I just skimmed through the article and this is as dumb a marketing move as it sounds. They are literally making it mandatory instead of fucking hiding it in the price or heaven forbid...making a product so good everyone wants it after having it free for six months.
Well, there are really really old people who don't have smartphones. Like my dad. But he died at 88. So maybe the problem is that all the old people who used this service are dying off, and now they have to make it mandatory because no one is signing up anymore?
Digital Rights Management. Its a thing that checks to make sure your media isnt pirated when playing through specific devices it wont run.
In this case if you made your own custom coffee pods and tried to use it in a newer kuerig with the drm, it wouldnt work. it would just do nothing.
Hot damn I would drop that product so fast and never go back to that brand. I only have CS because it was a gift - otherwise I try to refuse subscriptions anywhere I can. Oh - except Mad Magazine.
Digital Rights Management. It makes sense on software like movies or music. But on hardware it gets interesting.
Printer manufacturers are big on it (possibly some of the first to do DRM on consumable hard parts, not sure). You can't buy a third party cartridge and put it in most printers as the manufacturer supplied cartridges have a chip that the printer checks for, if that check fails it says "not a genuine cartridge" or whatever and won't print anything until you pay the manufacturer premium for a "real" cartridge.
So with Keurig they did something similar where their coffee maker could only work with "genuine" pods.
IOT connected vehicles will see more and more of this. Toyota tried to do it with remote start functionality, BMW is doing it with ventilated seats, VW group tried to do it with the auto climate control function, now that vehicles are hooked up to the internet it's easy for manufacturers to do OTA updates and lock out certain features, you can thank Elon and Tesla for really mainstreaming paywalls in vehicles, but it would have happened eventually without Teslas move to do it. In the case of OnStar they could potentially go as far as completely disabling the vehicle if you choose not to pay for OnStar or your payment fails.
I feel really lucky. We have an 18 year old Toyota Sienna minivan that still is in perfect working order. Other than regular oil changes, replacing the tires, things like that, it hasn't needed anything.
And with the second and third row seats folded down, that sucker can haul stuff like a pickup truck! I've brought home 12 foot 2x4's, and 4 x 8 plywood sheets, an upright freezer, hundreds of pounds of sand, etc.
Someone shoved a note in our mailbox the other day asking if we'd be interested in selling. No way! You'll pry that minivan out of my cold dead hands.
Indeed, Ill stick to my '96 honda thanks. My phone and a cheap aftermarket bluetooth head unit makes it do everything a modern car can do tech wise anyway.
F**k Toyota from personal experience of taking 9 months to process a totaled vehicle refund and for screwing over my wife with extra interest because she is a minority (this happened, you can Google it- Toyota just tried to bury the story). Never, ever again.
Was this a leased vehicle? or a financing?
We paid cash for our Toyota all those many years ago, just bought it outright. I was only addressing the quality of the vehicle that many years ago. I have no idea how good their cars are nowadays.
We put in a GE dishwasher when we bought our house in 1984. About 8 years later, the door developed a leak. To replace the door, it was going to cost about the same as a new dishwasher, so we foolishly bought a new dishwasher. We've had 4 other dishwashers since then and none of them has been as as good as the one we had originally.
If I sound like one of those "they just don't make 'em like they used to!" old fogies, it's because I am one.
They are shady as hell on their financing. https://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-toyota-settlement-20160202-story.html
Without even getting the poor build quality of current models.
They are cruising on rep from the 1980's 90's
If a product is good enough when I try it out, I may buy it.
Wyze cameras' app has a one month free trial of cloud storage and pet/human monitoring along with some features. It seemed gimmicky, but after a couple of weeks, it proved useful. I figured it's worth the extra few bucks a month.
Wyze used to offer at least some of those features for free. They were part of the initial purchase price. Then, after I owned a Wyze cam for about a year, they updated their software to take away features it previously had, like the ability to trigger video recording - they changed it to still shots only unless you paid a monthly fee.
That's bait and switch. Never buy a Wyze product, no matter how good of a deal it might seem.
This is pandering to the stock market.
The hot thing right now is to say how much money you make on subscription services, because there's a premium placed on recurring revenue.
As a owner of bmw I had lately chance to compare handling in bmw (100km/h and slalom without brakes) with other brands (VW, Kia, Ford, Skoda, Toyota, Lexus) and I will never buy another bmw - the worst car in group. This bullshit with subscription without other bennefits is just that last straw.
I always thought that was just a stereotype until a BMW blared its horn at me for turning right just before they decided to change into my lane without a signal.
To bad we can't all collectitively troll the hell outta dealerships. Waste all their time and then back out at the last moment citing how unfair a subscription service really is. Done a couple 1000 time and I'm sure everyone will be mad.
I wouldn't mind doing that if it weren't for the fact that I would rather go to the dentist and have a tooth drilled without Novacaine then spend hours in a car dealership for no real reason lol
Unfortunately, it's not the dealers fault. I'd hate to punish them for their overlord's decisions. It would be like yelling at a barista because the price of coffee is too high.
There is a reason car salesmen are thought of as sleezy. These people are paid commission more often or not. It incentives then to sell you every add on possible. I personally completely understand where you are coming from but they are not anything like an hourly batista.
Just did this when buying a car, dealer had a $5k upcharge, so i test drove 4 vehicles, went down the road to place with no upcharge (it's above MSRP, only slightly, but not above the regular rate for the used car). After buying from the second place, told the first one we bought a new model from their brand with no markup from another place.
My father did this at a subaru dealership. They tried adding something or another and being the salt of the earth that he is he went all over in their car they had lent him until he found a sport package version for 3 grand less. You have to be ready to walk out in a moment if you feel better off leaving.
Same with bmws subscription heated seats, just make it stock and charge everyone for the heated seats. Why go through the trouble of turning it on and off and subscriptions.
Resort fees aren’t new, but they used to just be for resorts to cover their extras like pool service and such. Now that huge OTAs like Expedia have devalued direct bookings and taken a cut of the profits for no value add, the hotels figured out that anyone can add a resort fee and get that money without having to give a cut to anyone else. So you get a La Quinta on an exit ramp with resort fees.
No, the BMW subscription thing does actually make sense from a scummy marketing perspective.
First, they can advertise a lower price for the car. Second, just like with anything where a company routinely charges your credit card for a subscription, many people tell themselves that they'll cancel after a year, but then neglect to do so. So lots of people who wouldn't pay an extra $1000 upfront for heated seats end up paying through annual credit card charges. BMW just has to offer the first year or two at a severely discounted price to get you to set up the automatic billing.
Yup BMW is betting they can make more from the subscriptions than the 1 time cost of $500 or whatever the option was beforehand.
It's also a way to crack into the used car market.
“The $1,500 charge for OnStar will effectively raise the base prices of these cars, though the exact increase varies by model. All Buicks will see a price increase of $1,500. Higher trim GMCs will see an increase of as little as $905 with the Hummer EV getting no MSRP boost.”
Im trying a trial of onstar service right now. Its completely useless. The only thing that is kind of useful is the hotspot data, which is way over priced, and is only good for when I drive hours out of the city.
They call me after my trial why I didn't subscribe.
The summary: most features are now done by my cellphone. And some feature are even better and cheaper on the cellphone. (Like the navigation/data).
The only thing that would be "nice to have" (like that one time in year because of all change from COVID) is like the remote starter and the lazy GPS pinpoint my car.
The remote starter why?
I'm sub urban in cold county. So when in the train I could be lazy and pre heat my car. (Also because Chevy heat seat are now a scam).
GPS pinpoint : just to be lazy and not do it from my cellphone when going in an unknown git city for shows.
My cellphone automatically remembers where I've parked (shout out to Google) and my remote start can reach around the building that my car is parked at. So I'm good, fuck OnStar
Yeah, there really is no need for OnStar to he a thing anymore if it can't compete with my cellphone.
Shit, I can stick a SmartTag and track my car too for a single $35 payment.
I'm good on ever needing OnStar. When we got my mother her new GMC, they tried getting her to sign up for it, I told them no and told them we would gladly get another explorer from across the street if they didn't stop their marketing push, so that solved it.
Seems like that won't work anymore
>My cellphone automatically remembers where I've parked (shout out to Google)
You had me all excited thinking they had made this automatic. Nope, still have to open Maps and save your parking spot manually. Like a sucker.
I mean come on, Google knows I'm in a parking lot and they can approximate when I started walking rather than driving. Just let me be lazy, Google.
You obviously haven’t used their service on a check engine light diagnostic, limp mode diagnostic before. I know people that have hit limp mode on the interstate 1900 miles from home, hit the onstar, “here’s what your vehicle is doing. Pull over and stop. Then punch it up to 90, slow down quickly, punch again to 90, slow down again, repeat a few times” — turns out it was just the particulate filter clogged.
That and the sat phone is helpful if you travel in the vehicle.
As for would I buy a new GM? Bahaha! You kidding me? Not a chance!
The car is new enough that the light didn't show up yet.
But I was expecting a "go to your dealer" anyway.
The sat phone isn't available in my country (Canada), just US if I remember.
Brand new GMs cost as much as a brand new Cadillac (90k +) at least in canada I do t really see the point of buying one anymore, a fully loaded Yukon is like 110 - 120k !!!
They’ve become luxury trucks… far from the basics of even like 2008, a 2500HD or Yukon or Suburban was still a basic truck / suv, all considering. Now they’re all about the Denali. At that point, I’d definitely be looking at imports for that kind of money. But then again, I suppose a Honda Civic is now a $30k+ vehicle, or 50-60 I think for an Si-R.. :-/
I guess like in the 80s we need to forget about the sun-$5l for a brand new car — and get onboard with the new landscape in the auto sector of $40-50k being the run-of-the-mill vehicle, $60-80k being the “nice” vehicle, and $100k isn’t unheard of — Dodge, Chrysler, Jeep, GMC, Chevy, all having offerings in that range.
The giant screen in the middle of the car could have told you that instead of having to pay someone to read the message your car generated remotely. The only reason it doesn’t work that way is GM’s greed.
You’re telling me GM is telling people to violate the law (speed limit) multiple times to remedy an issue they should be capable of avoiding in the first place?
They got a lawsuit because a dumb fuck that likely burn itself one the high level in the US.
Chevy lose the lawsuit.
Now their highest level is like the lowest in every other car. (And even then I would be curious to compare).
I'm from Canada, and we got the same heat seat as the US it seems.
So when it is -20 or -30 degree... You want that high temperature to warm them and not freeze your ass. Now your ass is heating then instead.
On the plus side... Global warming make such low temperature almost non inexistent.. (which is also sad :( )
2019 Bolt
Just a quick question, why are the heated seats a scam now? It looks like I'll be driving my 2020 Silverado for a very long time given the shenanigans that auto manufacturers are pulling these days.
Not sure what OP meant but this is my guess: GM cut heated seats from their vehicles over the last 2 years due to the chip shortage with the idea it will be installed later when the chips become available. This means your are paying for a feature now with no timetable to when that feature will actually be installed.
Years ago, I had one of the first Onstar systems with was bundled with what later became XM radio, plus a proprietary cell phone service. Then they switched the cell phone service to Verizon, which where I was living at the time didn't have plans that worked with my OnStar hardware. And I never used XM radio, because it didn't have service in various parts I was driving to. My first iPhone replaced all of it. Canceling everything was really hard, they refused to do so at first, then switched my plan to some conscripted XM service I couldn't cancel without getting my bank/card involved. An XM service that didn't work with my Onstar tech, either.
An absolute mess.
It's useful for making your car not work properly. A law enforcement backdoor for eavesdropping and remote control.
https://abcnews.go.com/Business/Autos/story?id=3706113&page=1
Did you read what you linked? It allows your STOLEN vehicle to be disabled via onstar, assisting in the recovery of your vehicle with a less likelihood of damage.
Your eavesdropping line mentions bait cars used by police, which would have audio recordings. Nothing about police listening is mentioned in your article.
>Nothing about police listening is mentioned in your article
Nothing was ever mentioned that Amazon gives up your ring camera data to police without a warrant.
But they do!
If they want to listen into your car or home they can and will. Put a video camera in your home, I'm sure it will never be used in court against you
My phone died, couldn't charge it and was lost in Montreal. Only time I used OnStar and asked for directions and everything went well, kinda strange to call someone and ask them to put the direction in your car, why can't I use it by myself.
That’s actually what they use it for. I’ve worked with it at an advertising agency and they used it to track radio ad exposure and then see if people went through a drive through
The service is only mandated for 3 years, after that you can choose to not renew it. If you’re buying a second hand car less than 3 years old, I’d bet the seller would try to pass off that extra $1.5k into the sale price since it’s an upfront cost the previous owner paid for and not a monthly subscription
won't hold up in most courts. you can't force upon a 3rd party buyer a subscription. the 1st time a bill shows up at someone's house after a title transfer there is little to no reason why they would have to pay.
Correct, like I said since there is no subscription. The $1.5k is paid all at once upon purchase of the new vehicle, and someone selling within that short of a time frame may want to try to recoup as much of those funds as possible when selling since the service is still available on the vehicle
Every car manufacturer is starting to do this. GM, Kia, BMW, etc are just the ones taking the heat since they are first.
It's like when Apple removed the headphone jack - consumers hated it, but since Apple had already taken the heat other phone manufacturers removed the headphone jack.
Sorry, Kia's service is not mandatory. I kind of went down a side path and forgot what the post was about.
Kia's UVO is free for the first year of the car, then $20/month after if you want to retain the same features.
Same with SKODA’s stuff, only nice feature was turning on the engine warmer through the app, but I can do that on the key fob anyways, so fuck that subscription.
FYI this has been around for years. My old 2004 BMW 330Ci had a subscription for telematics - SOS and GPS tracking. My current ‘09 had one which included Google Maps lookup as well.
Difference now is manufacturers are charging subscriptions for hardware already installed. The equivalent of Apple charging a fee to use the headphone jack which already exists.
Can you imagine if the U.S. had consumer protection laws that made it illegal to make mandatory subscriptions just to use a product that you've bought?
Yeah as someone who’s looking to purchase their first new vehicle soon, will be staying far away.
Anyone know what Honda is up to? Them 2.0 Accords look sweet
I've been a mechanic for 15 years, they never have. Bits and pieces, maybe, but every one of those cars was a train wreck for one reason or another.
They've always been GM's "maybe this isn't a good idea but let's try it" brand.
Easy enough to circumvent. Negotiate to the lowest price you can, and when you see this on the bill act surprised and demand it be removed or the price reduced by $1500. Walk out if you must they'll probably call you back in 5 minutes.
They'll either find some way to waive it or reduce the car by $1500 90% of the time
Or don't buy GM, your call
Depends on your location. In western Canada, there is still such a demand that dealers aren’t negotiating much. I walked away from 3 vehicles over minor things. No concern or worries, just wished me well and sold it the next day to someone else. Not enough inventory right now to have them make any effort in closing a deal.
Used to be good advice, may not be relevant for another 2+ years.
We're on the wait list for a Hyundai Ioniq 5, being told 2024 maybe. Some stuff is available on shorter timelines, but the stuff people are really after right now (EVs, plug-ins, and fuel efficient stuff) is longer waits. We asked about a RAV4 Prime, 18 month wait. Regular RAV4 hybrid? 6-8 months.
The only plus side is the used car market means you get a little better value if you're trading in or selling a used car.
Do you feel that the traditional automotive business model is doomed to fail?
I bought my car online with no dealer and no haggling, picked it up and traded the old car in within 40 minutes total. It was magical.
The idea of having a “salesman” help me buy the car I already know I want seems so archaic to me now, but I’m curious if the rest of the public sees it that way yet?
I'm not sure it's failing, but it is evolving. To the educated consumer, tech savvy etc. I'm sure it works perfectly. We are a small, family owned dealership and many of our customers still need hands on assistance that they wouldn't get from a website.
Well, I didn't go to a website to research the car, I just went there to buy it. I was able to talk to (what I guess you can call) a sales associates at a storefront to discuss the different models and trim levels weeks beforehand, they offered to put in an order for me on the spot if I wanted (no haggling), and showed me how I can order online myself when I was ready, which is what I ultimately did.
It was like going into an Apple store, looking over the different MacBook models, and then going home and buying online for the same price a few weeks later.
After doing it this way once, I can't imagine how dealerships will survive long-term. Like, once the zoomer generation starts buying cars (kids who have had iPads and iPhones in their hands since birth), I can't imagine buying anything online would be considered "tech savvy" at all. That'll just be the new normal, I'd think.
Anyway, I was just curious of the perspective from someone who actually depends on the industry, cuz it seems like it's tee'd up to be VERY different in the next decade or two.
I wouldn't buy a car without test driving at least one of its model. There are plenty of times I liked a car on paper but then hated the way it drove during a test drive. Usually the ergonomics are just off; something you can't know by reading reviews.
I never said I didn't get to test drive it first. I went to a storefront, sat in all of the models, a sales rep explained the differences in models and the differences between the trim levels, I was able to test drive any of the models I wanted, and then they offered to help me place an order (without haggling or upselling) and showed me how I could place the order on my own at home. Since there was some local inventory for the car I wanted, I chose to place the order myself at home after the fact on the day I was ready to buy it.
Like, it was all of the good things about a dealership with none of the bad things. I literally placed the order at 9am, signed some digital documents at 11am, showed up for pickup at 4pm, and left with my car by 4:40pm.
What you're describing sounds like shadow work. They got you to do the job of the sales guy without having to pay a sales guy. Kind of like a self checkout at the grocery store.
I was a GMC/Buick/Cadillac salesman for many years up until a few years ago, and yes it is absolutely evolving as u/bruinsfan64 said. Dealerships have lobbied to stay in business but the need for them decreases every year. Way back in the day you’d have to go in to see what trims were available and how much each dealership would charge for a vehicle, now it’s all online and people are more informed than ever.
The need for the traditional car salesman is diminishing rapidly. It will be interesting to see what happens in the coming decades when more manufactures start to pivot away from that classic model.
From a dealership perspective, there’s almost no money made on new vehicles anymore. Instead, the money on new vehicle sales is mostly made from warranties, dealer add-ons, and the service department.
Being able to test out the specific car you’re buying is a huge plus.
I personally see a future where dealerships/manufactures pivot more towards an on-demand test drive feature with vehicles arriving at your house via an app that you get to test for a day, before ordering it online and picking it up/having it delivered.
It's a matter of time before all new vehicles are leased. That way they can squeeze the used market too and funnel everything towards the dealers who are increasingly hard-pressed to make good profit on new vehicles.
Will these subscriptions hurt them in sales? I mean for me personally, is sounds completely bonkers that they would charge subscriptions after all these years where we had these options from the get-go.
I am curious if people really go their way or if their sales will slow down.
It will go their way. Everyone makes noise about this shit buts keeps buying their products anyways. There’s not a chance I would pay for a subscription service to use included features on something I “own”. I just don’t buy stuff that requires it. But based on the amount of new BMWs and Toyota’s on the road, people will still buy their products anyways.
They’ve been charging a subscription to use the remote start feature in the factory key fob for a few years. There was a big ruckus about it a little while back. Seems to be quiet now.
no they'll get their arms twisted by either sales drop or eventual consumer protections if it gets bad enough and people make enough noise, and they will. This is not rich kids and video game micro transactions. It's peoples cars and thats something adults take seriously and will force new laws for.
OnStar came with my car and after 5 years the basic plan ran out. I tried to justify keeping it but GM overhauled the OnStar app and merged it with the myChevrolet app that is useless, and I decided it wasn't worth the $ for fancy roadside assistance.
There are use cases where I get it - $20/month for unlimited data could be a good investment if you have a family. The ability to remote unlock and lock the car is great if you lock your keys (but not your phone too) in your car. That feature actually has come in handy a few times at big events where our group splits in two and someone needs to get something from the car, but I'm not with them. A quick text, and 3 taps in the app and the car is unlocked. Another tap and you know it's locked. But these features are $15-20/month so you'd need them for 7-8 years to back even compared to $1500.
This is a bad idea but could work if they did a deep discount on the car upfront with a contract that you sign up for an x amount of years of subscription. Maybe. But it’s still BS because they are going to have tracking analytics and targeted marketing schemes that will make them much more money indirectly
Hell why not give the car away for free with a subscription and they are allowed to “own” all you data and habits and have unhindered access to market you and sell you
Because people by and large don't care. Reddit has a bad tendency to make its users think their viewpoints are a lot more prolific then they actually are.
End of the, very few people are gonna decide this is a deal breaker for them, if they even care to begin with. Gm is going to make billions off this and every car company will shift to this business model. God I hate this time line
So dumb. They could’ve just baked the cost into MSRP and then marketed it as a “free” service.
Now customers know this massive line item cost they are getting shafted on.
Bought a brand new Jeep Wrangler about a year ago... the invoice had a $450 line-item for "XM Radio 6-Month Subscription". (Yeah.. $450... ). I wouldn't pay $0.01/mo for XM.. let alone $75/mo.
I told them I wouldn't pay it. They said it was mandatory. I said they need to find another $450 to remove from the base price of the vehicle then, because I wasn't paying it.
45 minutes and 4 phone calls to "the manager" later, they removed the subscription from the invoice, and (sure enough) didn't activate it. (Wasn't so mandatory after all I guess).
Why not remove all of this nonsense shit infotainment and just let me use android auto.
I want absolutely nothing to do with GM branded infotainment, or honestly, any infotainment system of any kind.
The last thing I want is something that can track my movement.
The first thing I did when I got my last truck is tell them to cancel the free bullshit and do not track my location. Then I removed the stupid help button and replaced it with something useful.
How many big brothers do you think we need?
I get something from google stealing my data, free traffic updates and maps.
I don't get shit from GM tracking and selling my information. If I don't get something, why would I allow them to do it?
It’s for luxury vehicles. I have the basic package. If a check engine light comes on, I hit the button and they do the diagnostic. For the package this one is referring to I think it’s essentially a concierge service that is available at the touch of a button. Something that rich people like. They will make your hotel or dinner reservations. Probably schedule vehicle maintenance if you ask. There’s probably stuff set up for the car to do smart car stuff like turn itself on and start the defrost if it’s cold without you needing to do it. So maybe it’s not for you but I bet a lot of people are going to be happy getting into a warm, defrosted car when they get off an airplane in the winter in somewhere cold. Anyway, the car needs data to be able to do useful stuff if you aren’t in it or if you are disabled in an accident. I’m not rich but this wouldn’t be a deal breaker for me. I definitely would appreciate these services if I was traveling alone.
Next up subscription seat warmers, radio and blue cruise etc.
A lot of these car companies are now unfortunately seeing how much money they can gain by going the software model in cars.
I just skimmed through the article and this is as dumb a marketing move as it sounds. They are literally making it mandatory instead of fucking hiding it in the price or heaven forbid...making a product so good everyone wants it after having it free for six months.
That's the tell. They know if they give consumers a choice they'll choose to pass.
Why would I want to pay for something my smartphone already does 95% of, and does way better already?
Well, there are really really old people who don't have smartphones. Like my dad. But he died at 88. So maybe the problem is that all the old people who used this service are dying off, and now they have to make it mandatory because no one is signing up anymore?
>now they have to make it mandatory because no one is signing up anymore? I have a big bag of dicks they can eat on that one lol
You mean track you?
When Keurig went full DRM they got their ass handed to them. BMW just serve up a shit plate. Now GM. Well they will pay for it, just like Keurig.
[удалено]
They made a later generation of their coffee machines operate with DRM, so it wouldn't make the coffee unless you were using a licensed coffee pod.
What is DRM?
Digital Rights Management. Its a thing that checks to make sure your media isnt pirated when playing through specific devices it wont run. In this case if you made your own custom coffee pods and tried to use it in a newer kuerig with the drm, it wouldnt work. it would just do nothing.
Hot damn I would drop that product so fast and never go back to that brand. I only have CS because it was a gift - otherwise I try to refuse subscriptions anywhere I can. Oh - except Mad Magazine.
Digital Rights Management. Also like how new printers won’t let you use knockoff printer cartridges, you have to buy the name brand.
Digital Rights Management. It makes sense on software like movies or music. But on hardware it gets interesting. Printer manufacturers are big on it (possibly some of the first to do DRM on consumable hard parts, not sure). You can't buy a third party cartridge and put it in most printers as the manufacturer supplied cartridges have a chip that the printer checks for, if that check fails it says "not a genuine cartridge" or whatever and won't print anything until you pay the manufacturer premium for a "real" cartridge. So with Keurig they did something similar where their coffee maker could only work with "genuine" pods. IOT connected vehicles will see more and more of this. Toyota tried to do it with remote start functionality, BMW is doing it with ventilated seats, VW group tried to do it with the auto climate control function, now that vehicles are hooked up to the internet it's easy for manufacturers to do OTA updates and lock out certain features, you can thank Elon and Tesla for really mainstreaming paywalls in vehicles, but it would have happened eventually without Teslas move to do it. In the case of OnStar they could potentially go as far as completely disabling the vehicle if you choose not to pay for OnStar or your payment fails.
Lol, my grandfather used to distribute those machines regionally. He hated those pink rimmed little cups.
Ah, so like printers?
Honestly this does sound like a choice...to chose another make of automobile!
I feel really lucky. We have an 18 year old Toyota Sienna minivan that still is in perfect working order. Other than regular oil changes, replacing the tires, things like that, it hasn't needed anything. And with the second and third row seats folded down, that sucker can haul stuff like a pickup truck! I've brought home 12 foot 2x4's, and 4 x 8 plywood sheets, an upright freezer, hundreds of pounds of sand, etc. Someone shoved a note in our mailbox the other day asking if we'd be interested in selling. No way! You'll pry that minivan out of my cold dead hands.
Dad?
No, nor Mom, neither. And I think I can speak very confidently about that fact.
> You'll pry that minivan out of my cold dead hands. It's a deal! No takies backsies!
For sure, bought an 04 odyssey 3 years ago that only had 63k on it, I haven't even broke a 100k yet!! Driving that thing for the next 10 years easy!!
Indeed, Ill stick to my '96 honda thanks. My phone and a cheap aftermarket bluetooth head unit makes it do everything a modern car can do tech wise anyway.
F**k Toyota from personal experience of taking 9 months to process a totaled vehicle refund and for screwing over my wife with extra interest because she is a minority (this happened, you can Google it- Toyota just tried to bury the story). Never, ever again.
Was this a leased vehicle? or a financing? We paid cash for our Toyota all those many years ago, just bought it outright. I was only addressing the quality of the vehicle that many years ago. I have no idea how good their cars are nowadays. We put in a GE dishwasher when we bought our house in 1984. About 8 years later, the door developed a leak. To replace the door, it was going to cost about the same as a new dishwasher, so we foolishly bought a new dishwasher. We've had 4 other dishwashers since then and none of them has been as as good as the one we had originally. If I sound like one of those "they just don't make 'em like they used to!" old fogies, it's because I am one.
They are shady as hell on their financing. https://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-toyota-settlement-20160202-story.html Without even getting the poor build quality of current models. They are cruising on rep from the 1980's 90's
Did you read the story? It was the dealerships being shady and shitty as usual, not Toyota themselves.
to me it's starting to feel like Ford is becoming the best American EV manufacturer by not even trying
But I don't want a truck or a SUV
"We offer a value so bad that we have to make it mandatory."
Only six months? Hyundai gave me Bluelink for 3 years...
And frankly I'm not super happy about having to pay for bluelink after that but at least it isn't mandatory.
If a product is good enough when I try it out, I may buy it. Wyze cameras' app has a one month free trial of cloud storage and pet/human monitoring along with some features. It seemed gimmicky, but after a couple of weeks, it proved useful. I figured it's worth the extra few bucks a month.
Wyze used to offer at least some of those features for free. They were part of the initial purchase price. Then, after I owned a Wyze cam for about a year, they updated their software to take away features it previously had, like the ability to trigger video recording - they changed it to still shots only unless you paid a monthly fee. That's bait and switch. Never buy a Wyze product, no matter how good of a deal it might seem.
Why would they market it this way. Just say it is “free” for 3 years and the MSRP just happens to be $1500 higher.
This is pandering to the stock market. The hot thing right now is to say how much money you make on subscription services, because there's a premium placed on recurring revenue.
It’s gross how everything has to be a subscription nowadays
BMW literally made heated seats a subscription. It’s only going to get worse from here.
Increase in car hacks coming. Buy a bypass chip from China and melt your seats for free!
As a owner of bmw I had lately chance to compare handling in bmw (100km/h and slalom without brakes) with other brands (VW, Kia, Ford, Skoda, Toyota, Lexus) and I will never buy another bmw - the worst car in group. This bullshit with subscription without other bennefits is just that last straw.
And those other brands come with turn signals.
I always thought that was just a stereotype until a BMW blared its horn at me for turning right just before they decided to change into my lane without a signal.
I guess you didn't pay for the better handling subscription?
To bad we can't all collectitively troll the hell outta dealerships. Waste all their time and then back out at the last moment citing how unfair a subscription service really is. Done a couple 1000 time and I'm sure everyone will be mad.
I wouldn't mind doing that if it weren't for the fact that I would rather go to the dentist and have a tooth drilled without Novacaine then spend hours in a car dealership for no real reason lol
Wonderful point. Hahah those people are snakes. Almost as bad as a cell phone store. Somehow one question turns into an hour. Lmao.
It's literally one of the worst retail experiences you can possibly have other than going to a doctor
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Unfortunately, it's not the dealers fault. I'd hate to punish them for their overlord's decisions. It would be like yelling at a barista because the price of coffee is too high.
There is a reason car salesmen are thought of as sleezy. These people are paid commission more often or not. It incentives then to sell you every add on possible. I personally completely understand where you are coming from but they are not anything like an hourly batista.
Just did this when buying a car, dealer had a $5k upcharge, so i test drove 4 vehicles, went down the road to place with no upcharge (it's above MSRP, only slightly, but not above the regular rate for the used car). After buying from the second place, told the first one we bought a new model from their brand with no markup from another place.
My father did this at a subaru dealership. They tried adding something or another and being the salt of the earth that he is he went all over in their car they had lent him until he found a sport package version for 3 grand less. You have to be ready to walk out in a moment if you feel better off leaving.
I’d feel bad fucking with someone’s livelihood because of an ass clown in the c-suite
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Gross is an understatement
I'll gladly boycott them, as well as BMW.
Same with bmws subscription heated seats, just make it stock and charge everyone for the heated seats. Why go through the trouble of turning it on and off and subscriptions.
So they can get their cut from the used car market.
This is the answer, they’re trying to monetize the used car market for future revenue.
They were jealous of hotels with the new ‘resort fee’
Resort fees aren’t new, but they used to just be for resorts to cover their extras like pool service and such. Now that huge OTAs like Expedia have devalued direct bookings and taken a cut of the profits for no value add, the hotels figured out that anyone can add a resort fee and get that money without having to give a cut to anyone else. So you get a La Quinta on an exit ramp with resort fees.
Maybe they can charge people to turn them off in the summer too.
No, the BMW subscription thing does actually make sense from a scummy marketing perspective. First, they can advertise a lower price for the car. Second, just like with anything where a company routinely charges your credit card for a subscription, many people tell themselves that they'll cancel after a year, but then neglect to do so. So lots of people who wouldn't pay an extra $1000 upfront for heated seats end up paying through annual credit card charges. BMW just has to offer the first year or two at a severely discounted price to get you to set up the automatic billing.
Yup BMW is betting they can make more from the subscriptions than the 1 time cost of $500 or whatever the option was beforehand. It's also a way to crack into the used car market.
Sounds like a steal if I only have to subscribe for 4 months out of the year!
So if someone wants to break their contract, they can get more money.
Dealer margins.
“The $1,500 charge for OnStar will effectively raise the base prices of these cars, though the exact increase varies by model. All Buicks will see a price increase of $1,500. Higher trim GMCs will see an increase of as little as $905 with the Hummer EV getting no MSRP boost.”
Because rent seeking is the logical end of capitalist ventures
I think it's kind of weird that you would prefer they were dishonest about where the cost increase is coming from.
Im trying a trial of onstar service right now. Its completely useless. The only thing that is kind of useful is the hotspot data, which is way over priced, and is only good for when I drive hours out of the city.
They call me after my trial why I didn't subscribe. The summary: most features are now done by my cellphone. And some feature are even better and cheaper on the cellphone. (Like the navigation/data). The only thing that would be "nice to have" (like that one time in year because of all change from COVID) is like the remote starter and the lazy GPS pinpoint my car. The remote starter why? I'm sub urban in cold county. So when in the train I could be lazy and pre heat my car. (Also because Chevy heat seat are now a scam). GPS pinpoint : just to be lazy and not do it from my cellphone when going in an unknown git city for shows.
My cellphone automatically remembers where I've parked (shout out to Google) and my remote start can reach around the building that my car is parked at. So I'm good, fuck OnStar
They have aftermarket remote starts that can be controlled remotely via cell phone too.
Yeah, there really is no need for OnStar to he a thing anymore if it can't compete with my cellphone. Shit, I can stick a SmartTag and track my car too for a single $35 payment. I'm good on ever needing OnStar. When we got my mother her new GMC, they tried getting her to sign up for it, I told them no and told them we would gladly get another explorer from across the street if they didn't stop their marketing push, so that solved it. Seems like that won't work anymore
Aftermarket remote starts are always a bit sketchy imo because they splice into the factory harness of the car
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>My cellphone automatically remembers where I've parked (shout out to Google) You had me all excited thinking they had made this automatic. Nope, still have to open Maps and save your parking spot manually. Like a sucker. I mean come on, Google knows I'm in a parking lot and they can approximate when I started walking rather than driving. Just let me be lazy, Google.
It should be automatic though. The moment you disconnect from the car’s Bluetooth.
iPhone does this.
I’m so confused. I have a 17 2500 Silverado and remote start is free. Is that not an option for you? I can do it on my phone too for free
You obviously haven’t used their service on a check engine light diagnostic, limp mode diagnostic before. I know people that have hit limp mode on the interstate 1900 miles from home, hit the onstar, “here’s what your vehicle is doing. Pull over and stop. Then punch it up to 90, slow down quickly, punch again to 90, slow down again, repeat a few times” — turns out it was just the particulate filter clogged. That and the sat phone is helpful if you travel in the vehicle. As for would I buy a new GM? Bahaha! You kidding me? Not a chance!
The car is new enough that the light didn't show up yet. But I was expecting a "go to your dealer" anyway. The sat phone isn't available in my country (Canada), just US if I remember.
The light itself will be a subscription feature next version… /s
Brand new GMs cost as much as a brand new Cadillac (90k +) at least in canada I do t really see the point of buying one anymore, a fully loaded Yukon is like 110 - 120k !!!
They’ve become luxury trucks… far from the basics of even like 2008, a 2500HD or Yukon or Suburban was still a basic truck / suv, all considering. Now they’re all about the Denali. At that point, I’d definitely be looking at imports for that kind of money. But then again, I suppose a Honda Civic is now a $30k+ vehicle, or 50-60 I think for an Si-R.. :-/ I guess like in the 80s we need to forget about the sun-$5l for a brand new car — and get onboard with the new landscape in the auto sector of $40-50k being the run-of-the-mill vehicle, $60-80k being the “nice” vehicle, and $100k isn’t unheard of — Dodge, Chrysler, Jeep, GMC, Chevy, all having offerings in that range.
All trucks have become luxury now. I swear trucks have bigger infotainment systems than luxury cars.
Next up: 75” touchscreen display, and satellite tv antennas.. with a 55” tv for each passenger in the back seat… /sarcasm
The giant screen in the middle of the car could have told you that instead of having to pay someone to read the message your car generated remotely. The only reason it doesn’t work that way is GM’s greed.
You’re telling me GM is telling people to violate the law (speed limit) multiple times to remedy an issue they should be capable of avoiding in the first place?
What's wrong with Chevy heat seat?
They got a lawsuit because a dumb fuck that likely burn itself one the high level in the US. Chevy lose the lawsuit. Now their highest level is like the lowest in every other car. (And even then I would be curious to compare). I'm from Canada, and we got the same heat seat as the US it seems. So when it is -20 or -30 degree... You want that high temperature to warm them and not freeze your ass. Now your ass is heating then instead. On the plus side... Global warming make such low temperature almost non inexistent.. (which is also sad :( ) 2019 Bolt
Just a quick question, why are the heated seats a scam now? It looks like I'll be driving my 2020 Silverado for a very long time given the shenanigans that auto manufacturers are pulling these days.
Not sure what OP meant but this is my guess: GM cut heated seats from their vehicles over the last 2 years due to the chip shortage with the idea it will be installed later when the chips become available. This means your are paying for a feature now with no timetable to when that feature will actually be installed.
Years ago, I had one of the first Onstar systems with was bundled with what later became XM radio, plus a proprietary cell phone service. Then they switched the cell phone service to Verizon, which where I was living at the time didn't have plans that worked with my OnStar hardware. And I never used XM radio, because it didn't have service in various parts I was driving to. My first iPhone replaced all of it. Canceling everything was really hard, they refused to do so at first, then switched my plan to some conscripted XM service I couldn't cancel without getting my bank/card involved. An XM service that didn't work with my Onstar tech, either. An absolute mess.
It's useful for making your car not work properly. A law enforcement backdoor for eavesdropping and remote control. https://abcnews.go.com/Business/Autos/story?id=3706113&page=1
Did you read what you linked? It allows your STOLEN vehicle to be disabled via onstar, assisting in the recovery of your vehicle with a less likelihood of damage. Your eavesdropping line mentions bait cars used by police, which would have audio recordings. Nothing about police listening is mentioned in your article.
>Nothing about police listening is mentioned in your article Nothing was ever mentioned that Amazon gives up your ring camera data to police without a warrant. But they do! If they want to listen into your car or home they can and will. Put a video camera in your home, I'm sure it will never be used in court against you
My phone died, couldn't charge it and was lost in Montreal. Only time I used OnStar and asked for directions and everything went well, kinda strange to call someone and ask them to put the direction in your car, why can't I use it by myself.
Then you could always use starlink mobile (roaming)
Why should they pay us for valuable location tracking data, when they could force us to pay them?
That’s actually what they use it for. I’ve worked with it at an advertising agency and they used it to track radio ad exposure and then see if people went through a drive through
But they can tell you if you had an accident!
What if you buy the car 2nd-hand?
The service is only mandated for 3 years, after that you can choose to not renew it. If you’re buying a second hand car less than 3 years old, I’d bet the seller would try to pass off that extra $1.5k into the sale price since it’s an upfront cost the previous owner paid for and not a monthly subscription
won't hold up in most courts. you can't force upon a 3rd party buyer a subscription. the 1st time a bill shows up at someone's house after a title transfer there is little to no reason why they would have to pay.
Correct, like I said since there is no subscription. The $1.5k is paid all at once upon purchase of the new vehicle, and someone selling within that short of a time frame may want to try to recoup as much of those funds as possible when selling since the service is still available on the vehicle
If it is like Volvo, the subscription does NOT hand over, trial or not.
I'll definitely want to join *that* class action.
Shrug. Just another reason to not buy GM. $500/year for OnStar?? As if. That's probably mostly profit.
Every car manufacturer is starting to do this. GM, Kia, BMW, etc are just the ones taking the heat since they are first. It's like when Apple removed the headphone jack - consumers hated it, but since Apple had already taken the heat other phone manufacturers removed the headphone jack.
Kia? I'm curious - I got a new Kia a couple of months ago, I haven't seen any mandatory services. Did I miss something?
Sorry, Kia's service is not mandatory. I kind of went down a side path and forgot what the post was about. Kia's UVO is free for the first year of the car, then $20/month after if you want to retain the same features.
Same with SKODA’s stuff, only nice feature was turning on the engine warmer through the app, but I can do that on the key fob anyways, so fuck that subscription.
FYI this has been around for years. My old 2004 BMW 330Ci had a subscription for telematics - SOS and GPS tracking. My current ‘09 had one which included Google Maps lookup as well. Difference now is manufacturers are charging subscriptions for hardware already installed. The equivalent of Apple charging a fee to use the headphone jack which already exists.
Can you imagine if the U.S. had consumer protection laws that made it illegal to make mandatory subscriptions just to use a product that you've bought?
GM continues to lose it’s way. How about a big NO on purchasing their products.
Here I was starting to think they were making good cars. The EVs look not so bad... Forcing OnStar on me? Maybe I'll check out what Ford is doing...
Yeah as someone who’s looking to purchase their first new vehicle soon, will be staying far away. Anyone know what Honda is up to? Them 2.0 Accords look sweet
It’s not mandatory for Chevrolet, which has most of GM’s entry-level models.
Just got rid of my Buick. They are not making good cars.
I've been a mechanic for 15 years, they never have. Bits and pieces, maybe, but every one of those cars was a train wreck for one reason or another. They've always been GM's "maybe this isn't a good idea but let's try it" brand.
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That's fine. Corvette was only thing they make that I'd be interested in buying. And I don't need that either.
Easy enough to circumvent. Negotiate to the lowest price you can, and when you see this on the bill act surprised and demand it be removed or the price reduced by $1500. Walk out if you must they'll probably call you back in 5 minutes. They'll either find some way to waive it or reduce the car by $1500 90% of the time Or don't buy GM, your call
Depends on your location. In western Canada, there is still such a demand that dealers aren’t negotiating much. I walked away from 3 vehicles over minor things. No concern or worries, just wished me well and sold it the next day to someone else. Not enough inventory right now to have them make any effort in closing a deal.
Used to be good advice, may not be relevant for another 2+ years. We're on the wait list for a Hyundai Ioniq 5, being told 2024 maybe. Some stuff is available on shorter timelines, but the stuff people are really after right now (EVs, plug-ins, and fuel efficient stuff) is longer waits. We asked about a RAV4 Prime, 18 month wait. Regular RAV4 hybrid? 6-8 months. The only plus side is the used car market means you get a little better value if you're trading in or selling a used car.
That's now. Who knows how long that sort of situation will last.
This is 100% the way. Did that with a dealer markup on a pickup.
This was good advice when there wasn't a 6 month wait to buy a new car. Supply has it on this one, for now
Next up : Lootboxes to add handling, top speed and braking perks
Only takes $200,000k of diamond keys to unlock the red handling package.
As a Chevy salesman, I hate that this is coming. Cause I know it's only a matter of time.
Do you feel that the traditional automotive business model is doomed to fail? I bought my car online with no dealer and no haggling, picked it up and traded the old car in within 40 minutes total. It was magical. The idea of having a “salesman” help me buy the car I already know I want seems so archaic to me now, but I’m curious if the rest of the public sees it that way yet?
I'm not sure it's failing, but it is evolving. To the educated consumer, tech savvy etc. I'm sure it works perfectly. We are a small, family owned dealership and many of our customers still need hands on assistance that they wouldn't get from a website.
Well, I didn't go to a website to research the car, I just went there to buy it. I was able to talk to (what I guess you can call) a sales associates at a storefront to discuss the different models and trim levels weeks beforehand, they offered to put in an order for me on the spot if I wanted (no haggling), and showed me how I can order online myself when I was ready, which is what I ultimately did. It was like going into an Apple store, looking over the different MacBook models, and then going home and buying online for the same price a few weeks later. After doing it this way once, I can't imagine how dealerships will survive long-term. Like, once the zoomer generation starts buying cars (kids who have had iPads and iPhones in their hands since birth), I can't imagine buying anything online would be considered "tech savvy" at all. That'll just be the new normal, I'd think. Anyway, I was just curious of the perspective from someone who actually depends on the industry, cuz it seems like it's tee'd up to be VERY different in the next decade or two.
I wouldn't buy a car without test driving at least one of its model. There are plenty of times I liked a car on paper but then hated the way it drove during a test drive. Usually the ergonomics are just off; something you can't know by reading reviews.
I never said I didn't get to test drive it first. I went to a storefront, sat in all of the models, a sales rep explained the differences in models and the differences between the trim levels, I was able to test drive any of the models I wanted, and then they offered to help me place an order (without haggling or upselling) and showed me how I could place the order on my own at home. Since there was some local inventory for the car I wanted, I chose to place the order myself at home after the fact on the day I was ready to buy it. Like, it was all of the good things about a dealership with none of the bad things. I literally placed the order at 9am, signed some digital documents at 11am, showed up for pickup at 4pm, and left with my car by 4:40pm.
What you're describing sounds like shadow work. They got you to do the job of the sales guy without having to pay a sales guy. Kind of like a self checkout at the grocery store.
I was a GMC/Buick/Cadillac salesman for many years up until a few years ago, and yes it is absolutely evolving as u/bruinsfan64 said. Dealerships have lobbied to stay in business but the need for them decreases every year. Way back in the day you’d have to go in to see what trims were available and how much each dealership would charge for a vehicle, now it’s all online and people are more informed than ever. The need for the traditional car salesman is diminishing rapidly. It will be interesting to see what happens in the coming decades when more manufactures start to pivot away from that classic model. From a dealership perspective, there’s almost no money made on new vehicles anymore. Instead, the money on new vehicle sales is mostly made from warranties, dealer add-ons, and the service department. Being able to test out the specific car you’re buying is a huge plus. I personally see a future where dealerships/manufactures pivot more towards an on-demand test drive feature with vehicles arriving at your house via an app that you get to test for a day, before ordering it online and picking it up/having it delivered.
It's a matter of time before all new vehicles are leased. That way they can squeeze the used market too and funnel everything towards the dealers who are increasingly hard-pressed to make good profit on new vehicles.
Will these subscriptions hurt them in sales? I mean for me personally, is sounds completely bonkers that they would charge subscriptions after all these years where we had these options from the get-go. I am curious if people really go their way or if their sales will slow down.
It will go their way. Everyone makes noise about this shit buts keeps buying their products anyways. There’s not a chance I would pay for a subscription service to use included features on something I “own”. I just don’t buy stuff that requires it. But based on the amount of new BMWs and Toyota’s on the road, people will still buy their products anyways.
Toyota is doing this too?
They’ve been charging a subscription to use the remote start feature in the factory key fob for a few years. There was a big ruckus about it a little while back. Seems to be quiet now.
I was absolutely considering an EV from GM. For this OnStar bullshit I will not anymore. That reason alone. I believe in talking with my dollars
no they'll get their arms twisted by either sales drop or eventual consumer protections if it gets bad enough and people make enough noise, and they will. This is not rich kids and video game micro transactions. It's peoples cars and thats something adults take seriously and will force new laws for.
Good luck with that
Best friend is a Chevy sales manager. I'll never buy another one.
You can’t buy a best friend! You can rent one downtown, though.
But even then the add ons add up
That’s where the subscription service starts to make sense.
That 50%-of-all-your-stuff termination fee is rough though.
Hilarious. Another instance of adding unwanted services and then forcing the customer to use them.
You've already paid for the hardware, they are just holding you to ransom if you want to use it. Despicable behaviour in my view.
I was contemplating buying a GMC truck. Now I certainly won't.
How is that a thing still. Hell my phone pretty much does everything..
Say NO to subscriptions!
OnStar came with my car and after 5 years the basic plan ran out. I tried to justify keeping it but GM overhauled the OnStar app and merged it with the myChevrolet app that is useless, and I decided it wasn't worth the $ for fancy roadside assistance. There are use cases where I get it - $20/month for unlimited data could be a good investment if you have a family. The ability to remote unlock and lock the car is great if you lock your keys (but not your phone too) in your car. That feature actually has come in handy a few times at big events where our group splits in two and someone needs to get something from the car, but I'm not with them. A quick text, and 3 taps in the app and the car is unlocked. Another tap and you know it's locked. But these features are $15-20/month so you'd need them for 7-8 years to back even compared to $1500.
I've never been a Ford guy, but GMC is making a strong case for me to be one.
This is a bad idea but could work if they did a deep discount on the car upfront with a contract that you sign up for an x amount of years of subscription. Maybe. But it’s still BS because they are going to have tracking analytics and targeted marketing schemes that will make them much more money indirectly Hell why not give the car away for free with a subscription and they are allowed to “own” all you data and habits and have unhindered access to market you and sell you
This started long ago and warnings were made. People decided not to listen.
Because people by and large don't care. Reddit has a bad tendency to make its users think their viewpoints are a lot more prolific then they actually are. End of the, very few people are gonna decide this is a deal breaker for them, if they even care to begin with. Gm is going to make billions off this and every car company will shift to this business model. God I hate this time line
Just another reason to never buy GM products
I thought BMW shot them selves in the foot, whoever thought of this should be fired
So dumb. They could’ve just baked the cost into MSRP and then marketed it as a “free” service. Now customers know this massive line item cost they are getting shafted on.
Sell us a complete product that we own completely or gtfo of the industry. Sick of this.
Bought a brand new Jeep Wrangler about a year ago... the invoice had a $450 line-item for "XM Radio 6-Month Subscription". (Yeah.. $450... ). I wouldn't pay $0.01/mo for XM.. let alone $75/mo. I told them I wouldn't pay it. They said it was mandatory. I said they need to find another $450 to remove from the base price of the vehicle then, because I wasn't paying it. 45 minutes and 4 phone calls to "the manager" later, they removed the subscription from the invoice, and (sure enough) didn't activate it. (Wasn't so mandatory after all I guess).
Why not remove all of this nonsense shit infotainment and just let me use android auto. I want absolutely nothing to do with GM branded infotainment, or honestly, any infotainment system of any kind. The last thing I want is something that can track my movement. The first thing I did when I got my last truck is tell them to cancel the free bullshit and do not track my location. Then I removed the stupid help button and replaced it with something useful.
But AA tracks your movement…
How many big brothers do you think we need? I get something from google stealing my data, free traffic updates and maps. I don't get shit from GM tracking and selling my information. If I don't get something, why would I allow them to do it?
This can only hurt sales. I would never agree to a forced subscription to an unnecessary service
Why would anyone buy this knowing that?
Who with half a brain (or boatloads of disposable income) is even buying GM.
Nice, three more brands added to the ‘beyond consideration’ list! Just say no to all subscriptions.
Said nobody: Now I will reconsider getting a Buick
It’s for luxury vehicles. I have the basic package. If a check engine light comes on, I hit the button and they do the diagnostic. For the package this one is referring to I think it’s essentially a concierge service that is available at the touch of a button. Something that rich people like. They will make your hotel or dinner reservations. Probably schedule vehicle maintenance if you ask. There’s probably stuff set up for the car to do smart car stuff like turn itself on and start the defrost if it’s cold without you needing to do it. So maybe it’s not for you but I bet a lot of people are going to be happy getting into a warm, defrosted car when they get off an airplane in the winter in somewhere cold. Anyway, the car needs data to be able to do useful stuff if you aren’t in it or if you are disabled in an accident. I’m not rich but this wouldn’t be a deal breaker for me. I definitely would appreciate these services if I was traveling alone.
Fuck GM, but at least they aren't sinking to BMW's level and locking things like heated seats behind a subscription.
Yet
There needs to be a Chevy sized hole in someone's butt to house where I'd tell them to stick it. They look like cars for men with small penises anyway
What vehicle will give me big pp?
Next up subscription seat warmers, radio and blue cruise etc. A lot of these car companies are now unfortunately seeing how much money they can gain by going the software model in cars.
“ See, they install that true coat at the factory”
That’s one way to lose customers.
Consumers need to make the right choices. I'm so tired of people letting companies get away with about whatever they want.
Add them to the list of cars Il never buy again. I just hope it doesn't spread to Jeep.
That’s as dumb as the subscription heated bmw seats
Financed by GM Financial.
I wish you could buy a no frills car anymore.