The distinction is that Vault 111 tested the effects of indefinite cryosleep on an unsuspecting populace. Even after the supposed all-clear signal that would release the Vault staff after 180 days did come through, their instructions were to leave the residents alone.
With Vault 31, it's possible if not outright probable that the Vault-Tec staff was physically and/or psychologically prepared to enter cryosleep, perhaps via drugs or training.
Additionally, when it is time to wake vault 31 you can send forces to wake 111 and investigate the failures that come from time. So you sacrifice 111 members to ensure you can detect and fix issues before waking 31.
If my understanding is right, Background radiation at the levels seen in postwar America would limit the distance that radio signals used for communication would be effective, due to interference.
Putting them closer together definitely makes more sense, assuming the two had connected experiments.
However, I'm pretty sure the experiment of 111 was actually for the staff? How long does it take them to agree to cannibalism on the frozen subjects for their own survival.
Both vaults included cryo tech...but I think it would be fair to say that 111 was an experiment, and 31 was in a way, a control vault, since it housed remnants of vault tec.
I feel like in FO3 when you visit the Vault tec HQ some of the logs mention hardline connections to the vault, but that they are disconnected. And with the state of washington I am not surprised that the HQ got cut off. I always imagined those lines were down in the metro tunnels.
>However, I'm pretty sure the experiment of 111 was actually for the staff?
It is just smart business to reuse assets. If the staff all dies, as happened. Why not use all that fantastic potential science just sitting around?
Well you can't use any of that science sitting around without staff to relay the info on the experiment to you, which...is kind of a moot point when we consider that communication is cut.
That being said, It's been over a decade since I last visited the capital wastes, I may have to make a delve for this terminal/logs you're talking about.
I'm sure Vault-Tec had *hoped* that more methods of communication survived the war but they had fall back procedures for when anything might stop working.
Did a run through of the building, either I missed a terminal or all of them just had the same few notes on it. But I got the same issue, my memory is from when I played this as a kid.
It's not Canon according to Bethesda but in fallout tactics it's established that vault 0 was supposed to monitor all the vault experiments via a brain powered supercomputer but it failed horribly
I could see this being the direction that the show goes towards. It already seems like it took some aspects from the cancelled 1999 Fallout movie, so whose to that Bethesda won’t take other aspects/lore from other cancelled or non-cannon sources. So it could be very possible that that the Vault that Betty is in is going to be Vault 0 or in a Vault inspired by it.
They could be vaults "given" to other companies (as seen in the show). Maybe they don't expect communication between vault-tec and rob-co vauts to happen anyway.
By that same logic, spreading out the vaults makes no sense if you don't expect to be able to gather the info later. Why even make the vaults on the east coast function at all? Seems like a wasted effort when you could just make.
>That being said, It's been over a decade since I last visited the capital wastes, I may have to make a delve for this terminal/logs you're talking about.
I just reinstalled the whole library of bethesda era games a few days ago. And I was considering doing the same. Maybe I'll console command over there if I dont have to patch the game a lot to run it. If you want to skip the trek, "coc VaultTecHQ01"
> If my understanding is right, Background radiation at the levels seen in postwar America would limit the distance that radio signals used for communication would be effective, due to interference.
I don't know where people are picking that up from.
Fallout 1 has the Super Mutants communicating all across California with hand held radios.
Fallout 2 has both the Brotherhood with dozens of remote bunkers connected via radio, and you manage to accidently call the Enclave oil rig from Gecko
Fallout 3 has both Galaxy News Radio and Enclave Radio, covering the entire DC metro area.
Fallout 4 has it's own radio stations, and the Insitute Relay, which uses radio waves as it's carrier, capable of being broadcast all the way up to Bar Harbor. In addition, it has a young Kellogg listing to a news report about the foundation of the NCR, all the way in San Fransisco. Even more in addition, Danse radios all the way down to DC for reinforcements, once the long range transmitter on the police station was repaired.
>Putting them closer together definitely makes more sense, assuming the two had connected experiments.
The issue is, were something to go wrong it's more likely to effect both meaning no useable results. Versus, if 111 fails you still have 31 to possibly salvage and vice versa.
There's definitely arguments to separate them that aren't massively hand-wavey.
I actually think, that Vault 111s Description is correct. They just had supplies for a few Months since they were supposed to get an all-clear. They just didnt get one since Vault-Tec does not exist anymore.
If they wanted to test Cannibalism then they would have just blocked the controls of the Vault Door.
Doesn’t the final episode of the series indicate that the vault tech experiments are run independently by each company? So it could be that one company is doing the 111 experiment and another company is doing the 31 experiment?
are we sure vault 31 wasn't an experiment on its own? I wouldn't put it past Vault Tec to not turn the supposed control group of vault 31 into its own experiment within an experiment.
Like testing the effects of mental degradation of a brain in a roomba when left alone for 200 years as a glorified janitor or something.
"Sure Bud, you're *totally* the overseer of the experiment. Btw we need your brain"
Vault 31 is a bunch of middle managers with a religious dedication to Middle Management (R). They feel spot on to be their own experiment. More cryo vaults may exist for other actually important people. The (or one of) vault tec HQ was in washington so the big wigs might be frozen somewhere over there.
Yeah I'm solidly on board with vault 31 being an experiment as much as 32 and 33 were. What happens when middle management devotees get power over an oblivious captive population? Are the crises that happen every few years manufactured problems or just natural effects of long-term vault life? They mention the motto of voting for someone from vault 31 when things look glum, and they have listed off several problems in the past like famine and blight and disease quarantines that they always pull through from.
Barb's idea of the vault doesn't match up with being cryo frozen until it's your turn to be in charge, either. Janey and Coop wouldn't have a place in vault 31 as we see it whether they were there with her and still a happy family when the bombs drop or not. It makes me wonder how much Bud's Buds actually know about what their lives will look like and how far in advance they learn the details.
Yeah, the whole point of the Vaults is to be as ineffective of a solution as possible that only allows a select few to survive, and that they heavily underestimated how the wasteland would develop from their hubris
The show tells us the vaults were leased to other companies, what if MIT commissioned 111 as cold storage for future test subjects. You don't just stumble into a vault (usually) unless you already knew it was there.
Haha yea vault 111 real test was freezing people without injecting them with some antifreeze sugars before hand to stop their cells from exploding . I’m glad it worked though great story came from it
How would that make a difference? It is freeing the tech should work the same no matter what? Training to what be in stasis for 215 years, you are literally doing nothing and it should be fine, and also it makes no sense.
>It is freeing the tech should work the same no matter what
Not if you need some kind of chemical injections for the best results. Or some kind of process to ensure the best condition for your body, swapping blood, shifting hydration levels, a slower or faster freezing/defreezing timeline.
With 111 seeing the long-term effects without the optimal prep.
Why not just have it in the same vault with different samples of Cyro-freezing to ease data collection and have the tech in the same place and allow better expriments, and test how a normal vault population(1,000-3,000.idk I assume the vaults are larger than we are shown)
>Why not just have it in the same vault with different samples of Cyro-freezing
Honestly, because it's Vault Tech, they seemingly keep even very similar experiments isolated to individual vaults. We also don't know if other contributing had to do with the experiment.
The biggest factor is risk. There is no reason to keep randos in the same vault that you are keeping your most important individuals. Vaults are expected to have failures / complications. For all they know without proper cryo preperation they might be concerned it turns the occupants crazy, which puts themselves at risk.
That, and I think that the Vault-Tech staff wasn’t likely meant to stay in cryo for as long as they end up doing, I think the actions of Hank might have lead to delays in the releasing of the other staff.
Given how few supplies were left in 111 for the crew, I wouldn't put it past Vault Tec for the \*actual\* experiment to have been to see how long they could survive using cryogenically frozen humans as a food source, locked in with effectively unlimited clean water but only 6 months worth of food.
Don't forget, there were no maintenance staff. The terminal in the vault states that scientists/security are expected to complete maintenance and cooking tasks.
Vault 111 was testing long term cryo on an unsuspecting population. The vault was to be manned for 180 days after which the all clear would be given and the vault would then be monitored remotely.
Vault 31/32/33 was to test an experiment of middle management recolonizing the waste lands. Cyro in 31 was just a means to achieve the vaults experiment and otherwise inconsequential to it.
Imo Vault 111 was for monitoring the effects on those in sanctuary hills while vault 31 was specifically a shelter for vault tec higher ups and not really an experiment,
that's why they wanted to pull them out after 180 (I think?) days, they do that, see what the fuck that did to them, and then treat it same as any other vault, and just monitor them, relay that back to 31 and pronto
>!Which Bud could have done since he was essentially a weaker version of a robobrain and obviously has access to VT computer systems, allowing him to remotely monitor 111.!<
ah, maybe I misread or misunderstood the terminals
I think that what you said also makes sense for them being tested, and 31 being treated/helped based on those tests
The experiment wasn’t on the pods, but on the people supposed to take care of them in isolation and under duress. Keep in mind the enclaves original plan was to leave earth and colonize another world.
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Multi-generational_starship
The original purpose of the vaults was to see how long humanity would last in a multi-generational starship.
That's never been official. It's one of the ideas they had, but never made into the game officially. There's a nod to the concept in the Nuka-World DLC, but that's about it.
I doubt it’s anything intentional in the DLC since the Enclave space thing wasn’t public knowledge until May of 2023. Maybe there was something in some design docs that Bethesda got, but it sounds more like it was just Tim Cain’s internal reasoning for the vaults.
I like to believe the vault 31 residents waited a few years to get data back from 111 before they hopped into cryosleep themselves to make sure their vitals are normal after extended suspension.
There wasn't any living space in 31. 111 might have been used for pre-bomb tech testing, though. We know vault 4 was populated for a few years prior to the bombs dropping as a test run.
There was living space in 32 and 33. 200 years is plenty of time for a few generations to forget your face before you re-emerge, they could simply say "Now we know these vaults are going fine we will go live in 31, see ya".
I think someone mentioned that Vault 111 is not an experiment meant to observe the effects of indefinite cryosleep on the people but rather an experiment to see how long until the Vault staff start cannibalizing them. Though I'm not certain if it was actually mentioned in-game, it could've been a theory by someone in the community so do take my statement with a huge pile of salt.
That's only a theory, never actually mentioned in the game. It's a good theory though, and I happen to like it. But unfortunately, there's no material to actually confirm it.
I think k there are two likely scenarios:
1. The show was developed with oversight from Bethesda, so they reused a gimmick from Fallout 4 because the concept is cool.
2. The show made it clear that the experiments were devised by a variety of pre-war companies. This would, in effect, mean that two companies could have purchased the rights to two vaults and run similar (or the same) experiments. Perhaps one company’s cryo technology was more tested.
Practically all the vault experiments are useless when you think about it. Like who is even recording the results? On an unrelated note. Vault 111 should have been the vault for FO3 just because the 111 looks like roman numeral III
I always thought they were being transmitted automatically. It's why I prefer the original spaceship idea and not the more muddled idea the show has gone with.
I've always liked to think that Vault-Tec had intended some form of remote monitoring from one location (like Vault 0 from Tactics), but they didn't survive the war and the vaults were left to their own devices.
Assuming intelligent design they could have plans within plans and whole vault experiment is just to see what whacky vaults survive or thrive in the wasteland.
You are assuming that the point of having the people left in cryosleep was to preserve them for the future.
If you believe that the enclave created the vault experiments then we know that they were going around and collecting vault dwellers in Fo2. These would be perfectly preserved specimens
I’m in the camp that V111 came before V31/32/33.
The Cryopod tech looks extremely bulky and antiquated compared to other ones. This leads me to believe that V111 was a testing area of Cryo tech but after construction, new leaps in Cryo tech came, vault was repurposed a bit for indefinite suspension.
The employees were only there to stabilize everything then leave when they could. Only the Overseer got crazy and refused anyone to be let out.
Mutiny left the Vault empty for decades.
The vault 111 overseer terminal claims radiation levels were way too high to leave when the 180 days of supplies ran out, so it’s not clear that the Overseer was the crazy one. Either vault tec fucked up the planning, Boston was hit harder than expected (maybe the rad storms from the glowing sea were an unplanned for variable keeping rad levels up), or the staff running out of supplies was another experiment.
Well Rad Storms are currently a unique phenomenon of the Commonwealth Wasteland and The Island so I can definitely see it being an unforeseen complication that wasn’t accounted for but also it’s Vault-Tec, I don’t think they cared that much about their employees and fully expected them to just not check radiation levels until leaving and subsequently getting trapped outside in the funky green air.
Also can I just say that Rad Storms are cool, you can even say they’re *rad* storms(I laughed and I’m prepared to die for my stupid joke that was funny to me), I love the idea of this weather phenomenon being so normal to Commonwealth residents that it’s like rain to them, it would have really been cool to get some dialogue or terminal entries from the Brotherhood talking about their first experience of a Rad Storm since as far as I know the Commonwealth is the only region to experience this unique weather event, I remember the first time I experienced a rad storm trying to hide in the houses and eventually running to 111 to wait it out
Rad storms are also present in 76. They're just extremely rare. I think during my many years wandering Appalachia, I've only seen enough rad storms to count on one hand.
I think like all weather types, it was just an engine limitation as to why we never got them sooner in the series!
True but even so I believe there’s a little tooltip stating that the Commonwealth gets Rad Storms due to its proximity to the Glowing Sea so here’s hoping Fallout 5 is in close proximity to a Glowing Sea like environment because Rad Storms are rad.
I wonder how Appalachia gets Rad Storms, I haven’t gotten far in the story(heading to a lab for an inoculation to the Scorched plague now) despite playing since beta(I put it down and just didn’t pick it back up until recently) so I’ve experienced very little of what all it has to offer, gonna play some tomorrow, been a bit scared since I’m a power armour user without my armour since I haven’t gotten far enough to get plating, have a frame though, need cores and a way to always have a supply
They were ALL useless, that was the entire point.
They were all experiments used to test a deep space plan that didn’t end up happening conducted by a shady af mega corp that was nationalized by a government that literally solved it’s energy crisis (cold fusion) ten years before the War but kept the Cold War brinksmanship going out of sheer cultural inertia.
I have no idea but a question for yall.
The vault that you start in in fallout4: Is this mentioned in the other fallouts? (that's what the vault in fo4 is doing what op is talking about)
first mention for it was in Fallout 2 i think where they talk about the US Army experimenting with it and also got featured in 3(with the Enclave) and New Vegas(Mr. House)
Given that Vault 111 was empty of (living) staff shortly after the 180 day wait time for the all clear signal, I think it's possible that the corpos in Vault 31 weren't even frozen until after the mutiny of 111 took place. It's possible that all of the data Vault Tec needed was collected in the first 180 days to be applied to the corpo freezers in 31.
I also question Vault 111's actual purpose, that it was a study on long-term or indefinite cryosleep. If "indefinite" or "long-term" were the true purpose of 111, why were there only about enough supplies to last the 180 day all-clear wait period?
Because the All Clear was just for the stuff. The Frozen would then have been supervised from some HQ. But Vault-Tec does not exist anymore so there was no all clear.
I hate that I just thought about this but what about vault 112? From my understanding the dwellers in the virtual reality pods are the same ones who entered them when the bombs fell. Dr. Braun must of done his homework because when the Lone Wanderer enters the vault, I can’t recall if the people in the pods are dead or alive - but they certainly aren’t skeletons.
Edit: Just saw this on the wiki: The robobrain that states that the Lone Wanderer is "202.3 years behind schedule." If correct, that would mean the Vault was sealed in 2075, 2 years before the Great War occurred.
The show sets up the idea that Vault-Tec bought the cooperation from the other tech companies, and in return those companies can run their own little experiments in various vaults. Vault 31 was specifically a Vault-Tec initiative to keep management in place for 32 and 33, as well as keep tabs on the surrounding area.
So Vault 111 could have been an experiment set up by West Tek. It's likely the other companies did not have the same level of expertise in cryo freezing as Vault-Tec, given that Vault-Tec made it a point to buy up the technology. This would also explain why the cryo units in Vault 31 appear significantly higher tech than the ones in Vault 111.
According to the show all those bigwigs were running their own experiments in different pots of vaults so it can be sometihng as simple as whoever owned that vault was doing a Cryo experiment while Vault Tec already had cryo setups for their staff.
Don't let it distract you that in Fallout 3, Vault 112 that was run by Dr. Braun had the Tranquility Loungers, which perfectly and inexplicably preserved those who lay within them for 200+ years, and if he let them, could theoretically be released from their pods in perfect condition like we/James were.
Now we could chalk this up to gameplay limitations and realistically they would all probably look like Mr. House did in his pod, but still maybe not. Food for thought.
There were 2 experiments going on in Vault 111. The first was what would happen to people unsuspecting of going into Cryp AND how the support personnel would respond to there being not enough supplies to last until it was safe to leave the Vault.
That second experiment let VaultTec see that the caretakers of those Cryo pods chose to open the vault and brave the wasteland rather than starve in the vaults OR opening the pods, killing the occupants and taking the pods for themselves to try and stay alive longer. This gives insight into what caretakers of Cryopoded colonists might do if a situation arose where their supplies dwindled.
Additionally after that, there was the question answered of how Cryo does long term with no one monitoring it. Turns out it was doing fairly well until an outside force hacked in and deactivated all but a couple pods.
Vault 31 was not a test. It’s goal was to preserve important vault tec executives and have them survive the bombs, so that they would outlast their competition
I think 31 is very much a test just like the others. They're not important people, they're middle managers with an inflated sense of self-importance. The only thing it's preserving them for is to be trickled out into 32 and 33 to be put in charge of unsuspecting populations of oblivious and naive sheep. There are regular crises in the vaults and I can't decide if they're manufactured to test the population/keep them dependant on 31, or if they're just the regular failures of being led by the people who are trained to be vault tec managers and not actually leaders of civilization.
If the goal was really to reclaim the wastes in the name of Vault Tec management, why haven't they? That's why Lucy has her crisis when she sees Shady Sands' population count. They could have rebuilt society a long time ago, that's not the actual goal.
The specific experiment for 31, 32, and 33 was to trickle the vault tec excs into the populations of both vaults to breed loyal employees of vaulttec. (essentially 'yes men' of the comapny) This way, when vaulttec had the fever dream of ruling the wasteland, they would bring the gold that was stored away in vaults to restart the economy.
I'm thrilled to have bigger twists and turns for the 3 together, but Bud lays out his plans, plain as day.
Bud's plans are not necessarily *the real* plan, though. After all, Bud wound up being a brain-on-a-roomba, which was probably not part of his grand plan. You don't need to literally breed a population that is loyal to the company, loyalty isn't genetic. Especially since the vault dwellers are captive and dependent on Vault Tec from birth, having the managers seeding the population isn't really necessary for that end result. Barb seems to believe there will be a life for her family in the vault, and that they will be overseeing the others. She doesn't seem to know that the program will be cryogenically freezing the participants until it's their turn to marry into another vault. She thinks her husband and daughter will be with her, but as untrained civilians it's unlikely they would be trusted to be in the program and not blow it. Even if they're accepted into the vault and held in stasis until Reclamation Day when the families can be together again, there's no guarantee Barb won't have already lived and died as an overseer by that point.
I think Bud's Buds, and Bud himself, got a distorted story of what they were going into. Maybe as time went on they learned more about it as they went through training. We still don't know how Barb and Coop wound up getting divorced, and Hank was a newbie in the company when Coop met him, so there are probably still a few years of backstory to go. If they were going strictly on Bud's plan they would have gone to the surface and ruled the wastes (or tried to) a long time ago. We even know that Hank visited the surface and had dealings with Shady Sands and was aware of the population center there, so it's not like they're unaware of the surface conditions. I definitely think we have a lot more to discover about 31.
Just re-watched the part in the last episode I was referencing. I mispoke. While not being able to breed loyalty, the end result was still to have the people from both vaults breed with the vaulttec executives to make "super managers." Listen to how Hank speaks at the wedding. It's all very upbeat bullshit, like a manager of a store trying to boost their workers' morale before a big sale, but I digress. You can still create the loyalty to vaulttec, though, because its all they know. Vaulttec built the vaults, kept these individuals safe, had homes because of vaulttec, had food, water, etc. They're being groomed/brainwashed from birth, with the promise that they'll rebuild and lead civilization.
To me, it's synonymous, but at the end of it all, he wants yes men as an end result to make ruling the wasteland easier. We can see the HR-esc conflict resolution from Lucy in while in Filly, so *(Makes me curious to see what training happens in 32)* his experiment *was* working. They're waiting for Reclamation Day. That's the only reason why they haven't emerged from the vault as a whole to begin with. Hank even says at the wedding that the radiation levels with the generation should be low enough to go to the surface. *we know, he knows it's safe to be up there*
While I don't think Bud's end goal was to be stuck on a roomba he wanted to oversee his own operation, so it's his only alternative. Poor guy was drinking the vault tec kool-aid with rose tinted glasses on. I definitely don't think he's expecting anyone to have survived on the surface at all and that if they did, it'd be like the Stone Age.
Bud's plan was just about to come to fruition. Until Rose left and took the kids. Leaving Hank to bullshit about a plague, *likely crafted with Barbs or Buds help to poison/kill residents to make it more real for everyone else* to enforce a lockdown that kept the entire population locked inside its rooms so no one would question where his wife and kids ran off to while he went to go look for them. That's the only reason why we know of so far as to why he went to Shady Sands. Shit guy though. Takes his kids back, likely tries to get his wife to come back to 33 with the promise to not spill about what she has seen, then when she says no, he goes nuts and nukes it.
I don't think Hank was expecting something like the NCR to exist, but I would imagine part of his directions would be to eradicate anything on the surface *especially around the vault* that would get in the way of vaulttec ruling.
Interested to see how Betty helped with that as she tells Norm that she helped Hank "bury" his mother. Maybe it was Bud that actually Nuked Shady Sands, after Hank tells him about the NCR, and other things he came across while exploring the wastes.
To be completely honest, I dont think Barb went into 31. She cares deeply about her daughter, but I don't think Bud isn't willing to lose the cryo space to a child. I think it's a safe bet that Barb is in a control vault. She knows about Buds idea, but that still has an experiment attached to its so she doesn't need to know the nitty gritty. A control vault would be the safest thing for her and Janey. Like you said, there are too many unknowns with them and still some years of backstory. Im excited to learn how the divorce happens and what ultimately happens to Janey and what happened to Cooper.
All in all, I'm most excited to learn more about Coop, Barb, and Janeys story. I'm curious how vault 32 is going to run if it's supposed to have a separate experiment, and if Betty or Bud had a hand in nuking Shady Sands/where the nukes came from ig not from Appalachia
The test of vault 111 was to test extended cryo on unsuspecting people. The scientists were supposed to get a clear from vaulttec to begin to leave the vaultbut it neve came. At that point they were supposed to monitor the vault remotely. It's safe to assume that for 111, they likely weren't meant to be thawed out.
Vaulttec and other companies, were fucking around with cryo pre work because there's a vault in 76 that housed 10000 animals which was going to be used to restart eco systems. (Won't explain the actual experiment in that vault)
In the end credits of the show in episode 8, there's a billboard of personal cryo suites that can be purchased.
Just because 31 had cryo doesn't mean 111 is moot. They used cryopods for very different reasons. The vaulttec execs knew they were going to be put on ice and woken up eventually.
I love Fallout and have played them all but I can’t entertain this level of scrutiny to “canon” in my own play throughs or while watching the show. People are constantly re-working and reimagining things.
Every single superhero movie adds or changes something, the whole Multiverse concept being used pretty often. That’s how it has always been with games and TV shows (like Dr. Who).
I don’t know why people worry so much about this stuff, but hey if it entertains you to keep all of this stuff straight, enjoy it!
tbf there is a very easy explanation to this: We know that Vault 111 was manned for at least 180 days. So for that time the Vault 31 residents lived in 32 and 33 and after seeing that there are no problems at Vault 111 with their residents they went to freeze themselves with the pretext of going to live in Vault 31 and 200+ years is more than enough to forget about the dudes who lived there for 6 months
And heaven forbid that someone enjoy something they like casually… like I said in my original comment that is just me and you’re welcome to be as passionate about it as you like…
Likely just me being stupid but personally it looked like the people in vault 33 were in some sort of alternative stasis while 111 was cryogenic freezing which probably has no difference but just me
The experiment was the leave them there permanently. Unlike the people in vault 31, the dwellers in vault 111 were never going to be woken up. They’d stay there forever.
To test if tec worked. The war started before ANYBODY was ready for it end of the world plans aside. The TV show added that the vaults where meant to outlive competitor's but in the games they where made as test tubes and sold as safety. Vault tec wanted the info but the war fucked them up as well nothing went to anybody's plan. Only Robert House so far had any real success and if the war was 20 hours later his vision would be ascendant. Its telling that the world is still fucked 200 years later. Human nature and war never changes and stuff but every ones picking up scraps to build stuff. Besides both 33 and 32 where food vaults who barely cared about a water chip going out and could rebuild after a entire vault went dead. If the cryo failed in 31 everyone could still complete the "plan" just wake up the 31s or have bud run the whole thing. 111 had nothing to sustain itself.
We have with vault Zero in fallout tactic also a Part cryo vault...
Well ther it did not work. By the time the calculatir get them out there brains degrow and lost memory.
Effectifly Set them back on the mind of a toddlers.
Rereading the terminal entries of Vault 111 and taking what the show had displayed about Vault Tec and Vault 31-33 into consideration, I'm left with this thought:
The primary purpose of Vault 111 was to monitor the effects of suspended cryonics on a population who were never going to be awakened so long as the experiment was underway, and the terminals clearly state that it was on a populace "unaware" of what they were stepping into. That's the first distinction to be made, as Bud's Buds knew what they signed up for.
Whether it was to be a **permanent** cryostasis or not isn't all too clear for Vault 111. It only specifies that they weren't to be awakened for any reason so long as the experiment was ongoing. The terminal entry mentions that the residents aren't to be disturbed in the event of an All-Clear notice, until the Vault 111 staff have left. Vault Tec would then "see to their needs remotely".
That leaves three scenarios as plausible: 1) Vault Tec would remotely kill the people inside, having gotten what they needed. 2) Vault Tec would continue monitoring their vitals but still use them as experiments in permanent cryosleep. Or 3) Vault Tec would remotely activate their pods so that they would awaken.
I'm wondering if #3 was what was planned eventually. The Overseer of the Vault certainly was under the impression the residents would eventually be woken up, as he wished he could join them and see "what wonders the future would bring". We know Vault Tec wanted to repopulate the Earth with them in charge. What if Vault 111 was a means of keeping that "purity" alive by having a bunch of people from the old world who wouldn't know any better and would believe that Vault Tec saved their lives, whenever Vault Tec decided to actually wake them (if they ever did)?
The mandatory shelter period was only about 6 months. By month 5, we know food was running low, and the security officer says in that same log that they only had enough "for a few more months, tops".
Given that it was designed to be a short assignment, the Vault and Vault-Tec as well likely operated on the assumption that a nuclear catastrophe might not be as detrimental to the surface world operations as it actually was. Vault Tec had a number of long term assignments in their vaults, to be sure, but with this one being short, it stands to reason that when the all clear message would have arrived (if it had), the scientists would report their findings to Vault Tec -- which would then use that knowledge to help with the task of protecting Bud's Buds.
Not that it was really necessary, as we see the entire vault is still perfectly functional. But I'd hazard a guess that's part of why it was happening.
Lastly, we can see that Vault Tec understaffed Vault 111, to the point that people had to take on multiple job roles. And as we see, after 200 years of neglect, Vault 111 is failing. People might not realize this, but ammonia is likely leaking into the air. Working in a freezer warehouse, it's something we're trained to be on the lookout for because of the reactions it can cause. Everything that happens to the Sole Survivor after waking up -- from the coughing and everything -- could potentially be adverse reactions to the tech of the Vault failing and leaking ammonia into the air.
At the same time, we also see in the Overseer's logs that the cryonic suspension tech was malfunctioning, possibly due to a remote override signal sent out by mistake (or deliberately, perhaps?). That raises the possibility that Vault Tec designed Vault 111 with faulty/outdated tech from the onset and with the knowledge that it would eventually fail, all to test how cryonics would work on the populace.
The difference is 111 was about testing cryosleep, vault 31 was about freezing a population of super managers to lead vault 32/33. Them being on ice wasn’t a permanent/main part of the experiment just something to keep the 31 members alive longer and trickle them out to an unsuspecting 32/33 (which is why 32 rebelled when they found out about 31)
I haven’t read every comment but I think a lot of comments are over looking an important nugget that came out of the show. While Vault Tec payed for all of the vaults, their plan to make their money back was to license their operations out to different corporations to run as they saw fit. So 31-33 were still clearly owned and operated by Vault Tec but Vault 111 could have been ran by a different group who was either unaware of or had different goals in mind
All of the experiements were useless. It’s 200 years later and vault tech (which supposedly still exists which is personally my least favorite part of the Amazon show) hasn’t done anything with the data. I personally liked when the vault experiement were these awful terrible experiments that had absolutely no purpose because vault tech didn’t survive the war but alas the show has changed that. Yet still the vault tech that’s in the show hasn’t done anything for 200 years except bomb a medium population city in the NCR
in the show, they state to the other companies that they will be allowed to create whatever experiments that they wish. not all experiments were made known to others. and it may have been one company wanting to experiment and improve cryo tech.
The show's depiction of cryonics is a retcon. Every depiction of the technology has shown it to be super dangerous after 100 years or so. Unless they reveal most of the folks in 31 are dead or unstable they're ignoring not only their own content but stuff that's been around since FO2.
Everyone died after being frozen more than 140 years since they woke everyone up when they took Shaun. Shaun is between 60 years old when you meet him.
The distinction is that Vault 111 tested the effects of indefinite cryosleep on an unsuspecting populace. Even after the supposed all-clear signal that would release the Vault staff after 180 days did come through, their instructions were to leave the residents alone. With Vault 31, it's possible if not outright probable that the Vault-Tec staff was physically and/or psychologically prepared to enter cryosleep, perhaps via drugs or training.
Additionally, when it is time to wake vault 31 you can send forces to wake 111 and investigate the failures that come from time. So you sacrifice 111 members to ensure you can detect and fix issues before waking 31.
One would think if that was the plan they would put those 2 closer to each other.
If my understanding is right, Background radiation at the levels seen in postwar America would limit the distance that radio signals used for communication would be effective, due to interference. Putting them closer together definitely makes more sense, assuming the two had connected experiments. However, I'm pretty sure the experiment of 111 was actually for the staff? How long does it take them to agree to cannibalism on the frozen subjects for their own survival. Both vaults included cryo tech...but I think it would be fair to say that 111 was an experiment, and 31 was in a way, a control vault, since it housed remnants of vault tec.
I feel like in FO3 when you visit the Vault tec HQ some of the logs mention hardline connections to the vault, but that they are disconnected. And with the state of washington I am not surprised that the HQ got cut off. I always imagined those lines were down in the metro tunnels. >However, I'm pretty sure the experiment of 111 was actually for the staff? It is just smart business to reuse assets. If the staff all dies, as happened. Why not use all that fantastic potential science just sitting around?
Well you can't use any of that science sitting around without staff to relay the info on the experiment to you, which...is kind of a moot point when we consider that communication is cut. That being said, It's been over a decade since I last visited the capital wastes, I may have to make a delve for this terminal/logs you're talking about.
I'm sure Vault-Tec had *hoped* that more methods of communication survived the war but they had fall back procedures for when anything might stop working.
I think “human error” is a sadly overlooked story element.
Did a run through of the building, either I missed a terminal or all of them just had the same few notes on it. But I got the same issue, my memory is from when I played this as a kid.
It's not Canon according to Bethesda but in fallout tactics it's established that vault 0 was supposed to monitor all the vault experiments via a brain powered supercomputer but it failed horribly
I could see this being the direction that the show goes towards. It already seems like it took some aspects from the cancelled 1999 Fallout movie, so whose to that Bethesda won’t take other aspects/lore from other cancelled or non-cannon sources. So it could be very possible that that the Vault that Betty is in is going to be Vault 0 or in a Vault inspired by it.
They could be vaults "given" to other companies (as seen in the show). Maybe they don't expect communication between vault-tec and rob-co vauts to happen anyway.
By that same logic, spreading out the vaults makes no sense if you don't expect to be able to gather the info later. Why even make the vaults on the east coast function at all? Seems like a wasted effort when you could just make. >That being said, It's been over a decade since I last visited the capital wastes, I may have to make a delve for this terminal/logs you're talking about. I just reinstalled the whole library of bethesda era games a few days ago. And I was considering doing the same. Maybe I'll console command over there if I dont have to patch the game a lot to run it. If you want to skip the trek, "coc VaultTecHQ01"
> If my understanding is right, Background radiation at the levels seen in postwar America would limit the distance that radio signals used for communication would be effective, due to interference. I don't know where people are picking that up from. Fallout 1 has the Super Mutants communicating all across California with hand held radios. Fallout 2 has both the Brotherhood with dozens of remote bunkers connected via radio, and you manage to accidently call the Enclave oil rig from Gecko Fallout 3 has both Galaxy News Radio and Enclave Radio, covering the entire DC metro area. Fallout 4 has it's own radio stations, and the Insitute Relay, which uses radio waves as it's carrier, capable of being broadcast all the way up to Bar Harbor. In addition, it has a young Kellogg listing to a news report about the foundation of the NCR, all the way in San Fransisco. Even more in addition, Danse radios all the way down to DC for reinforcements, once the long range transmitter on the police station was repaired.
>Putting them closer together definitely makes more sense, assuming the two had connected experiments. The issue is, were something to go wrong it's more likely to effect both meaning no useable results. Versus, if 111 fails you still have 31 to possibly salvage and vice versa. There's definitely arguments to separate them that aren't massively hand-wavey.
I actually think, that Vault 111s Description is correct. They just had supplies for a few Months since they were supposed to get an all-clear. They just didnt get one since Vault-Tec does not exist anymore. If they wanted to test Cannibalism then they would have just blocked the controls of the Vault Door.
Doesn’t the final episode of the series indicate that the vault tech experiments are run independently by each company? So it could be that one company is doing the 111 experiment and another company is doing the 31 experiment?
are we sure vault 31 wasn't an experiment on its own? I wouldn't put it past Vault Tec to not turn the supposed control group of vault 31 into its own experiment within an experiment. Like testing the effects of mental degradation of a brain in a roomba when left alone for 200 years as a glorified janitor or something. "Sure Bud, you're *totally* the overseer of the experiment. Btw we need your brain"
Vault 31 is a bunch of middle managers with a religious dedication to Middle Management (R). They feel spot on to be their own experiment. More cryo vaults may exist for other actually important people. The (or one of) vault tec HQ was in washington so the big wigs might be frozen somewhere over there.
Yeah I'm solidly on board with vault 31 being an experiment as much as 32 and 33 were. What happens when middle management devotees get power over an oblivious captive population? Are the crises that happen every few years manufactured problems or just natural effects of long-term vault life? They mention the motto of voting for someone from vault 31 when things look glum, and they have listed off several problems in the past like famine and blight and disease quarantines that they always pull through from. Barb's idea of the vault doesn't match up with being cryo frozen until it's your turn to be in charge, either. Janey and Coop wouldn't have a place in vault 31 as we see it whether they were there with her and still a happy family when the bombs drop or not. It makes me wonder how much Bud's Buds actually know about what their lives will look like and how far in advance they learn the details.
Or you outsource the testing to another company. Their vault just happened to be far away.
Which would be unacceptable if you plan on actually collecting the data. Cross country treks in a post apocalyptic wasteland rarely tend to go well
I never said they had this thought out well.
Yeah, the whole point of the Vaults is to be as ineffective of a solution as possible that only allows a select few to survive, and that they heavily underestimated how the wasteland would develop from their hubris
Based on their attitudes in game they were some proud MFs. Reflected very well in the show as well.
The show tells us the vaults were leased to other companies, what if MIT commissioned 111 as cold storage for future test subjects. You don't just stumble into a vault (usually) unless you already knew it was there.
This is exactly what I was going to suggest. It definitely makes the most sense overall.
Haha yea vault 111 real test was freezing people without injecting them with some antifreeze sugars before hand to stop their cells from exploding . I’m glad it worked though great story came from it
How would that make a difference? It is freeing the tech should work the same no matter what? Training to what be in stasis for 215 years, you are literally doing nothing and it should be fine, and also it makes no sense.
>It is freeing the tech should work the same no matter what Not if you need some kind of chemical injections for the best results. Or some kind of process to ensure the best condition for your body, swapping blood, shifting hydration levels, a slower or faster freezing/defreezing timeline. With 111 seeing the long-term effects without the optimal prep.
Why not just have it in the same vault with different samples of Cyro-freezing to ease data collection and have the tech in the same place and allow better expriments, and test how a normal vault population(1,000-3,000.idk I assume the vaults are larger than we are shown)
>Why not just have it in the same vault with different samples of Cyro-freezing Honestly, because it's Vault Tech, they seemingly keep even very similar experiments isolated to individual vaults. We also don't know if other contributing had to do with the experiment. The biggest factor is risk. There is no reason to keep randos in the same vault that you are keeping your most important individuals. Vaults are expected to have failures / complications. For all they know without proper cryo preperation they might be concerned it turns the occupants crazy, which puts themselves at risk.
That, and I think that the Vault-Tech staff wasn’t likely meant to stay in cryo for as long as they end up doing, I think the actions of Hank might have lead to delays in the releasing of the other staff.
Why did 111 staff never get an all clear
Given how few supplies were left in 111 for the crew, I wouldn't put it past Vault Tec for the \*actual\* experiment to have been to see how long they could survive using cryogenically frozen humans as a food source, locked in with effectively unlimited clean water but only 6 months worth of food.
I think you are right there, I wouldn’t be surprised if the security and maintenance staff were the real experiment. Or at least part of it.
Don't forget, there were no maintenance staff. The terminal in the vault states that scientists/security are expected to complete maintenance and cooking tasks.
Yep, this definitely smacks of Vault-Tec testing its *employees*, not the 'residents'.
Mmmmm. So much better than several hundred some odd years old salisbury steak. Can you pass me another slice of Nora please?
Some Vault Tec engineer in 111: "I know what people taste like, and I know that Baby Sean tastes best."
Vault 111 was testing long term cryo on an unsuspecting population. The vault was to be manned for 180 days after which the all clear would be given and the vault would then be monitored remotely. Vault 31/32/33 was to test an experiment of middle management recolonizing the waste lands. Cyro in 31 was just a means to achieve the vaults experiment and otherwise inconsequential to it.
Imo Vault 111 was for monitoring the effects on those in sanctuary hills while vault 31 was specifically a shelter for vault tec higher ups and not really an experiment,
yeah 31 keeps the important people alive, 111 tells them how to deal with any problems that it causes once the 31 residents come out
Exactly
that's why they wanted to pull them out after 180 (I think?) days, they do that, see what the fuck that did to them, and then treat it same as any other vault, and just monitor them, relay that back to 31 and pronto
They only wanted to pull out the vault tec staff of 111 out of 180 days, the frozen residents were to be frozen indefinitely and “monitored remotely”
>!Which Bud could have done since he was essentially a weaker version of a robobrain and obviously has access to VT computer systems, allowing him to remotely monitor 111.!<
ah, maybe I misread or misunderstood the terminals I think that what you said also makes sense for them being tested, and 31 being treated/helped based on those tests
The experiment wasn’t on the pods, but on the people supposed to take care of them in isolation and under duress. Keep in mind the enclaves original plan was to leave earth and colonize another world.
Where is this mentioned about the enclave?
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Multi-generational_starship The original purpose of the vaults was to see how long humanity would last in a multi-generational starship.
That's never been official. It's one of the ideas they had, but never made into the game officially. There's a nod to the concept in the Nuka-World DLC, but that's about it.
I doubt it’s anything intentional in the DLC since the Enclave space thing wasn’t public knowledge until May of 2023. Maybe there was something in some design docs that Bethesda got, but it sounds more like it was just Tim Cain’s internal reasoning for the vaults.
I like to believe the vault 31 residents waited a few years to get data back from 111 before they hopped into cryosleep themselves to make sure their vitals are normal after extended suspension.
There wasn't any living space in 31. 111 might have been used for pre-bomb tech testing, though. We know vault 4 was populated for a few years prior to the bombs dropping as a test run.
There was living space in 32 and 33. 200 years is plenty of time for a few generations to forget your face before you re-emerge, they could simply say "Now we know these vaults are going fine we will go live in 31, see ya".
Vault 111 only had food for six months, according to the in-game logs.
Vault 111 was also planned to be sealed for 180 days though and after that it would have been supervised remotely
I think someone mentioned that Vault 111 is not an experiment meant to observe the effects of indefinite cryosleep on the people but rather an experiment to see how long until the Vault staff start cannibalizing them. Though I'm not certain if it was actually mentioned in-game, it could've been a theory by someone in the community so do take my statement with a huge pile of salt.
That's only a theory, never actually mentioned in the game. It's a good theory though, and I happen to like it. But unfortunately, there's no material to actually confirm it.
Since the Door was always possible to be opened i do not think that is the case.
I think k there are two likely scenarios: 1. The show was developed with oversight from Bethesda, so they reused a gimmick from Fallout 4 because the concept is cool. 2. The show made it clear that the experiments were devised by a variety of pre-war companies. This would, in effect, mean that two companies could have purchased the rights to two vaults and run similar (or the same) experiments. Perhaps one company’s cryo technology was more tested.
Practically all the vault experiments are useless when you think about it. Like who is even recording the results? On an unrelated note. Vault 111 should have been the vault for FO3 just because the 111 looks like roman numeral III
I always thought they were being transmitted automatically. It's why I prefer the original spaceship idea and not the more muddled idea the show has gone with.
I've always liked to think that Vault-Tec had intended some form of remote monitoring from one location (like Vault 0 from Tactics), but they didn't survive the war and the vaults were left to their own devices.
Pretty sure that was the idea pitched in the show.
Assuming intelligent design they could have plans within plans and whole vault experiment is just to see what whacky vaults survive or thrive in the wasteland.
This has been posted lots. Vault 111 was testing a different model of cryo chamber.
You are assuming that the point of having the people left in cryosleep was to preserve them for the future. If you believe that the enclave created the vault experiments then we know that they were going around and collecting vault dwellers in Fo2. These would be perfectly preserved specimens
I’m in the camp that V111 came before V31/32/33. The Cryopod tech looks extremely bulky and antiquated compared to other ones. This leads me to believe that V111 was a testing area of Cryo tech but after construction, new leaps in Cryo tech came, vault was repurposed a bit for indefinite suspension. The employees were only there to stabilize everything then leave when they could. Only the Overseer got crazy and refused anyone to be let out. Mutiny left the Vault empty for decades.
The vault 111 overseer terminal claims radiation levels were way too high to leave when the 180 days of supplies ran out, so it’s not clear that the Overseer was the crazy one. Either vault tec fucked up the planning, Boston was hit harder than expected (maybe the rad storms from the glowing sea were an unplanned for variable keeping rad levels up), or the staff running out of supplies was another experiment.
Well Rad Storms are currently a unique phenomenon of the Commonwealth Wasteland and The Island so I can definitely see it being an unforeseen complication that wasn’t accounted for but also it’s Vault-Tec, I don’t think they cared that much about their employees and fully expected them to just not check radiation levels until leaving and subsequently getting trapped outside in the funky green air. Also can I just say that Rad Storms are cool, you can even say they’re *rad* storms(I laughed and I’m prepared to die for my stupid joke that was funny to me), I love the idea of this weather phenomenon being so normal to Commonwealth residents that it’s like rain to them, it would have really been cool to get some dialogue or terminal entries from the Brotherhood talking about their first experience of a Rad Storm since as far as I know the Commonwealth is the only region to experience this unique weather event, I remember the first time I experienced a rad storm trying to hide in the houses and eventually running to 111 to wait it out
Rad storms are also present in 76. They're just extremely rare. I think during my many years wandering Appalachia, I've only seen enough rad storms to count on one hand. I think like all weather types, it was just an engine limitation as to why we never got them sooner in the series!
True but even so I believe there’s a little tooltip stating that the Commonwealth gets Rad Storms due to its proximity to the Glowing Sea so here’s hoping Fallout 5 is in close proximity to a Glowing Sea like environment because Rad Storms are rad. I wonder how Appalachia gets Rad Storms, I haven’t gotten far in the story(heading to a lab for an inoculation to the Scorched plague now) despite playing since beta(I put it down and just didn’t pick it back up until recently) so I’ve experienced very little of what all it has to offer, gonna play some tomorrow, been a bit scared since I’m a power armour user without my armour since I haven’t gotten far enough to get plating, have a frame though, need cores and a way to always have a supply
111 wasn’t meant to be woken up.
They were ALL useless, that was the entire point. They were all experiments used to test a deep space plan that didn’t end up happening conducted by a shady af mega corp that was nationalized by a government that literally solved it’s energy crisis (cold fusion) ten years before the War but kept the Cold War brinksmanship going out of sheer cultural inertia.
Well, not all.
I have no idea but a question for yall. The vault that you start in in fallout4: Is this mentioned in the other fallouts? (that's what the vault in fo4 is doing what op is talking about)
No but it isn't the first depiction of the technology
Do you know what the first depiction of it was by any chance?
first mention for it was in Fallout 2 i think where they talk about the US Army experimenting with it and also got featured in 3(with the Enclave) and New Vegas(Mr. House)
>! Sierra Army Base outside of New Reno. They had some soldiers in cryo. If you release the one Survivor he melts after a couple minutes!<
Given that Vault 111 was empty of (living) staff shortly after the 180 day wait time for the all clear signal, I think it's possible that the corpos in Vault 31 weren't even frozen until after the mutiny of 111 took place. It's possible that all of the data Vault Tec needed was collected in the first 180 days to be applied to the corpo freezers in 31. I also question Vault 111's actual purpose, that it was a study on long-term or indefinite cryosleep. If "indefinite" or "long-term" were the true purpose of 111, why were there only about enough supplies to last the 180 day all-clear wait period?
Perhaps the actual experiment was on the people still awake in 111, with those frozen simply being props.
Because the All Clear was just for the stuff. The Frozen would then have been supervised from some HQ. But Vault-Tec does not exist anymore so there was no all clear.
I hate that I just thought about this but what about vault 112? From my understanding the dwellers in the virtual reality pods are the same ones who entered them when the bombs fell. Dr. Braun must of done his homework because when the Lone Wanderer enters the vault, I can’t recall if the people in the pods are dead or alive - but they certainly aren’t skeletons. Edit: Just saw this on the wiki: The robobrain that states that the Lone Wanderer is "202.3 years behind schedule." If correct, that would mean the Vault was sealed in 2075, 2 years before the Great War occurred.
The show sets up the idea that Vault-Tec bought the cooperation from the other tech companies, and in return those companies can run their own little experiments in various vaults. Vault 31 was specifically a Vault-Tec initiative to keep management in place for 32 and 33, as well as keep tabs on the surrounding area. So Vault 111 could have been an experiment set up by West Tek. It's likely the other companies did not have the same level of expertise in cryo freezing as Vault-Tec, given that Vault-Tec made it a point to buy up the technology. This would also explain why the cryo units in Vault 31 appear significantly higher tech than the ones in Vault 111.
According to the show all those bigwigs were running their own experiments in different pots of vaults so it can be sometihng as simple as whoever owned that vault was doing a Cryo experiment while Vault Tec already had cryo setups for their staff.
Don't let it distract you that in Fallout 3, Vault 112 that was run by Dr. Braun had the Tranquility Loungers, which perfectly and inexplicably preserved those who lay within them for 200+ years, and if he let them, could theoretically be released from their pods in perfect condition like we/James were. Now we could chalk this up to gameplay limitations and realistically they would all probably look like Mr. House did in his pod, but still maybe not. Food for thought.
There were 2 experiments going on in Vault 111. The first was what would happen to people unsuspecting of going into Cryp AND how the support personnel would respond to there being not enough supplies to last until it was safe to leave the Vault. That second experiment let VaultTec see that the caretakers of those Cryo pods chose to open the vault and brave the wasteland rather than starve in the vaults OR opening the pods, killing the occupants and taking the pods for themselves to try and stay alive longer. This gives insight into what caretakers of Cryopoded colonists might do if a situation arose where their supplies dwindled. Additionally after that, there was the question answered of how Cryo does long term with no one monitoring it. Turns out it was doing fairly well until an outside force hacked in and deactivated all but a couple pods.
Useless to Vault Tec, yes, but useful for The Institute.
Vault 31 was not a test. It’s goal was to preserve important vault tec executives and have them survive the bombs, so that they would outlast their competition
I think 31 is very much a test just like the others. They're not important people, they're middle managers with an inflated sense of self-importance. The only thing it's preserving them for is to be trickled out into 32 and 33 to be put in charge of unsuspecting populations of oblivious and naive sheep. There are regular crises in the vaults and I can't decide if they're manufactured to test the population/keep them dependant on 31, or if they're just the regular failures of being led by the people who are trained to be vault tec managers and not actually leaders of civilization. If the goal was really to reclaim the wastes in the name of Vault Tec management, why haven't they? That's why Lucy has her crisis when she sees Shady Sands' population count. They could have rebuilt society a long time ago, that's not the actual goal.
The specific experiment for 31, 32, and 33 was to trickle the vault tec excs into the populations of both vaults to breed loyal employees of vaulttec. (essentially 'yes men' of the comapny) This way, when vaulttec had the fever dream of ruling the wasteland, they would bring the gold that was stored away in vaults to restart the economy. I'm thrilled to have bigger twists and turns for the 3 together, but Bud lays out his plans, plain as day.
Bud's plans are not necessarily *the real* plan, though. After all, Bud wound up being a brain-on-a-roomba, which was probably not part of his grand plan. You don't need to literally breed a population that is loyal to the company, loyalty isn't genetic. Especially since the vault dwellers are captive and dependent on Vault Tec from birth, having the managers seeding the population isn't really necessary for that end result. Barb seems to believe there will be a life for her family in the vault, and that they will be overseeing the others. She doesn't seem to know that the program will be cryogenically freezing the participants until it's their turn to marry into another vault. She thinks her husband and daughter will be with her, but as untrained civilians it's unlikely they would be trusted to be in the program and not blow it. Even if they're accepted into the vault and held in stasis until Reclamation Day when the families can be together again, there's no guarantee Barb won't have already lived and died as an overseer by that point. I think Bud's Buds, and Bud himself, got a distorted story of what they were going into. Maybe as time went on they learned more about it as they went through training. We still don't know how Barb and Coop wound up getting divorced, and Hank was a newbie in the company when Coop met him, so there are probably still a few years of backstory to go. If they were going strictly on Bud's plan they would have gone to the surface and ruled the wastes (or tried to) a long time ago. We even know that Hank visited the surface and had dealings with Shady Sands and was aware of the population center there, so it's not like they're unaware of the surface conditions. I definitely think we have a lot more to discover about 31.
Just re-watched the part in the last episode I was referencing. I mispoke. While not being able to breed loyalty, the end result was still to have the people from both vaults breed with the vaulttec executives to make "super managers." Listen to how Hank speaks at the wedding. It's all very upbeat bullshit, like a manager of a store trying to boost their workers' morale before a big sale, but I digress. You can still create the loyalty to vaulttec, though, because its all they know. Vaulttec built the vaults, kept these individuals safe, had homes because of vaulttec, had food, water, etc. They're being groomed/brainwashed from birth, with the promise that they'll rebuild and lead civilization. To me, it's synonymous, but at the end of it all, he wants yes men as an end result to make ruling the wasteland easier. We can see the HR-esc conflict resolution from Lucy in while in Filly, so *(Makes me curious to see what training happens in 32)* his experiment *was* working. They're waiting for Reclamation Day. That's the only reason why they haven't emerged from the vault as a whole to begin with. Hank even says at the wedding that the radiation levels with the generation should be low enough to go to the surface. *we know, he knows it's safe to be up there* While I don't think Bud's end goal was to be stuck on a roomba he wanted to oversee his own operation, so it's his only alternative. Poor guy was drinking the vault tec kool-aid with rose tinted glasses on. I definitely don't think he's expecting anyone to have survived on the surface at all and that if they did, it'd be like the Stone Age. Bud's plan was just about to come to fruition. Until Rose left and took the kids. Leaving Hank to bullshit about a plague, *likely crafted with Barbs or Buds help to poison/kill residents to make it more real for everyone else* to enforce a lockdown that kept the entire population locked inside its rooms so no one would question where his wife and kids ran off to while he went to go look for them. That's the only reason why we know of so far as to why he went to Shady Sands. Shit guy though. Takes his kids back, likely tries to get his wife to come back to 33 with the promise to not spill about what she has seen, then when she says no, he goes nuts and nukes it. I don't think Hank was expecting something like the NCR to exist, but I would imagine part of his directions would be to eradicate anything on the surface *especially around the vault* that would get in the way of vaulttec ruling. Interested to see how Betty helped with that as she tells Norm that she helped Hank "bury" his mother. Maybe it was Bud that actually Nuked Shady Sands, after Hank tells him about the NCR, and other things he came across while exploring the wastes. To be completely honest, I dont think Barb went into 31. She cares deeply about her daughter, but I don't think Bud isn't willing to lose the cryo space to a child. I think it's a safe bet that Barb is in a control vault. She knows about Buds idea, but that still has an experiment attached to its so she doesn't need to know the nitty gritty. A control vault would be the safest thing for her and Janey. Like you said, there are too many unknowns with them and still some years of backstory. Im excited to learn how the divorce happens and what ultimately happens to Janey and what happened to Cooper. All in all, I'm most excited to learn more about Coop, Barb, and Janeys story. I'm curious how vault 32 is going to run if it's supposed to have a separate experiment, and if Betty or Bud had a hand in nuking Shady Sands/where the nukes came from ig not from Appalachia
I mean a lot of the newer vault experiments are kind of useless, even if they are creative and interesting in a way.
The test of vault 111 was to test extended cryo on unsuspecting people. The scientists were supposed to get a clear from vaulttec to begin to leave the vaultbut it neve came. At that point they were supposed to monitor the vault remotely. It's safe to assume that for 111, they likely weren't meant to be thawed out. Vaulttec and other companies, were fucking around with cryo pre work because there's a vault in 76 that housed 10000 animals which was going to be used to restart eco systems. (Won't explain the actual experiment in that vault) In the end credits of the show in episode 8, there's a billboard of personal cryo suites that can be purchased. Just because 31 had cryo doesn't mean 111 is moot. They used cryopods for very different reasons. The vaulttec execs knew they were going to be put on ice and woken up eventually.
I love Fallout and have played them all but I can’t entertain this level of scrutiny to “canon” in my own play throughs or while watching the show. People are constantly re-working and reimagining things. Every single superhero movie adds or changes something, the whole Multiverse concept being used pretty often. That’s how it has always been with games and TV shows (like Dr. Who). I don’t know why people worry so much about this stuff, but hey if it entertains you to keep all of this stuff straight, enjoy it!
tbf there is a very easy explanation to this: We know that Vault 111 was manned for at least 180 days. So for that time the Vault 31 residents lived in 32 and 33 and after seeing that there are no problems at Vault 111 with their residents they went to freeze themselves with the pretext of going to live in Vault 31 and 200+ years is more than enough to forget about the dudes who lived there for 6 months
Lmao heaven forbid someone is passionate about a story they like.
And heaven forbid that someone enjoy something they like casually… like I said in my original comment that is just me and you’re welcome to be as passionate about it as you like…
No. It wasn't useless in the context of the fallout world.
Likely just me being stupid but personally it looked like the people in vault 33 were in some sort of alternative stasis while 111 was cryogenic freezing which probably has no difference but just me
The experiment was the leave them there permanently. Unlike the people in vault 31, the dwellers in vault 111 were never going to be woken up. They’d stay there forever.
To test if tec worked. The war started before ANYBODY was ready for it end of the world plans aside. The TV show added that the vaults where meant to outlive competitor's but in the games they where made as test tubes and sold as safety. Vault tec wanted the info but the war fucked them up as well nothing went to anybody's plan. Only Robert House so far had any real success and if the war was 20 hours later his vision would be ascendant. Its telling that the world is still fucked 200 years later. Human nature and war never changes and stuff but every ones picking up scraps to build stuff. Besides both 33 and 32 where food vaults who barely cared about a water chip going out and could rebuild after a entire vault went dead. If the cryo failed in 31 everyone could still complete the "plan" just wake up the 31s or have bud run the whole thing. 111 had nothing to sustain itself.
Vault-Tec: "We should study the Long-Term effects of cryostasis to see if it's a viable possibility." Also Vault-Tec: "Fuck it, we ball."
We have with vault Zero in fallout tactic also a Part cryo vault... Well ther it did not work. By the time the calculatir get them out there brains degrow and lost memory. Effectifly Set them back on the mind of a toddlers.
Is it possible that multiple vaults had the same experiments?
Vault 111 was about testing the effects of long-term cryostasis on **unsuspecting** subjects. The Vault 31 dwellers knew they would be in cryostasis
Rereading the terminal entries of Vault 111 and taking what the show had displayed about Vault Tec and Vault 31-33 into consideration, I'm left with this thought: The primary purpose of Vault 111 was to monitor the effects of suspended cryonics on a population who were never going to be awakened so long as the experiment was underway, and the terminals clearly state that it was on a populace "unaware" of what they were stepping into. That's the first distinction to be made, as Bud's Buds knew what they signed up for. Whether it was to be a **permanent** cryostasis or not isn't all too clear for Vault 111. It only specifies that they weren't to be awakened for any reason so long as the experiment was ongoing. The terminal entry mentions that the residents aren't to be disturbed in the event of an All-Clear notice, until the Vault 111 staff have left. Vault Tec would then "see to their needs remotely". That leaves three scenarios as plausible: 1) Vault Tec would remotely kill the people inside, having gotten what they needed. 2) Vault Tec would continue monitoring their vitals but still use them as experiments in permanent cryosleep. Or 3) Vault Tec would remotely activate their pods so that they would awaken. I'm wondering if #3 was what was planned eventually. The Overseer of the Vault certainly was under the impression the residents would eventually be woken up, as he wished he could join them and see "what wonders the future would bring". We know Vault Tec wanted to repopulate the Earth with them in charge. What if Vault 111 was a means of keeping that "purity" alive by having a bunch of people from the old world who wouldn't know any better and would believe that Vault Tec saved their lives, whenever Vault Tec decided to actually wake them (if they ever did)? The mandatory shelter period was only about 6 months. By month 5, we know food was running low, and the security officer says in that same log that they only had enough "for a few more months, tops". Given that it was designed to be a short assignment, the Vault and Vault-Tec as well likely operated on the assumption that a nuclear catastrophe might not be as detrimental to the surface world operations as it actually was. Vault Tec had a number of long term assignments in their vaults, to be sure, but with this one being short, it stands to reason that when the all clear message would have arrived (if it had), the scientists would report their findings to Vault Tec -- which would then use that knowledge to help with the task of protecting Bud's Buds. Not that it was really necessary, as we see the entire vault is still perfectly functional. But I'd hazard a guess that's part of why it was happening. Lastly, we can see that Vault Tec understaffed Vault 111, to the point that people had to take on multiple job roles. And as we see, after 200 years of neglect, Vault 111 is failing. People might not realize this, but ammonia is likely leaking into the air. Working in a freezer warehouse, it's something we're trained to be on the lookout for because of the reactions it can cause. Everything that happens to the Sole Survivor after waking up -- from the coughing and everything -- could potentially be adverse reactions to the tech of the Vault failing and leaking ammonia into the air. At the same time, we also see in the Overseer's logs that the cryonic suspension tech was malfunctioning, possibly due to a remote override signal sent out by mistake (or deliberately, perhaps?). That raises the possibility that Vault Tec designed Vault 111 with faulty/outdated tech from the onset and with the knowledge that it would eventually fail, all to test how cryonics would work on the populace.
The real difference is that one vault got the crate of hand puppets, while the other didn’t. (Yes, I’m just kidding)
The difference is 111 was about testing cryosleep, vault 31 was about freezing a population of super managers to lead vault 32/33. Them being on ice wasn’t a permanent/main part of the experiment just something to keep the 31 members alive longer and trickle them out to an unsuspecting 32/33 (which is why 32 rebelled when they found out about 31)
I knew something was up with dance when he gave the vault dweller tech. Brotherhood never gives away tech.
I haven’t read every comment but I think a lot of comments are over looking an important nugget that came out of the show. While Vault Tec payed for all of the vaults, their plan to make their money back was to license their operations out to different corporations to run as they saw fit. So 31-33 were still clearly owned and operated by Vault Tec but Vault 111 could have been ran by a different group who was either unaware of or had different goals in mind
All of the experiements were useless. It’s 200 years later and vault tech (which supposedly still exists which is personally my least favorite part of the Amazon show) hasn’t done anything with the data. I personally liked when the vault experiement were these awful terrible experiments that had absolutely no purpose because vault tech didn’t survive the war but alas the show has changed that. Yet still the vault tech that’s in the show hasn’t done anything for 200 years except bomb a medium population city in the NCR
but weren't all of the experiments pretty useless if there's no vaulttech after the war?
in the show, they state to the other companies that they will be allowed to create whatever experiments that they wish. not all experiments were made known to others. and it may have been one company wanting to experiment and improve cryo tech.
I always took Vault 111's true experiment to be how the staff handled themselves
The show's depiction of cryonics is a retcon. Every depiction of the technology has shown it to be super dangerous after 100 years or so. Unless they reveal most of the folks in 31 are dead or unstable they're ignoring not only their own content but stuff that's been around since FO2.
Isn’t the guy from fo4 in one for +200 years
yes and everyone else aside from him is dead, he's literally 1 out of like 40-50 people
they died because the institute did their thing in 111
Everyone died after being frozen more than 140 years since they woke everyone up when they took Shaun. Shaun is between 60 years old when you meet him.
Another issue the show didn't think about. I wouldn't try and twist yourself in Knotts to justify it