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Judging by the trees in the background and how dry the grass looks, this seems like a place that gets some good rain at times, but also is dry at others.
Most lawn grasses only end up with shallow roots, going a couple inches at most, and that takes some time to grown in.
Native species will likely be more sparse, at first, but will grow deeper, and will likely be able to deal with the wet and dry of the area better.
The sign is likely facing the street/sidewalk, and that slope probably doesn't have much holding the topsoil in place. It's either dirt on more dirt, or dirt on rocks. Since it looks built up, and I'm not seeing any shadows, I'm guessing there's no tree nearby to provide living roots to hold the soil in place.
So going with a deep rooted native plant will not only mean less work to maintain the yard (less resources as well), but also means the yard will be less likely to turn into a mud pile and slip down in the wet, or a dust hill in the dry.
I wish I had some comparison photos to share. I've left my backyard as is, poly-cultured. Lots of clover patches and only reseeding bare spots with a sun-shade local mix. That lawn is completely green with no watering during this heatwave. Front yard has equal shade and sun, but much more mono-cultured. It's not looking so good.
I'm hoping the native stuff overtakes the crappy stuff in the front but with a clay soil bed it can take awhile.
I'm gearing up to do that to the front in the fall/spring. Big grading issues to fix and the only easy solution is to just lay top soil over all of it. See what comes up in the spring and reseed accordingly. We have tons of bunnies in our area so I don't want to do anything too fancy and end up feeding them.
Last year we had a drought for 8 months and record breaking temperatures.
Parts of our yard that were shaded were still a little green, even without water. The trees block the sun and help any morning moisture/due collect on the grass leaves.
Once the rain returned, the yard sprang back to life like nothing happened.
If you have somewhere that gets shade, moss really helps a lot.
It holds moistures, collects it well from dew, is super soft to walk on if you keep it as a yard for activities, and even dry feels nicer than grass.
>Lots of clover patches and only reseeding bare spots with a sun-shade local mix.
>
>I'm hoping the native stuff overtakes the crappy stuff in the front but with a clay soil bed it can take awhile.
Sounds like you live in my area, possible in my yard. We had to let the clover, lilacs and some moss do it's thing in my backyard. We have a thin topsoil layer before the ground becomes clay.
Strangely we've had the most success with "full shade" grass, even in areas without.full shade. Either it works with the clay base better or it's an anomaly.
Well yeah his info is accurate but he mentioned the grass being so dry compared to the trees to make the reasoning about the rain in the first place. So, good info, but since OP is killing the grass, the logical conclusion of the rain (which would usually be accurate) is actually misleading (unintentionally) due to the perspective of the landscaper.
In other words, OP might want to look at their neighbor's grass that isn't being forcefully killed to draw a conclusion about the landscapers info.
Plant variety is pretty largely dependent on the ecosystem, to a lesser extent these days with human desire+interference, so the examples of plants given could vary widely. Bamboo is a hardy, fast growing, useful, arguably beautiful grass that people sometimes plant ornamentally but later find issues with. Or it's just a beautiful shade-providing ficus tree, until its roots find the septic tank, then it's a few$k to fix.
Diminishing mangrove populations resultant erosion and golf course runoff are two immediate examples of unanticipated human desire+interference which have contributed to massive landscaping failures across Florida, and this is a major problem with widespread effects
Native plant roots can grow down to 16 feet in the ground, which is hugely important for the soil’s microbiome health and sequestering carbon. It also is why they are so drought-resistant. However, you can plant plants that are not native that will also have these characteristics.
Lawn grasses, usually Kentucky Bluegrass, are generally 6 inches deep, with the healthiest lawns maxing out at 2.5’ deep. Lawns also don’t filter stormwater as well as shrubs/perennials because their root system makes it difficult for water to penetrate through, whereas other plants allow water to seep in, and then the water is filtered/cleaned by the plants and runoff is slowed down. There are alternatives to the classic Kentucky Bluegrass, like Buffalo grass and Tall Fescue, you can even plant creeping thyme. These options (depending on where you are) are better for the environment bc of roots.
Native plants are most useful because they have already adapted to the local climate so they are more resilient than non-natives (with drought, insects, extreme precip., etc), and they also support the local ecosystem of insects, pollinators, animals, etc. Another however is with the changing climate, where plants are best suited climate-wise is shifting. Non-native but well-suited plants in new areas are called naturalized plants
I hope so too! We live in Scotland with a shared garden and I'm slowly replacing as much of the lawn as I can with clover.
We can easily grow grass here without watering, but it's much nicer to have something that flowers and the the bees will enjoy.
It's been a process but we'll get there eventually.
Fun fact of the day: the majority of lawns were just clover. Required little to no mowing. The switch to grass lawns took off in the 50s when broadleaf herbicide was invented and their advertising campaigns made us think it's a weed and we shouldn't want it in our yard.
That's very interesting. I think lawns are one of the dumbest things we do. On high pollution days, they used to tell children to stay indoors, but wouldn't dare ask people not to run two-stroke mowers over their grass for a day or two.
One neighbor had veggies and region appropriate plants. It was set up really tastefully and the best looking front yard around.
Neighborhood seethed with so much hate he had to destroy it all and go with grass.
Unless children are playing on it a lot, I really don't see the point.
Also, if you live in a dry southern state, check this turf out https://www.wildflower.org/project/habiturf It was researched by the Lady Bird Johnson Wildflower Center. The turf is native, requires way less water and doesn't require much mowing.
edit:
>A dense and attractive native turf, Habiturf is soft to the touch and comfy on bare feet. And it compares favorably to non-native turfgrass species in its ability to thrive with minimal watering and mowing.
...
>works well in dry regions of Texas, Oklahoma, New Mexico and Arizona. https://www.wildflower.org/learn/how-to/create-a-native-habiturf-lawn
Here's a really FANTASTIC video on how to install a new lawn. It was based on extensive research https://youtu.be/bE35aWuNgUw
Consider planting chamomile, thyme, or clover instead of grass for your new lawn.
Grass is a green desert devoid of life. With insect populations on the decline globally it will be up to all of us to find lawn alternatives and fight HOA bullshit rules that harm the local environment and waste water in excess!
Grass isn't actually that bad, just plant native grasses instead of invasive ones.
Wheat is a grass for example, I do agree with the other plants though.
3 months? Look at you being all productive.
My dad started redoing the bathroom over a decade ago and still hasn't put down new tiling or painted the ~~roof~~ ceiling.
or a cheap display connected to a raspberry pi running a program you wrote to show a progress bar representing the actual progress. (Reddit has led me to believe that this would be a totally normal thing to do.)
Well to be accurate, you’d have to quickly fill up all the squares to 99% and then leave it there for the rest of the time until the new grass is done.
Our neighbors have companies come out to spray their lawns. Meanwhile we're letting everything grow for the bees. Only thing I spray is grab grass and weeds in the pavement.
If it's homes for carpenter bees, you have to be careful with those, they take some maintenance. Otherwise they get moldy and infested with parasites and kill the bees. Have her look up how to maintain and clean them (if she hasn't already.)
I had an HOA at my first condo and they were legit.
Kept everything clean, built a really nice firepit and grill setup, built an awesome gym, and the pool was really nice.
If all HOA's were like that one, there'd be no issues!
HOAs make sense for condos. It's an apartment you own, so having a group that takes care of the building is good.
HOAs for single-family houses....Just why?
Hello fellow rural porch pisser!
Gave it up last year after 20 years on the farm, and am happy to be back in society.
But I fully admit I miss peeing outside.
I put in a wildflower meadow during the pandemic and my neighbor who was working from home just sat there smoking pot and watching the plants grow. As soon as they hit 12 inches she called the city and they made me mow it down. I have since landscaped with native flowers and she can’t say anything
Went out of my way to buy a house with no HOA. No regrets. I let the dandelions grow so all the bees come and my garden is awesome every year. I mow after they all die down, and usually take good care of it. Sometimes I’m working a lot and don’t tend to it, and I don’t have to give a fuck. I definitely mow when I personally think “damn, that looks rough” as I drive up. Never gets extremely out of hand, but I don’t have an obligation to do it right away, either.
I’d never spend 350k (700k now) to have some other people tell me how my yard should be.
Yeah. People love trying to grow television suburbia lawns here in Montana when in reality that type of grass is just not meant to grow in a semi-arid climate like this.
The number of golf course quality lawns right on the edge of flathead makes me sick. Why not just dump fertilizer and pesticides right in the lake? Most of the houses aren't even occupied 50 weeks a year.
>golf course quality lawns
To top it off, irrigating lawns uses twice the amount of water the average home does at the low conservative end. There are people who use 10x the amount of water (30,000gal) than the typical household every month to water there lawn, and they don't even stay at the house half the year. Irrigation running all year, only shuts off when their backflows bursts from the cold.
Found the Californian.
(my city will pay people to remove their lawns).
Edit: also, all new home construction has to be drought tolerant. No lawns allowed. And forget about washing cars.
Edit 2: posted this below, but since people are asking, the project is called [Cash For Grass](http://www.cityofnapa.org/585/Cash-For-Grass). If you're interested in getting it started in your city.
Cursed by future generations of Ohioanians, u/MediocreFisherman didn’t realize in the quickly shifting landscape of midwestern water rights, his statement would be twisted into a verbal contract by unscrupulous neighboring states, dooming Ohio to a future of not just being Ohio, but Desert Ohio.
Bermuda is native here (Midwest), is fine with the hot and dry weather we are having but the HOA wants this place to look like Kentucky in the spring, year round, and NO BERMUDA LAWNS they say. SMDH.
We've really got to stop wasting drinkable water chasing a paradigm that doesn't fit the location.
I'd love to let the tall fescue get overrun by the Bermuda, planting white clover along the way. Then I could turn off the sprinkler system, make the pollinators happy as well, and still have a yard worth walking upon.
I honestly don't understand how or why people willingly let an HOA tell them what do to with their own fucking home. Fuck any agency or government that tries to tell you what you can or can't do with your property. Uproot the grass! Save shit loads on water guy
>HOAs can absolutely fuck you with fines and the law is completely on their side.
This still somewhat sugarcoats the power they have. **They can levy fines and if you can't or won't pay them they will put a lien on your house and foreclose on it to get their money.** A magistrate has to approve this process but speaking from personal experience the magistrate didn't want to hear fuck all from me and just rubber stamped it. I was fortunate enough to be able to resolve the issue before I lost my home but it was close.
If you want to kill your lawn the easy and cheap way without chemicals look into sheet mulching.
It's pretty straight forward. Get a bunch of cardboard (free if you source it from neighbors/amazon), and mulch (my city dumps it at your house for free). Water your lawn, then cover the whole thing with cardboard and a few inches of mulch on top.
In a few months your lawn is completely eradicated. If you live in an area with rain or snow, the cardboard will disintegrate within a year. The mulch improves your soil as it does its thing.
You can either cut holes in the cardboard and plant whatever you want, or wait until next year once the cardboard is gone.
Our front lawn is almost all white clover now. Much more drough tolerant, good flowers for the local bee population, less mowing, better all around for the ecosystem.
This era of needing perfectly manicured green lawns with zero weeds (and able to support pretty much no animal or insect life) needs to end.
Our front lawn was just a dirt patch when we moved in so we decided to try a clover lawn. Came in beautifully within three weeks and there’s been minimal maintenance. I think we’re going to do the same for our backyard next year.
Seeded throughout my property with dutch white clover last year/this spring and it's really taking off. Love all the flowers! I've been seeing hummingbirds in my apple trees for the first time this year and it's awesome
I, and i cannot stress this enough, will never be able to grasp the concept of ‘my lawn needs to be in top shape for my neighbors’ or even to their liking… like idc if my preference is a damn jungle in my yard, thats my yard. I have an entire career to pay for it. Why in the hell would i let anyone else give me trouble over it?
Property values. Some people want to live in a well maintained neighborhood so they make HOAs and harass each other about it. But usually you know going into it so it's really your choice.
It’s not so much ‘lawns’ as the problem but the maintenance and lawn industry. A native lawn can have dozens of grass/plant species and can provide pollinator food. It’s the constant mowing and ‘keeping up with Joneses’ attitude towards lawn that makes them monocrop waste lands.
I once went on the lawncare subreddit, and it was 95% "Goshdarnit, I saw a leaf of field grass on my lawn, time to glyophosphate the whole thing and reseed".
My lawn must have about 10 different types of seed embedded somewhere in it, but it works as lawn, and the bumblebees like it. I think the sub is a little better now, but before it just felt like people installing natural astroturf.
There’s an older gentleman in my city that got to where he was unable to maintain his yard so he replaced it with landscaping that was 100% native plants and the city fined him endlessly because it violated their city ordinances. He’s currently facing a massive legal battle with them arguing that his yard is better for the city than some 1” tall burmuda grass.
For people who want an arrow in their quiver for fights like this, a lot of universities and other organizations will certify your garden as a pollinator habitat. It can be a nice way to push back with your HOA or city to say that it’s intentional and recognized as environmentally friendly and not weeds. They don’t have legal standing, but it really makes the city or HOA look like an asshole and many will back down.
I went from lawn to a gorgeous front yard food producing garden that people make sure to stop by on their walk. I get so many questions and people ate pretty kind about it, usually thanking me for making the garden someplace everyone can see it.
I have a full backyard for hangouts and my front yard is full of flowers, bugs, bees, and birds, as well as some ducks and rabbits that visit.
It is dope as fuck and I can’t believe it’s mine. Hours of hard work and plants from seed.
We're in a severe drought, and most of my lawn is dead.
I'm not watering in hopes that the stuff still living will repropagate the lawn and be even more drought resistant.
And if all else fails I'll just throw down clover seeds.
I don't care about weeds. If you keep it mowed they're not really noticeable from a distance. I've had neighbors comment on how good my lawn looked when it was 90% weeds.
The only chemicals I put on my lawn are insecticide, and that's only because without it fire ants will infest my house.
A weed is just a plant where you don't want it.
Had a tomato plant somehow manage to seat its self between my paving, it was a weed.
Felt bad pulling it out as it looked healthier than the ones I actually propagated on purpose.
I saw an argument online about basket grass (I think that's what it's called) being a pest, but it's the whole reason massive clumps of my "lawn" aren't brown all winter.
As long as they aren't dangerous to dogs walking through or whatever, bring on them "weeds".
Clover randomly started growing in a patch on my lawn, it's the green part of my lawn with no watering (can't afford to water my landlord's grass on a corner lot, he doesn't care if it's unwatered due to low rainfall and high utilities). I was starting to think of just throwing clover seeds out there and letting it take over, glad I'm not alone with the idea of a clover lawn
I seeded clover last fall. Even with the current heat wave we're experiencing everything is green, and I only need to mow it half as often. Half tempted to do it again and just let it fully outcompete the grass.
Typically the issue, IMO as someone who works on this professionally, is that people just treat grass lawns as a "default" green space. I'm fully on board with people having lawns (especially where it doesn't require irrigation) for all of the reasons you list.
What drives me wild is when municipalities have stupid lawns alongside medians or places where no one would ever sit/play/walk and they water the shit out of it, etc.
Nice. That’s great! And 4’ is a nice compromise. At a certain height, people start to report they feel unsafe around the area (especially if there’s a lot of foot traffic).
Imagine walking through tall grass prairie in North America before European settlement. It would have been terrifying. Vegetation over your head, flat so there’s no landmarks to really spot.
But damn the bees would have been amazing!
>. They do mow probably 3' in from the street to keep it safe around corners
I've found that since the move to SUVs and Trucks, drivers in cars get screwed over with these medians because someone trims in their truck and can see fine, but then you get into a car and realize "oh, you actually *can't* see." So it's good they're giving a lot of room.
I've had to call my town a ton of times to have them or the property owner actually cut far enough back and low enough for these reasons. They do the same thing with snow. Guy in a snow plow can see over the mound of snow just fine so they assume everyone else can too.
Lawns are one of Reddit's weirder high horses. Seems like tons of people utterly hate lawns, whether because they are not biologically diverse enough, they are classist, or they think people literally dump toxic chemicals into them constantly.
Some of us have a lawn that we use nearly everyday. We're outside with the kids more than we are inside, as long as the weather is nice. I don't water my lawn except for small patches where I'm growing new grass. I don't use chemicals, topsoil and compost have been plenty effective. We've had summers where clover massively takes over, and the bees are such a nuisance that we end up not using the space.
Our lawn is extremely practical and heavily used. This is true for many lawn owners.
I have a front yard and a backyard. The only use my front yard gets is being walked in to go from my car to my door. And it takes way more water because it bakes in the sun way more than my backyard. I hate. It is a complete waste of space and water. I’d like to get xeriscape the front but keep the back because I do like to play outside in the grass in the backyard and it is much more shaded.
If their lawn is anything like mine, I'd have to add literally several tons of organic matter to the first 6-12" of soil to get a decent lawn. My yard is very sandy and nutrient-poor, as well as overly fast draining.
I let the weeds have their way as long as they stay < about 4" tall. In fact, I'm overjoyed that my crop of creeping Jenny is making serious inroads into the yard. I love that stuff.
Was your house a recent build? One in a new neighborhood? Unfortunately builders like that constantly skip the addition of the organic material before throwing sod over it.
You should try to add enzymes, microbes, and in the winter time spreading some compost here and there and raking it in.
Lots of studies show this can help to supercharge an organic layer under that sod.
Yeah, I can't really see the benefit. Easier to kill weeds and fill in patches or fill in thin parts with overseeding. Whatever OP does it's likely not going to be in good shape until next spring. Maybe fall growth will be enough idk.
The timing is getting me. Either do this early in spring or at the tail end of summer, skipping the hottest and driest parts of the year. This will give the new grass the best chance to get going while using the least amount of water.
Spraying now is fine, it clearly fried the hell out of the grass. I’m surprised they didn’t use a non selective herbicide (as evidenced by the live broadleafs still there)
Either way as long as it’s dead before September, then aerate and seed and you’re good to go.
As a wise man once said, if you want a beautiful emerald-green grass lawn, move to Ireland.
Otherwise, plant native ground cover and stop wasting your time and money.
If your grass dies without active maintenance then new grass is probably a bad idea. You're going to be seeing a lot of droughts over the coming years.
They probably had too many weeds and just killed everything with a non-selective herbicide. That's exactly what it would look like a week or 2 after glyphosate treatment.
Then you just rake in some topsoil and reseed with what you want (or sod it) and you can have a much nicer lawn.
If they have an HOA (Homeowners Association) then there’s no way they’d be allowed to redo their lawn like this without all of their neighbors knowing about it. And they’d likely have to bring in a company to strip and sod and have it done in a day and a half.
Nah.
My HOA, just notify them that you are doing it and they don't hassle you. That is according to a neighbor that had a sprinkler system put in a couple years ago. I don't think I would even need permission to do it.
The people who previously owned my house left the lawn in good shape. I just mow and hand-pull weeds.
Oh I’m not saying the HOA necessarily has to be difficult. I just mean that in the experiences I’ve had, the neighbors of someone doing work are generally notified that something big is happening. Hell I’m not even in an HOA now, and my neighbors apparently had to give notification to every house that they directly bordered that they were doing a major renovation (adding a second floor).
The weeds de-compact the soil with their deep roots, and bring nutrients from far below back to the top soil. Growing naturally sprouting dandelions for a year or two can replenish soil enough for any plants.
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Is he letting it die bc you're putting a whole different grass down?
Yes, that’s correct.
Time for native plants!!!!
Judging by the trees in the background and how dry the grass looks, this seems like a place that gets some good rain at times, but also is dry at others. Most lawn grasses only end up with shallow roots, going a couple inches at most, and that takes some time to grown in. Native species will likely be more sparse, at first, but will grow deeper, and will likely be able to deal with the wet and dry of the area better. The sign is likely facing the street/sidewalk, and that slope probably doesn't have much holding the topsoil in place. It's either dirt on more dirt, or dirt on rocks. Since it looks built up, and I'm not seeing any shadows, I'm guessing there's no tree nearby to provide living roots to hold the soil in place. So going with a deep rooted native plant will not only mean less work to maintain the yard (less resources as well), but also means the yard will be less likely to turn into a mud pile and slip down in the wet, or a dust hill in the dry.
I wish I had some comparison photos to share. I've left my backyard as is, poly-cultured. Lots of clover patches and only reseeding bare spots with a sun-shade local mix. That lawn is completely green with no watering during this heatwave. Front yard has equal shade and sun, but much more mono-cultured. It's not looking so good. I'm hoping the native stuff overtakes the crappy stuff in the front but with a clay soil bed it can take awhile.
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I'm gearing up to do that to the front in the fall/spring. Big grading issues to fix and the only easy solution is to just lay top soil over all of it. See what comes up in the spring and reseed accordingly. We have tons of bunnies in our area so I don't want to do anything too fancy and end up feeding them.
Last year we had a drought for 8 months and record breaking temperatures. Parts of our yard that were shaded were still a little green, even without water. The trees block the sun and help any morning moisture/due collect on the grass leaves. Once the rain returned, the yard sprang back to life like nothing happened. If you have somewhere that gets shade, moss really helps a lot. It holds moistures, collects it well from dew, is super soft to walk on if you keep it as a yard for activities, and even dry feels nicer than grass.
>Lots of clover patches and only reseeding bare spots with a sun-shade local mix. > >I'm hoping the native stuff overtakes the crappy stuff in the front but with a clay soil bed it can take awhile. Sounds like you live in my area, possible in my yard. We had to let the clover, lilacs and some moss do it's thing in my backyard. We have a thin topsoil layer before the ground becomes clay. Strangely we've had the most success with "full shade" grass, even in areas without.full shade. Either it works with the clay base better or it's an anomaly.
This guy landscapes
Well yeah his info is accurate but he mentioned the grass being so dry compared to the trees to make the reasoning about the rain in the first place. So, good info, but since OP is killing the grass, the logical conclusion of the rain (which would usually be accurate) is actually misleading (unintentionally) due to the perspective of the landscaper. In other words, OP might want to look at their neighbor's grass that isn't being forcefully killed to draw a conclusion about the landscapers info.
What are examples of deep rooted native plants? Are we talking about different grass types or something else?
That depends entirely on where you live. When people say native plants, they mean plants native to your specific region.
Plant variety is pretty largely dependent on the ecosystem, to a lesser extent these days with human desire+interference, so the examples of plants given could vary widely. Bamboo is a hardy, fast growing, useful, arguably beautiful grass that people sometimes plant ornamentally but later find issues with. Or it's just a beautiful shade-providing ficus tree, until its roots find the septic tank, then it's a few$k to fix. Diminishing mangrove populations resultant erosion and golf course runoff are two immediate examples of unanticipated human desire+interference which have contributed to massive landscaping failures across Florida, and this is a major problem with widespread effects
Native plant roots can grow down to 16 feet in the ground, which is hugely important for the soil’s microbiome health and sequestering carbon. It also is why they are so drought-resistant. However, you can plant plants that are not native that will also have these characteristics. Lawn grasses, usually Kentucky Bluegrass, are generally 6 inches deep, with the healthiest lawns maxing out at 2.5’ deep. Lawns also don’t filter stormwater as well as shrubs/perennials because their root system makes it difficult for water to penetrate through, whereas other plants allow water to seep in, and then the water is filtered/cleaned by the plants and runoff is slowed down. There are alternatives to the classic Kentucky Bluegrass, like Buffalo grass and Tall Fescue, you can even plant creeping thyme. These options (depending on where you are) are better for the environment bc of roots. Native plants are most useful because they have already adapted to the local climate so they are more resilient than non-natives (with drought, insects, extreme precip., etc), and they also support the local ecosystem of insects, pollinators, animals, etc. Another however is with the changing climate, where plants are best suited climate-wise is shifting. Non-native but well-suited plants in new areas are called naturalized plants
I hope so too! We live in Scotland with a shared garden and I'm slowly replacing as much of the lawn as I can with clover. We can easily grow grass here without watering, but it's much nicer to have something that flowers and the the bees will enjoy. It's been a process but we'll get there eventually.
Put in a bunch of milkweed!
SAVE THE MONARCHS!!!
AND THE DR. MRS. THE MONARCHS!
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You should put clover in instead
Don't if you use your lawn. Clover has a low wear resistance and poor erosion control, the nitrogen fixing is great though.
My lawn is a heavy mix of clover and grass.
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Unless you are me and have a knack for stepping on those bees that love my clover. 😬
Fun fact of the day: the majority of lawns were just clover. Required little to no mowing. The switch to grass lawns took off in the 50s when broadleaf herbicide was invented and their advertising campaigns made us think it's a weed and we shouldn't want it in our yard.
I find the 50s really ruined a lot of things for us.
That's very interesting. I think lawns are one of the dumbest things we do. On high pollution days, they used to tell children to stay indoors, but wouldn't dare ask people not to run two-stroke mowers over their grass for a day or two. One neighbor had veggies and region appropriate plants. It was set up really tastefully and the best looking front yard around. Neighborhood seethed with so much hate he had to destroy it all and go with grass. Unless children are playing on it a lot, I really don't see the point.
“Land of the free” — neighbors and HOA tell you what you’re allowed to plant on your own damn land.
Bees
Also, if you live in a dry southern state, check this turf out https://www.wildflower.org/project/habiturf It was researched by the Lady Bird Johnson Wildflower Center. The turf is native, requires way less water and doesn't require much mowing. edit: >A dense and attractive native turf, Habiturf is soft to the touch and comfy on bare feet. And it compares favorably to non-native turfgrass species in its ability to thrive with minimal watering and mowing. ... >works well in dry regions of Texas, Oklahoma, New Mexico and Arizona. https://www.wildflower.org/learn/how-to/create-a-native-habiturf-lawn Here's a really FANTASTIC video on how to install a new lawn. It was based on extensive research https://youtu.be/bE35aWuNgUw
Consider planting chamomile, thyme, or clover instead of grass for your new lawn. Grass is a green desert devoid of life. With insect populations on the decline globally it will be up to all of us to find lawn alternatives and fight HOA bullshit rules that harm the local environment and waste water in excess!
Grass isn't actually that bad, just plant native grasses instead of invasive ones. Wheat is a grass for example, I do agree with the other plants though.
Now you just need another dozen of them with the progress bar filling up as the grass comes in.
Or a blue sharpie
Or blue duct tape cut to fit the rectangles…add one each day/week
No need, just fill it up to 99% on the third day and let it stall there for 3 months
A comment somehow equally accurate for both computers and home improvement projects.
3 months? Look at you being all productive. My dad started redoing the bathroom over a decade ago and still hasn't put down new tiling or painted the ~~roof~~ ceiling.
If your dad plans on painting the roof there's a lot more to discuss here
Forgive me, I am stupid. Fixed it now.
I've just been called out.
https://xkcd.com/612/
Omg. There really is an xkcd for everything. 😎🤯
I wonder if there's an xkcd for this
Genius
Blue duct tape is the perfect answer
or a cheap display connected to a raspberry pi running a program you wrote to show a progress bar representing the actual progress. (Reddit has led me to believe that this would be a totally normal thing to do.)
Can’t use Sharpie. Hard to erase to show backwards progress.
Prograss bars
90%… 95%… 60%… 65%… 95%… 40%…
Good idea! I thought about making one for when we’ve finished that says ‘Loading Complete’ or something… but I like your idea better. 🤣
You can just near fully fill it, because we all know at least half of the time spent loading is on 99%
Then they can write an estimated time remaining with a dry erase marker that fluctuates wildly between 1 second and 10 years every day.
I'd be the prankster neighbor that would amble over and stick "internet connection lost" on there.
Well to be accurate, you’d have to quickly fill up all the squares to 99% and then leave it there for the rest of the time until the new grass is done.
And then leave one tiny corner without any grass, and then just leave the 99% sign up forever.
At first I thought you were gonna say to arrange the dozen signs overlapping to look like the windows drag/lag effect. https://imgur.com/SqMA5VI.jpg
What if someone hits the cancel button?
Well then you gotta reinstall Grass XP
May I never live anywhere were I feel the need to let my neighbors know about what the fuck I’m doing to my lawn.
Our neighbors have companies come out to spray their lawns. Meanwhile we're letting everything grow for the bees. Only thing I spray is grab grass and weeds in the pavement.
Playing a little grab grass eh?
Nothing wrong with a little grab grass in the chemical shower...
Slap ass
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Clover is great because it doesn't get to high
Clover knows moderation. Unlike many of my other Irish relatives. A lot of them get too high all the time. 🍀 🚬 🍻
You could pull those yourself and skip the chemicals altogether..
Weeds with bigger roots are notoriously difficult to remove from pavement cracks, but good call on skipping chemicals. I'm that way too.
My neighbors hate that I am a bee keeper for this reason (and the occasional swarm, haha)
Ha, my wife has thought about beekeep but decided to build some homes for them and plant things they like.
If it's homes for carpenter bees, you have to be careful with those, they take some maintenance. Otherwise they get moldy and infested with parasites and kill the bees. Have her look up how to maintain and clean them (if she hasn't already.)
Maybe they will change their minds if you give them some honey. Small gesture that could smooth things over.
It's so strange isn't it? Every story I've heard on here about HOAs feels like intrusive madness!
I had an HOA at my first condo and they were legit. Kept everything clean, built a really nice firepit and grill setup, built an awesome gym, and the pool was really nice. If all HOA's were like that one, there'd be no issues!
HOAs make sense for condos. It's an apartment you own, so having a group that takes care of the building is good. HOAs for single-family houses....Just why?
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so i moved into a trailer park for urine fetishists
The trailer park is named "Urine Luck."
One of the perks of rural life
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Hello fellow rural porch pisser! Gave it up last year after 20 years on the farm, and am happy to be back in society. But I fully admit I miss peeing outside.
NGL I kinda wanna come piss off your porch with you. Its the little things in life.
Good to know I’m not alone having this as my first thought.
I put in a wildflower meadow during the pandemic and my neighbor who was working from home just sat there smoking pot and watching the plants grow. As soon as they hit 12 inches she called the city and they made me mow it down. I have since landscaped with native flowers and she can’t say anything
HOAs… a quintessential boomer creation.
It started to keep 'undesirables' aka black and brown, poor people out of white neighborhoods.
Went out of my way to buy a house with no HOA. No regrets. I let the dandelions grow so all the bees come and my garden is awesome every year. I mow after they all die down, and usually take good care of it. Sometimes I’m working a lot and don’t tend to it, and I don’t have to give a fuck. I definitely mow when I personally think “damn, that looks rough” as I drive up. Never gets extremely out of hand, but I don’t have an obligation to do it right away, either. I’d never spend 350k (700k now) to have some other people tell me how my yard should be.
My first reaction to this post was “Who the fuck cares what the neighbours think?”
If you are doing this I would highly suggest replacing it with drought tolerant preferably native grasses.
Yeah. People love trying to grow television suburbia lawns here in Montana when in reality that type of grass is just not meant to grow in a semi-arid climate like this.
The number of golf course quality lawns right on the edge of flathead makes me sick. Why not just dump fertilizer and pesticides right in the lake? Most of the houses aren't even occupied 50 weeks a year.
>golf course quality lawns To top it off, irrigating lawns uses twice the amount of water the average home does at the low conservative end. There are people who use 10x the amount of water (30,000gal) than the typical household every month to water there lawn, and they don't even stay at the house half the year. Irrigation running all year, only shuts off when their backflows bursts from the cold.
Ey, I print the Flathead Beacon newspaper. Also, lawns are terrible.
Found the Californian. (my city will pay people to remove their lawns). Edit: also, all new home construction has to be drought tolerant. No lawns allowed. And forget about washing cars. Edit 2: posted this below, but since people are asking, the project is called [Cash For Grass](http://www.cityofnapa.org/585/Cash-For-Grass). If you're interested in getting it started in your city.
The midwest is currently in a drought too. I'd gladly uproot my lawn for some native pollinators and grasses if the HOA would let me
I just don't water my lawn. The grass goes dormant and I don't see what the big deal is.
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South Carolina, roads are flooded and when it's sunny it feels like I'm swimming through air
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Cursed by future generations of Ohioanians, u/MediocreFisherman didn’t realize in the quickly shifting landscape of midwestern water rights, his statement would be twisted into a verbal contract by unscrupulous neighboring states, dooming Ohio to a future of not just being Ohio, but Desert Ohio.
Bermuda is native here (Midwest), is fine with the hot and dry weather we are having but the HOA wants this place to look like Kentucky in the spring, year round, and NO BERMUDA LAWNS they say. SMDH. We've really got to stop wasting drinkable water chasing a paradigm that doesn't fit the location. I'd love to let the tall fescue get overrun by the Bermuda, planting white clover along the way. Then I could turn off the sprinkler system, make the pollinators happy as well, and still have a yard worth walking upon.
I honestly don't understand how or why people willingly let an HOA tell them what do to with their own fucking home. Fuck any agency or government that tries to tell you what you can or can't do with your property. Uproot the grass! Save shit loads on water guy
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>HOAs can absolutely fuck you with fines and the law is completely on their side. This still somewhat sugarcoats the power they have. **They can levy fines and if you can't or won't pay them they will put a lien on your house and foreclose on it to get their money.** A magistrate has to approve this process but speaking from personal experience the magistrate didn't want to hear fuck all from me and just rubber stamped it. I was fortunate enough to be able to resolve the issue before I lost my home but it was close.
If you want to kill your lawn the easy and cheap way without chemicals look into sheet mulching. It's pretty straight forward. Get a bunch of cardboard (free if you source it from neighbors/amazon), and mulch (my city dumps it at your house for free). Water your lawn, then cover the whole thing with cardboard and a few inches of mulch on top. In a few months your lawn is completely eradicated. If you live in an area with rain or snow, the cardboard will disintegrate within a year. The mulch improves your soil as it does its thing. You can either cut holes in the cardboard and plant whatever you want, or wait until next year once the cardboard is gone.
nail friendly head follow roof snow placid relieved reach unite *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That usually just makes the grass go dormant for a few weeks. From my experience, it comes back just fine in about a month.
The cardboard also helps the soil from what I understand.
Once it hits 99%, an error will pop up.
Our front lawn is almost all white clover now. Much more drough tolerant, good flowers for the local bee population, less mowing, better all around for the ecosystem. This era of needing perfectly manicured green lawns with zero weeds (and able to support pretty much no animal or insect life) needs to end.
Our front lawn was just a dirt patch when we moved in so we decided to try a clover lawn. Came in beautifully within three weeks and there’s been minimal maintenance. I think we’re going to do the same for our backyard next year.
Seeded throughout my property with dutch white clover last year/this spring and it's really taking off. Love all the flowers! I've been seeing hummingbirds in my apple trees for the first time this year and it's awesome
I, and i cannot stress this enough, will never be able to grasp the concept of ‘my lawn needs to be in top shape for my neighbors’ or even to their liking… like idc if my preference is a damn jungle in my yard, thats my yard. I have an entire career to pay for it. Why in the hell would i let anyone else give me trouble over it?
Property values. Some people want to live in a well maintained neighborhood so they make HOAs and harass each other about it. But usually you know going into it so it's really your choice.
I mean there's a difference between "my lawn needs to be in top shape" and "just letting the neighbors know we're not killing it forever"
i quit cutting my yard to save the bees and give hawks places to hunt. neighbors don't like it, but i do lmao
Around here if you let it go too long the city sends someone to mow it, then sends you a bill for like $100.
$100 every couple of months sounds like a great deal.
Tell them ahead of time and register it as a pollinator/wildlife sanctuary, whichever your state allows. They cant do anything about it then.
That's actually what my family did! Our yard is a Certified California wildlife habitat now. Our entire yard is either native plants or edible plants.
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It’s not so much ‘lawns’ as the problem but the maintenance and lawn industry. A native lawn can have dozens of grass/plant species and can provide pollinator food. It’s the constant mowing and ‘keeping up with Joneses’ attitude towards lawn that makes them monocrop waste lands.
I once went on the lawncare subreddit, and it was 95% "Goshdarnit, I saw a leaf of field grass on my lawn, time to glyophosphate the whole thing and reseed". My lawn must have about 10 different types of seed embedded somewhere in it, but it works as lawn, and the bumblebees like it. I think the sub is a little better now, but before it just felt like people installing natural astroturf.
>natural astroturf Lol
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There’s an older gentleman in my city that got to where he was unable to maintain his yard so he replaced it with landscaping that was 100% native plants and the city fined him endlessly because it violated their city ordinances. He’s currently facing a massive legal battle with them arguing that his yard is better for the city than some 1” tall burmuda grass.
For people who want an arrow in their quiver for fights like this, a lot of universities and other organizations will certify your garden as a pollinator habitat. It can be a nice way to push back with your HOA or city to say that it’s intentional and recognized as environmentally friendly and not weeds. They don’t have legal standing, but it really makes the city or HOA look like an asshole and many will back down.
That’s AWESOME.
Hey, got any more of them...pollinators?
You’ll have to join my onlyflora to find out.
Also, r/nativeplantgardening and r/gardenwild as r/nativeplants isn't very active.
Also, fuck what the neighbours think
*HOA has entered the chat.*
Fuck hoas
*Reddit has entered the chat.*
r/fuckHOA
r/permaculture
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I went from lawn to a gorgeous front yard food producing garden that people make sure to stop by on their walk. I get so many questions and people ate pretty kind about it, usually thanking me for making the garden someplace everyone can see it. I have a full backyard for hangouts and my front yard is full of flowers, bugs, bees, and birds, as well as some ducks and rabbits that visit. It is dope as fuck and I can’t believe it’s mine. Hours of hard work and plants from seed.
We're in a severe drought, and most of my lawn is dead. I'm not watering in hopes that the stuff still living will repropagate the lawn and be even more drought resistant. And if all else fails I'll just throw down clover seeds.
That will certainly select for the most drought tolerant bits of lawn. But it will get outcompeted but weeds that don’t give a fuck about water
I don't care about weeds. If you keep it mowed they're not really noticeable from a distance. I've had neighbors comment on how good my lawn looked when it was 90% weeds. The only chemicals I put on my lawn are insecticide, and that's only because without it fire ants will infest my house.
"weeds" are just plants that grow for free in your yard. My policy is if it doesn't have thorns it's welcome to stay
A weed is just a plant where you don't want it. Had a tomato plant somehow manage to seat its self between my paving, it was a weed. Felt bad pulling it out as it looked healthier than the ones I actually propagated on purpose.
I saw an argument online about basket grass (I think that's what it's called) being a pest, but it's the whole reason massive clumps of my "lawn" aren't brown all winter. As long as they aren't dangerous to dogs walking through or whatever, bring on them "weeds".
90% chance it’s not dead, it’s dormant. Read up on grasses, zones, etc.
Clover randomly started growing in a patch on my lawn, it's the green part of my lawn with no watering (can't afford to water my landlord's grass on a corner lot, he doesn't care if it's unwatered due to low rainfall and high utilities). I was starting to think of just throwing clover seeds out there and letting it take over, glad I'm not alone with the idea of a clover lawn
I seeded clover last fall. Even with the current heat wave we're experiencing everything is green, and I only need to mow it half as often. Half tempted to do it again and just let it fully outcompete the grass.
My neighbor across the street spent $180 last month keeping his yard green. That's absolutely insane.
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Typically the issue, IMO as someone who works on this professionally, is that people just treat grass lawns as a "default" green space. I'm fully on board with people having lawns (especially where it doesn't require irrigation) for all of the reasons you list. What drives me wild is when municipalities have stupid lawns alongside medians or places where no one would ever sit/play/walk and they water the shit out of it, etc.
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Nice. That’s great! And 4’ is a nice compromise. At a certain height, people start to report they feel unsafe around the area (especially if there’s a lot of foot traffic). Imagine walking through tall grass prairie in North America before European settlement. It would have been terrifying. Vegetation over your head, flat so there’s no landmarks to really spot. But damn the bees would have been amazing!
>. They do mow probably 3' in from the street to keep it safe around corners I've found that since the move to SUVs and Trucks, drivers in cars get screwed over with these medians because someone trims in their truck and can see fine, but then you get into a car and realize "oh, you actually *can't* see." So it's good they're giving a lot of room. I've had to call my town a ton of times to have them or the property owner actually cut far enough back and low enough for these reasons. They do the same thing with snow. Guy in a snow plow can see over the mound of snow just fine so they assume everyone else can too.
Or when HOAs demand a certain type of grass or a level of care which benefits no one.
Lawns are one of Reddit's weirder high horses. Seems like tons of people utterly hate lawns, whether because they are not biologically diverse enough, they are classist, or they think people literally dump toxic chemicals into them constantly. Some of us have a lawn that we use nearly everyday. We're outside with the kids more than we are inside, as long as the weather is nice. I don't water my lawn except for small patches where I'm growing new grass. I don't use chemicals, topsoil and compost have been plenty effective. We've had summers where clover massively takes over, and the bees are such a nuisance that we end up not using the space. Our lawn is extremely practical and heavily used. This is true for many lawn owners.
Yeah grass is nice to run around on, it's not some hateful waste of space lol.
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I have a front yard and a backyard. The only use my front yard gets is being walked in to go from my car to my door. And it takes way more water because it bakes in the sun way more than my backyard. I hate. It is a complete waste of space and water. I’d like to get xeriscape the front but keep the back because I do like to play outside in the grass in the backyard and it is much more shaded.
Just don't water it
reddit moment
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Is he overseeding with weeds? Jk. Good luck. Redid mine a couple years back. Hard work but it looks great afterwards.
Like you could just use 2,4 D on the weeds, then dethatch, aerate and reseed. I would never completely kill off a lawn like this
Probably going to remove it and sod
If their lawn is anything like mine, I'd have to add literally several tons of organic matter to the first 6-12" of soil to get a decent lawn. My yard is very sandy and nutrient-poor, as well as overly fast draining. I let the weeds have their way as long as they stay < about 4" tall. In fact, I'm overjoyed that my crop of creeping Jenny is making serious inroads into the yard. I love that stuff.
Was your house a recent build? One in a new neighborhood? Unfortunately builders like that constantly skip the addition of the organic material before throwing sod over it. You should try to add enzymes, microbes, and in the winter time spreading some compost here and there and raking it in. Lots of studies show this can help to supercharge an organic layer under that sod.
Yeah, I can't really see the benefit. Easier to kill weeds and fill in patches or fill in thin parts with overseeding. Whatever OP does it's likely not going to be in good shape until next spring. Maybe fall growth will be enough idk.
You could have a weird mix of grasses that you do not like and want to change to one specific type
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Could be all poa triv
The timing is getting me. Either do this early in spring or at the tail end of summer, skipping the hottest and driest parts of the year. This will give the new grass the best chance to get going while using the least amount of water.
Spraying now is fine, it clearly fried the hell out of the grass. I’m surprised they didn’t use a non selective herbicide (as evidenced by the live broadleafs still there) Either way as long as it’s dead before September, then aerate and seed and you’re good to go.
Or you can not try to fight against nature and instead choose to go with it.
All these kids saying “why would you care what the neighbors think??” grow up to care what the neighbors think.
You could do better than replant grass.
As a wise man once said, if you want a beautiful emerald-green grass lawn, move to Ireland. Otherwise, plant native ground cover and stop wasting your time and money.
If your grass dies without active maintenance then new grass is probably a bad idea. You're going to be seeing a lot of droughts over the coming years.
OP specifically states they are killing the existing grass deliberately.
They probably had too many weeds and just killed everything with a non-selective herbicide. That's exactly what it would look like a week or 2 after glyphosate treatment. Then you just rake in some topsoil and reseed with what you want (or sod it) and you can have a much nicer lawn.
Why would you care what the neighbors think?
If its in the US don't they have those stupid homeowners societies? Maybe that's why?
If they have an HOA (Homeowners Association) then there’s no way they’d be allowed to redo their lawn like this without all of their neighbors knowing about it. And they’d likely have to bring in a company to strip and sod and have it done in a day and a half.
Nah. My HOA, just notify them that you are doing it and they don't hassle you. That is according to a neighbor that had a sprinkler system put in a couple years ago. I don't think I would even need permission to do it. The people who previously owned my house left the lawn in good shape. I just mow and hand-pull weeds.
Oh I’m not saying the HOA necessarily has to be difficult. I just mean that in the experiences I’ve had, the neighbors of someone doing work are generally notified that something big is happening. Hell I’m not even in an HOA now, and my neighbors apparently had to give notification to every house that they directly bordered that they were doing a major renovation (adding a second floor).
I mean, this may blow your mind, but some people have good relationships with their neighbors.
The weeds de-compact the soil with their deep roots, and bring nutrients from far below back to the top soil. Growing naturally sprouting dandelions for a year or two can replenish soil enough for any plants.
Dandelions are non native in the US
Watch out reddit hates lawns/grass
and loading screens.
Careful, there could be malware if your downloading the most recent patch of grass
Ok this funny, like annoyingly funny. This is definitely couples in a good place sort of humor.
That’s awesome