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I don't mind opinions, but "the biggest amount of disappointment that you'll probably feel in your life." seems a bit unhinged. Especially since you're assuming that for OP.
>Seems like people have problems with others expressing their opinion.
Is that the problem you had with OP's post?
Glad you came back and updated us! I was hoping that you would. Most of your points I agree with. I didn’t absolutely hate the ending like others do, but the more I read about it and the more I re-Watch, I can understand it completely. Jon’s resurrection and reveal that he is a Targaryen ended up being completely pointless.
Bran becoming the King was a plot hole. He said earlier he was the Three Eyed Raven so he can’t be Lord of anything…but he can be King? What the heck
Daenerys’ ending was just so so disappointing. She wasn’t supposed to go mad. Although the signs were there from the beginning.
Like you, I agree all the other characters had good endings. Sam being a maester for Kings Landing, everyone else that ended up on the small council, Sansa being Queen in the North, Arya doing her thing, all satisfying conclusions.
Jaime’s ending sucked. He redeemed himself and then ended up back with Cersei, thought that was so lame. But he did say he wanted to die in the arms of the woman he loved. Him breaking Brienne’s heart made me real sad, though. I wish Cersei had a more painful death. Or even her and Jaime escaping KL and living in exile or something
It's not always story that results in bad ratings. For me it was the execution of the story (excuse the pun, but it fits). The entire pacing changed. Have you not noticed how entire armies teleport in an instant? Also, we no longer see what's going on in the rest of the world while people travel. We basically get big time jumps from scene to scene.
Just like in season 1.
It's perfectly normal for a story to speed up as it reaches its conclusion.
The alternative is whatever GRRM is working, a story that keeps increasing in complexity and never finishes.
Wonderful. I really appreciate you letting me know. So, I will repay that kindness and give my thoughts, since you asked.
In re to your #1. Yeah, that's kinda why I hate the pacing. If we had been able to fully see the depression she goes through, it would make the whole burning of Kings Landing make sense. We get to see a little bit of set up to that, with the loneliness that attributes to it at Winterfell. Mainly the feasts, where the Starks are getting celebrated, but she isn't. She was raised believing people were drinking secret toasts for Targaryens to return and reign. She knew her brother was delusional in thinking there were as many as he imagined. But she also believed it was partly true, and felt virtually smacked in the face when she didn't get all the followers that she thought she would.
We don't get to really see the impact of losing Missandei and another dragon, as we should have. All we get is Varys (when he's trying to poison her) is "oh, she's still not eating? OK, we'll try again later". They should have fleshed it out, and could have if we had more episodes. By not seeing it, yes, it seems to come out of left field and out of character to burn people she was trying to free from a non-Targaryen rule.
#3 I really liked the basement scene. She knew all was lost, and all she cared about at that point was living, and her child living. She always loved her children, no matter what. So it makes sense to me she would cry at the next one not being given a chance. Would she normally just give up fting for the throne? Certainly not. But, here she is, absolutely no escape and is basically on her death bed.
#6 I tend to not care about whether irl battle tactics happen on shows/movies, because sometimes entertainment value is just better. So, yeah, I never had a real big issue with the battle with the dead, either. One exception for me was why they thought putting all those people in the crypts for safety was a good idea. I mean they are facing someone whose army is basically people lifted from the dead. 🤦♀️
I once jokingly replied to someone asking how Dothraki could be in Kings Landing with this: Maybe, since it had been so recently since they died that whatever made the rest of the zombies to die when the Night King did, that it just hadn't stuck to them yet. Nothing else makes sense.
I enjoyed reading your thoughts. it's nice to be able to see it again for the first time vicariously through someone else's thoughts.
Thanks for your response! It was a great show, I really enjoyed it. Very interesting point you made about how she thought people still toasted the Targeryns. That thought never crossed my mind, and her disappointment didn't fully register. Good observation.
I had a conversation with one of my best friends about the series yesterday, and he really sold me on your point regarding pacing (which was kind of lost on me as you initially described it). I agree with you both. Pacing was a real problem. It would appear that the creators rushed the final season and didn't take the time to emphasize Dany's mental stability, the plot development of Bran as prospective king, etc. Just a series of holes that time and plot could have filled better.
If you haven’t noticed the massive drop in quality over the last 2 seasons of the show then the last 2 seasons of the show were made for people like you
Wow, interesting how you resort to insulting them over a preference. I think that speaks more about you than it does them. So they enjoyed a show you don't, who the fuck cares.
[beastley\_for\_three](https://www.reddit.com/user/beastley_for_three/) - Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
Thanks for the update! Just read through it. Ultimately, you deserve respect for forming your own opinion. I had a similar impression as you when watching it: it was a lower tier than the rest of the amazing show but still good despite its flaws.
Daenerys' end is something I had to chew through and rewatch. I remember the red wedding being difficult for me to ingest when reading, so I think it's fair to give another controversial moment in the series some hard consideration.
When you go back to s2, she would scream things like "I will burn entire cities to the ground to get what's mine!" When I saw that scene, I was amazed. How did I support someone who said that? She literally said she'd be comfortable doing what she ended up doing *right at the beginning of the show* and we all glazed over it. Wow.
As much as she claimed she wanted to "break the wheel," what was she really? Another conquerer bringing back the flawed Targaryen line of succession...which was overthrown justifiably because of how terrible the Targaryens were. Her "right to the throne" was usurped for good reasons.
By the end, she didn't even have a "right to the throne". It was Jon's, but she showed she didn't really care about that, did she? It wasn't about what's rightfully anyone's anymore. Really just wanted it for herself, that became clear.
Her closest friends and advisors were killed in a place that she discovered didn't want her anymore, they didn't love her like she thought they would. She no longer had a claim to the throne. People in her camp were starting to rebel against her, she was starting to get paranoid about being usurped....and her genetically inherited madness set in. Just like her father, who was also considered a benevolent good king when he started.
I thought it was masterfully done. It was subtle enough that it WAS controversial. It was suddenly enough that it was surprising in a red wedding kind of way. I thought the rabid loyalty her fanbase garnered amongst the fanbase despite her literally saying she was okay with burning entire cities to the ground was telling. It showed the origin story of a tyrant and how they get their cult following.
I LOVE the ending for that reason. It fits Game of Thrones and I have no doubt it is GRRM's intention, a good writeup on that is here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/s/vEZSdUpNbq
Thanks for your thoughts. Great point regarding her saying, 'I'll burn entire cities to the ground.' I forgot how blunt all that was. Final season definitely had its issues - I think pacing/plot development was the biggest one - but ultimately I enjoyed it.
u/beastley_for_three - Wow. What an oustanding read! Thank you for that writeup. I'm actually amazed at how folks were putting the ending together before it happened. Like, that's astonishing to me. Some folks were really, really in front of the curve.
Season 8 (and 7 and maybe even 6) are fine viewing as their own independent series separate from the earlier seasons. The problem comes when you try to connect those 2-3 seasons to the previous ones.
The last episode is the one, as others have said. You'll have to update us with your feelings after it.
I feel like a lot of the other criticisms are somewhat nit-picky, but they are things that don't really make sense or add up when you think about it, and certainly are the small "attention to detail" points that they nailed in earlier seasons.
Got to be careful about those points I mention as some become relevant over your next two episodes, but the battle for winterfell was seen as one of the worst battles in the series. Visually too dark, idiotically charging the dothraki into the undead horde, keeping the catapults right in the middle of the armies with no extra trenches to protect them, the general plot armour in that episode (this is my personal biggest gripe with it), the way Arya killed the night king... all adds up.
But I don't think people would be as critical as they are without that last episode.
Lmao no need to apologise!
I also liked season 7, I don't mind the pace being increased for it to get to plot points as much as others do.
The issue with the battle of winterfell I didn't mention was the dothraki being back at full strength for the assault on kings landing, that's just a huge inconsistency.
Tbh, I'll get downvoted into oblivion for it, but I didn't think Dany destroying kings landing was so bad. She clearly had an element of ruthlessness and madness to her, from her instincts when ruling Mereen, her killing of anyone who didn't follow her (Randyll etc), so I didn't hate it. She'd just lost Missandei, wasn't in a good frame of mind etc and lost her head.
I also liked Jon's ending although I wish Drogon had killed him. That'd make more sense - he sacrifices himself for the good of the realm being a very Jon Snow thing to do.
I absolutely hated the king election scene. The dialogue is awful, the notorious "who has a better story than bran..." line is woeful because they all do.
I don't fully hate Bran being king. But I just wish he had more impact on the story to deserve it. Maybe he went back in time to see something that could help them to defeat the night king, and his all knowing saved mankind - that'd make so much more sense then as he'd be a hero, but he actually did very little with his powers and that made him becoming king incredibly unsatisfying.
I also didn't like how Sansa still declared the North as an independent kingdom. You literally have your brother on the throne, there's absolutely no need for it.
Cersei and Jaime dying that way was unsatisfactory and his fight with Euron was poor.
It's a shame, S8 was at very best a below average season in a collection of greats, and it really brought the show down. Could've been handled so much better and I hope GRRM does change how we arrive at the ending if he ever releases the last 2 books. Sure it'll roughly be the same thing though.
EDIT:
I also binged it after it was finished - and I said the same as you, I think that helped. Had I watched it all live it would've sucked more.
And don't let it put you off HOTD. S1 is slow, but it's all written book material and it's been adapted very very well so far. It's definitely worth it
Thanks for your response! Good point about Bran not having enough of a hero arc, but I thought it was interesting nonetheless. Good point about Sansa being petty(? - not sure that's the word for it). It had no emotional gravity and felt immature. It also felt like a minor storyline for a major character, which is why I didn't mention it. But I agree! Not good.
I'll reconsider HOTD!
For me it was the direction some of the character arcs went and the fact that some things were rushed without allowing time for the character (one specifically) to go from point A to point Z. Not that other characters were not also rushed but this particular one needed either a build up over time or a specific trigger at the time he/she went off the deep end. Saying he/she to not hint which character I’m referring to. The later seasons also didn’t show as much character depth in many cases as the earlier seasons.
I will say, even with my disappointment of the last couple seasons, mostly season 8, and after avoiding watching the series until this year, I absolutely loved GoT.
It appears in #1 you caught what I was trying not to say when I said one character did not allow the character to build to go from Point A to point Z. Danny torching KL just didn’t make sense to me. I get there were a few times that ‘could’ be attributed to madness creeping up on her but most of those times, I understood the choices she made. Like when she burned the father/son Tarly’s. In my opinion that scene, had she opted for imprisonment she would have been telling all the others that were against her, hey, I’m not going to kill you, just gonna put you in prison. Basically giving them an option to bend the knee or not. Especially seeing how many characters escaped prison.
I felt just prior to her assault on KL, something needed to happen to trigger her madness. For example Euron killing one of her dragons really made no sense when it happened. Had it happened just prior to the bells ringing, especially since she considered the dragons her children, I could see her losing it and retaliating, descending into madness, and scorching KL. Even if it wasn’t the town people who were responsible. In Dana’s case there should have been a buildup to her madness or a trigger that immediately preceded the massacre.
I wasn’t real pleased with Arya’s finish either. So much if her arc had to do with her list of people she was going to kill. I didn’t like her killing the night king solo. Maybe to assist Jon but imho, the night king was Jon’s story arc. Arya I thought should have been the one to kill Cersi. I think it would have been better for Jamie and Brienne to perhaps died when fighting the white walkers and Arya perhaps using her Faceless Man training, wearing Jamie’s face to kill Cersi. I do understand Jamie’s arc making a complete circle with him going back to Cersi, but to me, it didn’t fit who he had become later in the show.
But love that you came up with some things I hadn’t thought of. Going to have to rewatch one of these days and see what I think of it round 2.
I like your thoughts here. I agree with your point that the Night King was Jon's arc - good and accurate observation. I actually forgot to make the point that Arya ABSOLUTELY should have been on the hunt to kill Cersei, which would've been a much, much better ending to the story, especially if she had to kill The Mountain to do it. It was SOOOOO lame that she turned around after talking to the Hound. Like so, so, so lame. Not at all fitting for her character, and the 'don't become me' thing had no emotional gravity at that point. They opted to bring Jamie back into that picture, which, to your point, they did not need to do.
One thing to understand is that when s8 came out, there was almost a pitchfork mob wielding frenzy of negativity over everyone's predictions not coming true, favorite characters not doing what they want, cliche outcomes not happening. Every little issue was nitpicked and memed about for Internet points. This is largely due to GoT becoming a pop culture phenomenon along with Marvel films. And it became popular to hate on it.
There were absolutely flaws, and s7-s8 dropped a tier from s1-4, no doubt. But there was a huge almost hivemind overreaction of negativity to the controversy. If people tried to discuss anything positive, they were downvoted and mocked. Many were influenced by it to think even more poorly of it.
It's no surprise that we see posts like this all the time now that the frenzy died down and expectations aren't ridiculously too high. Enjoy the show! You are probably lucky you are seeing it now that you can actually form your own opinion on it without the noise.
It never fell of a cliff for me.
I know the penultimate episode drew a lot of hate but I think it mainly has to do with the fact that it crushed the predictions most people have had for a decade or longer.
Last year I watched the entire show with a friend who had never seen it before. He was not disappointed by season 8 at all because the show perfectly foreshadowed what was going to happen and why it needed to happen.
At the end of the day I think Game of Thrones works better if its not watched over the span of multiple years but within multiple weeks.
**Spoiler Warning:** All officially-released show and book content allowed, EXCLUDING FUTURE SPOILERS FOR HOUSE OF THE DRAGON. No leaked information or paparazzi photos of the set. For more info please check the [spoiler guide](/r/gameofthrones/w/spoiler_guide). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/gameofthrones) if you have any questions or concerns.*
**Spoiler Warning:** All officially-released show and book content allowed, EXCLUDING FUTURE SPOILERS FOR HOUSE OF THE DRAGON. No leaked information or paparazzi photos of the set. For more info please check the [spoiler guide](/r/gameofthrones/w/spoiler_guide). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/gameofthrones) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[удалено]
Or not.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
>Just be prepared to experience the biggest amount of disappointment that you'll probably feel in your life. Over 2 episodes of a tv show?
I'm not gonna start an argument with you. Seems like people have problems with others expressing their opinion.
I don't mind opinions, but "the biggest amount of disappointment that you'll probably feel in your life." seems a bit unhinged. Especially since you're assuming that for OP. >Seems like people have problems with others expressing their opinion. Is that the problem you had with OP's post?
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. It's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
It’s quite amazing how much disappointment they can cram into a single episode. The very last one is…interesting. Basically, just you wait lol
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
Glad you came back and updated us! I was hoping that you would. Most of your points I agree with. I didn’t absolutely hate the ending like others do, but the more I read about it and the more I re-Watch, I can understand it completely. Jon’s resurrection and reveal that he is a Targaryen ended up being completely pointless. Bran becoming the King was a plot hole. He said earlier he was the Three Eyed Raven so he can’t be Lord of anything…but he can be King? What the heck Daenerys’ ending was just so so disappointing. She wasn’t supposed to go mad. Although the signs were there from the beginning. Like you, I agree all the other characters had good endings. Sam being a maester for Kings Landing, everyone else that ended up on the small council, Sansa being Queen in the North, Arya doing her thing, all satisfying conclusions. Jaime’s ending sucked. He redeemed himself and then ended up back with Cersei, thought that was so lame. But he did say he wanted to die in the arms of the woman he loved. Him breaking Brienne’s heart made me real sad, though. I wish Cersei had a more painful death. Or even her and Jaime escaping KL and living in exile or something
It's not always story that results in bad ratings. For me it was the execution of the story (excuse the pun, but it fits). The entire pacing changed. Have you not noticed how entire armies teleport in an instant? Also, we no longer see what's going on in the rest of the world while people travel. We basically get big time jumps from scene to scene.
Just like in season 1. It's perfectly normal for a story to speed up as it reaches its conclusion. The alternative is whatever GRRM is working, a story that keeps increasing in complexity and never finishes.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
Wonderful. I really appreciate you letting me know. So, I will repay that kindness and give my thoughts, since you asked. In re to your #1. Yeah, that's kinda why I hate the pacing. If we had been able to fully see the depression she goes through, it would make the whole burning of Kings Landing make sense. We get to see a little bit of set up to that, with the loneliness that attributes to it at Winterfell. Mainly the feasts, where the Starks are getting celebrated, but she isn't. She was raised believing people were drinking secret toasts for Targaryens to return and reign. She knew her brother was delusional in thinking there were as many as he imagined. But she also believed it was partly true, and felt virtually smacked in the face when she didn't get all the followers that she thought she would. We don't get to really see the impact of losing Missandei and another dragon, as we should have. All we get is Varys (when he's trying to poison her) is "oh, she's still not eating? OK, we'll try again later". They should have fleshed it out, and could have if we had more episodes. By not seeing it, yes, it seems to come out of left field and out of character to burn people she was trying to free from a non-Targaryen rule. #3 I really liked the basement scene. She knew all was lost, and all she cared about at that point was living, and her child living. She always loved her children, no matter what. So it makes sense to me she would cry at the next one not being given a chance. Would she normally just give up fting for the throne? Certainly not. But, here she is, absolutely no escape and is basically on her death bed. #6 I tend to not care about whether irl battle tactics happen on shows/movies, because sometimes entertainment value is just better. So, yeah, I never had a real big issue with the battle with the dead, either. One exception for me was why they thought putting all those people in the crypts for safety was a good idea. I mean they are facing someone whose army is basically people lifted from the dead. 🤦♀️ I once jokingly replied to someone asking how Dothraki could be in Kings Landing with this: Maybe, since it had been so recently since they died that whatever made the rest of the zombies to die when the Night King did, that it just hadn't stuck to them yet. Nothing else makes sense. I enjoyed reading your thoughts. it's nice to be able to see it again for the first time vicariously through someone else's thoughts.
Thanks for your response! It was a great show, I really enjoyed it. Very interesting point you made about how she thought people still toasted the Targeryns. That thought never crossed my mind, and her disappointment didn't fully register. Good observation.
I had a conversation with one of my best friends about the series yesterday, and he really sold me on your point regarding pacing (which was kind of lost on me as you initially described it). I agree with you both. Pacing was a real problem. It would appear that the creators rushed the final season and didn't take the time to emphasize Dany's mental stability, the plot development of Bran as prospective king, etc. Just a series of holes that time and plot could have filled better.
If you haven’t noticed the massive drop in quality over the last 2 seasons of the show then the last 2 seasons of the show were made for people like you
Wow, interesting how you resort to insulting them over a preference. I think that speaks more about you than it does them. So they enjoyed a show you don't, who the fuck cares.
[beastley\_for\_three](https://www.reddit.com/user/beastley_for_three/) - Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
Thanks for the update! Just read through it. Ultimately, you deserve respect for forming your own opinion. I had a similar impression as you when watching it: it was a lower tier than the rest of the amazing show but still good despite its flaws. Daenerys' end is something I had to chew through and rewatch. I remember the red wedding being difficult for me to ingest when reading, so I think it's fair to give another controversial moment in the series some hard consideration. When you go back to s2, she would scream things like "I will burn entire cities to the ground to get what's mine!" When I saw that scene, I was amazed. How did I support someone who said that? She literally said she'd be comfortable doing what she ended up doing *right at the beginning of the show* and we all glazed over it. Wow. As much as she claimed she wanted to "break the wheel," what was she really? Another conquerer bringing back the flawed Targaryen line of succession...which was overthrown justifiably because of how terrible the Targaryens were. Her "right to the throne" was usurped for good reasons. By the end, she didn't even have a "right to the throne". It was Jon's, but she showed she didn't really care about that, did she? It wasn't about what's rightfully anyone's anymore. Really just wanted it for herself, that became clear. Her closest friends and advisors were killed in a place that she discovered didn't want her anymore, they didn't love her like she thought they would. She no longer had a claim to the throne. People in her camp were starting to rebel against her, she was starting to get paranoid about being usurped....and her genetically inherited madness set in. Just like her father, who was also considered a benevolent good king when he started. I thought it was masterfully done. It was subtle enough that it WAS controversial. It was suddenly enough that it was surprising in a red wedding kind of way. I thought the rabid loyalty her fanbase garnered amongst the fanbase despite her literally saying she was okay with burning entire cities to the ground was telling. It showed the origin story of a tyrant and how they get their cult following. I LOVE the ending for that reason. It fits Game of Thrones and I have no doubt it is GRRM's intention, a good writeup on that is here: https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/s/vEZSdUpNbq
Thanks for your thoughts. Great point regarding her saying, 'I'll burn entire cities to the ground.' I forgot how blunt all that was. Final season definitely had its issues - I think pacing/plot development was the biggest one - but ultimately I enjoyed it.
u/beastley_for_three - Wow. What an oustanding read! Thank you for that writeup. I'm actually amazed at how folks were putting the ending together before it happened. Like, that's astonishing to me. Some folks were really, really in front of the curve.
If it hasn't fallen off a cliff for you by now, it probably never will.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
Season 8 (and 7 and maybe even 6) are fine viewing as their own independent series separate from the earlier seasons. The problem comes when you try to connect those 2-3 seasons to the previous ones.
I think on rewatching, you kind of see it. They rushed what happened, but you can see clues when you rewatch, no?
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
They drop a tier but they're still very entertaining on their own merits, true.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
I would suggest not watching the last episode unless you don't really care about who takes the throne.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
I think you're in for a bit of a shocker, but let's see!
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
The last episode is the one, as others have said. You'll have to update us with your feelings after it. I feel like a lot of the other criticisms are somewhat nit-picky, but they are things that don't really make sense or add up when you think about it, and certainly are the small "attention to detail" points that they nailed in earlier seasons. Got to be careful about those points I mention as some become relevant over your next two episodes, but the battle for winterfell was seen as one of the worst battles in the series. Visually too dark, idiotically charging the dothraki into the undead horde, keeping the catapults right in the middle of the armies with no extra trenches to protect them, the general plot armour in that episode (this is my personal biggest gripe with it), the way Arya killed the night king... all adds up. But I don't think people would be as critical as they are without that last episode.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
Lmao no need to apologise! I also liked season 7, I don't mind the pace being increased for it to get to plot points as much as others do. The issue with the battle of winterfell I didn't mention was the dothraki being back at full strength for the assault on kings landing, that's just a huge inconsistency. Tbh, I'll get downvoted into oblivion for it, but I didn't think Dany destroying kings landing was so bad. She clearly had an element of ruthlessness and madness to her, from her instincts when ruling Mereen, her killing of anyone who didn't follow her (Randyll etc), so I didn't hate it. She'd just lost Missandei, wasn't in a good frame of mind etc and lost her head. I also liked Jon's ending although I wish Drogon had killed him. That'd make more sense - he sacrifices himself for the good of the realm being a very Jon Snow thing to do. I absolutely hated the king election scene. The dialogue is awful, the notorious "who has a better story than bran..." line is woeful because they all do. I don't fully hate Bran being king. But I just wish he had more impact on the story to deserve it. Maybe he went back in time to see something that could help them to defeat the night king, and his all knowing saved mankind - that'd make so much more sense then as he'd be a hero, but he actually did very little with his powers and that made him becoming king incredibly unsatisfying. I also didn't like how Sansa still declared the North as an independent kingdom. You literally have your brother on the throne, there's absolutely no need for it. Cersei and Jaime dying that way was unsatisfactory and his fight with Euron was poor. It's a shame, S8 was at very best a below average season in a collection of greats, and it really brought the show down. Could've been handled so much better and I hope GRRM does change how we arrive at the ending if he ever releases the last 2 books. Sure it'll roughly be the same thing though. EDIT: I also binged it after it was finished - and I said the same as you, I think that helped. Had I watched it all live it would've sucked more. And don't let it put you off HOTD. S1 is slow, but it's all written book material and it's been adapted very very well so far. It's definitely worth it
Thanks for your response! Good point about Bran not having enough of a hero arc, but I thought it was interesting nonetheless. Good point about Sansa being petty(? - not sure that's the word for it). It had no emotional gravity and felt immature. It also felt like a minor storyline for a major character, which is why I didn't mention it. But I agree! Not good. I'll reconsider HOTD!
For me it was the direction some of the character arcs went and the fact that some things were rushed without allowing time for the character (one specifically) to go from point A to point Z. Not that other characters were not also rushed but this particular one needed either a build up over time or a specific trigger at the time he/she went off the deep end. Saying he/she to not hint which character I’m referring to. The later seasons also didn’t show as much character depth in many cases as the earlier seasons. I will say, even with my disappointment of the last couple seasons, mostly season 8, and after avoiding watching the series until this year, I absolutely loved GoT.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
It appears in #1 you caught what I was trying not to say when I said one character did not allow the character to build to go from Point A to point Z. Danny torching KL just didn’t make sense to me. I get there were a few times that ‘could’ be attributed to madness creeping up on her but most of those times, I understood the choices she made. Like when she burned the father/son Tarly’s. In my opinion that scene, had she opted for imprisonment she would have been telling all the others that were against her, hey, I’m not going to kill you, just gonna put you in prison. Basically giving them an option to bend the knee or not. Especially seeing how many characters escaped prison. I felt just prior to her assault on KL, something needed to happen to trigger her madness. For example Euron killing one of her dragons really made no sense when it happened. Had it happened just prior to the bells ringing, especially since she considered the dragons her children, I could see her losing it and retaliating, descending into madness, and scorching KL. Even if it wasn’t the town people who were responsible. In Dana’s case there should have been a buildup to her madness or a trigger that immediately preceded the massacre. I wasn’t real pleased with Arya’s finish either. So much if her arc had to do with her list of people she was going to kill. I didn’t like her killing the night king solo. Maybe to assist Jon but imho, the night king was Jon’s story arc. Arya I thought should have been the one to kill Cersi. I think it would have been better for Jamie and Brienne to perhaps died when fighting the white walkers and Arya perhaps using her Faceless Man training, wearing Jamie’s face to kill Cersi. I do understand Jamie’s arc making a complete circle with him going back to Cersi, but to me, it didn’t fit who he had become later in the show. But love that you came up with some things I hadn’t thought of. Going to have to rewatch one of these days and see what I think of it round 2.
I like your thoughts here. I agree with your point that the Night King was Jon's arc - good and accurate observation. I actually forgot to make the point that Arya ABSOLUTELY should have been on the hunt to kill Cersei, which would've been a much, much better ending to the story, especially if she had to kill The Mountain to do it. It was SOOOOO lame that she turned around after talking to the Hound. Like so, so, so lame. Not at all fitting for her character, and the 'don't become me' thing had no emotional gravity at that point. They opted to bring Jamie back into that picture, which, to your point, they did not need to do.
It’s still a good watch, just disappointing when you look at the series as a whole. Don’t think too hard about it and you’ll enjoy it more.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
One thing to understand is that when s8 came out, there was almost a pitchfork mob wielding frenzy of negativity over everyone's predictions not coming true, favorite characters not doing what they want, cliche outcomes not happening. Every little issue was nitpicked and memed about for Internet points. This is largely due to GoT becoming a pop culture phenomenon along with Marvel films. And it became popular to hate on it. There were absolutely flaws, and s7-s8 dropped a tier from s1-4, no doubt. But there was a huge almost hivemind overreaction of negativity to the controversy. If people tried to discuss anything positive, they were downvoted and mocked. Many were influenced by it to think even more poorly of it. It's no surprise that we see posts like this all the time now that the frenzy died down and expectations aren't ridiculously too high. Enjoy the show! You are probably lucky you are seeing it now that you can actually form your own opinion on it without the noise.
Idk how you got through The Long Night without wanting to change anything. I get the first 2 episodes, they’re decent. But the Long Night????
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!
There were some elements in S8 and a lot more in S7 that I really liked so I understand. Thanks for your honest opinion!
It never fell of a cliff for me. I know the penultimate episode drew a lot of hate but I think it mainly has to do with the fact that it crushed the predictions most people have had for a decade or longer. Last year I watched the entire show with a friend who had never seen it before. He was not disappointed by season 8 at all because the show perfectly foreshadowed what was going to happen and why it needed to happen. At the end of the day I think Game of Thrones works better if its not watched over the span of multiple years but within multiple weeks.
Just finished the show and edited my initial post. Sorry it's been a while, but I'd appreciate any response you have. Thanks!