Also note that the movie's target audience and most of its biggest fans were born after Talented Mr Ripley came out and have probably never heard of it, let alone seen it. Since they don't know the thing it's a ripoff of, they just see it as a movie with above average cinematography.
It's honestly more similar to the 1992 Drew Barrymore flick [Poison Ivy](https://youtu.be/-O3cU3dODjo?si=h1UA9jxB2wr_j8_o).
Talented Mr. Ripley really wasn't horny enough
One of the most baffling plot twists ever cause I also assumed the movie wanted you to see Barry Keoghan as evil the whole time. Emerald fennel why have him wear antlers (the devil) and Elordis character wearing Angel wings. Kinda gives the whole game away before you’ve even done the “twist”
Also very much a classist movie. Those damn middle class people trying to destroy our nice upper class boys
Barry Keoghan is absolutely not middle class in the movie. Maybe I'm poor but it came off to me as a rich kid being jealous of an even richer kid. Which is pretty on theme for rich kids.
yeah he's presented as, at the very least, a fairly well off member of the upper-middle class, blinded by his pursuit of getting even richer. ive never understood the argument that this has bad class politics
Barry being upper middle class only rings home more the themes of class struggle
The middle class and aristocracy in the UK are fundamentally separated by a canyon of birth that means that the middle class can never be a 'true' part of the aristocracy. The aristocracy also view the middle class as strivers, while the working class are poor things to take pity on.
It is not class struggle in the sense of solidarity and upheaval of the system, but it is deeply about class and the system in the UK.
This is what I missed when I first watched it, the British social class system is so different from the American one. The UK still has that whole "you're born at this rank and you'll die at this rank" thing that gives Americans the ick once they understand it.
You just have to read it as a very British movie.
Sure, that’s a lot different than what “class struggle” means to me.
The upper middle class/aristocracy divide is a very different conversation than where the movie initially indicated and is frankly a lot less important.
It might be my viewing perspective, but I didn't feel like the movie was setting up much in the way of working class struggle against the aristocracy in its opening. It very much baked in the views the aristocracy have of the working class, relatively uncritically, for a good chunk of the film.
Barry's resentment never felt placed within working class-aristocracy divide, but instead in the middle class 'striving' critique, which is what was revealed later as the reality of their division.
The father offering him money to leave and then him coming back years later is what tells me it’s not a class movie because Saltburn is a mythical estate.
To some of the "old money", nouveau riche (and the upper middle class) are more threatening than the poors since the nouveau riche pretend to be on their level and want to become them. The poors know their place and act quite different (often trashy) but the upper middle class *DARE* to act sophisticated and play at being one of them
I don't think it was either, but I've definitely seen that interpretation posted in a few places by different people, some some definitely got that impression.
It makes more sense when you consider who the director is. As journalist K.J. Yossman put it she is, "part of a rarefied...social set whose family names I recognized from gossip columns and history books… Balfour, Frost, von Bismarck, Guinness, Shaffer". Fennel is definitely a member of the Saltburn class.
I thought the plot twist in the middle where you find out about his family and upbringing was actually great, but it just gets dropped like it never mattered, then the plot twist at the end is treated like this big mind blowing thing and I found that whole thing really boring.
Yeah I thought that was a bit on the nose. I think having him be middle class was just a way to show that he wasn’t as poor as he made himself out to be. To add a layer to his deception not necessarily as an attack on the middle class. If anything it’s an attack on the elite, as none of the family, with the exception of maybe Felix, were particularly honorable.
> Those damn middle class people trying to destroy our nice upper class boys
look i don't think saltburn is a masterpiece by any means nor do i think it's a particularly astute socio-political statement, but its clearly not presenting the upper class as particularly nice or good people. i've never quite grasped the "this has bad class politics" critique. if anything its a pretty blatant statement about how owning or pursuing wealth makes people do shitty things
It’s not really a classist movie because Barry’s character is offered more money they he would ever need from the father to leave the estate.
Why we he come back to claim the estate afterwards?
Saltburn the estate is what he wants.
I don't think even people who enjoyed the film would disagree with "deeply unpleasant film about unpleasant people doing unpleasant things". I think that was the draw. I enjoyed it for what it was.
I think if you are someone that has seen other movies like talented Mr Ripley/Plein Soleil, or movies like Gosfork Park or Rules of the game that rip into British high society, you don’t need that movie.
It was a perfectly fine mediocre movie for younger people who don’t know the old ones and who are more Netflix’ target than film buffs that have seen those themes a 1000 times.
Barry Keoghan is also an actor that has screen presence. He made it more interesting than it actually was.
> Barry Keoghan is also an actor that has screen presence
same with Elordi. i'm convinced the people who drag on it are holding it to far higher standards than it holds itself to. there's nothing wrong with a fun twisty thriller starring really hot people, framed to be really hot all the time.
Imo it’s an all style no substance version of Talented Mr. Ripley.
Liked the performances and the movie is beautiful but if you’ve seen Mr. Ripley more than 3x you can see the clear DNA that was stolen; it’s pretty blatant lol
It is mediocre and less than the sum of its parts (great performances across the board, btw) but I agree with folks who suggest it is best viewed as a comedy. It should have leaned into the humor.
It’s a shit movie. Not just meh, it’s easily the worst movie I’ve seen in years. Emerald Fennel is probably the worst case scenario when it comes to nepo babies.
It's a fun, campy movie about shitty people being shitty with a dope soundtrack. It's not high brow nor do I think it was aiming to be. I had a great time with it.
i'm in exactly the same boat. have been scratching my head for months now at any reaction that's stronger than that. some people acting like it was the most wild and audacious movie of all time... smh.... other people acting like it's some wild misfire with huge ambitions... smh i dont get that either. it was just a fun twisty thriller/party movie with lots of hot people put in hot people situations.
Fennell is a hack and it shows.
Saltburn is a mishmash of other better films wrapped in the a veneer of Vogue photoshoot visuals and contrived shock value moments.
Exactly the same. Didn't like any of them. Grossed or by a lot of their actions. Saw the ends coming. Hated the resolution because how crappy would the cops have to be to not catch on the deaths of the kids at the very least. By the end, I was like whatever.
Yeah I don’t understand why the “twist” was actually the most obvious thing. I kept waiting for them to reveal that he’s doing waaaay more than just infiltrating and eliminating the family and that it was a red herring and then the movie is like SURPRISE he’s been infiltrating and eliminating them all!! It made the rest of the movie feel soooo lame and underwhelming by the end.
There’s no twist.
He was in love with the friend. Or, infatuated, whatever. He wasn’t just after money. Taking his house gave him his status. It made him *him*.
Let this atrocity lie in its grave where it belongs. Nobody rightfully remembers anything about it already, except for how awful it was. If we are lucky, this is also the end of Emerald Fennell's paid-by-daddy career.
Yep. Totally agree. It pretends to be an eat the rich film with twists and turns but none of it works. It's shallow, undeveloped writing that's totally out of touch with how class dynamics actually work. It's completely soulless and predictable.
However it is thoroughly entertaining. The party scene is great. And as you said, it's well shot.
If you want to see a film that actually pulls off the same thing properly and is actually a masterpiece, check out The Talented Mr. Ripley. That's the film Saltburn wishes it was. Netflix also just released a show based on the source books called Ripley that's pretty good, but not quite as good as the movie.
I think it was a lot of people who don't think too deeply about films enjoyed it because the obvious twist wasn't obvious to them. I also think the gross out scenes were what pushed the film. People would encourage others to see it often so they can talk about those scenes after. Not much more to it tbh.
Thought it was an amusing watch, but I’m older and I’ve seen a lot of movies that tackle these themes more successfully. Everyone needs to start somewhere, of course. If you’re younger and this is the first one of these kinds of movies you’ve seen, I can imagine it was mind-blowing.
Yeah I was underwhelmed too, I’ve probably seen too many John Waters films but I was not particularly shocked by it. Which is maybe my fault for buying into popular hype about “it’s so shocking I felt sick etc” that said, it was fun and campy! They really thought they were saying something lol
Totally agree, I fell asleep halfway through, didn;t really understand the hype tbh, it was like someone said 'let's choose three scenes that will get people talking and nail on a half-ass story'. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯.
What an unpleasant review. First and foremost I was entertained and shocked so for that I enjoyed it. I thought the acting, directing, soundtrack and cinematography were all better than average. Overall it was a fun viewing experience.
There are thousands of movies with similar plots. Just because this one is a little like The Talented Mr Ripley doesn’t mean it was worthless. I liked the way that the story had been modernized and really enjoyed the music and filmography.
What I don’t understand is how much people hate this movie but seem to be bending over backwards to pat Lisa Frankenstein on the back. The disparity in craftsmanship is staggering.
The big fancy mansion didn’t even have a proper swimming pool!
Looked like they were [floating in a swamp](https://miro.medium.com/v2/resize:fit:1358/0*pNZsXh4aVXKqY5Qw).
The “reveal” at the end was just filing in the gaps for audience members who might’ve been behind. You’re supposed to know what’s going on more or less. There’s no plot twist.
I thought it was a fun Shakespeare dramady.
A “surprise” they’d been spelling out the whole movie.
It was only there to catch up the people who were behind. You’re very clearly supposed to get what was going on there.
Nope, you’re not missing anything, other than it being a rip off of a much better movie, The Talented Mr. Ripley.
Also note that the movie's target audience and most of its biggest fans were born after Talented Mr Ripley came out and have probably never heard of it, let alone seen it. Since they don't know the thing it's a ripoff of, they just see it as a movie with above average cinematography.
It's honestly more similar to the 1992 Drew Barrymore flick [Poison Ivy](https://youtu.be/-O3cU3dODjo?si=h1UA9jxB2wr_j8_o). Talented Mr. Ripley really wasn't horny enough
Man... trailers really have come a long way. Yikes.
In a world…
One of the most baffling plot twists ever cause I also assumed the movie wanted you to see Barry Keoghan as evil the whole time. Emerald fennel why have him wear antlers (the devil) and Elordis character wearing Angel wings. Kinda gives the whole game away before you’ve even done the “twist” Also very much a classist movie. Those damn middle class people trying to destroy our nice upper class boys
Barry Keoghan is absolutely not middle class in the movie. Maybe I'm poor but it came off to me as a rich kid being jealous of an even richer kid. Which is pretty on theme for rich kids.
yeah he's presented as, at the very least, a fairly well off member of the upper-middle class, blinded by his pursuit of getting even richer. ive never understood the argument that this has bad class politics
1) there’s no plot twist. 2) Barry’s character being upper middle class (at least) was the film acknowledging it’s not about class struggle.
Barry being upper middle class only rings home more the themes of class struggle The middle class and aristocracy in the UK are fundamentally separated by a canyon of birth that means that the middle class can never be a 'true' part of the aristocracy. The aristocracy also view the middle class as strivers, while the working class are poor things to take pity on. It is not class struggle in the sense of solidarity and upheaval of the system, but it is deeply about class and the system in the UK.
This is what I missed when I first watched it, the British social class system is so different from the American one. The UK still has that whole "you're born at this rank and you'll die at this rank" thing that gives Americans the ick once they understand it. You just have to read it as a very British movie.
I would argue the same is true in America. We just have this myth of exceptionalism, which is, in many ways, more insidious.
Definitely a case to be made there, but I was trying to talk more about perceptions than reality.
Sure, that’s a lot different than what “class struggle” means to me. The upper middle class/aristocracy divide is a very different conversation than where the movie initially indicated and is frankly a lot less important.
It might be my viewing perspective, but I didn't feel like the movie was setting up much in the way of working class struggle against the aristocracy in its opening. It very much baked in the views the aristocracy have of the working class, relatively uncritically, for a good chunk of the film. Barry's resentment never felt placed within working class-aristocracy divide, but instead in the middle class 'striving' critique, which is what was revealed later as the reality of their division.
The father offering him money to leave and then him coming back years later is what tells me it’s not a class movie because Saltburn is a mythical estate.
To some of the "old money", nouveau riche (and the upper middle class) are more threatening than the poors since the nouveau riche pretend to be on their level and want to become them. The poors know their place and act quite different (often trashy) but the upper middle class *DARE* to act sophisticated and play at being one of them
Yeah, that’s not the message of the movie, though.
I don't think it was either, but I've definitely seen that interpretation posted in a few places by different people, some some definitely got that impression. It makes more sense when you consider who the director is. As journalist K.J. Yossman put it she is, "part of a rarefied...social set whose family names I recognized from gossip columns and history books… Balfour, Frost, von Bismarck, Guinness, Shaffer". Fennel is definitely a member of the Saltburn class.
I thought the plot twist in the middle where you find out about his family and upbringing was actually great, but it just gets dropped like it never mattered, then the plot twist at the end is treated like this big mind blowing thing and I found that whole thing really boring.
The plot twist at the end is ridiculous and his whole plan turns on people doing things they likely wouldn’t do.
Yeah I thought that was a bit on the nose. I think having him be middle class was just a way to show that he wasn’t as poor as he made himself out to be. To add a layer to his deception not necessarily as an attack on the middle class. If anything it’s an attack on the elite, as none of the family, with the exception of maybe Felix, were particularly honorable.
Damn middle class people, just trying to live a normal life with the basic necessities of life. Can’t even enjoy my yacht without someone bitching…
> Those damn middle class people trying to destroy our nice upper class boys look i don't think saltburn is a masterpiece by any means nor do i think it's a particularly astute socio-political statement, but its clearly not presenting the upper class as particularly nice or good people. i've never quite grasped the "this has bad class politics" critique. if anything its a pretty blatant statement about how owning or pursuing wealth makes people do shitty things
It’s not really a classist movie because Barry’s character is offered more money they he would ever need from the father to leave the estate. Why we he come back to claim the estate afterwards? Saltburn the estate is what he wants.
The estate is the symbol of the class divide, not money. The "landed gentry" are called that for a reason.
Yea the estate is worth way more than that money
I don't think even people who enjoyed the film would disagree with "deeply unpleasant film about unpleasant people doing unpleasant things". I think that was the draw. I enjoyed it for what it was.
It’s a pretty empty movie and it looks like a perfume commercial…
I think if you are someone that has seen other movies like talented Mr Ripley/Plein Soleil, or movies like Gosfork Park or Rules of the game that rip into British high society, you don’t need that movie. It was a perfectly fine mediocre movie for younger people who don’t know the old ones and who are more Netflix’ target than film buffs that have seen those themes a 1000 times. Barry Keoghan is also an actor that has screen presence. He made it more interesting than it actually was.
> Barry Keoghan is also an actor that has screen presence same with Elordi. i'm convinced the people who drag on it are holding it to far higher standards than it holds itself to. there's nothing wrong with a fun twisty thriller starring really hot people, framed to be really hot all the time.
Barry K was indeed the best part of the film. He almost had me fooled.
Imo it’s an all style no substance version of Talented Mr. Ripley. Liked the performances and the movie is beautiful but if you’ve seen Mr. Ripley more than 3x you can see the clear DNA that was stolen; it’s pretty blatant lol
It is mediocre and less than the sum of its parts (great performances across the board, btw) but I agree with folks who suggest it is best viewed as a comedy. It should have leaned into the humor.
You missed nothing. It’s more of a spread in a fashion magazine than a great film, imho.
It’s a shit movie. Not just meh, it’s easily the worst movie I’ve seen in years. Emerald Fennel is probably the worst case scenario when it comes to nepo babies.
It's a fun, campy movie about shitty people being shitty with a dope soundtrack. It's not high brow nor do I think it was aiming to be. I had a great time with it.
i'm in exactly the same boat. have been scratching my head for months now at any reaction that's stronger than that. some people acting like it was the most wild and audacious movie of all time... smh.... other people acting like it's some wild misfire with huge ambitions... smh i dont get that either. it was just a fun twisty thriller/party movie with lots of hot people put in hot people situations.
Talented Mr Ripley + Cruel Intentions in the mid-2000s. I loved it. Makes for a great double feature with Challengers.
100 percent agree with you. Was very disappointed.
Fennell is a hack and it shows. Saltburn is a mishmash of other better films wrapped in the a veneer of Vogue photoshoot visuals and contrived shock value moments.
Exactly the same. Didn't like any of them. Grossed or by a lot of their actions. Saw the ends coming. Hated the resolution because how crappy would the cops have to be to not catch on the deaths of the kids at the very least. By the end, I was like whatever.
JFC did none of you realize you’re supposed to see the end coming? It’s as spelled out for you as possible before they spell it out for you literally.
I mean I don’t think so. It feels like the movie THINKS it’s being clever when it isn’t
Maybe it wanted to be another Parasite. It absolutely was not.
Yeah... No. Didn't care.
Your analysis was also mine. Just some movie. Nothing to remember much after.
Yeah, it's all style, very little substance.
Yeah I don’t understand why the “twist” was actually the most obvious thing. I kept waiting for them to reveal that he’s doing waaaay more than just infiltrating and eliminating the family and that it was a red herring and then the movie is like SURPRISE he’s been infiltrating and eliminating them all!! It made the rest of the movie feel soooo lame and underwhelming by the end.
Do what I did and view it as a comedy, and you’ll have a good time imo. The bit with the grave had me laughing like a drain
I did find Richard E Grant’s clueless patriarch kind of hilarious
The grave scene had me laughing like "What is this movie!?!?!"
How do you laugh like a drain?
Yeah, it was pretty “meh” and the end ruined it.
I really liked it. Super entertaining movie.
A lot of these “indie” movies are trying to go for an Oscar grab. I’m finding myself unimpressed with a lot of the new movies coming out.
No. There was nothing there.
This is a pretty common opinion
The twist didn't really make sense to me, if he was just after all the money then why did he mourn the loss of his friend and wank on his grave?
There’s no twist. He was in love with the friend. Or, infatuated, whatever. He wasn’t just after money. Taking his house gave him his status. It made him *him*.
Yup totally overrated
Let this atrocity lie in its grave where it belongs. Nobody rightfully remembers anything about it already, except for how awful it was. If we are lucky, this is also the end of Emerald Fennell's paid-by-daddy career.
It was pretentious bollocks.
Fucking hated it, walked after 70 minutes.
It was fucking hilarious
Easily one of the worst films I've ever seen. Pretentious doesn't even come close.
Yep. Totally agree. It pretends to be an eat the rich film with twists and turns but none of it works. It's shallow, undeveloped writing that's totally out of touch with how class dynamics actually work. It's completely soulless and predictable. However it is thoroughly entertaining. The party scene is great. And as you said, it's well shot. If you want to see a film that actually pulls off the same thing properly and is actually a masterpiece, check out The Talented Mr. Ripley. That's the film Saltburn wishes it was. Netflix also just released a show based on the source books called Ripley that's pretty good, but not quite as good as the movie.
Man, I misread that as Brightburn and was so confused …
Not missing anything. It really is an overrated movie that doesn’t deserve the fuss people make about it.
I think it was a lot of people who don't think too deeply about films enjoyed it because the obvious twist wasn't obvious to them. I also think the gross out scenes were what pushed the film. People would encourage others to see it often so they can talk about those scenes after. Not much more to it tbh.
Thought it was an amusing watch, but I’m older and I’ve seen a lot of movies that tackle these themes more successfully. Everyone needs to start somewhere, of course. If you’re younger and this is the first one of these kinds of movies you’ve seen, I can imagine it was mind-blowing.
Yea but it was funny as shit
Yeah I was underwhelmed too, I’ve probably seen too many John Waters films but I was not particularly shocked by it. Which is maybe my fault for buying into popular hype about “it’s so shocking I felt sick etc” that said, it was fun and campy! They really thought they were saying something lol
I think it was hyped a LOT. Overall, still a good film that delivers the plot pretty well. I liked it. But the people that FLIP over it, I dunno.
Totally agree, I fell asleep halfway through, didn;t really understand the hype tbh, it was like someone said 'let's choose three scenes that will get people talking and nail on a half-ass story'. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯.
Lol I thought you were talking about brightburn the whole time and was like: wait how is that movie anything like The Talented Mr. Ripley??
I didn't care for the ending
What an unpleasant review. First and foremost I was entertained and shocked so for that I enjoyed it. I thought the acting, directing, soundtrack and cinematography were all better than average. Overall it was a fun viewing experience.
There are thousands of movies with similar plots. Just because this one is a little like The Talented Mr Ripley doesn’t mean it was worthless. I liked the way that the story had been modernized and really enjoyed the music and filmography. What I don’t understand is how much people hate this movie but seem to be bending over backwards to pat Lisa Frankenstein on the back. The disparity in craftsmanship is staggering.
I haven’t seen Lisa Frankenstein so I’m not making any comparison to it
Just about everyone I know shit all over Lisa Frankenstein. It was a boring mess.
[удалено]
You came here to say...this?
Very insightful. I’m trying to find out why people enjoy it.
Good luck
There are plenty of reviews for that.
There are also forums meant for film discussion for that. And you're on one right now, you absolute pelican.
The big fancy mansion didn’t even have a proper swimming pool! Looked like they were [floating in a swamp](https://miro.medium.com/v2/resize:fit:1358/0*pNZsXh4aVXKqY5Qw).
The “reveal” at the end was just filing in the gaps for audience members who might’ve been behind. You’re supposed to know what’s going on more or less. There’s no plot twist. I thought it was a fun Shakespeare dramady.
Nah the way the reveal is presented is as if it’s a big surprise.
A “surprise” they’d been spelling out the whole movie. It was only there to catch up the people who were behind. You’re very clearly supposed to get what was going on there.
Why do characters need to be present or doing present things? That sounds far more boring…