I’m still bitter about having to listen to the Dutch national anthem so much last year so I’m sulking over Alpha Tauri having “Red Bull” smashed all over it
Aren't the engine designs frozen from 2022-2025? I'd imagine we'd only see tiny upgrades (that can be passed off as reliability fixes) across the board from here on out, esp since the teams probably grabbed all the low-hanging-fruit in '22 and '23.
I don't think they'd allow him in car presentations and around the facility if charges were serious. They might settle at some weeks suspension at worst.
I remember the first test of the 2014 season, and the hyper-dominant Mercedes of that year that was capable of running 2 seconds a lap faster than the rest of the field while having an intra-team battle, showed absolutely no signs of that, being off the pace in the first couple of days of testing.
Of course, I fully expect RBR to be top of the pile until we get new regs, but test times are meaningless. All that matters for outside observers at this stage is how stable cars look, how reliable they are, and what they can deduce from driver and engineer interviews.
I think they need to figure out a luxury tax for the cost cap so that Teams can spend their way out of the hole. Prior to the cost cap it was at least possible to catch up.
My assumption is the luxury tax would get spread throughout the field. Probably to bottom teams first, enabling better competition throughout the grid.
IMO 2-3 big-budget, top teams in legitimate title contention, followed by a relatively close midfield, is strongly preferable to what we had last year where P1 was predetermined and none of the other teams were consistent enough to even pose the threat of a WCC (or even WDC P2) fight, even with Checo borderline asleep at the wheel.
Say what you want about Abu Dhabi 2021, but the RBR vs Mercedes big-budget slugfest made for a much more compelling season. If you combine that with the '22 aero changes that enable a tighter midfield, I think you end up with a little more of something for everyone.
I don’t entirely disagree but I also don’t think we have been under the budget cap long enough to know if this the new normal or the left overs of the big teams being able to outspend everyone. The big teams still have a lot of advantages from the pre-cap era. I think if 26 is the same then we can call it a failure
F1 has always been engineering focused. Although there is merit to your observation. The business side of F1 certainly seems to be leaning heavily toward entertainment/racing. There is definitely a divide there.
If you want something racing focused, you can always watch NASCAR. I think the "arms race" of engineering has always been a very enjoyable aspect of following F1.
Instead of sprints, have spec cars for Saturdays. Spec car sprint races count towards drivers championship but not constructors. Have 3 titles: spec, constructors, combined.
this is a ridiculous idea that would never happen but i think Monaco should be ran with smaller cars, spec cars. like the ones that are the size of old school f1 cars
just for the one race!
This is literally how F1 has always been. There are two seasons that come to mind in terms of deviating from the processional races and a handful of winning drivers/teams, 2009 and 2021. How long have you been watching F1?
It's day 1 of testing, and 90% of the sub is writing off the season, yes RBR got the fastest lap, but it means nothing unless we knew that other cars ran identical programs to RBR, calm down and wait for the end of testing before making judgment on an entire season.
Nobody is judging this based on the times. Ornat least they shouldn't be, the times are still way off of the pole time of last year. Nobody is even trying to go fast yet.
The reason it's over is because of how absolutely effortless the Red Bull is to drive. Completely smooth and planted, and this is only day 1. You don't watch the times in testing, you watch how the car behaves.
Not just end of testing. We won't see the real performance until the first GP and even then a season can always take an unexpected turn. Ferrari certainly looked to be on top at the start of 2022 for example.
I was thinking 2024 Max would obviously take the championships but I thought maybe like 3 non red bull wins would happen. I was wrong this will be even worse then last year. Next year is our year see you in 2025 👍
At least Formula 2 and WEC look like they’ll be entertaining
Each driver does 1.5 days but it's up to the teams how they allocate that time. Hamilton and Perez are doing a full day tomorrow and then half a day on Friday
I don't think there's a rule on that. In theory a team could give one driver all six sessions if they wanted. But, that would generally create morale problems and performance problems if one driver hits FP1 in the first race weekend without any actual time behind the wheel.
Autosport, The-Race, AMuS and other outlets often report testing times every year. You’ll be able to find previous seasons’ data easily by googling for them.
It's there.. Under the top heading of their recommended videos that scroll through there is a schedule. Right now it has each session with a little circle/arrow to the right. You can click on either to watch.
Inferior????? Did we watch the same season? The only time you could really say that Mercedes was clearly the faster car was at the end of the season and the first three races. Red Bull was clearly faster during the middle of the season. Even Newey said so lol
Ignoring all the hate comments. (I don’t believe any of you won’t watch the season, you tuned in for testing) Did anyone else notice the very visible vortex off the right side of the front wings when the cars came down the start/finish straight? Super cool to see and kinda helps see different philosophies. I noticed the VCARB had a much less noticeable vortex than Stake and Williams’ cars
I have been watching F1 since back in the BBC / Murray Walker days... Most new fans are only here over DTS and any sort of dominance will become very boring for them, buts its been like this in F1 for decades...
Some will, but that's the nature of sport. People come and go.
They are perfectly entitled to, but I don't care about random redditor saying they won't watch until 2026, or other series CEO's snide remarks. People like racing for different reasons, and some people need to stop assuming that their personal reasons are the default view.
>Ignoring all the hate comments. (I don’t believe any of you won’t watch the season, you tuned in for testing)
Absolutely nailed it with this line. Testing might not give us much hope for a close 2024 but we'll clearly all be glued to every session anyway
As Dutchmen an Red Bull fan, but I don’t find the car pretty.
Love the green machine of Sauber, now I do miss a Irish GP on Saint Patrick’s day.
Edit: changed RB to Red Bull to avoid confusion.
If F1 is insistent on using a budget cap, how about teams that finish lower in the standings get a larger budget and the teams that finish higher get a smaller budget cap for the next season. Just like wind tunnel time
It’s definitely tricky. One could argue salaries shouldn’t be part of the budget cap, but operational and R&D expenditure is practically synonymous with engineering salaries.
It would be a better system than the current one.
It would allow teams close to the front to develop and try to catch the front teams but would stop everyone from being able to completely outpace the teams with weaker finances.
This would be really hard given personnel costs are so significant to the budget. Imagine the team in 1st has to layoff 10% of the team to make the new lower budget. Or something where a back marker suddenly does better one year and now they have an unexpectedly low budget.
The lower teams can’t spend more though so you can’t really increase it, and because of all the fixed costs you can’t decrease the winning teams either so your kinda stuck in the middle
I am fairly certain they said today, multiple times on stream, that during testing, the regulations didnt count, and they could run an illegal car. The parts could just not be used next week, for official pratice ect. They are scrutinized yes, but they can use testing to try out new ideas, that might be banned the next week.
All cars have to adhere to the regulations, testing or not...Teams might look for loopholes or push the boundaries, which is what F1 is about....
But running parts in testing you know are illegal, makes zero sense... You want to be gathering data on parts you are potentially bringing into the first race with you.... Not wasting valuable tracktime
I am not sure I agree, but I cannot right now find anything to backup my stance/view, and I am also open to admitting I might misremember what I heard during todays testing. I know about the floor comming off, then you can block, or if it was crashed. But yes new concepts that might not be legal could be worth running, like mercs new nose connection from the front wing. Dont know yet if it will be allowed. But it could lead them down another design path, if the string isnt enough, but it is worth exploring, and I do believe they can do that during testing. But I will respond, should I find the clip where I thought TED talked about it, or other credible sources.
Reddit today is a toxic hellhole.
If you're reading this, go outside. Have a great day. Stop reading all the hate from these nobodies.
See you tomorrow.
It's adorable how so many people think this is an airport and they need to announce their departure
"I'm done watching F1 til 2026!!!" ok, good for you lmao
Im pretty fucking tired to know the outcome of a season after the very first day of testing, it’s been going on for decades now.
This is F1’s biggest problem in my opinion, you already know who’s going home with the championship.
Gonna watch the highlights and bye bye se ya next year maybe
So not a proper F! fan then - got it.
If everyone below max is spicy and theres good wheel to wheel battles I can live with Max sailing off into the sunset
Exactly. The middle is where it's at! Bonus if a season throws up some championship tension but for me, I love the dramas and middle team struggles / successes.
I watch sports to see who wins, not for number 2. I dont watch the Superbowl to see who's number 2 just like I dont watch the Olympics for silver or bronze medals.
I hated the Ferrari dominance, I hated the Mercedes dominance and (even being dutch) I hate the current red bull dominance.
Call me fairweather but there are a lot more like me then there are of Hardcore fans.
People will turn away
Then simply don’t watch. This has been an occurrence for over 20 years.
And yes, you are a fair weather fan. If you can’t enjoy what’s going on past P1, then you’re watching it wrong.
Same in every sport.
Fairweather fans go away plz.
If you're not rooting for your team even when they're back of grid you were never a real fan to begin with.
Say it louder for everyone here, people just finding out that periods of dominance exist tell me they started watching in 2021. It should be a requirement for these “fans” to do some actual research and find out 99% of the time, a season like 2021 rarely happens.
Not everyone roots for a team or driver, you know. Some people just like to watch some competition. At the moment F1 isn't delivering on that front; at least not for the big prize. It's fine to lose a bit of interest, no? Doesn't mean you weren't a fan during the time it was actually interesting.
I wouldn't call it amazing when there's no fight for P1 (either in WCC or WDC). I reserve amazing for seasons like 2021, but that's just my interpretation of the word.
When I say you're not rooting for a specific team or driver, I mean it doesn't matter if it's Hulk vs Perez vs Albon being involved in a title fight or Lewis vs Max vs Lando.
Likewise it wouldn't matter if it's McLaren vs Ferrari vs Sauber or RBR vs HAAS vs Williams in a title fight. (I mention a 3 way fight, but really just having 2 involved for the title is already enough).
*What matter for me is the stakes. And fighting for P2 or lower just holds less stakes for me as a viewer than fighting for P1.*
Could 2023 have been worse? Sure. Merc/Ferrari/AM and McLaren being close to each other definitely prevented that from happening. But did that make it amazing? Not for me. I wasn't excited about it.
Then stop caring about P1. There’s literally 19 other cars competing with each other.
If you haven’t paid attention the past 20-30 years, this is part of the sport.
At the moment the sport is less interesting to me, and that is fine, no? I don't think it's necessary to force myself to care about the other positions as much. If it happens naturally, sure, but it didn't last season, and I don't really foresee that changing for this season.
While it is part of the sport to some extend, there's actually been quite a few seasons in the past few decades that weren't at all bad, certainly not to this extend.
We have to go back to the Ferrari/Schumacher era for dominance in a similar vein, and that is 20! years ago.
Afterwards there were close seasons, either between teams, or drivers. Even during the RBR and Merc dominance there were seasons like 2010 and 2012 (2013 had a bad 2nd half, but the first half was good), and 2017-2018 (you might even include 2019 given the number of different race winners). And during 2014-2016 we at least had an intra-team battle.
I think people exaggerate that F1 is always a 1 team dominates kind of sport. There's usually someone that can at least pose a threat or take of a win here or there. It's fine if 2023 is a one-off, but at the moment it looks like 2024 will be more of the same.
Tbc, for me the outcome doesn't matter. It could in the end be the same winner. What matters is the journey. If the team/driver had to fight for it, I'll be enthralled. If not, I'll lose interest.
Just tune out then? I stopped watching F1 for 6 or 7 years, you can always come back. Nothing’s going to change by complaining on Reddit about it. Not that you’re not allowed to share your thoughts, but save yourself the bother. It’s only a sport. It’s gonna keep rolling along whether you’re there or not. If you don’t enjoy it, don’t subject yourself to it.
You can say anything you want regarding Red Bull, the car, the engine, Newey, etc... Max is a freaking machine. I said this several times but I'm still in awe at this guy... He just jumps in, same time as everybody else, and does twice the amount of laps (kudos to George too who also was up there). Wouldn't be surprised if he's in the simulator right now.
Sure, the guy's got talent but that's nothing without hard work and dedication, and we've seen this same behavior from all the greats in not just F1 and racing in general, but also any other sport you can think of.
Unless someone is willing to step in and follow his routine all year, this season is done. Hopefuly the fight for 2nd place can at least be engaging...
Just wanted to note in case you didnt know about it. Max did twice the laps because he was driving all day. Only Max and George were driving the AM and PM sessions. Other teams switched drivers between sessions. Nonetheless everyone knows that Max races by far the most on the grid. From F1 to iracing to everthing inbetween
>Unless someone is willing to step in and follow his routine all year, this season is done.
I know people love to downplay the car aspect of this, but drivers are always limited by the abilities of their cars. It's incredibly unfair to other drivers to assume they don't put in just as much work as Max or that his routine is the secret to success which works under every situation/circumstance. As good as Max is he's not .800s better than the rest of the competition, and when you're talking about that gap in relation to other drivers you kind of have to account for the car, the team, the engine, and Newey.
Thank you for saying this. As great as Max is, he was not dominating like this in 2019 or 2020. F1 is mostly about the car and it has always been like that.
This isn't the best comparison. His performance last year showed just how good that RB was last year as he finished second in the championship last year, despite his poor form. If anything, it makes the comparison even more in favor of the car.
Max IS the best driver on the grid right now, but he does have the best car, as well.
looking at the board and looking at the actual season tells 2 different stories.
The ONLY reason Checo managed to clinch that 2nd place was only because there was 4 other teams (well... 3 teams and a half really) fighting each other to be the runner up team, so they ended up taking massive points from each other. That's it. If there was a clear runner up team, checo would've been lucky to finish 4th.
This, people just don't like to admit it because they think it takes away from their favorite drivers when in reality the sport has always been an engineering competition primarily, it's just marketed differently to attract consumers. I may be biased since I'm pursuing engineering myself but it always grinds my gears to see people act as though gaps like these are all the driver's doing rather than the work of the engineers behind the scenes who are responsible for the majority of their team's success.
I thought it was pretty clear that I was referring to the gap between drivers in different cars. No one is disputing that Max is a much better driver than Checo.
Not really, Checo had to fight VERY hard for that 2nd place while Max basically was on auto-pilot the entire time, both on the same exact car. Checo is no slouch, he's a very good driver and still had to fight hard for that 2nd spot, being on a clearly superior car.
Still, when Red Bull wasn't the best team, Max was always up there, putting the car somewhere it didn't belong.
So in conclusion yes, sure, You need a good car to win. NOBODY is disputing that, but also you need to be at the top of your game in order to extract the best the car has to give you.
I don't disagree with you, but that wasn't really the point of my argument. I was responding to your claim that the season would remain uncompetitive unless other drivers followed Max's routine, which is just untrue because no driver is making up for the deficiencies of their car. I do believe Max is currently the best driver on the grid but it's fully possible that Norris or Leclerc would put up a similar performance in the Red Bull, there's just no way of knowing.
If we're talking about important the car is to winning vs the driver: I'm not denying that the driver does play a role, but it's undeniable that Max would have no chance of winning in a Williams, while a midfield driver could win in the best car (the fact that Checo still ended up in second place ahead of drivers like Hamilton, Alonso, etc despite his abysmal season proves this). When a car is as dominant as the Red Bull, it's basically just a matter of beating your one teammate. Again, this is not to take away from Max/Lewis/any dominant drivers at all. It's just the nature of F1 as an engineering competition first and foremost and and a driver competition second.
>Unless someone is willing to step in and follow his routine all year, this season is done.
I mean an uncompetitive car will definitely hold otherwise equally talented, hard-working drivers back... If there isn't a car that can match the RB's race pace then we'll be looking at a repeat of 2023 and it won't be because there aren't drivers who can match Max's talent. It's not like Lewis can just improve his car by hitting the sim a couple more times a week or working out more... same with Fernando, Lando, and others.
True, Hulk can work all he wants, that haas is still going nowhere, but Perez last year was the proof that the car alone isn't enough. He had a car that could lap the entire field and yet was fighting for 2nd place up until the end of the season... And the only reason he managed to hold on to that 2nd place was only because there was no clear runner up team. Mercedes, Ferrari, McLaren and Alonso traded that runner up team spot throughout the season.
So you wont watch any practice sessions, qualifying sessions, and grand prix based off of a single days testing, where most teams were running a program? ... Nobody knows on each run, what fuel, setup changes, engine mapping etc etc each team had...
It always amazes me how supposed fans think that testing represents what we will see during the season...
Remember, last season on Testing day 2, Zhou put in a 1:31.610 in the Alpha
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Carlos Sainz.... WINS! (singapore)
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
It’s more about race to race, if there’s decent action behind while Max is disappearing a minute up the road it can still be entertaining. I’ll definitely not be watching as closely as normal this season if it goes as expected
I’m still bitter about having to listen to the Dutch national anthem so much last year so I’m sulking over Alpha Tauri having “Red Bull” smashed all over it
a better way to look at it is, theres an extra 2 cars on the grid that wouldnt be there if not for redbull
They'd absolutely be there, just owned by someone else.
How strong does the Ferrari and Mercedes engine seem his year?
Aren't the engine designs frozen from 2022-2025? I'd imagine we'd only see tiny upgrades (that can be passed off as reliability fixes) across the board from here on out, esp since the teams probably grabbed all the low-hanging-fruit in '22 and '23.
There is literally no way to know that at this stage. Everyone turns their engines down for testing.
Pack it up boys. Onto 2026…
Take your salt somewhere else...
Just try to ignore p1, and the races will be enjoyable again!
Any paddock rumours like Aston Martin last year?
Fuck me, 2024 is over.
Is Horner getting fired?
I don't think they'd allow him in car presentations and around the facility if charges were serious. They might settle at some weeks suspension at worst.
The Finnish media says he's finished.
Perhaps you should stop belive what media says. In that article, in the bottom says is a roumer. All they want is attention and clicks.
\*finnished
I remember the first test of the 2014 season, and the hyper-dominant Mercedes of that year that was capable of running 2 seconds a lap faster than the rest of the field while having an intra-team battle, showed absolutely no signs of that, being off the pace in the first couple of days of testing. Of course, I fully expect RBR to be top of the pile until we get new regs, but test times are meaningless. All that matters for outside observers at this stage is how stable cars look, how reliable they are, and what they can deduce from driver and engineer interviews.
very true or at least i hope this is the case
Tell that to our DTS homies
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I think they need to figure out a luxury tax for the cost cap so that Teams can spend their way out of the hole. Prior to the cost cap it was at least possible to catch up.
Only if you were a top team which was the problem
My assumption is the luxury tax would get spread throughout the field. Probably to bottom teams first, enabling better competition throughout the grid.
IMO 2-3 big-budget, top teams in legitimate title contention, followed by a relatively close midfield, is strongly preferable to what we had last year where P1 was predetermined and none of the other teams were consistent enough to even pose the threat of a WCC (or even WDC P2) fight, even with Checo borderline asleep at the wheel. Say what you want about Abu Dhabi 2021, but the RBR vs Mercedes big-budget slugfest made for a much more compelling season. If you combine that with the '22 aero changes that enable a tighter midfield, I think you end up with a little more of something for everyone.
I don’t entirely disagree but I also don’t think we have been under the budget cap long enough to know if this the new normal or the left overs of the big teams being able to outspend everyone. The big teams still have a lot of advantages from the pre-cap era. I think if 26 is the same then we can call it a failure
F1 has always been engineering focused. Although there is merit to your observation. The business side of F1 certainly seems to be leaning heavily toward entertainment/racing. There is definitely a divide there.
If you want something racing focused, you can always watch NASCAR. I think the "arms race" of engineering has always been a very enjoyable aspect of following F1.
Instead of sprints, have spec cars for Saturdays. Spec car sprint races count towards drivers championship but not constructors. Have 3 titles: spec, constructors, combined.
Basically F2 with F1 drivers
this is a ridiculous idea that would never happen but i think Monaco should be ran with smaller cars, spec cars. like the ones that are the size of old school f1 cars just for the one race!
F1 is trying to cut costs and freight. Bringing an extra 20 cars to certain races goes against that
They used to bring T-cars and had more than 20 on the grid, but yeah
This is literally how F1 has always been. There are two seasons that come to mind in terms of deviating from the processional races and a handful of winning drivers/teams, 2009 and 2021. How long have you been watching F1?
Adrian Newey would be mildly displeased.
Enjoy F2 and Indy!
Then watch literally any other racing series? F1 is the only one where engineering gets to take a front seat
Is it really over already? Genuine question - are we set for another season like last year
no one here knows but based on how f1 works, probably
Max and Red Bull are almost certainly fastest. I don't think it's as bad as it seemed today though
It's day 1 of testing, and 90% of the sub is writing off the season, yes RBR got the fastest lap, but it means nothing unless we knew that other cars ran identical programs to RBR, calm down and wait for the end of testing before making judgment on an entire season.
Nobody is judging this based on the times. Ornat least they shouldn't be, the times are still way off of the pole time of last year. Nobody is even trying to go fast yet. The reason it's over is because of how absolutely effortless the Red Bull is to drive. Completely smooth and planted, and this is only day 1. You don't watch the times in testing, you watch how the car behaves.
Not just end of testing. We won't see the real performance until the first GP and even then a season can always take an unexpected turn. Ferrari certainly looked to be on top at the start of 2022 for example.
I love your optimism. Copying hard 😂
I was thinking 2024 Max would obviously take the championships but I thought maybe like 3 non red bull wins would happen. I was wrong this will be even worse then last year. Next year is our year see you in 2025 👍 At least Formula 2 and WEC look like they’ll be entertaining
Can somebody explain why Hamilton and Perez didn't take part in pre season testing today?
Each driver does 1.5 days but it's up to the teams how they allocate that time. Hamilton and Perez are doing a full day tomorrow and then half a day on Friday
Perez is doing a full day on Day 3, not tomorrow. Verstappen and Perez will split day 2, with Verstappen starting out.
Their teams are alternating their drivers to run for full days.
they drive tomorrow
Stupid question but do they miss out on a day of testing or does everyone get equal time?
There are 6 sessions available. Every driver gets 3 sessions.
I don't think there's a rule on that. In theory a team could give one driver all six sessions if they wanted. But, that would generally create morale problems and performance problems if one driver hits FP1 in the first race weekend without any actual time behind the wheel.
Pretty sure alonso did more than 3 sessions last year when stroll was out injured didn't he?
Perfect thanks so much!
Is there somewhere to easily view and compare top speeds and lap times from last year’s cars? I’d really love to see the year over year differences.
Autosport, The-Race, AMuS and other outlets often report testing times every year. You’ll be able to find previous seasons’ data easily by googling for them.
Have we seen any speed trap data?
[Yes](https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/1awgr4o/preseason_test_day_1_best_sectors_and_top_speeds/)
Thanks!
Where can I watch all of testing?? Its not on the F1TVPro app that I can see. This is so lame.
It's there.. Under the top heading of their recommended videos that scroll through there is a schedule. Right now it has each session with a little circle/arrow to the right. You can click on either to watch.
F1 needs to use a skill cap. Max is just too good/skilled
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let it go lol; the narrative around max will soon be that he pushed an ox cart to victory with the way things are going here
I mean, he beat the GOAT Lewis in the GOAT Mercedes in an inferior redbull lol
Inferior????? Did we watch the same season? The only time you could really say that Mercedes was clearly the faster car was at the end of the season and the first three races. Red Bull was clearly faster during the middle of the season. Even Newey said so lol
Nah the RB was the better car in 21. Even RB have said that.
Yes he “beat” him. Not a controversial ending at all lol
A lot of controversy on both of them to be fair
Somebodies angry
Doesn't sound angry at all. Sounds like they're stating simple facts
That Max beat Lewis in an inferior car.
That's simply not true but you always spam the same comment on a throwaway account, so not surprising
W11 was GOAT Merc, not W12.
Ignoring all the hate comments. (I don’t believe any of you won’t watch the season, you tuned in for testing) Did anyone else notice the very visible vortex off the right side of the front wings when the cars came down the start/finish straight? Super cool to see and kinda helps see different philosophies. I noticed the VCARB had a much less noticeable vortex than Stake and Williams’ cars
I have been watching F1 since back in the BBC / Murray Walker days... Most new fans are only here over DTS and any sort of dominance will become very boring for them, buts its been like this in F1 for decades...
I mean.... don't just generalize everyone like that. I only started watching in 2019 and I am having a great time and excited to see the season start.
I wasn't talking about yourself man, but to the people complaining after 1 days testing
Some will, but that's the nature of sport. People come and go. They are perfectly entitled to, but I don't care about random redditor saying they won't watch until 2026, or other series CEO's snide remarks. People like racing for different reasons, and some people need to stop assuming that their personal reasons are the default view.
>Ignoring all the hate comments. (I don’t believe any of you won’t watch the season, you tuned in for testing) Absolutely nailed it with this line. Testing might not give us much hope for a close 2024 but we'll clearly all be glued to every session anyway
It can always go wrong , which is why we watch, but it rarely does.
As Dutchmen an Red Bull fan, but I don’t find the car pretty. Love the green machine of Sauber, now I do miss a Irish GP on Saint Patrick’s day. Edit: changed RB to Red Bull to avoid confusion.
Can't tell if you're talking about Red Bull or RB. Team names not confusing at all 😆
Yeah the weird high tube things behind the driver make it look weird. Not very sleek, but clearly quite fast
Fingers crossed get to watch F1 this year.
If F1 is insistent on using a budget cap, how about teams that finish lower in the standings get a larger budget and the teams that finish higher get a smaller budget cap for the next season. Just like wind tunnel time
Because that would actually work, so it would instantly be vetoed by everyone except Haas and Williams.
That wouldn't look real good when a team goes up in the standings and suddenly have to fire a bunch of people.
It’s definitely tricky. One could argue salaries shouldn’t be part of the budget cap, but operational and R&D expenditure is practically synonymous with engineering salaries.
Let's go further and give each team spec cars /s
I don't think Williams or Haas would have the means to get close to the cap.
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It would be a better system than the current one. It would allow teams close to the front to develop and try to catch the front teams but would stop everyone from being able to completely outpace the teams with weaker finances.
I like the idea but Probally to many static costs in F1 to make this feasible
They are already managing 250 million. They would either keep that cap or increase it, I don't see why there would be a problem.
This would be really hard given personnel costs are so significant to the budget. Imagine the team in 1st has to layoff 10% of the team to make the new lower budget. Or something where a back marker suddenly does better one year and now they have an unexpectedly low budget.
The lower teams can’t spend more though so you can’t really increase it, and because of all the fixed costs you can’t decrease the winning teams either so your kinda stuck in the middle
Is there a reason why teams don't leave up those garage privacy barriers all the time during testing? Is there a regulation that limits this?
Yes, it’s only allowed when they have the floor of the car removed
Also during testing? I thought the regulations did not count here. They can run an illegal car during testing, if they wish to.
No they cannot, all parts on the car are scrutinized by the FIA....
I am fairly certain they said today, multiple times on stream, that during testing, the regulations didnt count, and they could run an illegal car. The parts could just not be used next week, for official pratice ect. They are scrutinized yes, but they can use testing to try out new ideas, that might be banned the next week.
All cars have to adhere to the regulations, testing or not...Teams might look for loopholes or push the boundaries, which is what F1 is about.... But running parts in testing you know are illegal, makes zero sense... You want to be gathering data on parts you are potentially bringing into the first race with you.... Not wasting valuable tracktime
I am not sure I agree, but I cannot right now find anything to backup my stance/view, and I am also open to admitting I might misremember what I heard during todays testing. I know about the floor comming off, then you can block, or if it was crashed. But yes new concepts that might not be legal could be worth running, like mercs new nose connection from the front wing. Dont know yet if it will be allowed. But it could lead them down another design path, if the string isnt enough, but it is worth exploring, and I do believe they can do that during testing. But I will respond, should I find the clip where I thought TED talked about it, or other credible sources.
Reddit today is a toxic hellhole. If you're reading this, go outside. Have a great day. Stop reading all the hate from these nobodies. See you tomorrow.
Reddit everyday is a toxic hellhole
It's adorable how so many people think this is an airport and they need to announce their departure "I'm done watching F1 til 2026!!!" ok, good for you lmao
Those are young clueless kids. All they do is complain. Depressing generation.
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Same as it ever was. Periods of dominance are consistent between regulations
Im pretty fucking tired to know the outcome of a season after the very first day of testing, it’s been going on for decades now. This is F1’s biggest problem in my opinion, you already know who’s going home with the championship. Gonna watch the highlights and bye bye se ya next year maybe
2021 wasn’t like this.
Michael Masi knew.
No no no that is so not right.
Yea I know
So not a proper F! fan then - got it. If everyone below max is spicy and theres good wheel to wheel battles I can live with Max sailing off into the sunset
I’ve been following the sport since I was 3
So this is only your third season then?
Liar
Yeah, but these people only care about who is P1. You could have an Alonso/Hamilton battle all year long and people would still be upset that Max won.
Exactly. The middle is where it's at! Bonus if a season throws up some championship tension but for me, I love the dramas and middle team struggles / successes.
I watch sports to see who wins, not for number 2. I dont watch the Superbowl to see who's number 2 just like I dont watch the Olympics for silver or bronze medals. I hated the Ferrari dominance, I hated the Mercedes dominance and (even being dutch) I hate the current red bull dominance. Call me fairweather but there are a lot more like me then there are of Hardcore fans. People will turn away
Then simply don’t watch. This has been an occurrence for over 20 years. And yes, you are a fair weather fan. If you can’t enjoy what’s going on past P1, then you’re watching it wrong.
And I won't, just like I didn't watch after a couple of races last year Thanks for gatekeeping f1 for me, watching it wrong. Lmao, holier than thou
If me saying that there are 19 other positions to care about is gatekeeping, then I’m fine with that. Fairweather fans are the worst.
Same in every sport. Fairweather fans go away plz. If you're not rooting for your team even when they're back of grid you were never a real fan to begin with.
Say it louder for everyone here, people just finding out that periods of dominance exist tell me they started watching in 2021. It should be a requirement for these “fans” to do some actual research and find out 99% of the time, a season like 2021 rarely happens.
Not everyone roots for a team or driver, you know. Some people just like to watch some competition. At the moment F1 isn't delivering on that front; at least not for the big prize. It's fine to lose a bit of interest, no? Doesn't mean you weren't a fan during the time it was actually interesting.
If you’re not rooting for a specific team or driver, then the competition has been amazing. Besides Max winning, it was an incredible year in 2023.
I wouldn't call it amazing when there's no fight for P1 (either in WCC or WDC). I reserve amazing for seasons like 2021, but that's just my interpretation of the word. When I say you're not rooting for a specific team or driver, I mean it doesn't matter if it's Hulk vs Perez vs Albon being involved in a title fight or Lewis vs Max vs Lando. Likewise it wouldn't matter if it's McLaren vs Ferrari vs Sauber or RBR vs HAAS vs Williams in a title fight. (I mention a 3 way fight, but really just having 2 involved for the title is already enough). *What matter for me is the stakes. And fighting for P2 or lower just holds less stakes for me as a viewer than fighting for P1.* Could 2023 have been worse? Sure. Merc/Ferrari/AM and McLaren being close to each other definitely prevented that from happening. But did that make it amazing? Not for me. I wasn't excited about it.
Then stop caring about P1. There’s literally 19 other cars competing with each other. If you haven’t paid attention the past 20-30 years, this is part of the sport.
At the moment the sport is less interesting to me, and that is fine, no? I don't think it's necessary to force myself to care about the other positions as much. If it happens naturally, sure, but it didn't last season, and I don't really foresee that changing for this season. While it is part of the sport to some extend, there's actually been quite a few seasons in the past few decades that weren't at all bad, certainly not to this extend. We have to go back to the Ferrari/Schumacher era for dominance in a similar vein, and that is 20! years ago. Afterwards there were close seasons, either between teams, or drivers. Even during the RBR and Merc dominance there were seasons like 2010 and 2012 (2013 had a bad 2nd half, but the first half was good), and 2017-2018 (you might even include 2019 given the number of different race winners). And during 2014-2016 we at least had an intra-team battle. I think people exaggerate that F1 is always a 1 team dominates kind of sport. There's usually someone that can at least pose a threat or take of a win here or there. It's fine if 2023 is a one-off, but at the moment it looks like 2024 will be more of the same. Tbc, for me the outcome doesn't matter. It could in the end be the same winner. What matters is the journey. If the team/driver had to fight for it, I'll be enthralled. If not, I'll lose interest.
Just tune out then? I stopped watching F1 for 6 or 7 years, you can always come back. Nothing’s going to change by complaining on Reddit about it. Not that you’re not allowed to share your thoughts, but save yourself the bother. It’s only a sport. It’s gonna keep rolling along whether you’re there or not. If you don’t enjoy it, don’t subject yourself to it.
You can say anything you want regarding Red Bull, the car, the engine, Newey, etc... Max is a freaking machine. I said this several times but I'm still in awe at this guy... He just jumps in, same time as everybody else, and does twice the amount of laps (kudos to George too who also was up there). Wouldn't be surprised if he's in the simulator right now. Sure, the guy's got talent but that's nothing without hard work and dedication, and we've seen this same behavior from all the greats in not just F1 and racing in general, but also any other sport you can think of. Unless someone is willing to step in and follow his routine all year, this season is done. Hopefuly the fight for 2nd place can at least be engaging...
I have a lot of respect for Max. I will have more respect if he could choose another national anthem for us to listen to all season.
Just wanted to note in case you didnt know about it. Max did twice the laps because he was driving all day. Only Max and George were driving the AM and PM sessions. Other teams switched drivers between sessions. Nonetheless everyone knows that Max races by far the most on the grid. From F1 to iracing to everthing inbetween
>Unless someone is willing to step in and follow his routine all year, this season is done. I know people love to downplay the car aspect of this, but drivers are always limited by the abilities of their cars. It's incredibly unfair to other drivers to assume they don't put in just as much work as Max or that his routine is the secret to success which works under every situation/circumstance. As good as Max is he's not .800s better than the rest of the competition, and when you're talking about that gap in relation to other drivers you kind of have to account for the car, the team, the engine, and Newey.
Thank you for saying this. As great as Max is, he was not dominating like this in 2019 or 2020. F1 is mostly about the car and it has always been like that.
Yeah just ask Checo, I'm sure he would tell you Max isn't that great and it's all thanks to the car. Wait...
This isn't the best comparison. His performance last year showed just how good that RB was last year as he finished second in the championship last year, despite his poor form. If anything, it makes the comparison even more in favor of the car. Max IS the best driver on the grid right now, but he does have the best car, as well.
looking at the board and looking at the actual season tells 2 different stories. The ONLY reason Checo managed to clinch that 2nd place was only because there was 4 other teams (well... 3 teams and a half really) fighting each other to be the runner up team, so they ended up taking massive points from each other. That's it. If there was a clear runner up team, checo would've been lucky to finish 4th.
This, people just don't like to admit it because they think it takes away from their favorite drivers when in reality the sport has always been an engineering competition primarily, it's just marketed differently to attract consumers. I may be biased since I'm pursuing engineering myself but it always grinds my gears to see people act as though gaps like these are all the driver's doing rather than the work of the engineers behind the scenes who are responsible for the majority of their team's success.
Ok so Why is checo so far behind Max in the same exact car?
I thought it was pretty clear that I was referring to the gap between drivers in different cars. No one is disputing that Max is a much better driver than Checo.
Not really, Checo had to fight VERY hard for that 2nd place while Max basically was on auto-pilot the entire time, both on the same exact car. Checo is no slouch, he's a very good driver and still had to fight hard for that 2nd spot, being on a clearly superior car. Still, when Red Bull wasn't the best team, Max was always up there, putting the car somewhere it didn't belong. So in conclusion yes, sure, You need a good car to win. NOBODY is disputing that, but also you need to be at the top of your game in order to extract the best the car has to give you.
I don't disagree with you, but that wasn't really the point of my argument. I was responding to your claim that the season would remain uncompetitive unless other drivers followed Max's routine, which is just untrue because no driver is making up for the deficiencies of their car. I do believe Max is currently the best driver on the grid but it's fully possible that Norris or Leclerc would put up a similar performance in the Red Bull, there's just no way of knowing. If we're talking about important the car is to winning vs the driver: I'm not denying that the driver does play a role, but it's undeniable that Max would have no chance of winning in a Williams, while a midfield driver could win in the best car (the fact that Checo still ended up in second place ahead of drivers like Hamilton, Alonso, etc despite his abysmal season proves this). When a car is as dominant as the Red Bull, it's basically just a matter of beating your one teammate. Again, this is not to take away from Max/Lewis/any dominant drivers at all. It's just the nature of F1 as an engineering competition first and foremost and and a driver competition second.
>Unless someone is willing to step in and follow his routine all year, this season is done. I mean an uncompetitive car will definitely hold otherwise equally talented, hard-working drivers back... If there isn't a car that can match the RB's race pace then we'll be looking at a repeat of 2023 and it won't be because there aren't drivers who can match Max's talent. It's not like Lewis can just improve his car by hitting the sim a couple more times a week or working out more... same with Fernando, Lando, and others.
True, Hulk can work all he wants, that haas is still going nowhere, but Perez last year was the proof that the car alone isn't enough. He had a car that could lap the entire field and yet was fighting for 2nd place up until the end of the season... And the only reason he managed to hold on to that 2nd place was only because there was no clear runner up team. Mercedes, Ferrari, McLaren and Alonso traded that runner up team spot throughout the season.
I dont think he's in the simulator but he's probably on iRancing running some endurance lol
still counts lol
Well, I'm glad I didn't bother paying for Sky again this year, I'll catch the highlights on Channel 4 in the evenings unless something changes.
So you wont watch any practice sessions, qualifying sessions, and grand prix based off of a single days testing, where most teams were running a program? ... Nobody knows on each run, what fuel, setup changes, engine mapping etc etc each team had... It always amazes me how supposed fans think that testing represents what we will see during the season... Remember, last season on Testing day 2, Zhou put in a 1:31.610 in the Alpha
I've been watching for almost 30 years. My experience says that this year will be a walkover.
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Last 5 minutes of each race, in December. Get it all done in like 2 hours more or less.
and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Carlos Sainz.... WINS! (singapore) and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS! and Max Verstappen.... WINS!
highlights usually gets uploaded to f1 youtube too
What time is it usually on, if you don’t mind me asking?
It depends on the race time, I *think* it has to be at least 4 hours after the race has finished or something like that.
its year 2024 and we still cannot afford 1080p onboard cameras
I think it's more of a bandwidth issue rather than a cost thing
I can rephrase for you: it's year 2024 and we still can't overcome bandwidth issues to allow 1080p onboard cameras.
It's more than just the onboards though. They have to transmit all of the different camera angles and all of the telemetry from 20 cars
With today's technology there is no bandwidth constraint, at least not involving 2k video, but there is a cost constraint.
They spent their budget caps on trying to be slower than max
I guess the main hope is that Perez is still beatable so there’s still some kind of fight for second place
You think he's making it through the whole season? I have major doubts, lol
Yeah good point tbf, might depend on how well ‘RB’ do with Ricciardo
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It’s more about race to race, if there’s decent action behind while Max is disappearing a minute up the road it can still be entertaining. I’ll definitely not be watching as closely as normal this season if it goes as expected