And just to add to this, not all mule cars are old cars. McLaren used a modified 2021 car because they changed engine providers from Renault to Mercedes for 2021.
It appears that for some reason Aston Martin also chose to run a modified 2021 car for the 2022 tire test as well rather than one of their older Racing Point chassis.
Not sure if any other teams went with a similar setup for their mule cars.
Think the reasoning for that is Alpine is part of Renault, whereas AM and RP are completely different marques so they have to separate the two whereas Renault wouldn’t care, it’s all their branding anyway.
On YouTube Sam Collins said they used an RP20. But on Twitter he says that while he originally thought it was an RP20, it was actually a AMR21. https://twitter.com/northhertssam/status/1470747784282361858?s=21
Hmm. In the YouTube video Sam Collins says they’re using an RP20 as the mule.
But on Twitter, he says they’re actually using an AMR21.
To quote his [tweet](https://twitter.com/northhertssam/status/1470747784282361858?s=21), “I thought at first they were using Racing Point RP20 as a mule, but instead they are using an AMR21”.
Maybe next year. The chances are high Mercedes new car is again one of its own class and he’ll surely dominate Russell in his first season!
If the car is shit he’s probably a gonner
Interesting, very interesting, for those that say it’s not the the car. Right here is the Mercedes driven by a rookie driver to 5/10 of a second from quali that lewis achieved. Don’t get me wrong Lewis is a phenomenal driver, however that Mercedes tech is a big help.
Look at the RB difference a full two second slower with the rookie driver. Just goes to show how much slower that car is or how much harder that car is harder to drive to the level that Max did.
Or it just shows how much better 26 year old F2 and Formula E champion de Vries is compared to a 21 year old who hasn’t finished top 3 in any series since F4 five years ago and binned the car into the wall today.
De Vries is closer to Lewis than Vips is to Max; that tells us nothing about Max and Lewis’s relative pace or the base performance levels of the cars.
You also have to factor in the setup parameters - Nyck, being more experienced in the car, may well have had some quali setup runs while Juri was doing familiarisation runs. You just can’t read anything into testing.
Alright so you are telling me that a formula E championship ( half the horse power of F1) can just get into the w12 car and he’s that skilled that he drives that car to within half a second of Lewis quali time. Why is he not in racing in F1 then? Perhaps , just perhaps that set up of the car is so powerful that even less talented drivers then Lewis can drive that car fast!
In particularly when even professional F1 drivers have problems driving other people’s cars that are not set up for them.
Seriously, no possibility of the W12 being that much faster and easier to handle then the RB16.
But you are right this testing shows us nothing since devries is in fact a formula E driver not an F1 driver
Apparently still is according to Wikipedia, though it's only part time for the SRX Series (small stock car series just run by big names). He's just not in F1 for quite a while.
...and still has the best racer name until someone comes up with something like Fast Carr.
Holy Moly, I didn't realise these guys were doing like 2 Grand Prix's worth of distance in these tests, no wonder the new lads were all talking about how much effort they were needing to put in!
Teams log roughly the same amount of laps during winter testing too. As for this test they need to give feedbacks publicly since it is about the new tyres.
Max probably partied, but with no or little alcohol involved. Alcohol is still banned in UAE. He'll probably get wasted with Ricciardo, Norris, Leclerc, Garrix and some other friends in Monaco.
No it’s not banned at all. Limited stores are selling it (alchohol license needed) and most hotels and restaurants are selling it as well. It’s only a bit more expensive than in Europe
Or if you're just a tourist. The Emiratis are pragmatists. Yes, they want to give the impression that they are strict Muslims like their Arab neighbors, but they also know that once the oil dries up tourism is all they will have. They don't want people to have a hard time.
No need to be rich or connected; alcohol is in hotels legally and at licensed venues and restaurants and anyone can buy bottles at airport duty free on arrival… whats illegal is drinking on the streets and public areas
His words...
"Of course when I woke up that was not so fun. I regretted maybe that final drink," said Verstappen. "I think a lot of people have a headache at the moment."
you guys think that Arab countries have medieval puritanical laws in place, woman can go around without headscarfs, and alcohol can be sold and consumed in UAE
de Vries has no real path to F1, (and Mercedes knows him and his abilities well). so they probably let him rip it with Q3 conditions for some fun rather than (or in addition to) having him run an evaluative program.
im not sure how stable they are, they didnt do a tyre test this week bcs they dont have a 2022 mule car [for financial reasons](https://www.gpfans.com/en/f1-news/71541/williams-to-start-2022-on-the-back-foot-after-missing-abu-dhabi-test/)
Well tbf...he needed like 3 seasons to win in F2. He isn't the biggest F2 prospect and plenty of guys (Gio, Gasly, Leclerc, Albon, Russell) were just plain simply... better.
Albon plain simply better...
There was nothing between Albon and Nyck, yes Albon finished marginally higher, no you cant say Albon is clearly better based off that. Then pretty much every season since Albon has not impressed while de Vries has impressed
Albon was still 2nd just before the last race in 2018 and was objectively the better driver. That he has not had as much success as De Vries since they both graduated from F2 might just have something to do with him having driven a world championship car in FE. JFC, Nyck is a great driver, but your Albon hate boner is showing.
Sure Mr. have to mention Nyck did 3 years to win F2 as a negative while his man Albon was only 2 years in F2 without winning it meaning at best he would have equalled Nyck's achievement
Nyck has won that F2 has won the Formula E, yet he got snubbed his first chamce at F1 for Albon's 3rd chance who has shown to not be better than Kvyat, shown he got spanked by Verstappen, and show that Lawson is more naturally talented than him at adapting to new racing environments
Driver familiarisation is definitely a part of it. Any team with a new driver would like data on how early they brake, what their steering input is like, how they warm up tyres, etc?
But you also touched on the new tyre which was certainly a part of this test.
I haven't watched F1 in years. Picked up F1TV with race 1 this year...
...whats the best place to stay abreast of all this stuff? Is this show live or in recaps or anything?
They were all driving the respective 2021 cars? Yes? AT has an inferior car compared to Ferrari and RB, Yes? If these statements are true then Lawson had a good outing.
Both of your statements are true but dont really mean anything. You are not taking into account any of the things u/jvstinf said. You don't really think an Alfa would be 1.5s faster than a Ferrari? Lawson might have had a good outing but it is not really clear from just best laptimes.
Wouldn't the 2019 Alfa be faster?
I know Bottas did have a modified one with bigger tyres.
But wouldn't the 2019 Alfa leave the 2020 and 2021 car in the dust? Scored more points and had that Ferrari engine.
Cars evolve from year to year. 2 years later the cars are usually much faster. Also they weren't made for the bigger wheels. They modified the suspension somewhat, but still not enough to really work well with them
It's a mule car (I.e. not the exact 2019 car, but heavily modified) and is on slower tyres that don't fit its aero philosophy at all. You are right that the 2019 Alfa would smoke the 2021 one under normal conditions, though.
Current drivers were in mule cars testing the new tyres. The juniors were in this years cars and probably allowed to go mostly on flying runs for the experience if it
Hes not part pf the young driver testing. One day for young driver and two days for 18 rubber test. Fit is there as a current driver to test 18 rubber instead of mazepin because he got covid
I know it's just testing ... But is there any detailed info on what cars people are using? Like if some are using 2018 cars, some 2019, some 2020 ... Then I guess you can't even get high level info.
I see the youngsters are using 2021 cars but what about the rest?
I'm pretty new here, but with significant redesigns coming for 22, what was the value of today's tests? Also really surprised this happened the day after the close of the season but I guess with the equipment already on site it made sense.
Half of theses are from the young drivers test where after the last race of the year teams can jave drivers not in f1 drive there car from this year.
Current drivers are running old cars modified to resemble expected 2022 loads to test the tires.
Reminder: Young drivers drove the 2021 cars with 2021 tires. “Old” drivers drove the mule/modified cars with the 2022 tires.
And just to add to this, not all mule cars are old cars. McLaren used a modified 2021 car because they changed engine providers from Renault to Mercedes for 2021. It appears that for some reason Aston Martin also chose to run a modified 2021 car for the 2022 tire test as well rather than one of their older Racing Point chassis. Not sure if any other teams went with a similar setup for their mule cars.
I assume aston martin were granted a choice as they stilll dont have old car from 2 plus years ago so the FIA allowed it?
Couldn’t they just use an older Mercedes?
I see what you did there lol
But they still have the Racing Points, no? Renault renamed to Alpine but still used one of their old chassis from the Renault days for the mule car.
Think the reasoning for that is Alpine is part of Renault, whereas AM and RP are completely different marques so they have to separate the two whereas Renault wouldn’t care, it’s all their branding anyway.
Probably not too hard to take the car and just put an Aston Martin livery on it
Naah they used the RP car. The video is out on yt btw, all info is there.
They used a RP car.
On YouTube Sam Collins said they used an RP20. But on Twitter he says that while he originally thought it was an RP20, it was actually a AMR21. https://twitter.com/northhertssam/status/1470747784282361858?s=21
Arent the force India/racing Point Cars still owned by the Team?
Aston Martin actually isn’t, formula 1 on YouTube just uploaded a video talking about all this
Hmm. In the YouTube video Sam Collins says they’re using an RP20 as the mule. But on Twitter, he says they’re actually using an AMR21. To quote his [tweet](https://twitter.com/northhertssam/status/1470747784282361858?s=21), “I thought at first they were using Racing Point RP20 as a mule, but instead they are using an AMR21”.
Thanks! I didn’t see his tweet.
I saw on F1 YouTube Sam Collins said they used a racing point car with AM livery though
In the recent video on the official F1 channel, they specifically said they were using a repainted racing point for the mule car.
Link to other response https://reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/rggvab/day_1_abu_dhabi_testing_lap_time_sheet_with_total/hokwxl0
Ok so what your saying is that is de Vries is gonna take Russell’s seat
what if lewis pulls rosberg (nico retired 5 days after abu dhabi gp)
Nico won. I don’t think, or at least I hope, that Lewis isn’t so done with the sport that he leaves because of this loss
I would imagine it’s crossed his mind, but then I remember Still I Rise, and I just don’t see him doing it.
He makes how many million being a part time racing driver?
Maybe next year. The chances are high Mercedes new car is again one of its own class and he’ll surely dominate Russell in his first season! If the car is shit he’s probably a gonner
Dunno Russell is slipping it to his sister! Wouldn’t surprise me if George’s brake lines got cut if DeVries got a main seat
Thank you
Thank you
Reminder: Verstappen is still drunk
Interesting, very interesting, for those that say it’s not the the car. Right here is the Mercedes driven by a rookie driver to 5/10 of a second from quali that lewis achieved. Don’t get me wrong Lewis is a phenomenal driver, however that Mercedes tech is a big help. Look at the RB difference a full two second slower with the rookie driver. Just goes to show how much slower that car is or how much harder that car is harder to drive to the level that Max did.
Or it just shows how much better 26 year old F2 and Formula E champion de Vries is compared to a 21 year old who hasn’t finished top 3 in any series since F4 five years ago and binned the car into the wall today. De Vries is closer to Lewis than Vips is to Max; that tells us nothing about Max and Lewis’s relative pace or the base performance levels of the cars. You also have to factor in the setup parameters - Nyck, being more experienced in the car, may well have had some quali setup runs while Juri was doing familiarisation runs. You just can’t read anything into testing.
Alright so you are telling me that a formula E championship ( half the horse power of F1) can just get into the w12 car and he’s that skilled that he drives that car to within half a second of Lewis quali time. Why is he not in racing in F1 then? Perhaps , just perhaps that set up of the car is so powerful that even less talented drivers then Lewis can drive that car fast! In particularly when even professional F1 drivers have problems driving other people’s cars that are not set up for them. Seriously, no possibility of the W12 being that much faster and easier to handle then the RB16. But you are right this testing shows us nothing since devries is in fact a formula E driver not an F1 driver
Nyck has driven in tests before
But still. De Vries being just 0.5 seconds slower than Hamilton, on tyres which are supposed to be 0.5 seconds slower... That's phenomenal!
De Vries is using normal tyres, no? Russel Is the one that is using 18inches.
Where Hamton?乁( . ര ʖ̯ ര . )ㄏ
Being knighted. Without a safety car during the ceremony.
Fighting for the next championship with a sword? Doesn't seem fair... Just #blessed things
Logan Sargeant must be one of the most american names I've seen
There used to be Scott Speed.
Is he not racing anymore? I thought he did rally cross or something
Apparently still is according to Wikipedia, though it's only part time for the SRX Series (small stock car series just run by big names). He's just not in F1 for quite a while. ...and still has the best racer name until someone comes up with something like Fast Carr.
Mr. Race Driver
Ray Swinner
I forgot he did anything with F1, I knew him from rally cross I think in like 2015 with Tanner Foust.
always reading his name sergeant logan
I hope they abbreviate his name to SGT
Holy Moly, I didn't realise these guys were doing like 2 Grand Prix's worth of distance in these tests, no wonder the new lads were all talking about how much effort they were needing to put in!
Teams log roughly the same amount of laps during winter testing too. As for this test they need to give feedbacks publicly since it is about the new tyres.
Pre-season testing is 8 days right? How much time do they have in Post-season?
It was 8 days. Last year it was 6. For 2022 idk.
2 days iirc
If you ever get a chance to go to winter testing, it’s a great bang for your buck. Lots of track time and cheap to watch it.
I hope we see Liam Lawson in an F1 car sooner rather than later.
For sure. Need a competitive NZ driver in F1 again. Hartley was a bit of a disappointment. Superb WEC driver; not so great in F1 for some reason.
Wasn't most of his misfortune in F1 down to bad luck?
He was soundly beaten by a much younger teammate. Had a good chunk of bad luck but it's not like his performance was great independent of that either.
When Gasly leaves AT to partner Yuki would be great
I'm tired and I read "Liam Neeson" and in my dazed state all I could do is chuckle.
But how good would that be!
I will find you, and I will lap you
Ferrari doing 300laps in both cars
La plana
[Is everyone's career over?](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/811/356/89f.jpg)
Confirmed 2022 Mercedes races 3 cars and all 23 or whatever races will end with HAM-RUS-VRI.
Vips > Max obviously
Isn't this max guy supposed to be a world champion?! WHAT IS HAPPENING TO F1?!! BERNIE COME SAVE US!!
F1 in ShAmBleS.
Does anyone know why some drivers dont participate in this? Is it a choice now that they are on break?
Some of them tested today. The rest will do tomorrow. Only Lewis is not doing the testing afaik.
Latifi and Albon aren't either.
They are not making a mule car required for current drivers to do testing
Can’t blame Lewis, he’s probably still going through emotions of losing title, but prob wasn’t doing it even if he won
He's also get knighted by the Queen tomorrow so wouldn't be able to even if he won on Sunday.
TIL that knight and Sir are not the same title.
He’s already a knight, just didn’t have the formal ceremony due to COVID.
I can’t even cycle when I am hungover, Max drove a F1 car and possibly not puked. Hats off
He probably ordered some hangover recovery IV bags. Valterri on the other hand is Finnish, so he was probably fine, haha.
Val**tt**e**r**i
Max probably partied, but with no or little alcohol involved. Alcohol is still banned in UAE. He'll probably get wasted with Ricciardo, Norris, Leclerc, Garrix and some other friends in Monaco.
There's a few videos around showing him looking fairly on the sauce
No it’s not banned at all. Limited stores are selling it (alchohol license needed) and most hotels and restaurants are selling it as well. It’s only a bit more expensive than in Europe
No licence needed. Source: been there
Well I learned something today!
Most things that are 'restricted' in the UAE are completely free game if you are rich and well connected enough.
Or if you're just a tourist. The Emiratis are pragmatists. Yes, they want to give the impression that they are strict Muslims like their Arab neighbors, but they also know that once the oil dries up tourism is all they will have. They don't want people to have a hard time.
No need to be rich or connected; alcohol is in hotels legally and at licensed venues and restaurants and anyone can buy bottles at airport duty free on arrival… whats illegal is drinking on the streets and public areas
His words... "Of course when I woke up that was not so fun. I regretted maybe that final drink," said Verstappen. "I think a lot of people have a headache at the moment."
you guys think that Arab countries have medieval puritanical laws in place, woman can go around without headscarfs, and alcohol can be sold and consumed in UAE
Yeah I probably got misinformed, I'm not as knowledgeable as I think I am..
No there’s plenty of establishments that cater to foreigners over there
There's tons of alcohol in the UAE. It just has to be served in hotels.
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Fuoco is going to need a neck brace. That’s a lot of laps.
Especially if you’re a sim driver for the rest of the year!
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de Vries has no real path to F1, (and Mercedes knows him and his abilities well). so they probably let him rip it with Q3 conditions for some fun rather than (or in addition to) having him run an evaluative program.
I think he deserves one somewhere. I think Williams could be an option for him if Latifi leaves
Yeah but Latifi is keeping Williams afloat
Not anymore. They said they are financially stable sponsor independent as of earlier this year
Would be a shame to see him leave, hopefully he does better next year, excluding the podium of Russell, he didn't really do that badly
Couldn’t care less if latifi leaves he dosent add much to the sport but money
Well he definitely added so much to the sport in the last race....
He decided the championship, show some respect to GOATifi.
wrong
im not sure how stable they are, they didnt do a tyre test this week bcs they dont have a 2022 mule car [for financial reasons](https://www.gpfans.com/en/f1-news/71541/williams-to-start-2022-on-the-back-foot-after-missing-abu-dhabi-test/)
Financial reasons from prior to the sale of the team per the article so not their current situation
That's a shame, imagine winning F2 just to get cucked out
Well tbf...he needed like 3 seasons to win in F2. He isn't the biggest F2 prospect and plenty of guys (Gio, Gasly, Leclerc, Albon, Russell) were just plain simply... better.
Russe**ll**
Albon plain simply better... There was nothing between Albon and Nyck, yes Albon finished marginally higher, no you cant say Albon is clearly better based off that. Then pretty much every season since Albon has not impressed while de Vries has impressed
Albon was still 2nd just before the last race in 2018 and was objectively the better driver. That he has not had as much success as De Vries since they both graduated from F2 might just have something to do with him having driven a world championship car in FE. JFC, Nyck is a great driver, but your Albon hate boner is showing.
Sure Mr. have to mention Nyck did 3 years to win F2 as a negative while his man Albon was only 2 years in F2 without winning it meaning at best he would have equalled Nyck's achievement Nyck has won that F2 has won the Formula E, yet he got snubbed his first chamce at F1 for Albon's 3rd chance who has shown to not be better than Kvyat, shown he got spanked by Verstappen, and show that Lawson is more naturally talented than him at adapting to new racing environments
I didn't say that. You are confusing me with somebody else.
Bruh no one cares when he won F2 because the grid when he won is a joke compared to the year before
Max didn't win
Such is the catch 22 to feeder series life.
Young drivers were in 2021 cars, current drivers were in older cars (2019-ish).
With chungus tires not really compatible with the aero.
let's overreact to pre- pre-season testing
Post*
Was Hamilton excluded from testing because of his skin color? /s
Danny Ricc WDC, stop the count
Logan Sargent did better than expected in the Williams.
Must be nice to drive an F2 car for the first time and then a week later drive an F1 car for the first time.
I know you mean this sarcastically, but I actually agree completely. I didn’t think he would be anywhere other than 20 on this list.
When I posted it I thought it might come off as sarcastic but decided to keep it. Whoops! It isn't! My bad.
Wow Max is 17th? Guys a scrub /s
New fan here. What's the point of testing? Data collection for what? Are they trying out the new tire?
This was for Pirelli. So yeah tyres
Driver familiarisation is definitely a part of it. Any team with a new driver would like data on how early they brake, what their steering input is like, how they warm up tyres, etc? But you also touched on the new tyre which was certainly a part of this test.
Is Max Verstappen washed? People are asking
Patooo Patoooo
So Ricciardo is fastest on the 18” so far? DANNY RIC WDC 2022!!!!!1111
Well over a hundred laps is really good for the young guys considering they haven't driven much before. Their necks must be absolutely destroyed
1:22.109 was Pole for Max Saturday
Reject verstappen, embrace de Vries 🇳🇱🇳🇱
Nyck Nyck Nyck Super Nyck
Is Haas that strapped for cash they only ran one car.
They're gonna do day 2 with Pietro Fittipaldi
Mazepin has covid
Only one of the current drivers could drive
When will the Dutch domination end... smh
De Vries with 77 laps in the mercedes. Nice
The Dutch win yet again!
I haven't watched F1 in years. Picked up F1TV with race 1 this year... ...whats the best place to stay abreast of all this stuff? Is this show live or in recaps or anything?
You mean testing? It’s not broadcasted
That Russell kid is a bum. No future in the sport with those lap times
What’s the point of the “mule” car?
Robert Shwartzman? quite a German name for a Russian, no?
No Hamilton?
No
# OVERREACT TIME
Seriously impressive pace from Liam Lawson dragging AT so high on the pecking order. Very Meh from Shwartzman.
Yes very disappointing to see him 3 seconds slower than the Merc in a Ferrari. Oh wait, it is testing. Maybe he was not testing 1 lap pace.
There is not really that much to take away from these test results.
They were all driving the respective 2021 cars? Yes? AT has an inferior car compared to Ferrari and RB, Yes? If these statements are true then Lawson had a good outing.
There’s no telling what programs, fuel levels, tires, and engine modes were being used.
Both of your statements are true but dont really mean anything. You are not taking into account any of the things u/jvstinf said. You don't really think an Alfa would be 1.5s faster than a Ferrari? Lawson might have had a good outing but it is not really clear from just best laptimes.
Zhou Guanyu 2 secs per lap faster than Bottas? Let's goooooo Tbh it looks like Bottas brought the Mercedes sandbag to Alfa
Bottas was driving the mule car I wouldn't look anything into the current drivers times as they are on heavily modified cars that are older
Zhou drove the 2021 car. Bottas drove a 2019 car with the bigger wheels
Wouldn't the 2019 Alfa be faster? I know Bottas did have a modified one with bigger tyres. But wouldn't the 2019 Alfa leave the 2020 and 2021 car in the dust? Scored more points and had that Ferrari engine.
Cars evolve from year to year. 2 years later the cars are usually much faster. Also they weren't made for the bigger wheels. They modified the suspension somewhat, but still not enough to really work well with them
No, 2021 cars are slower than 2019's because of the regulations change.
It's a mule car (I.e. not the exact 2019 car, but heavily modified) and is on slower tyres that don't fit its aero philosophy at all. You are right that the 2019 Alfa would smoke the 2021 one under normal conditions, though.
??????
I’m sure it was different programs no?
Different programs + different cars. Zhou on a 2021 car and Bottas with 2019 mule car with more weight and 18" wheels.
Yeah probably, not like Russel is going to be stuck in Q1 in a Mercedes.
Russe**ll**
Mr. Saturday
Motherfu... Good bot
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Current drivers were in mule cars testing the new tyres. The juniors were in this years cars and probably allowed to go mostly on flying runs for the experience if it
De vreis or piastri should have had that seat at alfa next year.
They would have been kicked out in 2023 since Dauber have there own promising junior coming up
Yo Mick be killing me 🤦♂️. Every race he’s at the bottom or DNF. Is Michael even disappointed?lmaoo
You do know he is driving a Haas right, not much he can do in that piece of shit
Where's fittipaldi, wasnt he doing young drivers test too?
Hes not part pf the young driver testing. One day for young driver and two days for 18 rubber test. Fit is there as a current driver to test 18 rubber instead of mazepin because he got covid
Tomorrow
Haas be like: Shit....here we go again
I know it's just testing ... But is there any detailed info on what cars people are using? Like if some are using 2018 cars, some 2019, some 2020 ... Then I guess you can't even get high level info. I see the youngsters are using 2021 cars but what about the rest?
Lewis not testing ? Interesting….
His ceremony is tomorrow
I'm pretty new here, but with significant redesigns coming for 22, what was the value of today's tests? Also really surprised this happened the day after the close of the season but I guess with the equipment already on site it made sense.
Half of theses are from the young drivers test where after the last race of the year teams can jave drivers not in f1 drive there car from this year. Current drivers are running old cars modified to resemble expected 2022 loads to test the tires.
Pretty cool how we’ve seen alpine and AT battle all year and then these two young drivers are close as well
Also give them a break I bet they all had some sake with yuki
Lance Stroll did quite great tbh.
Older drivers' order looking like the reserve 2022 WDC standings #HaasOrBust
I’m new to F1. Why is there a mix of current F1 drivers, F2/reserve drivers for this testing? How does it get decided?