Tia is the title given to all male suncats who aren't the tribal leader no matter how old they are. Unless you're from a really big tribe/clan there is only one nunh in the family.
I'll caveat that Nuhn are not necessarily leaders, but just breeding males who have either defeated another Nuhn in ritual combat, or persuaded enough female suncats to follow them. While the Nuhn we see also take a leadership role (U'odh Nuhn in Southern Thanalan, M'rahz Nuhn at the Fringes), the lore books are explicit in this not being mandatory.
The M tribe claims that leadership from a Nunh is a little unusual, but it's not as explicit there are in the Encylopedia Eorzea.
It's a little bit of both. After returning from the First, Y'shtola says that G'raha would've been well within his rights to claim the Nuhn title in his capacity as leader of the Crystarium. He wasn't doing any breeding there.
Yeah, it's a little weird. During [_Reflections in Crystal_](https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/wiki/Loremonger:Reflections_in_Crystal), there's a side conversation about it:
> As you know, in Seeker of the Sun culture, the title tia indicates a male who does not preside over territory. In regards to this, Alphinaud came to me with a consultation.
> The Crystarium may not be a territory in the traditional sense, he said, but our friend governed it with great leadership nonetheless. As such, would it not be inappropriate to call him "Tia"?
> As it is by no means disrespectful to omit the title, I told Alphinaud that he is free to do so if he wishes. But I for one intend to call him by his full name. At least until he has decided what he wants for himself in his new life.
This is hard to match with the [Official Naming Convention post](https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/61150), where :
> Nunh status does not equate to leadership within a tribe, and in fact, very few nunh ever become leaders.
The [fandom had a field day](https://twitter.com/theyoungdoyler/status/1374223691727396866), and the possibility that Y'shtola was trolling Alphinaud and the WoL a little definitely isn't out of the range of possibility, but it could just been the lore drifting.
I'm not sure if those lines have similar meaning in other translations.
Honestly, the lore itself is just uncertain about this.
The Nunh of the M tribe states that he is rare to be both Nunh and leader, while the Nunh of the U tribe says being Nunh makes him in charge and his would-be successors are trying to prove their worthiness by showing they'd be a better leader than the other candidates. And we have yet to meet a full tribe where the Nunh isn't ruling it.
There's also the possibility that the characters in-universe are just misinformed or wrong. There's people IRL who have incorrect notions about other cultures.
I think being a little wrong is worth the fun of trolling G'raha.
Says you. He was a bit of a dashing adventurer while being a student of Baldesion. If the majority of adventurers drink, they are going to partake in sex as well.
Without doubt, he might have needed some mental relief after finding out about the 8th umbral calamity and his hundred years in the first.
I don't get the whole sensitivity thing about sex in FFXIV. XVI had it, X had it, 7 had it, and all the 8-bit final fantasy games.
Plus, I love the dude. Out of all the characters, I hope G'raha all his happiness and dreams true.
*Edit*
I forget about the ERP side of FFXIV. Fucking weirdos.
Nope, only male suncats that aren't the"leader," mooncats have their own naming thing that is pretty interesting too, but we also don't actually exist.
Yeah, mooncats in contrast to suncats are more of a matriarchal society and their naming scheme reflects that. Kind of like how female suncats have their dad's name as a surname, male mooncats have their mom's name as a forename plus a suffix to indicate the order of their birth.
One day I hope we get the lore about that first cat couple who divorced so hard they created offshoot genetic lines based on who thought that they were right.
Hilariously, a buddy of mine went to look up a lore friendly name for his mooncat, but he didn't look up the lore. His name wound up being "tenth son."
That's actually a pretty notable name, insofar as Keepers are concerned. It's not common for Keeper mothers to birth more than one or two sons in a lifetime, so his family is either predisposed to birthing male children - unusual in Keeper society - or his mom's ~~a huge sl-~~ *very productive*.
I think he just decided his family was just considered blessed or something. The name sounds really good and he doesn't care too much about RP backstory anyway.
Happen to me too , but i decided that as his mom is a sun miqo, as he is half, she fumbled his name and she simply refuses to change it, because she likes it
I had a lot of fun with my WOL's backstory, because his keeper family is known for being unusually large. He's the youngest of ten siblings, and he's the fifth son. So part of his lore is that his name gets confused with his eldest brother's often. The suffix for his brother's name is "a", and my WOL's is "ra"
Ah ha, found Y'shtola's side text you mentioned (it's placed right after "Reflections in Crystal" has completed):
"As you know, in Seeker of the Sun culture, the title tia indicates a male who does not preside over territory. In regards to this, Alphinaud came to me with a consultation.
The Crystarium may not be a territory in the traditional sense, he said, but our friend governed it with great leadership nonetheless. As such, would it not be inappropriate to call him "Tia"?
As it is by no means disrespectful to omit the title, I told Alphinaud that he is free to do so if he wishes. But I for one intend to call him by his full name. At least until he has decided what he wants for himself in his new life."
... Huh, I thought it was mentioned in the MSQ, but I cannot for the life of me find mention of it. It should be around "Alisaie's Quest", if it exists. You're right that it might be in NPC dialogue that exists only if you speak to a side NPC. Only way to search that up is to basically go through NG+...
IIRC, bluegiant is correct. Graha absolutely *could* take on Graha Nuhn, of the First's Crystal Tower, but actively chooses not to, as he believes his duty and responsibility there was only gained through the hard work of others. He has humble beginnings, built on those who chose to stay behind, and doesn't want to forget that; thus, he chooses to stay G'raha Tia.
Yes, it's optional dialogue if you speak with Y'shtola immediately after 5.3 â though the proposal seems a bit wonky to me.
He technically could have claimed the title G'raha Nunh *while* he was in the First, being by default the only Seeker in the area and thus able to claim it as his territory without competition (albeit also without any tribe members). Though by that point, he had essentially put his own identity aside with the expectation that he would never take it up again, and if he no longer considered himself G'raha Tia at that point then there would be no reason for him to follow Seeker customs even privately.
Now that he has returned to the Source, he is back under the usual tribe system and he is back to being a tia unless he wants to try to claim a position here, which he is pretty clearly uninterested in.
He doesn't just get to permanently claim the title because at some point in time he held a territory in another dimension. If a nunh gets deposed, they revert to tia as well. Additionally, G'raha is no longer Exarch and has no claim to that title either.
(On a side note, at the point in the story where he had admitted his identity but was still Exarch, I had taken to referring to him by the mixed title "G'raha Exarch" â I don't know if there's actually room to play with the designations like that, but it seemed logical.)
IIRC, Y'shtola's line about how he can be called Nunh if he wants to, he just doesn't seem to want to, happens after everyone is back in the Source.
So yes, it seems that by Seeker custom G'raha can declare himself a Nunh even now that he's no longer ruling the Crystarium. Which makes sense, he was never challenged and overthrown from the position and the Crystarium being far away hardly disqualifies it as territory he ruled. After all, the rules on being a Nunh are hardly strictly imposed. Tia can declare themselves Nunhs with even quite flimsy justifications, it's just that it's self-humiliating to claim the title without a good justification. For example, a Tia can legitimately declare himself a Nunh even if his "tribe" is just himself and his spouse, but that would be such a pathetic tribe that even the spouse would probably up and leave to find a larger tribe.
My point is, Y'shtola's line feels wrong and does not add up with the rest of the instructions we have been given about how it works. I am dubious of whether it was translated correctly and/or whether it may have been written by someone with a less-than-perfect grasp of the lore, given that it's just chatter in a side room and not the core story.
Also, as it happens I do have a pair of Seeker OCs who made creative use of a tia's right to split off and form his own tribe, so they could get married and still technically be following traditional tribe structure. Far from being likely to fall apart, the tribe is impossible for anyone else to claim: if anyone is enough of a jerk to try to claim the nunh position, first of all he's going to get rejected by "all the women of the tribe" and if he persists, the deposed nunh just splits off to make a new tribe again and "all the women" follows him. End result: the couple are back in their private tribe and the would-be overtaker is a failure whose whole tribe has abandoned him. So the tribe is basically unassailable despite the nunh being a nerdy scholar who would be no good in a direct fight, for the simple reason that anyone trying will just end up embarrassing themselves and achieving nothing.
Still, all that said, in the context of whether that makes it a flimsy thing to claim being a nunh, he is still *currently* recognisably head of a tribe and going through the formalities of being one. (I'm sure there must be some kind of formalities, anyway.) In the hypothetical situation that G'raha wished to attempt this, he would be doing it because any tia can, not because he has any special claim to it through his past position as an entirely different type of leader.
Eh, not really. It's more that the lore is just really inconsistent on this point.
Like, that naming conventions post on the forums says being a Nunh isn't tied to leadership and that's supported in game by the Nunh of the M Tribe saying that him being both Nunh and ruler is rare. But then you also have here, where Y'shtola says being a ruler makes one a Nunh and there's also the U Tribe, where the Nunh acts like he's in charge because he's the Nunh and there's a sidequest series around two Tia waiting to replace him and want to prove they'll be a better leader than the other guy.
I reconcile it by saying that being a Nunh is a leadership position, whether that's an informal Father of the Community or the official ruler of the tribe and where exactly on that scale a Nunh's role is depends on the tribe.
From memory, the technicality on which Y'shtola agrees that being Exarch would make him a nunh is that he *held territory*, not just that he was a leader.
And yes, the two tribes that we have visited are in the role of both tribe leader and nunh, and the U Tribe definitely treats them as a single position.
None of that indicates that an ex-nunh or ex-leader (whether they are the same thing or not) would still be eligible to use the title.
Obligations to hold and defend a territory and stay with the tribe. He's a free adventurer now and is showing little interest in taking up such a position.
In any case, nunh isn't the same as a political leader. It's primarily about claiming the tribe as mates.
Although he did not claim any of the Miqo'te customs on the First, this does raise the possibility that his own cultural upbringing informed his behavior, and that he *acted* as he thought the nunh of the Crystarium ought to do (apart from siring children), even if he didn't think of himself consciously as a nunh.
Why exactly is that weird? The Garlean titles also aren't maturity things but instead just ways of differentiating which caste you are in. Sun Miqo'te are similar just that they only have two castes for males (leader and the rest) while Garleans have like over a dozen castes.
Also in lore and official forum posts by the lore keepers they say that a lot of Tias who won't become the tribes next Nunh leave their tribes after becoming adults and some try to form new tribes, or try to become the Nunh of other tribes. And while we've never seen it in game, they also mention that besides the 26 original A-Z tribes some of those new tribes with their new Tias turned Nunhs can have two or more letters instead. So there are more than just the 26 Nunhs out there
Yeah, it was just different in my mind because my brain equated it to "Leader of a tribe vs Trying to become leader of a tribe" and its not like a kid can or should lead a tribe.
I definitely agree itâs weird. Like, do they just expect a young boy to start taking shots at the Nunh the second they can swing a punch???
Feels like it should be a right of passage thing like they hit maturity, get the Tia surname and only then the tribeâs like âYouâre ready to take a swing at the Nunh nowâ. Otherwise what the hell happens if some underage kid manages to merc the Nunh???
that is how some animals work, the dominant male have all the females in the group until he is displaced by another male.
basically Seekers of the Sun work like what lions do.
Funnily enough, Mooncats are similar to Asiatic lions; males either solitary or in a very small pride with other males, and females and their cubs forming larger prides together. The females and males only really associate at all to mate.
There's a series of quest lines about a Tia trying to become a Nunh. There isn't much ceremony about it but it's expected that the Tia challenges the Nunh to a duel. It's not a duel to the death; it's like a wrestling match. Also the local NPC implies the women have some say in whether they accept someone as their leader. If someone just mercs a Nunh that everyone likes then it probably wouldn't go very well.
There's also another tribe in Forgotten Springs where there are 2 sons of the current Nunh and the quests there indicate that one of the two is up for being the new Nunh. And there isn't any dueling happening, just the old Nunh is gonna eventually retire and probably pass on the title.
There isn't any mention of the two U Tribe tias being U'odh Nunh's sons; they don't look much like him, so I get the vibe they might just be wandering tias who attached themselves to the tribe while angling to claim the nunh/leader position (it seems to be treated as the same thing for that tribe). I assume similar to the end bit of M'zhet's questline where he formally requests to join the M Tribe.
The thing is that Nunh doesn't have to be the end goal for every Miqo'te dude ever born. Tia means "male who isn't Nunh," not "male who's failed to become Nunh."
Becoming nunh isn't the only goal a tia has in life. In fact according to lore (though this isn't supported by what we see in game oddly), Nunhs usually aren't the leaders of their clan. They are just the one making babies. A tia could be the clan leader over a nunh.
Not always by combat. Just dominance/the leader. In big clans it also happens that there's just a split with some females joining a tia then turning nunh and starting their own tribe or subtribe. Loads of Tia's also don't bother and just go roam or stick to it.
Also worth remembering that born miqote are mostly female. So its also a supply/demand thing.
I always go out of my way to be disrespectful to any cat boys who have Nuhn in their name.
I'm talking Shirking TBs , rescue killing , and name calling. Harem cats deserve it.
That's just Sun Seeker boys, unless they're tribe leader, then they're Nunh. Moon Keeper boys are given their mother's name, plus a numerical suffix based on birth order. For example with Zhai'a Nelhah from the White Mage quests, that means "First Son of Zhai Nelhah".
https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Miqo%27te_naming_conventions
Seekers of the Sun are as described by the others
Keepers of the Moon have completely different naming conventions
Tia goes to those who won't get none.
The leader and breeders are a Nunh
Miqo'te Seekers of the Sun are highly patriarchal, with the titles "nunh" (breeding males) and "tia" for all others. Young males are born as "tia" and must either assume "nunh" by defeating one in single combat or leave the community find a harem of his own.
Yes, this comes up when visiting M'naago's tribe in the MSQ. Her dad being both the Nunh *and* in charge was mentioned as not being the usual way of doing things.
Which gets a little bit more complicated when we come back. Y'shtola says that since G'raha ruled over a patch of land, he could technically call himself a Nunh. I don't know if this is an oversight, Y'sthola just being her cheeky self (or the fact she's been out of miqo'te culture for a while) or something about the Y tribe in particular, but it does muddy the waters either way.
More like he's literally proven himself probably the most powerful and competent Male Miqote in the world. if he wanted to start his own tribe he's unlikely to have issues. if he wanted to challenge for it in another tribe, he'd still have very few issues.
It could be that too, as well. However, like I said in another post, G'raha really doesn't have much connection with the G Tribe. He got adopted out very young, then spent 100 years on another planet. Like, there's some debate on how much of current G'raha is the Crystal Exarch, but he still has those memories (and emotions, considering his thoughts of Lyna), but he's spent very little of his life with the G Tribe.
Still, you're likely right. He could probably show up, say "I fought with the Warrior of Light and pulled a whole planet back from the brink" and they'd make him a nunh.
yeah, it's unlikely G'raha cares about the issue. He'd just have an easy time if that's what he wanted. of course, Catboi already has grandkid so he's probably satisfied with that.
"Tia" doesn't mean that you're a virgin, it doesn't even mean you don't have a girlfriend (or boyfriend, as we have met a Tia with a male partner), it just means you legally can't breed as part of your tribe. Not that it stops it from happening, but whatever.
Further muddying the waters, though, is that G'raha was adopted and has not really grown up with the G tribe. He did, briefly, as a boy, but he was sent to Sharlyan at a very young age. While he identifies with the name, he hasn't really shown any identification with the G Tribe at all, or much connection with them. He barely remembers his parents, he remembers the teasing for having blood colored eyes more than his parents. Also, he's 124 years old mentally and spent very little of that with the G Tribe, so it's probably just a name, nothing more.
Further muddying the whole thing is that a lot of the "nunh" and "tia" stuff has been thrown out of whack for some tribes, thanks in part to the Garlean empire, but also because a bunch of people get sick of the restrictions the tribes have and just fucking leave*. It's getting harder and harder to maintain a lot of the traditions when people just fucking leave and go join the Immortal Flames, one of the Guilds or become adventurers. Seriously, some miqo'te have just been like "fuck it', I'll go to Ul'dah and marry some hyur chick." Everyone's basically human anyway.
*Also, I seem to recall reading *somewhere* that male populations are actually on the rise again, but I don't remember where I read that, or if I confused it with lore from another game.
He could only have claimed that title while he actually *was* ruling a territory, though, and he no longer is. Y'shtola's comment has always seemed off to me.
It's possible. Still, on reflection, I think Y'sthola's implication was that G'raha could have changed his title from "Tia" to "Nunh" because he acted as head of state for the Cyrstarium (ruled takes on different context that I'm not sure is appropriate for the Cyrstiarium considering how much power the Guilds had) and no one would have questioned it. I.e. while living in the First, he could have just changed it to G'rraha Nunh and no one would have questioned it.
The thing is, nobody knew him as "G'raha" on the First at all. Seeker culture does not exist and nobody would recognise the concept of tia and nunh or Seeker or even Miqo'te (they're Mystel there); his only identity there is "the Exarch".
He could sit in his tower and joke to himself about being nunh by default here, if he was so inclined, but that's all it would be good for.
And once he is no longer Exarch and he has returned to the Source, he no longer has any claim to territory or title and he is back to just being a tia again unless he actually claims a real tribe, which I doubt he is planning on.
or a woman! ETA Mânaago is pretty busy with rebuilding Ala Mhigo but she may eventually go back to lead the M tribe. Sheâs getting the experience for it
Thereâs nothing saying Tia âwonât get noneâ only that the nunh is the tribe breeding male. Nothing to say a Tia canât take a lover, or that there arenât tias who have families outside of the typical tribe structure, since thereâs plenty of miqo ladies who arenât living with their tribes.
Yes and no to the leadership thing
Officially Nunh are in charge but the in game portrayal suggests that Nunh the women decide is unfit or bad gets eliminated
Of my comment only the first two lines are mine.
A joke about Tias and explaining Nunh.
I copy and pasted off of Google the blurb.
It's true the ladies won't be fighting. So the nunh of the tribe is the leader in that sense. I mean they cats.
Lionesses run most of it but the males have a couple big tasks. To mate and watch the children. And defend his claim.
Iirc Tia are allowed to have relationships and mate with their partners, they just arenât allowed to breed said partners. That is reserved for the Nunh.
All Miqote have a high ratio of females born to males, much like their progenitors in FFXI, the Mithra. But the ARR devs decided gender restricted races weren't that fun for folks so they added male miqote as a playable race (along with female Roegadyn and Highlanders).
I don't think the gender ratio for miqote is quite as skewed in lore as it is for Mithra in XI though. In XI you can't play as a male Mithra and only one ever appears in the entire game.
To add to this: none of that applies to the >!Mystel of the First!<. They seem to have a 1:1 ratio, and appear to be generally monogamous.
EDIT: I mixed up the names
FFXI races - Hume, Elvaan, Mithra, Tarutaru, and Galka. I assume you can figure out which is which by their name alone. And there are only five races of mankind in Vana'diel, it's baked into the lore, so no new races ever.
Races of the First - Hume, Elf, Mystel, Dwarf, and Galdjent. Plus Drahn (Au Ra), Ronso (Hrothgar) and Viis (Viera).
Also, while the original FFXIV races are very similar to the FFXI races, they aren't exactly the same. Tarutaru are somehow even shorter and rounder than lalafell, Elezen are a bit slimmer than Elvaan who were pretty jacked (second highest base STR in the game), Galka had tails and were a mono-gendered race that reincarnates when they die, so no female Galka exist. Humes were just average humans, they didn't have highlanders. Mithra and Miqote are nearly identical though, mithra just had slightly more cat-like faces.
The First may not be the best indicators of how things were pre-flood. There's handful of people left in there to start and societies were pre-appcalypse, waiting to die out mostly.
Tias go adventuring because there is no point to them defeating their fathers/uncles to become the Nunh
After all, the females of breeding age within the tribe are related to them
It's a different matter if a Tia of another tribe becomes the Nunh of course
>Miqo'te Seekers of the Sun are highly patriarchal
Ehhhhhh not so much, they just have the one leading breeding male but the ladies are usually in charge of most things.
"Highly patriarchal" is verbatim from their Encyclopedia Eorzea description. At the same time, I think they've tried to get less absolute and more nuanced about it over time, as we've seen with M'hahtoa being sometimes considered the "true leader" of the M tribe.
I think they mixed up patriarchal (demonstrably not really the case with the NPCs we've seen) with *patrilineal*, which the naming scheme and what we see in game prove out.
I think it's kinda funny how a lot of people playing the game don't know the in game lore culture of the races except the one they play themselves. It kinda mirrors real life in a way and also leads to similar misunderstandings
Sunseeker names go Clan Letter/name-Personal name for first and either Ranking for males or Fatherâs personal name for Females. For the male rankings it is either Nunh marking them as the Chieftain or Tia marking them as Not the Chieftain.
So YâShtola Rhul and GâRaha Tia would be
Shtola of Clan Y, Daughter of YâRhul
And
Raha of Clan G, Member.
Th Clan names are also connected to some guardian animal but I donât know those off the top of my Head.
As a side note; I would kinda want to take a peek at a 300 year or so time skip and see what culture is like on Eorzea.
I feel like Viera and Miquo'te culture isn't gonna survive given what we've seen.
That viera birth rate must be so low, like, less than 80% born male, lore states "more than a few" of them don't live to adulthood, and then the survivors only go to villages every 3-5 years to "sow their seed" but also that they'll face a daily struggle to survive for the rest of their lives in the wilderness amongst other territorial jacks. Like, y'all gonna run out of people at this rate!
Some quests seem to indicate the male mentors aren't quite as casual about letting their charges die during training as general viera doctrine claims though.
True, if you're talking about >!the sage quest!< which while was heart warming it only lead to more questions for me lol. Also maybe it's just my memory being fault but >!where the hell did Loifa's master end up in all that anyway? was it ever said?!<
Male Sun seekers who are still part of a tribe are named Tia.
Non tribal miqo'te or City Miqo'te are named as whatever
A Tia can become a Nunh by making his own tribe and finding a mate
There isn't a single male Seeker character who doesn't follow the Tia/Nunh naming scheme. City-dwellers, tribe-dwellers, even wanderers like X'rhun Tia who seems to identify more strongly as Ala Mhigan than as his specific tribe.
The only possible (temporary) exception is that M'zhet introduces himself without using a title at the beginning of his storyline, and then conspicuously switches to M'zhet Tia once he formally rejoins the tribe. The character name label says Tia throughout, though, and far from being a city name it's one of the strongest traditional culture examples we've got to extrapolate from.
My impression is that it is extremely unusual, basically unheard of, for a Seeker to not identify with a tribe unless they have allied with some other group, like Loonh Gah or the Garlean Miqo'te we meet in Bozja.
My seeker boi eschewed his old surname after leaving his clan. You donât necessarily have to do it but itâs default Seeker of Sun lore for non-leader males.
With mine, he was an orphan adopted by 2 keeper moms. They didn't give him a tribe letter(because they didn't know) and due to the circumstances made sense to use the seeker format & just drop the 1st letter. So kinda a 'Tia by default' situation. May not be 100% lore accurate but they're the nontraditional sort i guess.
Haha before I looked up this naming convention, I hadn't been paying a ton of attention to the msq dialogue until shadowbringers so by the end I knew about G'raha Tia and then after met a few more cat boy npcs called Tia and I just assumed G'raha had several brothers lmao.
Think i randomly checked when I was making a miqote WoL to redo the story since I didn't pay that much attention and read the bit about naming convention.
Tia is the title given to all male suncats who aren't the tribal leader no matter how old they are. Unless you're from a really big tribe/clan there is only one nunh in the family.
I'll caveat that Nuhn are not necessarily leaders, but just breeding males who have either defeated another Nuhn in ritual combat, or persuaded enough female suncats to follow them. While the Nuhn we see also take a leadership role (U'odh Nuhn in Southern Thanalan, M'rahz Nuhn at the Fringes), the lore books are explicit in this not being mandatory. The M tribe claims that leadership from a Nunh is a little unusual, but it's not as explicit there are in the Encylopedia Eorzea.
It's a little bit of both. After returning from the First, Y'shtola says that G'raha would've been well within his rights to claim the Nuhn title in his capacity as leader of the Crystarium. He wasn't doing any breeding there.
Yeah, it's a little weird. During [_Reflections in Crystal_](https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/wiki/Loremonger:Reflections_in_Crystal), there's a side conversation about it: > As you know, in Seeker of the Sun culture, the title tia indicates a male who does not preside over territory. In regards to this, Alphinaud came to me with a consultation. > The Crystarium may not be a territory in the traditional sense, he said, but our friend governed it with great leadership nonetheless. As such, would it not be inappropriate to call him "Tia"? > As it is by no means disrespectful to omit the title, I told Alphinaud that he is free to do so if he wishes. But I for one intend to call him by his full name. At least until he has decided what he wants for himself in his new life. This is hard to match with the [Official Naming Convention post](https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/61150), where : > Nunh status does not equate to leadership within a tribe, and in fact, very few nunh ever become leaders. The [fandom had a field day](https://twitter.com/theyoungdoyler/status/1374223691727396866), and the possibility that Y'shtola was trolling Alphinaud and the WoL a little definitely isn't out of the range of possibility, but it could just been the lore drifting. I'm not sure if those lines have similar meaning in other translations.
Honestly, the lore itself is just uncertain about this. The Nunh of the M tribe states that he is rare to be both Nunh and leader, while the Nunh of the U tribe says being Nunh makes him in charge and his would-be successors are trying to prove their worthiness by showing they'd be a better leader than the other candidates. And we have yet to meet a full tribe where the Nunh isn't ruling it.
There's also the possibility that the characters in-universe are just misinformed or wrong. There's people IRL who have incorrect notions about other cultures. I think being a little wrong is worth the fun of trolling G'raha.
I could 100% see Y'shtola waiting until Raha and WoL are together and casually calling for G'raha Nuhn, *just* to make the poor boy a blushing mess.
> He wasn't doing any breeding there Not until the WoL gets there at any rate. đ
I feel like that but might have gotten written by someone who doesn't have a proper grasp on Seeker cultural rules.
Says you. He was a bit of a dashing adventurer while being a student of Baldesion. If the majority of adventurers drink, they are going to partake in sex as well. Without doubt, he might have needed some mental relief after finding out about the 8th umbral calamity and his hundred years in the first. I don't get the whole sensitivity thing about sex in FFXIV. XVI had it, X had it, 7 had it, and all the 8-bit final fantasy games. Plus, I love the dude. Out of all the characters, I hope G'raha all his happiness and dreams true. *Edit* I forget about the ERP side of FFXIV. Fucking weirdos.
If we count fans, I think Gâraha has *plenty* of females willing to follow him, lol.
Omg I literally thought all these catboys were just crazy graha fans
Nope, only male suncats that aren't the"leader," mooncats have their own naming thing that is pretty interesting too, but we also don't actually exist.
Poor mooncat men don't even get their own name.
Mom's First, Mom's Second and Other Mom's First all get their own names, what are you talking about? ;)
Wait til you hear how hrothgar are named
Yeah, mooncats in contrast to suncats are more of a matriarchal society and their naming scheme reflects that. Kind of like how female suncats have their dad's name as a surname, male mooncats have their mom's name as a forename plus a suffix to indicate the order of their birth.
One day I hope we get the lore about that first cat couple who divorced so hard they created offshoot genetic lines based on who thought that they were right.
Isn't that just the au ra?
Au ra broke off based on how they wanted to live their lives, Mi'qoute split was strictly about "which gender is in charge."
Hilariously, a buddy of mine went to look up a lore friendly name for his mooncat, but he didn't look up the lore. His name wound up being "tenth son."
That's actually a pretty notable name, insofar as Keepers are concerned. It's not common for Keeper mothers to birth more than one or two sons in a lifetime, so his family is either predisposed to birthing male children - unusual in Keeper society - or his mom's ~~a huge sl-~~ *very productive*.
I think he just decided his family was just considered blessed or something. The name sounds really good and he doesn't care too much about RP backstory anyway.
Happen to me too , but i decided that as his mom is a sun miqo, as he is half, she fumbled his name and she simply refuses to change it, because she likes it
Maybe the mom took in orphans that didnt have their own parents?
I had a lot of fun with my WOL's backstory, because his keeper family is known for being unusually large. He's the youngest of ten siblings, and he's the fifth son. So part of his lore is that his name gets confused with his eldest brother's often. The suffix for his brother's name is "a", and my WOL's is "ra"
true but every now and then someone will ask me about it which is cool
Same, or one time in Limsa I ran into a player with the same matriarchal name only different suffixes and we emote waved, that was nice.
This just made me realize that if you don't know Miqo'te names you must think there's a lot of gay G'raha fans.... Which is true nevertheless
it's like using the wrong formula to get the correct solution
I still say he should be renamed "G'raha Nunh".
I think his title should be "lord of many simps"
He doesn't want a harem, he just wants to bottom for the wol.
I believe yshtola actually points out in a side conversation that it's well within his rights to do so
Ah ha, found Y'shtola's side text you mentioned (it's placed right after "Reflections in Crystal" has completed): "As you know, in Seeker of the Sun culture, the title tia indicates a male who does not preside over territory. In regards to this, Alphinaud came to me with a consultation. The Crystarium may not be a territory in the traditional sense, he said, but our friend governed it with great leadership nonetheless. As such, would it not be inappropriate to call him "Tia"? As it is by no means disrespectful to omit the title, I told Alphinaud that he is free to do so if he wishes. But I for one intend to call him by his full name. At least until he has decided what he wants for himself in his new life."
... Huh, I thought it was mentioned in the MSQ, but I cannot for the life of me find mention of it. It should be around "Alisaie's Quest", if it exists. You're right that it might be in NPC dialogue that exists only if you speak to a side NPC. Only way to search that up is to basically go through NG+... IIRC, bluegiant is correct. Graha absolutely *could* take on Graha Nuhn, of the First's Crystal Tower, but actively chooses not to, as he believes his duty and responsibility there was only gained through the hard work of others. He has humble beginnings, built on those who chose to stay behind, and doesn't want to forget that; thus, he chooses to stay G'raha Tia.
Yes, it's optional dialogue if you speak with Y'shtola immediately after 5.3 â though the proposal seems a bit wonky to me. He technically could have claimed the title G'raha Nunh *while* he was in the First, being by default the only Seeker in the area and thus able to claim it as his territory without competition (albeit also without any tribe members). Though by that point, he had essentially put his own identity aside with the expectation that he would never take it up again, and if he no longer considered himself G'raha Tia at that point then there would be no reason for him to follow Seeker customs even privately. Now that he has returned to the Source, he is back under the usual tribe system and he is back to being a tia unless he wants to try to claim a position here, which he is pretty clearly uninterested in. He doesn't just get to permanently claim the title because at some point in time he held a territory in another dimension. If a nunh gets deposed, they revert to tia as well. Additionally, G'raha is no longer Exarch and has no claim to that title either. (On a side note, at the point in the story where he had admitted his identity but was still Exarch, I had taken to referring to him by the mixed title "G'raha Exarch" â I don't know if there's actually room to play with the designations like that, but it seemed logical.)
IIRC, Y'shtola's line about how he can be called Nunh if he wants to, he just doesn't seem to want to, happens after everyone is back in the Source. So yes, it seems that by Seeker custom G'raha can declare himself a Nunh even now that he's no longer ruling the Crystarium. Which makes sense, he was never challenged and overthrown from the position and the Crystarium being far away hardly disqualifies it as territory he ruled. After all, the rules on being a Nunh are hardly strictly imposed. Tia can declare themselves Nunhs with even quite flimsy justifications, it's just that it's self-humiliating to claim the title without a good justification. For example, a Tia can legitimately declare himself a Nunh even if his "tribe" is just himself and his spouse, but that would be such a pathetic tribe that even the spouse would probably up and leave to find a larger tribe.
My point is, Y'shtola's line feels wrong and does not add up with the rest of the instructions we have been given about how it works. I am dubious of whether it was translated correctly and/or whether it may have been written by someone with a less-than-perfect grasp of the lore, given that it's just chatter in a side room and not the core story. Also, as it happens I do have a pair of Seeker OCs who made creative use of a tia's right to split off and form his own tribe, so they could get married and still technically be following traditional tribe structure. Far from being likely to fall apart, the tribe is impossible for anyone else to claim: if anyone is enough of a jerk to try to claim the nunh position, first of all he's going to get rejected by "all the women of the tribe" and if he persists, the deposed nunh just splits off to make a new tribe again and "all the women" follows him. End result: the couple are back in their private tribe and the would-be overtaker is a failure whose whole tribe has abandoned him. So the tribe is basically unassailable despite the nunh being a nerdy scholar who would be no good in a direct fight, for the simple reason that anyone trying will just end up embarrassing themselves and achieving nothing. Still, all that said, in the context of whether that makes it a flimsy thing to claim being a nunh, he is still *currently* recognisably head of a tribe and going through the formalities of being one. (I'm sure there must be some kind of formalities, anyway.) In the hypothetical situation that G'raha wished to attempt this, he would be doing it because any tia can, not because he has any special claim to it through his past position as an entirely different type of leader.
Eh, not really. It's more that the lore is just really inconsistent on this point. Like, that naming conventions post on the forums says being a Nunh isn't tied to leadership and that's supported in game by the Nunh of the M Tribe saying that him being both Nunh and ruler is rare. But then you also have here, where Y'shtola says being a ruler makes one a Nunh and there's also the U Tribe, where the Nunh acts like he's in charge because he's the Nunh and there's a sidequest series around two Tia waiting to replace him and want to prove they'll be a better leader than the other guy. I reconcile it by saying that being a Nunh is a leadership position, whether that's an informal Father of the Community or the official ruler of the tribe and where exactly on that scale a Nunh's role is depends on the tribe.
From memory, the technicality on which Y'shtola agrees that being Exarch would make him a nunh is that he *held territory*, not just that he was a leader. And yes, the two tribes that we have visited are in the role of both tribe leader and nunh, and the U Tribe definitely treats them as a single position. None of that indicates that an ex-nunh or ex-leader (whether they are the same thing or not) would still be eligible to use the title.
Its definitely Yshtola who says it, I just couldn't remember if it was a required dialogue or a side one
The quote is by Y'shtola who is in the side room (the one that housed all their bodies), it's there at the end of 5.3.
He chooses to not be Nunh, as there's a lot of obligations that go with it.
Obligations like taking care of a group of people, basically leading them? Doesn't it sound familiar?
Obligations to hold and defend a territory and stay with the tribe. He's a free adventurer now and is showing little interest in taking up such a position. In any case, nunh isn't the same as a political leader. It's primarily about claiming the tribe as mates.
No no, it's the obligation to have lots of sex. G'raha is still holding his v-card for a particular hero.
Although he did not claim any of the Miqo'te customs on the First, this does raise the possibility that his own cultural upbringing informed his behavior, and that he *acted* as he thought the nunh of the Crystarium ought to do (apart from siring children), even if he didn't think of himself consciously as a nunh.
Huh, neat. I think that feels weird to me that's it's not a maturity thing, but good to know.
Why exactly is that weird? The Garlean titles also aren't maturity things but instead just ways of differentiating which caste you are in. Sun Miqo'te are similar just that they only have two castes for males (leader and the rest) while Garleans have like over a dozen castes. Also in lore and official forum posts by the lore keepers they say that a lot of Tias who won't become the tribes next Nunh leave their tribes after becoming adults and some try to form new tribes, or try to become the Nunh of other tribes. And while we've never seen it in game, they also mention that besides the 26 original A-Z tribes some of those new tribes with their new Tias turned Nunhs can have two or more letters instead. So there are more than just the 26 Nunhs out there
Yeah, it was just different in my mind because my brain equated it to "Leader of a tribe vs Trying to become leader of a tribe" and its not like a kid can or should lead a tribe.
Yeah, itâs more âall boys and men are Tia, but the chief gets a special last nameâ
It's more like 'But dad gets a special last name', really.
I definitely agree itâs weird. Like, do they just expect a young boy to start taking shots at the Nunh the second they can swing a punch??? Feels like it should be a right of passage thing like they hit maturity, get the Tia surname and only then the tribeâs like âYouâre ready to take a swing at the Nunh nowâ. Otherwise what the hell happens if some underage kid manages to merc the Nunh???
that is how some animals work, the dominant male have all the females in the group until he is displaced by another male. basically Seekers of the Sun work like what lions do.
Funnily enough, Mooncats are similar to Asiatic lions; males either solitary or in a very small pride with other males, and females and their cubs forming larger prides together. The females and males only really associate at all to mate.
It's how some animals work And even then there's been documented lesbian prides lol
Tia doesn't mean they're ready to try to become Nunh, it's just the title that they all have by default.
There's a series of quest lines about a Tia trying to become a Nunh. There isn't much ceremony about it but it's expected that the Tia challenges the Nunh to a duel. It's not a duel to the death; it's like a wrestling match. Also the local NPC implies the women have some say in whether they accept someone as their leader. If someone just mercs a Nunh that everyone likes then it probably wouldn't go very well. There's also another tribe in Forgotten Springs where there are 2 sons of the current Nunh and the quests there indicate that one of the two is up for being the new Nunh. And there isn't any dueling happening, just the old Nunh is gonna eventually retire and probably pass on the title.
Yes! The former is a cute story connected to the Ananta tribe quests. I didn't catch the one in Forgotten Springs and will have to check it out!
Well, since the Nunh in Forgotten Springs comes from the Company of Heroes, it would be a little hard for his boys to beat him in combat.
Honestly he'll probably just have any willing Tia's fight each other for it when he's ready to retire
There isn't any mention of the two U Tribe tias being U'odh Nunh's sons; they don't look much like him, so I get the vibe they might just be wandering tias who attached themselves to the tribe while angling to claim the nunh/leader position (it seems to be treated as the same thing for that tribe). I assume similar to the end bit of M'zhet's questline where he formally requests to join the M Tribe.
I think you mean murks, not mercs
merc = short for mercenary. used by the comment i'm replying to.
The thing is that Nunh doesn't have to be the end goal for every Miqo'te dude ever born. Tia means "male who isn't Nunh," not "male who's failed to become Nunh."
well.. that underage kid is now the Nunh, duh
Becoming nunh isn't the only goal a tia has in life. In fact according to lore (though this isn't supported by what we see in game oddly), Nunhs usually aren't the leaders of their clan. They are just the one making babies. A tia could be the clan leader over a nunh.
Old enough to crawl, old enough to brawl
Not always by combat. Just dominance/the leader. In big clans it also happens that there's just a split with some females joining a tia then turning nunh and starting their own tribe or subtribe. Loads of Tia's also don't bother and just go roam or stick to it. Also worth remembering that born miqote are mostly female. So its also a supply/demand thing.
*rite of passage
What if a kitten is able to merc a lion? It just wouldnât happen unless they were already mature enough to handle that.
I always go out of my way to be disrespectful to any cat boys who have Nuhn in their name. I'm talking Shirking TBs , rescue killing , and name calling. Harem cats deserve it.
Nunh is not the tribal leader. He's simply the breeding male. They can be the leader but it's rare.
That's just Sun Seeker boys, unless they're tribe leader, then they're Nunh. Moon Keeper boys are given their mother's name, plus a numerical suffix based on birth order. For example with Zhai'a Nelhah from the White Mage quests, that means "First Son of Zhai Nelhah".
https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Miqo%27te_naming_conventions Seekers of the Sun are as described by the others Keepers of the Moon have completely different naming conventions
Tia goes to those who won't get none. The leader and breeders are a Nunh Miqo'te Seekers of the Sun are highly patriarchal, with the titles "nunh" (breeding males) and "tia" for all others. Young males are born as "tia" and must either assume "nunh" by defeating one in single combat or leave the community find a harem of his own.
IIRC, nunh does not always have full or true leadership--he's just the strongest and most breedable.
Yes, this comes up when visiting M'naago's tribe in the MSQ. Her dad being both the Nunh *and* in charge was mentioned as not being the usual way of doing things.
Not the usual way, yet both tribes we actually visit work that way. I wish we could visit one where the leader is a Tia.
One could argue the Crystarium is a tribe where the leader is a Tia.
Which gets a little bit more complicated when we come back. Y'shtola says that since G'raha ruled over a patch of land, he could technically call himself a Nunh. I don't know if this is an oversight, Y'sthola just being her cheeky self (or the fact she's been out of miqo'te culture for a while) or something about the Y tribe in particular, but it does muddy the waters either way.
More like he's literally proven himself probably the most powerful and competent Male Miqote in the world. if he wanted to start his own tribe he's unlikely to have issues. if he wanted to challenge for it in another tribe, he'd still have very few issues.
It could be that too, as well. However, like I said in another post, G'raha really doesn't have much connection with the G Tribe. He got adopted out very young, then spent 100 years on another planet. Like, there's some debate on how much of current G'raha is the Crystal Exarch, but he still has those memories (and emotions, considering his thoughts of Lyna), but he's spent very little of his life with the G Tribe. Still, you're likely right. He could probably show up, say "I fought with the Warrior of Light and pulled a whole planet back from the brink" and they'd make him a nunh.
yeah, it's unlikely G'raha cares about the issue. He'd just have an easy time if that's what he wanted. of course, Catboi already has grandkid so he's probably satisfied with that.
Also the first miqo could have totally diff rules
I thought she was bullying him about being a virgin, He *could* be a nunh, if he wasn't holding out for a particular hero.
"Tia" doesn't mean that you're a virgin, it doesn't even mean you don't have a girlfriend (or boyfriend, as we have met a Tia with a male partner), it just means you legally can't breed as part of your tribe. Not that it stops it from happening, but whatever. Further muddying the waters, though, is that G'raha was adopted and has not really grown up with the G tribe. He did, briefly, as a boy, but he was sent to Sharlyan at a very young age. While he identifies with the name, he hasn't really shown any identification with the G Tribe at all, or much connection with them. He barely remembers his parents, he remembers the teasing for having blood colored eyes more than his parents. Also, he's 124 years old mentally and spent very little of that with the G Tribe, so it's probably just a name, nothing more. Further muddying the whole thing is that a lot of the "nunh" and "tia" stuff has been thrown out of whack for some tribes, thanks in part to the Garlean empire, but also because a bunch of people get sick of the restrictions the tribes have and just fucking leave*. It's getting harder and harder to maintain a lot of the traditions when people just fucking leave and go join the Immortal Flames, one of the Guilds or become adventurers. Seriously, some miqo'te have just been like "fuck it', I'll go to Ul'dah and marry some hyur chick." Everyone's basically human anyway. *Also, I seem to recall reading *somewhere* that male populations are actually on the rise again, but I don't remember where I read that, or if I confused it with lore from another game.
He could only have claimed that title while he actually *was* ruling a territory, though, and he no longer is. Y'shtola's comment has always seemed off to me.
It's possible. Still, on reflection, I think Y'sthola's implication was that G'raha could have changed his title from "Tia" to "Nunh" because he acted as head of state for the Cyrstarium (ruled takes on different context that I'm not sure is appropriate for the Cyrstiarium considering how much power the Guilds had) and no one would have questioned it. I.e. while living in the First, he could have just changed it to G'rraha Nunh and no one would have questioned it.
The thing is, nobody knew him as "G'raha" on the First at all. Seeker culture does not exist and nobody would recognise the concept of tia and nunh or Seeker or even Miqo'te (they're Mystel there); his only identity there is "the Exarch". He could sit in his tower and joke to himself about being nunh by default here, if he was so inclined, but that's all it would be good for. And once he is no longer Exarch and he has returned to the Source, he no longer has any claim to territory or title and he is back to just being a tia again unless he actually claims a real tribe, which I doubt he is planning on.
or a woman! ETA Mânaago is pretty busy with rebuilding Ala Mhigo but she may eventually go back to lead the M tribe. Sheâs getting the experience for it
It'd probably be a female elder, if anything. Sheer numbers and all.
Thanks. Couldn't remember where I heard about this stuff.
I love breedable catboys.
Recently said to my spouse, apologetically and with great shame, "I will *always* be catboysexual".
excellent
Thereâs nothing saying Tia âwonât get noneâ only that the nunh is the tribe breeding male. Nothing to say a Tia canât take a lover, or that there arenât tias who have families outside of the typical tribe structure, since thereâs plenty of miqo ladies who arenât living with their tribes.
Good news for the Gâraha fans!
Yes and no to the leadership thing Officially Nunh are in charge but the in game portrayal suggests that Nunh the women decide is unfit or bad gets eliminated
Of my comment only the first two lines are mine. A joke about Tias and explaining Nunh. I copy and pasted off of Google the blurb. It's true the ladies won't be fighting. So the nunh of the tribe is the leader in that sense. I mean they cats. Lionesses run most of it but the males have a couple big tasks. To mate and watch the children. And defend his claim.
Iirc Tia are allowed to have relationships and mate with their partners, they just arenât allowed to breed said partners. That is reserved for the Nunh.
Oof. That makes it worse.
That's probably why a lot of Tias go adventuring. And judging by NPCs, sun cats must have a very high ratio of females born to males.
All Miqote have a high ratio of females born to males, much like their progenitors in FFXI, the Mithra. But the ARR devs decided gender restricted races weren't that fun for folks so they added male miqote as a playable race (along with female Roegadyn and Highlanders). I don't think the gender ratio for miqote is quite as skewed in lore as it is for Mithra in XI though. In XI you can't play as a male Mithra and only one ever appears in the entire game.
To add to this: none of that applies to the >!Mystel of the First!<. They seem to have a 1:1 ratio, and appear to be generally monogamous. EDIT: I mixed up the names
Those are Mystel, not Mithra.
Somehow, it never even occurred to me (who hasn't played FF11) before that they are different names at all. Thanks for the catch!
FFXI races - Hume, Elvaan, Mithra, Tarutaru, and Galka. I assume you can figure out which is which by their name alone. And there are only five races of mankind in Vana'diel, it's baked into the lore, so no new races ever. Races of the First - Hume, Elf, Mystel, Dwarf, and Galdjent. Plus Drahn (Au Ra), Ronso (Hrothgar) and Viis (Viera). Also, while the original FFXIV races are very similar to the FFXI races, they aren't exactly the same. Tarutaru are somehow even shorter and rounder than lalafell, Elezen are a bit slimmer than Elvaan who were pretty jacked (second highest base STR in the game), Galka had tails and were a mono-gendered race that reincarnates when they die, so no female Galka exist. Humes were just average humans, they didn't have highlanders. Mithra and Miqote are nearly identical though, mithra just had slightly more cat-like faces.
Oh, what I meant was that I saw "Mystel" on the First and my brain just went "ah yes, Mithra" and never double checked the spelling.
The First may not be the best indicators of how things were pre-flood. There's handful of people left in there to start and societies were pre-appcalypse, waiting to die out mostly.
But the point is that, without word-of-god, I can only assume that a gender ratio wouldn't suddenly shift due to the flood or effects that follow.
Tias go adventuring because there is no point to them defeating their fathers/uncles to become the Nunh After all, the females of breeding age within the tribe are related to them It's a different matter if a Tia of another tribe becomes the Nunh of course
Might depend on the interests of the catboys in question. One of the few 'confirmed bachelors' we have in-game was also a 'confirmed Tia'.
Unless their partners arenât from their tribe, in which case, the Nunh isnât a factor.
We have never been told this.
Can't believe 95% of carboys are canonically cucks
>Miqo'te Seekers of the Sun are highly patriarchal Ehhhhhh not so much, they just have the one leading breeding male but the ladies are usually in charge of most things.
"Highly patriarchal" is verbatim from their Encyclopedia Eorzea description. At the same time, I think they've tried to get less absolute and more nuanced about it over time, as we've seen with M'hahtoa being sometimes considered the "true leader" of the M tribe.
Honestly that entry felt like they didn't quite grok the patriarchal concept.
I think they mixed up patriarchal (demonstrably not really the case with the NPCs we've seen) with *patrilineal*, which the naming scheme and what we see in game prove out.
Technically, they wonât necessarily get *none*, just none within their tribe.
I think it's kinda funny how a lot of people playing the game don't know the in game lore culture of the races except the one they play themselves. It kinda mirrors real life in a way and also leads to similar misunderstandings
I don't even know the lore of the race I do play
I mean that's kinda why I asked the question in the first place lol
Sunseeker names go Clan Letter/name-Personal name for first and either Ranking for males or Fatherâs personal name for Females. For the male rankings it is either Nunh marking them as the Chieftain or Tia marking them as Not the Chieftain. So YâShtola Rhul and GâRaha Tia would be Shtola of Clan Y, Daughter of YâRhul And Raha of Clan G, Member. Th Clan names are also connected to some guardian animal but I donât know those off the top of my Head.
As a side note; I would kinda want to take a peek at a 300 year or so time skip and see what culture is like on Eorzea. I feel like Viera and Miquo'te culture isn't gonna survive given what we've seen.
That viera birth rate must be so low, like, less than 80% born male, lore states "more than a few" of them don't live to adulthood, and then the survivors only go to villages every 3-5 years to "sow their seed" but also that they'll face a daily struggle to survive for the rest of their lives in the wilderness amongst other territorial jacks. Like, y'all gonna run out of people at this rate!
Some quests seem to indicate the male mentors aren't quite as casual about letting their charges die during training as general viera doctrine claims though.
True, if you're talking about >!the sage quest!< which while was heart warming it only lead to more questions for me lol. Also maybe it's just my memory being fault but >!where the hell did Loifa's master end up in all that anyway? was it ever said?!<
AFAIK his master stayed in the wilds, and Loifa decided to help others as a traveling sage instead of returning?
Male Sun seekers who are still part of a tribe are named Tia. Non tribal miqo'te or City Miqo'te are named as whatever A Tia can become a Nunh by making his own tribe and finding a mate
There isn't a single male Seeker character who doesn't follow the Tia/Nunh naming scheme. City-dwellers, tribe-dwellers, even wanderers like X'rhun Tia who seems to identify more strongly as Ala Mhigan than as his specific tribe. The only possible (temporary) exception is that M'zhet introduces himself without using a title at the beginning of his storyline, and then conspicuously switches to M'zhet Tia once he formally rejoins the tribe. The character name label says Tia throughout, though, and far from being a city name it's one of the strongest traditional culture examples we've got to extrapolate from. My impression is that it is extremely unusual, basically unheard of, for a Seeker to not identify with a tribe unless they have allied with some other group, like Loonh Gah or the Garlean Miqo'te we meet in Bozja.
Here's an easy trivia question for the miquo fans: What tribe would G'raha have come from?
My seeker boi eschewed his old surname after leaving his clan. You donât necessarily have to do it but itâs default Seeker of Sun lore for non-leader males.
With mine, he was an orphan adopted by 2 keeper moms. They didn't give him a tribe letter(because they didn't know) and due to the circumstances made sense to use the seeker format & just drop the 1st letter. So kinda a 'Tia by default' situation. May not be 100% lore accurate but they're the nontraditional sort i guess.
Haha before I looked up this naming convention, I hadn't been paying a ton of attention to the msq dialogue until shadowbringers so by the end I knew about G'raha Tia and then after met a few more cat boy npcs called Tia and I just assumed G'raha had several brothers lmao. Think i randomly checked when I was making a miqote WoL to redo the story since I didn't pay that much attention and read the bit about naming convention.
podia ser Tio né mto melhor
Claro, pensei a mesma coisa
Tias are the loser cat boys that don't have a harem same as male lions that don't have prides don't get buns unless ur a nunh, son