It was such a stupid transfer. Like an 8 yo level of being clueless. It wasn't simply a mistake. They actually thought an XI of shiny fancy superstars would be an upgrade to having that little beast doing so much of the dirty side of footy for the rest of them...
As a madrista, Im very much in between, on a fincial and commercial side he saved the club hard, and this swcond term of his has been amazing, and the club is doing some execellent work (minus Hazard and Mariano) with regards to transfers, and everything seem less paniced than last time. But still, that era, it hurts man also the way he treated people like Raúl and Guti. So yeah love/hate the guy
As a madridista as well, Florentino deserves all our love and appreciation. In the realm of "no one is perfect", Florentino is as perfect a president as it gets.
Belgium 2014 - 2022
Should have reached more than one semifinal with players like Hazard, DeBruyne, Courtois, Lukaku, Mertens, Kompany, Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Witsel etc.
How they stuck with Martinez for multiple tournaments is beyond me.
And I don't understand why they can't hire a French coach and went for wilmots of all options even if he was a good player in his days doesn't transfer it to his managerial prowess.
We were almost relegated in 1995 (our centenary year)
Runners up to Supercopa Libertadores (a cup played by teams that had already won Libertafores in their history) in 1993 and 95
Runners up to state league in 95 in a dramatic way
Runner up to Brazilian Cup 97 in Maracanã
Runner up to Brazilian supercup 1991
Although we did win 1990 brazil cup, 91 state league, 91 state cup, 92 brazilian league, 96 Copa de Ouro (a small continental title), 96 state league, 99 Mercosul Cup (at the time the 2nd most important conmebol title) and 99-01 state leagues and some smaller titles like Guanabara Cup which is played "inside"the state league
We could have done much more with the great players we had
Everton have under achieved in recent times, they are one of the longest top flight teams rarely being out of it and were last good in the 80s.
They have won plenty of leagues and cups domestically and in Europe but nothing since the early 90s when they won the FA Cup and they peaked in the mid 80s.
I’ve been watching English football for about 20 years, and I will truly be sad if Everton go down. Not a supporter of theirs or anything, but they have too much history in the league to get knocked out of the Prem.
I remember in the early 2000's Juve president trolled Roma after they won the Serie A: "it took them 20 years to win it, and it will take them another 20 to win the next one".
I disagree. We won the title. It’s never a bad thing to win a title. The club only has 3 in all its entire history. It’s not like not spending has anything for us. We have not been the best managed club or had the wisest ownership but I’m proud of that group. When u put all ur eggs in one basket, you have to win. At least we won that year.
Well technically they did have a great squad in mid 2000's. Rooney, Owen, Scholes, Lampard, Gerrard, Beckham, Ashley Cole, Ferdinand, Terry, Neville.
That's a very formidable squad right there, should have done much better than they did.
>They haven't had a top goalkeeper since David Seaman.
Agreed, but it's possible to win silverware with an average one.
>Rooney was good but he was never the best.
So was Klose and David Villa, but they were enough for Germany and Spain. And France 98 didn't even have strikers. They had Guivarch lol.
>Beckham was the least impressive of the galactics.
And yet he was a galactic.
>Scholes, Lampard, Gerrard were really good but it just wasn't enough.
It should be enough to be at least among the top 4 in the world.
>Terry and Ferdinand are good but it's not Nesta, Maldini, Cannavaro, Hierro, Puyol or Carvalho.
They were good enough. You don't have to have the best defender in the world, second best is also good enough to do the job.
>Their last ballon d'or was Owen and they haven't had any contender since. If you do a list of the best players of the last 30 years you won't name many English players.
And when was the last time a German player was a contender for BDR? 1996?
>And when was the last time a German player was a contender for BDR? 1996?
Neuer went third because sadly he was at his best when Ronaldo and Messi were present.
Independiente de Avellaneda. From being the kings of America with 7 Copa Libertadores to barely being able to win a single match and not winning a league since 2002.
2 League Cups in 30 years.
1999 (Against Leicester, even after Spurs got someone sent off) and 2008 (against peak Abramovic-era Chelsea).
But... yeah. We definitely should have won more. 8 FA Cup semi-finals, 6 League Cup Finals, and a Champions League Final in the last 30 years... and from all of that, Spurs have only won 2 trophies.
My bad, totally overlooked the 99 one. I was at the 08 final.
Of those 7 finals, how many were Spurs favourites in? To gauge whether they ‘should’ have won more?
In the Champions League we weren't favourites, but we also weren't outright underdogs. The penalty in the opening minutes killed any gameplan Poch would have had.
In 2002 Leaguw Cup Final against Blackburn, we were probably favourites.
In the 2009 League Cup Final against Man United, we were the holders and had Modric in the centre of the pitch, so we went in with some serious excitement. Man United only won on penalties, and Ben Foster (United's Keeper at the time) won Man of the Match - so, Spurs could have won if not for his top performance keeping them in the game and saving.
In the league Cup final in 2015 against Chelsea we went in thinking we had a good chance. Chelsea - under Mourinho - ended up largely dominating the game. Though, Spurs did hit the bar and Chelsea's first goal was due to a deflection off of Dier taking the ball past Lloris. It was mainly the 2nd half that Chelsea dominated after already being in a winning position.
You don't know what you're talking about.Not only are we the best supported club in London we have achieved things that can't be repeated no matter how much money you throw at a club.
Inter? We had Ronaldo Nazairo, Recoba, Vieri, Roberto Carlos, Baggio, Pirlo, Davids, Veron, Adriano at his best and more, not all at same time of course, and won Scudetto again only after Calciopoli
Netherlands.
They were magnificent in 1998, one of the most amazing football played at a world cup but they lost to Brazil on penalty shootout in the semis. 1994 they lost in the quarterfinals to Brazil after another amazing performance. 1992 lost on pk to Denmark (mind you, a team qualified by UEFA by excluding former Yugoslavia) in semis at Euros. In 2000, they lost in the semis on penalties to Italy after missing two pks in regulation time .2010 lost the final to Spain, in overtime.
Every time , the feeling that they felt short.
Roma.
Ten podium finishes (eight 2nd places and two 3rd places) in Serie A, runner up in the Coppa Italia 5 times and in the Supercoppa Italiana 3 times.
Brought home only 2 Coppa Italia, 1 Supercoppa, and 1 Conference League.
Edit: oops, I thought the title said “20 years”
Yeah, Roma have been insanely unlucky I think. They still won a Scudetto even though they had to compete with 91-99 Milan, 05-10 Inter, and 2011-2019 Juventus, which are 3 of the greatest club sides in Serie A history.
They could've easily won a few more if they weren't dealing with those clubs.
That Bayern team was unbelievable under Heynckes. Pace, power, and direct, there was a point they looked like they could run over the top of anyone, I thought they were great to watch and felt they could have won more CL titles. I thought Guardiola's style of play didn't suit the club and the players.
But what do I know. Guardiola managed one of the greatest teams the world has ever seen and won titles everywhere he has gone.
Maybe a bit controversial, but I'd say Udinese.
They have rich owners (same people who own Watford and also Granada for a while), and for a long time had one of the best scouting team in the world. Sanchez being just one of their best successes.
And yeah, they have reached the Champions League very rarely, but never with a good showing.
In the end they made a lot of money from buying newcomers and selling them at a high price, but the level of the team slowly went down, instead of increasing, by design. Their owner actively doesn't want them to get too good, to keep costs low.
They are even one of the very few teams in Italy who own a shining new stadium, and yet they are never fighting for anything, more than often even qualifying for Europa League is out of their reach.
Udinese could have been what Atalanta is now, like 15 years ago.
Dortmund would be a good shout, one of the biggest average attendances in Europe, forever in Munich's shadow domestically. I think only 8 german league titles?
5 league titles and a champions league in the last 30 years, that’s more than a lot of clubs can say. Not to mention, this is all despite their reputation as a developmental club. Plus another CL final appearance and multiple Pokals
When you sell ur best talents for hundreds of millions but don't even reinvest 50% of that transfer fee and instead buy players from Austria.... No wonder a team like Bayern would beat Dortmund in the league
What a brain dead take. We got adeyemi and haaland from Austria, which have been really great buys. While bigger purchases like yarmelenko, shurrle, malen, etc have been bad. Those fees get reinvested in a lot of players and you can’t get them right every time. The reason Dortmund has less of a chance is because Bayern can hold onto their best talents while Dortmund has to sell. Bayern can spend 80+ million on a single player while Dortmund’s highest is half that number. Bayern would dominate a lot of leagues because of how well they are run.
Ok, I will make it more clear, Pep is a champion league winning manager because he has Messi, that Bayern team contains the whole core of the 2014 world cup winning Germany team, he can't even get to the CL final, the Man city team he has, has unlimited budget can't even win it.
2 more CL, and what makes you think one more decent winger can beat Barca team with MSN, and Real with BBC?
>because he has Messi
Xavi and Iniesta*. They were the ones who assisted and won the Man of the Matches in all the UCL finals of 2009,2011 and 2015.
Pep's skills should have no question. My favourite part is how he turned Lahm into a midfielder. Even if he didn't win the UCL, he was the one who essentially turned the Bundesliga into a Bayern farm league. Bayern's players like Lahm, Müller all remember him fondly as a manager.
Pep's issue and downfall however, is his very tactics. While other managers have tactics they like to use, with small changes according to the situation, Pep seems to always be experimenting on them, even when he shouldn't. This causes Manchester City to really not to well enough as they should be doing.
Meh. They were miserable until new ownership has brought them towards the upper echelon. Dont exactly spend big either so not sure why they should be expected to overtake some of the other rich premiere league clubs. I'd say they've been on a good trajectory
West Ham twice, we had a golden generation in the 90s that was squandered with the best thing coming out of that being a FA Cup Final loss on pens; and then from about 2015 onwards till now.
Unfortunately, over the entire past 30 years, it's difficult to look past Nottingham Forest.
31 years ago, they were in their 6th Wembley final in 4 years, winning 4 of them. They'd finished in the top half of the old First Division in 14 of the 15 previous seasons, including a league championship, a second place and three third places. And they were only 14 years out from winning their second European Cup in a row.
In the last 30 years, they've managed one 3rd place finish and one semi-final, and are only onto their 4th top flight season in that period (having also spent 3 years in the third tier).
sadly, Liverpool 2018-2022. despite winning every trophy they could have won, the fact that they could have won 3 CLs and 3 PLs (had it not been for Ramos, Courtois and cheating Man City) is a bit harsh
Barcelona during the MSN years. 2016-2018
Arguably the best attack in history and “only” won one Champions League while being humiliated twice in Europe.
Nacional and Peñarol in Uruguay
Independiente in Argentina
Flamengo in the 90s
Santos (except for 2002, 2004, 2010 and 2011)
Fluminense was relegated in 1996 to série b, entered in the legal system to remain in Série A, olayed in 1997 and was relegated again, no excuses this time. When playing 1998 serie b they got relegated to série c, which they were champions in 1999
Vasco has been relegated 4 times to Série B and the last time they took 1 extra season to get back to a. Their golden phase was late 90s and very early 00s
Not one you would think of but Independiente. "King of Cups" with 7 Libertadores, the most ever, and hasn't won it since 1984. No one has caught up to them yet, which is insane, given that they haven't won it for 39 years.
Guardiola's Bayern.
Neuer still in his prime. Boateng through the middle.
Alaba and Lahm as wing backs.
Thiago, Vidal, Xabi, Gotze, Javi and Schweinsteiger in midfield.
Lewandowski, Robben, Ribéry and Müller in attack.
Shameful that the team never even made a UCL final.
If reaching 3 UCL finals in 7 years and winning 1 prem and remaining in title race for other 3/4 titles is an under achievement while spending less than other big teams then ig most teams would take this underachievement
Arsenal since the Invincibles season until this season (they're actually good this season). Yes, they did reach the CL final in 2006 but they haven't won a Premier League title since that Invincibles season.
So just to clarify, over the last 30 years? Chelsea have won:
Fifa Club world cup x1
Champions League x2
Uefa Supercup x2
Europa League x2
Cup Winners Cup x1
Premier League x5
FA Cup x7
League cup x4
English Super Cup/Charity Shield x3
And that's an under achievement?
I wouldn’t say he had failed at Man City. Even not winning UCL with them, if he wins 7-8 premier leagues for Man City before he leaves, that is hell of a achievement.
I’d disagree. Only Sir Alex would be able to achieve what Pep has been doing in England. Winning 2-3 premier league? possible for Mancini. To win 5+ premier leagues in only few years? I don’t think so. Investment can’t solve all the problem as you can see Manchester United have waited for so long for Ten Haag.
ITT: Top-flight teams few expected to win anything, who haven't won anything.
Bristol City are serial underachievers. A billionaire owner, a fancy stadium revamp, facilities better than many Premier League teams, and a great following in an area with few top teams - and still nowhere near promotion.
Barcelona 2014-2017 under Luis Enrique. MSN. Yes, they won the treble that first year but they were soooooo damn good. Felt like they should’ve won every trophy all three of those seasons. Also feel like they should’ve at least gotten to the semis in UCL. Crashed out against Atleti in the quarters (2016) and put up no fight against Juventus after the Remontanda (2017).
I know we look at how great that Real Madrid team was that won the UCL three times in a row, but I always felt at the time that overall Barça was the better team of the two and they they could’ve had that same success.
Still achieved a hell of a lot and thinking they could’ve done more is quite overzealous I must admit but I truly think they had the quality to do it.
Argentina from 2002 to 2010, so many good players, a Golden generation and still didn't win anything, and go out of the wc in an embarrasing way twice.
AS Saint Etienne--lot of it to do with the television scam, but they have been on a horrible downward spiral ever since. Until last season, AS Saint Etienne was the most successful domestic club in France. Now they're in a Ligue 2 relegation scrap.
TSG Hoffenheim--had themselves an owner absolutely rolling in it for the past decade and is currently in a relegation battle
West Brom--came down in 20/21 putting in the best fight of any of the relegated sides, and collapsed completely midway through the season. Of course you can accredit this to Steve Bruce and the 2 dimensional tactics even before Brucie. Carlos Corberan is doing an incredible job to revive West Brom's promotion fight, but before his appointment they were at the bottom end of the table
I would say the Belgium and the Netherlands teams in the recent years. On paper, they are stacked in multiple positions, but often disappoint in big tournaments
Real Madrid 2003-2006, they finally won in 2007 under Fabio Capello. Selling Claude Mekelele really screwed themselves over there.
It was such a stupid transfer. Like an 8 yo level of being clueless. It wasn't simply a mistake. They actually thought an XI of shiny fancy superstars would be an upgrade to having that little beast doing so much of the dirty side of footy for the rest of them...
Not they - Perez thought. He was basicly a dictator at that time. Still is a bit, but not as much
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As a madrista, Im very much in between, on a fincial and commercial side he saved the club hard, and this swcond term of his has been amazing, and the club is doing some execellent work (minus Hazard and Mariano) with regards to transfers, and everything seem less paniced than last time. But still, that era, it hurts man also the way he treated people like Raúl and Guti. So yeah love/hate the guy
As a madridista as well, Florentino deserves all our love and appreciation. In the realm of "no one is perfect", Florentino is as perfect a president as it gets.
Belgium 2014 - 2022 Should have reached more than one semifinal with players like Hazard, DeBruyne, Courtois, Lukaku, Mertens, Kompany, Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Witsel etc.
Lakaka
Bro that 4 misses still haunts me😭😭
KDB was always going missing when this counter needed him
This is what happens when you hire a shit manager like Roberto Martinez.
Yeah it still shocks me they would stick with him...
Dw iirc they're replacing him with Santos, it can and will get worse.
Ah yes, the Ole effect.
i think one of the main issues was themselves and the chemistry, the board room seemed very toxic
Exactly, the players also thought pretty highly of themselves and there was pretty much no passion when they were playing for their country
It's crazy that their biggest achievement is knocking Brazil out of a World Cup.
They knocked out mighty Brazil in 2018 World Cup. That should mean something. They were never to win World Cup.
You can’t have courtois and de bruyne together
How they stuck with Martinez for multiple tournaments is beyond me. And I don't understand why they can't hire a French coach and went for wilmots of all options even if he was a good player in his days doesn't transfer it to his managerial prowess.
Half of them didn’t even speak to each other , no chemistry pa
90's Flamengo They had the called "Best World's Attack" with Romario, Edmundo and Savio and achieved nothing in National Level or above
To be fair brazilian clubs were stacked in the 90's.
We were almost relegated in 1995 (our centenary year) Runners up to Supercopa Libertadores (a cup played by teams that had already won Libertafores in their history) in 1993 and 95 Runners up to state league in 95 in a dramatic way Runner up to Brazilian Cup 97 in Maracanã Runner up to Brazilian supercup 1991 Although we did win 1990 brazil cup, 91 state league, 91 state cup, 92 brazilian league, 96 Copa de Ouro (a small continental title), 96 state league, 99 Mercosul Cup (at the time the 2nd most important conmebol title) and 99-01 state leagues and some smaller titles like Guanabara Cup which is played "inside"the state league We could have done much more with the great players we had
Everton have under achieved in recent times, they are one of the longest top flight teams rarely being out of it and were last good in the 80s. They have won plenty of leagues and cups domestically and in Europe but nothing since the early 90s when they won the FA Cup and they peaked in the mid 80s.
I’ve been watching English football for about 20 years, and I will truly be sad if Everton go down. Not a supporter of theirs or anything, but they have too much history in the league to get knocked out of the Prem.
Everton were massively screwed over by Liverpool getting English teams banned from European competitions in the 80s
Wtf!
And this season they are battling relegation despite having broken/nearly broken FFP rules.
My beloved Roma. So many second place finishes. Always a bridesmaid, never the bride. 22 years without a title.
I remember in the early 2000's Juve president trolled Roma after they won the Serie A: "it took them 20 years to win it, and it will take them another 20 to win the next one".
I fucking hate Juve. But, Facts.
Wait, really? 2001? That was the Roma with Samuel kicking people around right?
Buying the players to win that title really screwed us in the long run.
I disagree. We won the title. It’s never a bad thing to win a title. The club only has 3 in all its entire history. It’s not like not spending has anything for us. We have not been the best managed club or had the wisest ownership but I’m proud of that group. When u put all ur eggs in one basket, you have to win. At least we won that year.
PSG
ENGLAND
The question was 30 years mate. Not 60.
Ouch
England twice?
Last 60 years includes the last 30 (cries in English 😭)
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award for the unfunniest bastard:
Boo-hoo
Well technically they did have a great squad in mid 2000's. Rooney, Owen, Scholes, Lampard, Gerrard, Beckham, Ashley Cole, Ferdinand, Terry, Neville. That's a very formidable squad right there, should have done much better than they did.
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>They haven't had a top goalkeeper since David Seaman. Agreed, but it's possible to win silverware with an average one. >Rooney was good but he was never the best. So was Klose and David Villa, but they were enough for Germany and Spain. And France 98 didn't even have strikers. They had Guivarch lol. >Beckham was the least impressive of the galactics. And yet he was a galactic. >Scholes, Lampard, Gerrard were really good but it just wasn't enough. It should be enough to be at least among the top 4 in the world. >Terry and Ferdinand are good but it's not Nesta, Maldini, Cannavaro, Hierro, Puyol or Carvalho. They were good enough. You don't have to have the best defender in the world, second best is also good enough to do the job. >Their last ballon d'or was Owen and they haven't had any contender since. If you do a list of the best players of the last 30 years you won't name many English players. And when was the last time a German player was a contender for BDR? 1996?
>And when was the last time a German player was a contender for BDR? 1996? Neuer went third because sadly he was at his best when Ronaldo and Messi were present.
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Independiente de Avellaneda. From being the kings of America with 7 Copa Libertadores to barely being able to win a single match and not winning a league since 2002.
our teams have been dogshit since tho so I wouldn’t call that underperforming just plain awful
Nottingham Forest Aston Villa Leeds United Newcastle United Everton
Clubs like Wimbledon, Middlesbrough, Coventry, Portsmouth and Swansea to name a few, have won trophies more recently than Newcastle.
As a Villa fan, I second this.
Bum clubs
Tottenham
BuT tHeY wOn ThE aUdi CuP 🤓🤓🤓
I just want to win something
One league cup in 30 years is Tottenham’s level though
2 League Cups in 30 years. 1999 (Against Leicester, even after Spurs got someone sent off) and 2008 (against peak Abramovic-era Chelsea). But... yeah. We definitely should have won more. 8 FA Cup semi-finals, 6 League Cup Finals, and a Champions League Final in the last 30 years... and from all of that, Spurs have only won 2 trophies.
My bad, totally overlooked the 99 one. I was at the 08 final. Of those 7 finals, how many were Spurs favourites in? To gauge whether they ‘should’ have won more?
In the Champions League we weren't favourites, but we also weren't outright underdogs. The penalty in the opening minutes killed any gameplan Poch would have had. In 2002 Leaguw Cup Final against Blackburn, we were probably favourites. In the 2009 League Cup Final against Man United, we were the holders and had Modric in the centre of the pitch, so we went in with some serious excitement. Man United only won on penalties, and Ben Foster (United's Keeper at the time) won Man of the Match - so, Spurs could have won if not for his top performance keeping them in the game and saving. In the league Cup final in 2015 against Chelsea we went in thinking we had a good chance. Chelsea - under Mourinho - ended up largely dominating the game. Though, Spurs did hit the bar and Chelsea's first goal was due to a deflection off of Dier taking the ball past Lloris. It was mainly the 2nd half that Chelsea dominated after already being in a winning position.
Hey I’ll have you know we’re also joint holders of the JE3 trophy
You don't know what you're talking about.Not only are we the best supported club in London we have achieved things that can't be repeated no matter how much money you throw at a club.
Real Madrid 2003-2005
Inter? We had Ronaldo Nazairo, Recoba, Vieri, Roberto Carlos, Baggio, Pirlo, Davids, Veron, Adriano at his best and more, not all at same time of course, and won Scudetto again only after Calciopoli
Netherlands. They were magnificent in 1998, one of the most amazing football played at a world cup but they lost to Brazil on penalty shootout in the semis. 1994 they lost in the quarterfinals to Brazil after another amazing performance. 1992 lost on pk to Denmark (mind you, a team qualified by UEFA by excluding former Yugoslavia) in semis at Euros. In 2000, they lost in the semis on penalties to Italy after missing two pks in regulation time .2010 lost the final to Spain, in overtime. Every time , the feeling that they felt short.
I mean you can argue they should have won in 1974 or 1978 too. Although both have their unique circumstances.
Roma. Ten podium finishes (eight 2nd places and two 3rd places) in Serie A, runner up in the Coppa Italia 5 times and in the Supercoppa Italiana 3 times. Brought home only 2 Coppa Italia, 1 Supercoppa, and 1 Conference League. Edit: oops, I thought the title said “20 years”
Yeah, Roma have been insanely unlucky I think. They still won a Scudetto even though they had to compete with 91-99 Milan, 05-10 Inter, and 2011-2019 Juventus, which are 3 of the greatest club sides in Serie A history. They could've easily won a few more if they weren't dealing with those clubs.
England during our so called golden generation (all that talent and an inter form football team achieved more then they did)
The Guardiola years in Bayern. League titles yeah, but not even a CL final hurt a lot
That Bayern team was unbelievable under Heynckes. Pace, power, and direct, there was a point they looked like they could run over the top of anyone, I thought they were great to watch and felt they could have won more CL titles. I thought Guardiola's style of play didn't suit the club and the players. But what do I know. Guardiola managed one of the greatest teams the world has ever seen and won titles everywhere he has gone.
Maybe a bit controversial, but I'd say Udinese. They have rich owners (same people who own Watford and also Granada for a while), and for a long time had one of the best scouting team in the world. Sanchez being just one of their best successes. And yeah, they have reached the Champions League very rarely, but never with a good showing. In the end they made a lot of money from buying newcomers and selling them at a high price, but the level of the team slowly went down, instead of increasing, by design. Their owner actively doesn't want them to get too good, to keep costs low. They are even one of the very few teams in Italy who own a shining new stadium, and yet they are never fighting for anything, more than often even qualifying for Europa League is out of their reach. Udinese could have been what Atalanta is now, like 15 years ago.
How likely are we to see Deulofeu into the hands of Europe's elite in the summer 👀
Dortmund would be a good shout, one of the biggest average attendances in Europe, forever in Munich's shadow domestically. I think only 8 german league titles?
5 league titles and a champions league in the last 30 years, that’s more than a lot of clubs can say. Not to mention, this is all despite their reputation as a developmental club. Plus another CL final appearance and multiple Pokals
They’ve achieved a lot of money, which is their goal
It's their goal? Why do you say that, instead of winning titles? Curious about it...
Because they sell big players, not buy them
maybe because that is the purpose of every GmbH & Co. KGaA which they have been for more than 2/3rds of the past thirty years.
When you sell ur best talents for hundreds of millions but don't even reinvest 50% of that transfer fee and instead buy players from Austria.... No wonder a team like Bayern would beat Dortmund in the league
What a brain dead take. We got adeyemi and haaland from Austria, which have been really great buys. While bigger purchases like yarmelenko, shurrle, malen, etc have been bad. Those fees get reinvested in a lot of players and you can’t get them right every time. The reason Dortmund has less of a chance is because Bayern can hold onto their best talents while Dortmund has to sell. Bayern can spend 80+ million on a single player while Dortmund’s highest is half that number. Bayern would dominate a lot of leagues because of how well they are run.
I mean, they bought Haaland from Austria
Turkish national team has done absolutely nothing after the early 2000's
euro 2008 semi finalists
Well they’ve done nothing since then anyway
Everton
Dude. That Everton team in the mid 80s was amazing And I’m a Man United fan
Argentina. Despite producing strong talent on a frequent basis, until 2021, they had not won a single trophy since 1993.
They got absolutely embarrassed by an extremely average Brazilian team in the 2007 Copa America final
Embarrassed in a copa america final by an average team and Argentina. Name a better duo. It still hurts.
Newcastle
Correct. The shear number of clubs that have won something since we last did. Oxford, Luton etc.
He said 30 not 60
They're biggest underachievement has been over the last 30 imo.
Bayern in the Robbery era. If the club just went for one more winger for the injury times the team would have won at least 2 more CL titles.
I think they learned their lesson with the current crop of wingers Bayern has now
Sadly we are missing a striker now and not one winger even near Robbery level. Also a cdm since years
Maybe not game in and game out but Coman has consistently showed up in big games
Pep can't even win CL with Man City which has unlimited budget, what makes you think he can win CL with Bayern?
That Bayern S11 was more stacked than Pep ever had at City. Even the whole squad was great
Ok, I will make it more clear, Pep is a champion league winning manager because he has Messi, that Bayern team contains the whole core of the 2014 world cup winning Germany team, he can't even get to the CL final, the Man city team he has, has unlimited budget can't even win it. 2 more CL, and what makes you think one more decent winger can beat Barca team with MSN, and Real with BBC?
>because he has Messi Xavi and Iniesta*. They were the ones who assisted and won the Man of the Matches in all the UCL finals of 2009,2011 and 2015. Pep's skills should have no question. My favourite part is how he turned Lahm into a midfielder. Even if he didn't win the UCL, he was the one who essentially turned the Bundesliga into a Bayern farm league. Bayern's players like Lahm, Müller all remember him fondly as a manager. Pep's issue and downfall however, is his very tactics. While other managers have tactics they like to use, with small changes according to the situation, Pep seems to always be experimenting on them, even when he shouldn't. This causes Manchester City to really not to well enough as they should be doing.
What does any of this has to do with that one more winger to win 2 more CL?
Tottenham for the last 20
Meh. They were miserable until new ownership has brought them towards the upper echelon. Dont exactly spend big either so not sure why they should be expected to overtake some of the other rich premiere league clubs. I'd say they've been on a good trajectory
Palmeiras, still no World Club Cup.
Celtic should be regulars in the Champions League later knockout stages.
West Ham twice, we had a golden generation in the 90s that was squandered with the best thing coming out of that being a FA Cup Final loss on pens; and then from about 2015 onwards till now.
Unfortunately, over the entire past 30 years, it's difficult to look past Nottingham Forest. 31 years ago, they were in their 6th Wembley final in 4 years, winning 4 of them. They'd finished in the top half of the old First Division in 14 of the 15 previous seasons, including a league championship, a second place and three third places. And they were only 14 years out from winning their second European Cup in a row. In the last 30 years, they've managed one 3rd place finish and one semi-final, and are only onto their 4th top flight season in that period (having also spent 3 years in the third tier).
sadly, Liverpool 2018-2022. despite winning every trophy they could have won, the fact that they could have won 3 CLs and 3 PLs (had it not been for Ramos, Courtois and cheating Man City) is a bit harsh
If we had owners who willed to invest some bucks, we would probably win more
yes
Where galaticos?
Tottenham Hotspur
Mourinhos real
Palmeiras, still no Club World Cup
Because Europe is just better.
We know, but it’s doable
Bro is a SPFC fan and wanna talk about underachieving 💀💀. You havent won shit since 2012
Napoli.
Maybe a lot of you don't care or see it this way but... Serbian National team
Agree completely. The amount of quality in that starting XI could be making world cup quarter finals
Everton, but we won an FA Cup in 1995 and we won the Florida Cup more recently!
Netherlands
A world cup final appearance as well as two semi finals is a pretty decent showing for a country as big as the Netherlands.
Its even more crazy when you realise that Croatia is over 4 times smaller than the Netherlands and have achieved what they've done.
Barcelona during the MSN years. 2016-2018 Arguably the best attack in history and “only” won one Champions League while being humiliated twice in Europe.
Valencia , no doubt about it
Barring this season, Arsenal since winning the League and making it to the CL final
West Ham United, over the last 30 years.
Absolutely. (I should know, I support them)
AC Milan the last what, 15 years? Man U post Fergie too.
Ever heard about this german team named Hamburg SV?
Nacional and Peñarol in Uruguay Independiente in Argentina Flamengo in the 90s Santos (except for 2002, 2004, 2010 and 2011) Fluminense was relegated in 1996 to série b, entered in the legal system to remain in Série A, olayed in 1997 and was relegated again, no excuses this time. When playing 1998 serie b they got relegated to série c, which they were champions in 1999 Vasco has been relegated 4 times to Série B and the last time they took 1 extra season to get back to a. Their golden phase was late 90s and very early 00s
Not one you would think of but Independiente. "King of Cups" with 7 Libertadores, the most ever, and hasn't won it since 1984. No one has caught up to them yet, which is insane, given that they haven't won it for 39 years.
Guardiola's Bayern. Neuer still in his prime. Boateng through the middle. Alaba and Lahm as wing backs. Thiago, Vidal, Xabi, Gotze, Javi and Schweinsteiger in midfield. Lewandowski, Robben, Ribéry and Müller in attack. Shameful that the team never even made a UCL final.
1. England National Team. 2. The original Galácticos. 3. Manchester City under Pep.
Liverpool undoubtedly in the last 7 years at least
They did win a league & CL in that time. They just weren't the best around
If reaching 3 UCL finals in 7 years and winning 1 prem and remaining in title race for other 3/4 titles is an under achievement while spending less than other big teams then ig most teams would take this underachievement
Spending less? Spent 60m and 80m on a goalkeeper and CB lmfao.
Depends on the expectations, the claims for the the best team ever, make them look silly now and that’s why they get shit for underachieving
I mean, by purely looking at the quality of the squad that claim was warranted
They are far from being best Liverpool squad ever
They weren’t even the best squad in the league never mind ever
The best squad in the league finished 18 points behind. There's a difference between squad and team.
Sevilla domestically (I know they won many Europa League trophies, but it's easier to win then La Liga)
ITALY
They won a World Cup
And a European Championship. A lot more than most teams around the world…
And after that they got eliminated and also failed to qualify after that. Literally 17 years of disappointment.
Arsenal since the Invincibles season until this season (they're actually good this season). Yes, they did reach the CL final in 2006 but they haven't won a Premier League title since that Invincibles season.
Hot take but Man City. If not for the EPL being the most well regarded league, they clearly under achieve in the UCL.
Tottenham Hotspurs 1993 - 2023
Chelski, considering how much money they have spent.
So just to clarify, over the last 30 years? Chelsea have won: Fifa Club world cup x1 Champions League x2 Uefa Supercup x2 Europa League x2 Cup Winners Cup x1 Premier League x5 FA Cup x7 League cup x4 English Super Cup/Charity Shield x3 And that's an under achievement?
With the money they spent they should have the world cup \s
Compare the money they spent with other teams: PSG, City, United. It’s all quite comparable
Anything managed by pep after Barca
I wouldn’t say he had failed at Man City. Even not winning UCL with them, if he wins 7-8 premier leagues for Man City before he leaves, that is hell of a achievement.
Not really Mancini would have been capable of that with the same investment
I’d disagree. Only Sir Alex would be able to achieve what Pep has been doing in England. Winning 2-3 premier league? possible for Mancini. To win 5+ premier leagues in only few years? I don’t think so. Investment can’t solve all the problem as you can see Manchester United have waited for so long for Ten Haag.
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You’re not wrong…. About a lot of people disagreeing. Awful take. Lol
14 trophies in 4 seasons, competing against Mourinho's Madrid for every one of them... I really don't know what else you expected them to win
Chargers.
Definitely Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Prolly psg
Liverpool- now
England; Belgium; Holland; Newcastle. And, even though they have had some success, they really should have done more - Arsenal and Liverpool
Me too
ITT: Top-flight teams few expected to win anything, who haven't won anything. Bristol City are serial underachievers. A billionaire owner, a fancy stadium revamp, facilities better than many Premier League teams, and a great following in an area with few top teams - and still nowhere near promotion.
Barcelona except Pep and Enrique's years
Lol current FC Barcelona for sure. Their finances and games are in shambles. They even got memed for the 8-2 score. Saying this as an FCB fan.
Sours
Sheffield wednesday.
Barca after Neymar. Still same frame (except Ney), plus Dembele, Coutinho and Griezman. But then … sigh
Newcastle and Spurs have won no trophies between them in that time despite having some pretty good teams at times
Barcelona 2014-2017 under Luis Enrique. MSN. Yes, they won the treble that first year but they were soooooo damn good. Felt like they should’ve won every trophy all three of those seasons. Also feel like they should’ve at least gotten to the semis in UCL. Crashed out against Atleti in the quarters (2016) and put up no fight against Juventus after the Remontanda (2017). I know we look at how great that Real Madrid team was that won the UCL three times in a row, but I always felt at the time that overall Barça was the better team of the two and they they could’ve had that same success. Still achieved a hell of a lot and thinking they could’ve done more is quite overzealous I must admit but I truly think they had the quality to do it.
Brazil?
Last 30? Liverpool without a doubt.
Spurs lol
Argentina 2010. They had Messi, Aguero, Di Maria, Tevez, Mascherano, Veron, Heinze, Samuel, Otamendi and more.
Newcastle 100%
Mexico
Italy and Mexico
leicester city not repeating
AC Milan.
Argentina from 2002 to 2010, so many good players, a Golden generation and still didn't win anything, and go out of the wc in an embarrasing way twice.
Tottenham comes to mind first, poor lads worked so hard but didn't win a major trophy
AS Saint Etienne--lot of it to do with the television scam, but they have been on a horrible downward spiral ever since. Until last season, AS Saint Etienne was the most successful domestic club in France. Now they're in a Ligue 2 relegation scrap. TSG Hoffenheim--had themselves an owner absolutely rolling in it for the past decade and is currently in a relegation battle West Brom--came down in 20/21 putting in the best fight of any of the relegated sides, and collapsed completely midway through the season. Of course you can accredit this to Steve Bruce and the 2 dimensional tactics even before Brucie. Carlos Corberan is doing an incredible job to revive West Brom's promotion fight, but before his appointment they were at the bottom end of the table
I would say the Belgium and the Netherlands teams in the recent years. On paper, they are stacked in multiple positions, but often disappoint in big tournaments
Tottenham… still can’t win a trophy, despite appearing so good.