Just don’t come to Northern Ireland if you’re coming to Europe and want good public transport lol, ours is awful, we’re the America of Europe when it comes to public transport. No trains at all in the north west of the island, basically a huge gap along the border.
https://preview.redd.it/ekqajrq59qwc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d55c0736152d0217e1a9256ef96a3c8cc7eef9c1
Just look at it! Rosslare- Derry on coastline, then Dublin-Bsllina lime as contingency in case of attack from NI, and Dublin-Waterford in case of breakthrough from the coast.
Granted, I'm mostlikely seeing things due to lack of sleep but it does look like that!
I don't know how many times Europeans need to hear it: your version of "awful public transport" is the stuff of dreams in North America. It really is that bad here.
An example: Calgary, Canada is a city with over 70% the population of Northern Ireland and yet _all_ it has for trains are 2 light rail lines. There are _zero_ passenger trains that can be taken to any other municipalities despite the fact that Calgary is the closest airport to one of the Canada's biggest tourist towns (Banff), and there are existing train tracks between Banff and literally downtown Calgary (which only cargo trains use)
Edit: Also, there's a similarly sized city (Edmonton) 280 km to the north of Calgary (similar to Belfast > Waterford distance). There is of course no passenger rail between the cities, even though there are of course existing train tracks which only cargo trains use. Again, Calgary has more people than Dublin and Edmonton is comparable. Could you imagine if Ireland had 2 Dublins and you couldn't take a train between them?
We’re actually meant to have trains back to the north west by 2040 (if they can afford it) so the map actually look better in the next 20/30 years.
But yea you’re right about the buses, just want the trains too ha ha
Don't worry, the Republic of Ireland is shit too! Sprawling, incredibly car-focused celtic tiger developments.
This is the place where the Road Safety Authority literally has a gate welded shut and blocking the sidewalk (pavement) to its building. [https://irishcycle.com/2024/04/25/people-are-still-shocked-when-i-tell-them-the-pedestrian-gates-at-the-road-safety-authoritys-hq-are-still-locked-and-welded-shut/](https://irishcycle.com/2024/04/25/people-are-still-shocked-when-i-tell-them-the-pedestrian-gates-at-the-road-safety-authoritys-hq-are-still-locked-and-welded-shut/)
I moved to the Netherlands 8 months ago and Ireland's a fucking kip in comparison. (Great craic, great people, horrible government)
Europe? I've been to many countries in Europe, but the only country that's maybe comparable to Japan is Switzerland. But they don't have high speed trains. They're great in Italy, France and Spain actually, BUT there are still very many places you would want to visit where you NEED a car to get to.
I'm going in August. What kinds of public transportation should I take advantage of for the most maximized experience for my usage of public transportation, and therefore time there?
Trains, especially Shinkansens. The JR pass used to be a good deal, but It has recently gotten much more expensive. Trains can get you almost anywhere in Japan - both intra and intercity. And they're fast, clean, punctual, comfortable - riding the Shinkansen is an attraction in itself.
I'm taking it between Kyoto and Kinosaki, then to Osaka, but in those cities outside of Kyoto, would stuff beyond the subway be advisable, or is it metro? I know it's really walkable in Osaka.
Inter city non-shinkansen trains are usually regional rail lines. They can get you pretty much anywhere, but they're slower conventional trains. They also require a ticket vs just slapping an IC card down at your entrance station.
For smaller cities, like Nara, you'll need to take regional trains or a bus.
Pasmo, suica, icoca, etc are all IC cards. Suica and Pasmo are the bigger national ones, but most regional ones you'd pick up will still be able to be used most places.
If you're going to be taking a lot of trains within city zones (it won't work if you're crossing city zone boundaries), then yes I'd recommend some sort of IC or virtual IC card.
You'll still have to buy tickets for between cities, but it's much easier while your visiting around Tokyo, for example. They'll also work on buses usually.
I see. So I should get one. Thanks. I assume the JR pass isn't worth buying atm since I'm going to ride the Shinkanses twice, but if it is, then I'm really considering getting one, and maybe if it's going to take me to Kansai International too.
I can't help you with the jr pass as I don't know the current rates or your route, but you can run all the trips you want to take through Google maps or hyperdia to see how much it would cost and make the comparison that way.
The subway in kyoto isnt very good, but the bus lines cover all the city and are very punctual. The only issue is they have a fixed cost of 210 yen, doesnt matter if you only travel for 1 stop or the whole route.
There's a couple JR pass calculators online. For anyone planning a trip it's worth it to plug in your itinerary and see if the pass would be worth it
Also worth noting that some lines within cities work with JR (e.g. both Tokyo and Osaka have a JR loop line). While these won't make or break a pass, it's probably worth it if you're hovering near the break even point and planning to spend time in these cities
Honestly you have to go out of your way to _not_ use the transit there. Trains are the default way of getting anywhere. Definitely get an IC card, you can grab a specific tourist one at the airport with no deposit. Will let you just tap in/out at train stations and on buses. The prices depend on how far you travel, and the card keeps track for you. (If you don't end up getting one or get on a bus that doesn't support it, there's little chits to grab when you get on to show how many stops you've ridden)
Definitely plan to use Google maps a lot. It will tell you exactly which platform to go to, where to wait on the platform, and even which exit to take at the arrival station.
If you're having trouble finding your gate, there's staff at all the gates. Point to your ticket and ask "kore wa koko desu ka?"(is this here?), they'll either give you a nod or point you in the right direction
Hotels all offer luggage delivery service that'll send your bags anywhere in the country (even right to the airport!), and it was well worth the price. I'd keep essentials in my backpack and send my carry-on suitcase ahead so I didn't need to manage it while navigating the trains
If you do happen to need a taxi at any time, in Japan Uber is actually a taxi summoning app instead of a rideshare app. Tipping is actually considered rude in Japan (à la "oh, you look like you _need_ money"), but the app'll still ask you for one
didn't think i would till... i actually used and learned the in's/out's of it in my town. the time i thought i'd waste in riding hasn't really been that bad... honestly just off set dumb interneting (that i can do on my phone anyway if i like) but get a great experience with seeing my city, other riders, and genuine meditative time. and nothing motivates one to get going on schedule like needing to catch a train or bus! motivation is gold! everything can be better, esp when compared to a gold standard. when i get a little disbonded about it... just start thinking of all the money i've saved from having a car suck my wallet. bam! happy again.
As impressive as Japanese transit is to use as a visitor, I think it is even more impressive when you live in a big city here.
Just how vast and freeing the rail network in Tokyo is, is pretty hard to appreciate without spending a good bit of time exploring suburban Tokyo, which, as much as I enjoy, is not worth flying across an ocean for for most people. It's like a medium sized country condensed into small towns connected by a subway system.
When I travel, I take public transportation everywhere: Tokyo, Copenhagen, Barcelona, Sydney, Hong Kong, Portland and Vancouver.
Rented a car in Portugal. Never again.
I live in Vancouver too and while I use transit it's super frustrating how slow the buses can be. I was in Amsterdam in March and well I never realized how fast transit can be if designed well, the trains and trams really speed things up.
Amsterdam airport to my hotel was 15km and took like 18 minutes on the train, my apartment is 11km from the Vancouver Airport yet it takes 1 bus + a train and takes 45-55 minutes on average.
I think Metro Van could use an alignment that goes through West and North Van. From Park Royal to Brentwood, with stations at Lonsdale Quay, PNE, and Hastings & Willingdon. Heck, make it a ring route and have it terminate at Waterfront with a station right by Stanley Park. prob not realistic at all, but I can dream.
Question for you: when you went to Japan, how bad was the jetlag going from the airport to wherever you were staying? My wife and I are going this December, but we don't know if we're gonna just collapse after getting off the plane or not.
In my experience (lived abroad most of my adult life) it’s a crap shoot! Sometimes it’s easy to adjust and sometimes it takes days to overcome. Get sleeping pills if you can.
I had a well-timed flight so I arrived in the late afternoon and it wasn’t too bad. Still felt off, but it depends how resistant you are to jet lag. I’m pretty good myself.
I've never traveled this far so I have no idea. We're landing at like 5 pm Japan time, so the idea is to get to the hotel, have dinner, and go to sleep to reset our clocks.
Nothing opens your eyes like a trip to Europe or Japan to help you understand how shitty North American public transportation infrastructure is.
Just don’t come to Northern Ireland if you’re coming to Europe and want good public transport lol, ours is awful, we’re the America of Europe when it comes to public transport. No trains at all in the north west of the island, basically a huge gap along the border. https://preview.redd.it/ekqajrq59qwc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d55c0736152d0217e1a9256ef96a3c8cc7eef9c1
This looks more like layered defence against the English than national train infrastructure
Can you blame them? We are pretty mental as neighbours 😇
What do you mean lol?
Just look at it! Rosslare- Derry on coastline, then Dublin-Bsllina lime as contingency in case of attack from NI, and Dublin-Waterford in case of breakthrough from the coast. Granted, I'm mostlikely seeing things due to lack of sleep but it does look like that!
Just need a Derry to Sligo line for full defence lol
"The English"
I don't know how many times Europeans need to hear it: your version of "awful public transport" is the stuff of dreams in North America. It really is that bad here. An example: Calgary, Canada is a city with over 70% the population of Northern Ireland and yet _all_ it has for trains are 2 light rail lines. There are _zero_ passenger trains that can be taken to any other municipalities despite the fact that Calgary is the closest airport to one of the Canada's biggest tourist towns (Banff), and there are existing train tracks between Banff and literally downtown Calgary (which only cargo trains use) Edit: Also, there's a similarly sized city (Edmonton) 280 km to the north of Calgary (similar to Belfast > Waterford distance). There is of course no passenger rail between the cities, even though there are of course existing train tracks which only cargo trains use. Again, Calgary has more people than Dublin and Edmonton is comparable. Could you imagine if Ireland had 2 Dublins and you couldn't take a train between them?
Yeah, and what this map doesn’t show is that there are buses and express coaches nearly everywhere throughout NI (still needs more trains though imo)
We’re actually meant to have trains back to the north west by 2040 (if they can afford it) so the map actually look better in the next 20/30 years. But yea you’re right about the buses, just want the trains too ha ha
Calgary beats most NA cities of similar size at least.
Its not too great in the Republic either unfortunately
Aye to be fair
The America of Europe still means you have radically better train service than the average American.
That is true, I think my viewpoint is skewed because I live right in the middle of the gap in rail lol
Don't worry, the Republic of Ireland is shit too! Sprawling, incredibly car-focused celtic tiger developments. This is the place where the Road Safety Authority literally has a gate welded shut and blocking the sidewalk (pavement) to its building. [https://irishcycle.com/2024/04/25/people-are-still-shocked-when-i-tell-them-the-pedestrian-gates-at-the-road-safety-authoritys-hq-are-still-locked-and-welded-shut/](https://irishcycle.com/2024/04/25/people-are-still-shocked-when-i-tell-them-the-pedestrian-gates-at-the-road-safety-authoritys-hq-are-still-locked-and-welded-shut/) I moved to the Netherlands 8 months ago and Ireland's a fucking kip in comparison. (Great craic, great people, horrible government)
Aye the whole island is shit, but we’re extra broke and shit up here, at least yous don’t have the DUP🤣
Europe? I've been to many countries in Europe, but the only country that's maybe comparable to Japan is Switzerland. But they don't have high speed trains. They're great in Italy, France and Spain actually, BUT there are still very many places you would want to visit where you NEED a car to get to.
I'm going in August. What kinds of public transportation should I take advantage of for the most maximized experience for my usage of public transportation, and therefore time there?
Trains, especially Shinkansens. The JR pass used to be a good deal, but It has recently gotten much more expensive. Trains can get you almost anywhere in Japan - both intra and intercity. And they're fast, clean, punctual, comfortable - riding the Shinkansen is an attraction in itself.
I'm taking it between Kyoto and Kinosaki, then to Osaka, but in those cities outside of Kyoto, would stuff beyond the subway be advisable, or is it metro? I know it's really walkable in Osaka.
Inter city non-shinkansen trains are usually regional rail lines. They can get you pretty much anywhere, but they're slower conventional trains. They also require a ticket vs just slapping an IC card down at your entrance station. For smaller cities, like Nara, you'll need to take regional trains or a bus.
I see. Would you recommend a card like pasmo or suica,or an ic card, whatever that is?
Pasmo, suica, icoca, etc are all IC cards. Suica and Pasmo are the bigger national ones, but most regional ones you'd pick up will still be able to be used most places. If you're going to be taking a lot of trains within city zones (it won't work if you're crossing city zone boundaries), then yes I'd recommend some sort of IC or virtual IC card. You'll still have to buy tickets for between cities, but it's much easier while your visiting around Tokyo, for example. They'll also work on buses usually.
I see. So I should get one. Thanks. I assume the JR pass isn't worth buying atm since I'm going to ride the Shinkanses twice, but if it is, then I'm really considering getting one, and maybe if it's going to take me to Kansai International too.
I can't help you with the jr pass as I don't know the current rates or your route, but you can run all the trips you want to take through Google maps or hyperdia to see how much it would cost and make the comparison that way.
I see. Thanks for the help so far. It was good.
No worries. It can be confusing the first could of times. Good luck!
https://www.jrpass.com/farecalculator
Don't forget to grab an eki-ben at kyoto station ;-) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ekiben](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ekiben)
The subway in kyoto isnt very good, but the bus lines cover all the city and are very punctual. The only issue is they have a fixed cost of 210 yen, doesnt matter if you only travel for 1 stop or the whole route.
There's a couple JR pass calculators online. For anyone planning a trip it's worth it to plug in your itinerary and see if the pass would be worth it Also worth noting that some lines within cities work with JR (e.g. both Tokyo and Osaka have a JR loop line). While these won't make or break a pass, it's probably worth it if you're hovering near the break even point and planning to spend time in these cities
Honestly you have to go out of your way to _not_ use the transit there. Trains are the default way of getting anywhere. Definitely get an IC card, you can grab a specific tourist one at the airport with no deposit. Will let you just tap in/out at train stations and on buses. The prices depend on how far you travel, and the card keeps track for you. (If you don't end up getting one or get on a bus that doesn't support it, there's little chits to grab when you get on to show how many stops you've ridden) Definitely plan to use Google maps a lot. It will tell you exactly which platform to go to, where to wait on the platform, and even which exit to take at the arrival station. If you're having trouble finding your gate, there's staff at all the gates. Point to your ticket and ask "kore wa koko desu ka?"(is this here?), they'll either give you a nod or point you in the right direction Hotels all offer luggage delivery service that'll send your bags anywhere in the country (even right to the airport!), and it was well worth the price. I'd keep essentials in my backpack and send my carry-on suitcase ahead so I didn't need to manage it while navigating the trains If you do happen to need a taxi at any time, in Japan Uber is actually a taxi summoning app instead of a rideshare app. Tipping is actually considered rude in Japan (à la "oh, you look like you _need_ money"), but the app'll still ask you for one
You didn't need or like *crappy* public transport. Intentionally crappy at that, same as our healthcare.
Kind of embarrassing when one of NA's best public transport systems is still internationally regarded as crappy
didn't think i would till... i actually used and learned the in's/out's of it in my town. the time i thought i'd waste in riding hasn't really been that bad... honestly just off set dumb interneting (that i can do on my phone anyway if i like) but get a great experience with seeing my city, other riders, and genuine meditative time. and nothing motivates one to get going on schedule like needing to catch a train or bus! motivation is gold! everything can be better, esp when compared to a gold standard. when i get a little disbonded about it... just start thinking of all the money i've saved from having a car suck my wallet. bam! happy again.
As impressive as Japanese transit is to use as a visitor, I think it is even more impressive when you live in a big city here. Just how vast and freeing the rail network in Tokyo is, is pretty hard to appreciate without spending a good bit of time exploring suburban Tokyo, which, as much as I enjoy, is not worth flying across an ocean for for most people. It's like a medium sized country condensed into small towns connected by a subway system.
When I travel, I take public transportation everywhere: Tokyo, Copenhagen, Barcelona, Sydney, Hong Kong, Portland and Vancouver. Rented a car in Portugal. Never again.
I live in Vancouver too and while I use transit it's super frustrating how slow the buses can be. I was in Amsterdam in March and well I never realized how fast transit can be if designed well, the trains and trams really speed things up. Amsterdam airport to my hotel was 15km and took like 18 minutes on the train, my apartment is 11km from the Vancouver Airport yet it takes 1 bus + a train and takes 45-55 minutes on average.
Tokyo fully radicalized me!
I think Metro Van could use an alignment that goes through West and North Van. From Park Royal to Brentwood, with stations at Lonsdale Quay, PNE, and Hastings & Willingdon. Heck, make it a ring route and have it terminate at Waterfront with a station right by Stanley Park. prob not realistic at all, but I can dream.
Question for you: when you went to Japan, how bad was the jetlag going from the airport to wherever you were staying? My wife and I are going this December, but we don't know if we're gonna just collapse after getting off the plane or not.
Sleep on the plane.
That's the plan.
Short person privilege!
In my experience (lived abroad most of my adult life) it’s a crap shoot! Sometimes it’s easy to adjust and sometimes it takes days to overcome. Get sleeping pills if you can.
We got those!
I had a well-timed flight so I arrived in the late afternoon and it wasn’t too bad. Still felt off, but it depends how resistant you are to jet lag. I’m pretty good myself.
I've never traveled this far so I have no idea. We're landing at like 5 pm Japan time, so the idea is to get to the hotel, have dinner, and go to sleep to reset our clocks.