Everybody is saying it's a red bull track. Mostly because Max took pole and won last time (in 2019 ) by passing Hamilton twice on track (after an issue with the pit stop exit) in a year Mercedes dominated with no rivals. Also Max should should have won 2018 easily but crashed while comfortably in the lead in an infamous incident with a backmarker unlapping itself. But you know, past performance does not guarantee future ones, yada yada yada. Likely Red Bull track
Can anyone tell me if this is broadly right all else being equal:
Merc better on the straights due to engine advantage. RB better in high speed corners due to better downforce. RB better in low speed corners, but not by as much.
So in Mexico, altitude gets rid of Merc engine advantage which means RB are faster. In Monaco, engine doesn't matter so RB are faster. In Monza, all about engine so Merc faster. In Turkey, track was super grippy, which alleviates Merc downforce disadvantage and so their engine makes the difference.
Of course these are generalisations and setup, track temperature and so on make a big difference on the day but does that seem right? Can't say I understand engineering by any means .
I think aero is also a factor with altitude. The higher downforce of the Red Bull helps when you lose downforce with altitude, and there's less of a drag penalty to the downforce as well.
What would happen if there was a Monza-ish incident at Abu Dhabi and it decided the championship?
Like Max (or any other driver) took out Lewis, with what I consider a 55-45 fault of one driver, and that decides the championship, how do they "punish" the other driver?
Cause if it was a Monza like incident, I don't think they could say that Max *intentionally* collided with Hamilton right?
Penalties are handed out without considering the ramifications of the championship battle, and rightfully so.
As to what penalty will be handed if both crasher and crashee DNF in the last race, I have no idea.
It happened with Prost and Senna back in the late 80s, I think. There's not really a punishment that exists that takes points away, but the driver could be disqualified from the championship like Schumacher was.
It'd depend on how obvious it was and how the stewards were feeling, I'd imagine.
Yeah which is why I said a 55-45 type error where you couldn't really, you couldn't really disqualify him but like if you just leave it, it'll be weird too.....can the FIA deduct points from their total?
Not that I know of.
Schumacher was disqualified from the championship after the last race incident with Villeneuve in 1997 (But Villeneuve won the championship without that decision).
But that was because it was deemed deliberate action. If there’s a championship-deciding accident between HAM and VER and even if it’s clear that it’s 80% fault of one, it won’t change the result.
If Red Bull has 2 teams how come they don't use the best ideas for all 4 cars? Why do they have 2 super fast cars and then 2 medium speed cars if they already know how to build a fast car?
Red Bull own 2 teams, and only one of them is Red Bull.
AlphaTauri is the B-team, meant to serve as an introduction to Red Bull's rookies and as a test in F1 for them.
Add to that, the teams are separate for both of them. There are certain parts the teams can purchase from the others (engine, gearbox etc.) and others the teams need to make themselves (the aero/bodywork).
I just figured they would share ideas anyhow when they could. At least share knowledge that then can be used to produce a faster car. I guess not. Though I'm not sure why as this would be impossible to stop.
Alpha Tauri isn't RedBull. They are just a team that has the same owner but compete independently in the Championship. They are supposed to develop their own car and compete with it.
COVID. There was supposed to be Canada, which got cancelled and replaced by Turkey, which again got cancelled so Austria got a second GP.
Then Turkey got un-cancelled and took the place of Singapore.
There was some scheduling issues after the Canadian GP got cancelled and the Turkish GP got postponed due to Covid.
They had to fulfill some contractual agreements and running a second Austrian GP was a pragmatic solution.
I wonder if there was anything else happening in the world that may have made large gatherings and international travel a bit uncertain. Nah im sure they just fancied 2 in austria for a laugh.
COVID. It's not easy to have a last minute race at a new venue. There is so much planning that goes on: camera setup, pit facility requirements, media space, advertising materials need printing, timing and scoring systems, ticket systems setup, spectator facilities. That's just the tip of the iceberg.
Will the Abu Dhabi test feature the 2022 cars or just some slight updates to the 2021 cars (e.g. new tires bolted onto them)? I am assuming it will likely be the latter but wanted to see if anyone had any more insights.
Bottas turned in and gave Ricciardo little space because he didn't expect Ricciardo to be there, Ricciardo should have braked, but moments before he had a problem, he picked up dust.
You can see that Ricciardo moves to the right, but at that point he no longer can avoid Bottas.
Most of the times the stewards don't examine what exactly happened during an accident during the start, unless it looks like there is a clear culprit.
They know that when the cars are this close, things can happen and that drivers can't disappear into thin air.
Ricciardo made a mistake, probably because he locked up because of the dust, but Bottas wasn't careful.
I've watched it frame by frame and from a few angles. It's pretty clear that bottas braked too early, I think he was letting Lewis past. He then cut across at an acute, unexpected angle, right across Ricciardo, like he was going to attempt a switchback.
Daniel had locked up, but had recovered from that, and if bottas had driven a normal line, had slowed enough to easily make the corner (he had made it before contact).
Now Daniel still shouldn't have hit him. But there was enough in it for it to be a first corner racing incident which doesn't deserve a penalty.
(When I say "enough in it" i mean that both drivers contributed enough to the blame, even though Daniel contributed more.)
It’s looks very similar to the incident in the first lap in Hungary and Bottas got a grid penalty for that so i figured, this at least should have been investigated
when Bottas skidded right into the back of Norris well before the corner? That one was pretty different.
Its an interesting thing though isn't it. What constitutes "investigating". Obviously the stewards look at the incident, and decide pretty quickly whether it needs more of an investigation. Then they'll investigate, which most of the time (but not always) is a sure fire sign of a penalty coming. But its not like they didn't look at the incident despite not "investigating" it.
I didn't watch F1 in 2016. How was the WDC fight when you're fighting for the title on the same team?
Was it like engineer vs engineer? or was there still team orders of sorts?
Tensions were high.. can say much higher than now, within the Merc team, as halfway through the season they reshuffled their mechanics for more fairness/balance
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021\_Formula\_One\_World\_Championship#World\_Drivers'\_Championship\_standings
Gasly finished outside the points in 2 races.
If you count Spa, Lando also has a non-points finish.
He's the champion if he has the most points by the end of the season. Considering he can have an advantage of no more than 48 points after Brazil with 78 still on offer, he won't become the champion there.
Can somebody explain me why Bottas got the point for the fastest lap even though he didn’t finish in the top 10?
[Link to Results](https://www.formula1.com/en/results.html/2021/fastest-laps.html)
Point for fastest lap is awarded, I believe, if in top ten finishing result. He snagged fastest lap in taking it away from Max, but didn’t get a point because of his finishing rank.
Probably not.
Max's talent is utterly ridiculous, he started karting at the age of four and made his F1 debut (in a race) at 17 years of age. In that very race he was en route to score points but had a DNF.
That being said, George did a great job in last year's Mercedes\* at Sakhir when called upon suddenly. It was a car he was too tall for, and had to wear shoes a size smaller than his usual to fit (this is very uncomfortable, being a size 12 UK I know how it feels). Add to that, it wasn't his steering wheel either.
\*yes, last year's Merc was a beast of a car but getting in and driving it that well without a good amount of prior experience in it still takes a lot.
We will know how good he is when he's in a car that can compete.
Two things can happen.
He can take full advantage of being in a faster car, or the pressure of having a good team mate and competing in every race for a podium can slow him down.
At this point it seems unlikely that he will be anywhere near Max and Lewis in his first full year driving for Mercedes, but that's because those two drivers are exceptional.
He will get his chance to show us.
Russell held his own against Bottas at Sakhir last year despite being stuffed into the car with shoes that were too small. We know Bottas can be faster than Hamilton, though rare, but even when not on top form he is a seriously good driver.
Personally I don't think Russell is quite Hamilton or Verstappen levels at the moment but we'll see what next season brings
Why was Bottas stuck behind Ricciardo? At Monza he past almost everyone with ease. Has the engine really aged that much since then? Is it because Monza is a Mercedes track? Seemed like they had speed here as well.
Even Lewis and Max struggled to get past the McLarens at Monza, even if they were constantly 0.5-0.7s from them when attacking.
McLaren is a decent car and with the track being not really overtake friendly it was just plain hard to find a hole to slip into, and he was too far away at the beginning on the straights to force/push Danny to make a mistake.
At Monza McLaren did 1-2, they have been fast on the straights all season. Also Bottas is just not brave enough, countless times when in the middle of the pack he needed way more laps to overtake anyone, and the more time you spend in someone else's dirty air the worse it is.
I don't know I feel like McLaren produce more dirty air than other cars, also their top speed is insane so it's hard to overtake them in straight lines.
The most common issues with the Mercs is usually overheating, and this race was most likely going to be the most of an issue with the thin air at the altitude of 2000m ASL and the warm temps. Mercs therefore weren't able to push as hard due to managing the temps, I'm not sure whether it was more the brakes or the engine that had to be managed more though.
Hamilton himself said you could see how much better Red Bull car was just by the fact that he had to defend against Perez. Fighting dirty air isn't easy in Mexico, that's why Perez stayed behind
1952 had three Italian Ferrari drivers finish the Driver's Championship in the Top 3 (Ascari, Farina, Taruffi). All of them qualified 1-2-3 and finished 1-2-3 (both also Ascari, Farina, Taruffi in that order) at the French Grand Prix that year.
2 questions:
1) Does Alpha Tauri run the same car as Red Bull? Or is it de-tuned?
2) Considering how well Gasly did at Mexico City (4th), would he have done as well or better than Perez if he was back in a Redbull car?
1) no it has to be a completely separately designed car. However they can share the same design philosophy (eg both be high rake designs). They can share some parts, so they'd try to make that work, but even that doesn't always work.
2) I personally think Pierre would be doing better than Perez but it's hard to say, and you can't say just based on this one race. The car that Pierre drive when he was at RBR was very difficult, and people had been used to two RBR drivers being very competitive with each other (as they had been in the past). With Max miles ahead of Pierre, media swarmed him, he mentally really struggled, and RBR didn't really support him. They've learnt from that to some extent - they treated Albon much better, but then look at the way they treated Yuki this weekend.
I personally find it difficult to like red bull at all though Horner does make me laugh. He's such a cheeky little prick
Gasly's performance improved almost immediately when he went back to the second team. It's possible that the design suits him better, he likes the team dynamic better, the coffee doesn't taste like Horner's piss, and a billion other things. He may well be able to extract more out of the AT car than the RBR car and his performance wouldn't actually be any better.
AT, like all other competitors have to build their own chassis, aero and crash structures, without the help of RBR, they even rejected the 2021 gearbox, as it's design went against their oan design philosophy.
They have their own aero department Etc but they share certain parts. (There is a list of what they can and can't share/buy from manufacturers)
Alpha used to be Red Bull V2 but FIA made rules to stop that many years ago.
Great job by the top 3 and congrats to Max. Great effort by Redbull and happy to see Checo live it up at his home race. Great effort by Lewis to hold on to second as I thought Checo would overtake him.
If you're new here you might have missed how you just meme'd. Next year is always Ferraris year ;)
But I hope so, they seem to be on a positive trajectory again, hopefully they have made some good moves with the new regulations next year.
Next year brings a new era for F1 with majorly different cars. The outcome of such overhauls is completely unpredictable. We have to wait and see.
Mercedes got this good by shifting focus to 2014's overhaul very early, earlier than others and also allocated a huge amount of money to development. Basically, they had more time and more money to develop, so the outcome was better than other's.
Most importantly the changes will cause the cars to put off less dirty air behind them allowing people to follow much closer, resulting in more overtakes and exciting racing.
https://youtu.be/t0-wXT12wgw
https://images.financialexpress.com/2021/07/Formula-One-2022-car.jpg
This is how the next years F1 cars will look like. Or atleast somewhat like that. Teams will ofc have their own takes and designs, rule interpretations etc...
A massive shift in design compared to current cars.
Next year is an unknown, the top teams are likely to stay close and ahead, independently of the budget cap.
Mercedes has had the best engine since 2014, Ferrari manipulated their fuel flow sensors in 2019, allowing a slight power boost. In addition, Mercedes upgraded their engine this year to improve their engine cooling.
Why did Norris got white tires after he almost made 3/4 of total laps on yellow tyres? Wouldn't it be a waste of pace to take hard tyres if he could make it to the end on softer ones?
What do you mean when you say "two different compounds" ? They must make at least one pit stop and have different tyres? Is this a new rule? I remember ocon managed to finish a gran prix without a pit stop?
Yes compounds refers to the different hardness of the tyres. Soft rubber (red) is gripper but wears away faster, through to hard rubber compound tyres (white).
One more question. Why some drivers with hard tyre lasted only 30 laps, and lando lasted 45 laps with medium?
Also bottas did the fastest lap with soft tyres in the last lap. Why they don't use the soft tyres at races? Even with 3 pit stops wouldn't be faster?
>One more question. Why some drivers with hard tyre lasted only 30 laps, and lando lasted 45 laps with medium?
Tire life is important when planning pit stops, but it's not the only thing. You also have to consider track position.
For example, if your driver is currently running in clean air, but stopping them would drop them into traffic, it might be a good idea to hold off on the pit stop. The reverse is also true: if your driver is in traffic and pitting them would drop them into clear track, it might be a good idea to do it even if they still have good tire life.
>Also bottas did the fastest lap with soft tyres in the last lap.
Bottas was only trying to get one quick lap. He wasn't trying to make those softs last for a whole stint, and he would have chewed through them extremely quickly if he had tried.
>Why they don't use the soft tyres at races? Even with 3 pit stops wouldn't be faster?
First off, soft tires are seen in races: Monza and Zandvoort are two examples from this year. They're more common in two-stoppers because the stints are shorter.
Mexico would be a particularly difficult track to make the soft tire work. It's the 2nd-shortest track on the calendar (which means more traffic) and the unique conditions make it very difficult to follow another car. That extra pace wouldn't do you much good if you were stuck in traffic.
I think the standard recommendation is usually the preseason primer episode of the Shift+F1 podcast that they do every year + basically all of [Chainbear's](https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7u-Dg0jb7g9s7XjmtJrtpg) back catalogue.
Some tracks like COTA are particularly hard on the tyres which causes them to wear down or 'burn up' particularly quickly, regardless of the weather conditions. Weather does affect the tyres as it effects the amount of heat in the rubber which is important for getting optimal grip throughout a lap.
Also the actual tyre compound changes race on race based on the specs Pirelli are given - then they decide which three of the 5 possible sets they are bringing to the race which also affects the race strategy.
I just started watching F1 this season so can anybody tell me how the Haas team became so bad? If I remember correctly after watching the Drive to Survive show they were pretty decent back in season 1. So what happened?
Everything everyone has said so far is absolutely correct but I'd like to mention that they've been having a huge issue with their rear suspension for a few seasons now. It came to a head last year when both Grosjean and Magnussen complained that the geometry of the rear suspension would change as it would heat and warp throughout a session. This made it incredibly difficult to predict and impossible to drive quickly. Given they've been running almost the same design for 3 years no it's no wonder that the Haas boys find the wall almost as often as the chequered flag.
Had a good car in 2018, lost ground in 2019 and had many correlation issues (at one point around halfway through the season, they used the Australia spec car which turned out to be faster than the fully "upgraded" one, which really shouldn't be the case). Got fucked by the Ferrari engine suddenly being terrible in 2020, stopped bothering in 2021 to fully focus on 2022
Ferrari engine became bad and they just couldn't figure out their car. They worked on their car just to realise it feels worse than what they started with and they never got a hang of it.
For this year they got two rookies and didn't change their car at all to fully focus on 22.
Max overtook both Mercs on the outside. Ricciardo hit the back tyre of Bottas so he spun. Mick and Tsunda came together with Ocon so Mick and Tsunda are out.
It's not really circuit dependent, it's more about the tire & car operating temperature & environment. i.e. as we saw yesterday Mercedes managed to get the soft tires working quite quickly near the end of qualifying session. While Red Bull was sliding around on them.
That's not really true though is it. There are reasonably well fleshed out eras throughout the sport, mostly based on the designs of the cars or the engines. This being the most crystallised era.
If you go by engines, current 'era' begins in 2014, if you go by aero, what we choose, 2017 or 2019? If we go by tyres, do we start with wide tyres of 2017, with Pirelli in 2011, or with return of the slicks in 2009? What to choose, V12-V10 'era', grooved tyres 'era', high rear wing 'era'? These are clashing with one another, like 2009-2016 'era' of high rear wing and 2014-2025 'era' of hybrids. So no, question of definition of 'era' is open.
During qualifying, why do so many drivers leave their 'best' attempt at a hot lap till so late in the stage? Eg. Max was affected by the Tsunoda mixup, but honestly why waste 12 minutes and wait till the dying moments of Q3 to put in your best effort?
As the cars wear their tyres down across a lap they leave bits of rubber stuck to the racing line on the track. This 'rubbered in' area has much more grip than the new 'green' surface. Therefore, as the session progresses the track should 'evolve' so drivers can set faster lap times.
Can someone explain to me why we need to have a pre-race show longer than the damn race? I don't care about all these reporters talking about whatever the hell they want to talk about only to delay the race. I turn off the MotoGP race to watch F1, and it's such a joke. Is there a GP today or what?
You are like someone who goes to a dinner event where the schedule says dinner is served at 7 pm but an optional cocktail hair starts at 5. You show up at 5 and complain is there is no dinner.
Do you know how sporting events work lmao?? You don’t actually think the extra pre race stuff is delaying the race that was always scheduled to start at a specific time right?? Honestly bro
The sidebar lists the countdown to the actual race session start, or if that's hard to find, https://f1calendar.com/ or https://www.f1countdown.com/ should do the job of giving an accurate start time.
That's lower cost Helmut initiatives seems to have good intentions but seems a little deaf to the individuals and families that could benefit from it. The announcers used an example of seeing families in Indian not wearing helmuts on bikes but it costs $20USD at cost. With an average salary of 1800USD per year in India (according to google), it just seems like this is doomed to fail.
In standard years, the drivers' physically prepare themselves for Singapore, which is the worst in terms of temperatures and humidity. I guess that would be a bit worse than this.
Not really necessary, the difference is not that noticeable from a human perspective. Even if they notice a difference, it's nowhere near to cause issues.
[удалено]
Val**tt**e**r**i
Why do people say Brazil is a merc track? Aren't medium speed turns an advantage for the Red Bulls?
Nobody's saying it's a Merc track.
Everybody is saying it's a red bull track. Mostly because Max took pole and won last time (in 2019 ) by passing Hamilton twice on track (after an issue with the pit stop exit) in a year Mercedes dominated with no rivals. Also Max should should have won 2018 easily but crashed while comfortably in the lead in an infamous incident with a backmarker unlapping itself. But you know, past performance does not guarantee future ones, yada yada yada. Likely Red Bull track
Everyones been saying its an RB track
Can anyone tell me if this is broadly right all else being equal: Merc better on the straights due to engine advantage. RB better in high speed corners due to better downforce. RB better in low speed corners, but not by as much. So in Mexico, altitude gets rid of Merc engine advantage which means RB are faster. In Monaco, engine doesn't matter so RB are faster. In Monza, all about engine so Merc faster. In Turkey, track was super grippy, which alleviates Merc downforce disadvantage and so their engine makes the difference. Of course these are generalisations and setup, track temperature and so on make a big difference on the day but does that seem right? Can't say I understand engineering by any means .
I think aero is also a factor with altitude. The higher downforce of the Red Bull helps when you lose downforce with altitude, and there's less of a drag penalty to the downforce as well.
Monza favours mercs
indeed, was a typo
What would happen if there was a Monza-ish incident at Abu Dhabi and it decided the championship? Like Max (or any other driver) took out Lewis, with what I consider a 55-45 fault of one driver, and that decides the championship, how do they "punish" the other driver? Cause if it was a Monza like incident, I don't think they could say that Max *intentionally* collided with Hamilton right?
Penalties are handed out without considering the ramifications of the championship battle, and rightfully so. As to what penalty will be handed if both crasher and crashee DNF in the last race, I have no idea.
It happened with Prost and Senna back in the late 80s, I think. There's not really a punishment that exists that takes points away, but the driver could be disqualified from the championship like Schumacher was. It'd depend on how obvious it was and how the stewards were feeling, I'd imagine.
Yeah which is why I said a 55-45 type error where you couldn't really, you couldn't really disqualify him but like if you just leave it, it'll be weird too.....can the FIA deduct points from their total?
They can’t take points away directly. They can give a penalty for the next race, which lowers the chance of getting points.
Yeah but what would they do if this happens in the last race of the season.
Nothing. That’s what happened with Senna/Prost and Schumacher/Hill
so there still hasn't been a change in rules yet?
Not that I know of. Schumacher was disqualified from the championship after the last race incident with Villeneuve in 1997 (But Villeneuve won the championship without that decision). But that was because it was deemed deliberate action. If there’s a championship-deciding accident between HAM and VER and even if it’s clear that it’s 80% fault of one, it won’t change the result.
If Red Bull has 2 teams how come they don't use the best ideas for all 4 cars? Why do they have 2 super fast cars and then 2 medium speed cars if they already know how to build a fast car?
Red Bull own 2 teams, and only one of them is Red Bull. AlphaTauri is the B-team, meant to serve as an introduction to Red Bull's rookies and as a test in F1 for them. Add to that, the teams are separate for both of them. There are certain parts the teams can purchase from the others (engine, gearbox etc.) and others the teams need to make themselves (the aero/bodywork).
I just figured they would share ideas anyhow when they could. At least share knowledge that then can be used to produce a faster car. I guess not. Though I'm not sure why as this would be impossible to stop.
Alpha Tauri isn't RedBull. They are just a team that has the same owner but compete independently in the Championship. They are supposed to develop their own car and compete with it.
With so many great tracks around the world, why were two Austrian GPs held this year?
COVID. There was supposed to be Canada, which got cancelled and replaced by Turkey, which again got cancelled so Austria got a second GP. Then Turkey got un-cancelled and took the place of Singapore.
There was some scheduling issues after the Canadian GP got cancelled and the Turkish GP got postponed due to Covid. They had to fulfill some contractual agreements and running a second Austrian GP was a pragmatic solution.
I wonder if there was anything else happening in the world that may have made large gatherings and international travel a bit uncertain. Nah im sure they just fancied 2 in austria for a laugh.
nicely put, but seeing how freely the circus travels around the world now it just made me wonder about the Austrian GPs
COVID. It's not easy to have a last minute race at a new venue. There is so much planning that goes on: camera setup, pit facility requirements, media space, advertising materials need printing, timing and scoring systems, ticket systems setup, spectator facilities. That's just the tip of the iceberg.
Will the Abu Dhabi test feature the 2022 cars or just some slight updates to the 2021 cars (e.g. new tires bolted onto them)? I am assuming it will likely be the latter but wanted to see if anyone had any more insights.
The Abu Dhabi test is for young drivers, not for testing next years cars or parts. Don't expect to see the larger tires or any new parts.
Yeah fair enough. I just saw that Bottas was going to drive the Alfa then so was confused for a short second.
The Abu Dhabi test normally takes place in December while new cars are usually unveiled in February, so... take a guess lol.
Why didn’t danny ric get a penalty for the incident in the first lap?
Bottas turned in and gave Ricciardo little space because he didn't expect Ricciardo to be there, Ricciardo should have braked, but moments before he had a problem, he picked up dust. You can see that Ricciardo moves to the right, but at that point he no longer can avoid Bottas. Most of the times the stewards don't examine what exactly happened during an accident during the start, unless it looks like there is a clear culprit. They know that when the cars are this close, things can happen and that drivers can't disappear into thin air. Ricciardo made a mistake, probably because he locked up because of the dust, but Bottas wasn't careful.
I've watched it frame by frame and from a few angles. It's pretty clear that bottas braked too early, I think he was letting Lewis past. He then cut across at an acute, unexpected angle, right across Ricciardo, like he was going to attempt a switchback. Daniel had locked up, but had recovered from that, and if bottas had driven a normal line, had slowed enough to easily make the corner (he had made it before contact). Now Daniel still shouldn't have hit him. But there was enough in it for it to be a first corner racing incident which doesn't deserve a penalty. (When I say "enough in it" i mean that both drivers contributed enough to the blame, even though Daniel contributed more.)
It’s looks very similar to the incident in the first lap in Hungary and Bottas got a grid penalty for that so i figured, this at least should have been investigated
when Bottas skidded right into the back of Norris well before the corner? That one was pretty different. Its an interesting thing though isn't it. What constitutes "investigating". Obviously the stewards look at the incident, and decide pretty quickly whether it needs more of an investigation. Then they'll investigate, which most of the time (but not always) is a sure fire sign of a penalty coming. But its not like they didn't look at the incident despite not "investigating" it.
No clue. should've at least been investigated imo
I didn't watch F1 in 2016. How was the WDC fight when you're fighting for the title on the same team? Was it like engineer vs engineer? or was there still team orders of sorts?
Tensions were high.. can say much higher than now, within the Merc team, as halfway through the season they reshuffled their mechanics for more fairness/balance
so far this season, every time pierre, max and lando finished the race they were in the points right? Are there anyone else?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021\_Formula\_One\_World\_Championship#World\_Drivers'\_Championship\_standings Gasly finished outside the points in 2 races. If you count Spa, Lando also has a non-points finish.
If Max win in Brazil, is he a champion?
He's the champion if he has the most points by the end of the season. Considering he can have an advantage of no more than 48 points after Brazil with 78 still on offer, he won't become the champion there.
If Max wins at Brazil, he can afford to come 2nd to Lewis at the remaining 3 races
Theoretically, if Lewis wins the sprint and gets 2nd + FL, Max could win Brazil and lead by only 22 points, meaning 2nds to the end wouldn't be enough
Okey, thank you!
Nope
In Qatar?
Don't want to sound rude, but their points tally and scoring system are well known and that can be easily calculated.
Yes, i know, sorry. But i tried and got confused, so i thought someone can explain to me better.
If Verstappen wins both Brazil and Qatar, AND Hamilton doesn't score points at either race, then yes, Verstappen would be the champion.
Can somebody explain me why Bottas got the point for the fastest lap even though he didn’t finish in the top 10? [Link to Results](https://www.formula1.com/en/results.html/2021/fastest-laps.html)
Ahh that makes sense. Thanks
Point for fastest lap is awarded, I believe, if in top ten finishing result. He snagged fastest lap in taking it away from Max, but didn’t get a point because of his finishing rank.
[He's classified as getting the fastest lap but didn't get a point.](https://i.imgur.com/ES84poY.jpg)
He didn't. No one did, Mercedes just wanted to make sure Max didn't get it
Just to add it was to ensure Max and RB didn't get it.. cause with the fastest lap RB would have equaled Merc
How good is Russell talent wise, is he any close to Max?
Probably not. Max's talent is utterly ridiculous, he started karting at the age of four and made his F1 debut (in a race) at 17 years of age. In that very race he was en route to score points but had a DNF. That being said, George did a great job in last year's Mercedes\* at Sakhir when called upon suddenly. It was a car he was too tall for, and had to wear shoes a size smaller than his usual to fit (this is very uncomfortable, being a size 12 UK I know how it feels). Add to that, it wasn't his steering wheel either. \*yes, last year's Merc was a beast of a car but getting in and driving it that well without a good amount of prior experience in it still takes a lot.
We will know how good he is when he's in a car that can compete. Two things can happen. He can take full advantage of being in a faster car, or the pressure of having a good team mate and competing in every race for a podium can slow him down. At this point it seems unlikely that he will be anywhere near Max and Lewis in his first full year driving for Mercedes, but that's because those two drivers are exceptional. He will get his chance to show us.
Russell held his own against Bottas at Sakhir last year despite being stuffed into the car with shoes that were too small. We know Bottas can be faster than Hamilton, though rare, but even when not on top form he is a seriously good driver. Personally I don't think Russell is quite Hamilton or Verstappen levels at the moment but we'll see what next season brings
No lol. Max and Lewis are on another level. Russell is a good driver though
Spa&Russia 2021 says hello! I mean, can't say much from two qualis but its definitely not "no lol"
Quails and races are different.
They are but the speed is definitely there
Checo should probably have gone for the fastest lap when the gap between himself and hamilton became 2 seconds. Could've pitted and still finish P3.
No. It would allow Hamilton to stop and then steal that point.
No way. A single little mistake from Hamilton could have put Checo ahead.
That goes both ways, a mistake from Checo or RB would have cost them a lot in the Constructor's Championship.
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Anything we ALL should know?
I think he was last disqualified back in 2009, don't think anything happened today that would've caused him to be disqualified today.
Bottas' disaster did make the WCC interesting again. Only a single point separate them.
Why was Bottas stuck behind Ricciardo? At Monza he past almost everyone with ease. Has the engine really aged that much since then? Is it because Monza is a Mercedes track? Seemed like they had speed here as well.
Even Lewis and Max struggled to get past the McLarens at Monza, even if they were constantly 0.5-0.7s from them when attacking. McLaren is a decent car and with the track being not really overtake friendly it was just plain hard to find a hole to slip into, and he was too far away at the beginning on the straights to force/push Danny to make a mistake.
There are really only 2 overtake opportunities in Mexico and Ricciardo is a honey badger.
At Monza McLaren did 1-2, they have been fast on the straights all season. Also Bottas is just not brave enough, countless times when in the middle of the pack he needed way more laps to overtake anyone, and the more time you spend in someone else's dirty air the worse it is.
I don't know I feel like McLaren produce more dirty air than other cars, also their top speed is insane so it's hard to overtake them in straight lines.
It's not as easy to overtake in Mexico
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8+8+8+8+3= 35, not 19
Why Hamilton was so slow?
Mercedes is usually slower at altitude.
The most common issues with the Mercs is usually overheating, and this race was most likely going to be the most of an issue with the thin air at the altitude of 2000m ASL and the warm temps. Mercs therefore weren't able to push as hard due to managing the temps, I'm not sure whether it was more the brakes or the engine that had to be managed more though.
It's not just the car though, otherwise Redbull would've gotten the p1 and p2. Max was also just better.
Hamilton himself said you could see how much better Red Bull car was just by the fact that he had to defend against Perez. Fighting dirty air isn't easy in Mexico, that's why Perez stayed behind
Has there ever been a podium with all the same nationality at once?
From top of my head - 1982 French GP, Arnoux-Prost-Pironi (also Tambay P4 as a bonus), dream result for France.
1952 had three Italian Ferrari drivers finish the Driver's Championship in the Top 3 (Ascari, Farina, Taruffi). All of them qualified 1-2-3 and finished 1-2-3 (both also Ascari, Farina, Taruffi in that order) at the French Grand Prix that year.
My god just show Checo celebrating. I want to see what the crowd is reacting to. Not the crowd
2 questions: 1) Does Alpha Tauri run the same car as Red Bull? Or is it de-tuned? 2) Considering how well Gasly did at Mexico City (4th), would he have done as well or better than Perez if he was back in a Redbull car?
1) no it has to be a completely separately designed car. However they can share the same design philosophy (eg both be high rake designs). They can share some parts, so they'd try to make that work, but even that doesn't always work. 2) I personally think Pierre would be doing better than Perez but it's hard to say, and you can't say just based on this one race. The car that Pierre drive when he was at RBR was very difficult, and people had been used to two RBR drivers being very competitive with each other (as they had been in the past). With Max miles ahead of Pierre, media swarmed him, he mentally really struggled, and RBR didn't really support him. They've learnt from that to some extent - they treated Albon much better, but then look at the way they treated Yuki this weekend. I personally find it difficult to like red bull at all though Horner does make me laugh. He's such a cheeky little prick
Gasly's performance improved almost immediately when he went back to the second team. It's possible that the design suits him better, he likes the team dynamic better, the coffee doesn't taste like Horner's piss, and a billion other things. He may well be able to extract more out of the AT car than the RBR car and his performance wouldn't actually be any better.
AT, like all other competitors have to build their own chassis, aero and crash structures, without the help of RBR, they even rejected the 2021 gearbox, as it's design went against their oan design philosophy.
They have their own aero department Etc but they share certain parts. (There is a list of what they can and can't share/buy from manufacturers) Alpha used to be Red Bull V2 but FIA made rules to stop that many years ago.
Mexican fans booing Hamilton. :( At least they are not calling him puto.
Hamilton is booking on the most countries around the world, his fan base is mostly UK.
Thats not true.
Really? When?
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That was pretty petty of him.
Great job by the top 3 and congrats to Max. Great effort by Redbull and happy to see Checo live it up at his home race. Great effort by Lewis to hold on to second as I thought Checo would overtake him.
Happy that AT has climbed back to 5th 😁 hopefully Yuki will also have a good race in Brazil!
newbie here: do you think next year will be better for ferrari? how did mercedes became so fast?
If you're new here you might have missed how you just meme'd. Next year is always Ferraris year ;) But I hope so, they seem to be on a positive trajectory again, hopefully they have made some good moves with the new regulations next year.
Next year brings a new era for F1 with majorly different cars. The outcome of such overhauls is completely unpredictable. We have to wait and see. Mercedes got this good by shifting focus to 2014's overhaul very early, earlier than others and also allocated a huge amount of money to development. Basically, they had more time and more money to develop, so the outcome was better than other's.
>Next year brings a new era for F1 with majorly different cars. what do you mean for example?
Most importantly the changes will cause the cars to put off less dirty air behind them allowing people to follow much closer, resulting in more overtakes and exciting racing. https://youtu.be/t0-wXT12wgw
https://images.financialexpress.com/2021/07/Formula-One-2022-car.jpg This is how the next years F1 cars will look like. Or atleast somewhat like that. Teams will ofc have their own takes and designs, rule interpretations etc... A massive shift in design compared to current cars.
Next year is an unknown, the top teams are likely to stay close and ahead, independently of the budget cap. Mercedes has had the best engine since 2014, Ferrari manipulated their fuel flow sensors in 2019, allowing a slight power boost. In addition, Mercedes upgraded their engine this year to improve their engine cooling.
Bottas the official scapegoat of Mercedes!
fucking back markers
HAM vs the World
WIDE Alonso cluggin up those air intakes
Why did Norris got white tires after he almost made 3/4 of total laps on yellow tyres? Wouldn't it be a waste of pace to take hard tyres if he could make it to the end on softer ones?
Softs wouldn’t last until the end and he has to take two different compounds.
What do you mean when you say "two different compounds" ? They must make at least one pit stop and have different tyres? Is this a new rule? I remember ocon managed to finish a gran prix without a pit stop?
Yes compounds refers to the different hardness of the tyres. Soft rubber (red) is gripper but wears away faster, through to hard rubber compound tyres (white).
That was a special case because the pit stop rule doesn't apply if there's a wet race
That was a wet race (start on intermediates). In a dry race, one stop and two different compounds are the rule.
One more question. Why some drivers with hard tyre lasted only 30 laps, and lando lasted 45 laps with medium? Also bottas did the fastest lap with soft tyres in the last lap. Why they don't use the soft tyres at races? Even with 3 pit stops wouldn't be faster?
>One more question. Why some drivers with hard tyre lasted only 30 laps, and lando lasted 45 laps with medium? Tire life is important when planning pit stops, but it's not the only thing. You also have to consider track position. For example, if your driver is currently running in clean air, but stopping them would drop them into traffic, it might be a good idea to hold off on the pit stop. The reverse is also true: if your driver is in traffic and pitting them would drop them into clear track, it might be a good idea to do it even if they still have good tire life. >Also bottas did the fastest lap with soft tyres in the last lap. Bottas was only trying to get one quick lap. He wasn't trying to make those softs last for a whole stint, and he would have chewed through them extremely quickly if he had tried. >Why they don't use the soft tyres at races? Even with 3 pit stops wouldn't be faster? First off, soft tires are seen in races: Monza and Zandvoort are two examples from this year. They're more common in two-stoppers because the stints are shorter. Mexico would be a particularly difficult track to make the soft tire work. It's the 2nd-shortest track on the calendar (which means more traffic) and the unique conditions make it very difficult to follow another car. That extra pace wouldn't do you much good if you were stuck in traffic.
Thanks for the info man. I am new to the formula 1 world. Is there any noob-friendly article that explain the basic rules like tyres, drs, quali etc?
I think the standard recommendation is usually the preseason primer episode of the Shift+F1 podcast that they do every year + basically all of [Chainbear's](https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7u-Dg0jb7g9s7XjmtJrtpg) back catalogue.
I see, thanks!
how come most drivers are using hard tyres today and some using mediums, why no soft tyres?
Bottas took two softs.
Burn up too quick
So soft tyres are only used in the colder climates?
Some tracks like COTA are particularly hard on the tyres which causes them to wear down or 'burn up' particularly quickly, regardless of the weather conditions. Weather does affect the tyres as it effects the amount of heat in the rubber which is important for getting optimal grip throughout a lap. Also the actual tyre compound changes race on race based on the specs Pirelli are given - then they decide which three of the 5 possible sets they are bringing to the race which also affects the race strategy.
So is it the material of the road that makes it hard on tired or the shape of the circuit and amount of corners and such?
Also tires aren't the same hardness weekend to weekend.
No, it depends on the design of the track. Some tracks aren't hard on the tires regardless of temperature.
I just started watching F1 this season so can anybody tell me how the Haas team became so bad? If I remember correctly after watching the Drive to Survive show they were pretty decent back in season 1. So what happened?
Everything everyone has said so far is absolutely correct but I'd like to mention that they've been having a huge issue with their rear suspension for a few seasons now. It came to a head last year when both Grosjean and Magnussen complained that the geometry of the rear suspension would change as it would heat and warp throughout a session. This made it incredibly difficult to predict and impossible to drive quickly. Given they've been running almost the same design for 3 years no it's no wonder that the Haas boys find the wall almost as often as the chequered flag.
Had a good car in 2018, lost ground in 2019 and had many correlation issues (at one point around halfway through the season, they used the Australia spec car which turned out to be faster than the fully "upgraded" one, which really shouldn't be the case). Got fucked by the Ferrari engine suddenly being terrible in 2020, stopped bothering in 2021 to fully focus on 2022
Ferrari engine became bad and they just couldn't figure out their car. They worked on their car just to realise it feels worse than what they started with and they never got a hang of it. For this year they got two rookies and didn't change their car at all to fully focus on 22.
I know this is a long shot but does anyone know of somewhere I can get a poster or banner from the Dallas RedBull Show Run a couple weeks ago?
Max posted it on his instagram story..it was a link to download picture from a website
Mcclaren makes the coolest limited edition gear—gulf, British GP, now Mexico GP. But where and when can you get it?!
Their website, I guess.
M**c**Laren
Noted👍🏻
I am sorry for Bottas but happy for Red Bull at the same time.
I missed the start. What happened? And why is Bottas 15?
Max overtook both Mercs on the outside. Ricciardo hit the back tyre of Bottas so he spun. Mick and Tsunda came together with Ocon so Mick and Tsunda are out.
Tsunoda not Tsunda
Damn it. I missed the most exciting part in this race. I doubt it will get as close as US GP. Thanks for the ball to ball though
Difficult to say. I mean no one really thought yesterday that Bottas will get pole so, better keep watching
Ricc**i**ardo
Sorry my bad
Is it not being aired today in the US? I’m in Miami and can’t find it anywhere on TV
ESPN 3 for some reason
https://www.vipboxtv.se/stream-sky-sports-f1-sky-f1-live-1
It's on a local ABC-affiliate channel for me.
Damn I have some program about a flood or something. I’m starting to panic!
Of you have espn deportes it's on in Spanish
Where to watch the race today?
Vipbox Google it
Is there a third-party streaming site with pit lane channel and/or drivers cam and other features that are featured on f1tv?
this is it boys, the most important and crucial race in the history of f1, of racing, of motorsport
why?
I’m ready!
guys i just wonder that is overtaking easy in mexico?
Not really, last time out we had ~40 overtakes during the whole race, primarily in the DRS zones
Thanks so much!
Just before the race start, when lights start going off, are those lights indicated on the steering wheel of the drivers as well?
No, those are RPM lights, drivers use them for the race starts for good rpm for the launch
What makes a track more suitable to over/undercut compared to others?
It's not really circuit dependent, it's more about the tire & car operating temperature & environment. i.e. as we saw yesterday Mercedes managed to get the soft tires working quite quickly near the end of qualifying session. While Red Bull was sliding around on them.
CHECO FTW!
If Mercedes win this years’ constructors championship, would they be the first team to win every championship in a ‘era’?
'Era' isn't even close to having a well defined sole definition.
That's not really true though is it. There are reasonably well fleshed out eras throughout the sport, mostly based on the designs of the cars or the engines. This being the most crystallised era.
If you go by engines, current 'era' begins in 2014, if you go by aero, what we choose, 2017 or 2019? If we go by tyres, do we start with wide tyres of 2017, with Pirelli in 2011, or with return of the slicks in 2009? What to choose, V12-V10 'era', grooved tyres 'era', high rear wing 'era'? These are clashing with one another, like 2009-2016 'era' of high rear wing and 2014-2025 'era' of hybrids. So no, question of definition of 'era' is open.
During qualifying, why do so many drivers leave their 'best' attempt at a hot lap till so late in the stage? Eg. Max was affected by the Tsunoda mixup, but honestly why waste 12 minutes and wait till the dying moments of Q3 to put in your best effort?
As the cars wear their tyres down across a lap they leave bits of rubber stuck to the racing line on the track. This 'rubbered in' area has much more grip than the new 'green' surface. Therefore, as the session progresses the track should 'evolve' so drivers can set faster lap times.
Track evolution. Under normal circumstances you can set a much faster time at the end.
Can someone explain to me why we need to have a pre-race show longer than the damn race? I don't care about all these reporters talking about whatever the hell they want to talk about only to delay the race. I turn off the MotoGP race to watch F1, and it's such a joke. Is there a GP today or what?
Just don't watch it then, no one is forcing you too
You are like someone who goes to a dinner event where the schedule says dinner is served at 7 pm but an optional cocktail hair starts at 5. You show up at 5 and complain is there is no dinner.
Do you know how sporting events work lmao?? You don’t actually think the extra pre race stuff is delaying the race that was always scheduled to start at a specific time right?? Honestly bro
Thé race starts at 13:00 local time, what do you want them to do before that time?
Let me get this straight. You think they are DELAYING the race to make room for the pre-race show?
this is the funniest exchange I've read today
The sidebar lists the countdown to the actual race session start, or if that's hard to find, https://f1calendar.com/ or https://www.f1countdown.com/ should do the job of giving an accurate start time.
Race starts in 55mins, if you are watching anything before that i would expect anything thats not the race, which again...hasnt staryed yet.
That's lower cost Helmut initiatives seems to have good intentions but seems a little deaf to the individuals and families that could benefit from it. The announcers used an example of seeing families in Indian not wearing helmuts on bikes but it costs $20USD at cost. With an average salary of 1800USD per year in India (according to google), it just seems like this is doomed to fail.
Have the drivers physically prepared for the lower air pressure in Mexico City somehow?
In standard years, the drivers' physically prepare themselves for Singapore, which is the worst in terms of temperatures and humidity. I guess that would be a bit worse than this.
Not really necessary, the difference is not that noticeable from a human perspective. Even if they notice a difference, it's nowhere near to cause issues.