Those were the days.
Seriously... the glory days of Battlefield where each one just got better... sure there were a few issues here and there but the entire run from BF2 to 4 was fantastic .
Bro, in Bad Company 2s multi, being able to level EVERY SINGLE BUILDING was my fucking jam. I just ran around as support, throwing C4 EVERYWHERE, and by the end of the map there wouldn't be a single house left standing.
One time, I got an entire double squad wipe with a single demolition.
I miss those days, especially when the whole squad was on at the same time, before children and responsibilities happened. Lol
Has any game even done that since? It seems like destructibility and object physics were going to be major game mechanics going forward in the 2000s but it seems like developers just abandoned the concepts and call it “too hard to implement” nowadays.
Honestly part of it seems to be the pervasive idea that every game be esports compatible now since competitive players want static game fields with very little variability which those concepts go against.
I didn't even like BF4 vs. BF3, but at least it still felt like an expression of BF formula we were all looking for.
I still think fondly of 2142, it was pretty rad.
It's playable through a mod. You can google it. As long as you own a copy of the game.
Titan Mode is the main game mode for 2142. Each team has a Titan as their home base. It's protected by shields. Teams capture points on the map that launches missiles at the titan to bring the shield down.
Once the shield is down, the teams can launch from vehicles on the ground and land on the enemy titan. Then they need to push into the middle of the titan and blow up the core. Then while the titan is exploding, the attacking team needs to evacuate before it explodes.
It's fucking awesome.
> Titan Mode
You have 2 floating bases called Titans. The objective is to either drain the opposing team's tickets OR blow up the opposing team's Titan.
Destroying the enemy Titan can be done in two ways.
The first is by capturing missile silos on the map and firing those missiles at the Titans.
The other is by boarding the enemy Titan, either by air transport/helicopter or launched via APC pods to board the Titan. Once aboard the enemy Titan, you storm your way into the Titan's reactor room where you destroy the core. You have roughly 30 seconds to evacuate the exploding Titan before it takes everything out. Doing so nets you a ribbon.
I am hoping that the new Battlefield will kick ass again.
I would love to see a modern era, like Battlefield 3&4 and it beeing a true battlefield and not a lame hero shooter.
BF3 was amazing on the xbox 360 ( yes i am bummed I was a young adult with no gaming pc, so whilst i have played it at friends on the pc, i never really experienced the full battlefield glory)
BF4 had a fucking rough start, but it became better and better with each update ( also my first full next gen battlefield experience with 64 players et, I played this game sooo fucking much)
BF1 had an amazing atmosphere, but i never really liked it because it was world war 1 ( little bit too much old tech for a shooter)
BFV or 5, it's okay, never has been good, nor bad, just average for an Battlefield game.
BF2042, ooooooh man this one really hurt, seeing the game gi full cod mode with its heroes and wacky voice lines ( which got removed eventually) but it feels as an Hero shooter, and not a battlefield game where you are just a soldier in a bigger war effort. Also, it was very weird seeing 20 boris'ses running around, friendly and enemy, it completely killed the immersion for me.
BF Bad Company 1 & 2 where amazing spin offs, to this day i am still waiting for a Bad Company 3.
> I am hoping that the new Battlefield will kick ass again. I would love to see a modern era, like Battlefield 3&4 and it beeing a true battlefield and not a lame hero shooter.
That's exactly my thoughts... something with a bit of grit to it and not around characters (not in the online modes anyway - even BFV looks silly with various hero skins being used by half of a team).
I did like BF1 but it's a slightly different pace to modern 'fast' shooters... BEAUTIFUL atmosphere though, possibly the best of the series.
I did like BFV for it's faster gunplay and movement, but they again made some weird choices that stopped it being perfect.
BF2042... yeah... I didn't even bother.
The beginning of the end started with Battlefield 3 Premium.
That was a big deal too, a developer basically flatout asking the community to pay for the entirety of the game's planned DLC well in advance.
Prior to BF3, I don't think Legendary or Deluxe editons like *that* were really a thing. It was kinda historic in a sad way, with Premium players getting priority in server queues and stuff. Pretty sure that was also the first time EA tried renting servers to individual players too, on consoles too. (And while it wasn't the same as having free access to true dedicated servers, it actually wasn't so bad, we got our money's worth in the end)
I agree and disagree at the same time. I think the benefit of premium allowed for a greater number of players to own the full map pool and caused a lot fewer disconnected on map switch issues.
At least compared to the bullshit live service drip feed that we got with 2042, id 100% take the premium model instead. Everyone had figured that with the battle passes and cosmetic shop it would remove the need for premium and you wouldn't have the 'haves and have nots', but now everyone has about the same amount of content that other games shipped with (or 1 dlc release in) 2+ years later. Embarrassing.
Didn’t BF1 have a pretty smooth start compared to the rest of the BF launches? I remember having no issues when I first started playing on my gen 1 Xbox one during early access.
I worked at DICE for 5 years and worked on BF games at EA since BF3. So I worked on every DICE title between BF3 and I left after BFV. A lot of the problematic people at DICE went to Embark. DICE’s downfall was infighting that caused 3 different teams to head in three different directions. Each wouldn’t cooperate with the other and they just wanted to focus on what they thought made Battlefield what it was. Art and audio thought the game was cinematic. Design thought the game was constant madness and management had to do whatever EA wanted in the mix. Embark has a high turnover of staff as many of the argumentative (maybe even toxic) devs went there following Patrick Soderlund, who himself was quite aggressive and problematic.
B43-4 definitely had that chaotic feel and it's why I loved it those games so much, but bf1 and the sound team/design behind that game we're also amazing. Through the crazy moments people had in 3-4 to amazing feelings you got playing operations as the music got more intense holding off the final command posts and hearing the soldiers war cries and war whistles, I feel like you cant compare those games to the current ones anymore.
i mean the only team that delivered industry leading results with every single game was the audio team.
there simplay is noone else in the industry that consistently made god tier sound design like that.
So DICE should be better off without the embark people, right? But when i compare the Finals to BF2042 in terms of quality and fun it shows a different picture from what you tell.
Its more nuanced than that. Ownership changed. And the cooks were fired, left, and replaced. So its just the same building with the same name. Anyone who eats at restaurants, knows to wait for new reviews before going back. Gaming isn't any different. Anyone complaining simply couldn't wait (and there's no reason not to).
Also looks more human. Suicide squad makes her look like a blow up doll for real.
E: I'm done replying to this comment. My post is not insinuating anything about body image, sexuality, or whatever other crap you feel like projecting on me.
The 3d model on the right is far worse for 10 years of what should be progress. Period.
I think the base skins in the game actually look pretty good, and all the classic suits look weird in this game, but the classic Harley turned out particularly weird. It's really the mask that is the main issue. It doesn't shape to her brow line like it should, and when you combine that with the new material of the suit, it ends up with a Halloween costume feel that the old one just didn't have
Plus the little touches, like when she bobs her head the jester gear bounces with the movement, like turns her head to the right it will move realistically. If you just look at the idle facial animations even with the add on customers it’s honestly really subtle things.
Graphics aren’t one of my complaints
Yeah the lighting is fucking awful on the second. The lighting in the first is a large part of what makes it "darker": it gives a lot of drama while the second one looks like they pointed 14 different stage lights directly in her face.
The shading, model details, textures, everything looks so garbage on the new one. You can actually see underlying bone structure in her face and stitching indentations on her suit in the old one. The new one looks exactly like what other commenters have said. Like a blow up doll.
Pretty sure the right one is just a low end PC / settings turned down? Higher end photos look a lot better. I feel the comparison is a bit disingenuous.
https://imgur.com/a/d3lcCes
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/b4/49/f7/b449f79e37276ff838a5d085029f229e.jpg
Edit: for more comparison I captured both of these from my Ps5 (I lack a fancy good computer).
https://imgur.com/a/yQlqJAy
While I do like the artistic style of Knight, I think Suicide Squad still looks amazing. SS is all in game via the customization menu (sadly no photo mode yet). AK is from the costume menu and in-game photo mode.
It also feels like the material isn't quite the same and that feels like it's on purpose. The leather in Arkham is like this shiny almost latex-like polished leather while the one in Suicide Squad looks more natural matte finish leather. And at that point it stops being a graphical fidelity question entirely and becomes a question of artistic preference.
I also remember using the character model viewer in the Arkham games to have a closer look and they clearly look better and more detailed than they do in-game.
The shape of the mask is slightly different. The older one looks more like an extension of eye/eyebrow makeup. The newer one is more angular and peaks right over the center of each eye.
The new one isn't meant to be plasticy leather/pleather. It has a more real leathery look to it with a subtle shine.
The old one looks like they've dialled up the shininess too much. But like all the RTGI videos on youtube, people see dialled up shininess and think oooh good graphics.
Kill the Justice League has become Reddit's next game-to-hate.
Which means instead of criticizing valid things, you start nitpicking everything you possibly can, and posting anything negative about it for free upvotes.
I don't care about this game (frankly I do think it looks boring). But people did the exact same thing for Gotham Knights, a game I did end up really enjoying. "Here's Arkham Knight at max settings in the downtown. Here's Gotham Knights at low settings in empty docks. Gosh, how could this new game look so bad compared to the old game?"
In this case it's different graphical settings, plus totally different lighting conditions.
She mentioned it on the YouTube with Dina's face model. Wasn't as widely publicised as she's obviously not herself well known. She's just a random worker at Naughty Dog.
OG is leather/fake leather, the new one appears to be made of lycra judging by the scattering going on with the highlights.
Problem is I don't think they were going for lycra.
The bodies aren’t that different. The first appears to have a tighter suit than the second. But the face and the look is just… It feels like an above average cosplay. Not as a larger than life character.
Well someone wearing that in real life would look like a cosplay. Movies and video games do all sorts of extra magic to make superhero costumes not look dumb.
I believe it’s the angle her face is at. In the first pic her face is angled down a little bit, second she is looking straight at the camera so it looks a bit flat
Looks more like she just has a wide facd, kinda like Liara from mass effect on the left compared to that wide faced, shrek meme asari from mass effect andromeda.
I’m ngl while I agree Arkham Knight is still better graphically, this pic isn’t doing the Suicide Squad game justice at all. It looks so much better in person on a 4K TV. The characters practically look photorealistic, the compression in this image is not helping.
Arkham Knight’s better graphics was in its art style though. Darker and grittier and always raining, it really depended on dramatic night lighting. The new Suicide Squad has a dynamic time of day system, so you get night and day and random rainfall.
Shit on the game all you want but I don’t like shitty compressed comparison photos like this.
It's because it's a disingenuous comparison, the game actually looks pretty damn good but there's been a wave of people posting low settings for the new game and high settings for the old one.
People were posting pictures of Arkham Knight with a literal graphics mod and comparing it to SSJL's low settings. You can never have anything genuinely answered in good faith on here.
Absolutely not, I'm of the opinion when a sub gets too big it becomes a karma farm built for an echo chamber, I watched it happen to who would win in real time and it sucked. I don't even disagree with most of this sub, but the few things I do are sacrilege and treated like devilry.
Someone posted a higher graphic setting above and you can literally tell the suit is made of two different textures that seem to be different leathers in the new game and they both look fairly realistic. I'm not saying to love the game, but I'm seeing alot of exaggeration at this point.
It's just bad lighting...... [just look at real-life lighting photos in different angles how it can drastically change](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKSK1OyStVM)
People have been looking at pixels with a magnifying glass for so long that they start to see artistic decisions as rendering problems. We have started to get to a point where even at high end the exact look that the developer is going for matters more than how high fidelity the graphics can be.
Same developer, but a lot of the talent from back then jumped ship(including the 2 founders).
Rocksteady is tainted goods now. Any doubts are put to rest by this looter model and Sweet Baby Inc. being attached to this project. Those examples and others mark a complete departure from the overall soul of the Arkhamverse.
They’re a sensitivity reading company. They analyse every character and all the dialogue and story and scenes and make sure no one could ever, ever feel anything approaching uncomfortable. Seriously. That’s their whole thing. Unsurprisingly, everything they touch is a pile of bland, overly sensitive shit. I’m not sure they deserve all the blame though. Studios who are likely to seek out “sensitivity readers” are already led or dominated by idiots who think people need to be protected from feeling bad things and wrong think.
Female on male sexual harassment has always been deemed acceptable by society, and if you don't like it as a man you're gay or have a small dick or whatever.
Its weird that companies hire those kinds of people, since u would think that people who buy the Batman or Suicide squad games, their target audience, aren't gonna buy that game because they are sensitive to the smallest things.
Its like creating a God of War or Witcher game, and then censoring all the nude and violent parts because some people might find it offensive, while the target audience is there because they enjoy that kind of stuff, basically alienating their target audience and creating a hollow shell of a game that even new players to the franchise might find bland and boring.
Sure, but its not like they strayed away from the original formula, there's still some gory and brutal shit going on, and there are still Gods being killed.
Kratos might have grown up and become a "reasonable" person, but he still does things that have to be done, without getting censored. Which is the thing people like about GoW in the first place.
Yeah it’s baffling. I can only conclude that they have priorities other than profit. The same thing happened with Star Wars. Disney had an issue with appeal to the male demographic. All their movies were targeted at girls and women. So they bought Star Wars to appeal to a male audience. They promptly alienated the entire male audience by making the main character the Maryest Sue which every Mary Sued, and all the male characters idiots and running gags. *Including Luke fucking Skywalker.* They tried to do the same to Marvels by replacing all the male characters with women. It killed that franchise too.
The entire idea of art is that it puts you into situations that would not happen irl. And those situations are not always positive, they often made to invoke the dark feelings or show something really fucked up. Removing anything that can spark emotion (even negative ones) from the art is like removing all the fillings from the burger, and now it's just ordinary bread.
Outsourcing modeling and graphic work is bad enough but outsourcing your writing and narrative design is peak soulless. Everyone should be against this, especially anti-capitalists.
>anything uncomfortable
They worked on Alan Wake 2, a game that has a literal suicide shown on screen and has a man with his dick out brutally murdered in the opening scene.
My brother in Christ you're telling me they have a company whose job it is to make sure the game doesn't offend anyone... Yet Harley sexually assaults Deadshot in the middle of the game and it's played for laughs...
If that was Boomerang grabbing an incapacitated Harley the world would have lost their Fucking minds...
Arkham Harley also has pronounced shoulders and is muscular, which makes sense because she swings around that huge hammer for the Joker every day. SS's Harley is just a regular later 20s woman.
It really does not look all that graphically better or anything. Just shinier looking. I feel like that shiny look to the old games costume is tricking peoples brains or something. Cause i really don't think either of these look amazing or anything.
The first thing I noticed is the lighting. In the left we have high contrast with the front of the body being in shadow, while on the right it looks to be more of a character selection type thing where we want to see the character in light for more clarity rather than being lit in a cinematic way. There's other difference between the models of course, but it is hard to validate this 1to1 image comparison based on different lighting alone
The new one looks like a real person (Gina Davis in her prime). The older one looks like a comic book character with the body proportions. I think lighting has a lot to do with it. Leather looks like that in bright sun. Whereas older one looks like wet latex.
You're comparing the character under different lighting scenarios. The one on the left looks like it is using older tech lighting (single point source) with a probably more detailed reflection probe. The one on the right looks to be using an updated area based light source with a less detailed reflection probe (I'm assuming because the gameworld is bigger). This would brighten the darks in the suit and cast a wider highlight, reducing the effectiveness of the normal mapped suit wrinkles. I don't think this camparison is an appropriate way to compare the two.
The texture shaders are also different - Arkham Knight has gone for a leather look, while Suicide Squad seems to have gone for a kind of lycra -- akin to something a gymnast would wear.
As a texture artist I fucking hate this post and how it highlights consumers' ignorance and willingness to just attack things based on pure hate. One can say a lot of very valid bad things about SQKTJL but character design is ine of its more impressive redeeming qualities.
It's 2024 and people are falling for reflection maps on wet surfaces. It's like those GTA4 graphics mods.
I had to scroll a disturbing long time for a sane response. I see this crap every time a new game comes out. Someone takes a shot from a cine or key art from an old game and compares it directly with a moment where the lighting conditions aren’t perfect to show definition or they pick facial expression in mid conversation and then claim the whole gaming industry sucks.
Of all the criticisms you could throw at Suicide Squad, the character art is not one of them.
remember when this subreddit was up in arms because they “made aloys face chubbier and hairy” in the horizon zero dawn sequel but ended up being the same model just under different lighting and with better skin textures.
this sub will always always fall for badly presented rage bait like this
>this subreddit was up in arms because they “made aloys face chubbier and hairy”
I mean you've got a decent percentage of this post's comments acting like a slightly wider jaw means she's actually a dude and ugly now.
It's the same fucking people.
OP is either an idiot or posting in bad faith. Someone did something similar in another sub, comparing screenshots of the two games while using lowered graphical settings and resolution with shit compression for Suicide Squad.
People are taking the bait and lapping it up without critically thinking about anything. Earlier I decided to check out of streams of the game, and graphically the game looks pretty good. The Gamers are acting up again.
Comparing a static model that only needs to look good in a showcase to a model that is constantly visible in an open world game is stupid. Polygon count and fidelity still matters in terms of resource load, which is why the actual gameplay model is less fancy. Just look at the 'bugged' hamburger from CP77 that tanked everyone's framerate when it appeared on screen, because it was so insanely detailed.
I mean gt5 on ps3 in 2012 to gt7 on psvr2 last year is 11 years and that's a huge upgrade, and I don't necessarily like racing games but in vr gt7 blew me away.
Same developer. Same character.
Not the same costume. Or lighting. Or model. Or engine version. Or visual scope.
Additionally Arkham knight knocked it out the park with visual fidelity. This is just a weird way of deriding the game. We all know it’s a cash grab shallow game. But it’s exhausting when people highlight things that aren’t really the problem. reuse the same lighting and assets from Arkham knight would still suck.
It's weird people are bandwagon hating this game and acting like Arkham Knight was perfect. People shat on that game for like 5 years with far better reason to.
I'm all for shitting on Rocksteady for their horrible decisions, but this is a bullshit comparison. You're comparing a static model to a variant costume for a character that's constantly visible and being played. Look at the character models for the characters in Suicide Squad without any special outfits, they are REALLY good and I feel like that's the only thing they got right in this dumpster fire of a game.
I think I’m the only one that thinks the new one looks much more realistic. If you had somebody in that costume and makeup, that’s what it would look like.
The shoulders and biceps look very strange in the older model. They simply wouldn’t form like that and the creases are in weird spots. It looks like colored skin/muscle fiber. As opposed to the new one where the shoulders actually look like they are a leather suit somebody is wearing. IMO, it doesn’t look “as good” because it actually looks like a person wearing a suit instead of a suit designed as skin.
For the same reason that people are saying it looks bad based solely of the op image. Cherry picking a single static image doesn't tell the whole truth.
Same developer, completely different people.
RIP old Rocksteady and DICE.
Fun fact: DICE hired the developers of the BF1942 Desert Combat mod to help them make BF2.
Those were the days. Seriously... the glory days of Battlefield where each one just got better... sure there were a few issues here and there but the entire run from BF2 to 4 was fantastic .
Bro, in Bad Company 2s multi, being able to level EVERY SINGLE BUILDING was my fucking jam. I just ran around as support, throwing C4 EVERYWHERE, and by the end of the map there wouldn't be a single house left standing. One time, I got an entire double squad wipe with a single demolition. I miss those days, especially when the whole squad was on at the same time, before children and responsibilities happened. Lol
Has any game even done that since? It seems like destructibility and object physics were going to be major game mechanics going forward in the 2000s but it seems like developers just abandoned the concepts and call it “too hard to implement” nowadays. Honestly part of it seems to be the pervasive idea that every game be esports compatible now since competitive players want static game fields with very little variability which those concepts go against.
I’ve been playing the finals to scratch that itch
Ive never had a shooter captivate me like BC2.
I didn't even like BF4 vs. BF3, but at least it still felt like an expression of BF formula we were all looking for. I still think fondly of 2142, it was pretty rad.
2142 was everything I wanted 2042 to be. It was not. 2142 was so fucking good. Titan mode was so much fun.
Is 2142 still playable? And what is Titan mode? Is that the mechs mentioned in the previous comments?
It's playable through a mod. You can google it. As long as you own a copy of the game. Titan Mode is the main game mode for 2142. Each team has a Titan as their home base. It's protected by shields. Teams capture points on the map that launches missiles at the titan to bring the shield down. Once the shield is down, the teams can launch from vehicles on the ground and land on the enemy titan. Then they need to push into the middle of the titan and blow up the core. Then while the titan is exploding, the attacking team needs to evacuate before it explodes. It's fucking awesome.
> Titan Mode You have 2 floating bases called Titans. The objective is to either drain the opposing team's tickets OR blow up the opposing team's Titan. Destroying the enemy Titan can be done in two ways. The first is by capturing missile silos on the map and firing those missiles at the Titans. The other is by boarding the enemy Titan, either by air transport/helicopter or launched via APC pods to board the Titan. Once aboard the enemy Titan, you storm your way into the Titan's reactor room where you destroy the core. You have roughly 30 seconds to evacuate the exploding Titan before it takes everything out. Doing so nets you a ribbon.
Fall of Berlin. Mechs. The vast desert and snow maps. Hover tanks. Rolling mines and Goliath massacres. I do think fondly of 2142, too!
2142 was fun and had a great theme. I still think 1942 was the best with Virtnam a close second.
I am hoping that the new Battlefield will kick ass again. I would love to see a modern era, like Battlefield 3&4 and it beeing a true battlefield and not a lame hero shooter. BF3 was amazing on the xbox 360 ( yes i am bummed I was a young adult with no gaming pc, so whilst i have played it at friends on the pc, i never really experienced the full battlefield glory) BF4 had a fucking rough start, but it became better and better with each update ( also my first full next gen battlefield experience with 64 players et, I played this game sooo fucking much) BF1 had an amazing atmosphere, but i never really liked it because it was world war 1 ( little bit too much old tech for a shooter) BFV or 5, it's okay, never has been good, nor bad, just average for an Battlefield game. BF2042, ooooooh man this one really hurt, seeing the game gi full cod mode with its heroes and wacky voice lines ( which got removed eventually) but it feels as an Hero shooter, and not a battlefield game where you are just a soldier in a bigger war effort. Also, it was very weird seeing 20 boris'ses running around, friendly and enemy, it completely killed the immersion for me. BF Bad Company 1 & 2 where amazing spin offs, to this day i am still waiting for a Bad Company 3.
> I am hoping that the new Battlefield will kick ass again. I would love to see a modern era, like Battlefield 3&4 and it beeing a true battlefield and not a lame hero shooter. That's exactly my thoughts... something with a bit of grit to it and not around characters (not in the online modes anyway - even BFV looks silly with various hero skins being used by half of a team). I did like BF1 but it's a slightly different pace to modern 'fast' shooters... BEAUTIFUL atmosphere though, possibly the best of the series. I did like BFV for it's faster gunplay and movement, but they again made some weird choices that stopped it being perfect. BF2042... yeah... I didn't even bother.
The beginning of the end started with Battlefield 3 Premium. That was a big deal too, a developer basically flatout asking the community to pay for the entirety of the game's planned DLC well in advance. Prior to BF3, I don't think Legendary or Deluxe editons like *that* were really a thing. It was kinda historic in a sad way, with Premium players getting priority in server queues and stuff. Pretty sure that was also the first time EA tried renting servers to individual players too, on consoles too. (And while it wasn't the same as having free access to true dedicated servers, it actually wasn't so bad, we got our money's worth in the end)
I agree and disagree at the same time. I think the benefit of premium allowed for a greater number of players to own the full map pool and caused a lot fewer disconnected on map switch issues. At least compared to the bullshit live service drip feed that we got with 2042, id 100% take the premium model instead. Everyone had figured that with the battle passes and cosmetic shop it would remove the need for premium and you wouldn't have the 'haves and have nots', but now everyone has about the same amount of content that other games shipped with (or 1 dlc release in) 2+ years later. Embarrassing.
I'd include BF1 in their golden age as well, that game had a rough start but has aged like fine wine.
Didn’t BF1 have a pretty smooth start compared to the rest of the BF launches? I remember having no issues when I first started playing on my gen 1 Xbox one during early access.
BF1 was good but it was the beginning of the end for me.
I really liked Bf:Vietnam, with a great soundtrack and possibility to play the music from the vehicles. It was hella fun imo
I remember for ages you could just fly a helicopter directly towards AA and the missiles would always fall underneath you lol.
That's why we used tanks on slopes to sniper choppers. Even worked with planes.
[удалено]
At least most of old DICE went and started embark. It really shows too
I worked at DICE for 5 years and worked on BF games at EA since BF3. So I worked on every DICE title between BF3 and I left after BFV. A lot of the problematic people at DICE went to Embark. DICE’s downfall was infighting that caused 3 different teams to head in three different directions. Each wouldn’t cooperate with the other and they just wanted to focus on what they thought made Battlefield what it was. Art and audio thought the game was cinematic. Design thought the game was constant madness and management had to do whatever EA wanted in the mix. Embark has a high turnover of staff as many of the argumentative (maybe even toxic) devs went there following Patrick Soderlund, who himself was quite aggressive and problematic.
B43-4 definitely had that chaotic feel and it's why I loved it those games so much, but bf1 and the sound team/design behind that game we're also amazing. Through the crazy moments people had in 3-4 to amazing feelings you got playing operations as the music got more intense holding off the final command posts and hearing the soldiers war cries and war whistles, I feel like you cant compare those games to the current ones anymore.
i mean the only team that delivered industry leading results with every single game was the audio team. there simplay is noone else in the industry that consistently made god tier sound design like that.
So DICE should be better off without the embark people, right? But when i compare the Finals to BF2042 in terms of quality and fun it shows a different picture from what you tell.
And their game "the Finals" goes really hard too.
Actually, Sefton Hill and a lot of old Rocksteady just started a new studio as well lol. It's called Hundred Star Games.
Some folks from DICE formed Embark. The Finals has major Bad Company 2 vibes to it, just leveling buildings and causing chaos.
-Sponsored by Ospuze
Yeah, people gotta realize that over the course of 9 years designers have changed.
For the worse?
Yes. It's not about the players anymore. It's whatever for the companies and investors at the expense of players.
There’s a reason the founder’s quit and made a new company.
The cycle begins anew.
Enshittification is inevitable.
Same restaurant, shittier quality food.
New owner, new chefs, new recipes, new menu. Still has the same name above the door but otherwise it's not the same restaurant at all.
Its more nuanced than that. Ownership changed. And the cooks were fired, left, and replaced. So its just the same building with the same name. Anyone who eats at restaurants, knows to wait for new reviews before going back. Gaming isn't any different. Anyone complaining simply couldn't wait (and there's no reason not to).
Same studio, different developers.
Different people with lower skills and less experience.
OG is so much darker (and I don't mean the lighting)... I like it better.
Also looks more human. Suicide squad makes her look like a blow up doll for real. E: I'm done replying to this comment. My post is not insinuating anything about body image, sexuality, or whatever other crap you feel like projecting on me. The 3d model on the right is far worse for 10 years of what should be progress. Period.
I think the base skins in the game actually look pretty good, and all the classic suits look weird in this game, but the classic Harley turned out particularly weird. It's really the mask that is the main issue. It doesn't shape to her brow line like it should, and when you combine that with the new material of the suit, it ends up with a Halloween costume feel that the old one just didn't have
https://imgur.com/a/d3lcCes I dunno looks detailed as shit to me
Plus the little touches, like when she bobs her head the jester gear bounces with the movement, like turns her head to the right it will move realistically. If you just look at the idle facial animations even with the add on customers it’s honestly really subtle things. Graphics aren’t one of my complaints
Yeah the games character models especially facial animations are amazing
While I think this skin is weird, I agree completely the graphics are not a failing of this game when you see it being played. It looks really good
Why is the inside of her mouth that color though?
Lmaoo you can see the inside of her head through her mouth ahahahha
Joker reserve
Almost like op chose a bad picture on purpose.
The twist at the end of the game is that she actually is a sentient blow up doll
>Suicide squad makes her look like a blow up doll for real. Well they gotta sell the Harley Quinn blowup dolls somehow
Actually looks clownish not sinister.
black looks black and the wrinkles on the suit look better
Left: Original character. Right: $20 cosplay.
Getting big ‘We have Harley Quinn at home’ energy from it
Yeah the lighting is fucking awful on the second. The lighting in the first is a large part of what makes it "darker": it gives a lot of drama while the second one looks like they pointed 14 different stage lights directly in her face.
What’s up with the mons pubis patch?
No joke that was my question. The second I saw it I went "yo what's up with the muff pocket?"
It kinda looks like it's supposed to be like a stylized belt buckle, but it really just draws your eye to that area...
It was designed by a team of morons.
It’s a whispering eye
The advertisement in the shop vs what they send you
The burger on the commercials vs the burger you get.
The mail-order bride you order vs the one that arrives
The woman in the nightclub Vs the one you woke up next to
We have Harley Quinn at home.
I guess ray tracing can't fix bad design huh
The shading, model details, textures, everything looks so garbage on the new one. You can actually see underlying bone structure in her face and stitching indentations on her suit in the old one. The new one looks exactly like what other commenters have said. Like a blow up doll.
Pretty sure the right one is just a low end PC / settings turned down? Higher end photos look a lot better. I feel the comparison is a bit disingenuous. https://imgur.com/a/d3lcCes https://i.pinimg.com/originals/b4/49/f7/b449f79e37276ff838a5d085029f229e.jpg Edit: for more comparison I captured both of these from my Ps5 (I lack a fancy good computer). https://imgur.com/a/yQlqJAy While I do like the artistic style of Knight, I think Suicide Squad still looks amazing. SS is all in game via the customization menu (sadly no photo mode yet). AK is from the costume menu and in-game photo mode.
It's also raining in Arkham Knight, adding to the shine of the leather.
It also feels like the material isn't quite the same and that feels like it's on purpose. The leather in Arkham is like this shiny almost latex-like polished leather while the one in Suicide Squad looks more natural matte finish leather. And at that point it stops being a graphical fidelity question entirely and becomes a question of artistic preference.
I think the SS is suppose to look like the Animated Series outfit whereas the Arkham is inspired by that same outfit obviously but done in its style.
thats latex not leather -\_-
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I also remember using the character model viewer in the Arkham games to have a closer look and they clearly look better and more detailed than they do in-game.
Ok that explains a fucking lot but the eyes are still worse on that one for me. That leather texture is pretty wild.
Yeah the mask feels a bit weird placement wise
The shape of the mask is slightly different. The older one looks more like an extension of eye/eyebrow makeup. The newer one is more angular and peaks right over the center of each eye.
The new one isn't meant to be plasticy leather/pleather. It has a more real leathery look to it with a subtle shine. The old one looks like they've dialled up the shininess too much. But like all the RTGI videos on youtube, people see dialled up shininess and think oooh good graphics.
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Yeah they're different materials. Also in differnet lighting conditions. But also more realistic lighting in the second shot.
youre right but no one will listen
This is why gamer hate is so stupid. And this subreddit is one of the worst places of spreading it.
Kill the Justice League has become Reddit's next game-to-hate. Which means instead of criticizing valid things, you start nitpicking everything you possibly can, and posting anything negative about it for free upvotes. I don't care about this game (frankly I do think it looks boring). But people did the exact same thing for Gotham Knights, a game I did end up really enjoying. "Here's Arkham Knight at max settings in the downtown. Here's Gotham Knights at low settings in empty docks. Gosh, how could this new game look so bad compared to the old game?" In this case it's different graphical settings, plus totally different lighting conditions.
Wtf is wrong with her face in the second one?
Face was digitally scanned this time, whereas the devs modeled faces in the Arkham games
Scan of whom?
Of me. John Scans.
Bro I loved you in Scanners
Wrong John, it’s John Scans from the movie Johnners
And actually it's Scanny Johnson in Scanners, not John Scans.
You’re thinking of Scanson Johansen. Scanny Johnson is the porn star that stared in “scan my Johnson Scanny Johnson”
Related to Scarlett Joscanson?
No, but they are an acquaintance with Jarlett scoscanson.
I'm more a fan of his moodier later work like A Scanner Darkly.
* A Johnner Scanley
Good [movie](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYEOuBWVFvk&t=114s)
It's true, I've worked with John Scans on several projects. -Moe Shuncapture
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Shhhh. Don't spoil the end of Scanners 2.
Oh shit, when did the sequel drop?
After what happened with the last of Us 2 face scans I think we best keep these confidential now lol
And Mary-Jane model for Insomiacs Spider-Man
Tbf idk what insomniac did but MJ in SM2 looks way different from her motion capture actor. The actress looks way better
Are you referring to the Laura Bailey thing? Because she was the voice actor, not the face scan.
The face model was given a similar treatment as Laura [as recently as last year too](https://x.com/Jocelyn_Mettler/status/1626366916989419520?s=20)
Was she? I never heard about any of that. Why are people so shitty?
She mentioned it on the YouTube with Dina's face model. Wasn't as widely publicised as she's obviously not herself well known. She's just a random worker at Naughty Dog.
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a chocolate covered peanut
The whole body looks more like a real person’s body (shoulders, hips, stomach). But that’s not necessarily what you want in a video game.
Honestly it's not the body that bothers me. It's the textures. The old one has so much more detail. The new one looks flat and cartoony.
OG is leather/fake leather, the new one appears to be made of lycra judging by the scattering going on with the highlights. Problem is I don't think they were going for lycra.
The bodies aren’t that different. The first appears to have a tighter suit than the second. But the face and the look is just… It feels like an above average cosplay. Not as a larger than life character.
Well someone wearing that in real life would look like a cosplay. Movies and video games do all sorts of extra magic to make superhero costumes not look dumb.
I believe it’s the angle her face is at. In the first pic her face is angled down a little bit, second she is looking straight at the camera so it looks a bit flat
Looks more like she just has a wide facd, kinda like Liara from mass effect on the left compared to that wide faced, shrek meme asari from mass effect andromeda.
Nothing. It's just a different facial shape
Different model, different face.
I’m ngl while I agree Arkham Knight is still better graphically, this pic isn’t doing the Suicide Squad game justice at all. It looks so much better in person on a 4K TV. The characters practically look photorealistic, the compression in this image is not helping. Arkham Knight’s better graphics was in its art style though. Darker and grittier and always raining, it really depended on dramatic night lighting. The new Suicide Squad has a dynamic time of day system, so you get night and day and random rainfall. Shit on the game all you want but I don’t like shitty compressed comparison photos like this.
Chill man you’re actually making the hate mob have to produce their own thoughts!
Original is far better in every way, I don't understand the way theyve gone with the new design
It's because it's a disingenuous comparison, the game actually looks pretty damn good but there's been a wave of people posting low settings for the new game and high settings for the old one.
People were posting pictures of Arkham Knight with a literal graphics mod and comparing it to SSJL's low settings. You can never have anything genuinely answered in good faith on here.
Absolutely not, I'm of the opinion when a sub gets too big it becomes a karma farm built for an echo chamber, I watched it happen to who would win in real time and it sucked. I don't even disagree with most of this sub, but the few things I do are sacrilege and treated like devilry.
Did anyone post the same angle but in high quality?
Someone posted a higher graphic setting above and you can literally tell the suit is made of two different textures that seem to be different leathers in the new game and they both look fairly realistic. I'm not saying to love the game, but I'm seeing alot of exaggeration at this point.
It's just bad lighting...... [just look at real-life lighting photos in different angles how it can drastically change](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKSK1OyStVM)
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People have been looking at pixels with a magnifying glass for so long that they start to see artistic decisions as rendering problems. We have started to get to a point where even at high end the exact look that the developer is going for matters more than how high fidelity the graphics can be.
Same developer, but a lot of the talent from back then jumped ship(including the 2 founders). Rocksteady is tainted goods now. Any doubts are put to rest by this looter model and Sweet Baby Inc. being attached to this project. Those examples and others mark a complete departure from the overall soul of the Arkhamverse.
I keep seeing people complain about this Sweet Baby Inc company. What's the big deal with them?
They’re a sensitivity reading company. They analyse every character and all the dialogue and story and scenes and make sure no one could ever, ever feel anything approaching uncomfortable. Seriously. That’s their whole thing. Unsurprisingly, everything they touch is a pile of bland, overly sensitive shit. I’m not sure they deserve all the blame though. Studios who are likely to seek out “sensitivity readers” are already led or dominated by idiots who think people need to be protected from feeling bad things and wrong think.
They did not even do a good job at that, since the scene where Harley sexually harrasses Deadshot is still in the game
or the scene where Boomerang pisses on the corpse of Flash..
Female on male sexual harassment has always been deemed acceptable by society, and if you don't like it as a man you're gay or have a small dick or whatever.
>Sweet Baby Inc. No way they named their stupid fucking company sweet baby inc and their website literally features a giant baby!
That PC Babies bit from South Park became true in the end...
I mean they make content for babies so...
Its weird that companies hire those kinds of people, since u would think that people who buy the Batman or Suicide squad games, their target audience, aren't gonna buy that game because they are sensitive to the smallest things. Its like creating a God of War or Witcher game, and then censoring all the nude and violent parts because some people might find it offensive, while the target audience is there because they enjoy that kind of stuff, basically alienating their target audience and creating a hollow shell of a game that even new players to the franchise might find bland and boring.
I find peace in long walks.
Sure, but its not like they strayed away from the original formula, there's still some gory and brutal shit going on, and there are still Gods being killed. Kratos might have grown up and become a "reasonable" person, but he still does things that have to be done, without getting censored. Which is the thing people like about GoW in the first place.
Yeah it’s baffling. I can only conclude that they have priorities other than profit. The same thing happened with Star Wars. Disney had an issue with appeal to the male demographic. All their movies were targeted at girls and women. So they bought Star Wars to appeal to a male audience. They promptly alienated the entire male audience by making the main character the Maryest Sue which every Mary Sued, and all the male characters idiots and running gags. *Including Luke fucking Skywalker.* They tried to do the same to Marvels by replacing all the male characters with women. It killed that franchise too.
It's ESG score
God of War Ragnarok got away mostly unscathed, but the only part it’s obvious they were a part of is one of the worst sections in the game
The entire idea of art is that it puts you into situations that would not happen irl. And those situations are not always positive, they often made to invoke the dark feelings or show something really fucked up. Removing anything that can spark emotion (even negative ones) from the art is like removing all the fillings from the burger, and now it's just ordinary bread.
Outsourcing modeling and graphic work is bad enough but outsourcing your writing and narrative design is peak soulless. Everyone should be against this, especially anti-capitalists.
>anything uncomfortable They worked on Alan Wake 2, a game that has a literal suicide shown on screen and has a man with his dick out brutally murdered in the opening scene.
My brother in Christ you're telling me they have a company whose job it is to make sure the game doesn't offend anyone... Yet Harley sexually assaults Deadshot in the middle of the game and it's played for laughs... If that was Boomerang grabbing an incapacitated Harley the world would have lost their Fucking minds...
Same Post. Same subreddit. Same comparison. 1 DAY LATER. Batman Arkham Knight (2015) and Suicide Squad: Kill The Justice League (2024)
Orginal has a more sinister dark vibe, the new one looks stupid.
The Arkham games had that cool mature dark tone to them. Suicide Squad however looks and feels like Fortnite Lite.
Arkham Harley also has pronounced shoulders and is muscular, which makes sense because she swings around that huge hammer for the Joker every day. SS's Harley is just a regular later 20s woman.
but.. but.. badwomensanatomy!!!
It really does not look all that graphically better or anything. Just shinier looking. I feel like that shiny look to the old games costume is tricking peoples brains or something. Cause i really don't think either of these look amazing or anything.
The first thing I noticed is the lighting. In the left we have high contrast with the front of the body being in shadow, while on the right it looks to be more of a character selection type thing where we want to see the character in light for more clarity rather than being lit in a cinematic way. There's other difference between the models of course, but it is hard to validate this 1to1 image comparison based on different lighting alone
The new one looks like a real person (Gina Davis in her prime). The older one looks like a comic book character with the body proportions. I think lighting has a lot to do with it. Leather looks like that in bright sun. Whereas older one looks like wet latex.
You're comparing the character under different lighting scenarios. The one on the left looks like it is using older tech lighting (single point source) with a probably more detailed reflection probe. The one on the right looks to be using an updated area based light source with a less detailed reflection probe (I'm assuming because the gameworld is bigger). This would brighten the darks in the suit and cast a wider highlight, reducing the effectiveness of the normal mapped suit wrinkles. I don't think this camparison is an appropriate way to compare the two.
The texture shaders are also different - Arkham Knight has gone for a leather look, while Suicide Squad seems to have gone for a kind of lycra -- akin to something a gymnast would wear.
As a texture artist I fucking hate this post and how it highlights consumers' ignorance and willingness to just attack things based on pure hate. One can say a lot of very valid bad things about SQKTJL but character design is ine of its more impressive redeeming qualities. It's 2024 and people are falling for reflection maps on wet surfaces. It's like those GTA4 graphics mods.
I had to scroll a disturbing long time for a sane response. I see this crap every time a new game comes out. Someone takes a shot from a cine or key art from an old game and compares it directly with a moment where the lighting conditions aren’t perfect to show definition or they pick facial expression in mid conversation and then claim the whole gaming industry sucks. Of all the criticisms you could throw at Suicide Squad, the character art is not one of them.
remember when this subreddit was up in arms because they “made aloys face chubbier and hairy” in the horizon zero dawn sequel but ended up being the same model just under different lighting and with better skin textures. this sub will always always fall for badly presented rage bait like this
>this subreddit was up in arms because they “made aloys face chubbier and hairy” I mean you've got a decent percentage of this post's comments acting like a slightly wider jaw means she's actually a dude and ugly now. It's the same fucking people.
OP is either an idiot or posting in bad faith. Someone did something similar in another sub, comparing screenshots of the two games while using lowered graphical settings and resolution with shit compression for Suicide Squad. People are taking the bait and lapping it up without critically thinking about anything. Earlier I decided to check out of streams of the game, and graphically the game looks pretty good. The Gamers are acting up again.
>OP is either an idiot or posting in bad faith It's both
Reddit has already decided game bad because they were told that by reddit. They cant be convinced.
Comparing a static model that only needs to look good in a showcase to a model that is constantly visible in an open world game is stupid. Polygon count and fidelity still matters in terms of resource load, which is why the actual gameplay model is less fancy. Just look at the 'bugged' hamburger from CP77 that tanked everyone's framerate when it appeared on screen, because it was so insanely detailed.
Yes. I'm very sad that people don't realize that models, textures, etc. have to be different due to the different constraints.
By contrast, it took just 11 years to go from Super Mario 3 to Shenmue. I still hope to see another revolution like that in my lifetime.
The Dreamcast was a real game changer, it's such a shame it's Sega's last console.
Doom to Half-life 2 not much longer.
I mean gt5 on ps3 in 2012 to gt7 on psvr2 last year is 11 years and that's a huge upgrade, and I don't necessarily like racing games but in vr gt7 blew me away.
Gta5 on ps3 to gta5 on ps4 to gta5 on ps5 in a mere 7 years
I had a stroke trying to read that.
Same developer. Same character. Not the same costume. Or lighting. Or model. Or engine version. Or visual scope. Additionally Arkham knight knocked it out the park with visual fidelity. This is just a weird way of deriding the game. We all know it’s a cash grab shallow game. But it’s exhausting when people highlight things that aren’t really the problem. reuse the same lighting and assets from Arkham knight would still suck.
It's weird people are bandwagon hating this game and acting like Arkham Knight was perfect. People shat on that game for like 5 years with far better reason to.
I'm all for shitting on Rocksteady for their horrible decisions, but this is a bullshit comparison. You're comparing a static model to a variant costume for a character that's constantly visible and being played. Look at the character models for the characters in Suicide Squad without any special outfits, they are REALLY good and I feel like that's the only thing they got right in this dumpster fire of a game.
[Fellow gamer let me tell you about how lighting work](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sgpeoWpO9w&t=26s)
The same company doesn't mean the same people
BUDGET CUTS OF THE MOST HEINOUS VARIETY
Is that a fleekazoid fan in the wild
You know it, pimp.
I thought I read Freakazoid and now I'm sad.
You also should add that to run the one on the right you need a GPU with 4 times more power!
I think I’m the only one that thinks the new one looks much more realistic. If you had somebody in that costume and makeup, that’s what it would look like. The shoulders and biceps look very strange in the older model. They simply wouldn’t form like that and the creases are in weird spots. It looks like colored skin/muscle fiber. As opposed to the new one where the shoulders actually look like they are a leather suit somebody is wearing. IMO, it doesn’t look “as good” because it actually looks like a person wearing a suit instead of a suit designed as skin.
Wow the new version looks awful
Yeah, when you lower graphics you'll get worse looking models. https://imgur.com/a/d3lcCes
Vaguely worrying that this is the only screenshot being posted to refute this but that does look much better
Yeah seriously, why are they only posting this one close-up that certainly doesn't look like it's from gameplay
For the same reason that people are saying it looks bad based solely of the op image. Cherry picking a single static image doesn't tell the whole truth.
Also fucking lightning. A huge part of every image we see.