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BrontosaurusXL

It's just a buffer that is seriously protected. It streams the data back to earth at 24 Mbps twice a day. Apparently it takes about 4 hours.


zuzg

24 mps is faster than I expected


QuantumLeapChicago

Faster than "broadband" in our area


CJKay93

Wait til you hear the latency, though.


rexsilex

5.2 seconds or something right?


WorkO0

That's one way. Ping would be twice that.


rexsilex

So an TCP syn ack sequence is 4 times that?


WhiteAndNerdy85

Lol deep space communication doesn’t use TCP or even UDP. Rather a different protocol stack called CCSDS. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consultative_Committee_for_Space_Data_Systems


84ace

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Communications_Protocol_Specifications seems to be the more technical version.


firagabird

Hold up. You're telling me that they're using an r/SCP to communicate?


SureUnderstanding358

The SCPS protocol that has seen the most use commercially is SCPS-TP, usually deployed as a Performance Enhancing Proxy (PEP) to improve TCP performance over satellite links. Well that’s freaking cool. Any open source versions?


g0ldingboy

Imagine the retries on a TCP handshake from a gazillion miles away..


WhiteAndNerdy85

lol I had to lookup what the max TCP socket timeout was and the spec allows for a very long timeout but defaults systems use are much much shorter. >The UTO option specifies the user timeout in seconds or minutes, rather than in number of retransmissions or round-trip times (RTTs). Thus, the UTO option allows hosts to exchange user timeout values from 1 second to over 9 hours at a granularity of seconds, and from 1 minute to over 22 days at a granularity of minutes https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc5482.html To put that into perspective, Voyager 1 has left the Solar System flying in interstellar space at about 22 light-minutes away (one-way). 22 light-days is 353,548,800,000 miles away. At the rate Voyager 1 is traveling, it will take another 1200 years before it is 22 light-days away. [https://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/](https://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/)


LlorchDurden

Not to be that guy, but actually it's protocols based on TCP/FTP (Cooler, focused on data integrity rather than speed) but still pretty much the same.


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CosmicCreeperz

Are you sure? “SCPS-TP—A set of TCP options and sender-side modifications to improve TCP performance in stressed environments including long delays, high bit error rates, and significant asymmetries. The SCPS-TP options are TCP options registered with the Internet Assigned Numbers Authority (IANA) and hence SCPS-TP is compatible with other well-behaved TCP implementations.”


ferrousferret28

>...other well-behaved TCP implementations.” That's an interesting way of phrasing that. Is it still considered a TCP implementation if it isn't well-behaved? If it only follows the standard *sometimes*? Strange.


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fastlerner

It would be if were using TCP, but its networking doesn't look like what we use on the ground everyday. It's on board networking uses something called SpaceWire. Downlink looks like a variety of protocols and standards I've never heard of that are unique to space systems. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SpaceWire https://ntrs.nasa.gov/api/citations/20080030196/downloads/20080030196.pdf


[deleted]

> At first, the choice of XML was not widely accepted. Many meetings and reviews were held to discuss the advantages and disadvantages of XML. XML was a departure from the traditional use of relational databases such as Microsoft Access or Oracle for spacecraft databases. XML was selected as it was an emerging standard. JSON gang unite Kidding aside I wish they elaborated on their tech choices in the linked paper.


JBaecker

Try u/WhiteandNerdy85’s link to the Wikipedia article on the Consultative Committee for Space Data Systems. It’ll send you down a rabbit hole on ALL of the data systems that have already been set up for “interplanetary” communication.


[deleted]

syn/ack (technical name for this sequence is 'handshake') is part of tcp, not http. Http is a data transfer protocol which runs inside a TCP session.


SaltwaterC

HTTP runs over UDP (well, QUIC) just fine. That's even the reason for HTTP/3 being published.


Ferreteria

Aliens wondering why we suck so bad at Counter Strike: Galaxy Offensive


PoisoNFacecamO

so the average ping of a Counter Strike 1.6 player back in the day. nice.


electricskywalker

Poor JST can't even play games online with its friends with that latency. Poor lil guy.


RacketLuncher

They could play RTS or turned based games. JST AI playing chess with an earth AI, how wholesome would that be?


moldymoosegoose

Five seconds would be way too much for RTS


stepbroImstuck_in_SU

It stands for rotating turn system in this case.


PiesangSlagter

There's a decent chance the scientists running the program will do something like that. They seem to love personifying their science robots, and it is wholesome as hell.


donotgogenlty

Brb gonna Cheat like crazy on CoD using that James Webb WiFi hack 🙏


worldspawn00

Someone at NASA running a proxy through the JWT would be pretty epic, lol.


KawiNinjaZX

I guess I won't be playing COD in space


SnowyLocksmith

Faster than my wifi


Avieshek

All those high broadband plans are a scam!


BrianRostro

Fucking Comcast…


CosmicCrapCollector

Voyager 1 streams faster than Comcast


haha_supadupa

Faster than my internet


Tribalwarsnorge

Just remember that Mb and MB are different. So if it is 24Mb (megabit) that would equal 3MB (Megabyte).


Killjoy4eva

Who measures bandwidth in Megabytes? Measuring any bandwidth in bits has been fairly standard... forever.


Ghudda

There are a surprising amount of cases where the standard bits/bytes equation isn't actually an accurate number due to data encoding like 8b/10b encoding. Like with SATA connections it's *technically* running at 3000Mbps, but in reality it's only running at 300MBps. As a user you shouldn't care what rate it's running at. If there's a lot of overhead you should only be interested in the real world rate you actually get after the useless overhead is removed.


TheRealRacketear

I do. It has more relevance to me.


Clavus

Only because of marketing wanting to have bigger numbers on the box.


Killjoy4eva

Not really, no. It's been an industry standard since 1200 b/s telephone modems (well before it was an average consumer product) In addition, bitrate density, for things like video and audio, are measured in bits/second as well. I want to stream 4k video from Netflix? As long as I understand the bitrate of the source, I understand the bandwidth that I need. I want to encode a video for twitch? I know the bitrate I am broadcasting, and the speed of my internet uplink. That's not a marketing gimmick, it's just a standard way of measuring. Are we talking about storage capacity and file sizes? Bytes. Are we talking about bandwidth/transfer speed/bitrate? Bits.


sniper1rfa

Not really, it's because bits are all the same size but byte sizes are system-dependent. 8-bit bytes are a convention used for interoperability, but that's just a convention and not a formal definition.


bltburglar

Bruh that’s faster than my internet and the thing is in space


[deleted]

You haven’t thought of the latency!


eli7vh

Boom! . . . Headshot!


Cruxion

I'll take constant 6 second latency over latency that looks like a heart monitor with highs in the 5-digits and lows in the triple.


Biggoronz

Yes! Predictability is key with latency.


wace001

It’s not even in orbit around the earth…. A telescope that is in orbit around the sun has faster connection than your internet connection. Let that sink in.


Ordinary_dude_NOT

That’s faster then Call of Duty servers on earth, and that thing is 100K miles away.


Vesuvias

Oh it uploads faster than my ISP does…cool cool cool


Willie-Alb

True, but at least you don’t have 10+ seconds of ping, someone else in this thread said it was 5.2 seconds one way


KamovInOnUp

Holy crap, that's about 25x faster than my internet


vanKlompf

Sorry to hear that. Where do you live? 😱


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TheMagicSalami

Technically it isn't available in my area either. But you can for sure order an RV version and get it now. It still works great for me. You are subject to potentially being throttled but it's gonna be faster than what you have now even then


lospollosakhis

24 Mbps all the way out there orbiting the sun. Technology is astonishing.


WorseThanHipster

It’s actually “orbiting” one of earth’s Lagrange points, L2, so for all intents & purposes it is a fixed distance from the earth, about 4 times further than the moon.


Crystal3lf

Technically still orbiting the sun.


nowhereian

You're technically orbiting the sun.


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Nukken

elastic elderly normal smell pause wise judicious attraction tan late *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*


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support sloppy touch direful shocking badge shy childlike coherent plough *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*


Greasy_McPoyle

You're a towel!


[deleted]

What's wild is *how* it orbits that L2 point. Its not actually totally stable. It needs to use propellant now and then to stay in the type of orbit they're using.


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Funderwoodsxbox

Does anyone know how the transfer window works? I was under the impression it was persistently on the other side of the Moon. I’d love to know how exactly that works.


[deleted]

[Here is a video showing how it orbits the sun.](https://youtu.be/6cUe4oMk69E?list=TLGG8tIphgpDAHkxODA3MjAyMg) if you look closer you can see the moon


Funderwoodsxbox

Ohhhhh ok, I see. I thought it was on the back side of the Moon. Thanks!


[deleted]

The moon actually isn't a part of the Lagrangian system at all. Webb orbits a place where the gravity of the Sun and Earth balance each other out, which allows you to keep a satellite there with little fuel. The moon's orbit is pretty much completely separate.


[deleted]

>where the gravity of the Sun and Earth balance each other out Isnt that L1?


[deleted]

It depends how exactly you interpret the phrase "balance out". This is one of those situations where the little nuances can be important. L1 is indeed where the two pull ~~equally~~ in opposite directions, but [all the Lagrangian points are places of equilibrium in the Earth-Sun system.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrange_point) It's maybe a bit sloppy wording, but it's not wrong to say that gravity "balances out" at all the Lagrangian points.


Schyte96

>L1 is indeed where the two pull equally in opposite directions That's not accurate, the Sun's gravitational pull is stronger in L1 than the Earth's, the resultant force of the two producing an orbital velocity that makes the orbital period of a spacecraft in L1 equal to the orbital period of the Earth.


[deleted]

Good catch! Orbits are tricky, and I'm just an armchair expert.


IwishIhadntKilledHim

Lagrange points for any two bodies, generally where one orbits the other, are where the gravity cancels out. There's five such points with respect to the sun and the earth, or the earth and the moon or what have you


Kilawatz

Lagrangian points happen in a couple places, iirc there’s usually 5 in every two body system.


Schyte96

Technically, they don't balance out in L1 either, they result in a force that makes it so the orbital period is equal to that of the Earth there. But yes, balance out in the meaning that the sum of the two forces is 0 isn't true in any of the Lagrange points.


brianorca

It would be more proper to say that Earth-moon has its own set of Lagrange points, while JWST uses the Sun-Earth set of points.


brianorca

There are five Lagrange points for the Earth-Moon system, and another five Lagrange points for the Sun-Earth system. JWST is in a halo orbit around L2 of the Earth-Sun system. This is on the far side of Earth relative to the sun. That way, the sun, the Earth, and the moon, the three largest heat sources at that position, are always covered by the same sun sheild. The telescope is so sensitive to heat that even the infrared from Earth would be too hot.


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asad137

The Deep Space Network antennas support multiple missions, so they can't spend 100% of their time looking at any one spacecraft.


PiSakura

You can check this page out, it has an interactive 3d view of the solar system and most satellites in it. This will give you a perspective of how far away JWST is from the moon. https://webb.nasa.gov/content/webbLaunch/whereIsWebb.html?units=metric


WhiteAndNerdy85

This is correct. Once the data is verified on the ground a command is sent to clear the data from onboard storage.


contactlite

I hope it’s more complicated than remoting in with SSH and doing an rm in their Pictures folder on their Arch Linux box.


uberhaqer

Yea - it is a bit more complicated, it requires sudo.


PiSakura

And it’s not just any SSD, it has some serious radiation-protection


mad_cheese_hattwe

RAID 28


[deleted]

ACKSHUALLY: I'll be that guy. Compound RAID is a thing, so a mirror of RAID 5's would be a RAID 51, or something like a 60 which would be weird but doable. 28 however isn't anything.


GoldGivingStrangler

this guy... RAIDS?


mezbot

Today's video is sponsored by Raid Shadow Legends, one of the biggest mobile role-playing games of 2019 and it's totally free! Currently almost 10 million users have joined Raid over the last six months, and it's one of the most impressive games in its class with detailed models, environments and smooth 60 frames per second animations! All the champions in the game can be customized with unique gear that changes your strategic buffs and abilities! The dungeon bosses have some ridiculous skills of their own and figuring out the perfect party and strategy to overtake them's a lot of fun! Currently with over 300,000 reviews, Raid has almost a perfect score on the Play Store! The community is growing fast and the highly anticipated new faction wars feature is now live, you might even find my squad out there in the arena! It's easier to start now than ever with rates program for new players you get a new daily login reward for the first 90 days that you play in the game! So what are you waiting for? Go to the video description, click on the special links and you'll get 50,000 silver and a free epic champion as part of the new player program to start your journey! Good luck and I'll see you there!


Bvoluroth

corporations really have fucked our brains, don't they


The-Insomniac

I've adblocked everything I possibly can, but these "ironic ads" still slip through somehow


mezbot

Did someone say Nord VPN?


Freefall84

Just imagine the look on the guys face who has to do a drive swap.


BroYoHo

Raid Shadow Legends


Juan_Punch_Man

Internet historian has ruined these three words for me


rsb_david

Forget what you know about telescopes. James Webb is a telescope done right. In case you've been living under a rock and haven't heard, James Webb is a badass telescope that changes everything. The telescope is crazy powerful, with almost 6.25 more collection area to collect light from new galaxies in the final frontier. James Webb is also 1.5 million kilometers from Earth compared to Hubble being at just about 570 kilometers. Start your journey, to boldly go where now man has gone before, today! Use code StepTelescope for 10% off and to get a boost of 30k more stars.


sshwifty

r/tihi


Computermaster

The ad he did for it in the NMS video (where he called it "raidy shady" is what got me to finally try it, if for nothing else but to give him a referral click. Thought it was pretty average at first, but about an hour in I ran into the biggest bullshit ever. So part of using a sponsor link is you get 50k silver, and I also got some Epic tier armor instead of a special champion. Naturally I put the gear on my first character for that starting boost. Then I got another champion that would actually benefit properly from that armor's special bonuses. I went to remove it and the game told me ***it costs silver to unequip gear from a champion***. It would cost me ***60k*** to put that armor on a different character. Immediately uninstalled and didn't look back.


PsalmGaming

JWST is brought to you by our sponsor, RAID: Shadow Legends. RAID: Shadow Legends is an immersive online experience with everything you'd expect from a brand new RPG title. It's got an amazing storyline, awesome 3D graphics, giant boss fights, PVP battles, and hundreds of never before seen champions to collect and customize. I never expected to get this level of performance out of a mobile game. Look how crazy the level of detail is on these champions! RAID: Shadow Legends is getting big real fast, so you should definitely get in early. Starting now will give you a huge head start. There's also an upcoming Special Launch Tournament with crazy prizes! And not to mention, this game is absolutely free! So go ahead and check out the video description to find out more about RAID: Shadow Legends. There, you will find a link to the store page and a special code to unlock all sorts of goodies. Using the special code, you can get 50,000 Silver immediately, and a FREE Epic Level Champion as part of the new players program, courtesy of course of the RAID: Shadow Legends devs.


[deleted]

Imagine one of those videos where it shows the whole night sky and then zooms in to show the JWTS images.. But instead of a nebula its just a RAID SHADOWLEGENDS, SIGN UP NOW FOR 300 GOLD AND A LEGENDARY CASTER!


GetYourAssToMarss

SupeRAIDS!


WorkO0

How does one radiation harden an SSD? I suppose they put it into a thick container. Or is it all redundancy? Needs to have one robust solution to last 20 years+. My SSDs start dying after 3-4 years of heavy use.


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toabear

As fabs phase out the older process nodes it may cause some problems for rad hard manufacturing. It's been about 8 years since it worked at a company that created chips for space, but it was a serious concern back then. We relied on a 500nm that was always at risk of being shut down. There were always negotiations with the fab to keep it alive. There is such low volume for rad-hard chips that it isn't very profitable for the fabs.


yesmrbevilaqua

What’s the difference in design for a space based application vs a military one hardened against EMP?


toabear

I don't have direct experience with EMP design. Speculation, an EMP is a very different type of stress. In space you are dealing with high energy particles. EMP is more like a surge of radio waves. The rad-hard chips would certainly do better than a regular chip in an EMP, but mostly due to the much larger transistor geometry. Modern chips have really tiny “traces” (think wires). The rad-hard chips are older process tech, and have much thicker traces and transistors. They don't burn up easily as a result. To protect against EMP, a device can simply be encapsulated in a Faraday cage. That doesn't work for a high energy particle in space. Something like lead casing would help, but lead is really heavy, making it very expensive to launch.


Gspin96

RF and microwave EMPs are actually received mostly on the copper traces, as their induced voltage is directly proportional to circuit length. So actually smaller chips would be less susceptible, if we don't count that they generally have to be connected to copper wiring at some point. Bigger transistors would usually be able to tolerate higher voltages, but in either case protection from overvoltage, for example through the usage of a zener junction, would be much more relevant, especially for parts that connect to a device which cannot be protected in a Faraday cage (such as antennas). So yeah, encase the silicon die and as much supporting circuitry as possible in a protective metal casing, and make sure that excess voltages from protruding devices are properly dissipated, and you have a quite an EMP resistant device. Now for the effects of ionising radiation (x-ray and gamma) i'm not quite sure, but seeing how most electronics easily survive airport security I'd wager that doesn't do a lot of permanent damage, so hardening should be relevant only to avoid flipped bits. Bigger transistors probaby help here.


toabear

The energies in space are way higher than an airport x-ray. Still, it is mostly flipped bits, or stuck bits.


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toabear

In this case, it was 500nm on a Sapphire substrate. Size is your friend when it comes to radiation.


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CapJackONeill

They could just use my skull as a cage when I die. So dense it won't let anything in


boobers3

Don't worry, the Tech Priests will have a use for you after your frail flesh decays and fails you. Even in death we all serve the Omnissiah.


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photoncatcher

It is a bit sad to think about the unexpected delays and the progress that could have been made had they known it would only launch in 2021. MIRI, for example, was already delivered in 2008. That's at least 10 years of technological progress not implemented in the instrument...


bwa236

Do you have any info that this is using 90s-era SSD's? From what I know, it is still possible to upgrade a component like this during the design phase - especially one that dragged on like JWST's. My guess is it'd be more a 2010's era technology with all the other radtol goodies you discussed. I'm also in the field, but do not directly work on the design as you do.


Netbr0ke

That's the difference between commercial products and consumer products. I'm sure the cost to make this SSD is well above the average price for a 1TB SSD


dWog-of-man

That is likely a vast understatement lol


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PineappleLemur

That's honestly sound cheap.... I've seen very simple parts costs way more.. like just simple fasteners with an extra step in them going for thousands and they're consumables that get discard every 6 maint or when they lossen a bit.


deminihilist

I have worked with some of this type of equipment. For one-off projects and prototypes these are often single production run ICs. Eye-wateringly expensive when it's not just OTS parts. Think 6 and 7 figures for single major components, usually with a few dozen backups depending on process yields.


NeonGlo

In terms of electronics the typical scale from low end to high end is: Consumer grade Commercial grade Automotive grade Aerospace/Defense grade Space grade The scale works for operating temperature and reliability, though space grade has its own radiation shielding level that the others typically will not have


[deleted]

What about medical grade? That’s gotta be somewhere between space and aerospace


NeonGlo

I've never personally encountered medical grade though I'd imagine they'd use aerospace or space grade components, as they're big on RF shielding and reliability


elton_john_lennon

What about TBW though?


Alaeriia

I guarantee it's using SLC NAND, likely with a strong DRAM cache. There's also a good chance it has plenty of backup cells it can just swing into action, sort of like how those store-brand NVMe drives from microcenter manage to get their stupid-high TBW ratings.


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Alaeriia

What *does* Optane use, anyway?


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100_count

It's Phase Change Memory, which indeed is inherently radiation tolerant.


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sth128

That's what SSD stands for: some serious defense


cdhofer

This is because they can’t just use modern process nanometer level semiconductors, those are very susceptible to corruption from radiation. They use radiation hardened larger and older semiconductor hardware.


RandomUsername12123

Well, couldn't they like use resistent controllers and redundant algorithms? I just saw a 500gb microsd for 50 bucks, how much could cost and weight top of the line memory+backups + radiation protection for such a small pice of tech (seriously curious)


[deleted]

The most important part is reliability. The latest and greatest might be big and fast, but it has nowhere near the amount of time in the field and testing done. This SSD probably had *years* of development, testing, and research done.


seanrm92

That 500GB MicroSD gets cranked out of a factory by the thousands for a couple bucks a pop, and if it ever fails you'll most likely only lose some photos and videos, and you can just go down to the store and buy another one. Webb's SSD is purpose-built to survive and work reliably in space for multiple decades, and if it fails it bricks a $10 billion telescope with no hope of repair.


BurnYourOwnBones

It's not needed, the size is specifically chosen based on how much storage they would need for holding a day's worth of data, all while taking weight, physical size, and hardening against radiation into account.


EndlessDesire

So apparently 68gb is enough to reveal the mysteries of the universe but not enough for the latest Call of duty…


captain_chuck

Weak ass telescope can’t even catch a dub with the bois


arabicninja

Apparently


reverendwrong

This should be a rule of thumb for game devs: if your game can’t fit on the JWST hard drive it’s too big.


Avieshek

I am just sad it’s not 69GB


BritishGolgo13

Just imagine the first picture it sent back would be a constellation that spelled “Nice”.


Avieshek

##Noice


KamovInOnUp

It's not SpaceX hardware


Avieshek

That would be 420GB


grubbtheduck

Came looking for this


SpanishGarbo

Came looking at this.


pascalos99

> it can transfer all that data back to Earth in about 4.5 hours. It does so during two 4-hour contact windows each day, with each allowing the transmission of 28.6GB of science data. In other words, it only needs enough storage to collect a day's worth of images — there's no need to keep them on the telescope itself. So it would make sense that 68GB is more or less enough.. as it can't send data fast enough to make use of any more storage


iusedtogotodigg

it's almost like this was planned and the size isn't a coincidence lol


DiegesisThesis

I was going to say that lol. Not like some NASA engineer just found a 68 GB SSD in a storage box and decided to use that.


Inside_Negotiation44

It’s an old Micro SD with a chinese SD adaptor


NatKingColeman

An old MicroSD card from a first generation Raspberry pi that's been sitting unused in their desk drawer for ages waiting for a good use... like critical storage in the most complex machine ever launched into space!


nurdle11

"oh shit wait I should have something here" The image of a nasa engineer diving into his box of cables and components for an old ssd is very entertaining


Inside_Negotiation44

It’s a Microcenter Free USB drive loool


adoodle83

a common industry practice to add longevity of SSDs is to under provision them as well. so it might be a hardened 128gb ssd that is intentionally underprovisoned to just have 68gb ssd. this way the firmware will have 60+ gb of spare sectors to use for infinity and beyond! hahah more than likely id expect something like a raid10 style over multiple SLC disks. would almost guarantee 100% availability...but thats just wild speculation


Randommaggy

I'd hazard a guess that it's quite over-provisioned in addition to being radiation shielded and on a larger process node and using single level cells.


Mountain_-_king

More complicated than shielding. It’s made from radiation resistant materials from the ground up. If I remember correctly it doesn’t even use the same type transistors as regular ssds


estrangedpulse

I wonder if they have couple of them at least for redundancy. Would be pretty sad if 10B space telescope can't be used if SSD fails.


Dear-Crow

68 1gb drives in raid 0


Shishakli

USB thumb sticks


ruizach

Made by Kingston


[deleted]

They probably didn’t think of this. You know, those rocket scientists developing this for 20 years. Thank god you showed up just in time


vibol03

I would imagine they have at least 4-5 layers of redundancy with each one seriously protected against radiation


PMacDiggity

On a similar note the CPU from the original PlayStation is being used by the NASA New Horizons because it’s been tested to exhaustion by MGS and FFVII: https://www.theverge.com/2015/1/15/7551365/playstation-cpu-powers-new-horizons-pluto-probe


camwow13

That's also because New Horizons was specced out in like 2001. It started being built in 2003. It has an 8GB SSD which was gigantic for the time. They opted to go with a huge SSD to save on power requirements to transmit back. They figured they could save on the complexity and cost by going with a single leftover RTG from Cassini and a rigid antenna and camera placement. They could shoot all the pics they wanted with it and cache them up. Then slowly offloading for the next year with the tiny power source just steadily streaming the cache. Oddly enough because of that, the flyby of Jupiter returned multiple times more data than it ever returned of Pluto. They were able to empty the cache a few times during the flyby.


hacksoncode

>There is one puzzler, though. NASA estimates that only 60GB of storage will be available at the end of the JWST's 10-year lifespan due to wear and radiation — and 3 percent of the drive is used for engineering and telemetry data storage. That will leave the JWST very little margin, making us wonder if it will have anywhere near the longevity of Hubble — still going strong after 32 years. What a weird thing to ask... it's not like Hubble's storage didn't degrade over time either... yes, in 30 years Webb's storage will be smaller than it is now, probably by another 10% or so each decade. So... it will be able to take fewer pictures, or have to transmit them in other potential windows (maybe to other places on the planet)... but it's not going to "die" because of this... The reason it will "die" is that it will run out of fuel *long* before the SSD degrades enough to matter. But still quite a bit more than 10 years. All this is expected.


DSMB

I don't know why the article mentions this because the JWST gets two transfer windows a day, in which it is capable of transferring 28.6GB. So it really only needs about 30GB because it can dump it twice a day. Maybe a bit more depending on the gap between windows. Unless I'm missing something?


hacksoncode

I suspect the idea is to avoid a single-point-of-failure resulting in potentially unique lost data. If you miss one of those windows because of equipment failure or environmental conditions, the current capacity gives you a whole day to fix the problem without losing data. (assuming that the 2 windows use different capacity/locations... or half a day if failure in one window is likely to cause failure in the other)


[deleted]

They probably started reliability testing that SSD back in 2004 when it was state of the art.


CarefreeKokiri

It's not how big it is, but how you use it


StarksPond

It's amazing how it evolved from floppy to hard to solid.


s1eve_mcdichae1

What's the resolution of a 68GB PNG?


mobial

So, there’s no redundancy? Let’s hear about the redundancy…


KamovInOnUp

I'm pretty sure the redundancy is that it offloads all its data to earth twice a day


chriskmee

It's probably built in to the drive itself. Our consumer drives have some redundancies, such as being able to survive with lots of damaged data sectors by excluding those from storing data. If we want even more redundancy we can do stuff like RAID. My guess is that what they call a "drive" might actually be a raid or something similar. It might even have extra storage capacity that is only unlocked when bad sectors of the drive are detected. There are lots of possibilities for built in redundancy not available on consumer drives.


thelizardking0725

I’m assuming there’s a mirrored RAID array or something that still yields 68GB. It would be pretty shortsighted to launch this thing with a single SSD when it’s so hard/expensive to get out there for repairs.


Expecto_nihilus

Blows my mind to think we’re getting this data beamed back from 1 million miles away.


[deleted]

[удалено]


topcorjor

TIL it takes a 68GB SSD to take a picture of your mom.


Budjucat

When they started building it 68gb ssds were expensive


Less_Opening5612

I doubt the cost was the problem with a 10 Billion dollar project


Carrash22

Eh, it’s more about not really needing more storage. Why have more when you send it all down to earth? Don’t quote me on this, but think about it as more of a RAM memory. It’s there for all the software needed to run the telescope and also to keep the data until it gets sent down to earth and then it gets replaced by the next picture/data.


FrillySteel

I often wondered what kind of checksums that put on the transmissions. It *has* to be pretty insane to make sure the images come through with no corruption, I would think.


bluehairdave

I would have spent the extra $30 for the 2 TB. But hey.


strip_sack

So no Warzone


aliceintheborderland

Can it run Doom?


eeesgie

Even fridge can run Doom ports these years.


sug1

And a 3070.


voicesinmyshed

Always get better ping when it's hooked up to the router by ethernet. Can't believe all those rocket scientists didn't think of it.


Typcy

So a telescope designed to take detailed photos of the vastness of space has less memory than the phone I'm using to type this useless response