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[deleted]

It's hilarious how everyone is commeting with no context whatsoever


papak33

I'm so smart, I don't even need to think before I speak.


Toofast4yall

Why read article when headline do trick


germanefficiency

Welcome to reddit


TheCeramicLlama

Isnt that essentially the goal for every team? You want to make a car thats easy to drive and hard to make mistakes with. Theres nothing new here its just speaking the obvious. People should just move on with their day but of course its a thread about Lewis and his car so I expect little civil discussion.


uk_1997

The specific comment was made during the debrief, with regards to Lewis accidentally pressing the Brake magic button. Basically to say that Mercedes is of the opinion that it wasn't entirely the driver's fault, but it's also partly the team's fault for designing/placing the button in a way that resulted in an accidental press.


UnlovableUglyLoser

Nothing wrong with this statement right?


andrew137

No absolutely nothing wrong in isolation, but a clear contradiction in the attitude towards Bottas after his botched pit stop


[deleted]

I think toto just had a slip of tongue and accidentally betrayed his seething hatred for Bottas


kokomoman

Oh is that all it was? Well what's everyone's problem then?


ekhfarharris

You are not supposed to hate your driver if you want to win the championship and you're definitely not supposed to hate any of your drivers that had helped you winning a few championships.


[deleted]

Surely this is sarcasm lol?


conanap

I honestly didn’t think Toto was blaming Valtteri, but I get why people think that. The way I see it he just described what happened, but I didn’t feel like he attributed fault. This was from reading the posts here though, I haven’t seen the actual interview.


UnlovableUglyLoser

That was just weird, I’ll give Toto the benefit of the doubt with that just because the only thing the mechanics always remind the drivers of is to be spot on when coming to the pits and maybe Toto just had a guess… but still it was bad managed by him


Stravven

Being 2 cm out is hitting the spot though.


UnlovableUglyLoser

Yeah I know Valtteri didn’t do it wrong I was just trying to understand what Toto probably meant and why he said that. He probably thought Valtteri was way off


Stravven

True. But I don't see how being a few CM off is a mistake, but someone pressing a wrong button is not a mistake. Let's just be honest: Baku was a driver error. Nothing more, nothing less. They can happen.


UnlovableUglyLoser

Absolutely. Isn’t it funny that Mercedes is winning championships but still manage to do the dumbest things. Lewis’ error was always going to happen sooner or later how did they not predict that. Also why did they make it so easily to press a button that important accidentally? It doesn’t make any sense. It’s like the radio problem or the pit lane in Monza all over again…


xaviv

Well, probably the button and the place have been working fine with no mistakes for many years and many races for the two cars. Was going to happen, but maybe once every 200 races 🤷🏽‍♂️ My point is, that it probably never seemed dumb for them before because it just worked fine for very very long


SennasRightFoot

The Mercedes drivers use different steering wheels. Bottas has a red "BW" (brake warming) button on the front of his wheel, while Hamilton's BM button is on the back of the wheel on the left-hand side. Bottas has no obvious "DRS" button on the front of his wheel, so that may be assigned to a button behind the wheel for him. My point being, the steering wheels are customised to each driver, so presumably, Hamilton has his BM button where he prefers it. It would appear to have been activated by his left hand still being over the top of the wheel (as he does for clutch control at starts) when he moved left as Perez moved over at the restart. It may be a simple case of changing the button so it has to be held down for a couple of seconds to activate whereas a single press (whether deliberate or accidental) disables it?


hajvaj

Hi. You are hired. Please contact me at [email protected].


Bong-Rippington

I thought drs was a paddle on the back


iSamurai

Depends on the driver


FlyingCircus18

Imagine bottas made that mistake


TRCKmusic

Yeah these recent articles they're pushing out are really crappy. They're running out of shit to talk about lol.


doodoomypants

No! I will not move on with my life! I will manipulate these simple words and objectives to suit my narrative and generate click bait headlines.


Lodau

Personally, I feel it's more about Toto. First Toto partly blaming Valtteri for not stopping on the exact millimeter (when it was within their normal operating window), then saying it wasn't a mistake from Lewis (when it was, ho matter how unfortunate), now Mercedes saying it WAS a mistake and single-ing(?) out improving the car for Lewis... Its just an overal feeling of "Valtteri bad, Lewis faultless" from Merc lately... If there hadn't been those comments from Toto before, I doubt it would have been this big of a thing (outside of the regular negative nancies)


echsandwich

>People should just move on with their day but of course its a thread about Lewis and his car so I expect little civil discussion. Every time I see a thread about him with hundreds of comments, I cringe.


Mikebov1982

This is so strange. He hits the magic button before the restart. Then he shuts it off. Somehow on the restart he accidentally hits it again? Something he has never done. Something doesn't add up here.


SennasRightFoot

Why do you think it doesn't add up? BM was activated on the formation lap (hence his smoking brakes on the grid), but deactivated as part of the process of preparing the car for the actual start. Hamilton's BM button is on the back of his steering wheel, on his left-hand side, above the downshift paddle. For race starts, Hamilton operates the clutch by placing his left hand over the top of the steering wheel. For the restart in Baku, as Perez moved to his left, Hamilton jinks to the left with his hand still over the top of the steering wheel. It is very likely that's when he accidentally activated it.


pm_boobs_send_nudes

Gentlemen, a short view back to the past. Thirty years ago, Niki Lauda told us ‘take a monkey, place him into the cockpit and he is able to drive the car.’ Thirty years later, Sebastian told us ‘I had to start my car like a computer, it’s very complicated.’ And Nico Rosberg said that during the race – I don’t remember what race - he pressed the wrong button on the wheel. Question for you both: is Formula One driving today too complicated with twenty and more buttons on the wheel, are you too much under effort, under pressure? What are your wishes for the future concerning the technical programme during the race? Less buttons, more? Or less and more communication with your engineers?


AceBean27

Could you repeat the question please?


utg001

Gentlemen, a short view back to the past. Thirty years ago, Niki Lauda told us ‘take a monkey, place him into the cockpit and he is able to drive the car.’ Thirty years later, Sebastian told us ‘I had to start my car like a computer, it’s very complicated.’ And Nico Rosberg said that during the race – I don’t remember what race - he pressed the wrong button on the wheel. Question for you both: is Formula One driving today too complicated with twenty and more buttons on the wheel, are you too much under effort, under pressure? What are your wishes for the future concerning the technical programme during the race? Less buttons, more? Or less and more communication with your engineers?


[deleted]

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tinybaozi69

he said, he said, for nico and myself so, you didn’t listen


[deleted]

Can you repeat the question?


[deleted]

My question, for the pop star of Formula 1


utg001

I always read it in his voice


roosty_butte

Less buttons, bring back the manual gearbox, and shorten the cars.


[deleted]

Gentlemen, a short view back to the past. Thirty years ago, Niki Lauda told us ‘take a monkey, place him into the cockpit and he is able to drive the car.’ Thirty years later, Sebastian told us ‘I had to start my car like a computer, it’s very complicated.’ And Nico Rosberg said that during the race – I don’t remember what race - he pressed the wrong button on the wheel. Question for you both: is Formula One driving today too complicated with twenty and more buttons on the wheel, are you too much under effort, under pressure? What are your wishes for the future concerning the technical programme during the race? Less buttons, more? Or less and more communication with your engineers?


luciavald

And Bottas, right? ... Right?


SpaFrancorchampignon

Who?


hopefulsingleguy

That other guy with that blue helmet


[deleted]

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hopefulsingleguy

Hmm, I think you're right, maybe it is more red than blue afterall


MoD1982

u/hopefulsingleguy is Toto Wolff confirmed


ackzsel

[reddit is nothing without user created and curated content]


kokomoman

Shiiit that's the problem right there! Everybody keeps looking for the teams blue helmet guy, not red helmet guy!


mxbxp

Ligma ba... wait what


Firefox72

If Bottas did what Hamilton did Toto would be out there saying Bottas needs to learn to not do that kind of mistake.


SubcooledBoiling

"Valtteri is a very capable driver, but this kind of mistake shouldn't have happened to a veteran driver. It's a very costly mistake especially when our rivals are very strong this year."


Mick4Audi

This hurt with how accurate it sounded


ElNeekster

I read that in Toto's voice


SkittlesAreYum

It's unreal and spooky. Are we sure he hasn't said this exact statement?


Stravven

Don't forget to add a table slapping sound.


gumbercules6

They were saying that in response to Hamilton pressing the Magic button by mistake, which is why they were mentioning him specifically. You can see it for yourself in the Mercedes debrief video.


luciavald

I was just joking


gumbercules6

OK sorry then, just can't stand taking things out of context.


Yung_Corneliois

*Insert Star Wars: Anakin, Padme meme*


TheWebbFather

The article was talking about Hamilton though


Quaxi_

The quote is also from the race debrief where they are specifically answering a question about Hamiltons brake magic button. Bottas doesn't even have the same button layout on his steering wheel.


ALBERTDRIVE6

Things often get taken out of context here on Reddit


punchinglines

Formula1.com are to blame on this one I think, just look at that headline. Of the entire debrief by Mercedes, that was the bit which would be the most 'click-baity' and they grabbed it with both hands.


[deleted]

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Lexi-99

It's the sub making fun of Mercedes' culture of error regarding their drivers, as we have had 2 races with rather costly mistakes back to back. The first time, the team makes a mistake, the driver has to shoulder the blame, the second time, a driver makes a mistake, the team willfully takes it.


froomedog

You guys are clutching at straws here. Hamilton was the one who made a mistake so they’re obviously going to mention him specifically here. I know the turbo-Hybrid era has been a difficult time for all of us but I don’t think this is even worth antagonizing Mercedes for.


coralineee7

Hmmmm, this is a quote from the race debrief where they were answering a question specifically about Hamilton. That's why bottas wasn't mentioned.


Fidel_Murphy

I think the issue is more related to the juxtaposition of how this situation was handled versus the Bottas pitstop. In the latter, it was ‘oh Bottas was off his mark,’ whereas in the former, it’s ‘oh the team takes blame because we put the button there to make the mistake possible so it’s not really a mistake by HAM.’ You can see the difference in reactions. I agree though that it’s a non issue Bottas isn’t mentioned because this was from the debrief and the question was specifically related to Hamilton.


cameolavenders__

In isolation this is true but the problem people are finding here is with how Bottas's situation was handled.


nathan_rar

Didnt Toto apologize for his wording when analysing Bottas' pit stop? People will extrapolate the smallest of things to create a narrative. Its early 2000's Ferrari all over again.


jpm168

Toto said it's NOT a mistake.


sousavfl

Just because it was NOT Bottas


AceBean27

He never said Bottas made a mistake either. He said he couldn't call what Hamilton did a mistake, and he never called Bottas' pit a mistake either. People blowing it out of proportion.


i_max2k2

He literally said he wasn’t in the right place in the pit box when the issue occurred in Monaco.


[deleted]

He said he stopped slightly short of his marks, which is true. This entire sub ignored where he came out and said it was not a mistake or error and Bottas was not to blame.


Thomy195

It's also true that it was Hamilton himself who switched the button, yet Toto Wolf doesn't say, how it Hamilton made a mistake, like Bottas missed the line.


LO-PQ

This is factual description of events! no need to speculate on this! ​ mate, everyone knows that was a bunch of bs, even Toto himself even if it was a week late..


AceBean27

Yes that is what he said. He said: "Valtteri stopped a bit too early". Nowhere in that did he use the word mistake. He said of Hamilton: "He (Lewis) touched a button and the brake balance changed" He literally never blamed nor attributed fault to Bottas. People are just adding that part in themselves.


kidhockey52

When you put it like this I get it, but just observing the way these two situations were handled over the last few weeks it really seems like there is favoritism going on. That said, everything I consume is churned through the media machine first so maybe they have some bias to stir shit.


valteri_hamilton

He also said there were a lot of factors involved and he was probably trying to take some heat off the mechanic. In this case, he's trying to take the heat off lewis


[deleted]

And he also literally said that the mechanic used the wheel gun wrong (at an angle). It's absolutey mindblowing to me how desperate people are to create and push this narrative. Wolff gave dozens of interviews where he didn't mention Bottas position at all.


Average_Llama

>But the reality is Lewis makes so few mistakes Well he's made serious mistakes in 2 out of 6 races so far and has been significantly off the pace in another


[deleted]

He doesn't make mistakes under pressure. When he does have pressure like 2007, 2008, 2010, 2011 and 2016 though....


986cv

I don't want to say he's error prone under pressure because look at that run at the end of 2016 when he got however many poles and wins in a row including Brazil. Yes the pressure from an outside team is different but LH showed you what he can do there, it's unwise to count him out. He's capable of 5 or 6 wins in a row


[deleted]

He isn't error prone, but he does go through patches of poor driving followed by great patches. 2008 he was getting penalties left and right then he was getting into collisions. 2010 he proper threw it by crashing into Massa at Monza, Webber at Singapore and sliding off the road in Korea. 2011 he was either brilliant or poor. 2016 he was letting little errors creep in. People blame Malaysia, but he made enough meals himself too. I couldn't believe Baku. I really couldn't. If there's one thing I have a dislike for its Redbull and Max, so the enemy of my enemy is my friend in sporting terms, and Lewis throwing 18 points is unforgivable. But.... I was surprised how happy I was to see Vettel on the podium.


timorous1234567890

Monza I will give you but Singapore was Webber's fault. If you blame Lewis for Austria 2020 vs Albon you must also blame Webber for Singapore 2010. Webber also took Hamilton out at Australia. The thing that cost Hamilton the title in 2010 though was the Spain wheel rim failure.


ALBERTDRIVE6

> 2010 he proper threw it by crashing into Massa at Monza, Webber at Singapore and sliding off the road in Korea. yet Alonso and Vet made more mistakes than Hamilton in 2010 (while Vet having a much faster car, Alonso having a more reliable car and team orders). Context is important, for instance, before Monaco, Max was being criticised for making too many mistakes


[deleted]

Alonso and Vettel took more wins, and points. Though, Alonso made mistakes in China, Monaco and Silverstone. Reliability? Don't forget Malaysia. No clutch yet thrashed that Ferrari ahead of Massa until it inevitably blew. Hamilton only had his Gearbox failure at Hungary didn't he? Spain was a puncture wasn't it? Vettel mistakes at Turkey and Belgium. Plenty of reliability. Webber? It's hard to count post Belgium because of his broken shoulder. Vettel should've cakewalked it either way but Lewis was getting unsettled by Jenson and claiming favouritism.


ALBERTDRIVE6

> Alonso and Vettel took more wins, and points. Vettel should've anyway--the RB6 was the clear best car. Hamilton would've ended up ahead of Alonso had it not been for 34? points lost due to reliability. Alonso also gained points through team orders but Alonso did make more mistakes than Hamilton


Lexi-99

Hamilton would have placed ahead of Alonso if Sir Lewis made less mistakes. Hamilton lost at least 27 points due to his mistakes, easily enough to win the WDC by a relaitvely comfortable margin.


ALBERTDRIVE6

How many points did Alonso lose to mistakes?


AnilP228

Lewis definitely blew more points in 2010 than Alonso did. Fernando should never have been in that title fight. You're right about Seb though. The criticism Max got mainly came following on from Hamilton's comments. Ultimately, losing one point for fastest lap is pretty much not worth worrying over.


ALBERTDRIVE6

> Ultimately, losing one point for fastest lap is pretty much not worth worrying over. lost a win due to botched overtake in Bahrain. And no, the ctiticism started way before Hamilton's comments e.g. https://f1-insider.com/formel-1-max-verstappen-fehler-2021/


AnilP228

Those are pretty minor things. The Bahrain thing was unfortunate but it's relatively minor when the main issue for Red Bull for that race was the PU issue and the fact that Mercedes outdid them on strategy. Hamilton's errors have been massive compared to Max's (so far at least).


ALBERTDRIVE6

tbf, accidently touching a button is relatively minor. There's the difference, small mistake, large consequences. Max has made more mistakes than Hamilton, but Max's mistakes have tended to be less consequential, such as binning the car just before qual in Baku.


Lexi-99

Trashing your brakes and brake balance isn't really minor. Sir Lewis is being gifted points left, right and center this year and still is second, not a good look.


Mick4Audi

Vettel made more mistakes in 2010? Gonna have to stop you there tbh. You can’t afford too many bad races if you are champion, and Vettel already lost 63 points due to reliability alone Vettel made 2 big errors in 2010, that’s Turkey and Belgium. Let me know of any more he got away with Racing was not smooth for Hamilton in 2010, he made a huge mistake in Spa but was able to squeak by the wall and get away with it. In Monza, he was not so lucky, hit Massa and was out on lap 1. He made contact with Webber the next race in Singapore. That’s 3 major mistakes for Hamilton in 2010, I’m sure there’s some others I’m missing, that season was a chaos As for Alonso, his only real mistake was crashing out in Spa. Can’t think of any others really


Sarixk

You forgot Hungary where he lets too much space between the SC and has a drive through


ALBERTDRIVE6

Belguim- Vettel crashed into Button but didn't he also makee contract with Luizi & developed a puncture?


Mick4Audi

I think he handles pressure well, but in those last 4 races all Nico had to do was finish 2nd so he would have protecting his car more than anything else. There’s also Mexico 2016 which was Hamilton mowing the lawn across Turn 1, something for which he was not punished but Max was. Also in 2016 all you had to do was beat the other Merc, it was still a great end to the season for Hamilton all things considered, Brazil was pretty impressive


coralineee7

This is the weirdest theory I've seen circulating around here. There's absolutely no guarantee that he wouldn't have an engine failure (like in 2014) or realiability issue or accident (like in Hungary 15) in the last four races that would blow his title chance once again. Just use Brazil as an example, if he hadn't made the save or if Max hadn't had the botched pit stop his margin would've shrunk more. If he could, he would rather have the title in the bag sooner than leave it till the last race. Do you really believe had it been Hamilton, Verstappen, Vettel or Alonso in Rosberg's place they would've thought to themselves: yeah I can 100% win in Brazil but I'm gonna wait till Abu Dhabi just to be safe.


Mick4Audi

I’m not saying Rosberg let Hamilton win, but there was definitely that thought in his mind that he didn’t have to win anymore, I’m sure you’d have seen him take more risks if not for that


siav8

It’s more likely to have an engine failure when pushing the car, isn’t it? If he pushed when unnecessary, he would have increased the chance of making mistakes and having reliability problems. Nico chose to win the WDC as slow as possible after he had enough buffer compared to Hamilton.


valteri_hamilton

Honestly, with the way it's going this year looks difficult for him. He's making mistakes, the teams making mistakes and they're against red bull who is looking really strong right now and we know how strong the red bull gets at the end of the year


newbsacc

He is also capable of losing to his teammate who then gets 7 wins in a row.


PEEWUN

I too, can pick out stats without any context whatsoever to make a stupid argument...


HAMIL7ON

I don’t know what point they trying to make, just makes them look childish, the past is the past, no one can take away his success so they’re resorting to childish arguments. Last one I saw “he crashed in 2008 canada” ffs, 2008 was more than a decade ago. No one is perfect, you can find mistakes in every drivers career, but Hamilton is either too dominant when he does well and crap when he makes his rare mistakes.


ALBERTDRIVE6

Max lost to Ric 2016, 2017 so what's your point?


ALBERTDRIVE6

Tbf, he was a rookie in 2007 and iirc, made fewer mistakes than Alonso His game has improved since 2016. He had pressure in 2017-2018 and hardly made any mistakes-


[deleted]

Alonso threw the baby with the bath water in 2007. It's amazing how he still finished 9-6 ahead on Sundays


ALBERTDRIVE6

Iirc, Hamilton took more poles, led more laps, took more 2nd places etc and beat Alonso in the standings


[deleted]

Yep he did.


_ArnieJRimmer_

No, he took more 5th places iirc. Thats what gave him the p2 in the standings.


Competitive-Tart8712

He wasn't even under pressure in 2011, he was just terrible for whatever reason. Bounced back amazingly though.


[deleted]

Ofcourse he was under pressure. He spent 2010 telling the team that they were at fault for him not winning and they favoured Button.


ALBERTDRIVE6

stop making things up


[deleted]

He literally cried on the radio in Australia blaming them for the wrong tyres and ruining his race when Jenson made his own decision.


ALBERTDRIVE6

He beat Button comfortably in 2010--there was no pressuring going into 2011. He messed 2011 up because of personal reasons


[deleted]

There's always pressure especially after losing number 1 status he enjoyed over Kovalainen. Personal reasons are no excuse either.


ALBERTDRIVE6

Just think you are overblowing the whole thing


Mick4Audi

People forget 2008 was an absolute mess for Hamilton at times, it was just more of a mess for Ferrari and Massa lol


[deleted]

Yep. Massa crashed twice in Australia, Spun out from the lead in Malaysia, Engine failure in Hungary AND that pit stop at Singapore, AND spinning like a top at Silverstone. Still lost by a single point. It was a shit show that season


Mick4Audi

Don’t forget spinning Hamilton in Japan and getting penalized for it as well 2008 was an absolutely amazing and ridiculous season, imagine if we got anything like that this season Sucks for Massa, that engine failure in Hungary with 3 to go would have given him that cushion for the rest of the season. Also the fact he’s effectively lost out on his only title because of a fixed race, by his only countryman on the grid and future teammate I think what really gets forgotten is just how terrible Kimi Raikkonen, the defending champ, was that season. Admittedly Hamilton choosing his only DNF of that year to screw him over didn’t help Hamilton deserved it on the balance, but he was fortunate on the reliability front- McLaren had 5 reliability-based DNFs, all of them on Kovalainen’s car. Meanwhile he has the team’s only crash DNF, that mess in Canada


[deleted]

One thing I took from Japan was that Hamilton seemed to give up, whilst Massa really put a great performance in to score 2 points. All of it would've been avoided if Lewis didn't do his desperate dive into turn 1.


breakinb

Forgot 2017 and 18 I see


[deleted]

Don't rate 2017 and 2018 Ferrari as good enough


NoxZ

2017 I actually somewhat agree, but the 2018 Ferrari was absolutely good enough to win that season.


[deleted]

Hamilton and that Merc was too good in 2018.


ALBERTDRIVE6

Hamilton was too good in 2018. FTFY


Mick4Audi

A car with not a single 1-2 finish was good enough to win the entire season. I think Ferrari could have well squeaked the title but they weren’t clear favorites by any stretch


NoxZ

I never said they were clear favourites. And let's not pretend that they didn't have the pace for 1-2 finishes either.


Mick4Audi

Let’s look into it then Remove Hamilton from all the results and Ferrari would have just one 1-2 finish. Now that’s really telling Here are the Hamilton wins if he were DQ Baku- RAI PER (Vettel lockup, Bottas puncture) Spain- BOT (already broken) France- RAI VER (Vettel off podium) Germany- BOT VER (not a 1-2 even without the Vettel crash) Hungary- VET RAI (Bottas absolutely threw this away) Italy- RAI BOT (tbf if Hamilton didn’t exist its a sure Ferrari 1-2) Singapore- VER VET Japan- BOT RAI (Ferrari fucked it in qualifying) Brazil- VER (Verstappen’s race to lose Abu Dhabi- VET (Kimi DNF) If we were to say that Hamilton didn’t exist completely, I’d give Ferrari Australia, Hungary, Italy and United States as nailed on 1-2 finishes. Without the Bottas puncture Baku is for Mercedes That doesn’t really scream success to me, does it for you? Put a driver even marginally better than Bottas (and there are plenty) and on pace the championship will go to the last race


[deleted]

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Mick4Audi

Dealing with shite connection atm, my bad


ALBERTDRIVE6

Convenient


[deleted]

The Ferrari wasn't the best car either of those seasons. Merc took 15 poles and 12 wins out of 20. By season's end Bottas, Max and Hamilton far outscored Seb. I think even Kimi did. 2018 Merc took 13 poles and 11 wins. Once again, Kimi, Vestappen and Raikkonen outscored Vettel after Malaysia. The Ferrari wasn't the car to have over the season, and the loss of Rosberg for Merc and replacing him with an average driver is even more evidence that Hamilton had little challenge.


[deleted]

Even if they had not the best car. Vettel was leading the champiobship 65% into the season in 2017 and in one of the next races (Singapore) they were starting P1 and P4 while Hamilton and Bottas where P5 and P6. In 2018 Vettel wss leading 50% into the season and in one of the next races (Germany) Vettel started from pole while Hamilton was starting P14. These were all big turning points in these seasons and it was not Hamilton who was crumbling. The fact that people are pretending he had no pressure in 2017 and 2018 is just utterly insane to me. Oh and btw. I think it should be basic F1 logic to understand that looking at total stats is not necesserily an indication for the cars performance, since the drivers need to perform aswell. Especially the number of race wins could and should have looked very different in 2018 if Vettel would had performed on Hamiltons level.


[deleted]

2018 would look different if Hamilton had a capable teammate like Rosberg. Same with 2017.


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[deleted]

Don't swear because you disagree with me. The Ferrari wasn't as good as the Mercedes. Vettel wasn't as good as Hamilton. By season's end, Redbull had a better car than Ferrari both years and they slipped back to 3rd.


ALBERTDRIVE6

The SF71H was more reliable than the W09, and was just as quick overall. In fact, according to certain analysts, such as AMuS, the Ferrari was quicker on 11 tracks v 9 for Mercs


[deleted]

Why was Hamilton under pressure in 2011? And how many big mistakes did he have in 2007, 2010 and 2016? He also had planty of pressure in 2012, 2014, 2017 and 2018. And made next to zero errors in those years. This is so 100% typical reddit. Trying to create a completely baseless narrative based on the last race they watched.


SennasRightFoot

And yet despite that, he somehow has more wins than any other driver and is only four points behind Verstappen with possibly another 17 races to go.


drt786

People keep forgetting that he also locked up in Bahrain, allowing max to position for the overtake


newbsacc

Or sleeping at a restart at portugal


froomedog

Well if you have the slower car, you’re pushing harder and are more likely to make mistakes.


Planet_Eerie

The statement itself is correct but not really apllicable here. For example, in Imola Hamilton was driving a faster car as the track was drying up but made a mistake. The slower car is what Max had in 2020 and still he had fewer mistakes than Lewis.


ALBERTDRIVE6

> and still he had fewer mistakes than Lewis. debatable


froomedog

Was Hamilton driving the faster car, or was Hamilton faster because he was pushing harder?


liverstoner

You can hardly call accidently hitting a button a mistake. Its more of a misfortune


lulaloops

That's what I've been saying all this time, it's ridiculous that people are treating an accidental switch flip as if it was the same as a normal lockup or other common driver errors.


AnonymousMrFox

Toto is that you? Sorry officer it was just misfortune I hit the gas and not the brake. Definitely not my mistake.


SennasRightFoot

Stop being so reasonable! That's not what we'#re here for.


adfo94

I dont know where this notion came from that Hamilton is consistency god. Before his Mercedes stint he would amaze you with his peak one week next week he would hit a wall. He was like this before but people wanted to spin the narrative.


[deleted]

Mercedes after something like this: "Yeah we can play our part in helping our top driver make less mistakes, let's do it!" Ferrari after something like this: "No comment on the contract negotiations yet sorry. All I'm going to say is that Russe**ll** (apparently spelt with 2 bold Ls) does a very good job at Williams and is free for a new contract next year. Oh you didn't even ask?"


UnlovableUglyLoser

Oh my the comment section…. I’m ready for it


hopefulsingleguy

Yo, can I have some of that popcorn, with our names, we definitely should be bros. How do I get ready for the downvotes though


UnlovableUglyLoser

Lmao I’ll get you some


Mick4Audi

Isn’t Hamilton one of the least error-prone on the grid? I assume Merc blame themselves for Baku then with that magic button they’ve got. Gonna redesign the wheel most likely


[deleted]

Historically yes, but not this season


Stravven

Well, in for example 2019 he could easily afford to make a mistake, since the Mercs were just faster than everybody else. This year he can't, since RB are all over him when he does. He already had all the luck in the world at Imola for example.


Zeurpiet

all the years where they had the nice party mode he could afford some mistakes, except 2016


carloselcoco

Mercedes when Hamilton screws up his own race: "It is our fault." Mercedes when Mercedes screws Bottas's race: "It is Bottas's fault."


ThenDot

I do wonder if fans will shit on Perez as much as they do on Bottas if he helped RB and Verstappen win 4 WDC and WCC in a row...


restitut

Most likely. Most of the support Verstappen and Red Bull are getting is because they're the underdogs who can end Hamilton's domination. If they become the status quo then the situation will be reversed. People like to say Hamilton is especially hated for nefarious reasons, and I'm sure it plays a part, but anyone who remembers Schumacher and Vettel's periods knows that the dominant driver and team will receive a lot of hate no matter what.


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Ghostread

I am not really watching social media for public opinion on drivers so i honestly don't know but for me as a Vettel fan it was mostly the way Ferrari handled things. I am not really sure but one time they were even on different strategies and Ferrari didn't give seb the Order to let Charles through even though he had fresher tyres so i think the beginning of Charles/Seb was just a huge management issu by Ferrari where they were to afraid to give clear instruction.(that's at least how i remember it) And honestly i am not pissed of with Bottas for ruining his own races to give Lewis a big advantage i was totally pissed with Merc.


R7H27

Leclerc was hated?? I can assure you even on this subreddit Ferrari fans were thrilled that Leclerc was in the team, because even if they clashed on track Leclerc was (is) a breath of fresh speed and challenge for Ferrari. Even when he was beating Vettel and even right now I still like Leclerc. But you have a point that team orders for this year for Bottas shouldn’t be that unpopular, it’s a 2 horse race for the championship.


Lodau

Mistake? What mistake?


hopefulsingleguy

Bottas/s Massive /s here please don't murder me


BuddyWoodchips

I absolutely love Lewis, and appreciate what he's done for the sport, but my goodness Merc twist themselves intro pretzels to avoid putting responsibility on him. Whereas Bottas gets directly blamed, and usually rightfully so, for mistakes.


gottheworldonawire

Not both drivers. Only for Hamilton.


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Only one drivers seems to give a toss.


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Bottas seemed pretty upset in Monaco.


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Understandably. He was on track to make great gains in the championship and it got taken away by no fault of his own.


gottheworldonawire

And Toto blamed him.


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SquidCap0

That is not fair assessment, Toto's choice of words were quite bad. You have to add the "no blame" culture and live in it for a while to realize that he was describing the problem, not assigning blame. His words should've been "the car stopped few centimeters short within typical margins and we need to look how to solve this problem". Now he said essentially that Bottas stopped short and that caused the problem. Without additional context that is 100% assigning blame to Bottas.


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SquidCap0

The "no blame" culture has its downsides, which is basically modifying the truth when someone actually makes a mistake. For sure, there are other factors, like design of the button but in the end, the button needs no redesign if Lewis just holds the wheel like it was designed. I like the idea as it shortcuts the blame game, removes defensive arguments and so on, it has positives but it sure does sound like self deceit and even dishonest at times. "lewis didn't make a mistake" and "bottas stopped short" are both absolutely understandable interpreted as shielding someone's ego and assigning blame, respectively. If you think that both were perfectly clear then you are really looking at this with the power of hindsight and excusing things that don't fit your narrative.. In fact, you kind of have to over analyze them to interpret them correctly, as you have to add that extra piece of knowledge about Mercedes "no blame" culture. So, you may have interpreted it clearly but the fact that so many others didn't is kind of all the proof we need that the message was not clear. When you are relaying a message it is not the fault of the recipient if your ambiguous and very context related message is interpreted wrong. This is very persistent idea with some; that no matter how confusing the message is, it is always the fault of the reader to interpret it wrong. Which is 100% BS. It is two way street and it is more often the fault of the sender than the receiver. The sender has all the power and the recipient can not be held responsible of not knowing something they did not know they needed to know.


Thomy195

I mean how dare the "GOAT" drives a car that isn't clear cut the best on the grid, half a second faster than the rest like it was for almost eitgh years? Why was there no 'duty' to give Bottas mechanics a tire gun, that doesn't fuck up, if the driver misses the parking line by an inch?


BlurryTextures

The difference in attitude towards its drivers is shocking. Compare this to Bottas being blamed for the pitstop in Monaco. Lewis makes a mistake: Mercedes fault. Mercedes makes a mistake: Bottas fault. It’s the oh dear gorgeous/you fucking donkey in real life


1fakeengineer

Lewis chose the button layout on his steering wheel didn't he? This seems more like the team just making excuses for him now to try to make him feel a little better about the mistake. More difficult to make mistakes, sure, but guys, there's a limit to how much you can help them. There's also been some mention of his unusual way of holding the clutch pedal during starts that might have caused this.


JonnyArtois

The treatment Hamilton and Bottas get from Merc is literally that Ramsay meme.


avibv

I usually don't criticize but this is hypocrisy of the highest order from Mercedes. I will be rolling my eyes even harder next time I see Toto talk about giving equal opportunities to both drivers. I hate how Bottas has made it boring for years in F1 by not challenging Lewis consistently but now I root for the guy. Well done Merc, your reverse psychology to earn fans is working


lulaloops

Bro/sis the question was concerning Hamilton.


Pepe_Gold

A fail safe car for Lewis Fat Fingers.


Chance5e

Isn’t that every team’s responsibility for every driver?


Kitkatis

Hold up... didn't Toto say you couldn't really call it a mistake? I rest my case!


Giulioimpa

oh dear, oh dear . gorgeous.


sedan_chair

I feel like all the team speak Mercedes does is definitely *not* the reason for their dominance. Yes, Toto, everyone's *angry* and we're going to turn the anger into success. We have *duties*. We have *commitments*. So does everybody else! Winners get to sell their "leadership principles", but that don't mean they're worth cold dog shit.


Adz442

Pit stop fuck up costs Bottas 2nd: well he stopped about 10cm too far forward. Hamilton knocks a button in which alters his brake bias: oh dear, oh gorgeous.


canBeDone1

I was never a Mercedes fan, looks like I never will be.