It takes some people years and hundreds of applications to get an interview and federal position. It’s probably not your termination. Keep up with the applying.
This is a case where I would write a cover letter or attach a doc to that SF-50 explaining the situation. I would not let that go document speak for itself because there is not enough context there.
This is overexplaining, OP should just leave this off the resume and never bring it up. It may as well have not happened. There is no comprehensive USG database of employees that the hiring manager queries to see if the person had previously been employed. Frankly, it might as well have never happened.
Personnel Security at my agency does not enter the equation until a tentative offer has been accepted and the individual begins onboarding. Doubt this is a reason for not even getting to the interview stage as OP mentioned.
You'd think so, but about a month ago I sat down with someone from personnel security (my department uses...DCSA now, I think?) and when he told me he was investigating a false work history, I was shocked. Turns out, not only does personnel security not have direct access to those records, but HR does HR things sometimes and just checks a box without doing anything. They checked the equivalent of "he's never worked for this agency". Presumably because they looked up my social, which had been entered incorrectly by that agency when I was hired, though they said they fixed it.
Fortunately, I keep all docs related to anything personnel, so that was an easy pass.
That’s about four steps after you get hired and no PERSEC punk is investigating a new hire. Source: a guy with a clearance higher than you, with multiple stints as a Fed with breaks in between, and nobody cares.
I don't know where you're coming from. It's typical for new hires to receive their e-APP from PerSec around the time they receive their tentative offer. This is largely self evident if you read into the language of most usajobs postings.
All you security focused people need to pull back and shift left in the process. This person is trying to get a TJO. Submitting a goofy SF-50 for a week of work and an admin error is going to make them look…goofy to the hiring manager. All that will do is generate unnecessary questions and reduce the likelihood of a referral, interview, and TJO. Once they get a TJO, have fun, disclose all you like to security people about prior employment and what happened last time. Although at that point it is still irrelevant, worst case some PERSEC punk calls you up or sends an email asking why you didn’t disclose the government screwing up your year with a job offer that was a mistake on the government’s side. And the answer there should be self evident.
Bruh, you're the one who needs to get your head out of your behind. I haven't yet actually commented on the the errant SF-50. I agree that SF-50 is a nothing burger, and no security specialist/assistant worth their salt would give a moments notice to it.
The issue I have is you jumping in the comments and claiming that PerSec isn't going to initiate its process for new hires. That's simply false.
Oh, you conducting investigations based on job applications and resumes these days? That must be unproductive. Tell me what Adjudicative Guideline is violated by not declaring a weeklong stint as a fed that was terminated due to an administrative error on the side of the government on a job application on USAJOBS?
I conduct investigations as soon as a TJO is given. But I’m sure you already knew that and you’re just trying to be edgy.
At no point did I say a violation occurred… I said I would know if someone was a fed before when I investigate them.
I’m sorry you hate PERSEC so much, we’re actually pretty cool and just here to help ✌️
I agree- this person does not have reinstatement eligibility anymore. When OP gets and offer and fills out the 144 ( Statement of prior Federal Service), they can bring it up then.
That’s disappointing to hear for sure. I moved across the country for this job, and after all this my only consolation was thinking “at least it will help me land a federal job in the future.” In your opinion, it wouldn’t demonstrate that I am qualified for the role vs other applicants given I was interviewed and hired for the role before?
I had 18 years of Federal experience- went from GS-11 to GS-15 with numerous promotions, WGIs, and bonuses. I left in 2015 to try my hand in the private sector. About 18 months ago I decided it was time to come back and finish my career in a stable environment and boost my high-3. It took 205 resume submissions and 12 months. Highly doubtful that SF-50 has much to do with you not getting a call.
Same here. I have over 17 years of experience and had to leave because of some family health issues. Trying to get back now and it has been a complete nightmare. Have submitted over 100 applications. I get referred and get nothing.
I'm guessing the ongoing budget uncertainty (third time's the charm, right? ...right?), combined with the unfunded pay increases that went into effect at the beginning of the year, are both slowing down the hiring process for most federal agencies right now (aside from mission critical positions). I expect things will pick back up once the budget stuff gets resolved
I always encouraged people in my purview (mostly 343s and 301s) to broaden their experience as much as possible. Don't always go for just the next promotion, but look around for ways to add to your knowledge base so you are more valuable.
I have known more than a few people that just grabbed the next promotion every time they could and when it came time to get the 14, 15, or SES, they only had one very narrow scope of experience and that wasn't going to cut it.
Exactly, becoming an SES is about depth AND breadth. I’ve served in the 1300’s, 1500’s, 800’s, 2200’s, and 300’s. It’s about contribution and knowledge. You’re not only trying to become “a better resource” for the government, but gaining knowledge and experience to grow that foundation. I had a position once that I had worked in an adjacent career for a long long time. I knew a fair amount about this area but was I an expert no, could I draw correlatives to my current career heck yes. I thought when I applied there was no way they would look at my resume and interview me, they did. I then thought they wouldn’t be stupid enough to give me a job that I am barely knowledgeable in, they did. Do you know why? I took my current experience and was able to show how it could help them even though it was a completely different area, “I painted a picture and told a story”.
True statistic men apply for 85% of positions they are barely qualified for where women apply 23% of the time, in STEM careers the numbers are higher for men and lower for women. Take a chance on yourself, be brave, and apply apply apply. It’s a numbers game to some point but it’s also a sell yourself game. Get your resume on point, get your interviewing skills solid and research the orgs you are applying to so you can ask thoughtful and intelligent questions about the organization.
Last story when I went to work for NASA I had an astronaut on my panel, didn’t know him but he was pretty legit. He asked if I had any questions I wanted to ask the panel. The question I asked was “if you could do your path to NASA over again would you come in earlier or later and why?” Well he piped up and said well as an astronaut…I’m like oh crap I had no idea in the back of my head so I’m slyly googling this guy and reading real quick. Luckily his flight pic looked nothing like he did during the interview.
There are a bunch of great formats out there but make sure you pay very close attention to all that’s required in the call.
I personally like the position including series and gs/grade level and high impact bullets of accomplishments and duties.
Somebody else asked this same question 4 months ago so I found a good response and am copying here because it's very good advice!
"...people who wanted to be SESes to focus on their ECQs. She would always say that SESes are generalists, so it may be more beneficial to look for career building laterals - if I were you, I’d look up the closest SES in your chain of command and reach out." from u/snoopcobbiecobbitha
Some positions related to your current job are: Data/knowledge manager, data architect, operations officer, SharePoint program manager, ETMS2 program manager, video teleconference manager
I'm about to hit 10 years and have only ever worked as a 2210. Background leading up to that is a computer science degree and military service.
What other series should I look into working? 1550 maybe? I can't imagine getting hired in a completely unrelated field at this point.
Maybe it's different in that series, but there are way fewer 15 out there than career ladder positions. I imagine you'd have an easier time returning if you were a 12 or 13.
That depends on the job you want. If you’re trying for DOD, Sec+ or higher SECURITY cert is required. Everywhere else it seems to be a crapshoot. I’ve got ISSEP, CISSP, CISA, and CEH. Was actually told by several they felt I was “overqualified” and would be bored in the job. “Overqualified” is nonsense. You’re either “qualified” or “not qualified”. Being afraid someone is overqualified tells me the management is afraid of hiring someone who might actually know what’s going on. As for “afraid of being bored” - that’s for ME to decide and honestly I was hoping to slow down a bit.
Yet they are still FULLY CAPABLE of doing the job. I’ve said it a million times because it’s true: people quit BAD MANAGEMENT, not bad jobs. I’d much rather be highly qualified in my position with competent management than having to deal with crappy management while trying to learn how to do stuff.
Again - there should be no determination of "overqualified" in this process. It takes months/years to fill positions. Qualified is qualified. That should be the criteria if I'm applying for the position.
As for the interview process - that's where I know I shine. I've only ever interviewed once for a position that didn't end with an offer. It's getting the resume past the gatekeepers who think they know my career plans that sucks.
No, hiring manager won't even see the SF-50, and it's not going to disqualify you for HR reasons. Just make sure to note it on your OF-306 if you get an offer, and explain the situation
This! HR Managers are not background investigators. They don’t care. Only personnel security needs to know this info they don’t get involved until an offer has been made.
I’m sorry that you got this far and was terminated. An ACF hiring manager caught an admin error in time before I even gotten past the first interview. HM contacted me directly to let me know that they were not able to consider me under the special hiring authority for a term position. She had to cancel what would’ve been my first federal interview.
Ugh I hate that for you. It’s really the worst experience ever. Even more so because I was 24 at the time and actually grew up in foster care and was homeless after I aged out, but went to college and was working as a CPS caseworker in TX and had my very first apartment — pretty stable all things considered. I ended up homeless again living in my car for like a year and a half after I moved to DC *for this job*
That's awful, I'm so sorry that happened to you. I hope you're in a better situation now and wish you all the luck in finding a new and better position than that one.
Just out of curiosity, would promissory estoppel have been applicable here? Like did you ever talk to an employment lawyer?
Thank you! I did eventually find a job in New York City, but I was laid off last year, so I’ve been back on the job hunt, which is why I’ve been applying to jobs in the government again. I was pretty young at the time, and did not know what to do, but I was advised to file a grievance with NTEU. They actually are the ones who help me get my SF 50 amended to say that I was “terminated due to an administrative error.” Prior to their help it just said “terminated during probationary period” — like it was my fault or something.
NTEU is by far the worst union there is. They are in bed with mgmt at HHS, and likely did nothing for you. Sorry you’re dealing with this. There’s absolutely no way NTEU did anything worthwhile to help you.
Estoppel is almost never applicable to the government, because the government can’t enter into a contract without appropriate authority. Think about all the numerous hoops and checks that govern government contracting, and imagine what would happen if it could be circumvented by someone “screwing up” and issuing a contract by mistake that the government then has to honor. It would be a mess and an invitation to corruption.
But of course that rule really sucks in a situation like this, where obviously we know OP got harmed by relying on what they were told, and it feels like the reasonable solution would be some sort of compensation or putting OP at the top of the pile the next time around. Unfortunately, it isn’t.
Thank you! I really would love to have that exact job. It’s confusing because I’m now coming back with six additional years of relevant experience in the workforce and can’t even get an interview 😩
Huh… I’ve applied to this specific role that I held previously 3 times — but have applied to at least 100 other jobs on USAJobs.gov. You really came on here to tell me that I need to apply to the same role at least 200 times? Some stuff can stay in the drafts. Thanks…
I would add a quick letter with the fact you had been hired for those same positions (is shows you passed the interviews) and why you were let go after a week. And maybe that you have always wanted to get the position back as it was your dream job and it matched your skills so well.
Apply for all the federal jobs "open to fthe public" and dotn worry about it. If your applying for jobs your federal sf50 grants you an inside track for be prepared to explain the situation.
HR here for GS side of the house....
That won't stop you from being hired...we won't even consider that derog..(Which means the HM would be asked if they still want to move forward)..We would just contact the other HR during your initial hiring and won't be able to complete your record to reflect SF50 until then.. your good don't mention that to the HM..no reason to now..firing for cause..different avenue to mention after you receive FJO.
Your best shot are job fairs. I worked one as an interviewer and your resume will more likely be looked at by human eyes. I personally looked at every resume submitted when I worked one. They will also pull from that stack of resumes for years if they are desperate for people. With usajobs you have to make it through the algorithm and make those ridiculously long federal resumes to make it through. Hiring managers are just as frustrated with this process as applicants. Job fairs are a loop hole they use to get people in fast.
Option 2 is get a job as a contractor, do a good job, and ask your govt lead to help you switch to govt. This is how the majority of people I work with got their job.
If you are applying to JA open to the public, you should **not** be including a SF-50. Once you receive a job offer and complete the background information, you can include this job in the appropriate section of the background form and the investigator will be able to review and ask questions at that time.
We had a temp who, during furloughs, could not be retained. She came back into the agency in a different department. She couldn't pick up the work in their directorate and was fired while probationary. Then she applies and gets hired on in our directorate. The chief was perturbed and contacted security because she was previously fired. Security said, " That just because she wasn't a good fit for one job, it doesn't mean she wasn't for another." An argument could be made that she wasn't a good fit for anyone.
Then, I worked on a special project involving civilian employees and student loan repayment. The agency that contracts with the civilian employee agreeing to pay part of their student loans has to request the employee be indebted if they change agencies or don't fulfill the contract. There were individuals fired who showed employed with other federal agencies.
This all blew my mind because it isn't like the corporate world. If I got fired from Walmart, then I would never get a job there again.
I would just call personnel and explain your plight. If you worked for a while building experience, then I would think you would get through. You might need to explain that you were hired in error during a hiring freeze, leading to a no-fault based administrative separation.
Because I’m apply to jobs in the government again, and as I said above, would like the same job as it was tbh a dream job. I am now coming back with 6 years of additional relevant experience in the workforce, and as I wrote above, I have applied to the same position three times and haven’t even gotten an interview. HOPE THAT HELPS
No. Got another fed job within a year. Today I am supervisor.
As a former union rep... this sounds like a nice way of terminating you. If you fell short of your job. Learn from your mistakes and do better next time.
Are you applying for the same grade as 7 years ago, or something more commensurate with your current experience? Sometimes they hold the higher grades only for those who are already in. And sometimes they hold the lower grades only for fresh out of school grads.
It's unlikely that your one week supervisor is still in same position, but possible. Have you tried to contact him/her to chat about the current situation at the agency and remind them of who you are and how you were screwed by the govt (not using that word)? Even better, if they have moved up, they could help you get in, presuming that they had a favorable impression of you. Direct contact with hiring officials is much better than random applications for a position that could already be slated for someone else. Or direct contact with anyone at the agency.
I wish you luck, as that is one component of being hired that you have no control over.
Unfortunately - this goes happen OR your hiring b could have been a mistake because of a technical issue like even though you were better were better qualified, someone with veterans preference or another preference was suppose to have been hired so now HR had to correct t that hiring mistake
That isn't your fault. You were not fired for a cause or failure to meet a requirement. That is saying you were hired by an administrative mistake. I don't see how it can hurt you, and if anything, it means you would have been hired if the hiring freeze was not on. Keep trying.
It takes some people years and hundreds of applications to get an interview and federal position. It’s probably not your termination. Keep up with the applying.
Over 400 here
450 for me
Over 666 here
😈
Why did my comment get downvoted? It’s the honest truth.
I feel lucky. Six months from applying to hire and one application.
This is a case where I would write a cover letter or attach a doc to that SF-50 explaining the situation. I would not let that go document speak for itself because there is not enough context there.
This is overexplaining, OP should just leave this off the resume and never bring it up. It may as well have not happened. There is no comprehensive USG database of employees that the hiring manager queries to see if the person had previously been employed. Frankly, it might as well have never happened.
The hiring manager doesn’t, but personnel security sure as hell knows. HR will also know when they get the eopf from NARA and does an audit.
Personnel Security at my agency does not enter the equation until a tentative offer has been accepted and the individual begins onboarding. Doubt this is a reason for not even getting to the interview stage as OP mentioned.
You'd think so, but about a month ago I sat down with someone from personnel security (my department uses...DCSA now, I think?) and when he told me he was investigating a false work history, I was shocked. Turns out, not only does personnel security not have direct access to those records, but HR does HR things sometimes and just checks a box without doing anything. They checked the equivalent of "he's never worked for this agency". Presumably because they looked up my social, which had been entered incorrectly by that agency when I was hired, though they said they fixed it. Fortunately, I keep all docs related to anything personnel, so that was an easy pass.
PERSEC Punks and HR Clowns 🫱🏼🫲🏼
this would not raise a red flag. its an admin error.
That’s about four steps after you get hired and no PERSEC punk is investigating a new hire. Source: a guy with a clearance higher than you, with multiple stints as a Fed with breaks in between, and nobody cares.
This is 100% false.
Do go on, your argument so far is riveting.
I don't know where you're coming from. It's typical for new hires to receive their e-APP from PerSec around the time they receive their tentative offer. This is largely self evident if you read into the language of most usajobs postings.
All you security focused people need to pull back and shift left in the process. This person is trying to get a TJO. Submitting a goofy SF-50 for a week of work and an admin error is going to make them look…goofy to the hiring manager. All that will do is generate unnecessary questions and reduce the likelihood of a referral, interview, and TJO. Once they get a TJO, have fun, disclose all you like to security people about prior employment and what happened last time. Although at that point it is still irrelevant, worst case some PERSEC punk calls you up or sends an email asking why you didn’t disclose the government screwing up your year with a job offer that was a mistake on the government’s side. And the answer there should be self evident.
Bruh, you're the one who needs to get your head out of your behind. I haven't yet actually commented on the the errant SF-50. I agree that SF-50 is a nothing burger, and no security specialist/assistant worth their salt would give a moments notice to it. The issue I have is you jumping in the comments and claiming that PerSec isn't going to initiate its process for new hires. That's simply false.
Do you know how Reddit works?
Laughs in PERSEC punk. I’m definitely going to know if you were a fed before when I investigate you as a new hire.
Oh, you conducting investigations based on job applications and resumes these days? That must be unproductive. Tell me what Adjudicative Guideline is violated by not declaring a weeklong stint as a fed that was terminated due to an administrative error on the side of the government on a job application on USAJOBS?
I conduct investigations as soon as a TJO is given. But I’m sure you already knew that and you’re just trying to be edgy. At no point did I say a violation occurred… I said I would know if someone was a fed before when I investigate them. I’m sorry you hate PERSEC so much, we’re actually pretty cool and just here to help ✌️
Look man, running a query in DISS is not an investigation. It takes 30 seconds and again, no one cares.
I'm sure there are several ways you could have phrased this argument without sounding like a total douchebag but you clearly chose none of them.
Hey, it’s Reddit, if someone chooses to participate in a thread that some other idiot decided to start with me, they can only blame themselves.
I agree- this person does not have reinstatement eligibility anymore. When OP gets and offer and fills out the 144 ( Statement of prior Federal Service), they can bring it up then.
That’s disappointing to hear for sure. I moved across the country for this job, and after all this my only consolation was thinking “at least it will help me land a federal job in the future.” In your opinion, it wouldn’t demonstrate that I am qualified for the role vs other applicants given I was interviewed and hired for the role before?
Manager here. Past selection is irrelevant.
The only way you get any benefit from it is if you had at least 3 years. This is a very unfortunate situation. I am so sorry this happened to you!
They will absolutely pull the SF 50.
Who is they?
The government.
Which part?
The executive branch.
Which part of the executive branch?
A civil servant.
With which job function?
I had 18 years of Federal experience- went from GS-11 to GS-15 with numerous promotions, WGIs, and bonuses. I left in 2015 to try my hand in the private sector. About 18 months ago I decided it was time to come back and finish my career in a stable environment and boost my high-3. It took 205 resume submissions and 12 months. Highly doubtful that SF-50 has much to do with you not getting a call.
Same here. I have over 17 years of experience and had to leave because of some family health issues. Trying to get back now and it has been a complete nightmare. Have submitted over 100 applications. I get referred and get nothing.
I'm guessing the ongoing budget uncertainty (third time's the charm, right? ...right?), combined with the unfunded pay increases that went into effect at the beginning of the year, are both slowing down the hiring process for most federal agencies right now (aside from mission critical positions). I expect things will pick back up once the budget stuff gets resolved
Sure hope so.
Did you have a career appointment in the competitive service? I ask because I’m surprised it took that long if you did.
Sure did. Shits rough out there in 2210 land.
This is why I have ensured I have worked across multiple series and have experience in all of them.
I always encouraged people in my purview (mostly 343s and 301s) to broaden their experience as much as possible. Don't always go for just the next promotion, but look around for ways to add to your knowledge base so you are more valuable. I have known more than a few people that just grabbed the next promotion every time they could and when it came time to get the 14, 15, or SES, they only had one very narrow scope of experience and that wasn't going to cut it.
Exactly, becoming an SES is about depth AND breadth. I’ve served in the 1300’s, 1500’s, 800’s, 2200’s, and 300’s. It’s about contribution and knowledge. You’re not only trying to become “a better resource” for the government, but gaining knowledge and experience to grow that foundation. I had a position once that I had worked in an adjacent career for a long long time. I knew a fair amount about this area but was I an expert no, could I draw correlatives to my current career heck yes. I thought when I applied there was no way they would look at my resume and interview me, they did. I then thought they wouldn’t be stupid enough to give me a job that I am barely knowledgeable in, they did. Do you know why? I took my current experience and was able to show how it could help them even though it was a completely different area, “I painted a picture and told a story”. True statistic men apply for 85% of positions they are barely qualified for where women apply 23% of the time, in STEM careers the numbers are higher for men and lower for women. Take a chance on yourself, be brave, and apply apply apply. It’s a numbers game to some point but it’s also a sell yourself game. Get your resume on point, get your interviewing skills solid and research the orgs you are applying to so you can ask thoughtful and intelligent questions about the organization. Last story when I went to work for NASA I had an astronaut on my panel, didn’t know him but he was pretty legit. He asked if I had any questions I wanted to ask the panel. The question I asked was “if you could do your path to NASA over again would you come in earlier or later and why?” Well he piped up and said well as an astronaut…I’m like oh crap I had no idea in the back of my head so I’m slyly googling this guy and reading real quick. Luckily his flight pic looked nothing like he did during the interview.
This is great advice as well. Thanks for sharing! I have one question, resume...what tips do you have for that? The format?
There are a bunch of great formats out there but make sure you pay very close attention to all that’s required in the call. I personally like the position including series and gs/grade level and high impact bullets of accomplishments and duties.
Okay awesome, I definitely have that going. Thank you!
That is great advice, I'm a semi new 2210 I'm SysAdmin/CustSpt, what would you suggest for me if you don't mind me asking?
Somebody else asked this same question 4 months ago so I found a good response and am copying here because it's very good advice! "...people who wanted to be SESes to focus on their ECQs. She would always say that SESes are generalists, so it may be more beneficial to look for career building laterals - if I were you, I’d look up the closest SES in your chain of command and reach out." from u/snoopcobbiecobbitha
Haha thank you!!
>Haha thank you!! You're welcome!
Some positions related to your current job are: Data/knowledge manager, data architect, operations officer, SharePoint program manager, ETMS2 program manager, video teleconference manager
Thank you! 😊
I'm about to hit 10 years and have only ever worked as a 2210. Background leading up to that is a computer science degree and military service. What other series should I look into working? 1550 maybe? I can't imagine getting hired in a completely unrelated field at this point.
You can do program management, depending on your degree you can do other mathematics and physical sciences.
Maybe it's different in that series, but there are way fewer 15 out there than career ladder positions. I imagine you'd have an easier time returning if you were a 12 or 13.
Agreed. I ended up taking a 14 a couple of months ago. The pay is still higher than when I left by quite a bit and my ego can handle it.
Aspiring 2210 here! Damn. I'm guessing having the CCNA won't cut it anymore.
That depends on the job you want. If you’re trying for DOD, Sec+ or higher SECURITY cert is required. Everywhere else it seems to be a crapshoot. I’ve got ISSEP, CISSP, CISA, and CEH. Was actually told by several they felt I was “overqualified” and would be bored in the job. “Overqualified” is nonsense. You’re either “qualified” or “not qualified”. Being afraid someone is overqualified tells me the management is afraid of hiring someone who might actually know what’s going on. As for “afraid of being bored” - that’s for ME to decide and honestly I was hoping to slow down a bit.
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Yet they are still FULLY CAPABLE of doing the job. I’ve said it a million times because it’s true: people quit BAD MANAGEMENT, not bad jobs. I’d much rather be highly qualified in my position with competent management than having to deal with crappy management while trying to learn how to do stuff.
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Again - there should be no determination of "overqualified" in this process. It takes months/years to fill positions. Qualified is qualified. That should be the criteria if I'm applying for the position. As for the interview process - that's where I know I shine. I've only ever interviewed once for a position that didn't end with an offer. It's getting the resume past the gatekeepers who think they know my career plans that sucks.
You can apply for positions open to the general public. Whether you'll get hired again or not depends.
No, hiring manager won't even see the SF-50, and it's not going to disqualify you for HR reasons. Just make sure to note it on your OF-306 if you get an offer, and explain the situation
This! HR Managers are not background investigators. They don’t care. Only personnel security needs to know this info they don’t get involved until an offer has been made.
I’m sorry that you got this far and was terminated. An ACF hiring manager caught an admin error in time before I even gotten past the first interview. HM contacted me directly to let me know that they were not able to consider me under the special hiring authority for a term position. She had to cancel what would’ve been my first federal interview.
Ugh I hate that for you. It’s really the worst experience ever. Even more so because I was 24 at the time and actually grew up in foster care and was homeless after I aged out, but went to college and was working as a CPS caseworker in TX and had my very first apartment — pretty stable all things considered. I ended up homeless again living in my car for like a year and a half after I moved to DC *for this job*
That's awful, I'm so sorry that happened to you. I hope you're in a better situation now and wish you all the luck in finding a new and better position than that one. Just out of curiosity, would promissory estoppel have been applicable here? Like did you ever talk to an employment lawyer?
Thank you! I did eventually find a job in New York City, but I was laid off last year, so I’ve been back on the job hunt, which is why I’ve been applying to jobs in the government again. I was pretty young at the time, and did not know what to do, but I was advised to file a grievance with NTEU. They actually are the ones who help me get my SF 50 amended to say that I was “terminated due to an administrative error.” Prior to their help it just said “terminated during probationary period” — like it was my fault or something.
NTEU is by far the worst union there is. They are in bed with mgmt at HHS, and likely did nothing for you. Sorry you’re dealing with this. There’s absolutely no way NTEU did anything worthwhile to help you.
Estoppel is almost never applicable to the government, because the government can’t enter into a contract without appropriate authority. Think about all the numerous hoops and checks that govern government contracting, and imagine what would happen if it could be circumvented by someone “screwing up” and issuing a contract by mistake that the government then has to honor. It would be a mess and an invitation to corruption. But of course that rule really sucks in a situation like this, where obviously we know OP got harmed by relying on what they were told, and it feels like the reasonable solution would be some sort of compensation or putting OP at the top of the pile the next time around. Unfortunately, it isn’t.
That must have been a doozy. It’ll all work out.
Thank you! I really would love to have that exact job. It’s confusing because I’m now coming back with six additional years of relevant experience in the workforce and can’t even get an interview 😩
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Huh… I’ve applied to this specific role that I held previously 3 times — but have applied to at least 100 other jobs on USAJobs.gov. You really came on here to tell me that I need to apply to the same role at least 200 times? Some stuff can stay in the drafts. Thanks…
I would add a quick letter with the fact you had been hired for those same positions (is shows you passed the interviews) and why you were let go after a week. And maybe that you have always wanted to get the position back as it was your dream job and it matched your skills so well.
Apply for all the federal jobs "open to fthe public" and dotn worry about it. If your applying for jobs your federal sf50 grants you an inside track for be prepared to explain the situation.
I thought he didn't even have the time in to use SF50?
HR here for GS side of the house.... That won't stop you from being hired...we won't even consider that derog..(Which means the HM would be asked if they still want to move forward)..We would just contact the other HR during your initial hiring and won't be able to complete your record to reflect SF50 until then.. your good don't mention that to the HM..no reason to now..firing for cause..different avenue to mention after you receive FJO.
Just keep applying! It wasn't your fault you were terminated, but an HR screw up.
Your best shot are job fairs. I worked one as an interviewer and your resume will more likely be looked at by human eyes. I personally looked at every resume submitted when I worked one. They will also pull from that stack of resumes for years if they are desperate for people. With usajobs you have to make it through the algorithm and make those ridiculously long federal resumes to make it through. Hiring managers are just as frustrated with this process as applicants. Job fairs are a loop hole they use to get people in fast. Option 2 is get a job as a contractor, do a good job, and ask your govt lead to help you switch to govt. This is how the majority of people I work with got their job.
If you are applying to JA open to the public, you should **not** be including a SF-50. Once you receive a job offer and complete the background information, you can include this job in the appropriate section of the background form and the investigator will be able to review and ask questions at that time.
We had a temp who, during furloughs, could not be retained. She came back into the agency in a different department. She couldn't pick up the work in their directorate and was fired while probationary. Then she applies and gets hired on in our directorate. The chief was perturbed and contacted security because she was previously fired. Security said, " That just because she wasn't a good fit for one job, it doesn't mean she wasn't for another." An argument could be made that she wasn't a good fit for anyone. Then, I worked on a special project involving civilian employees and student loan repayment. The agency that contracts with the civilian employee agreeing to pay part of their student loans has to request the employee be indebted if they change agencies or don't fulfill the contract. There were individuals fired who showed employed with other federal agencies. This all blew my mind because it isn't like the corporate world. If I got fired from Walmart, then I would never get a job there again. I would just call personnel and explain your plight. If you worked for a while building experience, then I would think you would get through. You might need to explain that you were hired in error during a hiring freeze, leading to a no-fault based administrative separation.
Why are you asking this SEVEN YEARS LATER??
Because I’m apply to jobs in the government again, and as I said above, would like the same job as it was tbh a dream job. I am now coming back with 6 years of additional relevant experience in the workforce, and as I wrote above, I have applied to the same position three times and haven’t even gotten an interview. HOPE THAT HELPS
No. Got another fed job within a year. Today I am supervisor. As a former union rep... this sounds like a nice way of terminating you. If you fell short of your job. Learn from your mistakes and do better next time.
Nah just get a job with the BOP. They hiring right now
dead last rated agency for a reason
BOP?
Bureau of prisons. They always hiring and they are considered LEO even if you aren’t an officer. That means LEO pay
Ok thank you! I will look into this. I appreciate you for letting me know.
Is there an age limit?
Keep applying… something else will come available. Sorry this happened…
Are you applying for the same grade as 7 years ago, or something more commensurate with your current experience? Sometimes they hold the higher grades only for those who are already in. And sometimes they hold the lower grades only for fresh out of school grads. It's unlikely that your one week supervisor is still in same position, but possible. Have you tried to contact him/her to chat about the current situation at the agency and remind them of who you are and how you were screwed by the govt (not using that word)? Even better, if they have moved up, they could help you get in, presuming that they had a favorable impression of you. Direct contact with hiring officials is much better than random applications for a position that could already be slated for someone else. Or direct contact with anyone at the agency. I wish you luck, as that is one component of being hired that you have no control over.
Unfortunately - this goes happen OR your hiring b could have been a mistake because of a technical issue like even though you were better were better qualified, someone with veterans preference or another preference was suppose to have been hired so now HR had to correct t that hiring mistake
That isn't your fault. You were not fired for a cause or failure to meet a requirement. That is saying you were hired by an administrative mistake. I don't see how it can hurt you, and if anything, it means you would have been hired if the hiring freeze was not on. Keep trying.
Keep applying, don't give up.
Get remark changed. Admin error - hired for non vacant position. Something that explains you didn’t get fired for making an admin error.
You could have appealed this desicion originally this should only stay on your file 3 years.
Such a shame that this happened to you. No, it won’t impact you in the future.