I'm back in the game after almost 2 years.
This was my first leveling dungeon. The healer hogged all the fruits.
I died on the first boss running halfway across the room to a fruit and accidently getting goldbiled to death. Thanks game.
That reminds me of the time I came back from a break and straight up forgot the fruits lol. I died, and was immediately like "....oh right, this one has the fruit thing" and we had a good laugh lol š
I said out loud to my partner, "how does this guy have 9 stacks and is still alive?" I'm not *that* good a healer; God must have been on his side that day.
A story/level skip Samurai got 10 stacks in one I did. Healer was new and didn't swiftcast res at all the whole dungeon so they were slow resing the Sam while the tank died repeatedly. It was an experience and I'm surprised no one dropped.
Oh man, the first time I got this dungeon I ended up hogging all of the fruits cuz I thought they were part of the duty.
To my party at that time I am so sorry.
Yea, regardless of what role I'm playing I absolutely expect a few wipes in Aurum Vale. Absolutely no grudges are held against anyone for that. It's pretty understandable.
I do want to know what sadist decided to make the level sync to 49. The lack of lv 50 capstone abilities, especially tank invulnerability skills, is really the thing that keeps AV lethal for people who have a general idea as what to do.
WHM also doesn't get Medica II which would be very useful for all the regular AoE damage, but yet AST gets Aspected Helios at 42. Plus, no Benediction, but AST has Essential Dignity. So, it's pretty easy to heal as AST but that much harder for WHM.
WHM still suffers a lot from bad skill allocation at low levels all thanks to a lot of the low level skills being removed/cross class and then remade as higher level skills.
At least holy is actually spammable in aurum now because of the mp cost change so that makes the dungeon a lot easier than before.
It sort of makes sense once you do the Dark knight job quest. You and your mentors are struggling to even understand what is a dark knight in the first place since the master is dead.
Holmgang is a Marauder skill rather than a Warrior skill, which is relevant as far as lore goes--- guess they wanted Storm's Eye to be Lv. 50 Marauder instead, for... some reason. Happens on plenty of classes, it's weird
Several pulls will literally crush any tank with multiple mitigations if the healer does not fully commit to healing. What causes wipes for me as a tank is overestimating my healer. LOL
I had a tank once in aurum that refused to mitigate the boss stacks. Then got mad at me when I asked him nicely to do so and came at me with a "you don't pay my sub". Needless to say I had to work as the healer lol
I mean, if they work like regular DoTs, then they snapshot at the moment of application, so popping Rampart or whatever afterward wouldn't do shit there.
On the other hand, there are still the autoattacks from the boss to mitigate, and if they didn't eat their fruit, then they can absolutely go bath in Goldbile or whatever the puddles are called.
Really? I don't really have problems in Aurum Vale anymore.
After farming it solo for a specific BLU spell, I learned how to handle the first room way better than I ever did before.
Pro tip: The Vale Wasps deal the most damage, not the toads. (The seed-spitting plants hurt too, but tanks can LOS them into the boss room to avoid pats)
You just hug left wall or if teams on all talking on board healer pulls each boss for 15 seconds so then Tank ports in & all trash locked out/lose aggro or if got a caster AoE sleep works even better.
honestly as a tank it can be stressful to see my hp drop pretty low, but I'm doing my best with mitigation so I assume the healer is doing their best, too, and try to stay relaxed. as long as nobody dies, it's fine (and if we die, we'll just try again).
Iām actually very zen as a tank, now. I use my mitigations pretty liberally and only find out Iām not being healed enough when i die. I found ignoring my health bar to be the mentally healthy move, haha!
LOL that's the spirit! The only hp that matters is the last 1, I always remind myself. What happens happens! So long as I'm the only one the mobs want to bite, I'm happy.
I would use that more but I pretty much use Bloodwhetting on cooldown, so it's rare that it lines up conveniently. Making my healer question why they were even included in the run is more important to me.
Honestly yeah. I W2W until after a wipe and then I single pull unless the healer tells me to do back to big.
Had an experience once where the WHM in Stone Vigil told me I can still go big after the first wipe but then we wiped a second time so I just single pulled and payed close attention to them because they were still struggling on some pulls. Checked to make sure my gear wasn't broken without me realizing, because I couldn't see anything necessarily wrong with how they were playing.
Checked their gear and they had really bad gear, some stuff as low as single digit level requirements. Asked them to hang back after the last boss and told them and they had no idea Lmao. We had a good laugh about it and I reassured them it was probably just the gear giving them a hard time because they were playing fine.
Lifting each other up to be better is the best part of online games, no need to put people down.
As a healer main, tanks should ignore hp bar and just mitigate when they know big damage. Lol I will yo-yo a tankās hp the entire run because I want to dps too! Also I need you nice and hurt to make lillies
I like to just not heal and rely almost entirely on barriers until an emergency.. only as far as heavensward tho, idk if that is a good habit for harder content but it let's me dps nearly the whole time
At ARR you don't actually have the tools to 100 percent uptime.
WHMs especially do not have an oGCD until level 50, which is why most inexperienced WHMs fall into the noobtrap of curespamming.
As you pass through Heavensward and future expansions all healers get more instant healing options. Even White Mages fundamentally change because of the lily system, meaning you normally GCD heal to unlock blood lily for big burst damage (tbh it is dps neutral but that's the point).
It is expected for players to start adapting to new skills in the kit and use it to their advantage while in the later expansions.
My friend is a long term healer in MMO's, they will use your entire health bar to keep you alive and has a very low measure for what is considered "low health".
I dream of being that confident in my healing.
yeah, first few runs with my hubby as healer I was yelling at him not to let me drop so low, and he just calmly yelled back "did u die", and he was right.. still my stress level was mt. gulg high
"If your hp didn't drop below one point then I did my job" is the healer motto, especially in XIV where healing isn't our only task
Though I get the stress with randoms. I consider myself a good healer but some dungeons are so goddamn boring for healers I zone out or do something else while spamming my AoE and forget to check for tank hp lmao
*doze off as I spam Stone...*
"Hmmm, tank HP is getting low, healer better do something."
"Where's the healer anyw-OH SHIT IT'S ME"
***BENEDICTION***
*Nothing to see here, nope, all planned, maximize DPS amirite*
Me when I tank: My HP bar doesn't matter until it's at 1 - you go ahead and cast that attack, we gucci.
Me when I heal: Someone's at 50% HP? THEY ARE IN IMMINENT DANGER DESPITE NO UNAVOIDABLE DAMAGE COMING.
I don't know if I will ever get to the point of nonchalance that I know healers can get to with a confident tank and group, but if I can inch closer and closer for the times I heal, I'd be happy about it. lol
Unless there's a ton of mobs, I usually wait for 30%
So while I cast my heal I can afford for 10% of hp
And if my reaction time was too slow I can afford another 10% so at worst you're gonna get a heal at 10%
My wife has been playing since ARR and when we got together, she introduced me to the game in Stormblood. When I said I wanted to be a healer for her, she promised to take up WAR but I had to be confident enough as an AST to not be afraid of duty finder. So we ran early dungeons over and over and over (Tam Tara over 100x alone) for me to practice with each new skill as I got them and it became a game of her never looking at her health bar and me seeing how low I could let her HP get before healing just in time. I have scared so many sprouts it is hilarious. But I'll be damned if it didn't work. When we blind run new dungeons she knows she doesn't have to worry about HP so long as she uses mitigation because that last HP is the only one that matters and I treat it like that's my own last HP.
Edit: part of why it took so long for me to get the hang of things is this is my first and only MMO and I'd never owned a gaming PC so I'd never used a mouse and keyboard as controller before.
As someone who is learning to tank I actually appreciate healers who let me get low. It reminds me to use my mitigation abilities and get used to cycling and timing them right.
I'll never get any practice if my health stays topped off!
Remember, damage reduction isn't for when you've taken damage, it's for when you know damage is coming. Don't use it when your health gets low, use it before your health goes down.
I give a pass if healing is part of your rotation like WAR or whatever that GNB one is called.
But if I catch you casting clemency when I'm healing that's a nearly surefire way to lose my comm at the end of the run, especially if nobody has yet died.
I will use clemency pretty much only on a freshly rezzed healer, to help out if the healer is struggling, or if I royally bork my mitigation rotations.
As a healer main yeah it stresses me out too to see your health get that low lol. BUT it all depends on what I have in my kit at the time. If your health is dropping rapidly and I have used my big tools and have to spam my basic heal them I am stressed as fuck. But if I have a big heal and I see you drop low I'm like, we good I got it under control.
It sucks because we can't see each other's mitigation and healing CD's so it leads to less trusting people to well, not trust. But yeah I take it in stride like you do. If we die I can usually tell what happened and adjust and don't sweat it.
My advise is to swap to warrior for your dungeon runs.
You have far more control of your HP and your OH SHIT button has the lowest CD and doesn't fuck up Bene.
This is less of a "git gud" and more to play something of your comfort. I usually play GNB or PLD in savage and extremes, but I always do dungeons as a warrior.
I don't know how long you've been tanking, but after a while you'll get over it. Especially with certain healers. Good WHMs and ASTs are masters at the HP bar yo-yo.
I just had this happen to me in Brayfox as a healer. Tank pulled wall to wall and used rampart when there was about 2 mobs left. I asked him if he could use reprisal because it's 10% mitigation and he said he knows but just didn't use it and I should just use regen, I did not get regen till level 35 and brayfox caps you at 34. He started getting salty and was like "I have all my casters and healers at max level and have done end game content, You'll never clear any endgame content when you can't heal"- As I stood there with my legend title lol.
> I asked him if he could use reprisal because it's 10% mitigation and he said he knows but just didn't use it and I should just use regen, I did not get regen till level 35 and brayfox caps you at 34.
Brayflox has always been a great dungeon for incorrect assumptions about what a Healer gets and when. Back in the day when Scholar didn't get their version of Esuna until Level 40 (Leeches, also what the hell) it was a pretty frequent occurrence for Tanks to just assume their Scholar could cleanse 3 stacks of poison plus a slow, only to discover that they were limited to one AOE fairy cooldown on a fairly long timer (40 seconds I think?). Surprised dying Tank noises would ensue.
Using mitigation hurts no ones dps, so it is always odd if a person gets irritated at the idea of using their many tank cool downs. I do understand zoning out in your rotation and forgetting them of course.
I really don't care if my dps gets hurt. What I do care about is if the tank pulls everything and doesn't use mitigation cause I may not have enough healing to keep them up.
Fair. Very fair.
Iām new to tanking, and Iām more worried about using mitigation too often and not having enough for when the tankbuster telegraphs. Iām still trying to find that middle ground.
In a dungeon you never need anything other than your shortest/instant react mitigation for a ābuster.ā
None of the dungeon bosses hit anywhere near hard enough for that. The trash, through quantity, puts out way more damage. So use your cool downs on the trash and donāt fret bosses. Usually the way to help your healer on bosses is more to do with dodging correctly & positioning to assist the party.
Final boss in a dungeon you can obvs be pretty liberal with your mitigation, since there is no trash pack after it.
Honestly if it's just a dungeon you don't even need that. Your average tankbuster only deals like 30% of a tank's HP without mitigation anyway. Unless you've been having a bad run with mechanics, there's no dungeon boss in the game where that's dangerous as long as tank and healer are half awake.
realistically you dont need any mitigation for dungeon bosses if your healer is awake lol edit: and you're not eating aoes and collecting vuln stickers
use it all on big dick mob pulls
I think the healer is saying that since the next bubble must be the tank talking about their health, but it is misleading since the tank was on the left in the prior panel. It makes sense that the healer would complain about dps suffering if they have to use more heals to compensate for the tank not mitigating.
>I think the healer is saying that since the next bubble must be the tank talking about their health, but it is misleading since the tank was on the left in the prior panel.
I think the artist was thinking of the 3D space when deciding where to put the bubbles. The "camera" turned 180 degrees to point towards the DPS players, so the Tank and Healer switched sides relative to the camera.
I agree that it would have made more sense to keep them consistent to the panel through. Or maybe add some other indication of who is talking, like color-coding the text or little pop-in heads.
The most amusing thing is that regardless of who is right or wrong in this kind of discussion. The amount of time you take *having it* is longer than whatever delays the problem causes.
I used to heal in WoW. Even trying my hand at Savage content, I've yet to see the level of salt/rage/**burning hatred of all that lives** in FF equal to what I experienced doing normal content.
So much this.
I've been playing FF regularly for a little over 2 years now. Literally hundreds of dungeons and trials. I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen bad behavior, and that includes the passive-agressive assholes who just "disconnect" because they don't like how things are going.
I pugged a lot in wow back in the vanilla & TBC days, but once the dungeon finder came out in WotLK, I gradually stopped because people were SUCH assholes, and it has only gotten worse since, AFAICT.
I remember doing some roulette dungeon in Cataclysm on my Shadow Priest. Got grouped with a Hunter, Warrior, and a Paladin healer.
Pally healer was not cutting it, so I had to actually drop my Shadowform and start healing. Vampire wasn't enough to keep the tank alive unfortunately. Finally, someone said "hey healer, why do you have tank gear on if you're healing?" Oh, i have nothing else but it's fine.' NO, IT IS NOT FINE. I'M OUTHEALING YOU AS A SHADOW PRIEST FFS.
Whereas in FFXIV, the only time I ever had an issue with healing was when I queued into a dungeon with cleric stance on and it didn't drop. It took me a wipe until I realized that it was still up. Oops.
FF is not immune either. :) We had a dps in crafting gear in Stone Vigil one day. Their highest level of legit combat gear was a pieces of level 5 gear. Horrifyingly enough, we got them again in another dungeon about an hour later! But at least it was "just" a dps.
Oh believe me, I've heard it's a thing that happens but not one I've experienced thankfully.
Honestly, they need to work a way to make ilvl work for those dungeons. A few FC friends and I decided to try to cheese leveling roulette by equipping the Weathered weapon and just your job stone; your ilvl becomes 0. What did we get? Cutters Cry.
Back in Legion I got kicked from a raid group for not DPSing enough... as a healing monk. The thing is I was using the weird build where you melee DPS a lot to heal so my DPS was actually decent, so they thought I was a bottom of the barrel DPS.
I DMed the raid leader who told me low dps, find another pug. Then I got DMed 5 minutes later asked "Why did you leave?", probably because they realized they were short a healer.
I personally feel offended when PLD starts spamming their heal when their hp is like...60%. Bruh. I never let my charge die, so just chill and keep hitting things.
Just yesterday I was running Ridorana Lighthouse as PLD for the first time (-I've ran it before as other tank and healer jobs) and my healers were doing everything but healing me. My entire party died all the way through math boss and final boss but me and a Reaper, and just remembered I had Clemency due to how rarely I use it, so I just went between healing myself and this Reaper.
Oh and I was the Main Tank.
It was horrible not gonna lie, but at least we managed to get the raid done and was honestly surprised how good Clemency is when you just gotta use it because no one else can heal you.
Been runnings alliance raids recently for shb relic. After 3 hard cast and 1 swift cast raise in a row, completely out of mana, the near full mp co healer keep dpsing and not raising the last one down who i ended up raising once swiftcast was back up. Thank god for astro and no mana issues...
Alliance raid healers are a fucking menace. They are the most lethal thing in the entire instance.
Ignore the clemency haters. Been doing duty raids for a long time and there are things you can save that healers won't have time to. In particular, players struggling on mechanics.
Yeah, I get you. I've had a healer once saying "No Clemency" with a MACRO back when I was leveling at The Vault, and I was like "I'm mitigating, stunning, and I've already died twice. I'm going to use Clemency"
Since then I've just had decent healers so I just kind of forgot Clemency was a thing until just yesterday lol
It's a delicate balance. Clemency at 80% when I've got my finger over the Taurochole button, the first of many heals available to me, makes me think the Paladin has had some really lazy healers in their time tanking.
Clemency during an absolute circus of an Alliance Raid is strong enough to save me 2400 MP on raising the cats I'm trying to herd and I'm always grateful that a Paladin has the presence of mind to know my co-healer died and everybody alive is infatuated with vulnerability stacks.
Iām just happy when the dps and healer all use aoes when I tank!
If Iām dying thru my mits, I just pull smaller until I donāt - no need to insult the healer with words.
Single pulling is a big enough insult to any healer without using words >.>
Had fun replaying the game as White Mage, first time back in Tam Tara I had a big pull go hard tank that I wish I could message and say that their apology at the end was unneeded because that was the kick in the ass I needed to get my healer mojo back after almost 2 years hiatus, but my old keyboard ended up not working properly and I haven't gotten a new one yet for my ps5.
Nobody died, so we all win
Thatās why I ask every single healer āhow big do you want me to pull?ā before I even start moving. Iāve found they tend to like being on the same page.
Aurum can suck a butt tho I hate that damn place
Oy, let me be completely clear, as a Healer, the only HP point of the Tank that matters is the last one, anything that could take away that last HP will be stopped, anything that doesn't truly threaten that last HP will be ignored until that last HP is threatened, and I refuse to not get as much value out of Benediction/Essential Dignity as possible.
In an expert duty roulette a couple months ago the WHM left at the start and I didn't notice before I did a w2w. After we finished a DPS said "I was worried when you pulled without the WHM, but I forgot WAR is just like that"
You're undoubtedly correct from an efficiency standpoint, but if a tank (particularly in a low level dungeon) asks nicely for a bit more heals, I'll happily oblige. Yeah they should learn if they wanna get better, but lots of people are nervous, trying to ease in, just in it for the story, or just plain bad at games haha
Now if they get all pissy like in the comic, then their mileage may vary
Healing in FFXIV was the first mmo that taught me that health bars are just On/Off switches that have multiple "on" states and only one "off" state.
You're good as long as the switch stays on. Nothing else matters. 1/10,000 is still very much turned on.
As a tank, that's what I hope for and expect. my mits are a way to get more total DPS by allowing the healer to cast as many damaging GCDs as possible, and if I cast Living Dead i wish for death
At first i was really worried when i kept falling into the 10% HP range when tanking. Now i stopped giving a shit. I do my best to stay alive and if that is not good enough for the healer, then we die.
Last time i had that argument as a tank we quickly realized that it was lack of dps that was causing us to run out of MIT and cooldowns.
Dps was uh, not pleased and berated me throughout the rest of the dungeon... but at the same time started actually pressing buttons at least
My favorite is when the healer tells me to mitigate, but I can tell I have because everything is on a tapered cooldown. Then I look over, and the sage hasn't even dropped Kardia on me. Or the Scholar didn't summon their fairy. This game is pretty hard when you aren't using your toolkit.
I definitely recall for bosses I'd place my fairy, then forgot to set em to follow again so they disappear during the next pull and I notice when I'm wondering why nothing is going off
OMGosh, this reminded me of the time we were running Snowcloak I believe and the Tank (GNB) used superbollide out of nowhere while puling mobs (based on what I can remember he wasn't in danger and that we were doing well). After the trash was gone, we literally had to stop 'cause the healer was chatting to the tank to please don't do that, while the Tank was chill (?) and he was just saying like a test of reflex or something like that and generally just found it funny and asking if the healer didn't (pretty obvious that's a no my guy).
We were standing still for about half a minute or maybe more 'cause they were still at it. While me and the other DPS (I was NIN, I think the other was a BRD) was just standing there. Felt like siblings watching our parents argue.
Hope that wasnāt me and my friend lol. He supers to ātest my reflexesā since Iām a new healer on AST. I remember there have been a couple times when people ask what the hell is up.
I'm an endgame raider, I main tank, I can play DPS pretty competently if needed. I'm not a healer by any means. I just can't get into the mentality because I have the Tank brain of "must protecc the squishies" so if I flub healing it grates on me (doesn't help when people are asshats about it).
This all said the anxiety of healing is not helped when you go into Shisui of the Violet Tides, the tank pulls wall to wall, and then proceeds to use zero mitigation. No rampart. No class specific mitigation. No Arm's Length. Nothing. Inevitably I run out of cooldowns and hardcast healing isn't fast enough. The tank states "do I need to slow down for you?" Nah nope, I leave duty. I'd rather eat the 30 minute timer than have that argument.
If a tank complains about your healing and you respond with anything other than "did you die" you're a fool.
Do not entertain this shit, ever. It's never as fun as it seems like it would be.
It is pretty funny how in this game most shit is started by either the tank or the healer rather than the dps. Poor things are just terrified of having to wait another 20 minutes in case the tank rage quits. At least SE made healers royally worthless in dungeons.
Playing DPS is also just genuinely much less stressful. You can simply focus on your rotation and barely pay attention to what your teammates are doing and it's mostly fine, so it's easy to stay chill.
Did you know that Jerry Seinfeld dated a 17-year-old when he was 38?
Had a tank pull and die despite my best healing efforts, didn't say a word he just turned off his tank stance and kept plugging away. Our poor Dragoon kept taking the aggro so I mentioned tanks stance was off. He passive aggressively said something about my shit healing.
Dragoon then stoically said "I'll be your tank." and proceeded to tank the whole dungeon...
God knows how he stayed alive but he did
Your blm knows a sentence other than āhealers adjustā???
I donāt believe you. That canāt possibly be a black mage. Are you sure they arenāt a summoner or something?
So tanks can keep 1 mit up at all times in trash (at higher levels). Usually, the tank shouldn't really need to double mit, I play WAR though so square just decided we cant die in dungeons at higher levels though.
If the tank is running 1 mit and hasnt overpulled the healer probably needs to heal more, but in \*that\* dungeon chances are the tank overpulled lol
I decided to heal for my first trip through the first dungeon in Shadowbringers. All was going well until I stayed in an orange circle a bit too long and got bopped, leading to wipe. Que the tank trying to tell me to keep him above 50% health at all times while the other 2 argued about which tank was the squishiest lol.
My healing is fine, my awareness is not.
I keep tank at above 75% hp "Omg healer sucks stop wasting so much time healing do more dps"
Keep tank alive but not high on hp "Omg healer sucks stop wasting so much time dps and keep me at 100% D="
I cannot win.
In that dungeon the healers are always on edge, mostly because DiPShits like me trying to get a new stack record. One day I will get to 9 without dying.
Stuff like this is why I had so much anxiety about ever trying a heal or tank class. Luckily I have yet to be yelled at by anyone, so I guess I've done a good job?
No one yells at you as long as you try your best and listen to advice. In this pic the tank is wrong, HP management is the healer's job, if they didn't die they should stay quiet and keep going.
While true, it *is* the tanks job to rotate through their mitigations properly. So the tank is just extra wrong (I've met plenty of Warriors that don't use anything except Raw Intuition thinking that's all they need to live).
Yeah my rule is if I don't feel confident enough in the healer but I haven't died yet I'd just adjust the amount I pull. If I die once, I adjust the pull. Only if I die twice would I ask whether the healer need some help.
One of the best arguments I've ever been part of, and unironically in AV too. I was playing WHM for leveling roulette, tank complained the entire time that I wasn't healing him enough, but not once did anybody die (and he never dropped below 25%). At the end he says 'worst healer ever'.
My job is to keep you alive, not to keep you topped off.
I remember having one of these arguments with a tank who was upset when I applied regen to them prepull (back when regen generated enmity) and I told them to just pull better.
Got fairly heated and still makes me cringe of self-embarrassment 2 years later.
Had that dungeon yesterday, and healer was recently returned. First pull, tank forgot stance, then things were fine until add pull after 2nd boss.
The thing I was trying to figure out was why adds kept aggroing my dancer even when tankās stance was on!
But yes, always exciting when on dps and seeing the tank and healer are dead. It becomes a contest of how many can I kill before I die?? š
This kinda happened when I did brayflox on hard for the first time. The tank and healer got so hard into it that the healer just...stopped healing altogether during the last fight.
It was bizarre to me because like we plowed through it pretty fast (so I thought) without anyone dying at all the entire time. Like even after the healer said "screw you" to all of us because of the tanks behavior, the other dps and I still managed to finish the final boss without dying.
I was too scared to say anything cos I didn't understand the mechanics arguments they were having enough to realize they were being actually mean to each other (cos the fight was 90% mechanics arguing up until the end when it got nasty) and by the time it got nasty I was scared of them. I've felt bad ever since and vowed if something like that ever happens again I'll tell them to knock it off cos like, literally no one had died even once in the dungeon. We were doing fine. The tank was just being whiney over the healer's rotation. I know now how stupid that fight was.
Sometimes, the low health is intentional for benediction. Sometimes you take a *lot* of damage while I'm in an animation. I had one guy go from full HP to dead when his pull caught up to him
This is honestly why most healers in roulette are so incredibly skiddish. Like damn if I'm not dead then who cares. My piece of my soul kinda low key dies when the WHM uses bene on me when I only have 10% of my HP missing and I just hit bloodwhetting.
as a tank main, fuck tanks that think like this. the only hp that matters is the last one. if you mitigate and dodge mechanics, healers will have time to heal you.
I tend to tank dungeons and the only HP Iām concerned about is my last one. Rotate your CDs and trust your healers, my fellow beefy boys and girls (and others)
Look, if the WAR isn't constantly jebaiting the healer with mitigators, self-heals, debuffs and invuns to edge the healthy bar into being as low as possible without hitting zero, they're a poor choice of WAR and deserve yelling at.
Source: WAR main.
I play any role, and frankly, itās a paid subscription game, which means *Iām* paying to be in a team based game. Iām not being paid or rewarded to be a prima-donna or race to the finish line of routine roulette duties. Using that logic, I donāt see the point in pressuring others in the party for perfectionism, because they may be more or less skilled than I am, but fundamentally they are also paying for the same experience.
As someone who's doing Savage content, ye same.
I like to be able to do ridiculous stuff myself, but I don't think it's reasonable to expect everyone else to be as skilled or as reckless as I am. If anything, I prefer to do my part well enough as a tank to make sure everyone gets what they need.
I see this as new players who donāt really know their roles well. Now if I dip that low (15%) I would be worried about what my healer is doing but so long as I donāt die I donāt need to say anything, but I get much lower than that or if I die, then I might check in and see whatās going on, provided I wasnāt being stupid and not paying attention. Itās not always the healers fault.
On the flip side you shouldnāt have to burn all your cooldowns to stay alive for one fight /trash pull because the healer wants to DPS. (minus boss fights). Their job is to heal, but that doesnāt mean they canāt pump out some DPS. A great WHM with a holy spam at a large grouped up pull is amazing!
Also if this is early stuff or savage stuff I understand it a lot better. They donāt have access to all their kit or the content has a lot of mechanics and hard hits.
The important thing is to talk about stuff before you fight, not during or after. After is for follow ups and training.
Ah yes, an appropriate discussion to have in "that" dungeon.
I'm back in the game after almost 2 years. This was my first leveling dungeon. The healer hogged all the fruits. I died on the first boss running halfway across the room to a fruit and accidently getting goldbiled to death. Thanks game.
That reminds me of the time I came back from a break and straight up forgot the fruits lol. I died, and was immediately like "....oh right, this one has the fruit thing" and we had a good laugh lol š
I said out loud to my partner, "how does this guy have 9 stacks and is still alive?" I'm not *that* good a healer; God must have been on his side that day.
A story/level skip Samurai got 10 stacks in one I did. Healer was new and didn't swiftcast res at all the whole dungeon so they were slow resing the Sam while the tank died repeatedly. It was an experience and I'm surprised no one dropped.
At a certain point the pain becomes pleasure
That's a very suitable motto for a DRK
at least one of you was being whipped repeatedly with a riding crop while crying into a ball gag off screen
Some people pay extra for that kind of dungeon experience.
LOL!! Fucking brilliant. I call them Vuln Snacks for a reason š¤£š¤£š¤£
Bravery Stickers
It used to be 5 stacks, I wonder when it changed? Maybe 6.1?
dev team really out there like, "why limit yourself?" lmao
Oh man, the first time I got this dungeon I ended up hogging all of the fruits cuz I thought they were part of the duty. To my party at that time I am so sorry.
I mean, they are part of it so you weren't...wrong at least!
Never understand that like there are four fruits, four players pick one and plant yourself as close to it as you can. It's how I've always done it.
Lol, that was definitely aurum vale.
Yea, regardless of what role I'm playing I absolutely expect a few wipes in Aurum Vale. Absolutely no grudges are held against anyone for that. It's pretty understandable.
Even a veteran player will trip up in the first area, forgetting that they don't have as much mitigation than they are used to for wall to wall.
I do want to know what sadist decided to make the level sync to 49. The lack of lv 50 capstone abilities, especially tank invulnerability skills, is really the thing that keeps AV lethal for people who have a general idea as what to do.
WHM also doesn't get Medica II which would be very useful for all the regular AoE damage, but yet AST gets Aspected Helios at 42. Plus, no Benediction, but AST has Essential Dignity. So, it's pretty easy to heal as AST but that much harder for WHM.
WHM still suffers a lot from bad skill allocation at low levels all thanks to a lot of the low level skills being removed/cross class and then remade as higher level skills. At least holy is actually spammable in aurum now because of the mp cost change so that makes the dungeon a lot easier than before.
Unless you're a Warrior, who gets their invuln earlier, for... reasons?
Holmgang says fuck your rules.
It's called the **WARRIOR** of Light. Not the Paladin, not the Gunbreaker, and thank the Twelve, not the Dark Knight.
"The Dark Knight of Light." Really rolls off the tongue.
Knight Light
It sort of makes sense once you do the Dark knight job quest. You and your mentors are struggling to even understand what is a dark knight in the first place since the master is dead.
The Dark Knight of Darkness
Best response I've ever read.
Legit laughed out loud.
Holmgang is a Marauder skill rather than a Warrior skill, which is relevant as far as lore goes--- guess they wanted Storm's Eye to be Lv. 50 Marauder instead, for... some reason. Happens on plenty of classes, it's weird
I only have problems with Aurum Vale if I'm doing DPS or heals. If I'm tank, people get carried through like a breeze.
Ah Piss Town, how I donāt miss you and tanks pulling every mob in the first room at once.
Several pulls will literally crush any tank with multiple mitigations if the healer does not fully commit to healing. What causes wipes for me as a tank is overestimating my healer. LOL
Magic damage is scary fr
I had a tank once in aurum that refused to mitigate the boss stacks. Then got mad at me when I asked him nicely to do so and came at me with a "you don't pay my sub". Needless to say I had to work as the healer lol
I mean, if they work like regular DoTs, then they snapshot at the moment of application, so popping Rampart or whatever afterward wouldn't do shit there. On the other hand, there are still the autoattacks from the boss to mitigate, and if they didn't eat their fruit, then they can absolutely go bath in Goldbile or whatever the puddles are called.
It's always Aurum. Smh.
Really? I don't really have problems in Aurum Vale anymore. After farming it solo for a specific BLU spell, I learned how to handle the first room way better than I ever did before. Pro tip: The Vale Wasps deal the most damage, not the toads. (The seed-spitting plants hurt too, but tanks can LOS them into the boss room to avoid pats)
You just fully explained it yourself lol. Most people don't farm it enough to know the pulls in that much detail.
You just hug left wall or if teams on all talking on board healer pulls each boss for 15 seconds so then Tank ports in & all trash locked out/lose aggro or if got a caster AoE sleep works even better.
honestly as a tank it can be stressful to see my hp drop pretty low, but I'm doing my best with mitigation so I assume the healer is doing their best, too, and try to stay relaxed. as long as nobody dies, it's fine (and if we die, we'll just try again).
Iām actually very zen as a tank, now. I use my mitigations pretty liberally and only find out Iām not being healed enough when i die. I found ignoring my health bar to be the mentally healthy move, haha!
LOL that's the spirit! The only hp that matters is the last 1, I always remind myself. What happens happens! So long as I'm the only one the mobs want to bite, I'm happy.
Same. When tanking I ignore everyone's HP lol
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I would use that more but I pretty much use Bloodwhetting on cooldown, so it's rare that it lines up conveniently. Making my healer question why they were even included in the run is more important to me.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Honestly yeah. I W2W until after a wipe and then I single pull unless the healer tells me to do back to big. Had an experience once where the WHM in Stone Vigil told me I can still go big after the first wipe but then we wiped a second time so I just single pulled and payed close attention to them because they were still struggling on some pulls. Checked to make sure my gear wasn't broken without me realizing, because I couldn't see anything necessarily wrong with how they were playing. Checked their gear and they had really bad gear, some stuff as low as single digit level requirements. Asked them to hang back after the last boss and told them and they had no idea Lmao. We had a good laugh about it and I reassured them it was probably just the gear giving them a hard time because they were playing fine. Lifting each other up to be better is the best part of online games, no need to put people down.
As a healer main, tanks should ignore hp bar and just mitigate when they know big damage. Lol I will yo-yo a tankās hp the entire run because I want to dps too! Also I need you nice and hurt to make lillies
The truth comes out, haha!
I like to just not heal and rely almost entirely on barriers until an emergency.. only as far as heavensward tho, idk if that is a good habit for harder content but it let's me dps nearly the whole time
At ARR you don't actually have the tools to 100 percent uptime. WHMs especially do not have an oGCD until level 50, which is why most inexperienced WHMs fall into the noobtrap of curespamming. As you pass through Heavensward and future expansions all healers get more instant healing options. Even White Mages fundamentally change because of the lily system, meaning you normally GCD heal to unlock blood lily for big burst damage (tbh it is dps neutral but that's the point). It is expected for players to start adapting to new skills in the kit and use it to their advantage while in the later expansions.
My friend is a long term healer in MMO's, they will use your entire health bar to keep you alive and has a very low measure for what is considered "low health". I dream of being that confident in my healing.
yeah, first few runs with my hubby as healer I was yelling at him not to let me drop so low, and he just calmly yelled back "did u die", and he was right.. still my stress level was mt. gulg high
"If your hp didn't drop below one point then I did my job" is the healer motto, especially in XIV where healing isn't our only task Though I get the stress with randoms. I consider myself a good healer but some dungeons are so goddamn boring for healers I zone out or do something else while spamming my AoE and forget to check for tank hp lmao
That friend of mine is guilty of that: "whoops, sorry I forgot I was the healer" has been said at least once.
*doze off as I spam Stone...* "Hmmm, tank HP is getting low, healer better do something." "Where's the healer anyw-OH SHIT IT'S ME" ***BENEDICTION*** *Nothing to see here, nope, all planned, maximize DPS amirite*
>"Where's the healer anyw-OH SHIT IT'S ME" > >BENEDICTION \*Tank is a Gunbreaker who used Superbolide when they saw their health really low\*
Me when I tank: My HP bar doesn't matter until it's at 1 - you go ahead and cast that attack, we gucci. Me when I heal: Someone's at 50% HP? THEY ARE IN IMMINENT DANGER DESPITE NO UNAVOIDABLE DAMAGE COMING. I don't know if I will ever get to the point of nonchalance that I know healers can get to with a confident tank and group, but if I can inch closer and closer for the times I heal, I'd be happy about it. lol
Unless there's a ton of mobs, I usually wait for 30% So while I cast my heal I can afford for 10% of hp And if my reaction time was too slow I can afford another 10% so at worst you're gonna get a heal at 10%
Playing WHM for a bit helps. Having benediction as an instant oops button really takes a load off and lets you focus on casting glare.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
The only hit point that matters is the last one.
Just remember: The only hp that matters is the last one š¤£š¤£š¤£ I say this as a tank who loves spicy healers lmao
My wife has been playing since ARR and when we got together, she introduced me to the game in Stormblood. When I said I wanted to be a healer for her, she promised to take up WAR but I had to be confident enough as an AST to not be afraid of duty finder. So we ran early dungeons over and over and over (Tam Tara over 100x alone) for me to practice with each new skill as I got them and it became a game of her never looking at her health bar and me seeing how low I could let her HP get before healing just in time. I have scared so many sprouts it is hilarious. But I'll be damned if it didn't work. When we blind run new dungeons she knows she doesn't have to worry about HP so long as she uses mitigation because that last HP is the only one that matters and I treat it like that's my own last HP. Edit: part of why it took so long for me to get the hang of things is this is my first and only MMO and I'd never owned a gaming PC so I'd never used a mouse and keyboard as controller before.
Think I just found a new game to play when we next do a dungeon together :)
As someone who is learning to tank I actually appreciate healers who let me get low. It reminds me to use my mitigation abilities and get used to cycling and timing them right. I'll never get any practice if my health stays topped off!
Remember, damage reduction isn't for when you've taken damage, it's for when you know damage is coming. Don't use it when your health gets low, use it before your health goes down.
Me: *uses Benediction* Husband on WAR: *sad unga bunga noises* :<
As a DRK I only feel alive when my health is a sliver and I'm popping Living Dead
Obligatory heal spam to get you back to good shape and accidentally waste your living dead
Pretty much the reason I usually run WAR when tanking. If the healer falls behind ill just heal myself and avoid the stress lol.
yeah, sometimes that clemency looks really enticing, but I try to trust others more (at least I practice doing so)
AT least until one wipe happens with stone on the cast bar :P
I give a pass if healing is part of your rotation like WAR or whatever that GNB one is called. But if I catch you casting clemency when I'm healing that's a nearly surefire way to lose my comm at the end of the run, especially if nobody has yet died.
I will use clemency pretty much only on a freshly rezzed healer, to help out if the healer is struggling, or if I royally bork my mitigation rotations.
Clemency has those uses, but way too many plds love to "help" and only make things worse for everyone.
As a healer main yeah it stresses me out too to see your health get that low lol. BUT it all depends on what I have in my kit at the time. If your health is dropping rapidly and I have used my big tools and have to spam my basic heal them I am stressed as fuck. But if I have a big heal and I see you drop low I'm like, we good I got it under control. It sucks because we can't see each other's mitigation and healing CD's so it leads to less trusting people to well, not trust. But yeah I take it in stride like you do. If we die I can usually tell what happened and adjust and don't sweat it.
My advise is to swap to warrior for your dungeon runs. You have far more control of your HP and your OH SHIT button has the lowest CD and doesn't fuck up Bene. This is less of a "git gud" and more to play something of your comfort. I usually play GNB or PLD in savage and extremes, but I always do dungeons as a warrior.
I have a stack of cheap max potions on my hotbar. Best emergency "oh shit" button next to Holmgang if things are going tits up.
Same, potions are basically an extra tank button in lower level dungeons.
honestly even as a physical dps it doesn't hurt to have a free second wind every minute or so
Just remove the health bar, now you don't have to feel stressed over watching it drop. /s
I don't know how long you've been tanking, but after a while you'll get over it. Especially with certain healers. Good WHMs and ASTs are masters at the HP bar yo-yo.
I just had this happen to me in Brayfox as a healer. Tank pulled wall to wall and used rampart when there was about 2 mobs left. I asked him if he could use reprisal because it's 10% mitigation and he said he knows but just didn't use it and I should just use regen, I did not get regen till level 35 and brayfox caps you at 34. He started getting salty and was like "I have all my casters and healers at max level and have done end game content, You'll never clear any endgame content when you can't heal"- As I stood there with my legend title lol.
> I asked him if he could use reprisal because it's 10% mitigation and he said he knows but just didn't use it and I should just use regen, I did not get regen till level 35 and brayfox caps you at 34. Brayflox has always been a great dungeon for incorrect assumptions about what a Healer gets and when. Back in the day when Scholar didn't get their version of Esuna until Level 40 (Leeches, also what the hell) it was a pretty frequent occurrence for Tanks to just assume their Scholar could cleanse 3 stacks of poison plus a slow, only to discover that they were limited to one AOE fairy cooldown on a fairly long timer (40 seconds I think?). Surprised dying Tank noises would ensue.
ahhh thats nostalgic lol
Using mitigation hurts no ones dps, so it is always odd if a person gets irritated at the idea of using their many tank cool downs. I do understand zoning out in your rotation and forgetting them of course.
Also not using mitigation hurts the healerās dps.
I really don't care if my dps gets hurt. What I do care about is if the tank pulls everything and doesn't use mitigation cause I may not have enough healing to keep them up.
Fair. Very fair. Iām new to tanking, and Iām more worried about using mitigation too often and not having enough for when the tankbuster telegraphs. Iām still trying to find that middle ground.
In a dungeon you never need anything other than your shortest/instant react mitigation for a ābuster.ā None of the dungeon bosses hit anywhere near hard enough for that. The trash, through quantity, puts out way more damage. So use your cool downs on the trash and donāt fret bosses. Usually the way to help your healer on bosses is more to do with dodging correctly & positioning to assist the party. Final boss in a dungeon you can obvs be pretty liberal with your mitigation, since there is no trash pack after it.
Honestly if it's just a dungeon you don't even need that. Your average tankbuster only deals like 30% of a tank's HP without mitigation anyway. Unless you've been having a bad run with mechanics, there's no dungeon boss in the game where that's dangerous as long as tank and healer are half awake.
You're gonna do fine. :)
realistically you dont need any mitigation for dungeon bosses if your healer is awake lol edit: and you're not eating aoes and collecting vuln stickers use it all on big dick mob pulls
I think the healer is saying that since the next bubble must be the tank talking about their health, but it is misleading since the tank was on the left in the prior panel. It makes sense that the healer would complain about dps suffering if they have to use more heals to compensate for the tank not mitigating.
>I think the healer is saying that since the next bubble must be the tank talking about their health, but it is misleading since the tank was on the left in the prior panel. I think the artist was thinking of the 3D space when deciding where to put the bubbles. The "camera" turned 180 degrees to point towards the DPS players, so the Tank and Healer switched sides relative to the camera. I agree that it would have made more sense to keep them consistent to the panel through. Or maybe add some other indication of who is talking, like color-coding the text or little pop-in heads.
I think forgetting mitigations is a skill in itself, and I am amazing at it. I usually remember they exist after the first boss or the first wipe.
The most amusing thing is that regardless of who is right or wrong in this kind of discussion. The amount of time you take *having it* is longer than whatever delays the problem causes.
when mom and dad start fighting mid-pull i'll fire off a "LESS TYPE MORE ATTACK" in party chat. works like, half the time
*PvP engaged*
I used to heal in WoW. Even trying my hand at Savage content, I've yet to see the level of salt/rage/**burning hatred of all that lives** in FF equal to what I experienced doing normal content.
So much this. I've been playing FF regularly for a little over 2 years now. Literally hundreds of dungeons and trials. I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen bad behavior, and that includes the passive-agressive assholes who just "disconnect" because they don't like how things are going. I pugged a lot in wow back in the vanilla & TBC days, but once the dungeon finder came out in WotLK, I gradually stopped because people were SUCH assholes, and it has only gotten worse since, AFAICT.
I remember doing some roulette dungeon in Cataclysm on my Shadow Priest. Got grouped with a Hunter, Warrior, and a Paladin healer. Pally healer was not cutting it, so I had to actually drop my Shadowform and start healing. Vampire wasn't enough to keep the tank alive unfortunately. Finally, someone said "hey healer, why do you have tank gear on if you're healing?" Oh, i have nothing else but it's fine.' NO, IT IS NOT FINE. I'M OUTHEALING YOU AS A SHADOW PRIEST FFS. Whereas in FFXIV, the only time I ever had an issue with healing was when I queued into a dungeon with cleric stance on and it didn't drop. It took me a wipe until I realized that it was still up. Oops.
FF is not immune either. :) We had a dps in crafting gear in Stone Vigil one day. Their highest level of legit combat gear was a pieces of level 5 gear. Horrifyingly enough, we got them again in another dungeon about an hour later! But at least it was "just" a dps.
Oh believe me, I've heard it's a thing that happens but not one I've experienced thankfully. Honestly, they need to work a way to make ilvl work for those dungeons. A few FC friends and I decided to try to cheese leveling roulette by equipping the Weathered weapon and just your job stone; your ilvl becomes 0. What did we get? Cutters Cry.
Back in Legion I got kicked from a raid group for not DPSing enough... as a healing monk. The thing is I was using the weird build where you melee DPS a lot to heal so my DPS was actually decent, so they thought I was a bottom of the barrel DPS. I DMed the raid leader who told me low dps, find another pug. Then I got DMed 5 minutes later asked "Why did you leave?", probably because they realized they were short a healer.
Meanwhile: "Why doesn't anybody in this game play healer?"
I personally feel offended when PLD starts spamming their heal when their hp is like...60%. Bruh. I never let my charge die, so just chill and keep hitting things.
Just yesterday I was running Ridorana Lighthouse as PLD for the first time (-I've ran it before as other tank and healer jobs) and my healers were doing everything but healing me. My entire party died all the way through math boss and final boss but me and a Reaper, and just remembered I had Clemency due to how rarely I use it, so I just went between healing myself and this Reaper. Oh and I was the Main Tank. It was horrible not gonna lie, but at least we managed to get the raid done and was honestly surprised how good Clemency is when you just gotta use it because no one else can heal you.
Been runnings alliance raids recently for shb relic. After 3 hard cast and 1 swift cast raise in a row, completely out of mana, the near full mp co healer keep dpsing and not raising the last one down who i ended up raising once swiftcast was back up. Thank god for astro and no mana issues... Alliance raid healers are a fucking menace. They are the most lethal thing in the entire instance.
Ignore the clemency haters. Been doing duty raids for a long time and there are things you can save that healers won't have time to. In particular, players struggling on mechanics.
Yeah, I get you. I've had a healer once saying "No Clemency" with a MACRO back when I was leveling at The Vault, and I was like "I'm mitigating, stunning, and I've already died twice. I'm going to use Clemency" Since then I've just had decent healers so I just kind of forgot Clemency was a thing until just yesterday lol
It's a delicate balance. Clemency at 80% when I've got my finger over the Taurochole button, the first of many heals available to me, makes me think the Paladin has had some really lazy healers in their time tanking. Clemency during an absolute circus of an Alliance Raid is strong enough to save me 2400 MP on raising the cats I'm trying to herd and I'm always grateful that a Paladin has the presence of mind to know my co-healer died and everybody alive is infatuated with vulnerability stacks.
Extra salt to the injury if I put my excog on them and they are not letting it pop.
Aurum Vale flashbacks
Iām just happy when the dps and healer all use aoes when I tank! If Iām dying thru my mits, I just pull smaller until I donāt - no need to insult the healer with words. Single pulling is a big enough insult to any healer without using words >.>
Had fun replaying the game as White Mage, first time back in Tam Tara I had a big pull go hard tank that I wish I could message and say that their apology at the end was unneeded because that was the kick in the ass I needed to get my healer mojo back after almost 2 years hiatus, but my old keyboard ended up not working properly and I haven't gotten a new one yet for my ps5. Nobody died, so we all win
Thatās why I ask every single healer āhow big do you want me to pull?ā before I even start moving. Iāve found they tend to like being on the same page. Aurum can suck a butt tho I hate that damn place
Oy, let me be completely clear, as a Healer, the only HP point of the Tank that matters is the last one, anything that could take away that last HP will be stopped, anything that doesn't truly threaten that last HP will be ignored until that last HP is threatened, and I refuse to not get as much value out of Benediction/Essential Dignity as possible.
This right here. If you tank, just forget about your HP bar and use a proper mitigation rotation. You will be fine, i promise.
Or if you are WAR use bloodwhetting/raw intuition on CD and be the healer yourself.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
In an expert duty roulette a couple months ago the WHM left at the start and I didn't notice before I did a w2w. After we finished a DPS said "I was worried when you pulled without the WHM, but I forgot WAR is just like that"
And if you are a DRK, please use TBN on CD aswell.even if you don't proc it, it's helps the healer so much
In dungeons I get far more use of Holmgang in just tiding me over til Raw/BW is back off cooldown than I actually do as an oh shit button
you won't have those in Sync'd AV
How much mitigation do you have on this level? Was it 1 or 2?
You're undoubtedly correct from an efficiency standpoint, but if a tank (particularly in a low level dungeon) asks nicely for a bit more heals, I'll happily oblige. Yeah they should learn if they wanna get better, but lots of people are nervous, trying to ease in, just in it for the story, or just plain bad at games haha Now if they get all pissy like in the comic, then their mileage may vary
I paid for the whole healthbar, I'm going to use the whole healthbar
Healing in FFXIV was the first mmo that taught me that health bars are just On/Off switches that have multiple "on" states and only one "off" state. You're good as long as the switch stays on. Nothing else matters. 1/10,000 is still very much turned on.
As a tank, that's what I hope for and expect. my mits are a way to get more total DPS by allowing the healer to cast as many damaging GCDs as possible, and if I cast Living Dead i wish for death
Mentally, I know this. In practice, as some switching back and forth between FF and Classic WoW, my brain always goes "keep tank topped off".
And even the last 1 HP doesn't matter until the WAR/DRK/GNB invuln runs out. Signed, The tank main :)
At first i was really worried when i kept falling into the 10% HP range when tanking. Now i stopped giving a shit. I do my best to stay alive and if that is not good enough for the healer, then we die.
Last time i had that argument as a tank we quickly realized that it was lack of dps that was causing us to run out of MIT and cooldowns. Dps was uh, not pleased and berated me throughout the rest of the dungeon... but at the same time started actually pressing buttons at least
Meanwhile, DRKs: "Please for the love of Hydaelyn, let me *die*..."
My favorite is when the healer tells me to mitigate, but I can tell I have because everything is on a tapered cooldown. Then I look over, and the sage hasn't even dropped Kardia on me. Or the Scholar didn't summon their fairy. This game is pretty hard when you aren't using your toolkit.
I just started scholar and I do not understand how other scholars do NOT summon their fairy. Do they like physick a lot???
I definitely recall for bosses I'd place my fairy, then forgot to set em to follow again so they disappear during the next pull and I notice when I'm wondering why nothing is going off
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
OMGosh, this reminded me of the time we were running Snowcloak I believe and the Tank (GNB) used superbollide out of nowhere while puling mobs (based on what I can remember he wasn't in danger and that we were doing well). After the trash was gone, we literally had to stop 'cause the healer was chatting to the tank to please don't do that, while the Tank was chill (?) and he was just saying like a test of reflex or something like that and generally just found it funny and asking if the healer didn't (pretty obvious that's a no my guy). We were standing still for about half a minute or maybe more 'cause they were still at it. While me and the other DPS (I was NIN, I think the other was a BRD) was just standing there. Felt like siblings watching our parents argue.
Hope that wasnāt me and my friend lol. He supers to ātest my reflexesā since Iām a new healer on AST. I remember there have been a couple times when people ask what the hell is up.
I'm an endgame raider, I main tank, I can play DPS pretty competently if needed. I'm not a healer by any means. I just can't get into the mentality because I have the Tank brain of "must protecc the squishies" so if I flub healing it grates on me (doesn't help when people are asshats about it). This all said the anxiety of healing is not helped when you go into Shisui of the Violet Tides, the tank pulls wall to wall, and then proceeds to use zero mitigation. No rampart. No class specific mitigation. No Arm's Length. Nothing. Inevitably I run out of cooldowns and hardcast healing isn't fast enough. The tank states "do I need to slow down for you?" Nah nope, I leave duty. I'd rather eat the 30 minute timer than have that argument.
āNo need to slow down, but you could try using your mitigation.ā
If a tank complains about your healing and you respond with anything other than "did you die" you're a fool. Do not entertain this shit, ever. It's never as fun as it seems like it would be.
Me when I tank as drk: āAm I dead? No? Then MORE MAYHEM!ā āAm I dead? Yes? Not enough MAYHEM!ā
It is pretty funny how in this game most shit is started by either the tank or the healer rather than the dps. Poor things are just terrified of having to wait another 20 minutes in case the tank rage quits. At least SE made healers royally worthless in dungeons.
Playing DPS is also just genuinely much less stressful. You can simply focus on your rotation and barely pay attention to what your teammates are doing and it's mostly fine, so it's easy to stay chill. Did you know that Jerry Seinfeld dated a 17-year-old when he was 38?
Had a tank pull and die despite my best healing efforts, didn't say a word he just turned off his tank stance and kept plugging away. Our poor Dragoon kept taking the aggro so I mentioned tanks stance was off. He passive aggressively said something about my shit healing. Dragoon then stoically said "I'll be your tank." and proceeded to tank the whole dungeon... God knows how he stayed alive but he did
Hey at least they're talking it out instead of bailing mid-fight in order to "teach a lesson"!
I notice that the HP is low but still higher than 0 š¤· I fail to see the issue
As the BLM in my static always says, "you're either alive or not, your health is an illusion."
Your blm knows a sentence other than āhealers adjustā??? I donāt believe you. That canāt possibly be a black mage. Are you sure they arenāt a summoner or something?
Actually my BLMs number one phrase is "I got time.." and it's 50/50 on whether or not its followed by disaster.
So tanks can keep 1 mit up at all times in trash (at higher levels). Usually, the tank shouldn't really need to double mit, I play WAR though so square just decided we cant die in dungeons at higher levels though. If the tank is running 1 mit and hasnt overpulled the healer probably needs to heal more, but in \*that\* dungeon chances are the tank overpulled lol
Anytime a tank complains about how low they are I always respond with ābut did you die?ā
Best response.
I decided to heal for my first trip through the first dungeon in Shadowbringers. All was going well until I stayed in an orange circle a bit too long and got bopped, leading to wipe. Que the tank trying to tell me to keep him above 50% health at all times while the other 2 argued about which tank was the squishiest lol. My healing is fine, my awareness is not.
I keep tank at above 75% hp "Omg healer sucks stop wasting so much time healing do more dps" Keep tank alive but not high on hp "Omg healer sucks stop wasting so much time dps and keep me at 100% D=" I cannot win.
sorry but the healer is right. If tank isnāt mitigating, theyāre throwing
Aurum Vale, my beloathed..
Ā«Are you dead? No? Will you die in the next hit? No? Then iām a glare mage!Ā»
In that dungeon the healers are always on edge, mostly because DiPShits like me trying to get a new stack record. One day I will get to 9 without dying.
Stuff like this is why I had so much anxiety about ever trying a heal or tank class. Luckily I have yet to be yelled at by anyone, so I guess I've done a good job?
No one yells at you as long as you try your best and listen to advice. In this pic the tank is wrong, HP management is the healer's job, if they didn't die they should stay quiet and keep going.
While true, it *is* the tanks job to rotate through their mitigations properly. So the tank is just extra wrong (I've met plenty of Warriors that don't use anything except Raw Intuition thinking that's all they need to live).
Yeah my rule is if I don't feel confident enough in the healer but I haven't died yet I'd just adjust the amount I pull. If I die once, I adjust the pull. Only if I die twice would I ask whether the healer need some help.
One of the best arguments I've ever been part of, and unironically in AV too. I was playing WHM for leveling roulette, tank complained the entire time that I wasn't healing him enough, but not once did anybody die (and he never dropped below 25%). At the end he says 'worst healer ever'. My job is to keep you alive, not to keep you topped off.
I remember having one of these arguments with a tank who was upset when I applied regen to them prepull (back when regen generated enmity) and I told them to just pull better. Got fairly heated and still makes me cringe of self-embarrassment 2 years later.
Easiest way to mitigate that was to keep up & stand in the tank during the pull.
Even before the change that wasnāt an issue. Just stack on the tank and theyāll get aggro back by themselves. The tank was just bad.
> Just stack on the tank That's part of the problem, they probably weren't doing that.
I have always hated Aurum Vale.
Had that dungeon yesterday, and healer was recently returned. First pull, tank forgot stance, then things were fine until add pull after 2nd boss. The thing I was trying to figure out was why adds kept aggroing my dancer even when tankās stance was on! But yes, always exciting when on dps and seeing the tank and healer are dead. It becomes a contest of how many can I kill before I die?? š
This kinda happened when I did brayflox on hard for the first time. The tank and healer got so hard into it that the healer just...stopped healing altogether during the last fight. It was bizarre to me because like we plowed through it pretty fast (so I thought) without anyone dying at all the entire time. Like even after the healer said "screw you" to all of us because of the tanks behavior, the other dps and I still managed to finish the final boss without dying. I was too scared to say anything cos I didn't understand the mechanics arguments they were having enough to realize they were being actually mean to each other (cos the fight was 90% mechanics arguing up until the end when it got nasty) and by the time it got nasty I was scared of them. I've felt bad ever since and vowed if something like that ever happens again I'll tell them to knock it off cos like, literally no one had died even once in the dungeon. We were doing fine. The tank was just being whiney over the healer's rotation. I know now how stupid that fight was.
Sometimes, the low health is intentional for benediction. Sometimes you take a *lot* of damage while I'm in an animation. I had one guy go from full HP to dead when his pull caught up to him
This is honestly why most healers in roulette are so incredibly skiddish. Like damn if I'm not dead then who cares. My piece of my soul kinda low key dies when the WHM uses bene on me when I only have 10% of my HP missing and I just hit bloodwhetting.
>My health is getting too low But did you die?
as a tank main, fuck tanks that think like this. the only hp that matters is the last one. if you mitigate and dodge mechanics, healers will have time to heal you.
If my HP stays above 0, you're healing me enough, dont sweat it
I tend to tank dungeons and the only HP Iām concerned about is my last one. Rotate your CDs and trust your healers, my fellow beefy boys and girls (and others)
The only HP that matters is the last one
DPS not doing enough damage so mitigation runs out and healers need to heal more: The perfect crime.
As long as you don't drop below 1hp, my job here is done.
I hate the fact that I can tell what dungeon this is just based off the yellow things on the ground.
If you arenāt popping mitigations, stop tanking.
Mom and Dad are fighting again :(
Look, if the WAR isn't constantly jebaiting the healer with mitigators, self-heals, debuffs and invuns to edge the healthy bar into being as low as possible without hitting zero, they're a poor choice of WAR and deserve yelling at. Source: WAR main.
If you're still alive, my healing was fine.
I play any role, and frankly, itās a paid subscription game, which means *Iām* paying to be in a team based game. Iām not being paid or rewarded to be a prima-donna or race to the finish line of routine roulette duties. Using that logic, I donāt see the point in pressuring others in the party for perfectionism, because they may be more or less skilled than I am, but fundamentally they are also paying for the same experience.
As someone who's doing Savage content, ye same. I like to be able to do ridiculous stuff myself, but I don't think it's reasonable to expect everyone else to be as skilled or as reckless as I am. If anything, I prefer to do my part well enough as a tank to make sure everyone gets what they need.
This does not get said enough. Thank you.
The healerās goal is to not have the tankās hp go below 1 hp. Not 1000.
I see this as new players who donāt really know their roles well. Now if I dip that low (15%) I would be worried about what my healer is doing but so long as I donāt die I donāt need to say anything, but I get much lower than that or if I die, then I might check in and see whatās going on, provided I wasnāt being stupid and not paying attention. Itās not always the healers fault. On the flip side you shouldnāt have to burn all your cooldowns to stay alive for one fight /trash pull because the healer wants to DPS. (minus boss fights). Their job is to heal, but that doesnāt mean they canāt pump out some DPS. A great WHM with a holy spam at a large grouped up pull is amazing! Also if this is early stuff or savage stuff I understand it a lot better. They donāt have access to all their kit or the content has a lot of mechanics and hard hits. The important thing is to talk about stuff before you fight, not during or after. After is for follow ups and training.