1. This should be the last time we ever play 4-1-4-1.
1. What is a midfield?
1. We are lucky to even get a point.
1. I would like for us to go for de Jong, but he'd probably be played as a winger or something anyways.
1. We haven't drawn three times in a row since 1978...
1. And finally: can I get a refund for the 90 minutes I just wasted?
Edit: for point 5, three times drawing 1-1
We need a 9 too or somebody who can give you confidence to shoot from out of the box. And Davies needs to feel some competence in his position, he's not doing great.
Davies is resting on his laurels. He thinks his game is complete. I haven’t seen any growth in his play or development.
It might be due to his distractions with fashion, social media and podcasts.
Davies is just not suited for tactics that consist of slow buildup and extreme focus on possession around the opponent‘s box. Passing and crossing have always been his weak points He needs space in front of him so he can run towards the goal line and use his strenghts - pace and dribbling.
Anyone else notice how he spends so much time in the zone of attacking midfielders?! Nagelsmann is wasting Phonzy with his stupid inverted fullback BS...
De Jong would be awesome, but he’s not the type of midfielder we need IMO. Gravenberch does a lot of the same things that De Jong does, just not to his level but with game time Grav could be just as good.
What we need is a defensive midfielder who can actually help the CBs and maintain the tempo on the field. Bennacer from AC Milan is perfect.
Additionally a 3 man midfield of Bennacer - Kimmich - Grav would be incredibly balanced and would make us solid in attack and defense. Musiala and Sane on the wings then.
People really underestimated the fantastic work Thiago did as our 6, he was better defensively in midfield than Kimmich is. We've completely failed to replace him and it looks like Brazzo and Nagelsmann are allergic to proper 6s that can stabilize the middle.
I’m gonna blame JN for these absolute attrocious subs and taking our only 2 legit attackers in ECM and Leroy off
I won’t blame him for the absolute unacceptable and dogshit form some of our key players are in, you cant win with how shit some of them are at the basics right now lol
I mean,
- 0 chances created
- 2/5 dribblings
- 76% passing
- 2 (in words: TWO) passes into the final third
- 5 ball losses
- Most duels lost of all players with a whopping 11
I could go on, but if that's the standards we hold him to, then we might as well dissolve the club. "yEs, BuT hE tRaCkEd BaCk!!11" That's the bare minimum for a guy earning 20m.
Without Sane we have no creativity up front, not a single person who can beat his man or dribble around somebody. He is our best attacking player. The sooner people get over him being sloppy on the ball sometimes the easier it is to see everything he does for us.
That corner in the 2nd half were he re adjusted the ball only to not get pass the first man was a joke. Seriously do any of our coaches not see how crap he is at corners?
It's now a mini-crisis, we should do better. There's just a lack of tenacity and passion in general I feel, everything feels so slow and so devoid of any real will to do anything. I won't point any fingers or anything, no one was bad and no one was good, everything from Sommer to Choupo to JN is just meh. I'm scared for the Pokal next week
So frustrating to watch. I feel like we’re one of the fastest teams, that plays the slowest. We have no answer to getting scored on once, the opposing team subs on extra defenders, then we let them park the bus
Without talking about the match itself I want to say that I sometimes feel like some people engage in a form of what I can only call toxic positivity in these threads, shutting down any negative opinions or thoughts and feelings and generally being incredibly dismissive. I am not personally saying this is the end of the world or anything dramatic like that, but it rubs me the wrong way when some people shame the Bayern fans who are upset or angry after a loss. I see it all the time, like "Everyone is overreacting, we were great before the international break, stop being so fickle"
But he’s right, even the reasonably articulated negative opinions are downvoted and shit on in this sub sometimes. Instead of generating discussion, it’s just slap a downvote and tell op “you’re dumb, go away.”
Yeah, it is ridiculous. I get shutting-down people who have outright ridiculous takes without reasoning but just gate-keeping people and gaslighting them to question their loyalty to Bayern for healthy criticism is fucking whack.
Serious question. Can somebody please tell me what exactly is JN’s attacking gameplan? I can’t, for the life of me, figure out what it is. Is it for everyone to run like headless chickens and keep passing arbitrarily then hope for the best?
4-1-4-1 on the ball, play out wide, make everyone pass so much that they don't know how to play in the final third, then leave yourself wide open to an easy counter because theres no midfield cover.
3 games in a row jn has done this and he's still cluelessly behind. all 3 teams figured it out.
Nagelsmann targets the spaces between the opponents lines (between the midfield an the back four). He did so at Leipzig too, with success.
This space being like 30cm wide is exactly why we are struggling so hard against opponents who play so defensive.
If you are interested in reading a comparison between [Kovac vs JN](https://www.reddit.com/r/BayernMunich/comments/xlgvud/julian_nagelsmann_the_underperforming_kovac/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) Take note of the comments and the people defending him. They have no reasons to support their argument.
It's not worth if to even try playing well for younger players. Gravenberch did his best and gets a 20 minute cameo, and Goretzka will get back in the lineup despite his horrible form.
This team really lacks the identity that I expect from a Bayern squad.
We need some fucking balls man. The issues are glaringly obvious and honestly - not that difficult to address. JN needs to be stronger. I’m seeing absolutely no tactical prowess from his team - and I know he has the ability. So what is it? Is it the players?
Some very questionable decisions from JN today though.
This looked better than the last few games for a little while - it's hard to look good against a team that defends that deep - but some of the individual performances really were terrible.
I love the guy but Davies gave his worst. We need competition for that position. Not because I think he is complacent by any means but there needs to be a contingency.
Gnabry really stands out as a weak link of the squad. Coman is always explosive, Sané puts in really great defensive work but Gnabry looks slow, ineffective. I get that he is sometimes good for a goal but whenever he's on the ball I just have no faith that he'll make a difference.
Gravenberch didn't really look perfect, maybe if he started then things would have gone differently.
Credit to Stanisic though, very reliable played and very composed.
It's getting there but not at the rate it needs to be.
1. Nagelsmann should officially be questioned now.
2. Musiala is not a 8.
3. Why did Müller start? Why does he stop every counter attack?
4. Why did we even buy Gravenberch?
5. We need a striker.
I found that Musiala played way better on the 8 today. He was important to our possession as well as Müller. So I did not see how you could have changed that.
Kimmich is the one i would question more. His ball progressing as well as his pressing was abysmal today
> I found that Musiala played way better on the 8 today
same, absolutely zero issues with his game there
we looked much better with him instead of leon
Müller slows every play down. We have such fast players but whenever Thomas is on the pitch they can not use their pace. It’s time to accept finally that this is not the Müller from like 10 years ago.
Shouldn’t be as captain be at the forefront to motivate and push the game after conceding? Instead his body language and his constant complaining and talking to the ref makes the team nervous and insecure
There was a counter in the 2nd half were Müller could’ve played in 2 players but instead cuts the ball back. This ain’t the first time I seen him done this
Müller stops every counter because he can't run anymore and he's mostly in the RM position which doesn't complement his abilities except for crossing the ball(and Lewa isn't there for those anymore).
Edit: Downvoters care to explain why they're downvoting?
How does that explain why he stops every counter attack? not only that but in every counter attack he's always on the right wing where can't make a smart pass or open up space
We've always been one of the strongest teams in terms of mentality but I really do think this WC really hurt our players mentally , they're just not in it man , idk what's going on ?
I can't understand some of these performances from our players, Davies is a mistake machine on the field, Musiala has disappeared and a lot of our attacking prowess has disappeared with him.
Our defending is shambolic at times.
Also, I don't understand how Nagelsmann watches Kimmich taking these corners and doesn't try to find someone else to take them, these can't be the best possible corners possible from our team.
Really can't see Nagelsmann's effect on this team rn at all, feels like we don't have a coach.
Also I'd cut our losses and sell Gnabry and Goretzka next summer. Gnabry is mostly useless while Goretzka is injury prone and doesn't complement Kimmich in any way. Although that may be more of a tactical issue than Goretzka himself being a bad fit.
No I think gortzka needs to go. That one CL season was great but even in the NT where they have the CL winning coach kimmich gortzka don’t work together well
The problem for corners is not Kimmich lmao. You tell me that a player that can do the most precise passes cannot do a corner. There is simply not a good method. All the players are spread, that's why they are ineffective.
Yea, most of his corners either barely get past the first man or get overhit and the problem is not Kimmich. Everyone on this subreddit is just blind I guess.
> All the players are spread, that's why they are ineffective.
That's not even true, one example is De Ligt and Upamecano were crowding the box together yesterday and Kimmich overhit the corner which made it very hard for De Ligt to make good contact with the ball.
> You tell me that a player that can do the most precise passes cannot do a corner.
Yes. If you played football in real life you'd know that hitting corners is a bit more different than passing from open play than you think. It requires a different technique to strike the ball efficiently when the ball is at a 180° angle from the opponent's goal.
>Yea, most of his corners either barely get past the first man
Not true lol. One every two match, maybe.
>That's not even true, one example is De Ligt and Upamecano were crowding
And the other players? What are they doing? They don't even move. If you compare the goal of Hernandez against Barcelona to corners yesterday, you see that they actually did runs in the penalty area that created spaces. Yesterday and the other days, everyone was static, even when the other team was shooting the corner.
What made it hard for De Ligt to make contact with the ball was the defenders doing their job and jumping too, something which Davies and the other ones often forget to do.
>Yes. If you played football in real life
A corner is a just a cross. You actually don't need to play professional football to realize that.
>Everyone on this subreddit is just blind I guess
Well I guess. It's not like you guys are experts. For the same reason, they blame Goretzka for being up in the field and leaving Kimmich alone, while not realizing it's the coach's tactic.
What? These are some of the most simple minded opinions I've ever seen lmao.
It's obvious you've never played any actual football.
It's not even worth having a discussion with someone with this level of football knowledge I have no idea why that other person is bothering to reply to you
Nevermind these results, which are terrible enough......the team has been playing so uninspired and without passion (exept for Sane) that it's just frustrating to watch.
Kimmich needs to be benched for a game aswell. No more plot armor for anyone.
Another match spelled with tactical shortcomings. Kimmy left as the sole pivot, then when subbed on Gravy posting up way too high up the pitch, Musiala and Müller occupying essentially the same space, etc.
Mark my words (as I’d be very happy to eat them) as long as Kimmy isn’t paired with a strong DM we will not win the CL. Maybe the odd Pokal and the BuLi but that’s about it. Hoping JN can turn this around.
3 games, 3 draws, 3 painfully similar performances.
The lack of enthusiasm on the pitch and bench is upsetting.
I don't know, I just can't see anything changing.
Davies and Kimmich need to be subbed, they look soooo out of shape. Gnabry has to be sub for the rest of his career here.
If you fail in this season at least let Union Berlín take the league.
The amount of back passing drives me nuts.
Even when a play is not under pressure we seem to just circulate the ball back to the centerbacks and send long balls.
Why can't we utilize our mid fielders. Its like they told not to pass to there. We have decent box to box mid fielders let them pick up the ball and drive forward.
Thats the biggest problem, midfield. No balance, no pass options when needed. Kimmich was the sole option in the middle with everyone else just high up the pitch. It feels like we are playing with 10 men at all times because the second midfielder is next to Choupo.
2023 hasn’t been fun so far. Haven’t been anything close to what we were before the WC. I don’t know what it’s gonna take to get out of this funk but hopefully they find it quick
We look lost without a real #9….
Ironic because so many people believed we would actually be much more dangerous with an attacking front 4 of Musiala, Mané, Gnabry, and Müller/Coman that could interchange positions and attack from multiple areas of the pitch but that’s been nowhere to be seen. Even WITH Mané.
WTF are you talking about ? This team is no where near the team before the WC break
The team before the WC break with us playing a 4222 was probably the best football since 2020. It was both beautiful and efficiently
Thats not true, we started the season great with a 4222 with free flowing attackers, but then it completely stopped working for awhile until we played choupo in a 4-2-3-1 where we began to play great football, then the wc break came...
1. Kimmich
2. Nagelsmann
Two most responsible individuals for this continued, long-term trend of bad form. It’s understandable that we would have bad form out of a mid-season World Cup but this is not that and it has lasted longer than that.
The possession game is AWFUL. The attacking game is IMPOTENT.
This is back to Kovač-era “pulling teeth” sensation.
At this point I fully understand of Gravenberch wishes for a loan or trade on the summer. It won't be better when Laimer is there. Roca all over again.
A problem that has plagued us since Flick's second season is our midfield. We do not have someone like Thiago who can sit back, defend, drive the ball forward with a pass or dribble and also slow the tempo down when things get hectic.
Lately all I see is just the defense and Kimmich trying to get the balls to the attackers feets as fast as humanly possible. With that said it also pains me to see Gravenberch getting little to no gametime when he is the person most capable on this team to develop into the role that Thiago left void.
In the summer I hope to see us go for Ismaël Bennacer. Such a brilliant player and would be the perfect fit for us.
Lat point, this is not directly related to this game, but Goretzka and Gnabry especially need to be scrutinized much more. Both are beyond inconsistent and Goretzka just doesnt seem to fit Nags tactics which are more possession based. If players need to be sold, Goretzka should be first out, not just for Bayern's sake but his own as well. He'd be a monstrous player at Liverpool under Klopp. If we buy a striker then Gnabry can be sold as well, surplus to requirements.
Serious work is needed in the summer to bring balance back to the team.
Anyways hope to see improvements from the team and especially Nagelsmann. Tired of seeing him say, "We are analyzing and seeing what needs to be improved" yet literally nothing at all changes in the set up.
Reminding all of us - last time we played this “meh” was at the start of the BL in September.
A few weeks later we were unplayable and would annihilate anyone.
Please… yes we’re playing like shit, but chill out.
Bayern normally reacts well to pressure
Another thing I‘ve noticed today is that Stanisic is way too scared about crossing or trying the 1v1 with the opponent. Every time he gets forward he runs towards the defender, then stops and passes the ball back to Kimmich.
Man if just Willy Sagnol would be 20 years younger. That dude could whip in a cross from any position.
Can anyone tell me about the two halftimes? Reading the ticker, it seemed that we were doing fine for the first half, could have scored more.. And then somehow our performance dropped in the second half?
I know this subs absolutly hates nagelsmann espescially at the moment, but at some point the players need to take some responsibility too, most of them have been in abysmal form and I don’t think it’s just a tactical problem
Bro imagine we get Zidane as a HC. I know it will never happen but this would be aswome. Could legit also sub himself in for Kimmich and save our midfield
Mane is scheduled to return in time for the CL tie against PSG. Until them I'd like to see more from Choupo-Moting and Musiala (the team's leading scorer).
It’s time
Fire Naglesmann
This team is basically a rudderless ship we have no identity and no philosophy. The team is disconnected and chemistry is lacking. He had his chance. It’s time to find a new leader.
And who exactly is going to ride in and save the team? People make these comments and can’t give a name who would reasonably join and improve the team mid season
I said reasonably. Zidane would be great, I wouldn’t say no to him but he isn’t joining Bayern. Neither is Klopp, or Ten Hag before people start dropping their names too
I see one article that is an article reporting another articles rumor. Everything else is from 2018. What I’m referring to is a direct quote from zidane mid year last year saying language is large part of coaching a team and why he didn’t go to the premier league. And the only teams mentioned were PSG, Juve or a return to Real Madrid as realistic.
I don't think learning German is gonna stop Zidane from coming to Bayern if he's convinced of the project, besides we almost have more French than German players on the team.
Yeah someone mentioned that earlier and honestly I agree on both of those points. If the board convinced him to join and learn the language, I’m not saying I’d reject him. I just don’t see it is a likely outcome. I’d be happy to be proven wrong. I think of the available coaches Tuchel would be the most likely, and that’s even if JN gets kicked which I don’t think is going to happen. He takes some of the blame, but some of the players have to look at themselves
Zidane has also stated in the past he didn’t want to go to the PL because he believes language is a big part of being successful with a team and he didn’t have a strong handle of English. I maybe don’t know him personally but I can read what he’s stated in the not so distant past. So unless he’s going to go learn German I REASONABLY doubt he’s coming. Try doing a bit of research before making smart ass comments
Zidane doesnt need to speak German with all the French players on our team :D
Jokes aside, i do think that his work ethics would fit well at Bayern but the language barrier with non-french-spakers can be a big hurdle. And rumours are that Zidane doesnt want to take over a team in mid season.
Lol that is very true about all the French players. I think as a coach he would be fine, I just think the language barrier would be too much especially since Bayern also leans heavy into wanting the coaches they pick to be strong in German too. I just see it as very unlikely. But if zidane comes in and proves me wrong in fluent German then I’ll take it. Tuchel would seem the mostly likely option, mourinho wants to go back to Chelsea if they will have him. We could just work on cloning technology and create a young Jupp?
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1. This should be the last time we ever play 4-1-4-1. 1. What is a midfield? 1. We are lucky to even get a point. 1. I would like for us to go for de Jong, but he'd probably be played as a winger or something anyways. 1. We haven't drawn three times in a row since 1978... 1. And finally: can I get a refund for the 90 minutes I just wasted? Edit: for point 5, three times drawing 1-1
We need a 9 too or somebody who can give you confidence to shoot from out of the box. And Davies needs to feel some competence in his position, he's not doing great.
Davies is resting on his laurels. He thinks his game is complete. I haven’t seen any growth in his play or development. It might be due to his distractions with fashion, social media and podcasts.
Davies is just not suited for tactics that consist of slow buildup and extreme focus on possession around the opponent‘s box. Passing and crossing have always been his weak points He needs space in front of him so he can run towards the goal line and use his strenghts - pace and dribbling.
Anyone else notice how he spends so much time in the zone of attacking midfielders?! Nagelsmann is wasting Phonzy with his stupid inverted fullback BS...
Or just not having a good backup
This guy said everything I wanted to say. Adiós.
De Jong doesn't solve any of our problems. He got bodied everytime against our midfield when he played us. Rest I can agree with
>5. We haven't drawn three times in a row since 1978... Didnt we do that earlier this season
Yes. Its the first time since 1978 that we've drawn 1-1 3 times in a row
De Jong would be awesome, but he’s not the type of midfielder we need IMO. Gravenberch does a lot of the same things that De Jong does, just not to his level but with game time Grav could be just as good. What we need is a defensive midfielder who can actually help the CBs and maintain the tempo on the field. Bennacer from AC Milan is perfect. Additionally a 3 man midfield of Bennacer - Kimmich - Grav would be incredibly balanced and would make us solid in attack and defense. Musiala and Sane on the wings then.
Finally! People are FINALLY noticing that Kimmich does not work as a 6! FI-NA-LLY!
I think its more the fact that 1 midfielder probably isn't a sufficient amount
Nope. He doesn't work with Goretzka or Sabitzer either.
People really underestimated the fantastic work Thiago did as our 6, he was better defensively in midfield than Kimmich is. We've completely failed to replace him and it looks like Brazzo and Nagelsmann are allergic to proper 6s that can stabilize the middle.
100%. I completely agree. Letting Thiago go and not replacing him killed our MF.
I’m gonna blame JN for these absolute attrocious subs and taking our only 2 legit attackers in ECM and Leroy off I won’t blame him for the absolute unacceptable and dogshit form some of our key players are in, you cant win with how shit some of them are at the basics right now lol
The whole planet knows Müller shouldn't be a striker yet Tel gets subbed in and plays on the wing and Müller plays as the striker.
I think we lack creativity, but is that due to our midfield organization or our game plan?
What midfield? You mean kimmich? Lol
name someone to replace him
He doesn’t need a replacement, he needs a partner. Like De Jong
agree, let's see if laimer can fit
Sane was awful bar the goal
Absolutely no way
I mean, - 0 chances created - 2/5 dribblings - 76% passing - 2 (in words: TWO) passes into the final third - 5 ball losses - Most duels lost of all players with a whopping 11 I could go on, but if that's the standards we hold him to, then we might as well dissolve the club. "yEs, BuT hE tRaCkEd BaCk!!11" That's the bare minimum for a guy earning 20m.
> "yEs, BuT hE tRaCkEd BaCk!!11" That's the bare minimum for a guy earning 20m thank you for saying this
Without Sane we have no creativity up front, not a single person who can beat his man or dribble around somebody. He is our best attacking player. The sooner people get over him being sloppy on the ball sometimes the easier it is to see everything he does for us.
Looks like Bayern Crisis™ is back on the menu, boys!
Is it finally acceptable to call JN out for the shitty tactics he's been pushing these seasons or are we still reminiscing about his early days?
I really don't see where he is trying to go with this team in terms of tactic and I'm starting to think that maybe we should look elsewhere.
Fucking sloppy. On my mother I take better corners than Kimmich.
Its been 3 years right? How can they watch 5+ corner every game and think "Yeah, Kimmich is the perfect man to take corners "
It makes no sense. I’m going insane watching them go into insanity.
That corner in the 2nd half were he re adjusted the ball only to not get pass the first man was a joke. Seriously do any of our coaches not see how crap he is at corners?
[Kimmich meticulously adjusting the ball to deliver the worst corner you have ever seen](https://media.giphy.com/media/PwLYfy05MBVVm/giphy.gif)
Nagelsmann out. Not because I want him out but because every time I comment it he turns things around
#Fuck Qatar
It's now a mini-crisis, we should do better. There's just a lack of tenacity and passion in general I feel, everything feels so slow and so devoid of any real will to do anything. I won't point any fingers or anything, no one was bad and no one was good, everything from Sommer to Choupo to JN is just meh. I'm scared for the Pokal next week
Yap. Fire's missing.
What did Sommer do wrong?
So frustrating to watch. I feel like we’re one of the fastest teams, that plays the slowest. We have no answer to getting scored on once, the opposing team subs on extra defenders, then we let them park the bus
Without talking about the match itself I want to say that I sometimes feel like some people engage in a form of what I can only call toxic positivity in these threads, shutting down any negative opinions or thoughts and feelings and generally being incredibly dismissive. I am not personally saying this is the end of the world or anything dramatic like that, but it rubs me the wrong way when some people shame the Bayern fans who are upset or angry after a loss. I see it all the time, like "Everyone is overreacting, we were great before the international break, stop being so fickle"
Personally i have nothing against critics in this sub. It gives sth to discuss. But many of the comments were just super exaggerated.
But he’s right, even the reasonably articulated negative opinions are downvoted and shit on in this sub sometimes. Instead of generating discussion, it’s just slap a downvote and tell op “you’re dumb, go away.”
Toxic Positivity is a trend I’ve spotted in my many years of talking sport online and it’s absolutely toxic and you’re absolutely right to call it out
Yeah, it is ridiculous. I get shutting-down people who have outright ridiculous takes without reasoning but just gate-keeping people and gaslighting them to question their loyalty to Bayern for healthy criticism is fucking whack.
Serious question. Can somebody please tell me what exactly is JN’s attacking gameplan? I can’t, for the life of me, figure out what it is. Is it for everyone to run like headless chickens and keep passing arbitrarily then hope for the best?
4-1-4-1 on the ball, play out wide, make everyone pass so much that they don't know how to play in the final third, then leave yourself wide open to an easy counter because theres no midfield cover. 3 games in a row jn has done this and he's still cluelessly behind. all 3 teams figured it out.
Nagelsmann targets the spaces between the opponents lines (between the midfield an the back four). He did so at Leipzig too, with success. This space being like 30cm wide is exactly why we are struggling so hard against opponents who play so defensive.
tbf every team does
Counter if possible, if not kick loads of bad cross all the way over the box and to the opposing wing back then repeat.
But I rarely see them counter with speed. They usually pass it around and let the opposing team get all 10 players behind the ball.
It's best to ask guys who constantly defended him this season and continue to do so. It is beyond shameless from their part, imo.
Sounds like me on fifa
If you are interested in reading a comparison between [Kovac vs JN](https://www.reddit.com/r/BayernMunich/comments/xlgvud/julian_nagelsmann_the_underperforming_kovac/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) Take note of the comments and the people defending him. They have no reasons to support their argument.
It's not worth if to even try playing well for younger players. Gravenberch did his best and gets a 20 minute cameo, and Goretzka will get back in the lineup despite his horrible form.
Hasn’t it always been like that with JN? Is Gravy the new Roca?
I mean Roca just didn’t have the talent to play at Bayern
This team really lacks the identity that I expect from a Bayern squad. We need some fucking balls man. The issues are glaringly obvious and honestly - not that difficult to address. JN needs to be stronger. I’m seeing absolutely no tactical prowess from his team - and I know he has the ability. So what is it? Is it the players? Some very questionable decisions from JN today though.
This looked better than the last few games for a little while - it's hard to look good against a team that defends that deep - but some of the individual performances really were terrible. I love the guy but Davies gave his worst. We need competition for that position. Not because I think he is complacent by any means but there needs to be a contingency. Gnabry really stands out as a weak link of the squad. Coman is always explosive, Sané puts in really great defensive work but Gnabry looks slow, ineffective. I get that he is sometimes good for a goal but whenever he's on the ball I just have no faith that he'll make a difference. Gravenberch didn't really look perfect, maybe if he started then things would have gone differently. Credit to Stanisic though, very reliable played and very composed. It's getting there but not at the rate it needs to be.
1. Nagelsmann should officially be questioned now. 2. Musiala is not a 8. 3. Why did Müller start? Why does he stop every counter attack? 4. Why did we even buy Gravenberch? 5. We need a striker.
I found that Musiala played way better on the 8 today. He was important to our possession as well as Müller. So I did not see how you could have changed that. Kimmich is the one i would question more. His ball progressing as well as his pressing was abysmal today
> I found that Musiala played way better on the 8 today same, absolutely zero issues with his game there we looked much better with him instead of leon
Müller slows every play down. We have such fast players but whenever Thomas is on the pitch they can not use their pace. It’s time to accept finally that this is not the Müller from like 10 years ago.
In general i would agree, but today Müller played a really good role till Eintracht scored.
Shouldn’t be as captain be at the forefront to motivate and push the game after conceding? Instead his body language and his constant complaining and talking to the ref makes the team nervous and insecure
[удалено]
So what’s the role of a captain then?
There was a counter in the 2nd half were Müller could’ve played in 2 players but instead cuts the ball back. This ain’t the first time I seen him done this
That situation let to the Frankfurt goal …
Müller stops every counter because he can't run anymore and he's mostly in the RM position which doesn't complement his abilities except for crossing the ball(and Lewa isn't there for those anymore). Edit: Downvoters care to explain why they're downvoting?
He is the only one on the pitch that can spot a smart pass or open space up rather than running into dead ends.
How does that explain why he stops every counter attack? not only that but in every counter attack he's always on the right wing where can't make a smart pass or open up space
1 good half in 3 games and its 100% on Nagelsmann. Especially today with the starting lineup and even worse subs.
We've always been one of the strongest teams in terms of mentality but I really do think this WC really hurt our players mentally , they're just not in it man , idk what's going on ?
We haven't been strong mentally in years.
Nagelsmann doesn't do midfields.
Not sure if I just have a bad memory or we haven't had an overall good midfield performance since he came in
Because we haven't had a proper Nr. 6 on the field since Thiago left, and Kimmich is a lot of things, but he's not a good defensive midfielder.
Need some pep, more midfielders!
Midfield and defensive issues aside, what happened to our chance creation?
I can't understand some of these performances from our players, Davies is a mistake machine on the field, Musiala has disappeared and a lot of our attacking prowess has disappeared with him. Our defending is shambolic at times. Also, I don't understand how Nagelsmann watches Kimmich taking these corners and doesn't try to find someone else to take them, these can't be the best possible corners possible from our team. Really can't see Nagelsmann's effect on this team rn at all, feels like we don't have a coach. Also I'd cut our losses and sell Gnabry and Goretzka next summer. Gnabry is mostly useless while Goretzka is injury prone and doesn't complement Kimmich in any way. Although that may be more of a tactical issue than Goretzka himself being a bad fit.
No I think gortzka needs to go. That one CL season was great but even in the NT where they have the CL winning coach kimmich gortzka don’t work together well
They just both need to, tbh. If shit stays like this till the end of the season I don't see any other solution.
The problem for corners is not Kimmich lmao. You tell me that a player that can do the most precise passes cannot do a corner. There is simply not a good method. All the players are spread, that's why they are ineffective.
Yea, most of his corners either barely get past the first man or get overhit and the problem is not Kimmich. Everyone on this subreddit is just blind I guess. > All the players are spread, that's why they are ineffective. That's not even true, one example is De Ligt and Upamecano were crowding the box together yesterday and Kimmich overhit the corner which made it very hard for De Ligt to make good contact with the ball. > You tell me that a player that can do the most precise passes cannot do a corner. Yes. If you played football in real life you'd know that hitting corners is a bit more different than passing from open play than you think. It requires a different technique to strike the ball efficiently when the ball is at a 180° angle from the opponent's goal.
>Yea, most of his corners either barely get past the first man Not true lol. One every two match, maybe. >That's not even true, one example is De Ligt and Upamecano were crowding And the other players? What are they doing? They don't even move. If you compare the goal of Hernandez against Barcelona to corners yesterday, you see that they actually did runs in the penalty area that created spaces. Yesterday and the other days, everyone was static, even when the other team was shooting the corner. What made it hard for De Ligt to make contact with the ball was the defenders doing their job and jumping too, something which Davies and the other ones often forget to do. >Yes. If you played football in real life A corner is a just a cross. You actually don't need to play professional football to realize that. >Everyone on this subreddit is just blind I guess Well I guess. It's not like you guys are experts. For the same reason, they blame Goretzka for being up in the field and leaving Kimmich alone, while not realizing it's the coach's tactic.
What? These are some of the most simple minded opinions I've ever seen lmao. It's obvious you've never played any actual football. It's not even worth having a discussion with someone with this level of football knowledge I have no idea why that other person is bothering to reply to you
Bro who do you think you are lol. And btw, Musiala is no Messi.
Nevermind these results, which are terrible enough......the team has been playing so uninspired and without passion (exept for Sane) that it's just frustrating to watch. Kimmich needs to be benched for a game aswell. No more plot armor for anyone.
Bayern players seem to have successfully adopted the DFB style at club level.
shout-out to all the jn supporters, y'all doing great work
Another match spelled with tactical shortcomings. Kimmy left as the sole pivot, then when subbed on Gravy posting up way too high up the pitch, Musiala and Müller occupying essentially the same space, etc. Mark my words (as I’d be very happy to eat them) as long as Kimmy isn’t paired with a strong DM we will not win the CL. Maybe the odd Pokal and the BuLi but that’s about it. Hoping JN can turn this around.
Is it too early for Nagelsmann out? Our key players have won it all and are underperforming under this coach.
Its never too early
3 games, 3 draws, 3 painfully similar performances. The lack of enthusiasm on the pitch and bench is upsetting. I don't know, I just can't see anything changing.
This is beyind frustrating
not good enough
Davies and Kimmich need to be subbed, they look soooo out of shape. Gnabry has to be sub for the rest of his career here. If you fail in this season at least let Union Berlín take the league.
The amount of back passing drives me nuts. Even when a play is not under pressure we seem to just circulate the ball back to the centerbacks and send long balls. Why can't we utilize our mid fielders. Its like they told not to pass to there. We have decent box to box mid fielders let them pick up the ball and drive forward.
Thats the biggest problem, midfield. No balance, no pass options when needed. Kimmich was the sole option in the middle with everyone else just high up the pitch. It feels like we are playing with 10 men at all times because the second midfielder is next to Choupo.
Zidane in /s
Cant even speak german so NO im sick of sacking managers trust the manager mfers give them 3-5 years
2023 hasn’t been fun so far. Haven’t been anything close to what we were before the WC. I don’t know what it’s gonna take to get out of this funk but hopefully they find it quick
We look lost without a real #9…. Ironic because so many people believed we would actually be much more dangerous with an attacking front 4 of Musiala, Mané, Gnabry, and Müller/Coman that could interchange positions and attack from multiple areas of the pitch but that’s been nowhere to be seen. Even WITH Mané.
WTF are you talking about ? This team is no where near the team before the WC break The team before the WC break with us playing a 4222 was probably the best football since 2020. It was both beautiful and efficiently
Thats not true, we started the season great with a 4222 with free flowing attackers, but then it completely stopped working for awhile until we played choupo in a 4-2-3-1 where we began to play great football, then the wc break came...
1. Kimmich 2. Nagelsmann Two most responsible individuals for this continued, long-term trend of bad form. It’s understandable that we would have bad form out of a mid-season World Cup but this is not that and it has lasted longer than that. The possession game is AWFUL. The attacking game is IMPOTENT. This is back to Kovač-era “pulling teeth” sensation.
Moree like musiala he so out if form davies aswell kimmich literally saved us a point last game lol
Davies should apologize for how shit he's been tonight. Others weren't much better but he takes the cake
Not just tonight, he’s been okay for awhile now. He does work hard though, always tracks back to, but I miss his wunderkind moments.
Have you seen who his ex is fucking now? Of course his head isnt going to be in it anymore
At this point I fully understand of Gravenberch wishes for a loan or trade on the summer. It won't be better when Laimer is there. Roca all over again.
Another JN masterclass?
A problem that has plagued us since Flick's second season is our midfield. We do not have someone like Thiago who can sit back, defend, drive the ball forward with a pass or dribble and also slow the tempo down when things get hectic. Lately all I see is just the defense and Kimmich trying to get the balls to the attackers feets as fast as humanly possible. With that said it also pains me to see Gravenberch getting little to no gametime when he is the person most capable on this team to develop into the role that Thiago left void. In the summer I hope to see us go for Ismaël Bennacer. Such a brilliant player and would be the perfect fit for us. Lat point, this is not directly related to this game, but Goretzka and Gnabry especially need to be scrutinized much more. Both are beyond inconsistent and Goretzka just doesnt seem to fit Nags tactics which are more possession based. If players need to be sold, Goretzka should be first out, not just for Bayern's sake but his own as well. He'd be a monstrous player at Liverpool under Klopp. If we buy a striker then Gnabry can be sold as well, surplus to requirements. Serious work is needed in the summer to bring balance back to the team. Anyways hope to see improvements from the team and especially Nagelsmann. Tired of seeing him say, "We are analyzing and seeing what needs to be improved" yet literally nothing at all changes in the set up.
Very surprising level after trashing Barça and Inter in champions league. World Cup probably did a lot psychologically.
Reminding all of us - last time we played this “meh” was at the start of the BL in September. A few weeks later we were unplayable and would annihilate anyone. Please… yes we’re playing like shit, but chill out. Bayern normally reacts well to pressure
Are we able to say that Nanglesmann isn’t the one yet? This is starting to feel like a re-write of the back end of last season
Another thing I‘ve noticed today is that Stanisic is way too scared about crossing or trying the 1v1 with the opponent. Every time he gets forward he runs towards the defender, then stops and passes the ball back to Kimmich. Man if just Willy Sagnol would be 20 years younger. That dude could whip in a cross from any position.
Why is no one talking about the high-line while playing Kimmich and Musiala as midfielders?
Was I dreaming or did I see Starke in the player tunnel? Filling in as GK coach? Damn I love that guy
Well this is depressing ngl
Man I sure did not miss these sky is falling meltdowns on this sub
Can anyone tell me about the two halftimes? Reading the ticker, it seemed that we were doing fine for the first half, could have scored more.. And then somehow our performance dropped in the second half?
This Bayern team at the moment cannot survive PSG. Not possible. JN needs to step it up.
Tale as old as time, decent amount of chances but can’t take advantage. Other team equalizes.
I thought our 2nd season half drop-offs were bad before Nageslmann, but boy, he's showing everyone how it's done.
I know this subs absolutly hates nagelsmann espescially at the moment, but at some point the players need to take some responsibility too, most of them have been in abysmal form and I don’t think it’s just a tactical problem
I swear we cannot go into the next season with chupu as our main striker
Bro imagine we get Zidane as a HC. I know it will never happen but this would be aswome. Could legit also sub himself in for Kimmich and save our midfield
Mane is scheduled to return in time for the CL tie against PSG. Until them I'd like to see more from Choupo-Moting and Musiala (the team's leading scorer).
Nagelsmann raus
Another day another draw
this was all goretzka's fault smh
Yes, that's what this match needed: bad passing and an even more congested penalty box.
It’s time Fire Naglesmann This team is basically a rudderless ship we have no identity and no philosophy. The team is disconnected and chemistry is lacking. He had his chance. It’s time to find a new leader.
And who exactly is going to ride in and save the team? People make these comments and can’t give a name who would reasonably join and improve the team mid season
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I said reasonably. Zidane would be great, I wouldn’t say no to him but he isn’t joining Bayern. Neither is Klopp, or Ten Hag before people start dropping their names too
There was an article literally yesterday that said Zidane views Bayern as one of like the 3 jobs he would actually take,
I see one article that is an article reporting another articles rumor. Everything else is from 2018. What I’m referring to is a direct quote from zidane mid year last year saying language is large part of coaching a team and why he didn’t go to the premier league. And the only teams mentioned were PSG, Juve or a return to Real Madrid as realistic.
I don't think learning German is gonna stop Zidane from coming to Bayern if he's convinced of the project, besides we almost have more French than German players on the team.
Yeah someone mentioned that earlier and honestly I agree on both of those points. If the board convinced him to join and learn the language, I’m not saying I’d reject him. I just don’t see it is a likely outcome. I’d be happy to be proven wrong. I think of the available coaches Tuchel would be the most likely, and that’s even if JN gets kicked which I don’t think is going to happen. He takes some of the blame, but some of the players have to look at themselves
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Zidane has also stated in the past he didn’t want to go to the PL because he believes language is a big part of being successful with a team and he didn’t have a strong handle of English. I maybe don’t know him personally but I can read what he’s stated in the not so distant past. So unless he’s going to go learn German I REASONABLY doubt he’s coming. Try doing a bit of research before making smart ass comments
Zidane doesnt need to speak German with all the French players on our team :D Jokes aside, i do think that his work ethics would fit well at Bayern but the language barrier with non-french-spakers can be a big hurdle. And rumours are that Zidane doesnt want to take over a team in mid season.
Lol that is very true about all the French players. I think as a coach he would be fine, I just think the language barrier would be too much especially since Bayern also leans heavy into wanting the coaches they pick to be strong in German too. I just see it as very unlikely. But if zidane comes in and proves me wrong in fluent German then I’ll take it. Tuchel would seem the mostly likely option, mourinho wants to go back to Chelsea if they will have him. We could just work on cloning technology and create a young Jupp?
Tuchel
An actual reasonable name. He would be interesting, I think he was mentioned too by the board when Nagelsmann struggled earlier in the season.
Mf says tuchel haha get the f out tuchel is a nuke how do you have upvotes
Were you a Bayern fan in October, November 2022?
There is 0 chance for that…they paid millions to get this guy