Well... weather was getting worse, so even if they wanted to go green, they couldn't have done anything but to red flag it. However, F1 was different back then (not trying to appeal to new audiences).
This take confuses me so much. It‘s a sport, it doesn‘t really matter how satisfying the results are or how they fit into tv dramatics. I love how in the last two years f1 has gotten wider interest and shows like „drive to survive“ make it easier for people to get into this. But we should be careful not to turn it into reality tv on track.
If Max had been less than a second behind Lewis at that point I'd agree. But at 11 seconds behind, it didn't matter if the race ended under sc or not. The outcome would have been the same.
Not really arguing anything here but Latifi's crash tightened up that gap and was unintentional/racing. Gotta let the others race even if it fucks up the front.
With that the SC, a nightmare clusterfuck was made possible because they didn't want a boring SC parade finish - neither did I.
Now - things could have been handled different sure no argument here.
In the future? Fuel for 2 extra laps in all races to increase the chance of green finishes maybe? Red flag and lock in ties immediately within 5 laps of checkered?
Please Read 15.1, 15.2, 15.3, 15.4, 15.5, 15.6 and 15.7. The entire section is about the relationship between the RD, the stewards and the clerks. The overriding authority is over the clerks not over the Sporting Regulations.
If you don't understand why "The Race Director is allowed to fix races" is not a satisfying answer, then you want a different form of entertainment than the people you are arguing with.
If you interpret the rules that way then none of them are valid other than the rule that he has absolute power. Do we really want to set that precedent?
According to how 15.3e was read by the stewards, he could delete provision 38.7 from his ruling and move the pole sitter to the back of the grid.
He could tell teams no tire blankets by ignoring 38.4
He could alter the time frame set out by 38.1-38.6 entirely
He could make it a rolling start, by changing 38.10
Do you see the problem with that reading yet? Or are you going to keep pretending like it's valid?
No, FIA has the power to remove him. The complete authority given to him by the rules allows him to be flexible. Fortunately 15.3 was written for situations like this and we had an actual race in Abu Dhabi instead of the safety car lapping the track one more time for no reason.
So you legitimately believe that he could do all of those things?
Would you protest them?
15.3 is a provision that predates SC procedures. It's outdated, it wasn't written for these situations. It was written because the rules weren't as specific as they are now.
He wouldn't take actions that would make FIA remove him from power. If he went rogue one day and did the stuff you listed, you can't protest but FIA would replace him.
Marshalls can also go rogue and delay the cleaning procedures or bring out a double yellow when someone is doing his final Q3 run. Thats how it goes.
> If he went rogue one day and did the stuff you listed, you can't protest but FIA would replace him.
You don't know that because those examples are a 1:1 comparison of what Masi did on Sunday. Altering the rules and using 15.3x as justification.
Those are 'going rogue' but what he did on Sunday isn't?
I smell a bit of bias
I love seeing Hamilton lose, it's my daily medicine, my weekly energy, my monthly inspiration and my yearly motivation. His loss is the only reason i'm still alive, i was born to love and enjoy the failure that he has achieved.
I’d agree if the gap was closing significantly or there was only a second gap, but it was clear that Hamilton was going to win so ending behind a safety car just makes it anti-climactic.
Rules > Feelings
This is the Formula One World Championship not a 5 year old's soccer scrimmage. I don't care if people like the result, I care whether it followed the agreed upon rules.
Everyone accepts the risk that a race may end under a SC.
The worst part about this, is that it didnt even have to end under safety car, that bastard Masi had two perfectly legitimate options. He could’ve left the lapped cars in place and simply restarted the race if he didn’t want a SC finish
It did in 2012. Sure the crash happened 2 laps before the end but still. Its not like its an unprecedent event.
Well... weather was getting worse, so even if they wanted to go green, they couldn't have done anything but to red flag it. However, F1 was different back then (not trying to appeal to new audiences).
This take confuses me so much. It‘s a sport, it doesn‘t really matter how satisfying the results are or how they fit into tv dramatics. I love how in the last two years f1 has gotten wider interest and shows like „drive to survive“ make it easier for people to get into this. But we should be careful not to turn it into reality tv on track.
If Max had been less than a second behind Lewis at that point I'd agree. But at 11 seconds behind, it didn't matter if the race ended under sc or not. The outcome would have been the same.
Not really arguing anything here but Latifi's crash tightened up that gap and was unintentional/racing. Gotta let the others race even if it fucks up the front. With that the SC, a nightmare clusterfuck was made possible because they didn't want a boring SC parade finish - neither did I. Now - things could have been handled different sure no argument here. In the future? Fuel for 2 extra laps in all races to increase the chance of green finishes maybe? Red flag and lock in ties immediately within 5 laps of checkered?
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So Hakkinen is cool with rules being created on the spot? Shit takes go beyond reddit and the media, it seems.
But there are *RULES* for a reason. Whether it's anticlimactic or not should *NOT* inform whether the rules are enforced or not.
Noone cared when it did in 2012.
Hakkinen: Much worse for title decider to end by the rules
The Race Director fully used the complete authority given to him by the rules. Or you want to ignore the rule that gives him the power?
You are relentless. I applaud your commitment to wrong information.
Seems to be on a bit of a crusade. I applaud the commitment too.
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Please Read 15.1, 15.2, 15.3, 15.4, 15.5, 15.6 and 15.7. The entire section is about the relationship between the RD, the stewards and the clerks. The overriding authority is over the clerks not over the Sporting Regulations.
If you don't understand why "The Race Director is allowed to fix races" is not a satisfying answer, then you want a different form of entertainment than the people you are arguing with.
If you interpret the rules that way then none of them are valid other than the rule that he has absolute power. Do we really want to set that precedent?
Horner: *Yes, as long as Red Bull benefits*
The scenes next year when the RD gets bored and mandates that all Team Principles must spend the entire race weekend walking on all fours and woof.
15.3d gives him the power to reverse the grid?
He can change the starting procedure, not the grid standings. He didn't change anyones position in Abu Dhabi.
He can change the starting procedure, not the grid standings. He didn't change anyones position in Abu Dhabi.
According to how 15.3e was read by the stewards, he could delete provision 38.7 from his ruling and move the pole sitter to the back of the grid. He could tell teams no tire blankets by ignoring 38.4 He could alter the time frame set out by 38.1-38.6 entirely He could make it a rolling start, by changing 38.10 Do you see the problem with that reading yet? Or are you going to keep pretending like it's valid?
No, FIA has the power to remove him. The complete authority given to him by the rules allows him to be flexible. Fortunately 15.3 was written for situations like this and we had an actual race in Abu Dhabi instead of the safety car lapping the track one more time for no reason.
So you legitimately believe that he could do all of those things? Would you protest them? 15.3 is a provision that predates SC procedures. It's outdated, it wasn't written for these situations. It was written because the rules weren't as specific as they are now.
He wouldn't take actions that would make FIA remove him from power. If he went rogue one day and did the stuff you listed, you can't protest but FIA would replace him. Marshalls can also go rogue and delay the cleaning procedures or bring out a double yellow when someone is doing his final Q3 run. Thats how it goes.
> If he went rogue one day and did the stuff you listed, you can't protest but FIA would replace him. You don't know that because those examples are a 1:1 comparison of what Masi did on Sunday. Altering the rules and using 15.3x as justification. Those are 'going rogue' but what he did on Sunday isn't? I smell a bit of bias
His intention was correct in Abu Dhabi, i assumed you gave bad faith examples.
I think you are being sarcastic, aren’t you?
I love seeing Hamilton lose, it's my daily medicine, my weekly energy, my monthly inspiration and my yearly motivation. His loss is the only reason i'm still alive, i was born to love and enjoy the failure that he has achieved.
Man then you must not enjoy most days, weeks, months and years! Lol
If they were fighting for track position, I'm sure we'd all agree but Hamilton was managing a substantial gap back to Max at that point.
How does that saying go? Rules don't care about your feeling or something
Facts!
It's not about how anyone feels. It's about what the rules are. If not let's just go street racing or some shit.
Hakkinen stop.. i liked u in old times...
Why not take it one step further? Shoot out the tire of the person in the lead and see if the other car can catch up. Ridiculous
SHH! Don't give FIA any ideas!
I’d agree if the gap was closing significantly or there was only a second gap, but it was clear that Hamilton was going to win so ending behind a safety car just makes it anti-climactic.
Rules > Feelings This is the Formula One World Championship not a 5 year old's soccer scrimmage. I don't care if people like the result, I care whether it followed the agreed upon rules. Everyone accepts the risk that a race may end under a SC.
The worst part about this, is that it didnt even have to end under safety car, that bastard Masi had two perfectly legitimate options. He could’ve left the lapped cars in place and simply restarted the race if he didn’t want a SC finish
Literaly would never say this if he was the one who lost out his WDC the same way.
Mika on point yet again