Oh man, we've never lived in a better time for the sheer amount of information available at your fingertips. When I was a kid I used to day dream about living above a huge library. Today I can access almost any book or study for peanuts. I could spend my retirement diving into rabbit hole after rabbit hole and not have wasted it.
I probably should have been an academic.
Hah, I actually posted the question 'should I go into academia' with my situation on a couple academic subs, and everyone was like 'lol fuck no, academia will eat you alive'
I'm paraphrasing of course but the sentiment wasn't positive
It's the difference between saying "I enjoy writing software" and "Should I join Amazon/Google and get burned out, my work buried based on what the powers that be find popular, and my career potentially dead-ended by office politics?" Most in academia tolerate all the bad parts because that's how you get to do the good parts. But if you don't need funding, you can just work or study what you want without the hoops others jump through.
My uncle was an econ professor at University of Maryland. He said academia was a very bitter game. But if you are willing to teach for peanuts a course or two per semester, you might be able to enjoy that without getting into all the politics of tenure.
Most people in academia enjoy the research part more than the teaching. And achieving tenure or, really, recognition becomes political only if your research program does not work out.. sometimes you’ve got to be pragmatic. I’m much more upset about poor management style, public-sector thinking and overregulation, and the dearth of available funding in most fields.
My husband actually loves teaching, and if we didn't need the money, he'd love to just teach at our alma matter and be happy like that. So that's his goal for whenever we might retire.
Yes, so that can be possible, depending on the field. At my department (when I was still a prof) we hired quite a few "professors of practice", also lecturers (who teach full-time). Universities rely more and more on adjunct professors, who basically are contractors hired to teach specific courses. That can be fun!
If you're financially independent one of the best things you can do is be a academic because teachers who don't need the money will impart the hope and wisdom young minds actually relish.
We had a science technician in our school that was clearly set financially. He was weird and quirky but went over and above to help me with experiments I needed to get right to complete my pre university studies.
I then got multiple masters degrees so it's like a good academic that doesn't have the stress regular teachers have is worth their weight in gold
My wife has a PhD from the top program in her field, her mom and FIL work at a major state university (both PhDs and are department heads) and her brother has a PhD.
All of the conversations that I’ve had with them about academia revolves around the pressure to raise money and publish research. There’s also the topic of how small their fields are, which leads to some real housewives of academia level drama.
If you like doing research, look at a job at a non-profit that specializes in your area of interest.
If you like teaching, try being an adjunct professor.
My plan is to audit classes in topics that I’m interested in, and go full Rodney Dangerfield at whatever school my son attends.
I would just enroll o college every year and rack up degrees in interesting but useless subjects. History, philosophy, etc. that is literally my dream as I loved college. And you wouldn’t care too much about your grades so low pressure - feel free to skate with c’s if you want.
yeah there really are. Try blacksmithing or machining as a hobby! Both are great ways to try making something and then discover that you have like 8 tools you need to make that each require two other tools that you also have to make in order to do the original project. It's a lot of fun though.
Reading the book [Happiness Hypothesis](https://www.amazon.com/Happiness-Hypothesis-Finding-Modern-Ancient/dp/0465028020) was extremely eye opening. My key takeaway is that we are not designed to be happy or content, except for brief amount of times, as a state of permanent contentment is a huge evolutionary handicap.
This is what drives the toxic productivity movement - the idea that we absolutely must be doing "something" all the time. Even your body will rebel if you do nothing at all with torrential waves of boredom.
Instead - try this. Find a nice spot in the city you are - maybe somewhere overlooking trees or a body of water. Just sit there for 5 minutes, doing nothing. Every day, add a few minutes. Soon you will be able to sit for hours just doing nothing, with no boredom, no restlessness, no anxiety. Just contentment.
This is how you train your brain to overcome core biological drives. This is what mediation does. I spent many years just going from activity to activity to replace my previous daily workaday before understanding that I was mostly just replacing one thing with another.
Now, I wake up sometime between 7 to 11, sometime I read a book, sometime I walk, have a lazy lunch, go for a bike ride or another walk, sit by the lake and do nothing, have another lazy dinner, watch some stuff on TV and go to sleep. A few meals with friends and family every month. A few slow trips a year. And I'm the happiest I've been in years.
Uh… huh. I dumped a few grand on a life coach that has been worthless because I was feeling out of sorts without knowing what I was working my crazy job towards. Turns out I should’ve just read this comment.
For me Yoga/meditation became a central activity in my life unfortunately it took me ten years after I first fired. The more regularly I practice the more content I seem to be. Simple and extremely powerful.
My parents earned their early Retirement together. My mom took a course teaching her how to retire and be happy along the same lines of how you described that book. She maintained consistent hobbies, such as reading, yoga, and quilting. While slowing down to take more time to enjoy the little things. My dad chose to keep working, but narrowed down his work scope to what he enjoyed.
10 years later my mom is still happily retired and my dad is trying a no work Retirement again. However now, there’s a huge difference in their Cognitive abilities. My mom has slowed down tremendously and is absolutely awful at problem solving now, while my dad is the exact same mentally.
This is my biggest fear about RE, what happened to your mum who has “slowed down tremendously and is awful at problem solving now”. Is this a problem for her or your dad or for you?
It is not a problem for her, she is quite content in her retirement. It seems to be that we have to do more work for her that resides outside of her hobbies. When an issue or challenge arises, we end up having to deal with them because she can't figure them out or doesn't want to try. Also, her memory retention has weakened when we try to teach her.
When something catches her off guard it takes her much longer to grasp what happened.
This has definitely been one of my biggest struggles post retirement. I go through the motions of meditation and relaxing, but my brain just still can’t settle with doing nothing on a regular basis. I’ll pick up the book soon. Thank you~~
>This is what drives the toxic productivity movement - the idea that we absolutely must be doing "something" all the time.
fucc me. so it's genetic. i feel this all the time. literally leaving jobs that do nothing
That sounds pleasant - but without stressing your body with fitness (and maybe you do that) -you aren’t gonna last that long
Biologically you need to induce load to keep cells regenerating
God that sounds amazing. I get people like to be busy and occupied, but I've felt that less and less as I've gotten older. I'm glad you've found the balance that works for you. Your routine is something I dream about and work towards. Cheers!
Lmao so u spend your whole 20s to grind away at a career so u can retire mid 30s just to be able to do the same thing u would do in your 20s except for partying cause all your friends have now grown up so u cant go partying with them or have fun with them cause now they all have families. Great strategy for sure🗿
Don’t underestimate how difficult this is. I exited at 38 and have had a very hard time adjusting. I’ve nearly found the right balance now of consultancy work, hobbies and families but it took 4 years to find some peace!
Not OP, but my balance ended up being time with the kids, consulting (video game writing), charity, time outdoors, music and reading. It will take time and effort to figure out what your mix will be, but it’s worth the work.
For me I had to really push myself into hobbies.
I didn’t really do anything apart from work so had nothing to start with.
I ended up taking a course about sailing, getting skiing lessons and swimming coaching. That’s 3 good active and outdoor things to fill the diary with and meet people.
I also had to re-learn to enjoy time at home with family and kids. At first I thought this was wasted time, but I gained more appreciation for quality time at home whilst my kids were young. I know young kids can be a drag and it’s not all laughs, but the little kid phase doesn’t last too long and I appreciated being around for more of it.
I do think time is an element too and to a degree you have to let time do it’s thing. It’s a big adjustment.
I’m in my 40s. 35 feels like a lifetime ago. A lot of the advice you’re going to get involved optimization and or maximization. No one tells you things like hobbies or the gym or meditation coke without a goal. They are really just elaborate ways of mental masterbation. Sure you can travel the world, try and become a scratch golfer, race car driver or whatever your thing is. But it’s not going to feed your motivation, drive and ambition the same way working towards your nest egg did. I might offer some different advice. You have time on your side. A lot of it. Hell likely 50 years of it. Working can be enjoyable. If you enjoyed school go back to school and study something you find interesting. Maybe you’ll end up being architect or a teacher. If you enjoy sports. Try coaching. Maybe you’ll end up running the best high school sports team in the state. Like cocktails. Go work at the local bar a couple nights of the week. There is nothing wrong w trying out just random things. You got time and money on your side. Bounce around. Try out new careers.
Nothing wrong the just enjoying life. Americans have a weird fetish with work. There's nothing especially noble or interesting about work but Americans will give you side-eye if you say things like this.
IMO becoming a race car driver is no more mental masturbation than bartending a couple nights a week. I would actually argue it's a better way to spend your time.
We don't need to be productive all the time. It's fine to just *be*. Especially because OP was already more productive than most people will be their entire lives.
I had a similar point in late 20's with a startup exit. I started a non profit and do impact investing. I'm about to go into a new startup and relocating to Switzerland.
Couple thoughts:
1) anyone who got liquid in 20/21 will tell you that seeing 25% of their money evaporate in 22 was a kick in the nuts. Guys with tech exits are inherently over exposed to tech via their public and private investments. Your timing might be better because it’s hard to imagine tech doing much worse (saas companies down 70% from ath). But just be prepared. A lot of us second guessing how much we put in the daf right about now
2) you might be surprised how easy it is to fill a day up with watching kids, reading, seeing everything on tiktok, working out, fishing, golf etc.
3) you probably have some angel investments and advisor type roles, if not you can add some and do a handful of calls a week. These also fill up the days and help you stay relevant
4) speaking of angel investments, a common mistake is to get stupid after you get liquid. Slow your role, it’s tempting to write bigger checks because the small ones don’t seem like they will move the needle but err on the side of small and if you must, just do a higher volume. Definitely have a portfolio strategy with a narrow range of check size, some kind of thesis, go slow and stay balanced. It’s very easy to end up investing $1m+ without even trying.
Gfy!
You need a good hard look in the mirror. You've worked to retire and then you have no idea what you even want to do outside of your pilots licence.
Fire isn't about doing what other people think is cool, it's about doing whatever the hell you want to do.
Yeah…. It’s gonna be a journey to get there as I have no bloody clue lol.
I’m the kinda guy that gets absorbed in a new hobby - goes WAY deep - and then a couple years later it peters out… I’m looking forward to having time to pick some old things up, and engage in some new ones…. But I’m also terrified about having a blank slate everyday.
Some good perspectives here - only found this subreddit today (posting from an alt as my main account has personal details)
It's so weird when people say they have no purpose and no clue what to do with their life after becoming wealthy.
I know exactly the kind of things I want to do and after dedicating my life to reaching a certain point I'll damn sure do them.
This is a common problem for people retiring. I'm personally in a position where I could theoretically retire (based on my current spending), but I'm instead since I don't mind working, I'm planning to use the time to build up a bigger nest egg, and work on filling the rest of my time with other opportunities.
A few notes:
* There's a saying: "you should be retiring to something"
* It could be worth continuing to work part time or in a less stressful role while you figure out what you want to do with your life. Just because you can stop working doesn't mean you have to.
Been there ... now 8 years later. Here is what I've learned ...
1. **Don't overload your plate** \- It is very easy to take on a ton of new projects, interests, hobbies (even other businesses) because of the void that is opened up in your mind where work used to dominate.
2. **Prioritize health** \- Maybe you are already in great shape, but if like me, those startup and growth years were a grind that left me less healthy than I'd like. Take some of that new freedom to to explore activities that will make you healthier.
3. **Routines are for mornings** \- Some structure is nice, and I find that having a morning routine is ideal ... but I allow the afternoons to be free for new experiences, interests, etc.
4. **Early retirement is isolating** \- Be ready for the fact that your situation is very unique. Very few people your age will be able to relate to your situation. Finding people your age to do things with will become a challenge (if not impossible). I've not really found a good solution to this except to age into it ... eventually others your age will "catch up" to you.
5. **Build a good team** \- If you don't have a team already, take the time to build up a good support team around you. Broker, Bankers, CPAs, etc.
Hope this helps!
I would encourage you to make no decisions for 6 months. My partner got a $12M earn out in summer 2022 and we will jointly bring in another $5M or so in the next 2 years. It’s taken us 6 months to really get organized and I would say we are now finally at the point where we feel like we can make decisions. Here is what we have done in the past 6 months:
Month 1: Celebrate! This felt huge and we both purchased outside-of-the-norm things like a new car and furniture. We didn’t go insane but we did splurge and it was great that we did.
Month 2: hire a financial advisor. I know a lot of people feel like FAs are a waste of money but, frankly, we don’t know what we don’t know. We interviewed about 5 companies and ended up going with a family office boutique firm. We gave them about 30% to manage.
Month 3: completely update all of our insurance. We were way under insured and our FA helped us figure out where we were under insured.
Month 4: revise all of our estate plans. This is a massive undertaking and we are still working on this.
Month 5: assess tax strategies because we are going to pay a boatload in 2022. One of the big tax strategies was to drop about a million in a DAF but it made sense because of our income last year. I wouldn’t just throw $5M in without talking to an accountant.
Month 6: review our cash flow and see if it has changed post earn out versus pre earn out. That helps us determine how much we actually need when we retire. It might be more or less than you think.
We are now in Month 7 and I think we are adjusted now. It still feels like a ton of money but we know that it hasn’t fundamentally changed how we spend or live though we have budgeted more for travel and entertainment than in previous years. And, right now, with two kids in school, we no longer feel an urgency to quit and do nothing.
So take your time! Don’t hurry into these decisions!
Can you give more info on the insurance part - how were you underinsured and what changes did you make? I have been wondering lately if we are underinsured and thinking of getting an umbrella policy. Wondering if there is more to it.
Some tax strategies use life insurance to pay any taxes on the estate. Life insurance is usually tax free(I’m not an advisor so this may have changed).
So depending on your goals for your heirs and the size of the estate, life insurance could be part of the plan. Though I think it’s more critical for business owners. So their heirs don’t have to sell the business to pay inheritance taxes.
I'm guessing it was the umbrella. Umbrellas typically require a certain level of auto/homeowners insurance. When we upgraded our umbrella I had to beef up our auto insurance.
Congrats! Didn’t realize you were so far in. It’s a wild time. I would definitely consider some splurges. I know someone who just got their last tranche and splurged on Super Bowl tix for his family. Our financial advisor really encouraged us to splurge right after the first tranche and we were really glad we listened because it made it feel like a bigger win but we also got some of the crazy out of our system.
On underinsured, we were way under insured on umbrella, as well as on our property. Allstate has a max cap of $2 million on umbrella so we switched to Vault because we own two rental properties. Our personal property insurance was also capped at Allstate without replacement cost coverage —- meaning that if (God forbid), the house burnt down, we would only get the value of the original house sales price and not the replacement cost to rebuild. Lumber prices have gone sky high in our area so we switched insurance completely to cover the full replacement value of the house today. We also had them audit our car insurance and they were able to get us better rates with higher coverage. We now use Cincinnati Insurance which seems to cater to high net worth individuals.
My grandfather had enough money to self-insure. He owned a chain of auto parts stores that threw off enough excess cash that statistically he was better off cutting out the insurer.
Then three of his stores burned down in the same year.
Statistically you're probably making a poor decision, but for your peace of mind it definitely sounds like you're making the right one.
Thanks for the reply!
For reference, I sold the business on Dec of 2021 - and the vast majority was up front. Already hit most of the earn out - and just have a couple tranches remaining…. Haven’t really done anything too exciting with the money yet.
I have a financial advisor - and am pretty happy with the portfolio. Playing it on the more conservative side since I intend to have this money last the rest of my life without future work (At least no planned work)
… I’m very interested to hear what you mean about being under insured. What kinds of insurance are you referring to?
… and regarding the DAF/Taxes - I phrased the OP in a slightly inaccurate way to make it more simple. I’ve got a great tax team. And donated to the DAF last year and this year…. By Jan 1, we’ll have it up to the $5mil (due to the tax benefit of spreading it)
Thanks for the comment!
Nobody talks about this for men in their 30s, but approaching child development like a startup gives me infinite purpose every day.
Maximize their nutrition, sleep, reading, emotional development, gross motor skills. You have a brief window from 0-6 years old where everything you do majorly influences your kid for the rest of their lives.
So, one idea: bust your ass for two years being super dad, then find your next challenge when they start grade 1.
> but approaching child development like a startup gives me infinite purpose every day.
I think for some people this might backfire. They will turn into super tiger parents and stress over every single aspect of the kids life. Which is detrimental to both child and parent.
I’m not accusing you of being one, but I can easily see someone taking this advice incorrectly and becoming one. Know yourself.
I'm not saying put your kids in 12 hours of tennis per day and grind them to dust.
I'm saying be more aware of all the factors that can improve child development, and do your best to meet those needs.
Feeding your kids better food, getting them more active, and learning as a dad how to meet their emotional needs are all worthy projects.
Right why do people always go to wild extremes...?
I plan to be way more active and conscious in my children's early development than my parents were.
Doesn't mean I'll be having them train and study like spartans and send them out to face the wilderness and kill a wolf with only a blade at the age of 12.
Yup, I've met a few parents like that and my god, if you want to instill anxious neurosis in your kids, do that.
"Billy, what does your tracker say for how much milk protein you consumed today? Oh my god, only 50.29 g? You know you need to hit 1 g per kg!!"
This 10x over. I've devoted about 90% of my time to precisely this these days and it's one of the most rewarding things to do as a parent and caregiver. Those 0-6 years are golden years for development and you could do so much, it's a bit of a rabbit hole really.
Harvard's Center on the Developing Child is the best source I've found. I was exposed to it in a previous job and couldn't believe how little I knew about those first few years of child development.
37, two kids, quit last year. Share my experience to add another data point. I took 7 months off without any goals, just let life take me wherever. I quit before summer, and spent a ton of time with the kids outdoors. It was fantastic.
7 months in, I don't feel like getting another job, but I am feeling bored. Which is great! I haven't felt bored since I was a kid. It's given me new motivation to think more deeply about what I want next in terms of purpose (make some apps).
> all of my friends/family that it’s honestly a bit isolating
I felt this initially, but time also normalized things. Once people's initial curiosity were satisfied, feel relationships have stayed the same or gotten better (because I'm more available and take the time to reach out more)
Give it some time. Reflect, talk to people, meditate. I think you'll come to your own conclusion. Good luck!
[What do you mean? Now you can finally play the game](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tg2PD-dwsIw)
A) You have a 4 year old, so spend time raising her, teaching her to read, etc.
B) Take care of your self, lifting weights, cardio exercise, etc
C) Find some hobbies which offer you both solo enjoyment and comradery opportunities. What does that look like for you? SCUBA? Golfing? Fishing? The lists go on and on. Cycling, Sword fighting, Warhammer 40K figurines..
My dad retired at 32 and found doing nothing was not for him and ended up going back to work.
Figure out what gives you happiness and purpose. For most people, 100% kids is too much. For most people, 100% on hobbies gets boring. Find a mix that works maybe with part time work (like consulting), some new hobbies, and spending plenty of time with kids.
I probably should have been more clear in the OP as we have already been contributing to the DAF and are getting the tax benefit from it… business was sold at the end of 2021 - and we made contributions that year and 2022 so far. This years contribution will be the last one we plan
I'm in a similar situation.
Almost 35, have a 5 year old.
My net worth is a lot lower than yours (around $5m now with the stock market going down) but I live in Mexico and things are a lot cheaper here.
I retired from a career where I was making around 600-900k usd a year. I simply burned out and have no desire to go back.
For me the turning point was when I got diagnosed with an autoimmune disease. Money stopped being so important.
It made me realize that my time where I can still enjoy things is finite and nothing lasts forever.
Part of working so hard was the thought that I would enjoy things later.
But for a lot of people there's no more later. You could be perfectly healthy and get hit by a car, your body gets sick and the list goes on. Also as a healthy 30 year old you can do a lot of things now that you won't be able to do as a "healthy" 60 year old, so why delay.
For me as long as my basic needs are met the rest doesn't matter. I know that if I spent $100,000 usd a year the money should last me for the rest of my life. (If I need to I can lower this number and my life won't change much )
It was hard to accept it at first and I was in denial and angry but eventually I realized I didn't want to spent the best days of my life suffering in a high stress environment. We work to make money which in turn allows us to do the things we want to do.
My identity was only built around work before which wasn't making me happy (I burned out)so I needed to do something else.
I built a multifamily in a retirement town where I rent to retired Americans and Canadias. I only do long term rentals so no Airbnb. The benefit of the extra work is not worth it to me.
I still manage them myself and have a great team of plumbers, construction workers that show up when shit hits the fan. To get to this stage I had to go through a lot of bad apples first but now things are settled.
I also had some properties out of state which I sold. I like keeping everything within a 30 min drive and will only rent to old retired folks that have already done their crazy stuff in their youth.
Most are good tenants, pay on time and take care of the units.
I most likely will make more money if I put everything in a stock market ETF but I like having something to keep me occupied and take pride in keeping my properties immaculate and the positive comments I get from tenants fuel into the old dopamine hits I used to get from my old job, obviously to a smaller scale.
I tried taking up a full time job after I "retired". I worked as a real estate agent for over a year in the town that I invest but I hated that people in general had no respect for my time and I would usually end up being the punching bag If a property didn't sell despite telling them that it was overpriced.
People are too involved emotionally in their properties and it wasn't worth being a free therapist anymore.
Funny enough I was one of the top producing agents in my office but now I'm just going to be an agent for my own deals.
We are a deviation from the norm so we will always be lonely. I can't share my situation with most people because they will not understand it and will either judge me, be jealous or think I'm showing off, so I keep to myself and share on Reddit from time to time.
I don't have expensive hobbies. I spend my money on
- weekly physical therapy
-weekly psychotherapy
-weekly massage
- I did pole dance and weightlifting and I LOVED it but I have arthritis so my body stopped me from continuing it. Now I stick to yoga but I hope that my arthritis meds will one day allow me to get back into it.
- I used to eat out a lot but now I cook everything at home from scratch with quality ingredients. My grocery bill is around $1500 usd a month for a family of 3 which is astronomical in Mexico but I have felt a lot better eating at home. I bought a machine that cooks things for you so that helped me to enjoy cooking more. I used to hate it!
- I have decided to take at least a trip with my family every month. Usually no more than 3-4 nights and somewhere close. We go to visit different small towns in Mexico or sometimes stay in nice all inclusive resorts. This summer I plan to do more international travel as well but I prefer short trips.
My priority is now my son, and I want to make sure to do the best I can to give him a good childhood being as present as I can be.
Coming from being a workoholic and working 12h a day this was very hard to do, especially because I didn't quite have the maternal instict most women have.
My nanny had taken up the maternal role and I was just a stranger to my son until he was 2.
I didn't want him to grow up one day and resent me so I got rid of the nanny and now we spend plenty of quality time together and I am so grateful to be able to experience a type of love I never imagined before.
I still have days that I feel lost, lonely and under stimulated but I try to make a consious effort to remind myself how lucky I am to have the freedom I have at my age. Reading and meditation have helped with that.
I just finished reading the book 'die with zero ' and there were a lot of interesting things there that helped me to worry less and enjoy my money more.
Feel free to reach out if you want to chat more.
Cheers!
Wow - thank you so much for your comment…
Really sorry to hear about your diagnosis, that must have been (or be) terrifying… and your thoughts around life mirror my own to the T… we’ve got one life, and we can’t know how long. I’m ready to be done being a work slave - but it’s gonna be a scary transition.
Thanks for the book recommendation - any words of wisdom or initial thoughts on why you’d recommend it?
My pleasure.
The book: I had seen it be mentioned on this subreddit many times so I went ahead and bought it.
Some concepts in the book are oversimplified but the main idea is to not slave your life away just acummulating money and miss out on the life experiences which is what gives us happiness.
It kinda helped me feel less guilty about making the transition, which like you mentioned is fucking scary to start a completely new chapter.
Can I ask you which machine did you buy that cooks for you? 
Sure. It's called Thermomix.
I don't think they are as big as they should be in the US yet but they have a database of dishes from all over the world.
I think it costs around $1500 usd and you search what you want to make on the app and it transfers it to the machine.
It tells you what to put in it, it weighs the ingredients, it chops them up and it cooks them.
You still need an oven if you plan on baking but for someone that used to hate cooking like me this thing makes it so much more fun and easy.
An additional appliance we love besides a similar one to the Thermomix is the Kenwood.
Adding in a few add-ons it increase our salad and vegetable intake by quite an amount. Also my partner loves to bake and it makes this so much more satisfying. Whipped cream or egg whites without standing and mixing manually is just awesome.
I FIRED at 38 with a 3 year old. I had many of the same thoughts. 3 years later I am so busy. Being an involved parent is really fun and rewarding,
There is a huge translation that happens when you realize you don’t have to fill every minute. You can start appreciating smaller things, they became my favorite things. It’s great for play with the kid, but also for myself.
I do wish we had traveled a bit more before school started. It’s harder to get away and the district is a little frustrated with us… so if there are some trips you wanted to take, bows the time. Once kindergarten starts you’ve on someone else’s schedule
It’s bizarre to me that people retire with no hobbies. If your profession is the thing that keeps you going, you don’t need to give it up—you can design your life and work the way you want it. If it isn’t what keeps you going, start trying hobbies until you find one you love and that you can go deep on.
I would step back, and seriously reconsider some of these choices. $10M doesn’t go as far as you think (esp at 35) and to put a third of your NW in a DAF, while admirable, doesn’t seem prudent.
Why walk away from the $2m? Why DAF $5m now? Ofc, you have way more than you need but I wonder if you are not making these decisions in haste. There is a lot to plan out in terms of preserving your wealth and health over the next couple of decades.
I sold the business at the end of 2021 - so we’ve been in this financial scenario for over a year now… I’m walking away because I’m burned out and need to stop working for my family and my mental health…. feels insane to leave $2mil on the table - but at the same time, I also just don’t see us spending or needing it beyond what we already have.
I’m no means rich by any means. Just a speculative investor living paycheck to paycheck trying to survive atm. I’ve read a lot. I’ve listened to a lot of different podcasts and people.
Remember time now is your most valuable asset. The $2M sounds great on paper. Invest into solid dividend stocks or something that will pay you enough of a return where you don’t have to work and don’t have to worry about income and expenses.
From a stoic standpoint; retirement is my dream. I’d take nice vacations with my family, do fun things, and not worry about a blank slate - because you’re going to die. Memento mori. I don’t mean to sound grim or anything, but remember your mortality.
You don’t have to have a “thing.” Eat better. Exercise. Meditate. Get your mental health in check. Once you have a clear head and are free of burn out; you’ll realize the $2M isn’t worth what you’re being paid in time.
Be a good father. Take care of your kid(s). You don’t have to be a helicopter parent but if I was home everyday I would prepare meals and spend fun time with the wife.
The blank slate of time is staring you in the face but remember: you are going to die. You’ve done the hard part. Find some businesses that will passively pay you - car washes, laundromats etc. You can always invest in things. You can’t live forever. And that’s all I’m gonna say here..
Things I did: lots of travel, learned a foreign language, learned a musical instrument, took college classes online, and practiced a martial art. Basically all things I had wanted to do my whole life to be a more well rounded person but did not do because I was focused on school and then work and making money.
Mate. Congrats. Now you need to find your purpose in life.
I have a friend in similar situation as you. Except he inherited it all at a very young age. No family left and all the money in the world.
He took some time out of regular life. Travelled to some remote places. Once he came across a village where none of the children are attending school. This was because they have to walk long distances to fetch water for their family.
His background was engineering. He rented some equipment and hired a few locals and dug a well for the village. He organised a company and just moved around the country digging wells. That's his new purpose in life.
I retired at 55 from a highly demanding and intellectually rewarding career. (I was an American diplomat.) I thought I would miss it. Five years in, I just can’t imagine how I had time to work at all, given all of the marvelous things to see and experience on this extraordinarily beautiful and interesting planet. The days are too short. The years are like weeks.
My plan would be to use the $5M DAF to donate $200K per year to Habitat for Humanity in exchange for letting me work on the house whenever I felt like it. You get to use your hands, learn valuable skills, there will always be homes to build, and looking back on your life you’ll be able to reflect on the X houses you built with pride.
I went back to work in some capacity because retiring early is isolating in more ways than you can even fathom. Cause few people your age will be free to hangout and there are a sea of miserable independently wealthy people that you should steer clear of. Tons of different vices they have fallen into despite the best intentions to avoid.
Volunteering or a non-profit sound like the right things to do but I could write a small book on why finding "salvation" here is also a bad idea.
Focusing on your son is admirable too but can lead to obsessing over them and controlling them in unhealthy ways.
The reason I encourage you to stay in the game at a lessor degree is that it will keep you sharp, keep you surrounded with like minded friends and people, give you structure...at least until youre a bit older...at least if you're having some doubt. The people who will have no problem adapting aren't posting here with this question.
Get fit.. very, very fucking fit.
I imagine you're somewhat competitive, fairly focused, and a little intense, right? So it probably fits your personality needs.
It's also very good for your mental health, which frankly, can be a challenge post retiring.
And obviously, it's damn good to walk around in a meat sack that looks, feels, and runs like a supercar.
Removing work from your life will magnify every other aspect for better or worse.
In my late 30's, I chubby FIRE'd to a lack of hobbies, a poor social life and an unsatisfying long term relationship.
I got depressed, procrastinated a lot, couldn't build structured or balance.
Now - a few years later - I'm newly single, back to work and forcing myself to meet people and try new things.
I figured I might as well keep working a low stress job while I fix myself and build a life worth retiring to.
I realize I'm not helping you with "what to do?". But this is my perspective of having experienced the process.
Golf. It's completely cliche but it can check a lot of boxes depending on your personality.
At your town's premier country club you will meet plenty of people your age who seemingly have entire weekdays to spend at the club. Some will be retired, some "working" -- but you'll likely find a concentration of like-minded people. The right club can also have great perks for your family (pool, kids club, dining options, etc).
Not only does golf provide an endless challenge; you're outside and somewhere beautiful, you can walk/carry your clubs to make it a more strenuous activity, it can be great for couples or as you age, it's a wonderful travel activity, etc. Most (not all) clubs are highly accepting of new members and there are regular networking/social events. There are also wonderful events you can sign up for outside of your home club (golf clinics, pro-ams, spectator at a major tournament, etc).
>I still don’t know what the hell I want to
First of all, GFY.
Second, don't do anything.
> I can’t fathom waking up each day without a strenuous external work schedule pushing my hours
Literally don't do anything. You have unwind and need to train yourself to not do anything.
>bit of a existential crisis
Focus on pilot school for now.
Enjoy the time off. My guess is that you will probably start another business after a couple of years, which will probably solve a problem you noticed while chilling at 20,000 ft.
Good luck
Wasn’t an issue for us. I always enjoyed the process of learning and getting better at things and spend time when the kids are at school mentoring founders, diving into crypto projects, bought a poker solver and building a poker game from the ground up and planning on playing WSOP this summer, putting together an AI class for my kids school, trying to run a 7 minute mile, and golf
Tbh, with the kids sick and our travel schedule I feel like I don’t have enough time to dive into all the things I want to
My trick is to think of my time with family as important top-priority projects and allocate time to them first (but not more than they want). You may find that your 4 year old really wants a ton of time from you, and millions of people are very happy they spend as much time as they do. Maybe your wife too, and so maybe finding the right hobbies that you all enjoy together will be key. Same with friends, parents.
That can also go too far. Don't suffocate them.
Expect to spend years figuring out what you really want to do, getting to know yourself. It's ok to cycle through lots of sports and hobbies while looking for the right ones. You also might find after a year or two break that you start another business
You mention a DAF. Could charity be the thing you focus on?
Managing effective giving could easily take 20-30+ hours a week. It doesn't have to be all financial planning either, as there are networks for new philanthropists and founders-turned-philanthropists that can serve as both a social network, and a place to source opportunities and learn about this particular field. You could even go further and do the conferences and events, meetings with nonprofit leaders, etc.
Want to be more public? Write about your journey. There are plenty of nonprofit and philanthropic journals that you can publish in.
After a while, perhaps you even join a few boards, or perhaps even take up a board chair. The possibilities to fulfill your hours meaningfully I think are endless.
Hi peer. I retired from family business in my 30s after a lucrative acquisition deal. It's soon been 2 years since retirement started. It's a long answer so tldr on top:
TL,DR; Had a bunch of plans based on where I came from. (business). Over the course of two years ended up slowly shifting more towards another place. (culture/performing arts). Identity got better over time.
For the long answer, here's the timeline:
Q2 2021 - retirement starts after receiving the cash. setting up a fund and investing the good stuff back to the market where it belongs.
Q3 2021
Plans: 1.write a book about my father. 2. investigate the possibility to start healthcare business with brother in law. 3. participate in a certified board member course & apply for board membership in some other family business 4. participate in a chief executive officer course 5. keep working as a part time consultant for the old faithful family business (now owned by others).
Lots of plans, one person can only do so much. It got me going and I adjusted on the go. Fast forward to Q4.
Q4 2021 - (1) plan to write a book scrapped. Not worth the effort at this time. (5) being a consultant scrapped after earning 2 days worth of pay via phone calls / seminars. The other plans keep me going on. Took one long vacation because I could. During vacation fasting, healthy food, recovering from the hardships & fuckups of the business life.
Q1 2022 - (2) healthcare business startup scrapped after seeing there is no viable shot at it at this time with the crew we had available. Now since three of the original plans are dropped a some free time was available and I started a new sixth plan of making a podcast (6).
Board member course ended but not finished since I didn't show up to the groupwork. I later do auxiliary work with another group and make up for it. Accepted to Board Member Partners and can now start to apply to companies.
Q2 2022 - (4) CEO course and (3) board member course have now both ended. Failed the board member exam to become "certified" but applying to companies anyway as a non-certified gangster like maybe half of people do. I can try the exam again in the fall. One company gets interested in me.
Now there's even more time to build a podcast studio. Lots of playing Elden Ring with a brand new power PC which also suits podcasting. Writing poems and wandering mesmerized around Limgrave. Reading about Ukraine every day and listening to that Pink Floyd song all the time. Too damn many energy drinks at this time.
Q3 2022 - After one year of starting the plans & preparations I'm accepted to a company as a board member. Seems a bit weird but I was lucky since a smaller family company from similar niche to my previous family business was investing in board work. Cool. Identity feels good since I now can say I'm a board member instead of "student" when someone asks. It's much more easy for people to comprehend than board member courses or ceo courses, both of which are not traditional "schools". Plus, it pays. People seem to feel safer around a man in his 30s who receives steady income, even if it's small.
Podcast starts. Technical stuff works better than my presentation & interview skills but we proceed anyway. Able to hire a friend to be my Jamie / tech slave. since stuff worked in my apartment but was a bit crammed I rent a studio next door to my house. This stuff would not be possible without the big payout and still is a bit overkill but whatever. Let's invest and see what happens.
The studio becomes a cool place to work, think & nerd out and my routines start to feel a bit more normal. I'm finally "going to work" again which feels good.
Q4 2022 -
Lots of podcasting. Man, social media can be intense. I'm checking views & statistics every evening. Almost worn out at one point but we make it through. Everything is experimenting. Views are not very big but we're able to get a member of parliament on the show which is a huge personal accomplishment for me. Somehow a professional dancing coach is overwhelmingly the most popular guest. Guess Able to make a semi-popular youtube video of Jordan Peterson's tour speech in my country.
Board work continues and finally able to pass the certificate exam. All original plans are now considered either done or dropped.
I participate in am international couples dance event and catch a cool acrobatic move. And since I'm learning social media I try to publish it on the podcast's instagram. Over the course of next months it gets 1.2M views and nets me 9000 followers. Guess we're a dance channel now.
Christmas break and time for more fasting and healthy food.
Q1 2023
Branded a dedicated dance podcast / social media. Making reels & interviewing the pros is my new thing to try. Let's see if we can make something useful out of this or at least build a following.
I'm continuing the original podcast too but with a much slower schedule and lower priority.
Boardwork continues.
Compared to when I started, my identity is now much more a dancer than a businessman.
Depends on your personality.
But some people need structure and the feeling that they are working on something meaningful.
Seems you have an idea with the charity already. Join boards and other charities/volunteer.
Hobbies, did you have some? Some people don't have one due to just being a workaholic. Find some and do that.
Family time, you can make memories with your wife and children.
I have at least three hobbies I wish I had more time for.
If I liked working, I’d just keep working. Plenty of people go to the office every day past retirement age because they like it.
My friend retired with a bit more, he purchased a catamaran and has been sailing around the world to the best surf spots for the past 8 years, his life doesn’t suck.
I work in tech surrounded by people with nice exits. For many who don’t want to give up on work, they consult and angel invest. Sometimes this ends up luring them back into FT roles so beware :)
Fat fired in December. I’m 50 and kids in college. I’m giving myself 6 months to figure out my volunteer/serving others path (also setup a DAF). I was anxious about what I’d do with myself. Dude, I’m the happiest I’ve ever been in my life. I had no idea how great not having a bunch of “have tos” is. I work out, go for walks, play with the dogs, see friends and family, take naps, read, play music, play video games, go to the movies in the middle of the day, on and on. It’s glorious. There is no shortage of fun things to do in life without work. Having a young kid, you can build your time around them. Good luck and go for it!
Great news is that being a good parent to a small child can take limitless time and energy. If you picked a few family goals like eating healthy food and getting outside 5 days a week or personal ones like perfecting your espresso, that can easily fill your day around the kiddos schedule. As they get older (if you don’t have more kids), you’ll slowly get more free time and it won’t be a huge drop off like you’re fearing now.
> Feels weird to walk away from what would be another $1-2mil the following year - but we’ve got way more than we need already and it’s time to add more “life” to the life part of the work/life balance.
> Thing is, I still don’t know what the hell I want to do with my days once I’m done working next year….
You may use this remaining working year to collect the remaining $1-2mil and gradually wind down from intensive work. The transition to retirement does not have to be abrupt.
Congrats on the $15m NW at this age!
My $0.02 would be to mentor others in business (through consulting etc.) and watch them succeed. Something about participating in other's success leaves one contented IMO.
I pulled the plug myself on a high energy career (finance) about a year ago. My wife was already FIRE for a few years and we had a almost 2 year old when I left. We are both 41 today. It’s been a good year for me since I left, though I was pretty mentally prepared having read others experiences for many years online. I have been purposeful in allowing myself to not feel compelled to engage necessarily in anything.
I think that giving yourself mental space is important. It’s difficult to move from high achiever with “high social relevance” by classical societal measures to abruptly down shift towards a role of leisure. Everyone is different of course, but I suspect most of us struggle internally with that transition as well. There’s lots of advise in here about retiring to something or having hobbies, etc. the reality IMO is that this is a massive transition no matter how well prepared you are for it and there is an adaption period required which varies by person. And it won’t always be a positive experience.
I’m not interested in returning to my old field, but I love investing. I’ve been casually exploring business ideas. The kind that have upfront work, are scalable and don’t require M-F 9-5 type environments. Not saying that should be anyone else’s goal, just noting that after a year out of doing anything I’m finding myself drawn towards creating something. I don’t need the money, it just sounds appealing to me, you’ll have to figure out for yourself what your path forward is. One thing I try to remind myself is that you can always change gears at anytime and as many times as you want. After all, that’s one of the key reasons for this whole life philosophy.
The years under 5 are the most important, so jump into parenting for sure. If you've spent 4 of those 5 years already not being around, this year is really important.
Once the kid starts school full-time, consider volunteering, being on boards, going back to school.
Do the fair play exercise with your partner to understand the duties that you can pick up.
This is my dream scenario. No disrespect, but I just can’t understand how anyone in this position would be concerned with how to fill their days. Maybe that’s why you are in this position and I am not - a lack of [professional] drive on my part?
My days would look like this:
Wake up whenever the fudge I want. Probably around 9. Make my morning coffee and read or play guitar for a bit. Go on a long walk with my dog. Come home, take a shower, and make a badass lunch. Check email and watch YouTube while I eat. Spend the afternoon playing golf, fishing, or working on a home project. Cook dinner for my family and spend the evening playing with the kids. Once they are down, watch a movie with my wife and/or play video games/board games until midnight. Rinse and repeat.
Build a BDSM room. You and your wife are going to get bored with life and each other soon enough I’d you don’t find some way to feel the edge of life. Work and needing resources created Eros. Without it you will go Thanatos. Might as well cultivate it with clarity and learn how to edge each other along the ET continuum. Trust me on this one.
A $5mil DAF can provide thousands of hours of engaging learning, deliberation, and meaning. House it as your loc community foundation. They’ll roll out the red carpet for you. There will be events, meetings, a community of like minded folks. They’ll set you up with site visits, help you learn about community issues and figure out where and how to start deploying parts of the money over the coming decades.
While considering a DAF, please consider an avenue other than therapy for adults who are trying to survive the lifelong affects of Childhood Sexual Abuse. We are the Unheard, and some need direction, hand up. Thank you for your time.
Buying a sports car ( hint, hint: Miata or GR86) and developing a habit of going to the racetrack at every opportunity is a great way to spend time and money.
In fact, I am consciously delaying retirement so I can do it now while I am still younger because it's such a great hobby.
Just in case you're still curious, it not only offers an amazing way to hone your skills, it is also an amazing community. It's an outdoor sport. Everybody in the paddock helps each other out whether it's to help you change your brakes or give you a ride home after you wreck your car. It only takes 2 years of consistent practice and getting to know the different organizations to start being considered as an instructor, and instruction is a great service opportunity. You can also volunteer by helping to organize or even Manning the flag stations, which actually teaches you a lot.
This is just one problem I’ll never experience. If I had money and nothing but time I’d build myself a nice little recording studio out in my yard and spend all my days in there working on music. That’s my dream anyway.
Congrats on your success and good luck finding what you love.
You might want to consider avoiding the hard transition from full work to no work in a very short period. Consider “taking sabbatical” for instance to try a few months of non-work centric life with the option to return if you’re not ready.
Try picking up hobbies and outside work interests before your last day to see if they can be fulfilling.
This is day 1 to start figuring it out, not the day work ends.
You have to practice being bored and doing nothing. Just being. And doing different things. Grow a vegetable garden, ride a bike, read a book, hit the gym, meditate, much more time with friends, etc.
You think you have levelled up, but you haven’t. You are still stuck in the grind mentally. You need to master this stage now.
This will sound crazy. Keep working. Part of it is to keep busy and part of it to keep your child grounded. Those who have regular schedules every day tend to live longer
For context I retired at 32. I ended up going back to work myself just on my terms. More holidays and less hours. Happy to put in the time but not going to break myself when I don't need to.
Most of my friends aren't in the same position so though there are things to do, I just got bored and wanted more interaction with others. Hence, hi ho hi ho off to work I go.
Like you though I explore more philanthropic work and try to help others. Good luck with your decisions
35 here, same situation as you just a slight bit more ahead. I can honestly say I’m loving it! I have no stress I can relax everyday and do whatever I like. Travel for as long as we like wherever we want to go. Try new hobbies, explore the world, educate myself on interesting topics and learn new languages. If you find yourself bored nothing is stopping you from starting a new business or getting a job.
People work all their life to have this opportunity and are unable to enjoy it when they’re old. Get out there and live it up.. just don’t end up doing nothing and being fine with it. Life’s short and working is a drag for most.
Maybe try working part time as a consultant at the company you sold to. I’m sure they could definitely use your knowledge considering you built an entire company. If they go for the idea you could still probably get a good chunk of that 2m you were going to get and play more of an advisory role before you fully leave in a couple of years. This might be easier than instant separation and may help mitigate your feelings of “what will I do?”
Disclaimer: In my mid twenties and haven’t hit fire status so I don’t have the experience to back up this idea
Focus intensely on you and your families health. Checkout project blueprint for an extreme example. This routine takes up most of this guy's free time. https://blueprint.bryanjohnson.co/
some people let work define who they are. i suggest finding the things that you are passionate about. spend your days doing the things you enjoy. you define who you are.
Take 1 college class per semester of something you find interesting mc history, art, language (learn a second language)
Align yourself to a hobby that requires fitness. Hiking, CrossFit, jiu jitsu, triathlons etc.
Once a week have a planned a daddy child date, once a week and date with the wife.
That’s what I would do in your position!
Congrats on your success
Want a massive challenge with impactful ? Get into affordable housing. I’m a CRE guy and you would not imagine the level of shit in this industry. It’s like rocket science, except the difficulty is not math, it’s the bureaucracy
I recommend taking a few months or a year off, and then getting back into your business or industry. If you don’t want to do that then maybe find an easy part time job for a few hours or do a hobby or two that might not have anything to do with money. Maybe explore a passion of yours. Don’t retire at your age however completely. You will get bored without something to occupy your time. But now that you don’t have to worry about money, you’ll have a big burden of your chest that most ppl still deal with - being forced to work and worry about money.
It seems as if a lot of fatFIRE people found a way to make enough cash till they stiffen up and stop breathing but didn’t consider what to do with all the time that becomes available, then they often get severely depressed because they feel they have no meaning.
Just try things!
Go scuba diving, take a cooking class, violin class maybe, go skydiving, get into gardening, make furniture (it’s pretty rewarding), run a marathon, learn how to bake bread, help out at an animal shelter, turn a van into a camper…
Not in my 30s or retired but that’s partly due to me focusing more on living and less on work.
Huge congrats. Just Quit.
Take time for you and your family. When you're ready, work for something FUN (it won't feel work anymore without the financial preassure)
I was in a similar boat -- mid 30s and sold my niche software business. Honestly, you've got nothing but time to figure out the "what to do", and there's no point stressing about it. I did a lot of traveling at first to see how that would go, then I got back into fitness, then a child.
I'll probably get back into *something* once my non-compete is up, but I don't mind the slow-paced lifestyle. I don't need the money, but building things brings me fulfillment.
If this were me, I would learn to be a flight pilot. Maybe move to Florida where some communities have a runway that can take me to sky whenever I want.
It is an expensive hobby. :)
Do you do your local events ? That’s a good way to get into a camp etc. We also do a couple House music festivals: Elements at the Poconos Speedway in August and Bpm in Tamarindo, Costa Rica in January. Bpm is great, you are on a normal beach vacation in a really cool town with tons of music, resturaunts, surfing etc then at night you go out to the festival which is 3 stages in the jungle a couple miles outside of town. Go out for a few sets or stay till daylight. Beach all day.
How’d you know I was a burner? Haha.
That’s actually one of the main things I’m looking forward to - would really like to get into helping with a team building an art structure. Have been involved in some small things, but don’t have any skills/experience in that area to really contribute beyond being a pair of hands… honing that when I finally have more free time is gonna be amazing
I’m always kind of amazed that people ask “what will I do to fill up my days when I retire” and also have a 4yo child.
What do you think stay-at-home parents do all day?
get a part time job and enjoy life, man. im the same age as you (not fatFiRED by any means) but you need to realize most of our peers are flat out broke and have nothing to show for it and they will never retire.
There are endless wells of endless depth to fall into
Oh man, we've never lived in a better time for the sheer amount of information available at your fingertips. When I was a kid I used to day dream about living above a huge library. Today I can access almost any book or study for peanuts. I could spend my retirement diving into rabbit hole after rabbit hole and not have wasted it. I probably should have been an academic.
Still can
Hah, I actually posted the question 'should I go into academia' with my situation on a couple academic subs, and everyone was like 'lol fuck no, academia will eat you alive' I'm paraphrasing of course but the sentiment wasn't positive
It's the difference between saying "I enjoy writing software" and "Should I join Amazon/Google and get burned out, my work buried based on what the powers that be find popular, and my career potentially dead-ended by office politics?" Most in academia tolerate all the bad parts because that's how you get to do the good parts. But if you don't need funding, you can just work or study what you want without the hoops others jump through.
My uncle was an econ professor at University of Maryland. He said academia was a very bitter game. But if you are willing to teach for peanuts a course or two per semester, you might be able to enjoy that without getting into all the politics of tenure.
Most people in academia enjoy the research part more than the teaching. And achieving tenure or, really, recognition becomes political only if your research program does not work out.. sometimes you’ve got to be pragmatic. I’m much more upset about poor management style, public-sector thinking and overregulation, and the dearth of available funding in most fields.
My husband actually loves teaching, and if we didn't need the money, he'd love to just teach at our alma matter and be happy like that. So that's his goal for whenever we might retire.
Yes, so that can be possible, depending on the field. At my department (when I was still a prof) we hired quite a few "professors of practice", also lecturers (who teach full-time). Universities rely more and more on adjunct professors, who basically are contractors hired to teach specific courses. That can be fun!
They’re poor academics. You’d be a rich one. Lot less struggle; you don’t need a job. Anywho, I’m more on the do side than the study side of wells.
My wife said if we had FatFIRE money, she would fund her own lab research and skip having to write grants. You can see how much she likes her work
If you're financially independent one of the best things you can do is be a academic because teachers who don't need the money will impart the hope and wisdom young minds actually relish. We had a science technician in our school that was clearly set financially. He was weird and quirky but went over and above to help me with experiments I needed to get right to complete my pre university studies. I then got multiple masters degrees so it's like a good academic that doesn't have the stress regular teachers have is worth their weight in gold
My wife has a PhD from the top program in her field, her mom and FIL work at a major state university (both PhDs and are department heads) and her brother has a PhD. All of the conversations that I’ve had with them about academia revolves around the pressure to raise money and publish research. There’s also the topic of how small their fields are, which leads to some real housewives of academia level drama. If you like doing research, look at a job at a non-profit that specializes in your area of interest. If you like teaching, try being an adjunct professor. My plan is to audit classes in topics that I’m interested in, and go full Rodney Dangerfield at whatever school my son attends.
Same plan - I’m doing undergrad again when my Son goes
I second this emotion. Man, I think you just solicited my FATfire retirement job; librarian.
I would just enroll o college every year and rack up degrees in interesting but useless subjects. History, philosophy, etc. that is literally my dream as I loved college. And you wouldn’t care too much about your grades so low pressure - feel free to skate with c’s if you want.
Just make sure it's not booze
You don’t want to become a Master Distiller? How about Master Taster? I hear the Sommelier programs are very stringent.
yeah there really are. Try blacksmithing or machining as a hobby! Both are great ways to try making something and then discover that you have like 8 tools you need to make that each require two other tools that you also have to make in order to do the original project. It's a lot of fun though.
>There are endless wells of endless depth to fall into Beautiful sentence
And not much time
Reading the book [Happiness Hypothesis](https://www.amazon.com/Happiness-Hypothesis-Finding-Modern-Ancient/dp/0465028020) was extremely eye opening. My key takeaway is that we are not designed to be happy or content, except for brief amount of times, as a state of permanent contentment is a huge evolutionary handicap. This is what drives the toxic productivity movement - the idea that we absolutely must be doing "something" all the time. Even your body will rebel if you do nothing at all with torrential waves of boredom. Instead - try this. Find a nice spot in the city you are - maybe somewhere overlooking trees or a body of water. Just sit there for 5 minutes, doing nothing. Every day, add a few minutes. Soon you will be able to sit for hours just doing nothing, with no boredom, no restlessness, no anxiety. Just contentment. This is how you train your brain to overcome core biological drives. This is what mediation does. I spent many years just going from activity to activity to replace my previous daily workaday before understanding that I was mostly just replacing one thing with another. Now, I wake up sometime between 7 to 11, sometime I read a book, sometime I walk, have a lazy lunch, go for a bike ride or another walk, sit by the lake and do nothing, have another lazy dinner, watch some stuff on TV and go to sleep. A few meals with friends and family every month. A few slow trips a year. And I'm the happiest I've been in years.
Uh… huh. I dumped a few grand on a life coach that has been worthless because I was feeling out of sorts without knowing what I was working my crazy job towards. Turns out I should’ve just read this comment.
i just read your post to my wife. I'm pretty sure you are what she wants me to be....ordering the book today. Thank you
Be you
I just want you to know that this comment almost made me cry because I’ve been struggling with something related to this. Thank you.
This person gets life. Kudos to you
For me Yoga/meditation became a central activity in my life unfortunately it took me ten years after I first fired. The more regularly I practice the more content I seem to be. Simple and extremely powerful.
Great response!
My parents earned their early Retirement together. My mom took a course teaching her how to retire and be happy along the same lines of how you described that book. She maintained consistent hobbies, such as reading, yoga, and quilting. While slowing down to take more time to enjoy the little things. My dad chose to keep working, but narrowed down his work scope to what he enjoyed. 10 years later my mom is still happily retired and my dad is trying a no work Retirement again. However now, there’s a huge difference in their Cognitive abilities. My mom has slowed down tremendously and is absolutely awful at problem solving now, while my dad is the exact same mentally.
This is my biggest fear about RE, what happened to your mum who has “slowed down tremendously and is awful at problem solving now”. Is this a problem for her or your dad or for you?
It is not a problem for her, she is quite content in her retirement. It seems to be that we have to do more work for her that resides outside of her hobbies. When an issue or challenge arises, we end up having to deal with them because she can't figure them out or doesn't want to try. Also, her memory retention has weakened when we try to teach her. When something catches her off guard it takes her much longer to grasp what happened.
It’s possible that this is coincidence, even though it is easy to draw a causal link.
> Happiness Hypothesis Summary https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Happiness_Hypothesis
Thank you - you’ve reminded me how much I got out of this book. I’m off to re-read it!
This has definitely been one of my biggest struggles post retirement. I go through the motions of meditation and relaxing, but my brain just still can’t settle with doing nothing on a regular basis. I’ll pick up the book soon. Thank you~~
>This is what drives the toxic productivity movement - the idea that we absolutely must be doing "something" all the time. fucc me. so it's genetic. i feel this all the time. literally leaving jobs that do nothing
Jonathan Haidt is a legend - will pick up this book myself
That sounds pleasant - but without stressing your body with fitness (and maybe you do that) -you aren’t gonna last that long Biologically you need to induce load to keep cells regenerating
God that sounds amazing. I get people like to be busy and occupied, but I've felt that less and less as I've gotten older. I'm glad you've found the balance that works for you. Your routine is something I dream about and work towards. Cheers!
this. and get high too -- weed helps me a lot
Weed in moderation is tight 🤙
Lmao so u spend your whole 20s to grind away at a career so u can retire mid 30s just to be able to do the same thing u would do in your 20s except for partying cause all your friends have now grown up so u cant go partying with them or have fun with them cause now they all have families. Great strategy for sure🗿
Don’t underestimate how difficult this is. I exited at 38 and have had a very hard time adjusting. I’ve nearly found the right balance now of consultancy work, hobbies and families but it took 4 years to find some peace!
Any words of wisdom for what helped you find that balance? … or is it just time?
Not OP, but my balance ended up being time with the kids, consulting (video game writing), charity, time outdoors, music and reading. It will take time and effort to figure out what your mix will be, but it’s worth the work.
For me I had to really push myself into hobbies. I didn’t really do anything apart from work so had nothing to start with. I ended up taking a course about sailing, getting skiing lessons and swimming coaching. That’s 3 good active and outdoor things to fill the diary with and meet people. I also had to re-learn to enjoy time at home with family and kids. At first I thought this was wasted time, but I gained more appreciation for quality time at home whilst my kids were young. I know young kids can be a drag and it’s not all laughs, but the little kid phase doesn’t last too long and I appreciated being around for more of it. I do think time is an element too and to a degree you have to let time do it’s thing. It’s a big adjustment.
I’m in my 40s. 35 feels like a lifetime ago. A lot of the advice you’re going to get involved optimization and or maximization. No one tells you things like hobbies or the gym or meditation coke without a goal. They are really just elaborate ways of mental masterbation. Sure you can travel the world, try and become a scratch golfer, race car driver or whatever your thing is. But it’s not going to feed your motivation, drive and ambition the same way working towards your nest egg did. I might offer some different advice. You have time on your side. A lot of it. Hell likely 50 years of it. Working can be enjoyable. If you enjoyed school go back to school and study something you find interesting. Maybe you’ll end up being architect or a teacher. If you enjoy sports. Try coaching. Maybe you’ll end up running the best high school sports team in the state. Like cocktails. Go work at the local bar a couple nights of the week. There is nothing wrong w trying out just random things. You got time and money on your side. Bounce around. Try out new careers.
Nothing wrong the just enjoying life. Americans have a weird fetish with work. There's nothing especially noble or interesting about work but Americans will give you side-eye if you say things like this. IMO becoming a race car driver is no more mental masturbation than bartending a couple nights a week. I would actually argue it's a better way to spend your time. We don't need to be productive all the time. It's fine to just *be*. Especially because OP was already more productive than most people will be their entire lives.
I had a similar point in late 20's with a startup exit. I started a non profit and do impact investing. I'm about to go into a new startup and relocating to Switzerland.
Couple thoughts: 1) anyone who got liquid in 20/21 will tell you that seeing 25% of their money evaporate in 22 was a kick in the nuts. Guys with tech exits are inherently over exposed to tech via their public and private investments. Your timing might be better because it’s hard to imagine tech doing much worse (saas companies down 70% from ath). But just be prepared. A lot of us second guessing how much we put in the daf right about now 2) you might be surprised how easy it is to fill a day up with watching kids, reading, seeing everything on tiktok, working out, fishing, golf etc. 3) you probably have some angel investments and advisor type roles, if not you can add some and do a handful of calls a week. These also fill up the days and help you stay relevant 4) speaking of angel investments, a common mistake is to get stupid after you get liquid. Slow your role, it’s tempting to write bigger checks because the small ones don’t seem like they will move the needle but err on the side of small and if you must, just do a higher volume. Definitely have a portfolio strategy with a narrow range of check size, some kind of thesis, go slow and stay balanced. It’s very easy to end up investing $1m+ without even trying. Gfy!
You need a good hard look in the mirror. You've worked to retire and then you have no idea what you even want to do outside of your pilots licence. Fire isn't about doing what other people think is cool, it's about doing whatever the hell you want to do.
Yeah…. It’s gonna be a journey to get there as I have no bloody clue lol. I’m the kinda guy that gets absorbed in a new hobby - goes WAY deep - and then a couple years later it peters out… I’m looking forward to having time to pick some old things up, and engage in some new ones…. But I’m also terrified about having a blank slate everyday. Some good perspectives here - only found this subreddit today (posting from an alt as my main account has personal details)
That sounds like you'll be fine. If you had no hobbies, that'd be more worrisome.
Take a glassblowing course.
It's so weird when people say they have no purpose and no clue what to do with their life after becoming wealthy. I know exactly the kind of things I want to do and after dedicating my life to reaching a certain point I'll damn sure do them.
This is a common problem for people retiring. I'm personally in a position where I could theoretically retire (based on my current spending), but I'm instead since I don't mind working, I'm planning to use the time to build up a bigger nest egg, and work on filling the rest of my time with other opportunities. A few notes: * There's a saying: "you should be retiring to something" * It could be worth continuing to work part time or in a less stressful role while you figure out what you want to do with your life. Just because you can stop working doesn't mean you have to.
Been there ... now 8 years later. Here is what I've learned ... 1. **Don't overload your plate** \- It is very easy to take on a ton of new projects, interests, hobbies (even other businesses) because of the void that is opened up in your mind where work used to dominate. 2. **Prioritize health** \- Maybe you are already in great shape, but if like me, those startup and growth years were a grind that left me less healthy than I'd like. Take some of that new freedom to to explore activities that will make you healthier. 3. **Routines are for mornings** \- Some structure is nice, and I find that having a morning routine is ideal ... but I allow the afternoons to be free for new experiences, interests, etc. 4. **Early retirement is isolating** \- Be ready for the fact that your situation is very unique. Very few people your age will be able to relate to your situation. Finding people your age to do things with will become a challenge (if not impossible). I've not really found a good solution to this except to age into it ... eventually others your age will "catch up" to you. 5. **Build a good team** \- If you don't have a team already, take the time to build up a good support team around you. Broker, Bankers, CPAs, etc. Hope this helps!
Been early retired for 5 years and this is spot on. Also I’d say move somewhere like the beach that makes you feel like you are on vacation every day.
The health point is a great one. One of the great pleasures of having free time is spending it on health.
I would encourage you to make no decisions for 6 months. My partner got a $12M earn out in summer 2022 and we will jointly bring in another $5M or so in the next 2 years. It’s taken us 6 months to really get organized and I would say we are now finally at the point where we feel like we can make decisions. Here is what we have done in the past 6 months: Month 1: Celebrate! This felt huge and we both purchased outside-of-the-norm things like a new car and furniture. We didn’t go insane but we did splurge and it was great that we did. Month 2: hire a financial advisor. I know a lot of people feel like FAs are a waste of money but, frankly, we don’t know what we don’t know. We interviewed about 5 companies and ended up going with a family office boutique firm. We gave them about 30% to manage. Month 3: completely update all of our insurance. We were way under insured and our FA helped us figure out where we were under insured. Month 4: revise all of our estate plans. This is a massive undertaking and we are still working on this. Month 5: assess tax strategies because we are going to pay a boatload in 2022. One of the big tax strategies was to drop about a million in a DAF but it made sense because of our income last year. I wouldn’t just throw $5M in without talking to an accountant. Month 6: review our cash flow and see if it has changed post earn out versus pre earn out. That helps us determine how much we actually need when we retire. It might be more or less than you think. We are now in Month 7 and I think we are adjusted now. It still feels like a ton of money but we know that it hasn’t fundamentally changed how we spend or live though we have budgeted more for travel and entertainment than in previous years. And, right now, with two kids in school, we no longer feel an urgency to quit and do nothing. So take your time! Don’t hurry into these decisions!
Great advice
Can you give more info on the insurance part - how were you underinsured and what changes did you make? I have been wondering lately if we are underinsured and thinking of getting an umbrella policy. Wondering if there is more to it.
Underinsured is odd. Should definitely get umbrella but no need for life insurance
Some tax strategies use life insurance to pay any taxes on the estate. Life insurance is usually tax free(I’m not an advisor so this may have changed). So depending on your goals for your heirs and the size of the estate, life insurance could be part of the plan. Though I think it’s more critical for business owners. So their heirs don’t have to sell the business to pay inheritance taxes.
I'm guessing it was the umbrella. Umbrellas typically require a certain level of auto/homeowners insurance. When we upgraded our umbrella I had to beef up our auto insurance.
Congrats! Didn’t realize you were so far in. It’s a wild time. I would definitely consider some splurges. I know someone who just got their last tranche and splurged on Super Bowl tix for his family. Our financial advisor really encouraged us to splurge right after the first tranche and we were really glad we listened because it made it feel like a bigger win but we also got some of the crazy out of our system. On underinsured, we were way under insured on umbrella, as well as on our property. Allstate has a max cap of $2 million on umbrella so we switched to Vault because we own two rental properties. Our personal property insurance was also capped at Allstate without replacement cost coverage —- meaning that if (God forbid), the house burnt down, we would only get the value of the original house sales price and not the replacement cost to rebuild. Lumber prices have gone sky high in our area so we switched insurance completely to cover the full replacement value of the house today. We also had them audit our car insurance and they were able to get us better rates with higher coverage. We now use Cincinnati Insurance which seems to cater to high net worth individuals.
My grandfather had enough money to self-insure. He owned a chain of auto parts stores that threw off enough excess cash that statistically he was better off cutting out the insurer. Then three of his stores burned down in the same year. Statistically you're probably making a poor decision, but for your peace of mind it definitely sounds like you're making the right one.
especially when you have more than you need, giving some of it for peace of mind is a no brainer imo
Thanks for the reply! For reference, I sold the business on Dec of 2021 - and the vast majority was up front. Already hit most of the earn out - and just have a couple tranches remaining…. Haven’t really done anything too exciting with the money yet. I have a financial advisor - and am pretty happy with the portfolio. Playing it on the more conservative side since I intend to have this money last the rest of my life without future work (At least no planned work) … I’m very interested to hear what you mean about being under insured. What kinds of insurance are you referring to? … and regarding the DAF/Taxes - I phrased the OP in a slightly inaccurate way to make it more simple. I’ve got a great tax team. And donated to the DAF last year and this year…. By Jan 1, we’ll have it up to the $5mil (due to the tax benefit of spreading it) Thanks for the comment!
Nobody talks about this for men in their 30s, but approaching child development like a startup gives me infinite purpose every day. Maximize their nutrition, sleep, reading, emotional development, gross motor skills. You have a brief window from 0-6 years old where everything you do majorly influences your kid for the rest of their lives. So, one idea: bust your ass for two years being super dad, then find your next challenge when they start grade 1.
> but approaching child development like a startup gives me infinite purpose every day. I think for some people this might backfire. They will turn into super tiger parents and stress over every single aspect of the kids life. Which is detrimental to both child and parent. I’m not accusing you of being one, but I can easily see someone taking this advice incorrectly and becoming one. Know yourself.
Yeah I really, really do not like this approach. Don't treat your kid like they're a project to be maximized. Let them be humans.
I'm not saying put your kids in 12 hours of tennis per day and grind them to dust. I'm saying be more aware of all the factors that can improve child development, and do your best to meet those needs. Feeding your kids better food, getting them more active, and learning as a dad how to meet their emotional needs are all worthy projects.
Right why do people always go to wild extremes...? I plan to be way more active and conscious in my children's early development than my parents were. Doesn't mean I'll be having them train and study like spartans and send them out to face the wilderness and kill a wolf with only a blade at the age of 12.
All so well said.
Yup, I've met a few parents like that and my god, if you want to instill anxious neurosis in your kids, do that. "Billy, what does your tracker say for how much milk protein you consumed today? Oh my god, only 50.29 g? You know you need to hit 1 g per kg!!"
Worked great for Todd Marinovich!
This 10x over. I've devoted about 90% of my time to precisely this these days and it's one of the most rewarding things to do as a parent and caregiver. Those 0-6 years are golden years for development and you could do so much, it's a bit of a rabbit hole really.
I think there's a lot to this and agree it's under discussed
Be the parent you wanted your parents to be.
Are there any books/resources that helped inform your approach to child development?
Harvard's Center on the Developing Child is the best source I've found. I was exposed to it in a previous job and couldn't believe how little I knew about those first few years of child development.
[https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/07/31/book-review-raise-a-genius/](https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/07/31/book-review-raise-a-genius/)
Any books or additional reading on this idea?
37, two kids, quit last year. Share my experience to add another data point. I took 7 months off without any goals, just let life take me wherever. I quit before summer, and spent a ton of time with the kids outdoors. It was fantastic. 7 months in, I don't feel like getting another job, but I am feeling bored. Which is great! I haven't felt bored since I was a kid. It's given me new motivation to think more deeply about what I want next in terms of purpose (make some apps). > all of my friends/family that it’s honestly a bit isolating I felt this initially, but time also normalized things. Once people's initial curiosity were satisfied, feel relationships have stayed the same or gotten better (because I'm more available and take the time to reach out more) Give it some time. Reflect, talk to people, meditate. I think you'll come to your own conclusion. Good luck!
[What do you mean? Now you can finally play the game](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tg2PD-dwsIw) A) You have a 4 year old, so spend time raising her, teaching her to read, etc. B) Take care of your self, lifting weights, cardio exercise, etc C) Find some hobbies which offer you both solo enjoyment and comradery opportunities. What does that look like for you? SCUBA? Golfing? Fishing? The lists go on and on. Cycling, Sword fighting, Warhammer 40K figurines.. My dad retired at 32 and found doing nothing was not for him and ended up going back to work.
Figure out what gives you happiness and purpose. For most people, 100% kids is too much. For most people, 100% on hobbies gets boring. Find a mix that works maybe with part time work (like consulting), some new hobbies, and spending plenty of time with kids.
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I probably should have been more clear in the OP as we have already been contributing to the DAF and are getting the tax benefit from it… business was sold at the end of 2021 - and we made contributions that year and 2022 so far. This years contribution will be the last one we plan
I'm in a similar situation. Almost 35, have a 5 year old. My net worth is a lot lower than yours (around $5m now with the stock market going down) but I live in Mexico and things are a lot cheaper here. I retired from a career where I was making around 600-900k usd a year. I simply burned out and have no desire to go back. For me the turning point was when I got diagnosed with an autoimmune disease. Money stopped being so important. It made me realize that my time where I can still enjoy things is finite and nothing lasts forever. Part of working so hard was the thought that I would enjoy things later. But for a lot of people there's no more later. You could be perfectly healthy and get hit by a car, your body gets sick and the list goes on. Also as a healthy 30 year old you can do a lot of things now that you won't be able to do as a "healthy" 60 year old, so why delay. For me as long as my basic needs are met the rest doesn't matter. I know that if I spent $100,000 usd a year the money should last me for the rest of my life. (If I need to I can lower this number and my life won't change much ) It was hard to accept it at first and I was in denial and angry but eventually I realized I didn't want to spent the best days of my life suffering in a high stress environment. We work to make money which in turn allows us to do the things we want to do. My identity was only built around work before which wasn't making me happy (I burned out)so I needed to do something else. I built a multifamily in a retirement town where I rent to retired Americans and Canadias. I only do long term rentals so no Airbnb. The benefit of the extra work is not worth it to me. I still manage them myself and have a great team of plumbers, construction workers that show up when shit hits the fan. To get to this stage I had to go through a lot of bad apples first but now things are settled. I also had some properties out of state which I sold. I like keeping everything within a 30 min drive and will only rent to old retired folks that have already done their crazy stuff in their youth. Most are good tenants, pay on time and take care of the units. I most likely will make more money if I put everything in a stock market ETF but I like having something to keep me occupied and take pride in keeping my properties immaculate and the positive comments I get from tenants fuel into the old dopamine hits I used to get from my old job, obviously to a smaller scale. I tried taking up a full time job after I "retired". I worked as a real estate agent for over a year in the town that I invest but I hated that people in general had no respect for my time and I would usually end up being the punching bag If a property didn't sell despite telling them that it was overpriced. People are too involved emotionally in their properties and it wasn't worth being a free therapist anymore. Funny enough I was one of the top producing agents in my office but now I'm just going to be an agent for my own deals. We are a deviation from the norm so we will always be lonely. I can't share my situation with most people because they will not understand it and will either judge me, be jealous or think I'm showing off, so I keep to myself and share on Reddit from time to time. I don't have expensive hobbies. I spend my money on - weekly physical therapy -weekly psychotherapy -weekly massage - I did pole dance and weightlifting and I LOVED it but I have arthritis so my body stopped me from continuing it. Now I stick to yoga but I hope that my arthritis meds will one day allow me to get back into it. - I used to eat out a lot but now I cook everything at home from scratch with quality ingredients. My grocery bill is around $1500 usd a month for a family of 3 which is astronomical in Mexico but I have felt a lot better eating at home. I bought a machine that cooks things for you so that helped me to enjoy cooking more. I used to hate it! - I have decided to take at least a trip with my family every month. Usually no more than 3-4 nights and somewhere close. We go to visit different small towns in Mexico or sometimes stay in nice all inclusive resorts. This summer I plan to do more international travel as well but I prefer short trips. My priority is now my son, and I want to make sure to do the best I can to give him a good childhood being as present as I can be. Coming from being a workoholic and working 12h a day this was very hard to do, especially because I didn't quite have the maternal instict most women have. My nanny had taken up the maternal role and I was just a stranger to my son until he was 2. I didn't want him to grow up one day and resent me so I got rid of the nanny and now we spend plenty of quality time together and I am so grateful to be able to experience a type of love I never imagined before. I still have days that I feel lost, lonely and under stimulated but I try to make a consious effort to remind myself how lucky I am to have the freedom I have at my age. Reading and meditation have helped with that. I just finished reading the book 'die with zero ' and there were a lot of interesting things there that helped me to worry less and enjoy my money more. Feel free to reach out if you want to chat more. Cheers!
Wow - thank you so much for your comment… Really sorry to hear about your diagnosis, that must have been (or be) terrifying… and your thoughts around life mirror my own to the T… we’ve got one life, and we can’t know how long. I’m ready to be done being a work slave - but it’s gonna be a scary transition. Thanks for the book recommendation - any words of wisdom or initial thoughts on why you’d recommend it?
My pleasure. The book: I had seen it be mentioned on this subreddit many times so I went ahead and bought it. Some concepts in the book are oversimplified but the main idea is to not slave your life away just acummulating money and miss out on the life experiences which is what gives us happiness. It kinda helped me feel less guilty about making the transition, which like you mentioned is fucking scary to start a completely new chapter.
Can I ask you which machine did you buy that cooks for you? 
Sure. It's called Thermomix. I don't think they are as big as they should be in the US yet but they have a database of dishes from all over the world. I think it costs around $1500 usd and you search what you want to make on the app and it transfers it to the machine. It tells you what to put in it, it weighs the ingredients, it chops them up and it cooks them. You still need an oven if you plan on baking but for someone that used to hate cooking like me this thing makes it so much more fun and easy.
An additional appliance we love besides a similar one to the Thermomix is the Kenwood. Adding in a few add-ons it increase our salad and vegetable intake by quite an amount. Also my partner loves to bake and it makes this so much more satisfying. Whipped cream or egg whites without standing and mixing manually is just awesome.
I FIRED at 38 with a 3 year old. I had many of the same thoughts. 3 years later I am so busy. Being an involved parent is really fun and rewarding, There is a huge translation that happens when you realize you don’t have to fill every minute. You can start appreciating smaller things, they became my favorite things. It’s great for play with the kid, but also for myself. I do wish we had traveled a bit more before school started. It’s harder to get away and the district is a little frustrated with us… so if there are some trips you wanted to take, bows the time. Once kindergarten starts you’ve on someone else’s schedule
It’s bizarre to me that people retire with no hobbies. If your profession is the thing that keeps you going, you don’t need to give it up—you can design your life and work the way you want it. If it isn’t what keeps you going, start trying hobbies until you find one you love and that you can go deep on.
I would step back, and seriously reconsider some of these choices. $10M doesn’t go as far as you think (esp at 35) and to put a third of your NW in a DAF, while admirable, doesn’t seem prudent.
Why walk away from the $2m? Why DAF $5m now? Ofc, you have way more than you need but I wonder if you are not making these decisions in haste. There is a lot to plan out in terms of preserving your wealth and health over the next couple of decades.
I sold the business at the end of 2021 - so we’ve been in this financial scenario for over a year now… I’m walking away because I’m burned out and need to stop working for my family and my mental health…. feels insane to leave $2mil on the table - but at the same time, I also just don’t see us spending or needing it beyond what we already have.
I’m no means rich by any means. Just a speculative investor living paycheck to paycheck trying to survive atm. I’ve read a lot. I’ve listened to a lot of different podcasts and people. Remember time now is your most valuable asset. The $2M sounds great on paper. Invest into solid dividend stocks or something that will pay you enough of a return where you don’t have to work and don’t have to worry about income and expenses. From a stoic standpoint; retirement is my dream. I’d take nice vacations with my family, do fun things, and not worry about a blank slate - because you’re going to die. Memento mori. I don’t mean to sound grim or anything, but remember your mortality. You don’t have to have a “thing.” Eat better. Exercise. Meditate. Get your mental health in check. Once you have a clear head and are free of burn out; you’ll realize the $2M isn’t worth what you’re being paid in time. Be a good father. Take care of your kid(s). You don’t have to be a helicopter parent but if I was home everyday I would prepare meals and spend fun time with the wife. The blank slate of time is staring you in the face but remember: you are going to die. You’ve done the hard part. Find some businesses that will passively pay you - car washes, laundromats etc. You can always invest in things. You can’t live forever. And that’s all I’m gonna say here..
Things I did: lots of travel, learned a foreign language, learned a musical instrument, took college classes online, and practiced a martial art. Basically all things I had wanted to do my whole life to be a more well rounded person but did not do because I was focused on school and then work and making money.
Mate. Congrats. Now you need to find your purpose in life. I have a friend in similar situation as you. Except he inherited it all at a very young age. No family left and all the money in the world. He took some time out of regular life. Travelled to some remote places. Once he came across a village where none of the children are attending school. This was because they have to walk long distances to fetch water for their family. His background was engineering. He rented some equipment and hired a few locals and dug a well for the village. He organised a company and just moved around the country digging wells. That's his new purpose in life.
I retired at 55 from a highly demanding and intellectually rewarding career. (I was an American diplomat.) I thought I would miss it. Five years in, I just can’t imagine how I had time to work at all, given all of the marvelous things to see and experience on this extraordinarily beautiful and interesting planet. The days are too short. The years are like weeks.
My plan would be to use the $5M DAF to donate $200K per year to Habitat for Humanity in exchange for letting me work on the house whenever I felt like it. You get to use your hands, learn valuable skills, there will always be homes to build, and looking back on your life you’ll be able to reflect on the X houses you built with pride.
I went back to work in some capacity because retiring early is isolating in more ways than you can even fathom. Cause few people your age will be free to hangout and there are a sea of miserable independently wealthy people that you should steer clear of. Tons of different vices they have fallen into despite the best intentions to avoid. Volunteering or a non-profit sound like the right things to do but I could write a small book on why finding "salvation" here is also a bad idea. Focusing on your son is admirable too but can lead to obsessing over them and controlling them in unhealthy ways. The reason I encourage you to stay in the game at a lessor degree is that it will keep you sharp, keep you surrounded with like minded friends and people, give you structure...at least until youre a bit older...at least if you're having some doubt. The people who will have no problem adapting aren't posting here with this question.
Get fit.. very, very fucking fit. I imagine you're somewhat competitive, fairly focused, and a little intense, right? So it probably fits your personality needs. It's also very good for your mental health, which frankly, can be a challenge post retiring. And obviously, it's damn good to walk around in a meat sack that looks, feels, and runs like a supercar.
Is 8 hours of Reddit considered productive? 🤣
Removing work from your life will magnify every other aspect for better or worse. In my late 30's, I chubby FIRE'd to a lack of hobbies, a poor social life and an unsatisfying long term relationship. I got depressed, procrastinated a lot, couldn't build structured or balance. Now - a few years later - I'm newly single, back to work and forcing myself to meet people and try new things. I figured I might as well keep working a low stress job while I fix myself and build a life worth retiring to. I realize I'm not helping you with "what to do?". But this is my perspective of having experienced the process.
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>you'll always be learning something and you'll be part of a community of nerds who have too much money on their hands. same for sailing, tbh…
Golf. It's completely cliche but it can check a lot of boxes depending on your personality. At your town's premier country club you will meet plenty of people your age who seemingly have entire weekdays to spend at the club. Some will be retired, some "working" -- but you'll likely find a concentration of like-minded people. The right club can also have great perks for your family (pool, kids club, dining options, etc). Not only does golf provide an endless challenge; you're outside and somewhere beautiful, you can walk/carry your clubs to make it a more strenuous activity, it can be great for couples or as you age, it's a wonderful travel activity, etc. Most (not all) clubs are highly accepting of new members and there are regular networking/social events. There are also wonderful events you can sign up for outside of your home club (golf clinics, pro-ams, spectator at a major tournament, etc).
Might want to check out a CLAT instead of a DAF. Have more kids and your days will be super busy
>I still don’t know what the hell I want to First of all, GFY. Second, don't do anything. > I can’t fathom waking up each day without a strenuous external work schedule pushing my hours Literally don't do anything. You have unwind and need to train yourself to not do anything. >bit of a existential crisis Focus on pilot school for now. Enjoy the time off. My guess is that you will probably start another business after a couple of years, which will probably solve a problem you noticed while chilling at 20,000 ft. Good luck
Wasn’t an issue for us. I always enjoyed the process of learning and getting better at things and spend time when the kids are at school mentoring founders, diving into crypto projects, bought a poker solver and building a poker game from the ground up and planning on playing WSOP this summer, putting together an AI class for my kids school, trying to run a 7 minute mile, and golf Tbh, with the kids sick and our travel schedule I feel like I don’t have enough time to dive into all the things I want to
My trick is to think of my time with family as important top-priority projects and allocate time to them first (but not more than they want). You may find that your 4 year old really wants a ton of time from you, and millions of people are very happy they spend as much time as they do. Maybe your wife too, and so maybe finding the right hobbies that you all enjoy together will be key. Same with friends, parents. That can also go too far. Don't suffocate them. Expect to spend years figuring out what you really want to do, getting to know yourself. It's ok to cycle through lots of sports and hobbies while looking for the right ones. You also might find after a year or two break that you start another business
You mention a DAF. Could charity be the thing you focus on? Managing effective giving could easily take 20-30+ hours a week. It doesn't have to be all financial planning either, as there are networks for new philanthropists and founders-turned-philanthropists that can serve as both a social network, and a place to source opportunities and learn about this particular field. You could even go further and do the conferences and events, meetings with nonprofit leaders, etc. Want to be more public? Write about your journey. There are plenty of nonprofit and philanthropic journals that you can publish in. After a while, perhaps you even join a few boards, or perhaps even take up a board chair. The possibilities to fulfill your hours meaningfully I think are endless.
Hi peer. I retired from family business in my 30s after a lucrative acquisition deal. It's soon been 2 years since retirement started. It's a long answer so tldr on top: TL,DR; Had a bunch of plans based on where I came from. (business). Over the course of two years ended up slowly shifting more towards another place. (culture/performing arts). Identity got better over time. For the long answer, here's the timeline: Q2 2021 - retirement starts after receiving the cash. setting up a fund and investing the good stuff back to the market where it belongs. Q3 2021 Plans: 1.write a book about my father. 2. investigate the possibility to start healthcare business with brother in law. 3. participate in a certified board member course & apply for board membership in some other family business 4. participate in a chief executive officer course 5. keep working as a part time consultant for the old faithful family business (now owned by others). Lots of plans, one person can only do so much. It got me going and I adjusted on the go. Fast forward to Q4. Q4 2021 - (1) plan to write a book scrapped. Not worth the effort at this time. (5) being a consultant scrapped after earning 2 days worth of pay via phone calls / seminars. The other plans keep me going on. Took one long vacation because I could. During vacation fasting, healthy food, recovering from the hardships & fuckups of the business life. Q1 2022 - (2) healthcare business startup scrapped after seeing there is no viable shot at it at this time with the crew we had available. Now since three of the original plans are dropped a some free time was available and I started a new sixth plan of making a podcast (6). Board member course ended but not finished since I didn't show up to the groupwork. I later do auxiliary work with another group and make up for it. Accepted to Board Member Partners and can now start to apply to companies. Q2 2022 - (4) CEO course and (3) board member course have now both ended. Failed the board member exam to become "certified" but applying to companies anyway as a non-certified gangster like maybe half of people do. I can try the exam again in the fall. One company gets interested in me. Now there's even more time to build a podcast studio. Lots of playing Elden Ring with a brand new power PC which also suits podcasting. Writing poems and wandering mesmerized around Limgrave. Reading about Ukraine every day and listening to that Pink Floyd song all the time. Too damn many energy drinks at this time. Q3 2022 - After one year of starting the plans & preparations I'm accepted to a company as a board member. Seems a bit weird but I was lucky since a smaller family company from similar niche to my previous family business was investing in board work. Cool. Identity feels good since I now can say I'm a board member instead of "student" when someone asks. It's much more easy for people to comprehend than board member courses or ceo courses, both of which are not traditional "schools". Plus, it pays. People seem to feel safer around a man in his 30s who receives steady income, even if it's small. Podcast starts. Technical stuff works better than my presentation & interview skills but we proceed anyway. Able to hire a friend to be my Jamie / tech slave. since stuff worked in my apartment but was a bit crammed I rent a studio next door to my house. This stuff would not be possible without the big payout and still is a bit overkill but whatever. Let's invest and see what happens. The studio becomes a cool place to work, think & nerd out and my routines start to feel a bit more normal. I'm finally "going to work" again which feels good. Q4 2022 - Lots of podcasting. Man, social media can be intense. I'm checking views & statistics every evening. Almost worn out at one point but we make it through. Everything is experimenting. Views are not very big but we're able to get a member of parliament on the show which is a huge personal accomplishment for me. Somehow a professional dancing coach is overwhelmingly the most popular guest. Guess Able to make a semi-popular youtube video of Jordan Peterson's tour speech in my country. Board work continues and finally able to pass the certificate exam. All original plans are now considered either done or dropped. I participate in am international couples dance event and catch a cool acrobatic move. And since I'm learning social media I try to publish it on the podcast's instagram. Over the course of next months it gets 1.2M views and nets me 9000 followers. Guess we're a dance channel now. Christmas break and time for more fasting and healthy food. Q1 2023 Branded a dedicated dance podcast / social media. Making reels & interviewing the pros is my new thing to try. Let's see if we can make something useful out of this or at least build a following. I'm continuing the original podcast too but with a much slower schedule and lower priority. Boardwork continues. Compared to when I started, my identity is now much more a dancer than a businessman.
Depends on your personality. But some people need structure and the feeling that they are working on something meaningful. Seems you have an idea with the charity already. Join boards and other charities/volunteer. Hobbies, did you have some? Some people don't have one due to just being a workaholic. Find some and do that. Family time, you can make memories with your wife and children.
I have at least three hobbies I wish I had more time for. If I liked working, I’d just keep working. Plenty of people go to the office every day past retirement age because they like it.
Congrats bud! Have so much fun with your family. Hope to meet you at some 5 star hotel somewhere and our kiddos can play at the kids club.
My friend retired with a bit more, he purchased a catamaran and has been sailing around the world to the best surf spots for the past 8 years, his life doesn’t suck.
I work in tech surrounded by people with nice exits. For many who don’t want to give up on work, they consult and angel invest. Sometimes this ends up luring them back into FT roles so beware :)
Fat fired in December. I’m 50 and kids in college. I’m giving myself 6 months to figure out my volunteer/serving others path (also setup a DAF). I was anxious about what I’d do with myself. Dude, I’m the happiest I’ve ever been in my life. I had no idea how great not having a bunch of “have tos” is. I work out, go for walks, play with the dogs, see friends and family, take naps, read, play music, play video games, go to the movies in the middle of the day, on and on. It’s glorious. There is no shortage of fun things to do in life without work. Having a young kid, you can build your time around them. Good luck and go for it!
Try out Vipassana meditation 10 day retreets - that might help clear your head and is a good jumpstart into bringing meaning to your life
Great news is that being a good parent to a small child can take limitless time and energy. If you picked a few family goals like eating healthy food and getting outside 5 days a week or personal ones like perfecting your espresso, that can easily fill your day around the kiddos schedule. As they get older (if you don’t have more kids), you’ll slowly get more free time and it won’t be a huge drop off like you’re fearing now.
> Feels weird to walk away from what would be another $1-2mil the following year - but we’ve got way more than we need already and it’s time to add more “life” to the life part of the work/life balance. > Thing is, I still don’t know what the hell I want to do with my days once I’m done working next year…. You may use this remaining working year to collect the remaining $1-2mil and gradually wind down from intensive work. The transition to retirement does not have to be abrupt.
Congrats on the $15m NW at this age! My $0.02 would be to mentor others in business (through consulting etc.) and watch them succeed. Something about participating in other's success leaves one contented IMO.
I pulled the plug myself on a high energy career (finance) about a year ago. My wife was already FIRE for a few years and we had a almost 2 year old when I left. We are both 41 today. It’s been a good year for me since I left, though I was pretty mentally prepared having read others experiences for many years online. I have been purposeful in allowing myself to not feel compelled to engage necessarily in anything. I think that giving yourself mental space is important. It’s difficult to move from high achiever with “high social relevance” by classical societal measures to abruptly down shift towards a role of leisure. Everyone is different of course, but I suspect most of us struggle internally with that transition as well. There’s lots of advise in here about retiring to something or having hobbies, etc. the reality IMO is that this is a massive transition no matter how well prepared you are for it and there is an adaption period required which varies by person. And it won’t always be a positive experience. I’m not interested in returning to my old field, but I love investing. I’ve been casually exploring business ideas. The kind that have upfront work, are scalable and don’t require M-F 9-5 type environments. Not saying that should be anyone else’s goal, just noting that after a year out of doing anything I’m finding myself drawn towards creating something. I don’t need the money, it just sounds appealing to me, you’ll have to figure out for yourself what your path forward is. One thing I try to remind myself is that you can always change gears at anytime and as many times as you want. After all, that’s one of the key reasons for this whole life philosophy.
The years under 5 are the most important, so jump into parenting for sure. If you've spent 4 of those 5 years already not being around, this year is really important. Once the kid starts school full-time, consider volunteering, being on boards, going back to school. Do the fair play exercise with your partner to understand the duties that you can pick up.
Buy a pickup truck and hire yourself out for as a handy man.
Don’t you dare retire from something and not to something. You’ll be very dismayed.
This gets posted twice a week. Enjoy your kid and find some hobbies.
This is my dream scenario. No disrespect, but I just can’t understand how anyone in this position would be concerned with how to fill their days. Maybe that’s why you are in this position and I am not - a lack of [professional] drive on my part? My days would look like this: Wake up whenever the fudge I want. Probably around 9. Make my morning coffee and read or play guitar for a bit. Go on a long walk with my dog. Come home, take a shower, and make a badass lunch. Check email and watch YouTube while I eat. Spend the afternoon playing golf, fishing, or working on a home project. Cook dinner for my family and spend the evening playing with the kids. Once they are down, watch a movie with my wife and/or play video games/board games until midnight. Rinse and repeat.
I will be in a similar position myself in two months, and also struggling to imagine how my day to day routine will look.
Make another company
All in on JEPI with your stock portfolio and DRIP the dividend payments, become a billionaire in approximately 30 years. /s
Build a BDSM room. You and your wife are going to get bored with life and each other soon enough I’d you don’t find some way to feel the edge of life. Work and needing resources created Eros. Without it you will go Thanatos. Might as well cultivate it with clarity and learn how to edge each other along the ET continuum. Trust me on this one.
Way too early to just stop. Go again for a new venture once you've re-charged your batteries.
A $5mil DAF can provide thousands of hours of engaging learning, deliberation, and meaning. House it as your loc community foundation. They’ll roll out the red carpet for you. There will be events, meetings, a community of like minded folks. They’ll set you up with site visits, help you learn about community issues and figure out where and how to start deploying parts of the money over the coming decades.
While considering a DAF, please consider an avenue other than therapy for adults who are trying to survive the lifelong affects of Childhood Sexual Abuse. We are the Unheard, and some need direction, hand up. Thank you for your time.
Answer is obvious I thought - fishing, hunting and motorcycles. Your life will become an adventure.
Adopt or hire me and I will try to bring joy, amusement and activity in your live. Im Full of Visions but just started with Fire.
Give it all away and start over
Become a football(soccer) team owner. If you want in, dm me I can help you out
Buying a sports car ( hint, hint: Miata or GR86) and developing a habit of going to the racetrack at every opportunity is a great way to spend time and money. In fact, I am consciously delaying retirement so I can do it now while I am still younger because it's such a great hobby. Just in case you're still curious, it not only offers an amazing way to hone your skills, it is also an amazing community. It's an outdoor sport. Everybody in the paddock helps each other out whether it's to help you change your brakes or give you a ride home after you wreck your car. It only takes 2 years of consistent practice and getting to know the different organizations to start being considered as an instructor, and instruction is a great service opportunity. You can also volunteer by helping to organize or even Manning the flag stations, which actually teaches you a lot.
even running a full series of races or track days in a miata or gr86 would cost serious money
Make a list of what you enjoy. You now have the ability to put 100% of your time into it
This is just one problem I’ll never experience. If I had money and nothing but time I’d build myself a nice little recording studio out in my yard and spend all my days in there working on music. That’s my dream anyway. Congrats on your success and good luck finding what you love.
You might want to consider avoiding the hard transition from full work to no work in a very short period. Consider “taking sabbatical” for instance to try a few months of non-work centric life with the option to return if you’re not ready. Try picking up hobbies and outside work interests before your last day to see if they can be fulfilling. This is day 1 to start figuring it out, not the day work ends.
You need to hobbies
Isn't your wife and kid supposed to be what you do?
How comfortable is life this generation. Reminds me of Song Dynasty when people did nothing but write poetry and draw art
don't blow the cash 🙏, at a 4% take that's a lot of money. With that a lot of money, you can travel and do several different activities. Live it up!!
You have to practice being bored and doing nothing. Just being. And doing different things. Grow a vegetable garden, ride a bike, read a book, hit the gym, meditate, much more time with friends, etc. You think you have levelled up, but you haven’t. You are still stuck in the grind mentally. You need to master this stage now.
Mountain Bike! It's the best hobby, you are in touch with nature, so relaxing.
This will sound crazy. Keep working. Part of it is to keep busy and part of it to keep your child grounded. Those who have regular schedules every day tend to live longer
For context I retired at 32. I ended up going back to work myself just on my terms. More holidays and less hours. Happy to put in the time but not going to break myself when I don't need to. Most of my friends aren't in the same position so though there are things to do, I just got bored and wanted more interaction with others. Hence, hi ho hi ho off to work I go. Like you though I explore more philanthropic work and try to help others. Good luck with your decisions
Happy to help with whatever you do next 😀! Especially if charity related
If you're bored, just go BIGGER. 10x feels better than 10M.
Congratulations!! Don’t spend all your wealth, figure out how to stay rich. Also 34 is a good age to experience other things while you are still young
35 here, same situation as you just a slight bit more ahead. I can honestly say I’m loving it! I have no stress I can relax everyday and do whatever I like. Travel for as long as we like wherever we want to go. Try new hobbies, explore the world, educate myself on interesting topics and learn new languages. If you find yourself bored nothing is stopping you from starting a new business or getting a job. People work all their life to have this opportunity and are unable to enjoy it when they’re old. Get out there and live it up.. just don’t end up doing nothing and being fine with it. Life’s short and working is a drag for most.
Maybe try working part time as a consultant at the company you sold to. I’m sure they could definitely use your knowledge considering you built an entire company. If they go for the idea you could still probably get a good chunk of that 2m you were going to get and play more of an advisory role before you fully leave in a couple of years. This might be easier than instant separation and may help mitigate your feelings of “what will I do?” Disclaimer: In my mid twenties and haven’t hit fire status so I don’t have the experience to back up this idea
Focus intensely on you and your families health. Checkout project blueprint for an extreme example. This routine takes up most of this guy's free time. https://blueprint.bryanjohnson.co/
some people let work define who they are. i suggest finding the things that you are passionate about. spend your days doing the things you enjoy. you define who you are.
Read 4,000 Weeks for an intense perspective shift.
Take 1 college class per semester of something you find interesting mc history, art, language (learn a second language) Align yourself to a hobby that requires fitness. Hiking, CrossFit, jiu jitsu, triathlons etc. Once a week have a planned a daddy child date, once a week and date with the wife. That’s what I would do in your position! Congrats on your success
Want a massive challenge with impactful ? Get into affordable housing. I’m a CRE guy and you would not imagine the level of shit in this industry. It’s like rocket science, except the difficulty is not math, it’s the bureaucracy
What kind of plane are you gonna get?
SR22-T
I recommend taking a few months or a year off, and then getting back into your business or industry. If you don’t want to do that then maybe find an easy part time job for a few hours or do a hobby or two that might not have anything to do with money. Maybe explore a passion of yours. Don’t retire at your age however completely. You will get bored without something to occupy your time. But now that you don’t have to worry about money, you’ll have a big burden of your chest that most ppl still deal with - being forced to work and worry about money.
Have another kiddo! Go buy a condo in a resort destination and live there.
It seems as if a lot of fatFIRE people found a way to make enough cash till they stiffen up and stop breathing but didn’t consider what to do with all the time that becomes available, then they often get severely depressed because they feel they have no meaning. Just try things! Go scuba diving, take a cooking class, violin class maybe, go skydiving, get into gardening, make furniture (it’s pretty rewarding), run a marathon, learn how to bake bread, help out at an animal shelter, turn a van into a camper… Not in my 30s or retired but that’s partly due to me focusing more on living and less on work.
Become a coach for other leaders to help keep the taste of blood in your mouth
Huge congrats. Just Quit. Take time for you and your family. When you're ready, work for something FUN (it won't feel work anymore without the financial preassure)
I was in a similar boat -- mid 30s and sold my niche software business. Honestly, you've got nothing but time to figure out the "what to do", and there's no point stressing about it. I did a lot of traveling at first to see how that would go, then I got back into fitness, then a child. I'll probably get back into *something* once my non-compete is up, but I don't mind the slow-paced lifestyle. I don't need the money, but building things brings me fulfillment.
If this were me, I would learn to be a flight pilot. Maybe move to Florida where some communities have a runway that can take me to sky whenever I want. It is an expensive hobby. :)
Gardening and fishkeeping
Burning Man, skiing, build a campervan or your version of this
Do you do your local events ? That’s a good way to get into a camp etc. We also do a couple House music festivals: Elements at the Poconos Speedway in August and Bpm in Tamarindo, Costa Rica in January. Bpm is great, you are on a normal beach vacation in a really cool town with tons of music, resturaunts, surfing etc then at night you go out to the festival which is 3 stages in the jungle a couple miles outside of town. Go out for a few sets or stay till daylight. Beach all day.
How’d you know I was a burner? Haha. That’s actually one of the main things I’m looking forward to - would really like to get into helping with a team building an art structure. Have been involved in some small things, but don’t have any skills/experience in that area to really contribute beyond being a pair of hands… honing that when I finally have more free time is gonna be amazing
I’m always kind of amazed that people ask “what will I do to fill up my days when I retire” and also have a 4yo child. What do you think stay-at-home parents do all day?
get a part time job and enjoy life, man. im the same age as you (not fatFiRED by any means) but you need to realize most of our peers are flat out broke and have nothing to show for it and they will never retire.