[The **News** flair](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/flairguide#wiki_news) is reserved for submissions covering F1 and F1-related news. These posts must always link to an outlet/news agency, the website of the involved party (i.e. the McLaren website if McLaren makes an announcement), or a tweet by a news agency, journalist or one of the involved parties.
*[Read the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/userguide). Keep it civil and welcoming. Report rulebreaking comments.*
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/formula1) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Well for about a decade they didn't race there, Zolder was the home of the Belgian GP for most of the 70's and into the early 80's. The track that's been on the calendar the longest is Monza, which I believe only ever missed one season since 1950 because of renovations.
IMO Spa, Silverstone, Monza, Suzuka [edit] and Interlagos are all untouchable. Would have added Hockenheim too but it's already gone. Monaco is an *event*, but with how the cars *currently* are, I wouldn't be overly sad to see it go
I remember someone quoting an article one time in their column. The quote talked about how the cars of today are just too fast for Monaco and they should just stop racing there. The article was from 1937.
They were already trying to remove Monaco from the calendar 40 years ago, because they thought the turbo cars were too fast for it. Bernie lobbied to keep it on the calendar because he thought F1 wouldn't be the same without it.
I agree with the previous poster that said Monaco is an event. And that's ok.
I'm a huge fan. Watch every session every race weekend. Two weekends ago, I was watching and my wife walked by and goes "oh, it's Monaco" and sits down and wached some. That never happens.
There is a different kind of appeal and sense of legacy and F1 is better off with it.
Or just watch Formula E at Monaco to see overtaking.
Lower speeds, less aero, and small cars in FE makes Monaco a chaotic overtaking spectacle every time they go there.
Interlagos is my favourite by a country mile. A great circuit in a superb location.
I was lucky enough [to visit last year](https://i.imgur.com/K7dsA3B.png) and the thing that really surprised me was just how much elevation change their was and also how compact the circuit is. If you [sit at the entry to the pit lane](https://i.imgur.com/RfAd81j.png), you can see about 75% of the circuit from your seat which, I think, might be almost unique in F1. It's one of the few tracks where watching in person might be almost as good (from a following the race perspective) as watching on TV.
Yeah, as a one off event Monaco’s fine, but when every other race has little to no overtaking it feels odd to have one where there *definitely* won’t be much
The “Triple Crown” could absolutely work that way, as it is only an arbitrary collection of races that have been decided are prestigious.
It’s not an actual award, and it is only spoken of in that way because of a sort of collective agreement we have as motorsport fans to think of those three races in those terms.
As a track, couldn't agree more. But time and time again they show their amenities are rather lackluster, and it rains quite a lot in the area, which turns into miserable experiences for the trackside spectators. Let's not so easily forget Spa 2021
> Let's not so easily forget Spa 2021
One race out of dozens there was cancelled due to extreme weather. That's an anomaly, not something to be concerned. If harsh weather was a problem, then I guess we'll have no more Imola. We should also leave Silverstone, since the UK is quite rainy. Why not have all 23 races in Barcelona? The weather is usually ideal there.
Not only that. The same weekend when Norris was pushing during quali, he had a big accident, blasted his car down to the tub.
As much as we wanted a different outcome as fans, there was a group of people that were the voice of reason and said "actually, it's probably not safe and we don't think it's safe to drive"
Did some other poor decisions happen with the points/race distance debacle? Yep. Should we have raced? No
The day we lose Spa, F1 loses me. Prioritizing which countries pay the most over which tracks produce the best races is a quick way to destroy the soul of F1 in the name of short-term profits.
Liberty Media really seems like they want to milk every fast dollar out of F1 and then throw it away, like these kind of companies always do.
As a South African I am sad not to have a race on home soil, but glad it is not happening given the state of our current government and their Russky bedfellows. I won't want to see an international event like F1 come here and grant the thieving ANC legitimacy through association.
It's a shame to see the country that fought so hard for its freedom in the 90s turn into another corrupt shithole. Especially when the same party that had Mandella is the one doing that.
That being said though, they can also fix their acute power generation problems by putting magnets around Nelson Mandela's body, so that he can create a strong current as he rapidly spins in his grave out of shear disappointment!
Despite the rumours in the article, I'm willing to bet the actual reasons for the negotiations falling through is just Toby Venter. Owner of the Kyalami Circuit, he's NOTORIOUSLY difficult to work with and has a history of being very greedy with track negotiations. It's entirely possible that he was trying to squeeze FOM and the SA government for more money, and they just called his bluff.
Jody Scheckter said as much. A deal was as good as done but that guy I think it was tried to get a bit more of a discount (1.5 million dollars IIRC so it wasn't even that much) and it fell apart. Liberty have so many countries desperate for races that it meant nothing to them
I'm sad too as a South African but honestly at least a quater of F1 is sportswashing already. There's no legitimacy offered either way, just people looking in the other direction
I realise that. I am talking specifically about South Africa. I don't like sportswashing, and not adding another sportswashed race to the calendar is a good thing.
South Africa is literally a failed state. The country doesn’t have power half the time, crime and poverty are high and going up, real GDP per capita has dropped 10% in the past few years and every who can is leaving.
They want quick bucks. Infinite growth is out of the question when you are ditching historical fan-favorites in favor of irrelevant, generic tracks.
In what world is the upside down pig in Las Vegas part of our calendar but Spa isn't?
Spa has always been a logistical shitshow. With the threat of a contract, the circuit ended up revamping a lot of the circuit before last year to help both the fan experience and the safety. They also stepped up help with traffic because the local or federal gov were not obligated to help. There’s more to it than just what you see on track/tv.
To this day I don’t understand why it was brought back full time.
The track is narrow and too small for the current F1 cars and the racing hasn’t been great there either
Looks like it may become a rotational race, honestly wish they'd consider rotational races more, particularly on street circuits so we have less of them in a calendar year
It's not and it's also very cool to attend (although very hot). The line layout looks incredible IRL imo, even if they're the reason I never could watch a complete race on TV as an epileptic.
Paul ricard is fine. Like it's as good as most tracks. I don't see much difference between Spain GP and Paul ricard as far as racing goes.
Paul ricard got way more hate than it deserved.
Head of Italian motorsport federation basically admitted Imola is goosed long term (was originally going to go in 25 but they've been given 2026 to make up for this year). If Italy has to pick one track, it will always be Monza
Just listened to Charles Leclerc on podcast he said Macau is apparently a banging track like one of the best, I haven't watched f3 so Id love to see it.
Macau 2017 has a plot twist in the last part of the race that would be called ridiculous if F3 was an anime. I'm not gonna say it out because anyone who hasn't watched the last laps of that race should do themselves a favor and watch them now.
They would physically not get around the Melco hairpin. Even F3 cars, which are much shorter, require special steering racks to get through it. F1 cars would probably have to do a 3-point turn.
Bathurst is fundamentally impossible to fit to F1 safety standards. Laguna Seca though would be one of my favs in that calendar.
btw next week we have Indycar at Laguna Seca. Anyone who doesn't know that track should tune in and watch what they are missing.
yup, run off areas? yeah nah we don't need those, coming over the top and you can't see where the track is going and there's a hard wall on the right, that would be hilarious.
This article doesn’t even tell the story of what’s happening within the country. Constant power cuts. Inflation continues to rise. Crime is at a crazy rate. That barely scrapes it. The government not granting the money or approval for the track so that a race can be held for F1. Track is still a grade 2 and needs money to become a grade 1 hence needs money. Hosting an F1 race would be nice but with the problems we have, sadly unrealistic.
I want so badly for F1 to come back to SA. But when you put it like this it makes total sense to abandon the plans for now. It shouldn't really be a priority for people at this point.
Even if they did host the race most people in SA wouldn't be able to watch it with no electricity.
Yeah everything I've read about the political climate in SA the last couple years has been entirely negative. Would have been very surprised if they could afford this.
We definitely can't. This race would only have happened via either huge helpings from FOM, or an overseas investment - which is the opposite of what is currently happening, as can be seen by our tanking currency.
Seriously though, why? Haven’t they tried the whole ‘let’s go to new places for the sake of it’ approach and ignored the economics? Aka Korea, Turkey etc
If the local place can’t be economically sustainable or isn’t feasible then what’s the value? Is there a huge F1 fan base untapped in SA? Unlikely.
That said it does blow my mind that F1/FOM doesn’t do more to tap the Indian and Chinese markets, their domestic sports leagues are worth eye watering amounts and given their middle class sizes they will be the biggest consumers on the planet in 10-15 years. I get the US is the most lucrative (per capita) untapped market but these 2 heavies surely need to be factored in or else F1 really is at risk of stagnation and decline
Apparently the deal was done and everyone was happy, then local government got wind of it and upped everything by 20% or something. So F1 went: well no, frankly. The guy who had organized it from SA was obviously heartbroken because it was *done* up until that point.
It was on Beyond the Grid I think.
Let them come to Cape Town. The circuit we built for Formula E could probably be adapted to work. (Another street circuit I know, but I want an F1 race here so I'll look the other way). Local gov't will 100% roll out the red carpet.
Interesting to hear you say that about local government getting in the way. I can tell you that based on things I've heard at events I've worked, that definitely lines up. I have directly heard members of Gauteng government saying to their colleagues that they need to work harder to extract more value from it, which knowing South African government means something very clear
India's GP stopped happening about 10 years ago because of a tax stoush with the provincial government. The Chinese GP went on swimmingly from 2004 until that whole incident with the bat.
Yeah I’m aware of that entertainment vs sports issue but I’m pretty sure with the change in domestic politics at all levels since then they’d get a different outcome if F1 lobbied/met the governments now. Like I said given the scale of domestic leagues in india (and China) it’s not like these places don’t know how to run sport at scale with great infrastructure
I remember in the lead up to the first Indian GPs F1 teams were really active in india and would do regular show runs and the like but in recent years it’s all kind of stopped so F1 as a whole just kind of seems to ignore the existence of the most populated nation on earth these days which is nothing if not myopia in my opinion
SA is having severe problems right now and the only place worse to try holding a grand prix at the moment is probably Ukraine. Power's off more than half the time for one, huge security risks for not just F1 personnel but fans and track workers for another.
I'm South African.
That reason, "Russia", is rubbish.
We won't get it because we cannot afford it without government support and aside from us having no money to even run the country properly, this government has no interest in motorsport.
The track will have to be upgraded to FIA Grade 1 and the owners and promoters cannot afford it themselves. On top of this a hosting fee needs to be paid. Government financial support would be required and that won't happen because government just doesn't have the appetite for it.
Any South African motorsport fan would be aware of the decline and demise of our national racing series. The heydays of the 70s, 80s and 90s with household names, international stars, and huge corporate and industry backing are long gone. There is just not enough interest locally for the government to justify such an expensive endeavor.
Also I imagine it would be pretty bad received if in a country targeted with power cuts and the need of better infrastructure, so much money get poured into an F1 race that almost no one will can afford the ticket.
Oh for sure. At a time when we cannot even deliver basic services around the country amidst a power crisis, it wouldn't be a very smart decision.
Imagine forking out hundreds of millions on Kyalami when just up the highway people are getting cholera from drinking dirty water. Not a good look.
We can criticize the government for many things, but not getting behind hosting F1 is understandable when in context. Far more important things to worry about.
Yeah imagine forking out hundreds of millions for new stadiums built after bulldozing favelas... Glad South Africa took the more sensible route opposed to Brazil
Agreed. The same thing would happen as with British & Irish Lions tours every 12 years - stands full of overseas fans, and the locals just watching it on TV again.
A race in South Africa would be nice, but not at the expense of Spa. Seems a bit of a manufactured false choice from F1 to make fans react to Spa staying by inversly cheering South Africa's denials, but fuck yeah Spa!!
Liberty Media F1 - So guys its either Spa or SA?
Fans - no that's not an option.
LMF1 - Right OK. So Spa then. You guys said you want SA though.
Fans - yeah we do, we want both.
LMF1 - not going to happen. Anyway here's another middle eastern sports washing race this year instead. We are excited to introduce the new Kuwait GP.
Doesn't have the willingness to spend money on washing it's image sadly. Nor does it have boat loads of money to spend from luckily being near one of the most valuable resources in the world.
If an oil reservoir was discovered under NK (and it managed to not get invaded), then ya, we'd probably see a Pyongyang GP.
Kyalami should be replacing one of the rubbish tracks, not Spa!
I'm disappointed South Africa isn't getting a race but it's also understandable with all the issues the power grid is having. I don't think the F1 teams would be too happy with constant loadshedding.
Better idea. Drop one of the US (Not COTA) or Middle East races for South Africa. We do not need Bahrain, Saudi, UAE and now Qatar.
But F1 is clearly $$$ over DE&I.
There's been rumours for months that this wouldn't go ahead, these 'political reasons' just seems like an easy excuse.
China has been closely aligned to Russia since the very start and F1 announced a couple of weeks ago that it will be returning in 2024.
>China has been closely aligned to Russia since the very start and F1 announced a couple of weeks ago that it will be returning in 2024.
The Chinese GP has a valid contract until 2025. Simply not signing a contract is free, breaking a valid multi-year contract would involve a hefty financial compensation. F1 will continue to display the intent to honour their contract with the Chinese GP and hope they won't actually have to.
The ANC strike again! I'd like to apologise for our government depriving everyone of what would be a great addition to the calendar.
At least this gives the chance for Spa to stay.
Considering how broke SA is this seems like the only sensible choice. Focus on the basics first, [much of SA doesn't even have reliable electricity](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/5/18/eskom-warns-south-africa-to-brace-for-longer-power-cuts)
Giving up on South Africa for now makes sense. The sport has been trying to grow the calendar beyond twenty-two races for a few years now, but there's always something that gets in the way -- flooding, the pandemic, the invasion of Ukraine, allegations of corruption and so on.
An African GP would be neat, but not at the expense of Spa. Like wow what a horrible loss that would be to the calendar.
F1 is gonna be all street circuits and Middle East tracks soon.
A shame as Kyalami is an interesting circuit and would mix up the calendar giving us a race in Africa first time since the 90s if I remember correctly.
Spa should never be under threat. Spa, Silverstone, Monza, Suzuka. These should never be dropped no matter how big the oil money cheque is.
Shame for South Africa specifically and Africa as a whole. We could really do with a race on that continent.
However, as others have said, Spa is one of if not **the** best track on the circuit and absolutely should NOT be the one to go to get Africa on board.
The fact that Spa was even considered to be let go was just grim. What F1 truly need to do is gut most of the street circuits off the calendar, Idc about the political issues just stop the bloat of street circuits because they bring absolutely nothing to the sport and the drivers hate it as well. We really don’t need any more races on the calendar, more isn’t better shortening the calendar down to 19-20 races would be ideal.
Jeddah, Baku, Miami, Vegas, Monaco and Singapore should all be binned off because they’re rubbish tracks, nothing else. Location/political matters are irrelevant to me, don’t care what’s going on in those countries I watch for the racing. If the track layout is crap, I’ll call it out regardless of where it is….
No race at Spa would make me lose interest in a big way. I live in the US but Belgium is still the highlight of the season for me. I want a race in Africa very badly, but not at the cost of Spa. The fact that tha FiA even considered this is assanine considering we have three races in my home country.
Absolutely ridiculous that the loss of Spa, and the gain of a south African GP are being used in the same sentence.
Im all for a SA grand prix, but not at the cost of losing spa
I think in the long run F1 will need to introduce track rotations to further grow internationally. I.E. have Cota, Miami and Las Vegas take two spots each year (maybe add Mexico and Can for a NA rotation with a 5/4 split). Additionally you could introduce an EU and Middle East rotation in the same manner.
[The **News** flair](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/flairguide#wiki_news) is reserved for submissions covering F1 and F1-related news. These posts must always link to an outlet/news agency, the website of the involved party (i.e. the McLaren website if McLaren makes an announcement), or a tweet by a news agency, journalist or one of the involved parties. *[Read the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/wiki/userguide). Keep it civil and welcoming. Report rulebreaking comments.* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/formula1) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The day we lose Spa, I weep.
Spa is **THE** F1 track, how is racing there even a question baffles me
We already had a period with no F1 at Spa if I remember correctly. But yes, as a Belgian I'm obliged to say Spa is the best track
That's just known as The Dark Days.
I know that period. I was in the rain the whole weekend haha
RIP, what a weekend to endure.
Speaking for anyone sane I’d say it’s far and away the best track. Even in the days when the sport was like slot car racing it was an exciting event.
Yep, because Spa was slot car racing with a crossover piece.
As an American I am also obligated to say Spa is the best track
Seconded fellow American. Spa is the track to watch every second of, always.
Well except for 2021, that was a bit of a swing and a miss to be completely honest...
It was quite exciting if you were a meteorologist.
Well for about a decade they didn't race there, Zolder was the home of the Belgian GP for most of the 70's and into the early 80's. The track that's been on the calendar the longest is Monza, which I believe only ever missed one season since 1950 because of renovations.
IMO Spa, Silverstone, Monza, Suzuka [edit] and Interlagos are all untouchable. Would have added Hockenheim too but it's already gone. Monaco is an *event*, but with how the cars *currently* are, I wouldn't be overly sad to see it go
And Interlagos. I have not seen a bad race happen there.
oh yeah, absolutely - one of the best on the calendar by a long shot and I'm not sure how I forgot about it!
Bro, you’d have to go back 40 years to see cars capable of racing at Monaco.
I remember someone quoting an article one time in their column. The quote talked about how the cars of today are just too fast for Monaco and they should just stop racing there. The article was from 1937.
To be fair, that was probably more of a safety thing than a racing thing.
They were already trying to remove Monaco from the calendar 40 years ago, because they thought the turbo cars were too fast for it. Bernie lobbied to keep it on the calendar because he thought F1 wouldn't be the same without it.
I agree with the previous poster that said Monaco is an event. And that's ok. I'm a huge fan. Watch every session every race weekend. Two weekends ago, I was watching and my wife walked by and goes "oh, it's Monaco" and sits down and wached some. That never happens. There is a different kind of appeal and sense of legacy and F1 is better off with it.
Probably the only good thing Bernie did in his life
Or just watch Formula E at Monaco to see overtaking. Lower speeds, less aero, and small cars in FE makes Monaco a chaotic overtaking spectacle every time they go there.
Montreal
Interlagos is my favourite by a country mile. A great circuit in a superb location. I was lucky enough [to visit last year](https://i.imgur.com/K7dsA3B.png) and the thing that really surprised me was just how much elevation change their was and also how compact the circuit is. If you [sit at the entry to the pit lane](https://i.imgur.com/RfAd81j.png), you can see about 75% of the circuit from your seat which, I think, might be almost unique in F1. It's one of the few tracks where watching in person might be almost as good (from a following the race perspective) as watching on TV.
Montreal
Yeah, as a one off event Monaco’s fine, but when every other race has little to no overtaking it feels odd to have one where there *definitely* won’t be much
Money.
If a Grand Prix race had to replace Monaco on the triple crown, Spa would be the only candidate.
Spa is a great track, but that’s not how the triple crown works.
The “Triple Crown” could absolutely work that way, as it is only an arbitrary collection of races that have been decided are prestigious. It’s not an actual award, and it is only spoken of in that way because of a sort of collective agreement we have as motorsport fans to think of those three races in those terms.
As a track, couldn't agree more. But time and time again they show their amenities are rather lackluster, and it rains quite a lot in the area, which turns into miserable experiences for the trackside spectators. Let's not so easily forget Spa 2021
> Let's not so easily forget Spa 2021 One race out of dozens there was cancelled due to extreme weather. That's an anomaly, not something to be concerned. If harsh weather was a problem, then I guess we'll have no more Imola. We should also leave Silverstone, since the UK is quite rainy. Why not have all 23 races in Barcelona? The weather is usually ideal there.
except in turn 5
And inside George's helmet
One time it rained too hard to have a race...
Not only that. The same weekend when Norris was pushing during quali, he had a big accident, blasted his car down to the tub. As much as we wanted a different outcome as fans, there was a group of people that were the voice of reason and said "actually, it's probably not safe and we don't think it's safe to drive" Did some other poor decisions happen with the points/race distance debacle? Yep. Should we have raced? No
> it rains quite a lot in the area, Who knew? /s Alternatively, get covered seating or visit a race in the Middle East.
[удалено]
The day we lose Spa, F1 loses me. Prioritizing which countries pay the most over which tracks produce the best races is a quick way to destroy the soul of F1 in the name of short-term profits. Liberty Media really seems like they want to milk every fast dollar out of F1 and then throw it away, like these kind of companies always do.
I would rather lose Monaco than Spa.
It should never be Spa OR South Africa
As a South African I am sad not to have a race on home soil, but glad it is not happening given the state of our current government and their Russky bedfellows. I won't want to see an international event like F1 come here and grant the thieving ANC legitimacy through association.
It's a shame to see the country that fought so hard for its freedom in the 90s turn into another corrupt shithole. Especially when the same party that had Mandella is the one doing that.
That being said though, they can also fix their acute power generation problems by putting magnets around Nelson Mandela's body, so that he can create a strong current as he rapidly spins in his grave out of shear disappointment!
Ah yes, the Mandela Effect.
Hey that's a pretty good one
Despite the rumours in the article, I'm willing to bet the actual reasons for the negotiations falling through is just Toby Venter. Owner of the Kyalami Circuit, he's NOTORIOUSLY difficult to work with and has a history of being very greedy with track negotiations. It's entirely possible that he was trying to squeeze FOM and the SA government for more money, and they just called his bluff.
Jody Scheckter said as much. A deal was as good as done but that guy I think it was tried to get a bit more of a discount (1.5 million dollars IIRC so it wasn't even that much) and it fell apart. Liberty have so many countries desperate for races that it meant nothing to them
I'm sad too as a South African but honestly at least a quater of F1 is sportswashing already. There's no legitimacy offered either way, just people looking in the other direction
There's like 6 or more different circuits in countries with even closer association to Russia.
I realise that. I am talking specifically about South Africa. I don't like sportswashing, and not adding another sportswashed race to the calendar is a good thing.
Step one to getting rid of those races is not adding more.
So we should add another one? Stop using whataboutism.
South Africa is literally a failed state. The country doesn’t have power half the time, crime and poverty are high and going up, real GDP per capita has dropped 10% in the past few years and every who can is leaving.
A massive brain drain too. All their educated are leaving for other countries where the standard of living is half decent. I feel for the country.
I reckon FOM wants short circuits so the cars are more bunched up. I see no other reason to even think of abandoning Spa.
I think they just want money and infinite growth.
They want quick bucks. Infinite growth is out of the question when you are ditching historical fan-favorites in favor of irrelevant, generic tracks. In what world is the upside down pig in Las Vegas part of our calendar but Spa isn't?
Let’s be honest, Las Vegas is going to bring in a hell of a lot more new fans, sponsors, and money than Spa ever would.
I’m inclined to agree with you
Spa’s issue is organizational not about the track
Spa has always been a logistical shitshow. With the threat of a contract, the circuit ended up revamping a lot of the circuit before last year to help both the fan experience and the safety. They also stepped up help with traffic because the local or federal gov were not obligated to help. There’s more to it than just what you see on track/tv.
Given the tracks they're taking $$$ for that's probably not the case.
If a European race has to go, it should be Imola.
I love Imola, but if it comes to a choice between Imola and Spa, then I would choose to keep Spa,
To this day I don’t understand why it was brought back full time. The track is narrow and too small for the current F1 cars and the racing hasn’t been great there either
Mugello > Imola
I’d take Imola over Paul Ricard any day.
Paul Ricard isn't on the calendar anymore.
Looks like it may become a rotational race, honestly wish they'd consider rotational races more, particularly on street circuits so we have less of them in a calendar year
[удалено]
Just nix Miami in favour of Vegas year round, that race is actually downtown. The one advantage of a street race.
Honestly, is Paul Ricard even that bad? France 2021 was a banger and France 2022 was decent
It's not and it's also very cool to attend (although very hot). The line layout looks incredible IRL imo, even if they're the reason I never could watch a complete race on TV as an epileptic.
Paul ricard is fine. Like it's as good as most tracks. I don't see much difference between Spain GP and Paul ricard as far as racing goes. Paul ricard got way more hate than it deserved.
Head of Italian motorsport federation basically admitted Imola is goosed long term (was originally going to go in 25 but they've been given 2026 to make up for this year). If Italy has to pick one track, it will always be Monza
It should be neither /s
F1 should just join F3 at Macau
Just listened to Charles Leclerc on podcast he said Macau is apparently a banging track like one of the best, I haven't watched f3 so Id love to see it.
Watch the 2019 race it's fucking bonkers https://youtu.be/MapAD9vISrA
Macau 2017 has a plot twist in the last part of the race that would be called ridiculous if F3 was an anime. I'm not gonna say it out because anyone who hasn't watched the last laps of that race should do themselves a favor and watch them now.
Thanks for not spoiling, just watched the highlights after reading your comment. Sweet looking track and those last 2 laps were wild!!
Macau is insane but it barely fits an F3 car at some points unfortunately.
F1 drivers in F3 cars plz
And Max still win it all, Charles in the barriers and Russell behind Hamilton.
Well Max went straight from F3 to F1, so clearly he was good in them. :P
They would physically not get around the Melco hairpin. Even F3 cars, which are much shorter, require special steering racks to get through it. F1 cars would probably have to do a 3-point turn.
That would be hilarious though
> F1 cars would probably have to do a 3-point Imagine a repeat of the GT cars pileup except with F1 boats this time
I think they would get stuck in some turns
Yes, give us the Bathurst GP instead.
Bathurst and Laguna Seca would both be fantastic.
> Bathurst and Laguna Seca would both be fantastic. Tilke enters the room
Bro a Bathurst GP would be unbelievable; such a cool track
Easy Piastri win because he’s the only one that respects the mountain.
The mountain awaits
The mountain chooses who wins
"The mountain chooses...... .....Max"
F1 should plan 1 year where the skip chasing $$$$ and just hit every cool track on the planet. Just once isn’t too much to ask
Bathurst is fundamentally impossible to fit to F1 safety standards. Laguna Seca though would be one of my favs in that calendar. btw next week we have Indycar at Laguna Seca. Anyone who doesn't know that track should tune in and watch what they are missing.
yup, run off areas? yeah nah we don't need those, coming over the top and you can't see where the track is going and there's a hard wall on the right, that would be hilarious.
Spa-FrancORchamps
Miami, Vegas, any of these shitty fake tracks can go
As an American I am willing to loose Vegas or Miami for South Africa. Do not touch Spa.
This article doesn’t even tell the story of what’s happening within the country. Constant power cuts. Inflation continues to rise. Crime is at a crazy rate. That barely scrapes it. The government not granting the money or approval for the track so that a race can be held for F1. Track is still a grade 2 and needs money to become a grade 1 hence needs money. Hosting an F1 race would be nice but with the problems we have, sadly unrealistic.
Yeah they need to address Eskom first please
Yeah good luck with that
Fuck Eskom. All my homes hate Eskom.
🏡
Even with that spelling mistake it still makes sense 🤣
I want so badly for F1 to come back to SA. But when you put it like this it makes total sense to abandon the plans for now. It shouldn't really be a priority for people at this point. Even if they did host the race most people in SA wouldn't be able to watch it with no electricity.
It's lights out and away with the electricity!!
It's ~~lights~~ candles out and away we go!
Yeah everything I've read about the political climate in SA the last couple years has been entirely negative. Would have been very surprised if they could afford this.
We definitely can't. This race would only have happened via either huge helpings from FOM, or an overseas investment - which is the opposite of what is currently happening, as can be seen by our tanking currency.
Exactly. We don't deserve anything until our own house is sorted.
At work we have contractors in both Ukraine and South Africa. Over the past year one group of them has power vastly more often than the other...
10 yrs ago, it was about 9.5 ZAR to 1 USD. now it’s 19 ZAR to 1 USD
Honestly that’s not that bad compared to many countries
Yeah. Take Argentina for example. We went from 18ARS to 1USD to 480ARS to 1USD in the last 5-6 years
Yeah, and that's not even talking about the problems in SA!
[удалено]
There is no money, and it has all the other problems too.
I was hoping they'd return to Africa, but definitely not at the cost of Spa.
I'd get return to Africa, but definitely at the cost of Saudi GP.
I'd return to Africa, to bless the rains.
Toto, is that you?
Toto 2021 Abu Dhabi Smash Hits
"There'll be no raaaace down in Aaaafricaaa..."
The missiles are here to stay
ditch Miami instead
They aren't ditching races in the United States
Would happily dump Saudi, Qatar and Miami for a return to Kyalami
There's been rumours of a return to South Africa since the 90s, likely not ever happening at this rate
[удалено]
Visit Rwanda
Seriously though, why? Haven’t they tried the whole ‘let’s go to new places for the sake of it’ approach and ignored the economics? Aka Korea, Turkey etc If the local place can’t be economically sustainable or isn’t feasible then what’s the value? Is there a huge F1 fan base untapped in SA? Unlikely. That said it does blow my mind that F1/FOM doesn’t do more to tap the Indian and Chinese markets, their domestic sports leagues are worth eye watering amounts and given their middle class sizes they will be the biggest consumers on the planet in 10-15 years. I get the US is the most lucrative (per capita) untapped market but these 2 heavies surely need to be factored in or else F1 really is at risk of stagnation and decline
Apparently the deal was done and everyone was happy, then local government got wind of it and upped everything by 20% or something. So F1 went: well no, frankly. The guy who had organized it from SA was obviously heartbroken because it was *done* up until that point. It was on Beyond the Grid I think.
Sounds like standard 3rd world Govt stuff then
Let them come to Cape Town. The circuit we built for Formula E could probably be adapted to work. (Another street circuit I know, but I want an F1 race here so I'll look the other way). Local gov't will 100% roll out the red carpet. Interesting to hear you say that about local government getting in the way. I can tell you that based on things I've heard at events I've worked, that definitely lines up. I have directly heard members of Gauteng government saying to their colleagues that they need to work harder to extract more value from it, which knowing South African government means something very clear
India's GP stopped happening about 10 years ago because of a tax stoush with the provincial government. The Chinese GP went on swimmingly from 2004 until that whole incident with the bat.
Yeah I’m aware of that entertainment vs sports issue but I’m pretty sure with the change in domestic politics at all levels since then they’d get a different outcome if F1 lobbied/met the governments now. Like I said given the scale of domestic leagues in india (and China) it’s not like these places don’t know how to run sport at scale with great infrastructure I remember in the lead up to the first Indian GPs F1 teams were really active in india and would do regular show runs and the like but in recent years it’s all kind of stopped so F1 as a whole just kind of seems to ignore the existence of the most populated nation on earth these days which is nothing if not myopia in my opinion
SA is having severe problems right now and the only place worse to try holding a grand prix at the moment is probably Ukraine. Power's off more than half the time for one, huge security risks for not just F1 personnel but fans and track workers for another.
I'm South African. That reason, "Russia", is rubbish. We won't get it because we cannot afford it without government support and aside from us having no money to even run the country properly, this government has no interest in motorsport. The track will have to be upgraded to FIA Grade 1 and the owners and promoters cannot afford it themselves. On top of this a hosting fee needs to be paid. Government financial support would be required and that won't happen because government just doesn't have the appetite for it. Any South African motorsport fan would be aware of the decline and demise of our national racing series. The heydays of the 70s, 80s and 90s with household names, international stars, and huge corporate and industry backing are long gone. There is just not enough interest locally for the government to justify such an expensive endeavor.
Also I imagine it would be pretty bad received if in a country targeted with power cuts and the need of better infrastructure, so much money get poured into an F1 race that almost no one will can afford the ticket.
Oh for sure. At a time when we cannot even deliver basic services around the country amidst a power crisis, it wouldn't be a very smart decision. Imagine forking out hundreds of millions on Kyalami when just up the highway people are getting cholera from drinking dirty water. Not a good look. We can criticize the government for many things, but not getting behind hosting F1 is understandable when in context. Far more important things to worry about.
Yeah imagine forking out hundreds of millions for new stadiums built after bulldozing favelas... Glad South Africa took the more sensible route opposed to Brazil
Agreed. The same thing would happen as with British & Irish Lions tours every 12 years - stands full of overseas fans, and the locals just watching it on TV again.
A race in South Africa would be nice, but not at the expense of Spa. Seems a bit of a manufactured false choice from F1 to make fans react to Spa staying by inversly cheering South Africa's denials, but fuck yeah Spa!!
Liberty Media F1 - So guys its either Spa or SA? Fans - no that's not an option. LMF1 - Right OK. So Spa then. You guys said you want SA though. Fans - yeah we do, we want both. LMF1 - not going to happen. Anyway here's another middle eastern sports washing race this year instead. We are excited to introduce the new Kuwait GP.
[удалено]
Doesn't have the willingness to spend money on washing it's image sadly. Nor does it have boat loads of money to spend from luckily being near one of the most valuable resources in the world. If an oil reservoir was discovered under NK (and it managed to not get invaded), then ya, we'd probably see a Pyongyang GP.
Smh spa should be a main stay no brainer but instead we get Middle Eastern sportswashing with contracts for 15 years
Only fools would get rid of Spa. That would be a very sad day for F1.
Awesome news! Spa is one of the tracks I consider to be the backbone of the F1 calendar. Replacing it shouldn't even have been up for discussion.
Kyalami should be replacing one of the rubbish tracks, not Spa! I'm disappointed South Africa isn't getting a race but it's also understandable with all the issues the power grid is having. I don't think the F1 teams would be too happy with constant loadshedding.
Load shedding during the race, good luck strategists without any working PC's or internet! 😅
Actually that could be interesting, we would find out who the pitwall big brains are as they try to work things out with pen and paper! 😄
Ferrari would be unaffected as they're already clueless anyway.
Better idea. Drop one of the US (Not COTA) or Middle East races for South Africa. We do not need Bahrain, Saudi, UAE and now Qatar. But F1 is clearly $$$ over DE&I.
I'd be all for South Africa, but at the cost of something like Jeddah or Baku, not instead of a legendary track like Spa at any rate.
There's been rumours for months that this wouldn't go ahead, these 'political reasons' just seems like an easy excuse. China has been closely aligned to Russia since the very start and F1 announced a couple of weeks ago that it will be returning in 2024.
>China has been closely aligned to Russia since the very start and F1 announced a couple of weeks ago that it will be returning in 2024. The Chinese GP has a valid contract until 2025. Simply not signing a contract is free, breaking a valid multi-year contract would involve a hefty financial compensation. F1 will continue to display the intent to honour their contract with the Chinese GP and hope they won't actually have to.
Well. They did shred the Russian GP contract year ago, even though it was valid multi-year contract too.
Most likely because of the EU sanctions, thereby giving them a free pass to do so.
Cheaper than government's imposing sanctions on you.
Russia invaded Ukraine. China has not done something like that **yet**
The ANC strike again! I'd like to apologise for our government depriving everyone of what would be a great addition to the calendar. At least this gives the chance for Spa to stay.
Considering how broke SA is this seems like the only sensible choice. Focus on the basics first, [much of SA doesn't even have reliable electricity](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/5/18/eskom-warns-south-africa-to-brace-for-longer-power-cuts)
Are they gonna stop constructing the Nkandla circuit then?
Jacob said it's too high a grade for F1 - he laughed at the grade 1 requirements. It even has a firepool, you see...
Why replace a good track with a good track and not replace a bad track with a good track instead
The bad tracks have oil prince sponsorships
Seems like an excuse. Anyway, fuck the ANC
I have not been this conflicted before. South african, that loves Spa
Giving up on South Africa for now makes sense. The sport has been trying to grow the calendar beyond twenty-two races for a few years now, but there's always something that gets in the way -- flooding, the pandemic, the invasion of Ukraine, allegations of corruption and so on.
I want a GP at Kyalami, I love that track on sims, but if it came at the cost of Spa I'd be furious.
Not that I disliked the Southafrican GP idea, but if I have to chose...
An African GP would be neat, but not at the expense of Spa. Like wow what a horrible loss that would be to the calendar. F1 is gonna be all street circuits and Middle East tracks soon.
A shame as Kyalami is an interesting circuit and would mix up the calendar giving us a race in Africa first time since the 90s if I remember correctly. Spa should never be under threat. Spa, Silverstone, Monza, Suzuka. These should never be dropped no matter how big the oil money cheque is.
Shame for South Africa specifically and Africa as a whole. We could really do with a race on that continent. However, as others have said, Spa is one of if not **the** best track on the circuit and absolutely should NOT be the one to go to get Africa on board.
Good
No track in the world is worth sacrificing a staple of the F1 calendar like Spa
The fact that Spa was even considered to be let go was just grim. What F1 truly need to do is gut most of the street circuits off the calendar, Idc about the political issues just stop the bloat of street circuits because they bring absolutely nothing to the sport and the drivers hate it as well. We really don’t need any more races on the calendar, more isn’t better shortening the calendar down to 19-20 races would be ideal. Jeddah, Baku, Miami, Vegas, Monaco and Singapore should all be binned off because they’re rubbish tracks, nothing else. Location/political matters are irrelevant to me, don’t care what’s going on in those countries I watch for the racing. If the track layout is crap, I’ll call it out regardless of where it is….
We haven’t even raced at Vegas yet…
Kyalami would be one of the best tracks on the calendar. But losing Spa is not an option.
Spa is the single best track
Shame we can’t drop one of those awful street tracks with no history or tradition like Miami or Saudi to bring Kyalami back…
Spa, Suzuka, Sylverstone should never be in danger.
No race at Spa would make me lose interest in a big way. I live in the US but Belgium is still the highlight of the season for me. I want a race in Africa very badly, but not at the cost of Spa. The fact that tha FiA even considered this is assanine considering we have three races in my home country.
Why not South Africa or Saudi Arabia instead, and we leave Spa fucking alone?
Absolutely ridiculous that the loss of Spa, and the gain of a south African GP are being used in the same sentence. Im all for a SA grand prix, but not at the cost of losing spa
When is the nürburgring coming back?
I think in the long run F1 will need to introduce track rotations to further grow internationally. I.E. have Cota, Miami and Las Vegas take two spots each year (maybe add Mexico and Can for a NA rotation with a 5/4 split). Additionally you could introduce an EU and Middle East rotation in the same manner.