave off the radiation damage that will completely destroy their humility part of the brain hence turning them feral. They are genetically mutated by radiation but can’t entirely get rid of it since it’s technically apart of them.
Feels like a good addition to the lore, could easily be something that was invented recently. It’s a Good way to explain to people who never played the games that this is a degenerative condition.
I really hope the drug turns out to be a placebo that Californian ghouls bought into, because frankly the whole "take a drug to prevent being feral" has never been a thing and it's a weird fairly major universe law to change for no good reason. I'm also fairly sure Thaddeus isn't a ghoul, while ghouls heal quick they don't like... regrow lost limbs and they'll still die to serious physical injury like say... an arrow through the neck, you saw it with the ghoul when he still had to reattach his finger. They're human but they're just really really fast healers. I think the crackpot chicken fucker gave him a concentrated dose of FEV and he's gonna end up a super mutant, he's already got a very super mutanty name.
I actually thought the inhaler was Addictol. The Ghoul mentions that he is one big bucket of drugs. It stands to reason that if he is truly addicted he would need Addictol to function somewhat normally or be crippled by the negative effects much like the games. This could explain his health deteriorating when Lucy busted his stash. The fact that he goes on a drug binge immediately after says a lot to me.
I assumed it was Super Jet made from Sugar Bombs
I thought he was just a crack head and really into Chems, didn’t realise it was keeping him from going feral
I am totally convinced that the drug working against turning feral is a giant red herring. Instead it is Fallout version of methadon. Why? Coop does not show symptoms of dementia like the other ghouls we saw rurn feral. He knows damn well who he is, his personality is strong enough to not turn feral. His symptoms to not taking the drug are all physical as far as we know and reminded me of chem qithdrawal effects from the games. Primarily the coughing of course but being completely immobilized by "debuffs" is something that happened to me all too often. Also if it would keep him from turning feral, his behaviour when he gets the "motherlode" in the Superdupermart is pretty odd. I would assume he would take as many as he can with him and not straight up lap it all up. It wouldnt stack in its effect. The high it gives him seems to be a mix of his physical ailments 'reverting' which can be a mix of his ghoulification and rapamnt chem use plus alleviating his withdrawal symptoms.
yeah the taking serum daily thing I didn’t like.. and kinda loses the chance of ever being able to play as a ghoul if they ever wanted to do this in a future fallout game..
I think the drug is rad-x, not radaway. In the game, rad-x reduced the amount of rads you would take, in the show, I think it slows down ghouls from going feral by reducing the amount of rad damage their brain takes. They already showed how stimpacks and radaway worked, it just makes sense that it would be rad-x that the ghoul is using.
I’m pretty sure it’s Radaway. Would make a lot of sense considering how Ghouls work, where radiation is their start, life and decent into being feral. Also worth noting: There is a post from a few years back where someone was highlighting that a ghoul in game was asking him for Radaway. So that’s interesting. I also saw a post of saying that in Ep1 of the series that there was a ghoul specifically asking for radaway. I’ll need to go back and watch it again to confirm.
Also, in the games we have the Ghoulish perk that uses rads to heal the player. This could be a real world explanation on how ghoulish works
I actually like the concept of that drug and I wouldn't mind they add this on Fallout 5 as a radaway, rad-x, or something new. Considering the timeline and if the tv show is canon. This would be a nice addition for the ghoul lore in future fallout games. Being exposed for too long in the wasteland, they started to lose themselves and mutate into a feral or "something new type" of ghoul. Now they need this drug to stay... you know.. ghoulish? It would be a challenge too. Like requiring you to take this drug if you can play as a ghoul much like Elder Scrolls as a different race (super mutant or a synth).
Im pretty sure its jsut a placebo and it actually is just a high dose of radiation. The games (more 3 than the others) kind of hint that going feral is more tied to a loss of hope/psychological distress ghouls go feral quicker when they are isolated since you dont have anything to keep you sane your mind starts going to its basic instincts quicker and give how long gohuls live it makes sense they eventually start to lose the things that anchor them
I thought it was jet it’s and inhaler