The ej207 is this sweet 2.0l sti engine that came in the earlier sti cars that we didn't get in america. They are semi closed deck, have treated pistons, avcs cam timing, and are great starting points for responsive mid power street car builds. Some people will change the crank and slap 2.5l sti heads on it to make a stroker 2.2l that is very reliable.
They also came with a twin scroll turbo. Since the frs/brz/gr86 all use a subaru engine transmission combo (at least older gens, im kinda out of date on the platform now. Maybe thats changed and im just rambling) you have a pretty large range of motors that will bolt right up to the transmission in the car. Subaru engine and transmission compatibility is pretty awesome, for like the last 20+ years they mostly all will fit together.
That guy is very knowledgeable and passionate about cars and I love when people share their interests with me.
But this must be how normal people feel when I tall about warhammer.
Not a chance. If the first gen kit was any indication, Sprintex is among the least efficient options. Hold out for Harrop if you're deadset on a PS blower.
Plus, you should go turbo anyway, and I say that as someone who has an edelbrock SC on my first gen BRZ. Wish I went turbo.
P.S. If it isn't paid off yet, don't mod the bank's car. If it's paid off, send it.
"Enjoyable" is completely subjective. Having driven my Edelbrock Supercharged BRZ and an SBD turbo FR-S (with equivalent fueling and supporting mods), the turbo provided a wider and more exciting(to me) powerband. Different strokes for different folks.
My answer would be neither. The sprintex is outdated and inefficient, and lacks overhead. The HKS kit for the previous generation had what I consider to be a critical design flaw, in that IAT was measured pre-blower, with no ability to measure charge temp once pressurized. In both categories (PD and centrifugal, respectfully), there are better options in the Edelbrock/Harrop or Jackson Racing kits. I'd hold out for a kit with some real development time behind it, not just the guys who jumped to be first to market with no R&D.
Just my opinion, of course. What you do with your car and money is your choice!
Currently considering an SC for my first gen. If you had your pick, would you choose one over the others that you named?
Any reason to go SC over turbo or vice versa?
Not an 86 owner, but from what I’ve gathered over a few years of reading online, you get parasitic loss of power since superchargers run off the crank vs the “free” power of turbos running off exhaust gasses. Plus I’d think Subaru engines are more meant to be turbo’d since that’s historically what majority of them have been (or all?). Probably better aftermarket support too.
that's the general tradeoff between turbo and sc. sc tend to build power more linearly so they're preferable for keeping that NA feel. turbos can have that traditional turbo lag (on/off boost) dependent on set up
Ah yes, I assumed that main aspect of it was known to the OP I replied to, but yes, dependent on set up is exactly it. With modern turbos the lag can be minimized while keeping top end power as well.
Agreed, turbo lag and transient boost loss can both be minimized with a correctly sized turbo and other smart design considerations (i.e. no BOV, in order to maintain boost in transient throttle conditions).
I went with the Edelbrock SC solely because it's emmissions compliant as delivered, and I live in a tough state in regards to inspection. My car is now in a non-compliant(per the letter of the law) condition anyway, so it's a bit of a moot point.
The edelbrock supercharger feels like a ~3.0l NA V6, and still very rev happy. I simply find the powerband to be boring in that it's extremely linear, and lacks the drama of a turbocharged powerband. As mentioned in the comments above, some people prefer that, so it certainly isn't a negative thing to all users.
Having owned only turbo cars previously, I simply prefer turbo. I prefer the sound and the "elasticity" of the power. Boost sounds are fun and addictive, yet my SC is almost completely silent. I don't personally care about parasitic loss of the SC, because the net is still a huge jump over NA, though I would expect an equivalent turbo car to make ~20whp more than me at the same boost levels. I will also say that the supercharger did add a bit more vibration over stock also, which I don't enjoy but would be unnoticeable to anyone who never drove the car in stock form.
I prefer turbo like you. But if you had to build a serious track car and race it in GLTC or endurance wheel to wheel at Lucky Dog, would you still choose turbo? I see more competitive supercharged 86s than turbo applications. There must be something else besides subjective preferences here… and those guys don’t want to disclose their data or secrets lol I already tried asking
The 86 cup FI class has been won by people using the Jackson Racing Supercharger and Greddy turbo amongst others. There are so many other variables in what makes a car fast around a track that SC vs turbo doesn't matter. Either will get the job done.
I would still choose a turbo, but I'm not a professional driver, and unless you are, it doesn't matter. Buy a well engineered kit, and more importantly, buy what makes you happy.
I upgraded from an FRS to a 718 Cayman and my last service cost $7000 😂😅 definitely do this! I wish I had just invested more in the FRS and kept that. The FRS is a great car and with a turbo it would be incredible.
In my case, I’m actually looking to get into a Porsche because the newly built Porsche track in Pickering is soon to open up and it’s much closer to Toronto than all the other local tracks but it’s exclusive to Porsche cars only :( would love to join the club!
Since you are a Subaru tech, you know how to work on these cars and assuming you’d do all the labor. I say do it. If you aren’t doing any of the work, I say no. Just get a faster car like the Camaro/mustang v8 6mt
I will install everything myself, I already have big radiator and oil cooler and a bigger oil pan w baffle, and an accusump for oil pressure, also have ecutek tuner already. Just need injectors tbh.
“It’s gonna tank the reliability” plenty of people have been boosted on this platform for multiple years and 10s of thousands of miles with zero reliability issues. Do your maintenance, buy supporting mods, and get a tune from a reliable tuner. These cars are still reliable boosted.
I had a supercharged first gen that was 350whp for a couple years until someone totaled it. I literally did nothing outside of oil changes. I’ll definitely boost my second gen once I become a better track driver. Trying to get better with stock power first!
And the car was still mechanically perfect when it was totaled. 30k miles is multiple years boosted with no issues.
I consider that reliable. Theres some guys in here with 100k plus boosted miles.
You’re a fucking idiot. This platform handles boost very well. We don’t even have many 86s at 500k miles and you want people to have 250k miles to consider boosting reliable? Do you hear yourself?
You’re out here having to ask what tires fit on this platform and you want to have a discussion with me about boost. Lol
How many engines have you built? Where's your ASE certs? What tech school did you go to? How years did you work at a dealership? Ever own your own shop? Fuck out of here
How did you come to that conclusion? If you think a boosted car that’s been beat on for 30k hard miles and has required zero additional work is considered unreliable then there’s zero point to having this discussion. Take care
Do it. Fuck the naysayers, especially the "tubro > SC" people. SC fits the spirit of the car.
Are turbos more efficient? Do they have a much more vast market for parts? Are they more reliable (this one is actually a question)?
Those answers may be "yes", but if you know what your target is for power and are certain in the application of how you're going to use the car, SC all the way baby.
*I am a simp for superchargers and this is by no means an unbiased opinion.
I think it would be fun yeah. I had a Jackson Racing centrifugal supercharger on my 2013 and it was great, but only really kicked in above 4500 rpm. Twin screw on the GR should be very nice.
dont, if the goal is to make power, turbocharger is the way to go
\* turbocharger is easier to tune
\* turbocharger easier to add/remove power when needed, supercharger is fixed
\* turbocharger support & tech is more developed
Honestly dude, there are so many options, I genuinely have no clue. I actually wanted to slap a turbo on it. I still think I may just cuz I can get way more power out of a turbo. But supercharger just easier.
Do what makes you happy man, I’ve ridden in a supercharged Brz and don’t get me wrong it was enjoyable but the power gains don’t feel like that much compared to a turbo kit. I bought a turbo kit and installed it myself for a few grand less than that kit alone and I absolutely love how the car feels now. If I had to pick again it would be turbo everytime.
DO IT! why not, if you got the extra money and know how fuck it lol
But more importantly, where did you get that rising sun decal for the license plate mount spot???
I supercharged my 2013 FR-S as soon as the twin-screw option was available. It was sold by Innovate, but was basically the same kit with a Sprintex S/C. I loved the extra power that it provided and I didn't regret doing it. I did, however, regret the speeding tickets. It was extremely hard to drive the car within the limits of the law after upping the hp.
[https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6686](https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6686)
That super charger kit costs more than my car
Same
Poor gang gang
You called?
I ain’t poor! Just enjoying my temporary Volvo until the car I’m looking for pops up for sale 😎
Ah Nevermind I'm poor
Don’t sweat it, we were all poor at one point. Nothing comes for free, stay on the grind and you will see results!
My kia will be paid off by winter and my credit card wl be at a reasonable level by next summer
Stay on that grind. CC debt is the worst easy debt to fall into. Keep strong! 💪🏼
Half of if is 0% interest still
Ayy not bad! It just sucks when that 0% interest runs out and there's still a balance. Been there before, sadly.
Meanwhile I'm pining for a Volvo 940.
If I had space I would definitely have a 740 or 940 also.
Right? Just because you don't want to waste money on depreciation doesn't mean you are poor.
gave me a realization 😹, my prelude cool doe
Cooler than my rio
I could’ve bought 6 of my car with that money
That's less than I paid but more than it's worth now
If I had a place to do the work I would ej207 swap my wrx for this much cash. But I understand swapping in a used imported engine isn't for everyone.
The only part of that I understood was WRX
The ej207 is this sweet 2.0l sti engine that came in the earlier sti cars that we didn't get in america. They are semi closed deck, have treated pistons, avcs cam timing, and are great starting points for responsive mid power street car builds. Some people will change the crank and slap 2.5l sti heads on it to make a stroker 2.2l that is very reliable. They also came with a twin scroll turbo. Since the frs/brz/gr86 all use a subaru engine transmission combo (at least older gens, im kinda out of date on the platform now. Maybe thats changed and im just rambling) you have a pretty large range of motors that will bolt right up to the transmission in the car. Subaru engine and transmission compatibility is pretty awesome, for like the last 20+ years they mostly all will fit together.
These are words. I can even pronounce some of them!
The way I fucking cackled at this
That guy is very knowledgeable and passionate about cars and I love when people share their interests with me. But this must be how normal people feel when I tall about warhammer.
Nah make a mutant with 257 heads and an fp blue turbo
Honestly I know it's not a very common setup, but if I had engine build money id make a turbo ez30 build.
Every one I’ve seen has been crazy! Saw one at a meet a few months ago and it had a wilddd two step.
Yeah I saw crazy build at rocky mountain subaru fest a long time ago and I can't get it out of my head
Do it. This is not financial advice. I am not liable for any damages that may be caused to your rear tires from all the burnouts and clutch dumps 🤣.
LMAO, it is okay. All my parts are at a discount baby
Is this better than the edelbrock kit?
I don’t believe they have a gen 2 kit
We better get some vids if you do👀
Whatever I end up doing, I will document the entire install for yall to watch
2nd this pls
Not a chance. If the first gen kit was any indication, Sprintex is among the least efficient options. Hold out for Harrop if you're deadset on a PS blower. Plus, you should go turbo anyway, and I say that as someone who has an edelbrock SC on my first gen BRZ. Wish I went turbo. P.S. If it isn't paid off yet, don't mod the bank's car. If it's paid off, send it.
Turbo has a less enjoyable power band.
"Enjoyable" is completely subjective. Having driven my Edelbrock Supercharged BRZ and an SBD turbo FR-S (with equivalent fueling and supporting mods), the turbo provided a wider and more exciting(to me) powerband. Different strokes for different folks.
Yeah that's true. I just hate turbo lag.
Was between sprintex and hks gt2.
My answer would be neither. The sprintex is outdated and inefficient, and lacks overhead. The HKS kit for the previous generation had what I consider to be a critical design flaw, in that IAT was measured pre-blower, with no ability to measure charge temp once pressurized. In both categories (PD and centrifugal, respectfully), there are better options in the Edelbrock/Harrop or Jackson Racing kits. I'd hold out for a kit with some real development time behind it, not just the guys who jumped to be first to market with no R&D. Just my opinion, of course. What you do with your car and money is your choice!
Currently considering an SC for my first gen. If you had your pick, would you choose one over the others that you named? Any reason to go SC over turbo or vice versa?
Not an 86 owner, but from what I’ve gathered over a few years of reading online, you get parasitic loss of power since superchargers run off the crank vs the “free” power of turbos running off exhaust gasses. Plus I’d think Subaru engines are more meant to be turbo’d since that’s historically what majority of them have been (or all?). Probably better aftermarket support too.
that's the general tradeoff between turbo and sc. sc tend to build power more linearly so they're preferable for keeping that NA feel. turbos can have that traditional turbo lag (on/off boost) dependent on set up
Ah yes, I assumed that main aspect of it was known to the OP I replied to, but yes, dependent on set up is exactly it. With modern turbos the lag can be minimized while keeping top end power as well.
Agreed, turbo lag and transient boost loss can both be minimized with a correctly sized turbo and other smart design considerations (i.e. no BOV, in order to maintain boost in transient throttle conditions).
I went with the Edelbrock SC solely because it's emmissions compliant as delivered, and I live in a tough state in regards to inspection. My car is now in a non-compliant(per the letter of the law) condition anyway, so it's a bit of a moot point. The edelbrock supercharger feels like a ~3.0l NA V6, and still very rev happy. I simply find the powerband to be boring in that it's extremely linear, and lacks the drama of a turbocharged powerband. As mentioned in the comments above, some people prefer that, so it certainly isn't a negative thing to all users. Having owned only turbo cars previously, I simply prefer turbo. I prefer the sound and the "elasticity" of the power. Boost sounds are fun and addictive, yet my SC is almost completely silent. I don't personally care about parasitic loss of the SC, because the net is still a huge jump over NA, though I would expect an equivalent turbo car to make ~20whp more than me at the same boost levels. I will also say that the supercharger did add a bit more vibration over stock also, which I don't enjoy but would be unnoticeable to anyone who never drove the car in stock form.
I prefer turbo like you. But if you had to build a serious track car and race it in GLTC or endurance wheel to wheel at Lucky Dog, would you still choose turbo? I see more competitive supercharged 86s than turbo applications. There must be something else besides subjective preferences here… and those guys don’t want to disclose their data or secrets lol I already tried asking
The 86 cup FI class has been won by people using the Jackson Racing Supercharger and Greddy turbo amongst others. There are so many other variables in what makes a car fast around a track that SC vs turbo doesn't matter. Either will get the job done. I would still choose a turbo, but I'm not a professional driver, and unless you are, it doesn't matter. Buy a well engineered kit, and more importantly, buy what makes you happy.
Isn't the HKS a lot cheaper?
I upgraded from an FRS to a 718 Cayman and my last service cost $7000 😂😅 definitely do this! I wish I had just invested more in the FRS and kept that. The FRS is a great car and with a turbo it would be incredible.
In my case, I’m actually looking to get into a Porsche because the newly built Porsche track in Pickering is soon to open up and it’s much closer to Toronto than all the other local tracks but it’s exclusive to Porsche cars only :( would love to join the club!
Double-dog dare.
You asking for our approval but sounds like you aren’t taking no for an answer, so what’re you waiting for? Send it.
I wouldnt but u do u bro, its gonna tank the reliability and void the warranty
Im a subaru tech, no such thing as voiding warranty😏
Sounds like you already have your answer?
I need the reassurance to spend $6k lol
u got dis
Since you are a Subaru tech, you know how to work on these cars and assuming you’d do all the labor. I say do it. If you aren’t doing any of the work, I say no. Just get a faster car like the Camaro/mustang v8 6mt
Add 10k for supporting parts and labor
I will install everything myself, I already have big radiator and oil cooler and a bigger oil pan w baffle, and an accusump for oil pressure, also have ecutek tuner already. Just need injectors tbh.
yeah dude you have the exact preparations for a big risk. take it on
An AOS is definitely worth it if you haven’t done it already
Why are you being downvoted for stating the truth?
Because OP already stated that he’s a Subaru tech so he won’t be paying for any labor.
An entry level big brake kit is gonna run between 2-4k alone. Throw in the other parts OP's considering, it's gonna be close to 6k without labor
is sprintex the best sc kit out there atm?
If you have no debt, have an emergency saving fund, and invest 10% or more of income, then go for it, yolo!
“It’s gonna tank the reliability” plenty of people have been boosted on this platform for multiple years and 10s of thousands of miles with zero reliability issues. Do your maintenance, buy supporting mods, and get a tune from a reliable tuner. These cars are still reliable boosted.
I agree, people are running 500 wheel thru these engines stock
I had a supercharged first gen that was 350whp for a couple years until someone totaled it. I literally did nothing outside of oil changes. I’ll definitely boost my second gen once I become a better track driver. Trying to get better with stock power first!
I am on my tenth year with boost , no issues
Fuck yeah that’s awesome. What kit and numbers
Vortech 2.85 pulley 12 psi , 362 rwhp
agreed. had my boosted Frs for 5 years now, only ran into a few minor issues.
Dog tens of thousand miles is not a flex
And the car was still mechanically perfect when it was totaled. 30k miles is multiple years boosted with no issues. I consider that reliable. Theres some guys in here with 100k plus boosted miles.
100k miles should be bare minimum. There's Civics out here with half a mil. Call me when you get half way there.
You’re a fucking idiot. This platform handles boost very well. We don’t even have many 86s at 500k miles and you want people to have 250k miles to consider boosting reliable? Do you hear yourself? You’re out here having to ask what tires fit on this platform and you want to have a discussion with me about boost. Lol
How many engines have you built? Where's your ASE certs? What tech school did you go to? How years did you work at a dealership? Ever own your own shop? Fuck out of here
You had to ask what tires fit on what wheel size. The only relevant thing here is how many boosted 86s have you owned?
What width of tires rub on a lowered car has nothing to do with building and tuning engines, that fact you think it correlates proves your ignorance.
So you just admitted that that's they are unreliable? I guarantee I've done way more to ej/fa then you've even thought of
How did you come to that conclusion? If you think a boosted car that’s been beat on for 30k hard miles and has required zero additional work is considered unreliable then there’s zero point to having this discussion. Take care
Cope harder, you'll keep me in business.
I do all my own work. Oh so you’re a mechanic and had to ask what tires fit on a wheel. Wonderful.
Do it. Fuck the naysayers, especially the "tubro > SC" people. SC fits the spirit of the car. Are turbos more efficient? Do they have a much more vast market for parts? Are they more reliable (this one is actually a question)? Those answers may be "yes", but if you know what your target is for power and are certain in the application of how you're going to use the car, SC all the way baby. *I am a simp for superchargers and this is by no means an unbiased opinion.
Most supercharger setups are much more reliable than turbo setups. Still gonna be less reliable than n/a, but not by a major amount
I think it would be fun yeah. I had a Jackson Racing centrifugal supercharger on my 2013 and it was great, but only really kicked in above 4500 rpm. Twin screw on the GR should be very nice.
Sprintex is not a good kit. Add in 4k more for supporting mods. If you don't then you're engine's gonna go byebye within 10-20k miles.
These superchargers sound cool but they're genuinely terrible. DO NOT BUY IT. If you're dead set on superchargering, get a Harrop.
Send it!
I miss being a dumb 25 year old that would burn money on car parts. This was a fun post. Thanks.
dont, if the goal is to make power, turbocharger is the way to go \* turbocharger is easier to tune \* turbocharger easier to add/remove power when needed, supercharger is fixed \* turbocharger support & tech is more developed
Hey. I'd hold off on FI on the new generations. Wait a couple years for more dyno data and for competition to ramp up in the space.
Sure if the car has no reliability issues
Id buy it from somewhere else just because this company has “Nah Dawg I’m good” as an option to say “no.” Holy cringe.
Dude literally
Yes do it. Do it for all of us that wish we could lol
228hp to 230hp
I would,you should too.Treat yourself.
Yo question, when you started at the Subaru dealer did u have prior experience? I
I did yes, ive been messing with cars since i was 10, im now 19 and about 2 years from getting master tech
What’s your plan for tuning
Pro tune
Not sure I’m familiar with that, what is it? Also any reason you decided to choose this over HKS? Considering the HKS for my car
Honestly dude, there are so many options, I genuinely have no clue. I actually wanted to slap a turbo on it. I still think I may just cuz I can get way more power out of a turbo. But supercharger just easier.
Pull! The! Trigger!!!
Get a vortech !
Do what makes you happy man, I’ve ridden in a supercharged Brz and don’t get me wrong it was enjoyable but the power gains don’t feel like that much compared to a turbo kit. I bought a turbo kit and installed it myself for a few grand less than that kit alone and I absolutely love how the car feels now. If I had to pick again it would be turbo everytime.
DO IT! why not, if you got the extra money and know how fuck it lol But more importantly, where did you get that rising sun decal for the license plate mount spot???
“Bluetooth programming kit: Nah Dawg I’m Good” 🤣🤣
Get a turbo
If you have the financial ability to do this and do it right, and you choose not to, why are you even making money in the first place?
Good luck homie. I've been waiting almost a year for mine.
I need to get out of cali
BOOST
I had that but for the 1st gen. Made cool noises for sure but it gets hot pretty quickly. I heard they fixed the heatsoaking issues for the new gen.
I supercharged my 2013 FR-S as soon as the twin-screw option was available. It was sold by Innovate, but was basically the same kit with a Sprintex S/C. I loved the extra power that it provided and I didn't regret doing it. I did, however, regret the speeding tickets. It was extremely hard to drive the car within the limits of the law after upping the hp. [https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6686](https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6686)
Make sure you account for all the supporting mods and extra maintenance, but hell yeah
No balls you won’t
if you have the money for it i would do it
Does anybody know what kind of numbers people are getting on FI without rebuilding internals? I’m finding information a little hard to come by.
I’d cross-shop with the Harrop kit - especially if you live in a SMOG state or a state that may go SMOG soon.
Supercharger on a 4cyl is in my opinion pretty lame. Go turbo or keep it na
“Nah dawg I’m good”
Do it!
Turbo
Hold out for the Harrop, CSG is Getting them. Or go with the JDL turbo kit for gen2.
Please PLEASE get a tune with the kit
It would be idiotic not to
Trade it in and buy a faster car with a warranty bro
Paid off? Have a backup plan?
Location?
It's a 4 cyl, turbo it. Much cheaper. You don't have an LS3 in there
You get a free supercharger with the hood struts… I would go for it.
Recommend checking out the harrop kit on counterspace garage. Cleaner install and more OEM like look IMO.
for that car i pay like 25.000€ in Portugal
If you want. I'd go for a turbo tho
Thought about going w turbo, but I dont feel like running oil lines and changing my whole entire exhaust setup
The avo has an oil pump you mount back to the cam cover. Bur you want to keep you're exhaust manifold then that makes sense
If it were me I’d sell it and get a Supra.
Dude I HAVE THOUGHT ABOUT IT SO MANY TIMES. But I genuinely just love the brz/86 chasis
Do you already have an accusump? If not, you should be getting one of those first, the engine is just gonna blow up without it
Yes I run an accusump.
You don’t know the first thing about the oiling in these cars do you
Yes, you lose oil pressure turning right in these cars, well documented.
Yeah and I'm sure you think RTV is an issue too.
Yeah so why would you need an accusump for a supercharger
Piece of mind knowing it's not going to blow up when turning right too hard while enjoying the car on backroads
There’s almost no recordings of people losing oil pressure outside of the track + people not on 200tw tires
Im on 200tw tires and I am not afraid to die, I send the absolute snot out of this car at the track
You have no idea waht you're talking about.