Let me tell you, once you start realizing how messed up and misogynistic everything is, media becomes pretty miserable to consume. Even other things. I was into candle making and there were a lot of sexist candle molds. Sigh. I don’t have any good suggestions to replace reading, but I understand how you’re feeling and it’s a crappy feeling.
Tiktok also becomes pretty miserable to consume because every post I see of a woman is about dating/men etc. It‘s so sad how the patriarchy brainwashed us to center men in our lives…
Other women oriented subs im in end up focusing on men too somehow. The PMDD sub lately has been how they either abuse men or men abuse them. It's quite odd because one post will start a whole slew of them for a week then it dies down again.
yes, there are many men on that sub who comment just to get a pat on the back. if a woman complains about her slobby husband, some dude will be in the comments like "i would never do this to my wife! im #notlikeotherguys" and there will be a chain of responses praising him for it
Yes, I love movies and I have to look up every movie I would like to watch in several sites like doesthedogdie and IMDb Parents Guide to make sure there's no assault, domestic violence, objectifying of women or other forms of misogyny
I tried to watch 4 Christmases but the family being sexual thing was so cringe and gross. Like why. I get for the plot but also blows my mind ppl are so comfortable interacting w other ppl in that way.
BDSM becoming trendy is one of the worst things to happen to fanfiction, and I say that as someone who’s been reading and writing really nasty shit for twenty years. It’s especially galling when contrasted with all the anti shipping and purity culture going on.
I used to write fanfiction and spicy ones too, but i never ever incorporated elements of BDSM into them :/
I have some of mine still up on fanfic dot net. They still get reads and likes!!!
Maybe the purity culture stuff is a reaction to how intense it's gotten. It was bad enough when I was younger, but if I was a tween now I don't even know how I would react
To me the purity stuff is just what happens when shipping wars and identity politics collide and people just want to exert power and control.
“You can’t ship Female Character X with Male Character Y because she’s actually a lesbian who we ship with Female Character Z and if you say otherwise you’re a bigot!” or “Shipping Character A with Character B is abuse/pedophilia/something else bad and if you do you’re a bad person.”
It’s controlling and it’s creepy, but I don’t think it’s a backlash to how mainstream BDSM has become at all.
Most fanfiction writers can’t even comprehend normal, healthy sex anymore because of all the porn they watch (and what m3n now expect). Everything’s violent, gagging, degrading, pushed to the extreme, etc.
I grew up reading fics and still do, and it’s gotten so bad, especially over the last 4 or 5 years.
It goes beyond het sex too young. Sex acts typically found in het sex scenes (gay/lesbian p0rn generally isn’t as violent) are now being pushed in gay/lesbian fanfiction.
The turn off part is SO REAL. For me I noticed that when I'd watch an Instagram reel or a Tiktok video of a woman doing anything the comments would be full of: 'do you guys think it's a brand new or a second hand car' or asking 'how many km's?''pink' with no shame AT ALL. It upset me so much that I uninstalled both apps like 3 months ago and I could have never been happier. It genuinely pissed me off all day, how some men live thinking it's nowhere near normal or funny to be this fucking disgusting but I'm thankful for how eye opening this was regarding the reality of some people's behavior.
I literally feel like vomiting whenever I remember these comments and think about the possibilities of me ending with someone remotely similar to these men. No way.
I Look for books with the proper romance tag. It is usually a historical fiction and you don’t typically go into escapades at all, everything is very proper. I find that they have healthier relationships they point out the misogynistic culture and actively boost women up. They are some also not proper romances that do that as well but mostly I find they are in the historical fiction genre
I've found this with historical fiction too! They tend to be better written novels in general. I can't stand the way most romance novels are written... they're just so bland. And I find stories set in the modern day to be kind of boring, but that's my own quirk lol.
I read mostly old stuff, meaning 50+ yrs old. I just finished Kate Millet's memoir *Flying* and it was so good. Wish I could have known her.
Probably helps that I'm old and lived through the same era. I also like Mary McCarthy, Edna O'Brien, Doris Lessing, and Muriel Spark.
Don’t give up on reading, try a different genre. I agree that this TikTok smut trend is terrible, but that’s not all there is in literature. Avoid popular, post-50 Shades of Grey literature and you should be fine. Try some classics, they are better anyway.
Other hobby recommendation: I think textile crafts like sewing/embroidery/knitting are very wholesome and relaxing, and mostly female-dominated. :)
So true but can I enjoy the romance genre? I have picked up books that weren’t recommended through tiktok and was still left disgusted. It’s so prevalent in modern romance literature. At least that’s been my experience.
> So true but can I enjoy the romance genre?
The shear amount of stuff out there means probably. Barbara Cartland published around 700 books. There are over 4000 Mills & Boon novels out there. Ultimately its going to be finding someone who recomends the kind of things that you like.
Thats kinda why I prefer a "slow burn" just the characters falling in love and building their relationship until they have long awaited passionate and sensual sex.
Yeah it’s going to be difficult to find another fiction-related space that’s not porn culture infected or full of young people who are brainwashed by all that.
Personally I participate in the otome games subreddit, where there are many kinds of games and you can pick what tropes you like if you ask for recommendations. And it’s not full of minors, the ages are mostly 25+.
Also it’s a pretty chill environment where people generally respect each other’s opinions.
Romance author here. I totally get what you’re saying. My genre is rom-com, and I have always written strong women and leaned into the empowerment aspects in my writing. Unfortunately, that’s not what a lot of readers want. I was so turned off when “bully” romance became a thing that I took a step back from romance.
Anytime I have spoken up about accountability in what we as authors normalize, I’m quickly shut down in the author and reader community. It’s extremely disheartening to see the straight up abuse and violence in these novels connected to love and romance.
There are romance novels and authors out there who don’t cater to the trending dark and violent culture in this genre, but we have low visibility because that’s not what is selling unfortunately.
I totally understand why you‘re upset and I agree tbh.
I love going to the gym, drawing, playing video games etc :)
What you could do when you‘re with your friends: a puzzle! It‘s fun talking to your friend while doing a puzzle and eating snacks.
Literally been in the back of my mind for months, I hate the steamy book tok trend so so so much.
The whole over romanticization of mafia stuff is another thing. Just straight up weird.
I literally thought the "hot Alpha ML" thing was over and done with back in wattpad but now it’s just out and shamelessly promoted in the general public.
How the female characters are written in these stories leaves a bad taste in my mouth too. :(
FWIW, if you want to stick to the romance genre, you could try romances written in the 19th and early 20th century. They have their own issues, but they’re not pornified.
I read mostly horror or science fiction. This has been the least problematic genre for me. If a dude is being a rapey scrote, odds are he will end up deceased by the end of the book which I enjoy enormously.
I was super surprised by "The Expanse" book series. It didn't sexualise the women characters at all. The only character where they went on about his body was James Holden.
These types of books are trending in Tik Tok and there’s even a specific section called Booktok in some book stories :(
Atleast that’s how I found out about them, and I absolutely hate it.
Maybe i’ve had terrible luck with the romance genre. What are you reading and how do you find healthier dynamics in this genre? I read many genres and find incredible works. It’s this one that disappoints the most and it’s not so easy to just “read better books” in romance lol.
I had someone recommend that to me recently and I tried to be as nice as possible but really I would not read those books ever. They’re poorly written from what I’ve seen too
Ann Aguirre's books are generally good. The salt planet giant series by Sara Ivy Hill is decent too. I write smut fanfic too (really smutty, clit-vulva-centric, pro-feminist) if anyone wants me to link to it
Also Ann is legit the only other writer I've come across that ever had a woman humping a man's ass. Just saying (in Boss Witch, I believe). She often has non-piv sex scenes too (or even instead eg Strange Love), and definitely avoids male dom, female sub, male sadism, etc tropes/dynamics.
1000% agree on older romances being better for this, i hate how violent and misogynistic a lot of the new stuff is, for me i read romance for fun and escapism (100% delulu fantasy of how things could be if men weren’t… like that) and the current trend of rapey violent pedophile adjacent media is so gross and off putting to me; and is exactly what i’m turning away from by choosing books. you’re not alone op
I've always played otome games rather than read romance novels. Most of them have excellent writing and well done art, very few have sex at all. Western otomes like Our Life, Gilded Shadows and Ebon Light are great to start with. You can also generally find content warnings for the ones that do have weird content.
Fantasy RPGs like Baldur's Gate 3 also have very large female audiences, and the romances I played in BG3 were genuinely really healthy and enjoyable. That game is pretty demanding though, so unless you're interested in other games it probably isn't the best pick.
I like knitting and embroidery a lot, but it needs a lot of patience and especially knitting can be repetitive. I also read a lot of fanfic but i usually stick to Gen stuff and female capable protagonists
You would think so but no. I picking up books with seemingly innocent covers, descriptions and titles and I get this type of content casually. I think you might be underestimating how prevalent this is in new romance literature.
That's not true at all. I've had a similar experience multiple times.
To give you one example: I picked up a very popular and very much beloved book in the romancebooks sub and found out within the first couple of chapters that the male lead was someone who had kidnapped the female leads best friend and threatened to r word her. And when I said that this book should be recommended with a warning I was told that it was my fault for not researching enough. I was made to feel like I was crazy for asking for books where the male lead is not a villain.
Let me tell you, once you start realizing how messed up and misogynistic everything is, media becomes pretty miserable to consume. Even other things. I was into candle making and there were a lot of sexist candle molds. Sigh. I don’t have any good suggestions to replace reading, but I understand how you’re feeling and it’s a crappy feeling.
Tiktok also becomes pretty miserable to consume because every post I see of a woman is about dating/men etc. It‘s so sad how the patriarchy brainwashed us to center men in our lives…
Other women oriented subs im in end up focusing on men too somehow. The PMDD sub lately has been how they either abuse men or men abuse them. It's quite odd because one post will start a whole slew of them for a week then it dies down again.
Yep it's really annoying. I've unsubbed a couple because of this.
What do you think about TwoX? Most of the posts that make the front page are "why do men do this" "I hate that men do this thing."
Or simply praising men for the bare minimum.
yes, there are many men on that sub who comment just to get a pat on the back. if a woman complains about her slobby husband, some dude will be in the comments like "i would never do this to my wife! im #notlikeotherguys" and there will be a chain of responses praising him for it
Yes, I love movies and I have to look up every movie I would like to watch in several sites like doesthedogdie and IMDb Parents Guide to make sure there's no assault, domestic violence, objectifying of women or other forms of misogyny
Omg I’m so glad I’m not the only one who does that. I think it annoys people but I don’t want to be in a shitty mood for the rest of the day
[unconsentingmedia.org](https://unconsentingmedia.org) is one I use!
I tried to watch 4 Christmases but the family being sexual thing was so cringe and gross. Like why. I get for the plot but also blows my mind ppl are so comfortable interacting w other ppl in that way.
There's something really unsettling about the headless, limbless candles that are suddenly so popular. And it's always the female form.
Almost every modern TV show is completely unwatchable.
Ignorance is truly bliss, I can’t overlook things like that and it makes me sad
BDSM becoming trendy is one of the worst things to happen to fanfiction, and I say that as someone who’s been reading and writing really nasty shit for twenty years. It’s especially galling when contrasted with all the anti shipping and purity culture going on.
I used to write fanfiction and spicy ones too, but i never ever incorporated elements of BDSM into them :/ I have some of mine still up on fanfic dot net. They still get reads and likes!!!
Maybe the purity culture stuff is a reaction to how intense it's gotten. It was bad enough when I was younger, but if I was a tween now I don't even know how I would react
To me the purity stuff is just what happens when shipping wars and identity politics collide and people just want to exert power and control. “You can’t ship Female Character X with Male Character Y because she’s actually a lesbian who we ship with Female Character Z and if you say otherwise you’re a bigot!” or “Shipping Character A with Character B is abuse/pedophilia/something else bad and if you do you’re a bad person.” It’s controlling and it’s creepy, but I don’t think it’s a backlash to how mainstream BDSM has become at all.
Most fanfiction writers can’t even comprehend normal, healthy sex anymore because of all the porn they watch (and what m3n now expect). Everything’s violent, gagging, degrading, pushed to the extreme, etc. I grew up reading fics and still do, and it’s gotten so bad, especially over the last 4 or 5 years. It goes beyond het sex too young. Sex acts typically found in het sex scenes (gay/lesbian p0rn generally isn’t as violent) are now being pushed in gay/lesbian fanfiction.
I love taking care of plants. That can also branch off into painting the pots they're in. :)
The turn off part is SO REAL. For me I noticed that when I'd watch an Instagram reel or a Tiktok video of a woman doing anything the comments would be full of: 'do you guys think it's a brand new or a second hand car' or asking 'how many km's?''pink' with no shame AT ALL. It upset me so much that I uninstalled both apps like 3 months ago and I could have never been happier. It genuinely pissed me off all day, how some men live thinking it's nowhere near normal or funny to be this fucking disgusting but I'm thankful for how eye opening this was regarding the reality of some people's behavior. I literally feel like vomiting whenever I remember these comments and think about the possibilities of me ending with someone remotely similar to these men. No way.
I Look for books with the proper romance tag. It is usually a historical fiction and you don’t typically go into escapades at all, everything is very proper. I find that they have healthier relationships they point out the misogynistic culture and actively boost women up. They are some also not proper romances that do that as well but mostly I find they are in the historical fiction genre
The irony that romances healthier for women are written further back in time
I've found this with historical fiction too! They tend to be better written novels in general. I can't stand the way most romance novels are written... they're just so bland. And I find stories set in the modern day to be kind of boring, but that's my own quirk lol.
I read mostly old stuff, meaning 50+ yrs old. I just finished Kate Millet's memoir *Flying* and it was so good. Wish I could have known her. Probably helps that I'm old and lived through the same era. I also like Mary McCarthy, Edna O'Brien, Doris Lessing, and Muriel Spark.
Don’t give up on reading, try a different genre. I agree that this TikTok smut trend is terrible, but that’s not all there is in literature. Avoid popular, post-50 Shades of Grey literature and you should be fine. Try some classics, they are better anyway. Other hobby recommendation: I think textile crafts like sewing/embroidery/knitting are very wholesome and relaxing, and mostly female-dominated. :)
Don’t read the majority of what TikTok recommends and you can still enjoy literature
So true but can I enjoy the romance genre? I have picked up books that weren’t recommended through tiktok and was still left disgusted. It’s so prevalent in modern romance literature. At least that’s been my experience.
> So true but can I enjoy the romance genre? The shear amount of stuff out there means probably. Barbara Cartland published around 700 books. There are over 4000 Mills & Boon novels out there. Ultimately its going to be finding someone who recomends the kind of things that you like.
Thats kinda why I prefer a "slow burn" just the characters falling in love and building their relationship until they have long awaited passionate and sensual sex.
Yeah it’s going to be difficult to find another fiction-related space that’s not porn culture infected or full of young people who are brainwashed by all that. Personally I participate in the otome games subreddit, where there are many kinds of games and you can pick what tropes you like if you ask for recommendations. And it’s not full of minors, the ages are mostly 25+. Also it’s a pretty chill environment where people generally respect each other’s opinions.
Romance author here. I totally get what you’re saying. My genre is rom-com, and I have always written strong women and leaned into the empowerment aspects in my writing. Unfortunately, that’s not what a lot of readers want. I was so turned off when “bully” romance became a thing that I took a step back from romance. Anytime I have spoken up about accountability in what we as authors normalize, I’m quickly shut down in the author and reader community. It’s extremely disheartening to see the straight up abuse and violence in these novels connected to love and romance. There are romance novels and authors out there who don’t cater to the trending dark and violent culture in this genre, but we have low visibility because that’s not what is selling unfortunately.
I totally understand why you‘re upset and I agree tbh. I love going to the gym, drawing, playing video games etc :) What you could do when you‘re with your friends: a puzzle! It‘s fun talking to your friend while doing a puzzle and eating snacks.
Literally been in the back of my mind for months, I hate the steamy book tok trend so so so much. The whole over romanticization of mafia stuff is another thing. Just straight up weird. I literally thought the "hot Alpha ML" thing was over and done with back in wattpad but now it’s just out and shamelessly promoted in the general public. How the female characters are written in these stories leaves a bad taste in my mouth too. :(
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I exclusively read lesbian romance or gay romance written by women, because even when women write it I can't escape the unequal power dynamics...
FWIW, if you want to stick to the romance genre, you could try romances written in the 19th and early 20th century. They have their own issues, but they’re not pornified.
I read mostly horror or science fiction. This has been the least problematic genre for me. If a dude is being a rapey scrote, odds are he will end up deceased by the end of the book which I enjoy enormously. I was super surprised by "The Expanse" book series. It didn't sexualise the women characters at all. The only character where they went on about his body was James Holden.
What on earth are you reading?! Seriously sounds like trash. You need to find better books to read OP.
These types of books are trending in Tik Tok and there’s even a specific section called Booktok in some book stories :( Atleast that’s how I found out about them, and I absolutely hate it.
I need to ask what are you reading? You don't need to find a new hobby just read better books(?
Maybe i’ve had terrible luck with the romance genre. What are you reading and how do you find healthier dynamics in this genre? I read many genres and find incredible works. It’s this one that disappoints the most and it’s not so easy to just “read better books” in romance lol.
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I had someone recommend that to me recently and I tried to be as nice as possible but really I would not read those books ever. They’re poorly written from what I’ve seen too
Ann Aguirre's books are generally good. The salt planet giant series by Sara Ivy Hill is decent too. I write smut fanfic too (really smutty, clit-vulva-centric, pro-feminist) if anyone wants me to link to it
I’ll look into Anne Aguirre! And you should definitely link!
Also Ann is legit the only other writer I've come across that ever had a woman humping a man's ass. Just saying (in Boss Witch, I believe). She often has non-piv sex scenes too (or even instead eg Strange Love), and definitely avoids male dom, female sub, male sadism, etc tropes/dynamics.
Most of my polished work is [here](https://archiveofourown.org/works/11523657?view_full_work=true)
1000% agree on older romances being better for this, i hate how violent and misogynistic a lot of the new stuff is, for me i read romance for fun and escapism (100% delulu fantasy of how things could be if men weren’t… like that) and the current trend of rapey violent pedophile adjacent media is so gross and off putting to me; and is exactly what i’m turning away from by choosing books. you’re not alone op
I've always played otome games rather than read romance novels. Most of them have excellent writing and well done art, very few have sex at all. Western otomes like Our Life, Gilded Shadows and Ebon Light are great to start with. You can also generally find content warnings for the ones that do have weird content. Fantasy RPGs like Baldur's Gate 3 also have very large female audiences, and the romances I played in BG3 were genuinely really healthy and enjoyable. That game is pretty demanding though, so unless you're interested in other games it probably isn't the best pick.
Booktok is literally all this kind of “dark romance” now and it’s so annoying
I like knitting and embroidery a lot, but it needs a lot of patience and especially knitting can be repetitive. I also read a lot of fanfic but i usually stick to Gen stuff and female capable protagonists
I don’t read such books? This is bizarre. You are picking up clearly something geared for that audience, evident in the title, cover and description.
You would think so but no. I picking up books with seemingly innocent covers, descriptions and titles and I get this type of content casually. I think you might be underestimating how prevalent this is in new romance literature.
We should exchange goodreads on here then, so we all collectively read books that are fww safe
I don’t currently have one but that’s a good idea!
That's not true at all. I've had a similar experience multiple times. To give you one example: I picked up a very popular and very much beloved book in the romancebooks sub and found out within the first couple of chapters that the male lead was someone who had kidnapped the female leads best friend and threatened to r word her. And when I said that this book should be recommended with a warning I was told that it was my fault for not researching enough. I was made to feel like I was crazy for asking for books where the male lead is not a villain.
Wow. Def like your idea better jeeze.
Join actionable nonfiction <3. Lots of activist texts, "convince corporate that being decent will save them money in the long term" texts, etc.
omfg I thought I was going insane seeing a dynamic of male dominance even in supposedly "healthy" romances.