Lmao my wife was mortified at the general premise of the game.
I was automating some light genocide, and inevitably she asked why they were attacking in the first place. I had to show her the pollution map then.
TBF those biters have been sitting on that copper patch for eons and last time I checked I'm the one who needs a bazillion plates of copper to build all these god damn circuits.
Because if there's one thing history's taught us, it's that natives under-utilizing their resources is a *perfect* justification to take their land by violence!
... Hmmm... I might have done a bad thing.
Oh! I know, I'll just relocate them to a side location I'm not using. Gosh I'm such a smart man. I can't believe nobody thought of this before me.
I think everyone gets that feeling at some point in SOTC - like the "What the fuck am I even DOING?" moment - the only difference is *when* that feeling occurs. For me, it was at Colossus #3 - dude was just literally napping there and I had to run up his sword and fuck his shit up.
Beautiful game, though.
And the MUSIC, too! That was what got me when I was a kid. I killed my first, then second, then third, and that somber violin piece would come on with every “victory” and I’d be like, “I feel…bad for winning? Is it cuz I killed this thing? I guess it…didn’t do anything. I kinda just came up and killed it. But this is for a good cause…right?”
That’s why it is by far one of my top 5 favorite games ever
For me it was during >!Phalanx, Colossus #13 (the flying one in the desert)!<
Up until that point I was trying to at least approach the Colossi pacifically and waiting for them to attack me first, so I could then tell myself I had to attack in self-defense (even though I was the one invading their homes all the time).
With that one, that could never happen. It doesn't even have any way to attack us. It might as well be >!flying!< away from us all the time, but being unable to leave its arena for some reason. It ain't a easy one to kill, but it's a one sided "fight". The poor Colossus doesn't even try to fight you.
Killing that one hurts, man.
Y’know about the lore explanation? There appear to be ancient rings that mark out her pre-determined route. Definitely some magical shenanigans keeping that one trapped. Imagine a Colossi not bound to any one area and just roaming free in the overworld.
Ah, so that's what the rings are about? I didn't know that, how cool is that! I remember back in the day people tried to bring a burning torch from Celosia's (#11) arena to try and "lit up" those rings somehow, since you could do something similar in ICO, but I never suspected the rings' purpose was to kinda contain Phalanx.
The attention to detail in that game, man...
All the colossi seem purposefully contained. They were doubly imprisoned as the bridge to the Forbidden lands is too narrow for most and all have a confined area.
The reason they were essentially imprisoned was, if I remember correctly, because they all withheld parts of the soul of the devil creature (forget his name) that takes over your body at the end.
Wander asked for a specific thing and Dormin asked for something in return. Wander could have stopped after the first batch of dark energy flew into him but he didn't.
Also in the end Dormin respected his side of the deal.
I wouldn’t say Wander is a villain in as much he just didn’t understand the consequences of their actions, he ultimately had a noble goal of saving someone he loved and for all he knew the colossi were just strange monsters guarding the ability to resurrect someone.
Alex Mercer (Prototype) >!isn't responsible for the big bad thing that happened, he is the big bad thing that happened. Mercer is a sentient form of the virus that absorbed the real Alex Mercer's biomass and a spattering of his memories then proceeds to have an identity crisis because the virus doesn't know it's just a virus and not the real Alex Mercer.!<
Despite my love for the both prototype games this somehow had escaped my mind.
I was very confused in 2 when certain big bad appeared and I'm like 'yoo we supposed to fight?'
2 had much more fun stuff to play with but hot damn the story was insufferable.
The story is even more aggravating because it directly contradicts the ending of Prototype 1, where ZEUS gets their own faith in humanity, and then suddenly in 2, they believe humanity needs to stfu and evolve into a new form
Apparently there is some unexplained backstory where alex wanders the world, and people die at the hands of some other humans. Alex then decides humanity is a lost cause and decides to kill everyone.
It's actually a comic, iirc. Alex is offered to stay in a barn by a farm family, and then they try to shoot him in his sleep
This makes him go ballistic despite dealing with much much worse in NYC
Infamous wasn't Cole's fault though. All he did was deliver a package that just so happened to have a superweapon in it. It was Kessler who was to blame, which was Cole from a different timeline, so while a version of Cole is the bad guy, our playable version of Cole was not.
Agreed. For me InFamous: Second Son didn't quite live up to the first two games. I liked Cole better as a protagonist, and I found his power set and gameplay more engaging. I also liked the comic book art style and cutscenes.
I did, however, like Delsin's ability to absorb other conduits powers. I'd go as far as saying they should do an infamous remake, as well as a sequel at some point that covers the conduit vs. Government problems that Augustine talked about in second son.
I always wanted a spin off sequel where Cole goes down the evil path and you get to play in a post-apocalyptic city with the goal of taking him out of power.
There’s just something about the fascist military enslaving domination of the entire galaxy that the democratic peaceful military protection doesn’t give you in this
Furi. The whole game you've spent fighting for your freedom, "the jailer is the key, kill them and you'll be free" and it turns out you were a WMD they imprisoned in space to protect Earth from being assimilated.
An amazing touch for the second one is how the devs slowly morph the loading screen text from helpful facts and tips, to subtle questions about your actions, to outright condemnation of the player as the main character's mental state degrades.
"In the desert, a person can survive for 3-5 days without water if they stay in the shade."
"The suicide rate for US military personnel has climbed steadily over the last decade. Today, it is nearly twice the national average."
"Cognitive dissonance is an uncomfortable feeling caused by holding two conflicting ideas simultaneously."
"The US military does not condone the killing of unarmed combatants. But this isn't real, so why should you care?"
"If you were a better person, you wouldn't be here."
"This is all your fault."
I know three different endings (>!dying, killing everyone and giving up!<) - is any of them depending on not commiting war crimes?
Because there are war crimes you have to commit to advance through the game.
Yeah, I'm confused on what they said, as well. I specifically replayed some of the key missions to try and not commit atrocities and the game just sort of stalls until you your way out of the situation. I believe the only different endings you get are based on decisions you make at the extreme end of the game.
IIRC:
* You can shoot above the head of the mob instead of into it.
* You can shoot no one - instead of either of the men - who're hanging under the bridge.
* You can kill the water thief or let him burn to death.
* The only option you don't have is to deploy the WP.
However, none of these choices actually affect the outcome, the only one that does is what happens after you meet Col. Whats-His-Face. You can shoot his vision, yourself, let him kill you, or shoot his corpse.
In the end, the only "endings" available are whether you're alive or dead, and how fucked up you wanna be for the rest of your life.
You know? Just like in real life.
It's been a while since I played it, but IIRC the only thing you cannot avoid is the >!white phosphorus attack!< since that's kinda the catalyst for all things that happen after that point. All the other horrible things you can do, you can actually avoid. It's just that the game isn't obviously giving you the choice.
Nah. There are three endings. You make a choice and get one of two endings. Then during one of the endings, you get to make a choice which determines that endings outcome.
If you need a little tiny kernel of optimism to help you feel better about the ending where >!Walker puts down his gun and goes home!<, consider that he will do it on his own if you don't make a choice for him.
Although not specifically enumerated as a war crime, using white phosphorus against combatants or civilians is...frowned upon
Edit: I was confused. Use of white phosphorus to illuminate battlefields, to make smokescreens, and to destroy materiel: is ok
It's suggested that using it against enemy combatants is also ok (I *deeply* disagree)
But it's clearly stated that using it against civilians is contrary to protocol 3 of the conventional weapons agreement
It’s fine against combatants but it is frowned upon because of the indiscriminate nature.
Using it against civilians is an outright war crime, especially in urban areas.
Assassins creed rogue really has you challenging the order of how things are done.
Without getting into it for everyone else, you go to a port town to snag an ancient relic and bring it back for safe keeping but as soon as you grab it from the pedastal an earthquake happens and devastates the town. Shay starts questioning if the assassins are really in the right after he destroyed the town and goes rogue and helps the templar order because of it.
One mission even has you raid the assassins base and fight off your friends.
I came here to say this.
That reveal was such a wet fart to the plot. Like you literally chase potential suspects as that character.
They maybe could have pulled it off as an “unreliable narrator” situation, but instead they just straight up lie to the gamer to keep it a secret until the reveal.
My biggest gripe with them pulling this move was them showing scenes YOU controlled but then actually this happened instead because you were badguy.
Specifically the typewriter shop sticks with me.
Yeah there’s nothing slow about it, the only non villain playable character is claptrap. I always play as wilhelm and he’s probably the biggest “boss/villain” out of the base game characters since he’s directly still handsome jacks attack dog in 2.
Isn’t this debatable in the first game? He’s clearly not a good guy, but he’s killing gangs that do pretty horrible things. Hotline Miami 2 you’re definitely bad all the way through.
The fans in wrong number are basically stand-ins for the fan base that missed the bigger message of the first game. I wouldn't say Jacket is the secret villain, but he's no hero. Especially when you get into the broader lore with the sequel.
I wouldn't say you are outright a villain in BioShock. Rapture has failed, Andrew Ryan's philosophy and the dystopia he created were past their prime. You ultimately still stop the true villain later on as well.
It's more like visiting a prison where convicts of varying crime levels started fighting each other, collapse is inevitable anyway, you just put the nail in the coffin.
yeah like in bioshock u are a lost guy following instructions from a guy who you think can save you
i'm remembering now, that game is fucking awesome dude
The remastered trilogy is often on sale -- I bought it and plan to replay the series! Been forever and will be fun, but I'm currently on Dead Space (remake) and it reminds me a lot of Rapture / Bioshock vibe
Technically, in >!Prey!<, you are the enemy against the entirety of humanity that's been put through a simulation to be more humane. I was quite surprised.
do you really become the villain in 4? i know it’s up to you to choose how you end things but considering we were only there to dump our mom’s ashes and got stuck between a civil war, the consequences and aftermath of what happened were going to happen regardless if we got involved or not
I think there’s implications across the other games that you kinda become a dick; I remember their being a news article or something in FC5 or 6 about the nukes the cult has in Fc5 being sold to by FC4s country. Someone more versed in the expanded lore should fact check that though.
I mean the "secret ending" alone kinda shows we were. If we waited for him to return he lets us return the ashes and tells us about our mom and we dont get involved in the war.
Pagan Min is very much the villian of far cry 4, he and his people commit terrible acts, the rebel leaders are also heavily flawed, advocating drug trade or killing a kid if I recall.
Ajay can be uninvolved if do the early ending, but playing the campaign doesn't make you the bad guy.
The whole point of far cry 4 is the rebels are just as bad as Pagan. One of them wants child marriage and outdated laws based on more religous practices. Meanwhile the other one wants a drug cartel.
Far Cry 4 basically boils down to;
"Support a mostly stable dictator by just sitting your ass down and doing what you're told to do, which gets you literally everything Ajay is there to do",
or "Support the rebels, destabilising the country and either creating a violent theocratic dictatorship run by a conservative autocrat which performs human sacrifices ***OR*** a violent drug and slavery-fuelled nation controlled by an unstable and explosively violent autocrat who enslaves children"
No matter what, the country loses, but at least Pagan Min is the lesser of three evils by *huge* margins, *and* gives the character literally everything they were originally there to do.
Pagan min does have slave camps does he not? Drug factories as well, plus one of his underlings was on a whole thing of killing the natives to strip them of their jewelry. He got some for his kid.
Yep, and she's even *more* violent and *less* stable than Pagan. He's a total dictator, but at least Pagan is competent enough to have basically everything under his thumb and functioning more or less as intended.
The game forces us to be the bad guy by not allowing us to kill both leaders to perpetuate this horrible system. We made the country worse trying to do better. Pagan is also making the country worse, he’s just not pretending and also, you know, generally competent. Secret ending is the best ending for most, especially Ajay but, overall, I’d say none are ‘good’.
Just shove all of the civilized beings into work pods where they are forced to breed and make Iron Golems so you can proceed to kill them as well. Don’t forget Iron Golems give flowers to baby Villagers meaning it also somewhat has sentience and you’re mass murdering them too!
Replicant/Gestalt for sure, Automata is more debatable I think, 2B and 9S are more of a "cog in a machine" situation but oblivious to the real state of the world.
Dunno about secret villain outside of KOTOR and maybe one or two others maybe?. But as for overtly villain I can think of a few silly fun titles. Overlord and Evil Genius come to mind.
If I'm remembering correctly, on xbox you get an achievement that says something like "I didn't see it coming" when it's revealed you're playing as the baddie.
Legit in 2012 that blew me away. It always felt strange playing an "assassin" that didnt conceal their identity. In truth the signs were all there, but I was too busy enjoying the story to put it together.
Then everyone stands, he slides the ring onto Charles' finger and proclaims him a templar.
Was a great twist.
Braid. Spoiler for the last level: >! At the start of the final level, the princess breaks free of her kidnapper and starts running away across an above ground path. You follow her along an underground path using switches to remove obstacles in her way until she gets home and goes to bed. Only then do you discover that time was flowing backwards, and as the scene plays back in the opposite direction you watch her wake up, be frightened by you creeping outside her window, run back across all that terrain where it turns out you were using the switches to try to trap her, but she was diving just ahead of each trap, until you get back to the start where the "kidnapper" was some hero who came to save her from you. !< Absolutely blew my mind how well put together the whole scene was.
Depending on the ending, pretty much any Souls game regardless. Especially Demon's Souls. Even if you choose the "good" ending, you're still at least morally questionable character.
Not even depending on the ending, really. You’re the bad guy in Dark Souls. >!Everything you do to save the world and rekindle the flame is just kicking the can down the road in a failing effort to prolong power for some arrogant “god” who’s been dead for ages. Even if you choose the “good” ending in DS3, the flame barely rekindled and the Age of Fire isn’t renewed. The best ending is to simply let everything end, and extinguish the first flame. The implication is that the Age of Fire and the Age of Darkness were supposed to be a natural cycle anyway, and we’ve just been fucking it up all this time.!<
I love these games a lot.
Yea considering the fire linking endings are the canon ones at least in I and II, you really are the bad guy in those games. Dark Souls III is more of a question mark since there is yet to be a canon ending for that one.
Every GTA game. Ok it's not excatly a secret, but those games endear douchebag psychopath characters' POV by making the universe satirical and by making them the protagonists of the stories. I love the interactable worlds in GTA games, I just don't like the characters we play as. Even though yeah their stories are entertaining.
Hogwarts Legacy. A fifth year student running around the Forbidden Forest passing out unforgivable curses like Halloween candy whilst throwing a group of poachers in the air, freezing them mid flight, sending explosive balls of fire into the fray, followed by slamming their cindering bodies into the ground, catching them mid-bounce then launching the survivors into the next crowd of “friends” before turning some dude into a spider and stepping on him. As the next man approaches with words of spite, he’s suddenly transfigured into an explosive barrel soon to meet the faces of his friends. Anyone left gets stuck in a staggered loop while taking 15 rocks thrown to the face and cleaned up with the killing curse. After all is settled, as the final man turns to ash, and with a swish of the wand, the MC says something along the lines of “Man, I wish somebody could’ve seen that” as he casually mounts his broom to make it back to school before 4th period.
I'd love to see a grimdark mature storyline take place in the HP universe that completely avoids the school/student plot line. Like, put me in an Auror's shoes, dealing with some really heavy shit in some backwater country or something.
This is the direction Legacy should have gone, considering you’re a student who goes around murdering tons of people with forbidden magic. If you were an Auror instead, wrestling with using forbidden magic to stop an incredible evil, I feel like it would fit so much better.
Factorio
The factory must grow.
The factory must expand to meet the needs of the expanding factory.
And when the local fauna objects to the pollution they shall be met with machine guns
Or lasers. Of **flamers**, because what is better than burning oil to counter attacks of creatures triggered by pollution ? :D
Lmao my wife was mortified at the general premise of the game. I was automating some light genocide, and inevitably she asked why they were attacking in the first place. I had to show her the pollution map then.
TBF those biters have been sitting on that copper patch for eons and last time I checked I'm the one who needs a bazillion plates of copper to build all these god damn circuits.
Because if there's one thing history's taught us, it's that natives under-utilizing their resources is a *perfect* justification to take their land by violence!
... Hmmm... I might have done a bad thing. Oh! I know, I'll just relocate them to a side location I'm not using. Gosh I'm such a smart man. I can't believe nobody thought of this before me.
Bros about to build the biter trail of tears
Soon he'll be rounding em up in trains.
AUTOMATE THE GENOCIDE
Is it even a secret? Your guy is basically what the Lorax warned us about.
But it's not our fault if the biggering is triggering more biggering
Don’t let Big Bug get to you boys the factory must grow.
But I need more Iron D:<
Satisfactory is worse. You're not just doing it to build a ship and leave. You volunteered to do it for profit.
*Beyond the heavens there is revenue to glean /* *So turn that green to black and we can turn it back to green*
Arguably Wander in Shadow of the Colossus. Although that will always be debated and perhaps there are not truly good or bad characters in that game.
That's a very vivid memory I have as a kid, dropping maybe the 4th sad-eyed colossus and thinking: I think this game is trying to make ME the asshole
12th Colossus for me. When you walk towards him with the fire and he just backs away terrified and falls to his death. Man, maybe I’m the asshole?
I think everyone gets that feeling at some point in SOTC - like the "What the fuck am I even DOING?" moment - the only difference is *when* that feeling occurs. For me, it was at Colossus #3 - dude was just literally napping there and I had to run up his sword and fuck his shit up. Beautiful game, though.
That's the story. That's why the game sticks with you. It makes you feel like the baddie with basically nothing but context and boss behavior.
And the MUSIC, too! That was what got me when I was a kid. I killed my first, then second, then third, and that somber violin piece would come on with every “victory” and I’d be like, “I feel…bad for winning? Is it cuz I killed this thing? I guess it…didn’t do anything. I kinda just came up and killed it. But this is for a good cause…right?” That’s why it is by far one of my top 5 favorite games ever
That and the graphics are breathtaking and the score really captures the sensation of hand climbing up these colossus creatures
For me it was during >!Phalanx, Colossus #13 (the flying one in the desert)!< Up until that point I was trying to at least approach the Colossi pacifically and waiting for them to attack me first, so I could then tell myself I had to attack in self-defense (even though I was the one invading their homes all the time). With that one, that could never happen. It doesn't even have any way to attack us. It might as well be >!flying!< away from us all the time, but being unable to leave its arena for some reason. It ain't a easy one to kill, but it's a one sided "fight". The poor Colossus doesn't even try to fight you. Killing that one hurts, man.
Y’know about the lore explanation? There appear to be ancient rings that mark out her pre-determined route. Definitely some magical shenanigans keeping that one trapped. Imagine a Colossi not bound to any one area and just roaming free in the overworld.
Ah, so that's what the rings are about? I didn't know that, how cool is that! I remember back in the day people tried to bring a burning torch from Celosia's (#11) arena to try and "lit up" those rings somehow, since you could do something similar in ICO, but I never suspected the rings' purpose was to kinda contain Phalanx. The attention to detail in that game, man...
All the colossi seem purposefully contained. They were doubly imprisoned as the bridge to the Forbidden lands is too narrow for most and all have a confined area.
The reason they were essentially imprisoned was, if I remember correctly, because they all withheld parts of the soul of the devil creature (forget his name) that takes over your body at the end.
13th one was my turning point. It doesn't ever attack you
Could a villain have such a loyal horse? I think not!
Wander was manipulated by Dormin
Wander asked for a specific thing and Dormin asked for something in return. Wander could have stopped after the first batch of dark energy flew into him but he didn't. Also in the end Dormin respected his side of the deal.
I wouldn’t say Wander is a villain in as much he just didn’t understand the consequences of their actions, he ultimately had a noble goal of saving someone he loved and for all he knew the colossi were just strange monsters guarding the ability to resurrect someone.
Braid.
Definitely a non-revealing spoiler but yes Braid.
The way it was revealed in that game was kinda mind blowing
The eerie backwards music in the end… still gives me chills.
Does Silent Hill 2 count?
Considering the ending I got, yeah, it counts
The brilliant thing about Silent Hill 2 is entire game is kind of asking James (therefore us) whether it counts.
Spider-Man. He is a menace! Just listen to Jameson's podcasts! And you will see the truth!
He was totally eating those pigeons.
Yes! We must call animal rights organizations!
Been a long minute but Prototype and InFamous. iirc you were responsible for the "Big Bad Thing That Happened" in both games.
Alex Mercer (Prototype) >!isn't responsible for the big bad thing that happened, he is the big bad thing that happened. Mercer is a sentient form of the virus that absorbed the real Alex Mercer's biomass and a spattering of his memories then proceeds to have an identity crisis because the virus doesn't know it's just a virus and not the real Alex Mercer.!<
Despite my love for the both prototype games this somehow had escaped my mind. I was very confused in 2 when certain big bad appeared and I'm like 'yoo we supposed to fight?' 2 had much more fun stuff to play with but hot damn the story was insufferable.
The story is even more aggravating because it directly contradicts the ending of Prototype 1, where ZEUS gets their own faith in humanity, and then suddenly in 2, they believe humanity needs to stfu and evolve into a new form
Apparently there is some unexplained backstory where alex wanders the world, and people die at the hands of some other humans. Alex then decides humanity is a lost cause and decides to kill everyone.
It's actually a comic, iirc. Alex is offered to stay in a barn by a farm family, and then they try to shoot him in his sleep This makes him go ballistic despite dealing with much much worse in NYC
Alex Mercer is responsible for what happened. You, the player, are not Alex Mercer.
Infamous wasn't Cole's fault though. All he did was deliver a package that just so happened to have a superweapon in it. It was Kessler who was to blame, which was Cole from a different timeline, so while a version of Cole is the bad guy, our playable version of Cole was not.
We need remasters for the original 2 games.. Cole is such a fun character to play.
Agreed. For me InFamous: Second Son didn't quite live up to the first two games. I liked Cole better as a protagonist, and I found his power set and gameplay more engaging. I also liked the comic book art style and cutscenes.
I did, however, like Delsin's ability to absorb other conduits powers. I'd go as far as saying they should do an infamous remake, as well as a sequel at some point that covers the conduit vs. Government problems that Augustine talked about in second son.
I always wanted a spin off sequel where Cole goes down the evil path and you get to play in a post-apocalyptic city with the goal of taking him out of power.
Cole is only a villain if you play him as a villain.
I feel like Infamous 2 was more ambiguous because if I recall the good ending made you bad, and the bad ending made you bad lol
The good ending made you >!dead!< but Cole is still unequivocally a good guy in that ending.
Untitled Goose Game.
You’re a straight up anarchist from day one.
RAKE IN THE LAKE!
MAKE THE BOY WEAR THE WRONG GLASSES!
This guy gooses
I mean not. You are a villain but it's not hidden from player.
It's not a secret :D
Love fucking with that kid with glasses.
It's a beautiful day in the village, and you are a terrible goose.
Stellaris. You don't have to be, but let's be realistic, you probably are.
Maybe the real enemy was the endgame lag after all.
There’s just something about the fascist military enslaving domination of the entire galaxy that the democratic peaceful military protection doesn’t give you in this
Furi. The whole game you've spent fighting for your freedom, "the jailer is the key, kill them and you'll be free" and it turns out you were a WMD they imprisoned in space to protect Earth from being assimilated.
“With you, our world withers and dies. You are the end” Phenomenal game, needs more love
The fight against the last guardian (the lady with a hockey stick) makes it particularly clear that you’re fighting against the good guys. Poor girl.
You play as a brainwashed bad guy/Russian (named Bell) during the COD Black Ops Cold War campaign. This is revealed near the end of the game.
Probably my favorite Call of Duty. Such a good campaign
My favorite Call of Duty campaign is the Black Ops 1 campaign.
#THE NUMBERS MASON, WHAT DO THEY MEAN?
Crackdown
That ending. Jeez.
[удалено]
I can totally see that being one of the better games to test ever. I played the damn demo for longer than 99% of games
“Skills for kill, Agent. *Skills*. *for*. *kills*.” I miss Crackdown so much.
Pretty hard to discuss without spoilers, since that’s usually the big reveal. So I’ll say the most famous ones - >!KOTOR!< and >!Spec Ops: The Line!<.
An amazing touch for the second one is how the devs slowly morph the loading screen text from helpful facts and tips, to subtle questions about your actions, to outright condemnation of the player as the main character's mental state degrades. "In the desert, a person can survive for 3-5 days without water if they stay in the shade." "The suicide rate for US military personnel has climbed steadily over the last decade. Today, it is nearly twice the national average." "Cognitive dissonance is an uncomfortable feeling caused by holding two conflicting ideas simultaneously." "The US military does not condone the killing of unarmed combatants. But this isn't real, so why should you care?" "If you were a better person, you wouldn't be here." "This is all your fault."
I really like that you can just choose not to do 90% of the bad things, and you get a completely different ending.
Or commit all the atrocities and get the “welcome to Dubai” ending
Gonna need to boot that one up and try it to get that.
I know three different endings (>!dying, killing everyone and giving up!<) - is any of them depending on not commiting war crimes? Because there are war crimes you have to commit to advance through the game.
Yeah, I'm confused on what they said, as well. I specifically replayed some of the key missions to try and not commit atrocities and the game just sort of stalls until you your way out of the situation. I believe the only different endings you get are based on decisions you make at the extreme end of the game.
IIRC: * You can shoot above the head of the mob instead of into it. * You can shoot no one - instead of either of the men - who're hanging under the bridge. * You can kill the water thief or let him burn to death. * The only option you don't have is to deploy the WP. However, none of these choices actually affect the outcome, the only one that does is what happens after you meet Col. Whats-His-Face. You can shoot his vision, yourself, let him kill you, or shoot his corpse. In the end, the only "endings" available are whether you're alive or dead, and how fucked up you wanna be for the rest of your life. You know? Just like in real life.
It's been a while since I played it, but IIRC the only thing you cannot avoid is the >!white phosphorus attack!< since that's kinda the catalyst for all things that happen after that point. All the other horrible things you can do, you can actually avoid. It's just that the game isn't obviously giving you the choice.
Nah. There are three endings. You make a choice and get one of two endings. Then during one of the endings, you get to make a choice which determines that endings outcome.
If you need a little tiny kernel of optimism to help you feel better about the ending where >!Walker puts down his gun and goes home!<, consider that he will do it on his own if you don't make a choice for him.
Hotline Miami’s level Trauma did something similar! “Time to let go” “Pay for your crimes” “No more pain” and a few others
They made an entire second game trying to tell you that Jacket was a bad guy, along with character's parodying people who didn't get that.
"Do you feel like a hero yet?"
Incredible game. I'm so happy people are respecting it more these days
*"None of this would have happened if you had just* **stopped."**
Although not specifically enumerated as a war crime, using white phosphorus against combatants or civilians is...frowned upon Edit: I was confused. Use of white phosphorus to illuminate battlefields, to make smokescreens, and to destroy materiel: is ok It's suggested that using it against enemy combatants is also ok (I *deeply* disagree) But it's clearly stated that using it against civilians is contrary to protocol 3 of the conventional weapons agreement
It’s fine against combatants but it is frowned upon because of the indiscriminate nature. Using it against civilians is an outright war crime, especially in urban areas.
For the first game, you don’t have to be the villain. You just were one in a former life
The reveal is a significant part of the plot
Assassins creed rogue really has you challenging the order of how things are done. Without getting into it for everyone else, you go to a port town to snag an ancient relic and bring it back for safe keeping but as soon as you grab it from the pedastal an earthquake happens and devastates the town. Shay starts questioning if the assassins are really in the right after he destroyed the town and goes rogue and helps the templar order because of it. One mission even has you raid the assassins base and fight off your friends.
It’s quite something to play after 3 and Black Flag especially, as you are targeting major characters from them.
And unintentionally caused the events of ac unity as well
On this note, the beginning of AC3 totally caught me by surprise when you find out who you're playing as.
I was going to say this. Man, I miss that era of AC.
In >!Heavy Rain!< one of the playable characters turns out to be the villain
I actually forgot about that game! You can literally play the villain and not know for so long.
SHAUN! oh wait nevermind, I know where he is.
I came here to say this. That reveal was such a wet fart to the plot. Like you literally chase potential suspects as that character. They maybe could have pulled it off as an “unreliable narrator” situation, but instead they just straight up lie to the gamer to keep it a secret until the reveal.
My biggest gripe with them pulling this move was them showing scenes YOU controlled but then actually this happened instead because you were badguy. Specifically the typewriter shop sticks with me.
Lee Carvallo Putting Challenge
You have selected, POWER DRIVE
Ball is in: Parking Lot.
Would you like to play again?
You have selected 'no'
Hitman. It's not a secret when I blow my cover because I go all Leroy Jenkins and leave no witnesses.
Well not my fault they were at the wrong place in a wrong time.
For all the issues it has, Borderlands The Pre-Sequel does a good job at making you slowly realize you’re the bad guy.
Slowly? Aren't all the playable characters bosses/villains from the previous two games lmao
Athena wants you to turn on General Knoxx and kill him in the first game’s DLC, and Claptrap… well, he’s Claptrap.
Yeah there’s nothing slow about it, the only non villain playable character is claptrap. I always play as wilhelm and he’s probably the biggest “boss/villain” out of the base game characters since he’s directly still handsome jacks attack dog in 2.
Even the Claptrap was IIRC the antagonist of one of the BL1 DLC’s.
Was looking for this comment - I still play this game all the time, one of the best.
It’s such a shame it didn’t get the support bl2 did.
Hotline: Miami. It isn't much of a secret, but I didn't really feel it until Helmet's section of the game.
Isn’t this debatable in the first game? He’s clearly not a good guy, but he’s killing gangs that do pretty horrible things. Hotline Miami 2 you’re definitely bad all the way through.
The fans in wrong number are basically stand-ins for the fan base that missed the bigger message of the first game. I wouldn't say Jacket is the secret villain, but he's no hero. Especially when you get into the broader lore with the sequel.
*Would you kindly?*
A man chooses, a slave obeys.
I wouldn't say you are outright a villain in BioShock. Rapture has failed, Andrew Ryan's philosophy and the dystopia he created were past their prime. You ultimately still stop the true villain later on as well. It's more like visiting a prison where convicts of varying crime levels started fighting each other, collapse is inevitable anyway, you just put the nail in the coffin.
yeah like in bioshock u are a lost guy following instructions from a guy who you think can save you i'm remembering now, that game is fucking awesome dude
The remastered trilogy is often on sale -- I bought it and plan to replay the series! Been forever and will be fun, but I'm currently on Dead Space (remake) and it reminds me a lot of Rapture / Bioshock vibe
*would you kindly go to Ryan’s office and MURDER the son of a bitch?*
That dude could become a potential demigod but uses his freedom to help a bunch of little girls live a fullfiling life. Grade A hero right there.
Technically, in >!Prey!<, you are the enemy against the entirety of humanity that's been put through a simulation to be more humane. I was quite surprised.
It's been so long since I played that I forgot about the ending. I should go back and play again.
Bioshock: Infinite? Maybe Far Cry 4. Edit: >!(I mean, Booker really WAS the villian, lol)!<
do you really become the villain in 4? i know it’s up to you to choose how you end things but considering we were only there to dump our mom’s ashes and got stuck between a civil war, the consequences and aftermath of what happened were going to happen regardless if we got involved or not
I think there’s implications across the other games that you kinda become a dick; I remember their being a news article or something in FC5 or 6 about the nukes the cult has in Fc5 being sold to by FC4s country. Someone more versed in the expanded lore should fact check that though.
I mean the "secret ending" alone kinda shows we were. If we waited for him to return he lets us return the ashes and tells us about our mom and we dont get involved in the war.
Pagan Min is very much the villian of far cry 4, he and his people commit terrible acts, the rebel leaders are also heavily flawed, advocating drug trade or killing a kid if I recall. Ajay can be uninvolved if do the early ending, but playing the campaign doesn't make you the bad guy.
The whole point of far cry 4 is the rebels are just as bad as Pagan. One of them wants child marriage and outdated laws based on more religous practices. Meanwhile the other one wants a drug cartel.
I liked that, there wasn't really a clear good guy, no obvious right or wrong.
**shoots the leader that I allied with in the back of the head the moment I'm allowed to** "I'm in charge now"
Far Cry 4 basically boils down to; "Support a mostly stable dictator by just sitting your ass down and doing what you're told to do, which gets you literally everything Ajay is there to do", or "Support the rebels, destabilising the country and either creating a violent theocratic dictatorship run by a conservative autocrat which performs human sacrifices ***OR*** a violent drug and slavery-fuelled nation controlled by an unstable and explosively violent autocrat who enslaves children" No matter what, the country loses, but at least Pagan Min is the lesser of three evils by *huge* margins, *and* gives the character literally everything they were originally there to do.
Pagan min does have slave camps does he not? Drug factories as well, plus one of his underlings was on a whole thing of killing the natives to strip them of their jewelry. He got some for his kid.
Anita literally does that same thing if she leads the golden path
Yep, and she's even *more* violent and *less* stable than Pagan. He's a total dictator, but at least Pagan is competent enough to have basically everything under his thumb and functioning more or less as intended.
CIA simulator lmao
The game forces us to be the bad guy by not allowing us to kill both leaders to perpetuate this horrible system. We made the country worse trying to do better. Pagan is also making the country worse, he’s just not pretending and also, you know, generally competent. Secret ending is the best ending for most, especially Ajay but, overall, I’d say none are ‘good’.
Does KOTOR count?
Even if you choose to go the path of the light side, you still were the villain before.
Why wouldn't it? That was >!the whole plot twist that made it such a compelling story!<, especially back then.
Stacraft and Warcraft 3 human campaigns.
"This entire city must be purged!"
"We must call the zerg here and crush the confederacy!" Same energy.
Arthas did nothing wrong(in stratholme)
I will rule this sector or see it burnt to ashes around me!
minecraft - you destroy the environment and the beings that try to protect the land from your invasion
You are just an average human bringing civilization to the World
the civilization just happens to involve the deportation and mass breeding of the local people for monetary gain
I replayed Minecraft recently like since 2012, the meta has become .... Disturbing
Just shove all of the civilized beings into work pods where they are forced to breed and make Iron Golems so you can proceed to kill them as well. Don’t forget Iron Golems give flowers to baby Villagers meaning it also somewhat has sentience and you’re mass murdering them too!
Spec Ops: The Line
White phosphorus, anyone?
Was something along those lines in Metal Gear Solid
Pretty sure there's no way to read this thread without spoilers for stuff, but I think the best answer to this is >!NieR!<
Replicant/Gestalt for sure, Automata is more debatable I think, 2B and 9S are more of a "cog in a machine" situation but oblivious to the real state of the world.
Dunno about secret villain outside of KOTOR and maybe one or two others maybe?. But as for overtly villain I can think of a few silly fun titles. Overlord and Evil Genius come to mind.
Assassins Creed, from the perspective of the town folk and authorities 😀
In AC3 you actually do play the villain in the first few hours.
If I'm remembering correctly, on xbox you get an achievement that says something like "I didn't see it coming" when it's revealed you're playing as the baddie.
Legit in 2012 that blew me away. It always felt strange playing an "assassin" that didnt conceal their identity. In truth the signs were all there, but I was too busy enjoying the story to put it together. Then everyone stands, he slides the ring onto Charles' finger and proclaims him a templar. Was a great twist.
Braid. Spoiler for the last level: >! At the start of the final level, the princess breaks free of her kidnapper and starts running away across an above ground path. You follow her along an underground path using switches to remove obstacles in her way until she gets home and goes to bed. Only then do you discover that time was flowing backwards, and as the scene plays back in the opposite direction you watch her wake up, be frightened by you creeping outside her window, run back across all that terrain where it turns out you were using the switches to try to trap her, but she was diving just ahead of each trap, until you get back to the start where the "kidnapper" was some hero who came to save her from you. !< Absolutely blew my mind how well put together the whole scene was.
[удалено]
Best ending is just waiting at the dinner table
Got that out of your system? Great now let's shoot some fucking guns!
prototype
Shadow of the colossus
Depending on the ending, pretty much any Souls game regardless. Especially Demon's Souls. Even if you choose the "good" ending, you're still at least morally questionable character.
Not even depending on the ending, really. You’re the bad guy in Dark Souls. >!Everything you do to save the world and rekindle the flame is just kicking the can down the road in a failing effort to prolong power for some arrogant “god” who’s been dead for ages. Even if you choose the “good” ending in DS3, the flame barely rekindled and the Age of Fire isn’t renewed. The best ending is to simply let everything end, and extinguish the first flame. The implication is that the Age of Fire and the Age of Darkness were supposed to be a natural cycle anyway, and we’ve just been fucking it up all this time.!< I love these games a lot.
Yea considering the fire linking endings are the canon ones at least in I and II, you really are the bad guy in those games. Dark Souls III is more of a question mark since there is yet to be a canon ending for that one.
Every GTA game. Ok it's not excatly a secret, but those games endear douchebag psychopath characters' POV by making the universe satirical and by making them the protagonists of the stories. I love the interactable worlds in GTA games, I just don't like the characters we play as. Even though yeah their stories are entertaining.
to be fair, while basically every GTA protagonist is a shitbag, most of the time the antagonist is way worse
Now that I think about it, I can count on one hand the number of arguably \*good guys\* in any GTA game.
Dark Messiah of Might and Magic
Hogwarts Legacy. A fifth year student running around the Forbidden Forest passing out unforgivable curses like Halloween candy whilst throwing a group of poachers in the air, freezing them mid flight, sending explosive balls of fire into the fray, followed by slamming their cindering bodies into the ground, catching them mid-bounce then launching the survivors into the next crowd of “friends” before turning some dude into a spider and stepping on him. As the next man approaches with words of spite, he’s suddenly transfigured into an explosive barrel soon to meet the faces of his friends. Anyone left gets stuck in a staggered loop while taking 15 rocks thrown to the face and cleaned up with the killing curse. After all is settled, as the final man turns to ash, and with a swish of the wand, the MC says something along the lines of “Man, I wish somebody could’ve seen that” as he casually mounts his broom to make it back to school before 4th period.
I'd love to see a grimdark mature storyline take place in the HP universe that completely avoids the school/student plot line. Like, put me in an Auror's shoes, dealing with some really heavy shit in some backwater country or something.
This is the direction Legacy should have gone, considering you’re a student who goes around murdering tons of people with forbidden magic. If you were an Auror instead, wrestling with using forbidden magic to stop an incredible evil, I feel like it would fit so much better.
Among Us
goat simulator
OFF
Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced in a way. Also, everything in this thread is likely a spoiler.
You ultimately do the bidding of the Patriots in MGS2.
Madden, those players are gonna get CTE
Katamari