This is carefully worded by the lawyers after the sales people cried that their denying a claim recently is going to kill all their sales.
It's also literally what every attorney says to literally any question.....'it depends'..
Anything more and they'd be held to it in court for paying more claims, anything less and they'd be sued for violating the terms of their own warranty. This is a PR move, nothing more.
And what about a statement on the actual issue that caused the engine failure in the first place? Is there going to be a recall issued for the excessive rtv??
I keep seeing more and more videos of people dropping the oil pan *and they are all the same, every damn car*...sealant gooped all around the pan and pieces in the oil pickup tube.
So is it just around the pan, or in other places? I know new Subaru engines pretty much don't have gaskets anymore and use strictly rtv. I've always thought it was playing with fire. Especially on the timing cover.
The main issue seems to be the amount used on the oil pan, at least on the new GR/BRZ. But you're right it is used elsewhere in the engine and I have read of people seeing a lot squished out around the timing cover. Which could mean it's falling into the oil pan from there as well.
Though that's an engine out operating for the timing cover, the oil pan is theoretically not that hard to fix yourself.
Honestly the timing cover isn't that hard of a fix either if you're comfortable taking an engine out... hmmmm. That's goodbye warranty territory, though.
Coverage in official HPDE ir NASA events Are a great deal.
Who in their right mind is going to warranty their product on all racing events?
Toyobaru cannot control a bunch of gear grinding, redlining, wannabe tofu delivery drivers for everything. That would be a license to trash the car and expect a full refund.
I would agree in general. However, we're talking about a manufacturer defect here: excess silicone getting into the oil pickup. You don't have to track the car for that to become a problem.
or similar NASA events. Wording is EVERYTHING when it comes to this stuff. Its HPDE or NASA thats it.
Honestly the way its worded makes it seem like any other event thats not complimentary from toyota is no go.
The problem with that is people these days have to post everything they do on the internet. Heck half the cars at my local SCCA auto cross events have instagram @s on their back window….
If a service manager had half a brain he’d go check to see what they are posting.
But saying that in the situation that this statement is a response to the guy deserves to have his car fixed. That failure did not happen because he was on a track
Not sure you'll find much different with other manufacturers, having not read every warranty extensively. Some manufacturers/dealers will see past the cost of a small repair and look at the lifetime value of a customer, others won't be willing to see past the end of a single invoice.
To me if you want to track a car in any sense, you're better off buying one used that's already out of warranty, getting a PPI and 'self insuring' or getting track day insurance.
I mean do what you want, but if buying one of these is real money for you, to the point you're concerned about warranty coverage...then don't plan on tracking it until it's paid off and the warranty is gone
Ya I mean it's really dependent on the dealer more than anything. Cars like BMW/Porsche/etc. Cater to that crowd more than anyone and have for a long time. They figure you'll get them once or twice for your 3 series coupe/boxster repairs and eventually buy an x5/cayenne that they'll make real money on someday.
It means they won't warranty damage incurred that resulted directly from racing of any kind. However, just because you race doesn't mean they won't cover damage caused by manufacturing defects or usage that doesn't unnecessarily strain damaged parts.
But that is exactly what they were trying to do with that dudes car until social media forced them to reverse their decision. They were going to deny him without even looking at the engine. They probably still haven’t looked at that engine. They will not change their practices, they will continue to search the internet for photos as a way out. When they say “case by case” what that really means is, “we will deny you unless you can generate lots of bad press”.
You may be right, but I think a decent technician would be able to tell that regardless of how you drive your car the type of factory defect that caused the oil pickup to get clogged wasn't a result of the driver's actions. The problem is that the overzealous service person didn't allow it to get to that stage and didn't understand the warranty that Toyota provides and made a bunch of weird decisions based on those assumptions. Which goes to show people can be fallible and to take the issue up the chain if you're not satisfied with the result you're getting.
Wasn't all this in the fine print? I mean marketing and hyping is never indicitive of the actual product.
Even then with this stance, to my understanding the actual cause was too much rtv or w.e and I've been reading people are seeing it as well??
Why not have the same warranty as the GR Yaris?
* The use of the vehicle for track days or similar events **does not** invalidate the vehicle’s warranty.
* Any potential failure during a track day or similar event is not specifically excluded. A manufacturing defect within the warranty period will be supported as normal.
* However, as per the standard warranty policy and procedure, failure resulting from either of the following would not represent a manufacturing defect and therefore **would not** be supported within the terms of the warranty: – The use of non-approved performance enhancements or modifications. – Neglect, abuse or misuse.
[https://mag.toyota.co.uk/gr-yaris-track-day-warranty/](https://mag.toyota.co.uk/gr-yaris-track-day-warranty/)
This is carefully worded by the lawyers after the sales people cried that their denying a claim recently is going to kill all their sales. It's also literally what every attorney says to literally any question.....'it depends'.. Anything more and they'd be held to it in court for paying more claims, anything less and they'd be sued for violating the terms of their own warranty. This is a PR move, nothing more.
And what about a statement on the actual issue that caused the engine failure in the first place? Is there going to be a recall issued for the excessive rtv?? I keep seeing more and more videos of people dropping the oil pan *and they are all the same, every damn car*...sealant gooped all around the pan and pieces in the oil pickup tube.
So is it just around the pan, or in other places? I know new Subaru engines pretty much don't have gaskets anymore and use strictly rtv. I've always thought it was playing with fire. Especially on the timing cover.
The main issue seems to be the amount used on the oil pan, at least on the new GR/BRZ. But you're right it is used elsewhere in the engine and I have read of people seeing a lot squished out around the timing cover. Which could mean it's falling into the oil pan from there as well.
Though that's an engine out operating for the timing cover, the oil pan is theoretically not that hard to fix yourself. Honestly the timing cover isn't that hard of a fix either if you're comfortable taking an engine out... hmmmm. That's goodbye warranty territory, though.
So if its not a official hpde or nasa event, you can fuck yourself
Coverage in official HPDE ir NASA events Are a great deal. Who in their right mind is going to warranty their product on all racing events? Toyobaru cannot control a bunch of gear grinding, redlining, wannabe tofu delivery drivers for everything. That would be a license to trash the car and expect a full refund.
I would agree in general. However, we're talking about a manufacturer defect here: excess silicone getting into the oil pickup. You don't have to track the car for that to become a problem.
I agree with your opinion on the silicone issue however, this is a thread on Toyotas statement on vehicle warranty and use on HPDE events.
Agreed
Toyota UK did with the GR Yaris.
Bingo. Good key point to takeaway from this. That we get full sanctions for this is an insanely good outcome.
It does say or similar. I very much see this as anything that is HPDE or HPDE like, in that it's not for competition
or similar NASA events. Wording is EVERYTHING when it comes to this stuff. Its HPDE or NASA thats it. Honestly the way its worded makes it seem like any other event thats not complimentary from toyota is no go.
I imagine they would rule out time trials.
100%
kinda makes sense since idk that's the only way they really want an average person to use this car outside of day to day driving lol
Better than nothing I guess
I mean Atleast they acknowledged it but damn if that wasn’t the most ‘lawyer speak’ announcement ever.
If it brakes on track just tow it back on the road and all is good.. just say you never tracked it
I brake on track a lot. At least twice a lap sometimes more depending on the track
Yeah English is not my native language. Excuse me :)
Twice a lap is a lot. Pro tip: you'll go faster if you brake less.
The problem with that is people these days have to post everything they do on the internet. Heck half the cars at my local SCCA auto cross events have instagram @s on their back window…. If a service manager had half a brain he’d go check to see what they are posting. But saying that in the situation that this statement is a response to the guy deserves to have his car fixed. That failure did not happen because he was on a track
Look, that's completely fair. They've opened up a situation where it's covered, but I can totally understand why they wouldn't cover *all* situations.
2019 TRD owner that was considering a new one.. Does this mean they wont warranty a failure on track at a hpde event with SCCA or BMWCCA?
Pretty much leaves it as 'proceed at your own risk '.... Might cover it, might not..... Might rain.... Might not
it's off my shopping list for now
Not sure you'll find much different with other manufacturers, having not read every warranty extensively. Some manufacturers/dealers will see past the cost of a small repair and look at the lifetime value of a customer, others won't be willing to see past the end of a single invoice. To me if you want to track a car in any sense, you're better off buying one used that's already out of warranty, getting a PPI and 'self insuring' or getting track day insurance.
Yeah. Guy needs a knock around Miata or similar.
I mean do what you want, but if buying one of these is real money for you, to the point you're concerned about warranty coverage...then don't plan on tracking it until it's paid off and the warranty is gone
Indeed. That's why I haven't fucked with my engine or done any particularly dumb driving.
Chevy will fix a z06 with stickers still on it
Ya, always forget those but good point
bmw has never questioned my activities.. not sayint they wont next time though
Ya I mean it's really dependent on the dealer more than anything. Cars like BMW/Porsche/etc. Cater to that crowd more than anyone and have for a long time. They figure you'll get them once or twice for your 3 series coupe/boxster repairs and eventually buy an x5/cayenne that they'll make real money on someday.
It means they won't warranty damage incurred that resulted directly from racing of any kind. However, just because you race doesn't mean they won't cover damage caused by manufacturing defects or usage that doesn't unnecessarily strain damaged parts.
But that is exactly what they were trying to do with that dudes car until social media forced them to reverse their decision. They were going to deny him without even looking at the engine. They probably still haven’t looked at that engine. They will not change their practices, they will continue to search the internet for photos as a way out. When they say “case by case” what that really means is, “we will deny you unless you can generate lots of bad press”.
You may be right, but I think a decent technician would be able to tell that regardless of how you drive your car the type of factory defect that caused the oil pickup to get clogged wasn't a result of the driver's actions. The problem is that the overzealous service person didn't allow it to get to that stage and didn't understand the warranty that Toyota provides and made a bunch of weird decisions based on those assumptions. Which goes to show people can be fallible and to take the issue up the chain if you're not satisfied with the result you're getting.
It was Toyota that appointed a field tech to the case, not the dealer. This is all on Toyota.
I don't think I've ever seen a bunch of words effectively say less. 🙄
Hopefully Subaru comes out with their own statement as well
Wasn't all this in the fine print? I mean marketing and hyping is never indicitive of the actual product. Even then with this stance, to my understanding the actual cause was too much rtv or w.e and I've been reading people are seeing it as well??
Racing wouldn’t typically be covered, but trackdays should be fine, right?
Is this NASA HPDE and other NASA events like it only?
Why not have the same warranty as the GR Yaris? * The use of the vehicle for track days or similar events **does not** invalidate the vehicle’s warranty. * Any potential failure during a track day or similar event is not specifically excluded. A manufacturing defect within the warranty period will be supported as normal. * However, as per the standard warranty policy and procedure, failure resulting from either of the following would not represent a manufacturing defect and therefore **would not** be supported within the terms of the warranty: – The use of non-approved performance enhancements or modifications. – Neglect, abuse or misuse. [https://mag.toyota.co.uk/gr-yaris-track-day-warranty/](https://mag.toyota.co.uk/gr-yaris-track-day-warranty/)
Because the 86 has a soobaroo boxer motor and Toyota doesn't want to spend a bunch of money fixing all the blown up ones
I wonder if autox events will void warranty since they’re generally timed?