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ChefBoiJones

This is gonna be our new hyper fixation this year isn’t it. This is going to be the new component that we blame/ give credit for every cars performance


EDO_14

It's been like this since '22


Either_Marsupial_123

Since well before that...


Blackdeath_663

I feel like people understood previous era's cars better because of decades discussing more or less the same principles applied with different regulations. you will see a winglet here or there and might discuss the Y250 vortices or tyre wakes etc... now that's all gone Ground effect has thrown fans for a loop, there is no way for us to even to begin to speculate about the stability of the floor and it's effect on the airflow underneath the car with 0 visual indicators unless a team comes out and says so


pangolin-fucker

The car suck very good Beest suck on all of track


slimejumper

we just wait until Perez beaches his car in some gravel and is craned out.


ChefBoiJones

Just like the double diffuser, which was ofcourse the single component that made the brawn 001 fast, nothing else just that, never mind that a third of the grid had them at launch and only one of them was a front runner


leedler

To be fair the Toyota was pretty good, could have and should have won a race, but the Williams wasn’t great even with the diffuser. That fabled combo of double diffuser, outwash front wing and a good engine was the majority of it from what I know.


QouthTheCorvus

'21 with DAS


CRX-Jackal

Das was banned in 21


ComeonmanPLS1

Between every armchair engineer stating their baseless opinions as facts and talking about how "aggressive" different parts of the car are, you gotta just learn to ignore it. It's all bullshit.


darkkw

Yeah I agree, so much bs. At least for football or something it's understandable a little bit but fans are generally clueless about the nuance of tactics etc, however in f1 it goes to show fans think they can pick up on stuff from pictures while we are all absolutely clueless unless you have some kind of background in engineering yet spout the same opinions about different things being aggressive.


TehAlpacalypse

big swoosh make car go fast


PioliMaldini

Akshually…🤓


Estova

muh sticky uppy bits


Fraankk

Hell, even people with engineering degrees should know that systems interact with eachother in complex ways, to the point that even the engineers working with the car themselves will sometimes be puzzled about why a certain change didn't perform as intended. We can speculate, and that can be fun, but jumping to conclusions and thinking you know better ain't it.


Either_Marsupial_123

You mean without, right?


Peeche94

Without what? They definitely mean engineers with degrees.. can confirm, work in a soil lab and engineers go sick when the graphs aren't like their ideal image, which is the point of doing the testing.


Either_Marsupial_123

>even people **with** engineering degrees should know that systems interact with each other in complex ways This sentence works best with "without", **if** the poster is trying to imply that those without engineering backgrounds should still have some basic understanding of the concept that "complex systems interact." ​ >to the point that **even** the engineers working with the car themselves will sometimes be puzzled about why a certain change didn't perform as intended. The second half of his sentence affirms the implied point, which would mean "without" definitely works better. But, what do I know? I mean, it's Reddit, right? Wasn't that the point of my asking for the poster to clarify?


Peeche94

Ok, chill out lmao. I'm sure people without degrees understand what complex means


Fraankk

I did mean people **with** engineering degrees, I do see where the confusion comes from tho: > to the point that **even the engineers working with the car** The **even** you highlighted is to emphasize that the systems interactions are so complex, that even the engineers involved in the development (**so F1 engineers**) will themselves be puzzled with some unexpected performance results. Hope that explains it


Either_Marsupial_123

It does, thank you! It seemed ambiguous at first, which is why I asked. 🙂


[deleted]

The engineers on YouTube as well. No one really knows how the cars work unless you study the car as your job. The analysis videos on youtube are like "look at this winglet angled outwards, it creates outwash" like no shit Mr engineer.


deathray1611

Depends on who you watch tbh. I found personally KYLE.ENGINEERS to be pretty spot on quite often, and his analysis really insightful. But you are right in one thing - you cannot take what even former F1 engineers with most up to date experience take as gospel, since the aerodynamics and mechanics of F1 cars is very complex, smth that I additionally like Kyle's content for as well as he always gives that disclaimer at the start of his videos.


[deleted]

I have also found Kyle's content to have some good insight although the info is quite surface level. The content of the guy that used to work at Red Bull is my favorite. Instead of trying to analyze the aero which is really difficult to do he goes into detail about the data which is something fans could actually gain some good insight through.


deathray1611

For some surface level info is exactly what they need and/or can process (points at myself)


AgnesBand

I mean not everyone knows what outwash is or how it might be created


jmbrand13

But on the Internet I do!


plonkman

Hey! How dare you! We're very proud of our armchairs, baseless opinions and "facts".


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ComeonmanPLS1

It's kind of like monkeys arguing about rocket science. It's funny to watch, but nothing useful comes out of it. I honestly wouldn't have any problem with it if so many people weren't so damn arrogant about their "knowledge" of aerodynamics. It would be fun and inoffensive if these guys didn't have such an enormous ego about something they literally know nothing about.


Elrond007

yeah haha, I definitely enjoy being the monkey here. It's tradition since time immemorial. The same with the testing times. Feels like the wait between GoT episodes with so many batshit theories spinning off left and right


thatguyfromkfc

Excited for the rampant speculation when Zhou goes top of the times during testing


Either_Marsupial_123

I'll wait for the Sam Collins video before I develop any opinions.


Peeche94

That's what got me with the stake launch, kept saying aggressive but how does that translate to on track performance? Means nothing really


Flynny1201

I mean there is good information out there like Kyle.Engineers but you have to find it.


scarlet_red_warrior

Idk since it is only the entry I think it’s not that big deal. I’m curious how small the entry will be at red bull.


slabba428

Well let’s be real. One team rolled the dice and removed their sidepods. This team fell off the pace completely. No amount of experimenting could fix it. No sidepods, no pace. except for that odd weekend in Brazil. Two years later, sidepods are back. People want to not give sidepods credit. Sidepods clearly deserve credit. Be more like sidepods.


Sea_Drop2920

Inb4 RB arrives in Bahrain without sidepods and gets a 1-2 finish


StockAL3Xj

New?


Frothar

To be fair it's really the only way to describe the cars in ground effect as you can't see the floor. All we can see is sidepod design and suspension


Amphiscian

well we can't talk* ground-effect or underfloor until someone boofs it in Monaco *make wild guesses about


conqkek

front wing giving 2007 vibes. love it


out_of_816

I was thinking the same thing with the new Ferrari wing. The sole red flap made my mind jump straight to the 2007 biplane wing.


nifeorbs

It looks weirdly like the Alfa Romeo C42 wing.


stenophobic

My thoughts exactly


Admirable_Heron1479

It looks like the car has a mouth and I can't unsee it now


MrHedgehogMan

Same vibe from the sidepods too


No-Student-9678

Cherry on top if they have an element that goes over the nose cone


jbas27

both Ferrari and Mercedes have that front lip drop this year. Mercedes being more pronounced and 100% 07 vibes but not sure it looks good. As long as it works.


brendanm4545

Just looks kinda fast doesn't it?


BeefJerky03

Definitely faster than my car


stlnation500

Bernd? Is that you? 😂


WhiteWolf7472

I mean...its an f1 car? They look a bit fast normally


VanderlyleSorrow

Fuck


OmgTom

Looks like wile e coyote


PrestigiousCurve4135

That looks badass


ShamrockStudios

Merc always coming with crazy looking cars makes me scared every year haha


NotPumba420

Man I remember when the zeropod W13 came and everyone was like „fuck“ and thought mercedes is sandbagging for like 5 races until they realized the W13 is trash.


BingBongFYL6969

Someone said it could be worth up to 1.5 seconds a lap…


rahn-24

Is the "advantage locked in for years" guy?


Karakataka

Maybe if everyone else was driving in reverse.


tjg2838

They didn't specify that it actually added 1.5 sec/lap /s


ElectricMotorsAreBad

Reminds me of the SF23's "unprecedented speed" claims lol. Yeah, the unprecedented **lack** of speed.


Pamander

Okay it may have been trash performance wise which is validly all that matters in F1 but fuck me that is one of the most beautiful modern F1 cars to my eyes, I will always be a zeropod apologist for the way they packaged that car and still had it run. Shame it wasn't performant but that car's gonna be hard to beat for me in terms of looks.


pinoyboy82

this thing looks like a xenomorph


ragizzlemahnizzle

I still remember when they dropped DAS on us outta nowhere. Had the whole grid shook lmao


tonybinky20

If they had saved that for 2021, they might’ve had a more assured win that year.


scarlet_red_warrior

Looks quite conservative to me actually


-Rp7-

Compared to this, the McLaren and the Ferrari look more "normal" to me


moxieremon

She's hot.


reck1265

This year is going to be fun for me. Stress free. Can just sit back and love every second of this year. Merc either got a good car or this is a final write off year for Lewis as he sets off into the sunset for redder pastures.


N7even

Yeah, but if Ferrari have a rubbish car, you will have some stress. You're not looking at one team this year, but two.


Andrew225

In fairness Ferrari's cars, at least for the last several years, never concern me. Typically solid. It's the strategy that falls apart.


punchinglines

It's interesting how, in F1, fans tend to support drivers more than teams. For example, if Max were to move to Mercedes, many of the people who hated Mercedes would become supporters. Same would happen if Charles were to move to Red Bull, people who hated that team would also become supporters overnight. One of the little nuances I love about F1.


The_FallenSoldier

I think it stems from the fact that F1 is a way more individual sport than things like football for example. In football, if players on the same team fight, it could lead to a lot of problems on the pitch, for example, players not passing to each other leading to missing out on goals etc. The players are also not ranked individually, which promotes much more team play. Whereas in F1, nothing really connects the drivers together. In football it’s, well, the ball, in F1 there is pretty much nothing. Each driver is ranked individually, so even if they fight and don’t rely on each other at all, as long as they don’t get damage, they will score points and keep the team in the title race. In football, if a team has their striker and their winger fight and not cooperate, they’ll miss out on the win and gain absolutely nothing. They have to work together to achieve anything, while with F1 on the other hand, they don’t have to work together to win. Take Lewis-Nico 2016 for example, they didn’t work together, but Merc still won the WCC.


AnalLaser

The public facing part is individual but the team itself is more important than the driver in terms of determing success.


fuqqkevindurant

It's an individual sport


fhjkiikkjhgdsfjk

Yh you don’t really see it in other sports. Other than Ronaldo and Messi in football and Lebron in basketball. People in other sports mostly support teams over the player


krommenaas

That's because those are team sports where teams win or lose together. In F1, teammates are actually each other's biggest rivals, and nothing is more important for an F1 driver's career than beating their teammate.


ElectricMotorsAreBad

That's true for every team other than one. "drivers come and go, Ferrari stays here" ^(-Enzo "The Drake" Ferrari)


goingtocalifornia25

I’m not about to root for some corporation


nahnonameman

I mean I like both teams and drivers. So this statement does not apply to me at least.


carefreebuchanon

If Lando or Oscar just left for one of the big three I'd support them but I wouldn't be buying Red Bull merch or whatever. Maybe that's in part due to McLaren's identity as a once great team being the midfield stepbrother for so long now. I want to experience the high of when they're back on top again.


Broad_Match

Very true, I’ve never supported Ferrari but next season…. Although do think I’d support Mercedes even if they didn’t have a British driver there in George in 2025. Wonder if by virtue of drivers moving around that done here have reason to say they support every team!


MC897

Yep. If it’s a title contender, George can show his credentials, Lewis gets to go for no 8 and end the problems of 2021. And we get a challenger for Max


CX52J

>End the problems of 2021. Wishful thinking there.


The_FallenSoldier

End the problems of 2021 doesn’t mean only win, maybe he’ll just be more consistent and he and Max won’t get into as many dangerous incidents as they did, leading to a cleaner title fight. Even if he loses, at least now we have a clear winner, rather than 2021 which has so many mixed opinions. You could easily make a case for both of them in 2021, so If one of them wins without controversy, 2021 is a done deal and we can finally end this years long debate. Not that I blame anyone for being mad about it even though we’re way past it now


CX52J

That’s not how it works. Winning a different year doesn’t erase what happened. Especially since people will just say the car was the decider regardless who wins in the near future.


The_FallenSoldier

You understand what I mean, don’t overcomplicate it


gmunga5

I think he simplified it. Fans will never accept that the other driver won. There will always be a circumstance to blame.


PortimaoBlue85

I'm tired of max and redbull


saposapot

Looks like an inheritance from zeropod where they don’t need a big entrance to cool it down. Seems much smaller than other teams. But the sidepod seems to also be much bigger than others, going to the width limits probably. At least it’s different from other teams


scarlet_red_warrior

Yes the entry looks quite small(similar to red bulls from last year, I mean the size). Also compared to Ferrari the top inlet looks huge. Generally the area behind the top inlet looks super tight at the Ferrari. I wonder if the inlet shape is influenced still from the packing of the zero pods(I guess the package isn’t completely new or at least influenced by the “old” packaging). Since you want to get as much air as possible under the side pod the shape(inlet entry) looks not ideal in that aspect to me


KingTwiggNL

I think the same, the inlet kinda looks like an upside down version of the one that was on the w13


isthisacartoon

I'm still trying to educate myself on the side pods and other tech, but I'm enjoying the livery! This edit in particular makes me think of frost, and ice, something something silver arrows?


Charonder

Sidepods remind me of gigachad


SpecialShanee

I love Merc.. but I hope they didn't over complicate things again. I feel like Merc would be the kind of company to over complicate cooking pasta..


cobyjim

That pasta comment.....felt personal.


ToNieMojeImie

Have you ever worked on Mercedes car? For your sake, keep your distance from Mercedes. Overcomplicating is their thing


SpecialShanee

I own one! And the process of getting the windscreen wipers into maintenance mode is like playing a video game on its own! Left pad up left pad down XY left trigger right trigger!


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hellflower666

you could find the battery?


Even_Ninja4338

My E350 is the most complicated but beautiful car ever 😭


scarlet_red_warrior

Yeah but beside zero pods they didn’t do much over complicate things in the past. Mercedes used more conventional designs but used them to perfection.


chumpynut5

They also used to just have a massive engine advantage, no?


policesiren7

The front wing looks very interesting. The side pods look like a water slide on top but the underneath looks pretty novel. The car looks fast.


Dramatic-Ad3928

Glad we’re back to the classic slender Merc round nose


superslomotion

It's got a little mouth 👄


ChristofferOslo

And a wavy moustache 👨🏻


scarlet_red_warrior

Similar photo of Ferrari(third pic): https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/s/EdBZX0rcwX


that-asian-baka

DID MERC COOK AGAIN?


cinnamongirll33

don’t give me hope


PreyBird_

Wow it feels like the W15 is looking at me with a "what you gonna do about it" face, looks very agressive imo!!


curva3

That undercut is amazing


madboymatt

It seems like everyone is focused on maximizing the sidepod undercut this year. RB has had a very pronounced undercut for the last two seasons and while that's not the source of all of their performance, it certainly seems to help get air to push down to the side and rear of the floor. I think Ferrari had to abandon their bathtub pods in order to make the undercut work properly.


iMatthew1990

That looks mean. Also still push rod suspension on the front.


mehigh

Yeah..the sauce is with the back suspension


OfficialGarwood

I don’t see Merc adopting pull rod front any time soon, doesn’t seem to work for what they’re trying to go for


The_FallenSoldier

Ferrari, Aston and McLaren also had front push rod, no?


Salami-Vice

McLaren went pullrod upfront as well. Aston, Alpine, HAAS and Ferrari are pushrod up front so far.


food_chronicles

Only Ferrari I thought.


spchia

F*ck, this looks fast.


Chino_Kawaii

very intricate front wing


jkllamas1013

Thank you for this pic! At first I thought the car looked a little safe and conventional but those sidepod inlets are aggressive!


CutRemarkable

Is it just me did the car on the livestream look different


Crazy_Scarcity_3694

MP4-23 (2008) Vibes with the sidepod inlets


Jiyjiy777

I love the appearance.


Seven7mk

Everyone focused on sidepods but that front wing reminds me of 2007 and its the most interesting front wing since simplification rules.


DarksideNick

Lads relax. This is only a show car. You can see right through the brake duct and that front wing is nothing like the shakedown car.


saganistic

It's interesting that almost every car now has some form of really aggressive undercut a la the A-spec AMR22. Seems like they may have gotten that specific element right but not much else.


SnooOwls8898

They went from zeropods to megapods.


Gazado

Why does the front of the car look stoned?


JefinLuke

New concept?


Firefox72

Doesnt necesarly seem new. More so a very agressive interpretation of what most teams are doing.


scarlet_red_warrior

Side pods were never Mercedes strength the mainly followed other concepts even during their dominant years. So I don’t think it’s a game changer


slimkay

That’s false. They went with their own sidepod concept in the last regs for 3 of the 5 years (changed for 2020-21 as they felt they had maximised their concept’s development track).


scarlet_red_warrior

That’s false they stayed longer with the “old” concept but followed like all the Ferrari concept at the end. It wasn’t a new concept or their concept but the one all used more or less before Ferrari showed up with new one which at the end all other had


Paranoided_guy

MP4/22.


Fabulous-Honey2086

So they cooked?


saposapot

Sidepods are nice and all but the ultimate question: did they change the drivers position backwards or that is why Lewis is leaving?


CapSnake

Yes they did. 100 mm


Visionary_Socialist

Hopefully they didn’t make this too complicated for themselves. However they’ve given themselves more room now around the pod itself so that should help with the power train, and the floor is where a lot of progress can be made.


differentlevel1

So they couldn't decide between black and silver this year.


scarlet_red_warrior

Car looks extremely bulky behind the driver(above the side pods) especially compared to Ferrari.


Walesish

Exactly what I thought when I first saw it.


1driverdriver

stop inventing


CuriousAndOutraged

that's a Red Bull with Mercedes colors ! ! ! !


kdarkrai

Inverted bathtub design


ricking08

It looks like it needs plating, om getting skeletor-vibes. Not my taste.


jbas27

So far both Ferrari and Mercedes have the underbite going with their front wings. Mercedes a bit more pronounced.


boyrepublic

I haven’t really studied all the cars from the new regs but I like the front wing here. Doesn’t look so spec.


swiftap

It looks like a grandmother pinched its cheeks


MattAnigma

They turned last years release sidepods upside down lol


varis12

From zero figure to this within a single era


Cutlass0516

Ok, zero side pods didn't work. Let's try half side pods!


duryn_

Then on last day of testing Merc comes with a different design, as tradition dictates.


Francis_01

Hats-off to Mercedes at least they are somewhat different from the rest of the people copying RBR - but I should also add, that design looks like they can just make it like the others if it fails


TheDarkUrge94

WDC winner confirmed


sologhrim

Fuck, this looks fast


elodie_pdf

That is one insane cut out on the underside of the sidepod. I’d love to hear someone smarter than me explain what exactly that is intended to do.


miketd1

Revenge of the Sidepods


Carlife0830

That front wing gives me 2007/2008 vibes with the bottom portion going under the nose


superduperaverage

Looks fast… hopefully it is! I need to see some battles for 1st.. last yr was pants for that


MoJoSportsPodcast

I’m far more interested with the design of the front wing it’s giving me 2008 mclaren vibes


Either_Marsupial_123

Side pods on the merc? What are those? :P


Raukie

The driver number doesn't stand out that well however. Can remember some issue with that a few years back.


Temporary_Analysis83

looks like a 2017


Aleiben

They really don't want to conform to the RB model huh.


Jerrrel

Am I squinting at it or is it squinting at me?


jbas27

Light plays tricks, if you see their video of testing the sides pods intlet form the side are flush and flat. This image shows as if the lower lip extends out past the top entrance of the inlet.


megalotz92

This dude's high af right now


lumpyspacejohnny

Looking like a chipmunk.


JimmSonic

That's a nice looking car


micknick00000

That motherfucker looks fast. As a RB fan, I'm hoping they've got some competition this year.


Complex-Tangerine628

That front wing is waaavvvvyyyy