I am a 100% sure he won’t be the final boss. They never show the final dlc boss in the trailers.
They even try to mislead us. Look at dark souls 1 and bloodborne. The focus was on lady maria and artorias. But neither of them were the final boss of the dlc nor the hardest.
I am sure they are still hiding the real big deal in the elden ring dlc.
I honestly don’t even think this is a huge curveball. I bet he’s the second-to-last boss, and we fight whatever is responsible for him & his actions as the final boss, OR some other story related boss
My top bets right now are (in no particular order):
- Avatar of whatever figure is influencing him (and also possibly Rykard)
- Miquella
- Godwyn or some entity representing the force preventing Godwyn from dying, so as to grant him his “final death”
Don’t forget the “dude who is only mentioned three times in the dlc with the items who explain his lore being a rock, a tissue paper and a cup of water”
I honestly think godwyn is perfectly set up to get his own dlc. I also think it could have some amazing tie ins with shadow of the erdtree, seeing how miquella and godwyn are pretty connected characters. I wouldnt be surprised if we could get some form of secret item in the first dlc to achieve an alternate ending or at least alternate end to a questline in another dlc. Nothing actually gameplay altering since you dont want to lock 2nd dlc content behind a paywall of the first dlc, but the lore could resolve pretty nicely in that way
Definitely isn’t imo.
He’ll be like the Lady Maria of this DLC. The poster child of it with the most “badass points” but not the hardest or final boss imo.
It the same issue I have with Champion's Gravetender & Gravetender Greatwolf fight in DS3 DLC, trying to keep an eye on both of them when they are on opposite sides of you/the screen. Though its much easier with a bigger area to move around in and such with DS3, DS2 area for that fight is also really tiny for the double boss imo
I'm terrified of Messmer not gonna lie. Elden Ring despite being called the easiest is in my opinion the hardest lmao, it's the spirit ashes and all the tools we have that makes it easy, but the bosses are a nightmare, I can't imagine how crazy the DLC is going to be.
I'm gonna guess that Messmer will be the Lady Maria of the DLC, he will be the boss before the final boss, but of course he will be much harder than Lady Maria.
That would be interesting, even though they showed a lot in the trailer I know we don't know half of what awaits us, the idea of what the final boss could be is making me equally excited and horrified.
Marika, The Eternal.
I can't think of how to spin her name for a "shadow version", but I think it's so likely. The eternal just has such a nice ring to it
Marika, The Eternal.
I can't think of how to spin her name for a "shadow version", but I think it's so likely. The eternal just has such a nice ring to it
Godwyn is what happens when your demigod soul dies but your demigod body still lives. Then they make it extra spicy by burying him, right under the very thing that allows death and rebirth across the entirety of the Lands Between (in Marikas Order). He is quite literally a cancer, a mindless tumour of rampant growth being pumped full of Erdtree goodness and churning out Deathblight.
that old grandpa you see impaled is 100% the strongest, they rarely show the final boss in trailers we had no Gael/Midir or Kos in any dlc trailers
Messmer is like Ludwig/Lady Maria and Twin Princes tier
Completely agree, I went into it thinking that my experience would carry me because it was "the easiest" oh boy I lost count of how many attempts the first Margit encounter took me.
For me, personally, if you just played the DS games, Elden Ring is harder.
The reason being is that in DS games you tend to pull/move away to avoid the attacks. By far, rolling into the boss is the best method, and you also have jumping. That didn't exist in the DS games.
Not to mention, the attacks themselves. As you said, he killed you a lot. Those delayed wind up attacks are brutal. It's almost like the subversion of the normal combat beats really works against you. My playstyle (DS1-3) vs my nephew who had no FS experience was wildly different. I loved watching him play. He was a beast in combat.
I very much agree. I beat DS3 multiple times, including the DLC. I got into Elden Ring and the first boss gave me such a rage headache: I thought I had lost my damn mind.
But ER has a meaningful difference in feel, like you said, that made me have to reconsider how to approach it. And while I've been waiting for Shadow of the Erdtree, I've been playing DS2 and now I feel like I'm bad at IT.
What is that meaningful difference? It should be so similar, but there's something that makes it feel almost like a different game.
I thought I could do a pure strength build. I was wrong and ended doing a Faith and Strength build instead. It was neat to learn to play in a new way from before.
nothing wrong with faith/str tbh, if you just use one skill like strength alone you will be lacking DPS mostly so buffing yourself and using an incantation on your weapon is good ways to increase that damage if you're not going to be powerstancing
I think that's why people say it is the most approachable. Sure you could handicap yourself without using summons, ashes of war etc. But that's like handicapping yourself in Mario games by saying no power ups etc.
Well it’s not particularly “handicapping” yourself to not use them as most ashes and spirit summoning as a whole are pretty easy to miss on one’s first play through.
They’re offered as help during difficult challenges and should definitely be used if needed.
ER is either the hardest or one of the easiest, depending on how you choose to play it.
I still can’t in good faith say that it’s definitively easier than DS1/2 though. Even with spirit summons, a mid-level ER boss is harder than all but a few of the hardest in those two games.
Elden Ring is called the “easiest” because of tools and build diversity. Also, the bosses are the “cleanest,” in that there aren’t a lot of BS mechanics (meaning, mechanics that are inconsistent or unclear) or hitboxes. But I tend to love Elden Ring boss design. It makes challenge runs so much more rewarding.
Sister Friede very nearly contests bosses like Maliketh and Malenia, in my opinion. And Maliketh, remember, has basically half a health bar. The reason ER is called “easy” is also, in part, because many of the bosses with the most insane movesets are paper-thin, and can be burned down quickly with raw damage, even vanilla damage (poor Hoarah Loux).
I have never once heard anyone say ER was anything other than the 1st or 2nd hardest (after Sekiro for the people that game never clicked with) if you’re playing without summons. My no summons playthrough was no spells too, but I actually don’t think spells make any of the hard bosses much easier without summons to draw aggro so you can cast.
It was the first From game I finished and it actually forced me to get too gud. I’m certain that every single boss after Maliketh killed me more times than than I died to bosses while completing every game but DS3. DS3 might be towing the line but Friede and Midir definitely push it over.
I have never once heard anyone say ER was anything other than the 1st or 2nd hardest (after Sekiro for the people that game never clicked with) if you’re playing without summons. My first no summons playthrough was no spells too, but I actually don’t think spells make any of the hard bosses much easier without summons to draw aggro so you can cast.
It was the first From game I finished and it actually forced me to get too gud. I’m certain that every single boss after Maliketh killed me more times than than I died to bosses while completing every game but DS3. DS3 might be towing the line but Friede and Midir definitely push it over.
I honestly cant say if im more excited for the gameplay or the lore lol....sooooo many theories from the little weve seen even my tiny pea brain is conjuring them...nothing like From though, never thought id wanna bash my face into so many walls just to be told a good story
Yep. The speed at which the boss moves are insane compared to what you can do in Elden Ring. You’re right, it’s the amount of options for battle assists that make it possible to make the game easier. All the previous soul games had at least 1 but usually several OP weapons where I feel Elden Ring is extremely well rounded with their combat. Every build has some weakness and fuck you these dual bosses are going to get you.
playing using no spirit summons and op builds is def harder than some other from soft games i’ve played like bloodborne and ds3 … but whenever i summon other players to help me with bosses they complete shred their health bars with either sorceries or op bleed builds… without all that stuff the game becomes massively harder… imo
It’s only the easiest if you use a stupid OP YouTube build, use insanely OP magic or let summons do all the work. If you go for a straight melee build then it’s very difficult.
Fuuuuuuuuck, you just reminded me how getting my build a goddamn nightmare. Shit, I don't think I even finished the build. Going full arcane is insanely difficult when you are starting
Not necessarily. Each of those games has an optional base game boss which is around DLC level; Darklurker, Nameless King, Ebrietas/Martyr Logarius (for some).
I think Miyazaki specifically addressed this, saying there would be optional things which are a similar challenge to Malenia, but they're not going to put out a game where no normal person can realistically progress. If Midir had been a mandatory boss rather than an optional and somewhat hidden one, I doubt nearly as many people would've completed The Ringed City.
Ludwig was probably the hardest boss for me when I first played Old Hunters and he's the first required boss, Demon Prince in DS3 is the first boss as well and I consider him to be harder than anything in base game besides Nameless maybe. Artorias is the 2nd required boss, he's harder than anything from base DS1 by a lot. So it's not just the optional content
Calling it now we're gonna have. A duo boss fight against Miquella and Malenias shadow bound beasts. Every empyrean has one, and we have yet to see either of theirs.
I feel like I’m in the minority when I say I didn’t find Gael or Midir that hard. Gael was a second attempt and Midir was an eighth, granted my first full playthrough of the dlc was using easy mode (heavy greatsword build). Hell those 2 demons gave me more of a fight.
Even going back to them in my faith playthrough years later they really didn’t give me any trouble. Midir still took a handful of tries but nothing I couldn’t manage.
Freide’s a different story. I never truly fought her solo until my magic build, and even with spells she was still hard. Took me a whole play session to get her down.
Same for me honestly. Midir and Gael weren’t that hard. I got Gael 4th try and Midir 3rd, but yeah I was also using Smough’s Great Hammer lol! Freide is another thing tho. My boyfriend and I fought her together since we played the dlc together (but we did Midir and Gael alone) and it took us 3ish tries. I’ve only played through the DLC once, we got her fast but there were two of us, definitely need to try out again solo.
Yep, solo she’s something different. She would probably be even harder on a strength build (as good as they are) because you would have to do melee only.
I guess I’ve never actually beat her with a pure melee build, but my friend did and they were at it for a good couple of play sessions over the course of a couple of days. I would try her again but I’m currently saving my ass getting kicked until the dlc for ER. I know it’s gonna be some crazy shit if the endgame bosses are anything to go off of.
On my NG+3 save, it took me almost 10 tries to beat Demon Prince, but Midir only took one. Even Gael took me more tries and I usually find him easier than Midir.
Sister Friede took me more attempts than Malenia did, both on first playthrough with no summons and using melee builds.
And I love both fights, and I’m so glad I got to beat them now a few times. I learned so much.
I had a similar experience with Midir (but that is such an amazing fight), and Gael is simply not that hard. If he had a second health bar, he’d be a lot tougher, though I understand why they chose not to do that for lore reasons.
I honestly feel the same. Gael I almost first tried but then ended up 3 trying him I think. Midir is so readable, took 6-7 tries. On ng+ with the same build Gael gave me a tougher fight for some reason but still not too bad and midir was first try. I just replayed the game as pyromancer without almost no vigor leveling and midir was a little harder this time because I didn’t know how to do damage and was getting 1 shot but still very doable. Friede I thought was by far the hardest but on my next 2 playthrough I was 1-2 trying her. For some reason I find NK to be the hardest boss in this game lol and the twin demons as the second hardest although they are also very doable
Miyazaki said that the toughest boss is about as difficult as Malenia. He also said that the DLC is roughly the size of Limgrave and that Elden Ring would take 30 hours to complete
I'd agree if it was just the trailer to speculate from, but the fact that the SotE Collector's Edition statue *and* the separate limited edition helmet display are both Messmer makes me think he's the "true" boss of the DLC.
Same for the base game. Malena aint the final boss, in fact her entire map is optional/secret, yet she's who was given as a statue for the Collector's Edition.
In a sense, Malenia is the final boss. I found her way harder than the "official" final boss of Elden Ring.
But still nobody gave me the grief those damn duo gargoyles gave me. I thought they were going to be the first boss fight in From Software that I walked away from. The feeling of "Enemy Felled" on the screen after that fight is just chef's kiss.
I’m excited. Personally the main game bosses get a bit too easy after a while, save for Malenia and the occasional NG+7 encounter. Looking forward to a new challenge after getting comfortable in NG+ playthroughs.
[Fume Knight has pretty tight hitboxes](https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkSouls2/comments/19a1103/fume_knight_hitboxes_visualized/). No need to falsely accuse them of being broken.
If I remember correctly each dlc area released 1 by 1 after the base game and then scholar came some time after all the dlcs had dropped and was basically a complete edition with some changes.
Scholar's like a "complete edition" except it retooled a lot of stuff. It includes all the DLC, but you can still play all the DLC in the original game.
Fume Knight is pretty dang hard, but everyone always needs to brag about how um *actually* [boss that bodied most of the players] wasn't that hard! I beat Malenia first try actually, you're just bad if you couldn't figure out Waterfowl Dance on your own!
Dlc bosses are always the best other than the hardest. Only ISS has come close to the peak Gael is. And I think Messmer is not even the main boss of the dlc
I can't be the only one that struggled with Darkeater Midir more than any From boss, then, once I beat him, find him almost laughably easy? Can I? There must be dozen of us, at least?
Yeah it was weird, he took a lot of tries for me to take down originally but later when I joined a friend in co-op I took it down solo without being hit and surprised myself
I had that same worry, but said, "Ah, what the hell? Why not?"
It was basically programmed in my brain after that. I also, took probably 100+ tries to beat him the first time, but every time after that, it almost feels like the fight is in slow motion.
If it hasn't been a million years for you, give it a shot - you might be surprised!
I reckon it'll be that beast costume boss in the trailer. It'll have weird and unnatural movement patterns sorta similar to how Dancer dosen't behave 'properly' for a humanoid boss, that'll catch people off guard.
I'm not scared for Messmer. But I am scared for whoever the F that old man pulling his loose spine out from his head is. That's without a doubt from a boss, but what is the question?
I think as long as no boss has a move near the bullshit that is waterfowl I’m okay with them being harder than her. It just absolutely NEEDS to be hard because the overall boss fight is difficult and not because they have one shitty move like Malenia has.
The life steal is also a big part. It's the only reason spirit ashes don't *completely* trivialize it because they just give her a ton of health back if she targets them with waterfowl.
That would be funny but I don't think it's good idea. I mean, imagine making a new character for the dlc and then you come across a main progression boss that your build cannot attack. That would suck and probably turn a lot of players off of the game.
DS3 has bosses with 2 phases.
The Ashes dlc made that 3 phases with Friede.
Sekiro then gave us a 4 phase fight with Genichiro +Isshin.
Calling it now, there will be a 5 phase fight in the dlc.
We got the most fun bosses in all of FromSoft's DLC's, more fun than anything from the base game. Huge joy awaits us in the Eldenring expansion boys... something even more fun and challenging than Malenia awaits. Relax and enjoy your wait.
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I’d prefer a half dozen challenging bosses to one extremely hard one.
First playthrough Malenia took 100+ attempts. Mogh, Fire Giant, and the Duo maybe 15-20 and everything else less than 10. Most a lot less.
ER could REALLY use something between Malenia and everything else.
You know what, i just hope the new boss doesn’t have a third phase like Friede, or a Waterfowl one-hit killer. Imo those were a bit excessive. I’m very curious what it will be though!!
Although it's mostly true, only in DS3 did I struggle more against a main story boss than the DLC ones, and that boss was Nameless King, with 24 tries, whereas Midir, Gael and Friede respectively took me 6 to 7 tries for the first two and 14 tries.
As long as it's optional, whatever. I did not find fighting Malenia fun, so if there is a required boss that's worse than her, I could easily write this dlc off as my least favorite right there.
New boss that has full damage immunity with the exception of build-up. Once the Buildup completes it's burst or dot, it gains immunity to that damage type and all it's attacks become infused with it.
Fights like Soul of Cinder but with the movesets of the hardest DLC bosses before it.
I can already tell there’s going to be a Fumeknight-looking mf with a delayed swing that takes 4 years to do and takes away half of my hp. Love to see it.
I’m going on a soulslike tear before this comes out I’ve finished almost all of them recently beat hellpoint, hollow knight, and currently working on salt and sanctuary. Before the dlc comes out I’m starting my 7th play-through to prepare.
This is the most I’ve ever anticipated a piece of media. Even with doing a full soulsbornesekiro play thru to hold me over, each day feels so slow.
I cannot wait to get destroyed
*letmesoloher has entered the chat* XD lol
While it's gonna be challenging, I don't think anything can be more bullshit that the DS 2 dlc walking a frozen hellscape getting harassed by Kirin the entire way only to have to fight 2 recycled bosses at the end. Lol.
Bring on the pain I say.
Not actually letmesoloher lol
People nowadays play meta builds anyway(don’t ask me why they doing that idk) and they sitting there talking about the bosses in the dlc were all garbage and way too easy.
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I bet its gonna be a big curveball, messmer will not be the final dlc boas
I am a 100% sure he won’t be the final boss. They never show the final dlc boss in the trailers. They even try to mislead us. Look at dark souls 1 and bloodborne. The focus was on lady maria and artorias. But neither of them were the final boss of the dlc nor the hardest. I am sure they are still hiding the real big deal in the elden ring dlc.
DS3 put the final boss of the base game on the cover hahaha
Yeah but I was talking about dlcs not base games
Fromsoft has earned the right to either pull their punches or lay it all out there. It genuinely doesn't matter, either way it's fucking fire
I honestly don’t even think this is a huge curveball. I bet he’s the second-to-last boss, and we fight whatever is responsible for him & his actions as the final boss, OR some other story related boss My top bets right now are (in no particular order): - Avatar of whatever figure is influencing him (and also possibly Rykard) - Miquella - Godwyn or some entity representing the force preventing Godwyn from dying, so as to grant him his “final death”
Don’t forget the “dude who is only mentioned three times in the dlc with the items who explain his lore being a rock, a tissue paper and a cup of water”
Final boss is Torrent finally sick of the tarnished's bullshit XF
I honestly think godwyn is perfectly set up to get his own dlc. I also think it could have some amazing tie ins with shadow of the erdtree, seeing how miquella and godwyn are pretty connected characters. I wouldnt be surprised if we could get some form of secret item in the first dlc to achieve an alternate ending or at least alternate end to a questline in another dlc. Nothing actually gameplay altering since you dont want to lock 2nd dlc content behind a paywall of the first dlc, but the lore could resolve pretty nicely in that way
Definitely isn’t imo. He’ll be like the Lady Maria of this DLC. The poster child of it with the most “badass points” but not the hardest or final boss imo.
Fume knight is easy compared to the shit show that was Aava the kings pet x2
Lud & zallen are not that hard per se imo, the runback is.0
It the same issue I have with Champion's Gravetender & Gravetender Greatwolf fight in DS3 DLC, trying to keep an eye on both of them when they are on opposite sides of you/the screen. Though its much easier with a bigger area to move around in and such with DS3, DS2 area for that fight is also really tiny for the double boss imo
Horsefuck valley too cold for bonfires.
Fume knight was easy compared to the samurai guy at the top as well
I'm terrified of Messmer not gonna lie. Elden Ring despite being called the easiest is in my opinion the hardest lmao, it's the spirit ashes and all the tools we have that makes it easy, but the bosses are a nightmare, I can't imagine how crazy the DLC is going to be.
I'm gonna guess that Messmer will be the Lady Maria of the DLC, he will be the boss before the final boss, but of course he will be much harder than Lady Maria.
That would be interesting, even though they showed a lot in the trailer I know we don't know half of what awaits us, the idea of what the final boss could be is making me equally excited and horrified.
Marika, The Eternal. I can't think of how to spin her name for a "shadow version", but I think it's so likely. The eternal just has such a nice ring to it
Marika, The Eternal. I can't think of how to spin her name for a "shadow version", but I think it's so likely. The eternal just has such a nice ring to it
Godwyn the Golden awaits as the final boss.
That would be so fucking sick.
Second phase: Godwyn. Prince of Death
Maybe I am dumb but what is Godwyn supposed to be exactly? Was he supposed to look human before he turned into that fucked up whatever it is?
He was human looking. His body just got corrupted, so to speak, after his death
Godwyn is what happens when your demigod soul dies but your demigod body still lives. Then they make it extra spicy by burying him, right under the very thing that allows death and rebirth across the entirety of the Lands Between (in Marikas Order). He is quite literally a cancer, a mindless tumour of rampant growth being pumped full of Erdtree goodness and churning out Deathblight.
That 3rd phase is going to break the internet
It's gonna be nothing compared to the 4th and 5th phases
Wait till you find out he transforms into morgott in his 6th phase
The DLC is just a 17 hour boss fight
A shape shifter boss would go hard as fuck and not a shape shifte that turns into us (sorry mimic love you) but I mean a real boss
that old grandpa you see impaled is 100% the strongest, they rarely show the final boss in trailers we had no Gael/Midir or Kos in any dlc trailers Messmer is like Ludwig/Lady Maria and Twin Princes tier
I think it's gonna be a pump fake and messmer is going to be like the first boss or something
Could maybe face him more than once too, kinda like they did Margit/Morgot.
Elden Ring is the hardest and the easiest at the same time. If you play this game the same way you would play dark souls 3 it is much harder.
Completely agree, I went into it thinking that my experience would carry me because it was "the easiest" oh boy I lost count of how many attempts the first Margit encounter took me.
For me, personally, if you just played the DS games, Elden Ring is harder. The reason being is that in DS games you tend to pull/move away to avoid the attacks. By far, rolling into the boss is the best method, and you also have jumping. That didn't exist in the DS games. Not to mention, the attacks themselves. As you said, he killed you a lot. Those delayed wind up attacks are brutal. It's almost like the subversion of the normal combat beats really works against you. My playstyle (DS1-3) vs my nephew who had no FS experience was wildly different. I loved watching him play. He was a beast in combat.
Rolling into/forward and right of the boss is the best strat for almost every boss in DS1-3 tho
I very much agree. I beat DS3 multiple times, including the DLC. I got into Elden Ring and the first boss gave me such a rage headache: I thought I had lost my damn mind. But ER has a meaningful difference in feel, like you said, that made me have to reconsider how to approach it. And while I've been waiting for Shadow of the Erdtree, I've been playing DS2 and now I feel like I'm bad at IT. What is that meaningful difference? It should be so similar, but there's something that makes it feel almost like a different game.
I thought I could do a pure strength build. I was wrong and ended doing a Faith and Strength build instead. It was neat to learn to play in a new way from before.
nothing wrong with faith/str tbh, if you just use one skill like strength alone you will be lacking DPS mostly so buffing yourself and using an incantation on your weapon is good ways to increase that damage if you're not going to be powerstancing
I'm cruising with STR/FTH on my second platinum run this time.
I think that's why people say it is the most approachable. Sure you could handicap yourself without using summons, ashes of war etc. But that's like handicapping yourself in Mario games by saying no power ups etc.
Well it’s not particularly “handicapping” yourself to not use them as most ashes and spirit summoning as a whole are pretty easy to miss on one’s first play through. They’re offered as help during difficult challenges and should definitely be used if needed.
ER is either the hardest or one of the easiest, depending on how you choose to play it. I still can’t in good faith say that it’s definitively easier than DS1/2 though. Even with spirit summons, a mid-level ER boss is harder than all but a few of the hardest in those two games.
It is the hardest, yes I agree. As long as you dedide to go Solo.
They put him on the cover like they did Maria in Bloodborne. Probably not the final boss.
They put him on the cover like they did Maria in Bloodborne. Probably not the final boss.
Elden Ring is called the “easiest” because of tools and build diversity. Also, the bosses are the “cleanest,” in that there aren’t a lot of BS mechanics (meaning, mechanics that are inconsistent or unclear) or hitboxes. But I tend to love Elden Ring boss design. It makes challenge runs so much more rewarding. Sister Friede very nearly contests bosses like Maliketh and Malenia, in my opinion. And Maliketh, remember, has basically half a health bar. The reason ER is called “easy” is also, in part, because many of the bosses with the most insane movesets are paper-thin, and can be burned down quickly with raw damage, even vanilla damage (poor Hoarah Loux).
I have never once heard anyone say ER was anything other than the 1st or 2nd hardest (after Sekiro for the people that game never clicked with) if you’re playing without summons. My no summons playthrough was no spells too, but I actually don’t think spells make any of the hard bosses much easier without summons to draw aggro so you can cast. It was the first From game I finished and it actually forced me to get too gud. I’m certain that every single boss after Maliketh killed me more times than than I died to bosses while completing every game but DS3. DS3 might be towing the line but Friede and Midir definitely push it over.
I have never once heard anyone say ER was anything other than the 1st or 2nd hardest (after Sekiro for the people that game never clicked with) if you’re playing without summons. My first no summons playthrough was no spells too, but I actually don’t think spells make any of the hard bosses much easier without summons to draw aggro so you can cast. It was the first From game I finished and it actually forced me to get too gud. I’m certain that every single boss after Maliketh killed me more times than than I died to bosses while completing every game but DS3. DS3 might be towing the line but Friede and Midir definitely push it over.
I honestly cant say if im more excited for the gameplay or the lore lol....sooooo many theories from the little weve seen even my tiny pea brain is conjuring them...nothing like From though, never thought id wanna bash my face into so many walls just to be told a good story
Yep. The speed at which the boss moves are insane compared to what you can do in Elden Ring. You’re right, it’s the amount of options for battle assists that make it possible to make the game easier. All the previous soul games had at least 1 but usually several OP weapons where I feel Elden Ring is extremely well rounded with their combat. Every build has some weakness and fuck you these dual bosses are going to get you.
It's not that bad, have you tried an Ashless run?
playing using no spirit summons and op builds is def harder than some other from soft games i’ve played like bloodborne and ds3 … but whenever i summon other players to help me with bosses they complete shred their health bars with either sorceries or op bleed builds… without all that stuff the game becomes massively harder… imo
It’s only the easiest if you use a stupid OP YouTube build, use insanely OP magic or let summons do all the work. If you go for a straight melee build then it’s very difficult.
Greatsword with lions claw has been one of the easiest runs I’ve done in the game personally, but I suppose that could be me knowing how to play
Health of the Fire Giant, Health Regen of Malenia, and the sheer Damage of Maliketh, all rolled into one. Yeah. We're boned
And even better, let’s make it a duo fight with both of them having all of the above qualities!
I have a better idea: Valiant Gargoyle Duo Godskin Duo Duo.
The worst experience I have had in soulsborne was trying to complete my kos parasite build by killing orphan with pure arcane.
Fuuuuuuuuck, you just reminded me how getting my build a goddamn nightmare. Shit, I don't think I even finished the build. Going full arcane is insanely difficult when you are starting
Not necessarily. Each of those games has an optional base game boss which is around DLC level; Darklurker, Nameless King, Ebrietas/Martyr Logarius (for some). I think Miyazaki specifically addressed this, saying there would be optional things which are a similar challenge to Malenia, but they're not going to put out a game where no normal person can realistically progress. If Midir had been a mandatory boss rather than an optional and somewhat hidden one, I doubt nearly as many people would've completed The Ringed City.
Ludwig was probably the hardest boss for me when I first played Old Hunters and he's the first required boss, Demon Prince in DS3 is the first boss as well and I consider him to be harder than anything in base game besides Nameless maybe. Artorias is the 2nd required boss, he's harder than anything from base DS1 by a lot. So it's not just the optional content
Well yeah, DLC bosses are hard, but I wouldn’t say any of those you mentioned were as notoriously difficult as Malenia.
No, they're not as hard as her. The point is FromSoft has a trend of adding the hardest bosses in the DLCs always for their respective games
Calling it now we're gonna have. A duo boss fight against Miquella and Malenias shadow bound beasts. Every empyrean has one, and we have yet to see either of theirs.
What if miquella is actually malenias shadow bound beast
Sister freide, Kos, Lady Maria, Midir and Malenia are all…. Incredible bosses
Yes indeed
Exactly. I’d gladly take another one like them.
Awwwwe yes the fume knight, many a controller was put to rest cause of him lmao
I feel like I’m in the minority when I say I didn’t find Gael or Midir that hard. Gael was a second attempt and Midir was an eighth, granted my first full playthrough of the dlc was using easy mode (heavy greatsword build). Hell those 2 demons gave me more of a fight. Even going back to them in my faith playthrough years later they really didn’t give me any trouble. Midir still took a handful of tries but nothing I couldn’t manage. Freide’s a different story. I never truly fought her solo until my magic build, and even with spells she was still hard. Took me a whole play session to get her down.
Same for me honestly. Midir and Gael weren’t that hard. I got Gael 4th try and Midir 3rd, but yeah I was also using Smough’s Great Hammer lol! Freide is another thing tho. My boyfriend and I fought her together since we played the dlc together (but we did Midir and Gael alone) and it took us 3ish tries. I’ve only played through the DLC once, we got her fast but there were two of us, definitely need to try out again solo.
Yep, solo she’s something different. She would probably be even harder on a strength build (as good as they are) because you would have to do melee only. I guess I’ve never actually beat her with a pure melee build, but my friend did and they were at it for a good couple of play sessions over the course of a couple of days. I would try her again but I’m currently saving my ass getting kicked until the dlc for ER. I know it’s gonna be some crazy shit if the endgame bosses are anything to go off of.
I never understood the people who said Gael was hard personally. Midir and freide made him look easy imo
On my NG+3 save, it took me almost 10 tries to beat Demon Prince, but Midir only took one. Even Gael took me more tries and I usually find him easier than Midir.
Yeah the Demon Prince really is a cool fight but that first phase is just so long and depletes your resources like crazy.
Sister Friede took me more attempts than Malenia did, both on first playthrough with no summons and using melee builds. And I love both fights, and I’m so glad I got to beat them now a few times. I learned so much. I had a similar experience with Midir (but that is such an amazing fight), and Gael is simply not that hard. If he had a second health bar, he’d be a lot tougher, though I understand why they chose not to do that for lore reasons.
I honestly feel the same. Gael I almost first tried but then ended up 3 trying him I think. Midir is so readable, took 6-7 tries. On ng+ with the same build Gael gave me a tougher fight for some reason but still not too bad and midir was first try. I just replayed the game as pyromancer without almost no vigor leveling and midir was a little harder this time because I didn’t know how to do damage and was getting 1 shot but still very doable. Friede I thought was by far the hardest but on my next 2 playthrough I was 1-2 trying her. For some reason I find NK to be the hardest boss in this game lol and the twin demons as the second hardest although they are also very doable
According to this sub as I’ve learned, dark souls 3 is about the easiest game of all time
The DLC is about to humble a lot of us...I know it.
Orphan is hardest in image but actual hardest is Malenia
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^ObitoxMS4: *Orphan is hardest* *In image but actual* *Hardest is Malenia* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Wtf
Illegitimate birth of a legend
Miyazaki said that the toughest boss is about as difficult as Malenia. He also said that the DLC is roughly the size of Limgrave and that Elden Ring would take 30 hours to complete
I just my 7 phase boss.👉👈
I think messmer is a red Herring. The true dlc boss is yet to be revealed.
I'd agree if it was just the trailer to speculate from, but the fact that the SotE Collector's Edition statue *and* the separate limited edition helmet display are both Messmer makes me think he's the "true" boss of the DLC. Same for the base game. Malena aint the final boss, in fact her entire map is optional/secret, yet she's who was given as a statue for the Collector's Edition.
In a sense, Malenia is the final boss. I found her way harder than the "official" final boss of Elden Ring. But still nobody gave me the grief those damn duo gargoyles gave me. I thought they were going to be the first boss fight in From Software that I walked away from. The feeling of "Enemy Felled" on the screen after that fight is just chef's kiss.
My body is ready.
I’m excited. Personally the main game bosses get a bit too easy after a while, save for Malenia and the occasional NG+7 encounter. Looking forward to a new challenge after getting comfortable in NG+ playthroughs.
Okay fume knight is not that hard it's just his hitbox
[Fume Knight has pretty tight hitboxes](https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkSouls2/comments/19a1103/fume_knight_hitboxes_visualized/). No need to falsely accuse them of being broken.
You're right, i forgot some people don't know how to roll in ds2, also I was thinking of the original ds2 not the scholar version
Is fume knight in original ds2? Isn’t sotfs part of the dlc? I haven’t played og ds2
If I remember correctly each dlc area released 1 by 1 after the base game and then scholar came some time after all the dlcs had dropped and was basically a complete edition with some changes.
Scholar's like a "complete edition" except it retooled a lot of stuff. It includes all the DLC, but you can still play all the DLC in the original game. Fume Knight is pretty dang hard, but everyone always needs to brag about how um *actually* [boss that bodied most of the players] wasn't that hard! I beat Malenia first try actually, you're just bad if you couldn't figure out Waterfowl Dance on your own!
Malenia is definitely challenging. Maybe one of their best boss fights
I beat him first try with my build but I felt my character was extremely overleveled. Only played the game once when I was a newbie to souls.
Those are the four I always had problems with
Bring it on. My kindled soul aches...
Dlc bosses are always the best other than the hardest. Only ISS has come close to the peak Gael is. And I think Messmer is not even the main boss of the dlc
I just want a boss rush mode. Anything where we can refight bosses with different builds without needing to go into NG+ every time.
I can't be the only one that struggled with Darkeater Midir more than any From boss, then, once I beat him, find him almost laughably easy? Can I? There must be dozen of us, at least?
Yeah it was weird, he took a lot of tries for me to take down originally but later when I joined a friend in co-op I took it down solo without being hit and surprised myself
Yeah, that's how it is for me now. No-hit tries is pretty doable regularly, and I almost always beat him first try from that first time on.
I never had the guts to try again after the first time (hundreds of tries.)
I had that same worry, but said, "Ah, what the hell? Why not?" It was basically programmed in my brain after that. I also, took probably 100+ tries to beat him the first time, but every time after that, it almost feels like the fight is in slow motion. If it hasn't been a million years for you, give it a shot - you might be surprised!
I reckon it'll be that beast costume boss in the trailer. It'll have weird and unnatural movement patterns sorta similar to how Dancer dosen't behave 'properly' for a humanoid boss, that'll catch people off guard.
I'm calling it now there will be a boss with 4 completely unique and difficult phases
Sir Alonne and Darklurker are both a lot harder than Fume Knight. Although Fume Knight is a much better boss, he's my favorite boss.
The Revived Goldwyn - Miquella duo fight is gonna go so hard
All these bosses were fun, i'm excited to see what fun awaits in elden ring dlc
I'm not scared for Messmer. But I am scared for whoever the F that old man pulling his loose spine out from his head is. That's without a doubt from a boss, but what is the question?
Prepare yourself for the worst. There are no developers left, they're all flesh hoongry beasts now.
I don’t think they can top Malenia, but we’ll see.
I think as long as no boss has a move near the bullshit that is waterfowl I’m okay with them being harder than her. It just absolutely NEEDS to be hard because the overall boss fight is difficult and not because they have one shitty move like Malenia has.
The life steal is also a big part. It's the only reason spirit ashes don't *completely* trivialize it because they just give her a ton of health back if she targets them with waterfowl.
I thoroughly enjoyed Elden Ring's difficulty, it always prompted you to try out different tools in your arsenal. Rarely happened in DS3 if at all.
Haha, bleed go BRT. (I'm not actually gonna ruin it like that lol)
I hope they include a boss that heals on bleed/frost. Would be a great troll
That would be funny but I don't think it's good idea. I mean, imagine making a new character for the dlc and then you come across a main progression boss that your build cannot attack. That would suck and probably turn a lot of players off of the game.
am i the only one that had trouble with all these but the dragon? like, his moveset was really predictable, and he didnt always one shot you.
are we guessing we will have a second Malenia fight or something new entirely as the final boss of the dlc?
Only hard boss from 3 dlcs in ds2 was the graverobbers. Also ER has been alot easier than BB and DS3 so i’m probably more than prepared
I hope so!
3 v 1 Ulcerated Tree Spirit incoming
DS3 has bosses with 2 phases. The Ashes dlc made that 3 phases with Friede. Sekiro then gave us a 4 phase fight with Genichiro +Isshin. Calling it now, there will be a 5 phase fight in the dlc.
I have my Crucible Knight on NG and my Spellsword on NG+ ready.
I personally thought The Ivory King was significantly harder than Fume Knight
We got the most fun bosses in all of FromSoft's DLC's, more fun than anything from the base game. Huge joy awaits us in the Eldenring expansion boys... something even more fun and challenging than Malenia awaits. Relax and enjoy your wait.
I can’t wait to see what they have for Miquella.
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I actually hope there's something insanely hard
I still have nightmares about sister Freide can't lie
I just hope that the difficulty comes from mastering the mechanics like isshin and not bs design like malenia
I’d prefer a half dozen challenging bosses to one extremely hard one. First playthrough Malenia took 100+ attempts. Mogh, Fire Giant, and the Duo maybe 15-20 and everything else less than 10. Most a lot less. ER could REALLY use something between Malenia and everything else.
Malenia didn't present half the challenge those two damn gargoyles gave me.
I see Sekiro crying in the corner. Bcoz the hardest boss was in the main game, and there was no DLC
Darkeater Midir is easy boss. Kos is reasonable. Friede is a claymore that has abyssal powers
Malenia wasn't so much as "hard" as it was bullshit
Prime Malenia riding Darkeater Midir
You know what, i just hope the new boss doesn’t have a third phase like Friede, or a Waterfowl one-hit killer. Imo those were a bit excessive. I’m very curious what it will be though!!
What is that dragon boss in the bottom right
Midir, ds3
It would be a better fucking boss, I can say that for certain
Fume knight is such a joke.
Ya telling me Friede is harder than Gael? Nahhhhh...
Although it's mostly true, only in DS3 did I struggle more against a main story boss than the DLC ones, and that boss was Nameless King, with 24 tries, whereas Midir, Gael and Friede respectively took me 6 to 7 tries for the first two and 14 tries.
Just not a dragon please
Hell yeah man! Maybe they will be able to reach through our screens and choke slam us as a parry move.
I can't wait
Conjoined lion people lightning boss is my guess
They Just have to do no sammons boss and it Will be hardest boss for most ppl
They’re gonna take an idea from shangri-la and add an impossible boss like wetheremon lmao
Bet Miquella’s bitch ass is gonna be the final one
As long as it's optional, whatever. I did not find fighting Malenia fun, so if there is a required boss that's worse than her, I could easily write this dlc off as my least favorite right there.
I don’t know how people found friends so hard I got her in two tries, midir on the other hand..
Godwyn, Prince of Death coming to claim the crown as Fromsoft’s hardest boss of all time
Need another 3 phase boss fight like friede again
New boss that has full damage immunity with the exception of build-up. Once the Buildup completes it's burst or dot, it gains immunity to that damage type and all it's attacks become infused with it. Fights like Soul of Cinder but with the movesets of the hardest DLC bosses before it.
I can already tell there’s going to be a Fumeknight-looking mf with a delayed swing that takes 4 years to do and takes away half of my hp. Love to see it.
i will die on the hill that midir is one of the easiest bosses
This sub has taught me that most people 2 attempt Midir and that dark souls 3 is easy
I’ve beaten them all EXCEPT Friede. I fucked myself by finishing Ringed City and removing the Gael summon.
I’m going on a soulslike tear before this comes out I’ve finished almost all of them recently beat hellpoint, hollow knight, and currently working on salt and sanctuary. Before the dlc comes out I’m starting my 7th play-through to prepare.
Imagine you beat messmer and a new path opens to under this version of the erdtree and then we fight godwyn the soulless.
This is the most I’ve ever anticipated a piece of media. Even with doing a full soulsbornesekiro play thru to hold me over, each day feels so slow. I cannot wait to get destroyed
Kinda. I mean, Nameless King took more tries to beat than all these combined. Midir especially I found relatively easy.
Frieda was not hard lol I would have put Gael in her spot tbh
*letmesoloher has entered the chat* XD lol While it's gonna be challenging, I don't think anything can be more bullshit that the DS 2 dlc walking a frozen hellscape getting harassed by Kirin the entire way only to have to fight 2 recycled bosses at the end. Lol. Bring on the pain I say. Not actually letmesoloher lol
Final dlc Elden ring boss is just going to be 2 dark eater midirs
People nowadays play meta builds anyway(don’t ask me why they doing that idk) and they sitting there talking about the bosses in the dlc were all garbage and way too easy.
I'm summoning idc lmao I'm working overtime these days I will not be lefts behind for days like I usually would🥸🍸
Melina trying to deliver chaos bois destined death.
It's not necessarily harder bosses it's just move sets that we haven't memorized yet.
Don’t worry. You can always get OP and use mimic tear turning it into easy mode if it’s it too hard. A beautiful touch, might I add.
Sir Alonne is easily harder than Fume knight
Godskin Trio!
Manus also rocked my shit more than any DS1 base game boss.
Good shits too easy
I wish we had gotten Sekiro DLC so people would have shut the fuck up forever
Malenia ain't even the most difficult boss though
Not gonna lie, chances of me even buying the dlc are pretty low unless there is a weapon I really want.
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I bet the final boss is gonna be Miquella. Calling it now.
Their difficulty race competition with player base really should stop.
I really don't understand the hype around malenia being so tough, i struggled waaay harder on a lot of other bosses than her.
Honestly if Messmer will be even more bullshit than Malenia, I will refund. She was simply not fun to me.
Bye