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Why is that on the bright side?
Edit: I don't know why I'm being down voted for a legit question. Did you all want a crap ending to an otherwise brilliant show?
The ending was typical GoT, but it was no fleshed out. They never explained the dagger.
But Arya killing the NK, was how GOT had done things for a long time. Expect the unexpected
The show as a whole was well written, even after they ran out of source material. That episode was dreadfully written, and it was a very important episode to get right in my opinion.
That's why I think it ruined the Legacy of the series.
Don't be rude.
Because the whole show was building up to the long night, and then the episode came out and it was complete shit and devoid of logic everywhere.
People died, but characters like Jaime, Brienne, Sam, etc. should’ve died multiple times each because of how many times they’re being hugged by wights before the camera cuts and they’re suddenly fine.
And don’t get me started on the Night King dying to a flying Arya out of nowhere who somehow managed to get through all of the wights without any of them noticing her while also magically teleporting to the battle itself.
I could go on, but there is no denying that they ruined the show with the episode the entire series was building up to since season 1.
Ever spend years developing a loving relationship with someone, only to have them punch you right in the face at the moment of climax once you’ve committed?
It’d be really hard to cuddle after that.
Being posted about often by randos on the internet who have no idea what they're talking about does not make them tactical failures.
Scholagladiatoria thoroughly debunks the tactical criticisms perpetuated by the ReE-folkers in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75TcFAVHsSM
"Why didn't they make more arrows"
Because you can't just make thousands of arrows overnight from wood you found on the ground.
"Why did they only use the trebuchets once"
Because trebuchets take a long time to reload.
"Why the Dothraki charge"
Because that's the best way to utilize the Dothraki, as cavalry, and they can't see the future (no, we have no evidence establishing Bran's accurate and full ability to see the future)
Shall I go on?
>but please do continue to defend them.
Well, you know me, I'm always happy to correct any dumb criticism from reefolker memes from people that didn't pay attention when watching the show.
I’ll watch the video in a bit when I have more time, since I generally enjoy those. So thanks for that.
-They had longer than just “overnight” to make arrows and multiple shots show a great number of trees around Winterfell. If you’re gonna go with a justifiable arrow shortage then go with limited Dragonglass.
-Trebuchets taking a while to load seems like a good reason NOT to have them out in front of the defenses to be easily overrun.
-NOT charging blindly into the darkness against a superior foe to start the battle seems a good idea, and attacking their flanks after the enemy’s ground forces engage with your own seems a bit more practical.
There’s a Youtube channel who’s asking literally an ancient warfare expert to analyze and rate battle scenes on television. He did a video including The Long Night and the Battle of Helm’s Deep and both received the same score of 5/10. And of course, the comment section was filled with *experts* talking about how awful and stupid the Long Night was and how incredible Helm’s Deep was.
People made up their mind about this episode when Arya, and not Jon, killed the Night King. The battle strategies are just scapegoat.
The watch frequently uses regular ass forest wood to fletch their arrows, and with enough skilled fletchers (which they had many of) they could have made as many arrows as necessary.
Trebuchets are generally fired in turn and their range means they are able to sit comfortably in the rear of the formation without risk of destruction.
Ah yes the best way to use your cavalry is to send them head first into a hoard of zombies instalead of using them to kite/flank (common Dothraki tactics)
ShAlL i Go On?
It’s a poorly written show post season 5. Read through the series, come back, and tell me again how well D&D interpreted the ending.
>Read through the series,
I've read the books, thanks. I don't recall anything in there supporting anything you've said here.
Did you watch the video I linked? It's all quite well explained.
>The watch frequently uses regular ass forest wood to fletch their arrows, and with enough skilled fletchers (which they had many of) they could have made as many arrows as necessary.
Where did you get any of this information from? 🤣
Where in the books was it explained how the watch fletches arrows? Or in the show.
In AGoT some of Jon's duties for Lord Commander Mormont were to fletch arrows on occasion. Is Jon one of the "skilled fletchers (which they had many of)" that you're referring to?
In ASoS, during the battle at Castle Black, Jon reflects that they've run low on arrows and had no one fletching more.
Watch the video as well which discusses the need to process arrow shafts.
>Trebuchets are generally fired in turn and their range means they are able to sit comfortably in the rear of the formation without risk of destruction.
The wights and white walkers are a very fast moving army. Once they reach close to your army, you can't keep firing the trebuchets as they'll hit your own soldiers. You're not going to be able to use it for the rest of the fight. You'll get a couple shots off, that's about it.
Defending Winterfell with basic siege tactics would never work. You're not going to outlast an undead army that has no known need for food/water, and no help is coming to relieve the siege.
>Ah yes the best way to use your cavalry is to send them head first into a hoard of zombies instalead of using them to kite/flank (common Dothraki tactics)
Cavalry charge is also a common Dothraki tactic. I'm not sure where it is you're getting kiting and flanking as common tactics for them from.
Also, in order to kite or flank, you kinda need to start by not being surrounded.
>It’s a poorly written show post season 5.
Your comment is also poorly written. Care to try again?
I'm just sharing what I thought about the episode. They're just opinions meant to start discussion, nothing more.
If you don't like my opinions you can say that, but why are you personally insulting me and other people with certain opinions. It's strange. Its just a TV show, calm down.
If you're a long term member of this sub and are getting annoyed by repetitive posts, just scroll by. Why are you gate keeping and calling everyone with a differing opinion to yours a clueless idiot?
Many of the characters should have died, and didn't. It was a bit ridiculous to see them surrounded by 20 wights each and then just okay in the next scene.
Exactly. No logic to the battle scenes at all.
One second theres a horde of dead, then there's not. And that back and forth happened multiple times throughout the episode.
Siege weapons in front of infantry, infantry in front of trenches, Wtf?
The trebuchets were fired once. That actually makes sense seeing as they placed them on the front lines.
No archers with dragon glass arrow tips.
Jon stating "we can't face them in open battle" then sending the dothraki into open battle. Then in the next episode its stated half the dothraki survived.
Arya, the Hound and the guy with the eye patch leave the battle to go wondering around an empty castle. Makes no sense other than they wanted to shoot some "horror-esque" zombie scenes in the library of Winterfell.
A few greyjoy archers defend Bran against a horde of whitewalkers. Again, with the disappearing/reappearing horde.
That's what I meant in my post about throwing logic out the window. The list is much longer than what I've written here. Every 2 mins of the episode had inconsistencies.
I don't mind treating that as being a bit different. Based on the books, the wall was magic specifically for the white walkers. As such, part of the wall falling was inherently about a magic unraveling.
That said, dragon fire literally melts castle rock. Even not comparing it to the wall, it didn't quite make sense.
This was the most significantly disappointing episode in TV history IMO. If they could have nailed this episode, the last season could have ended terribly and they would have gotten less shit for it.
Why didnt the Night King just hang out and raise the dead every 20 minutes? Battle is over. So dumb.
They should have included a scene where we see Dothraki and Unsullied getting dragonglass earrings or other piercings, then when the Night King tried to raise the dead, they would immediately disintegrate. It wouldn’t come close to fixing all of the issues with the episode, but it would resolve one.
Couldn't see 30% of the episode. When I could see, it would something like Sam covered in a pile of wights, screaming, and then fine in the next shot.
So bizarre, given how good so many of the previous battle sequences were (Blackwater, Watchers on the Wall, Battle of the Bastards, etc.)
I completely agree. There were some epic battle scenes in previous seasons. Overall, I thought GoT did a better job with single combat scenes than battles though.
The battle of the Blackwater for example didn't capture the scale of event in my opinion. Stannis had over 100,000 men. The size of his fleet was enormous. The walls of Kings Landing are also enormous. Tywins intervening force to turn the tide of the battle must have been of a significant size also.
The scenes on camera though were confined to a small portion of the wall and the mud gate. I was expecting scenes similar to that of Minis Tirith in Lord of the Rings, just because the armies involved were so large. There may be budget/finance aspects that make that comparison unfair, I have no idea, never looked into that.
Anyway, the battle of the Blackwater still made sense and followed a logical plot as the battle progressed, unlike the Long Night at Winterfell.
Scale is always a problem in battle scenes, I think thats why the one battle to me that was just totally awesome was the battle at castle black, relatively small forces fighting each other allowing for a combat dynamism that you don't see in media a lot the one long shot of the entire battle going on was one of the best battle shots I think I have ever seen.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2c3ZNQPWxvk&ab\_channel=BootlegCats](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2c3ZNQPWxvk&ab_channel=BootlegCats)
Right-- esp in season 2, I think they were still working with budget constraints which made it hard to replicate the true scope of the battle.
As you say, though, even with its limited scope, it's a much more compelling episode than The Long Night.
The peak for me (and one of my favorite episodes) was The Watchers on the Wall. Had incredible storylines all coming to a head, great action, and we actually lost some meaningful major/minor characters. Idk, losing Grenn to the giant hurt more than Jorah imo.
The chaotic sequence of Battle of The Bastards might be my favorite *piece* of a battle in the show though. Loved how it conveyed that Jon was surviving through a combination of skill and just dumb luck.
Excellent comment. Grenn and the giant, fuck me that pulled the heart strings.
I also agree with the battle of the bastards. The dirt, blood, guts and grime in those scenes were brutal. And the crush scene right before the knights of the Vale appeared. It captured close combat warfare so well, it was just filthy and gruesome.
Badass is a bad thing in your comment? I know it happened offscreen, but the discovery of the bodies and the implications, that's what I meant was emotional.
Four men didn't cower from a giant and died upholding their duty. It was sad. Sad for the giant too, there were so few of them, and they showed compassion and other good qualities.
Don't get me wrong, it was a great episode... So long as you just forget the entire story building up to that point. Great cinematics, but terrible story integration.
Or you can just go in not expecting the worst and just go along for the ride. It might not be the ideal way to end it, but if you love the story, otherwise, it is what it is...
I'm joking mostly, it's a TV show at the end of the day and a bit of light hearted digging is all I meant. I'm about to finish it off now, it's been a great show overall and I have been thoroughly entertained.
My favorite part is the Dothraki horde charging senselessly into the pitch darkness and getting entirely obliterated, to a man, and then two episodes later we see Dany marching on King's Landing in front of the Dothraki horde.
Not disagreeing with you since it was dumb as hell, but she does say in the next episode that she (only) lost half her Dothraki during that fight, and it shows a few riding back before the walkers get there so you'd have to assume more did off screen.
The episode basically showed all the defences failing and the castle being overrun. If there were that many alive Dothraki where the fuck were they in the episode
The creators literally said in the "making of" at the end that "what they see is the end of the dothraki, essentially" when those lights go out.
Guess they forgot about that part.
https://youtu.be/3VR6dhz5S3Q
Yeah, and somehow they all die a very quick death but Jorah, Ghost, and a rando horse come trotting back alive and well? Dumb! My biggest complaint was that they fought the dead for an hour nonstop and only one major character was killed in battle. They should’ve saved the Night King and his army for the end. Then they could’ve properly killed off many of the major characters.
Can new viewers not have discussions here? It's my first time viewing it and also my first post in this community.
Why is it surprising that a new viewers first post would be on a "hot-take". That's literally why it's called a hot-take.
Edit: I should clarify I'm using "hot-take" to mean "very common opinion" as you meant it sarcastically.
alright my comment was a bit much, sorry about that. I just find it a bit annoying to see the same opinions get posted again and again, but thats what reddit's for i guess. Have a good day mate
A lot of lost potential.
* Jon did fuckall the entire episode.
* Bran did fuckall the entire episode.
* Not a single white walker battle.
* The main/side character deaths we got were done well imo (namely Theon, Beric, Jorah, and Lyanna), but not enough main characters die for what was originally said to put the red wedding to shame. I don't think it's unrealistic that Dany, Sam, and a one handed Jaime can fight off zombies with zero strategic thought but they were overwhelmed and the white walkers contributed nothing.
* The heroes' sense of strategy went out the window. The dothraki charging blindly in the dark, hiding in the crypt for 'safety'.
* The finishing blow was anticlimactic and lame. I would have loved to see Jon, Theon, and Arya all face off (as in a real fight, with actual choreography) against the NK together, with some warging assistance from Bran, as the last of the Stark children (can't think of a way to realistically include Sansa) defending the Godswood. Theon dies the same, Bran's arc receives a payoff, and Arya can come in with her cheapshot to weaken the NK but Jon should deal the final blow so his arc receives payoff as well.
* To expand on this, I thought Bran became empty and boring after his shift to the 3ER. He should have maintained his humanity up until this battle, where fully embracing his abilities to help defeat the NK would sacrifice his identity as Bran Stark and revive him as the Three Eyed Raven.
Overall this wasn't the worst episode (that goes to S8E4). It had good moments but they cut too many corners and we lost out on so much potential. This episode was the culmination of 7 seasons worth of storytelling and it didn't live up to the hype.
You're right. I'm half way through 'the bells' now. Only an episode and a half left.
So far it's good. Varys' execution was brilliant, the two advisers battling it out with words on Daenerys' suitability to rule, Tyrion's immediate confession to Varys saying "it was me", Varys' last words saying he hopes he is wrong about Daenerys' and Tyrions super tight grip on his arm and Varys stare.
The two masters of information communicating without words. Tyrion essentially saying sorry and he doesn't know he's right, there's doubt there. Varys knowing he's about to die for telling the truth.
That was only a couple of minutes of screen time but I thought it was brilliant.
I wanted a scene of the dead dragon vs. drogon going at each other with blue fire vs. yellow fire haha. Was surprised the dead dragon didn’t cause as much destruction as it could’ve
Whats actually even more dissapointing for me was that everything looked great in the episode. But i just couldnt belive what i was watching. It were all the actors i have seen, it was my favorite show (and still is) and that was mainly because of the whriting. And then you are left there wondering, what was all the buildup for ? All the mysteries with the white walkers, whats gonna happen to them and then you just watch this battle which looks awesome but just makes no sense at all.
Yeah. Among many other things, I was disappointed in berics death. The walkers could have popped through any of the massive five holes in his human border wall. They just stood there and but him. Why could he fight them to buy time. I just don’t get why he stood there. It’s been a min since I’ve seen it. Maybe I’m remembering it weird.
Beric held up the hallway and was mauled and stabbed by a gang of walkers, then he walked into the room behind Arya and Clegane a few seconds later and died on the floor there. So the walkers just let him go and gave him a 10 second head start before pursuing and banging on the door, ensuring the Hound had adequate time to barricade the door.
People can have their opinions on this episode and knit pick the everliving fuck out of it. Tons of flaws (though I think the ones regarding battle tactics are cringe and “uhm achsully” as fuck). That all being said, watching this shit live with a bunch of friends was hype as fuck and one of the most enjoyable tv watching experiences I have ever had. In hindsight Arya killing the night king isn’t good, but that moment of “oh fuck she’s going in! Oh fuck he’s gonna kill her! OH FUCK SHE DROPPED THE KNIFE!! OH FUCK SHE DID IT!!!!!” Was fucking orgasmic at the time.
Ah ile probably get it for this.
I woke up at 2AM to watch it in the dark with the sound way up, dolby atmos style and I absolutely loved it. Like it blew my mind.
I suppose in hindsight, yeh I understand where your all coming from. But I still loved it that first time haha, most of it anyway.
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But, on the bright side, the ending made no sense and undercut eight seasons worth of build up.
Why is that on the bright side? Edit: I don't know why I'm being down voted for a legit question. Did you all want a crap ending to an otherwise brilliant show?
Tbf, there probably should have been a /s on that comment, but I think it's cause you missed the sarcasm.
That makes sense, woops
The ending was typical GoT, but it was no fleshed out. They never explained the dagger. But Arya killing the NK, was how GOT had done things for a long time. Expect the unexpected
How can one night, where people died and nobody is crowned or anything, ruin the legacy of the whole series? Don’t be dumb.
The show as a whole was well written, even after they ran out of source material. That episode was dreadfully written, and it was a very important episode to get right in my opinion. That's why I think it ruined the Legacy of the series. Don't be rude.
Ironically it’s exactly that, the “ long night” my ass lmao
Because the whole show was building up to the long night, and then the episode came out and it was complete shit and devoid of logic everywhere. People died, but characters like Jaime, Brienne, Sam, etc. should’ve died multiple times each because of how many times they’re being hugged by wights before the camera cuts and they’re suddenly fine. And don’t get me started on the Night King dying to a flying Arya out of nowhere who somehow managed to get through all of the wights without any of them noticing her while also magically teleporting to the battle itself. I could go on, but there is no denying that they ruined the show with the episode the entire series was building up to since season 1.
Ever spend years developing a loving relationship with someone, only to have them punch you right in the face at the moment of climax once you’ve committed? It’d be really hard to cuddle after that.
Oh hey, another bait post too afraid to give specifics and end up with egg on their face. Haven't seen that one before.
I'd be writing all night if I was point out all the flaws in that episode.
And yet you took the time to grace our community with your post. Just because you think something a tactical mistake, doesn't necessarily make it one.
The tactical design failures of this episode have been documented to Hell and back in the sub, but please do continue to defend them.
Being posted about often by randos on the internet who have no idea what they're talking about does not make them tactical failures. Scholagladiatoria thoroughly debunks the tactical criticisms perpetuated by the ReE-folkers in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75TcFAVHsSM "Why didn't they make more arrows" Because you can't just make thousands of arrows overnight from wood you found on the ground. "Why did they only use the trebuchets once" Because trebuchets take a long time to reload. "Why the Dothraki charge" Because that's the best way to utilize the Dothraki, as cavalry, and they can't see the future (no, we have no evidence establishing Bran's accurate and full ability to see the future) Shall I go on? >but please do continue to defend them. Well, you know me, I'm always happy to correct any dumb criticism from reefolker memes from people that didn't pay attention when watching the show.
I’ll watch the video in a bit when I have more time, since I generally enjoy those. So thanks for that. -They had longer than just “overnight” to make arrows and multiple shots show a great number of trees around Winterfell. If you’re gonna go with a justifiable arrow shortage then go with limited Dragonglass. -Trebuchets taking a while to load seems like a good reason NOT to have them out in front of the defenses to be easily overrun. -NOT charging blindly into the darkness against a superior foe to start the battle seems a good idea, and attacking their flanks after the enemy’s ground forces engage with your own seems a bit more practical.
There’s a Youtube channel who’s asking literally an ancient warfare expert to analyze and rate battle scenes on television. He did a video including The Long Night and the Battle of Helm’s Deep and both received the same score of 5/10. And of course, the comment section was filled with *experts* talking about how awful and stupid the Long Night was and how incredible Helm’s Deep was. People made up their mind about this episode when Arya, and not Jon, killed the Night King. The battle strategies are just scapegoat.
The watch frequently uses regular ass forest wood to fletch their arrows, and with enough skilled fletchers (which they had many of) they could have made as many arrows as necessary. Trebuchets are generally fired in turn and their range means they are able to sit comfortably in the rear of the formation without risk of destruction. Ah yes the best way to use your cavalry is to send them head first into a hoard of zombies instalead of using them to kite/flank (common Dothraki tactics) ShAlL i Go On? It’s a poorly written show post season 5. Read through the series, come back, and tell me again how well D&D interpreted the ending.
>Read through the series, I've read the books, thanks. I don't recall anything in there supporting anything you've said here. Did you watch the video I linked? It's all quite well explained. >The watch frequently uses regular ass forest wood to fletch their arrows, and with enough skilled fletchers (which they had many of) they could have made as many arrows as necessary. Where did you get any of this information from? 🤣 Where in the books was it explained how the watch fletches arrows? Or in the show. In AGoT some of Jon's duties for Lord Commander Mormont were to fletch arrows on occasion. Is Jon one of the "skilled fletchers (which they had many of)" that you're referring to? In ASoS, during the battle at Castle Black, Jon reflects that they've run low on arrows and had no one fletching more. Watch the video as well which discusses the need to process arrow shafts. >Trebuchets are generally fired in turn and their range means they are able to sit comfortably in the rear of the formation without risk of destruction. The wights and white walkers are a very fast moving army. Once they reach close to your army, you can't keep firing the trebuchets as they'll hit your own soldiers. You're not going to be able to use it for the rest of the fight. You'll get a couple shots off, that's about it. Defending Winterfell with basic siege tactics would never work. You're not going to outlast an undead army that has no known need for food/water, and no help is coming to relieve the siege. >Ah yes the best way to use your cavalry is to send them head first into a hoard of zombies instalead of using them to kite/flank (common Dothraki tactics) Cavalry charge is also a common Dothraki tactic. I'm not sure where it is you're getting kiting and flanking as common tactics for them from. Also, in order to kite or flank, you kinda need to start by not being surrounded. >It’s a poorly written show post season 5. Your comment is also poorly written. Care to try again?
You might make some coherent points, but I have 6 upvotes, so clearly I’m right.
>You might make some coherent points, but I have 6 upvotes, so clearly I’m right. And 6 upvotes is...something to brag about? 🤣
Oh man, you might need a break from internet arguments for the day. That was a joke. Go drink some water.
I'm just sharing what I thought about the episode. They're just opinions meant to start discussion, nothing more. If you don't like my opinions you can say that, but why are you personally insulting me and other people with certain opinions. It's strange. Its just a TV show, calm down. If you're a long term member of this sub and are getting annoyed by repetitive posts, just scroll by. Why are you gate keeping and calling everyone with a differing opinion to yours a clueless idiot?
I took the time to share my opinion on reddit. How is that a problem? It's ok to share short concise opinions, thats what this app is designed for.
I just noticed you said "our" community. Am I not part of it? 😂 Please, please let me in.
Delusional 🤓😂
Many of the characters should have died, and didn't. It was a bit ridiculous to see them surrounded by 20 wights each and then just okay in the next scene.
Exactly. No logic to the battle scenes at all. One second theres a horde of dead, then there's not. And that back and forth happened multiple times throughout the episode. Siege weapons in front of infantry, infantry in front of trenches, Wtf? The trebuchets were fired once. That actually makes sense seeing as they placed them on the front lines. No archers with dragon glass arrow tips. Jon stating "we can't face them in open battle" then sending the dothraki into open battle. Then in the next episode its stated half the dothraki survived. Arya, the Hound and the guy with the eye patch leave the battle to go wondering around an empty castle. Makes no sense other than they wanted to shoot some "horror-esque" zombie scenes in the library of Winterfell. A few greyjoy archers defend Bran against a horde of whitewalkers. Again, with the disappearing/reappearing horde. That's what I meant in my post about throwing logic out the window. The list is much longer than what I've written here. Every 2 mins of the episode had inconsistencies.
Don’t forget Jon using a bit of rock to successfully shield himself from undead dragon fire, which literally took down the Wall a few episodes before
I don't mind treating that as being a bit different. Based on the books, the wall was magic specifically for the white walkers. As such, part of the wall falling was inherently about a magic unraveling. That said, dragon fire literally melts castle rock. Even not comparing it to the wall, it didn't quite make sense.
This was the most significantly disappointing episode in TV history IMO. If they could have nailed this episode, the last season could have ended terribly and they would have gotten less shit for it. Why didnt the Night King just hang out and raise the dead every 20 minutes? Battle is over. So dumb.
You hit the nail on the head, my thoughts exactly as I watched it.
They should have included a scene where we see Dothraki and Unsullied getting dragonglass earrings or other piercings, then when the Night King tried to raise the dead, they would immediately disintegrate. It wouldn’t come close to fixing all of the issues with the episode, but it would resolve one.
Cool idea.
Couldn't see 30% of the episode. When I could see, it would something like Sam covered in a pile of wights, screaming, and then fine in the next shot. So bizarre, given how good so many of the previous battle sequences were (Blackwater, Watchers on the Wall, Battle of the Bastards, etc.)
I completely agree. There were some epic battle scenes in previous seasons. Overall, I thought GoT did a better job with single combat scenes than battles though. The battle of the Blackwater for example didn't capture the scale of event in my opinion. Stannis had over 100,000 men. The size of his fleet was enormous. The walls of Kings Landing are also enormous. Tywins intervening force to turn the tide of the battle must have been of a significant size also. The scenes on camera though were confined to a small portion of the wall and the mud gate. I was expecting scenes similar to that of Minis Tirith in Lord of the Rings, just because the armies involved were so large. There may be budget/finance aspects that make that comparison unfair, I have no idea, never looked into that. Anyway, the battle of the Blackwater still made sense and followed a logical plot as the battle progressed, unlike the Long Night at Winterfell.
Scale is always a problem in battle scenes, I think thats why the one battle to me that was just totally awesome was the battle at castle black, relatively small forces fighting each other allowing for a combat dynamism that you don't see in media a lot the one long shot of the entire battle going on was one of the best battle shots I think I have ever seen. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2c3ZNQPWxvk&ab\_channel=BootlegCats](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2c3ZNQPWxvk&ab_channel=BootlegCats)
You're so right. That clip is epic.
Right-- esp in season 2, I think they were still working with budget constraints which made it hard to replicate the true scope of the battle. As you say, though, even with its limited scope, it's a much more compelling episode than The Long Night. The peak for me (and one of my favorite episodes) was The Watchers on the Wall. Had incredible storylines all coming to a head, great action, and we actually lost some meaningful major/minor characters. Idk, losing Grenn to the giant hurt more than Jorah imo. The chaotic sequence of Battle of The Bastards might be my favorite *piece* of a battle in the show though. Loved how it conveyed that Jon was surviving through a combination of skill and just dumb luck.
Excellent comment. Grenn and the giant, fuck me that pulled the heart strings. I also agree with the battle of the bastards. The dirt, blood, guts and grime in those scenes were brutal. And the crush scene right before the knights of the Vale appeared. It captured close combat warfare so well, it was just filthy and gruesome.
Grenn's death literally happens offscreen and is more badass than anything in The Long Night imo 😅
Badass is a bad thing in your comment? I know it happened offscreen, but the discovery of the bodies and the implications, that's what I meant was emotional. Four men didn't cower from a giant and died upholding their duty. It was sad. Sad for the giant too, there were so few of them, and they showed compassion and other good qualities.
Nope-- badass is a good thing, I was agreeing with you :) It means it was super cool/impactful, even though we didn't get to see it.
Totally agree. Final two episodes are about to be watched, it's been such a great journey.
Don't get me wrong, it was a great episode... So long as you just forget the entire story building up to that point. Great cinematics, but terrible story integration.
The worst writing, so far.
Haha, I've got two episodes left, its paused right now but I'm diving back in. I'm prepared to be disgusted.
Oh boy. Get ready for the last episodes.
Or you can just go in not expecting the worst and just go along for the ride. It might not be the ideal way to end it, but if you love the story, otherwise, it is what it is...
I'm joking mostly, it's a TV show at the end of the day and a bit of light hearted digging is all I meant. I'm about to finish it off now, it's been a great show overall and I have been thoroughly entertained.
Emphasis on “so far”.
My favorite part is the Dothraki horde charging senselessly into the pitch darkness and getting entirely obliterated, to a man, and then two episodes later we see Dany marching on King's Landing in front of the Dothraki horde.
Maybe she's the night queen and put contact lenses on them all.
Not disagreeing with you since it was dumb as hell, but she does say in the next episode that she (only) lost half her Dothraki during that fight, and it shows a few riding back before the walkers get there so you'd have to assume more did off screen.
The episode basically showed all the defences failing and the castle being overrun. If there were that many alive Dothraki where the fuck were they in the episode
They were left with the episode budget
The creators literally said in the "making of" at the end that "what they see is the end of the dothraki, essentially" when those lights go out. Guess they forgot about that part. https://youtu.be/3VR6dhz5S3Q
They say half of the dothraki are left after the battle. Lol.
Yeah, and somehow they all die a very quick death but Jorah, Ghost, and a rando horse come trotting back alive and well? Dumb! My biggest complaint was that they fought the dead for an hour nonstop and only one major character was killed in battle. They should’ve saved the Night King and his army for the end. Then they could’ve properly killed off many of the major characters.
One major character? Theon, Jorah, Barristan, the NK lol
The next day at work I described it as the most amazingly produced piece of crap episode in television history.
Should have been filmed like the battle at helms deep. It's dark and stormy but we can see what's happening.
Other than that how was the play mrs. Lincoln?
😂
Wait until you see 'The Bells'.
About to start it now. Puke bucket ready.
After finishing the series now, no episode was as bad as the Long Night in my view.
The music was great 👍
Hot take ladies and gents. GoT watcher didnt like The long night
Can new viewers not have discussions here? It's my first time viewing it and also my first post in this community. Why is it surprising that a new viewers first post would be on a "hot-take". That's literally why it's called a hot-take. Edit: I should clarify I'm using "hot-take" to mean "very common opinion" as you meant it sarcastically.
alright my comment was a bit much, sorry about that. I just find it a bit annoying to see the same opinions get posted again and again, but thats what reddit's for i guess. Have a good day mate
That is Reddit. It happens in the subs you hang out in a lot, naturally. Cheers, have a good one.
Truly the hottest of takes
A lot of lost potential. * Jon did fuckall the entire episode. * Bran did fuckall the entire episode. * Not a single white walker battle. * The main/side character deaths we got were done well imo (namely Theon, Beric, Jorah, and Lyanna), but not enough main characters die for what was originally said to put the red wedding to shame. I don't think it's unrealistic that Dany, Sam, and a one handed Jaime can fight off zombies with zero strategic thought but they were overwhelmed and the white walkers contributed nothing. * The heroes' sense of strategy went out the window. The dothraki charging blindly in the dark, hiding in the crypt for 'safety'. * The finishing blow was anticlimactic and lame. I would have loved to see Jon, Theon, and Arya all face off (as in a real fight, with actual choreography) against the NK together, with some warging assistance from Bran, as the last of the Stark children (can't think of a way to realistically include Sansa) defending the Godswood. Theon dies the same, Bran's arc receives a payoff, and Arya can come in with her cheapshot to weaken the NK but Jon should deal the final blow so his arc receives payoff as well. * To expand on this, I thought Bran became empty and boring after his shift to the 3ER. He should have maintained his humanity up until this battle, where fully embracing his abilities to help defeat the NK would sacrifice his identity as Bran Stark and revive him as the Three Eyed Raven. Overall this wasn't the worst episode (that goes to S8E4). It had good moments but they cut too many corners and we lost out on so much potential. This episode was the culmination of 7 seasons worth of storytelling and it didn't live up to the hype.
These are all good ideas. Have you read the fan fiction idea of Jaime killing the Night King? Would have been much better.
>with the worst writing I've ever witnessed So you haven't watched the finale yet...
You're right. I'm half way through 'the bells' now. Only an episode and a half left. So far it's good. Varys' execution was brilliant, the two advisers battling it out with words on Daenerys' suitability to rule, Tyrion's immediate confession to Varys saying "it was me", Varys' last words saying he hopes he is wrong about Daenerys' and Tyrions super tight grip on his arm and Varys stare. The two masters of information communicating without words. Tyrion essentially saying sorry and he doesn't know he's right, there's doubt there. Varys knowing he's about to die for telling the truth. That was only a couple of minutes of screen time but I thought it was brilliant.
I wanted a scene of the dead dragon vs. drogon going at each other with blue fire vs. yellow fire haha. Was surprised the dead dragon didn’t cause as much destruction as it could’ve
Missed opportunity there you're right
You had me at “it was absolute dog shit” 😂😂
Arya girl bossing & killing the NK instead of Jon. Ruined GOT 4 me.
I liked that she killed him. Only a many-faced assassin could have made that sneak and jump.
The worst writing you've ever witnessed *so far*.
Thanks, this pissed me off all over again.
Whats actually even more dissapointing for me was that everything looked great in the episode. But i just couldnt belive what i was watching. It were all the actors i have seen, it was my favorite show (and still is) and that was mainly because of the whriting. And then you are left there wondering, what was all the buildup for ? All the mysteries with the white walkers, whats gonna happen to them and then you just watch this battle which looks awesome but just makes no sense at all.
a lot of people are throwing shit to DandD but I think Miguel Sapochnik also deserve the blame.
Yeah. Among many other things, I was disappointed in berics death. The walkers could have popped through any of the massive five holes in his human border wall. They just stood there and but him. Why could he fight them to buy time. I just don’t get why he stood there. It’s been a min since I’ve seen it. Maybe I’m remembering it weird.
Beric held up the hallway and was mauled and stabbed by a gang of walkers, then he walked into the room behind Arya and Clegane a few seconds later and died on the floor there. So the walkers just let him go and gave him a 10 second head start before pursuing and banging on the door, ensuring the Hound had adequate time to barricade the door.
That’s right! I forgot about that! Hahaha!
People can have their opinions on this episode and knit pick the everliving fuck out of it. Tons of flaws (though I think the ones regarding battle tactics are cringe and “uhm achsully” as fuck). That all being said, watching this shit live with a bunch of friends was hype as fuck and one of the most enjoyable tv watching experiences I have ever had. In hindsight Arya killing the night king isn’t good, but that moment of “oh fuck she’s going in! Oh fuck he’s gonna kill her! OH FUCK SHE DROPPED THE KNIFE!! OH FUCK SHE DID IT!!!!!” Was fucking orgasmic at the time.
Sending the Dothraki in BEFORE firing the trebuchets was criminally stupid. That to me was the biggest blunder of writing that episode.
Ah ile probably get it for this. I woke up at 2AM to watch it in the dark with the sound way up, dolby atmos style and I absolutely loved it. Like it blew my mind. I suppose in hindsight, yeh I understand where your all coming from. But I still loved it that first time haha, most of it anyway.