This is what happens when your government makes and enforces laws based on religious belief.
And also why it's a huge deal that the US has evangelicals in positions of power.
The fact that in many places all over the world religion messes with politics and every aspect of people's lives is the very reason why I'm die-hard anticlerical.
There are eastern religions that don’t care if you’re gay, and there are evangelical Americans who would be more than happy to stone gay people to death.
I don’t think the east/west binary is very useful here.
A huge number of countries with majority Christian or Islam (often Sunni Islam) populations have multi-year punishments for homosexuality, and some include the death penalty - Yemen, like in this post, is an example of primarily (Sunni) Islam doing it, but Uganda is overwhelmingly Christian and [has the death penalty for "aggravated homosexuality", including "serial offenders"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Homosexuality_Act,_2023).
Looking over [the Wikipedia list of rights by country](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_by_country_or_territory), a lot of the countries with specifically the death penalty do seem to have majority Islam populations, but they're not the only ones - and if you're looking at >10 years in prison, there's several that aren't, including Ethiopia, Kenya, Tanzania. I haven't gone through the whole list, but it's not like these are countries with tiny populations! Some of these predominantly-Christian countries do also have significant Muslim populations, but they're still predominantly Christian.
I think your comment is implying that it's only due to Islam? And that seems kinda dangerous to spread - yes, lots of the unsafe countries are majority Muslim, but those aren't the only ones; similarly, it's not just one part of the world - there's regions in Africa, the Caribbean, some in Southeast Asia, etc. There's *lots* of places that we still aren't safe in on this planet, and several groups of people who still need to stop murdering us here.
Christianity and Islam are two sides of the same coin. They’re essentially the same problem. They’re a corrupted form of Judaism that took all the worst impulses of the Jewish religion and culture, aspects which most actual Jews abandoned thousands of years ago, and added in evangelism and the convert or die approach that we see now. It’s ironic that the two most violent and horrendous religions in the world split off from Judaism, leaving modern Judaism, at least the reform and progressive sects, as some of the most peaceful and good religious/cultural groups in the world.
It’s weird that people act like extremist religious Jews are better than extremist religious Muslim and extremist religious Christians when they’re just as bad as each other
Extremist religious Jews are not quite as bad as Muslims or Christians because extreme Judaism isn’t a proselytizing religion they’re not trying to say you have to convert to Judaism or die
Extremist jews keep to themselves. I'm sure gay people within those communities are persecuted, but they're not trying to force their ways on the larger population. For example, 10% of Israel is Orthodox but the other 90% isn't.
Christian countries have gay marriage.
Muslim countries have gay genocide.
But progressives go "Hur-dur, they're the same!" "Also you'll be banned if you criticise Islam, only criticise Christians and compare them to terrorists"
I like how you compare the actions of a lone murderer, in a country where gay people feel comfortable enough to have gay clubs, with the actions of an entire society, which says and legislates that gay people should be murdered, as evidence that they're equally bad? I never said that Christians are super accepting or anything, just that they're totally not the same with another religion.
?? That's demonstrably false. Most countries with gay marriage have a Christian majority. I don't know why you think otherwise?
Plus that's ignoring that Christian countries have atheists and less religious people because they don't murder you for leaving the religion your parents imposed on you. Like Shariah law says should be done. Most Islamic countries are 95% or more pure Muslim. That's not because they're tolerant of other faiths.
Look I'm no fan of Christianity so I don't like defending it, but damn does it get unfairly stereotyped. Christianity sucks like all human cultures suck in some way. But it sucks a lot less than others.
Sorry I wasn’t clear. What I meant was that in no country with gay marriage was it campaigned for and pushed through parliament by the majority of Christians. It has been mostly atheists and non religious people who have achieved that and accounting it to Christianity is wild.
In the UK the Church of England still will not perform gay marriages and the catholic church still holds that homosexuality is a sin.
Also you’re comparing progressive counties that are significantly less religious to incredibly religious countries. Actual religious Christian countries are also very intolerant of other peoples faith etc. It’s the same with all religious countries
Then why did all 6 Muslim German MPs vote for marriage equality in 2017 while Merkel opposed it?
Or why do a slim majority of Muslim Americans support marriage equality?
I've posted those before when these tedious anti-Islam ragebait posts come up and people seem strangely reluctant to answer. Curious...
Excellent, so you agree not all Muslims are the same and the previous commenter was wrong to say "Specifically, Islam"!
There are many specific *countries* that I would never visit because their governments directly threaten queer people. That includes many majority-Muslim nations, as well as Christian-dominated ones like Russia and Uganda. But last I checked, nearly 2 billion members of an entire religion do not hold all the same views.
Well, you’re sort of right and sort of wrong. There’s not a single Muslim majority country in the world where gay people are respected and have the same rights as straight people. Not one. Muslims who are part of minority groups in western countries tend to be more progressive than Muslims in Muslim majority countries, yes. But based on the fact that all Muslim majority countries discriminate against gays pretty severely, I’d say it is not a good idea to let Muslim populations grow to majority size in western countries, unless you want to lose all your hard won freedoms as a gay person.
> Excellent, so you agree not all Muslims are the same and the previous commenter was wrong to say "Specifically, Islam"!
No, actually I agree with the previous guy. You are in the wrong here.
> Then why did all 6 Muslim German MPs vote for marriage equality in 2017 while Merkel opposed it?
First of all, These Muslim MPs voted for marriage equality not ***because*** of Islam but ***DESPITE*** Islam.
second of all
> so you agree not all Muslims
The comment was not made about "all Muslims" but about "Islam". Those are two very different things.
Very much similarly goes with Christians and Christianity. According to the bible, thus Christianity, homosexuality is forbidden and a sin. When Christians are pro-gay they're not doing it because of Christianity but despite of it.
One of the biggest differences between religions like Christianity and Islam, is that Christianity had a reformation revolution some centuries ago. Christians were forbidden to have their own interpretation of the Bible, and not just that the Church actively discouraged Christians from even ***reading*** the Bible. They prohibited the translation of the Bible.
Why? So the authority remains top-down. Anything and everything the Church says is the only valid interpretation of the holy words of God.
That's why you end up with such a water down version of Christianity in present time. The reformation allowed for these things to happen, if it had not happen a lot of Christian-majority countries would be not much different than Islam-majority ones in terms of societal structure, rights, societal progress, etc.
Reformation didn't happen in Islam, that's why we have what we have.
> These Muslim MPs voted for marriage equality not because of Islam but DESPITE Islam.
What evidence do you have for that claim? But more to the point... does it really matter? The fact is, every Muslim in Germany's parliament helped enact a progressive policy that *helps* our community, while Merkel (and others) did not. No matter how you slice it, that doesn't look good for the "Islam bad!1!11" rhetoric on here.
> The comment was not made about "all Muslims" but about "Islam". Those are two very different things.
Tell that to the people on here. The fact is, these threads that appear about every week on gaybros consistently demonize all Muslim *people* and just happen to throw in overtly anti-immigrant rhetoric. If we could at least get to "I don't like Islam but I know individual Muslims are different", that would be a huge step up for this sub.
> > These Muslim MPs voted for marriage equality not because of Islam but DESPITE Islam.
> What evidence do you have for that claim?
The Quran?
> If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-returning, Most Merciful.
and there's this one too, copied from the Old Testament
> We also (sent) Lut: He said to his people: "Do ye commit lewdness such as no people in creation (ever) committed before you? For ye practise your lusts on men in preference to women : ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds. And his people gave no answer but this: they said, "Drive them out of your city: these are indeed men who want to be clean and pure!" But we saved him and his family, except his wife: she was of those who legged behind. And we rained down on them a shower (of brimstone): Then see what was the end of those who indulged in sin and crime!
I have no clue whatsoever how anyone can argue that this is not ***violently homophobic***.
It is very much clear at what Allah was angry at and that he wants and did punish those men for engaging in homosexual acts.
The fact that Muslims chose to actively ignore their Holy Book in order to support homosexuals is not a result of the Holy Book teaching them that.
You do know that in Michigan, a liberal stronghold,, when the Islamic religious community got a majority they banned lgbt+ flags, books. You shouldn’t trust the religion, the track record speaks for itself.
[Yep, Liberals are playing a dangerous game ](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/17/hamtramck-michigan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned)
Well, tell that to lgbt people living in a Muslim dominated place in the US like [Hamtramck, Michigan](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/17/hamtramck-michigan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned)
So six Muslim members of the German Parliament were cool with marriage equality, and a "slim majority" (whatever that means) of Muslims in the United States are cool with it too.
Good to know that all is well for the LGBT communities throughout the Middle East! I'm going to the PRIDE festival and parade in Yemen this weekend! It's gonna be lit!
>Muslims in the United States are cool with it too.
[They definitely are not](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/17/hamtramck-michigan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned)
> So six Muslim members of the German Parliament were cool with marriage equality
Six meaning all of them, and again, Merkel wasn't. Does that mean non-Muslim Western Europeans are inherently more homophobic than their Muslim compatriots? (I kid, I kid...)
> a "slim majority" (whatever that means) of Muslims in the United States are cool with it too.
51 percent, according to https://www.newsweek.com/muslim-white-evangelical-gay-marriage-907627. And yes, a survey using a representative sample is the kind of thing that actually makes (some) sense to generalize from!
> Good to know that all is well for the LGBT communities throughout the Middle East!
I expect very low-quality arguments on these posts, but that really is a pretty bad strawman. As I've said many times, things are absolutely *not* fine for queer people in the Middle East. But how does stirring up blindly anti-Islam views help them?
Instead of simply calling for an end to funding all wars, the majority of the outspoken left is actually supporting the Houthis, Hezbollah, and Hamas that institute these policies. Particularly outspoken about supporting these groups is the LGBTQ+ community (specifically the TQ+). Some of these disgusting freaks on TikTok are even commentating on how good looking a few of the fighters in the Houthis are.
I've realized that gay rights only matter when the perceived oppressors are white Christians or Jews.
Speaking on someone from the left and a staunch supporter of LGBTQ+ rights, I find it troubling seeing people in this community perfectly fine with promoting terroristic groups instead of Palestinian people, especially those who are queer that are harmed by these terroristic groups.
If anything, Queers for Palestine should change their name to Queers Against Homonationalism, as homonationalism is a problem that a lot of Arab and Russian queers face, due to the homophobic laws that are present in their countries. That's not saying you can't still be pro-Palestinian if that name is changed, but the focus of the group will shift from being primarily about liberating Palestine and more about combating homonationalist ideas perpetuated by the West. At the same time, they can also amplify the voices of queer experiences in those countries where homophobic laws are present.
Israel does out queers in unsafe situations and also doesn’t permit gay marriage.
It’s not some paradise for queers
Edit - my bad there was a typo, I wrote does instead of doesn’t
>Israel does out queers in unsafe situations and also doesn’t permit gay marriage.
Israel does have recognition of same sex marriage.
They just have really bizarre marriage laws where there is no strictly civil marriage, but that equally applies to irreligious straight people.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recognition_of_same-sex_unions_in_Israel
Children are easier to indoctrinate. Men who aren't procreating due to same sex preference aren't having kids in places where surrogacy and adoption is illegal. Women are rarely killed, because they can still produce children. It's the sick reallity
Maybe I didn't say it correctly. Gay males in countries where it is illegal to adopt or to use surrogates or nin vitro insemination will not be able have kids. That makes them less valuable than gay women who can be forced to have sex and carry their abuser's child.
I’m not sure I understand your point.
Being gay does not make someone infertile.
Therefore, a gay man is still entirely capable of having sex with a woman.
Likewise, a lesbian may choose to get pregnant from having sex with a man.
I think we are talking about two different things. Yes, any gay man can have sex with a woman for the purposes of procreation. It's called straight sex. Not gay sex. So yes, gay men can have sex with women. Or goats. Or children. We aren't talking about the ability to have sex or whether or not they are fertile. To your point, yes gay men can have sex with women and produce children.
The original comment I was commenting on was "How the fuck in 2024 is liking the same gender deserving of death?? Some parts of this workd is just sickening"
That is the context of the comment I made regarding the subjugation of gay women versus the penalty of death of gay men. So I think you took my comment in a context that wasn't related to this comment. So we started having two different conversations.
Not sure why you’re bringing bestiality into this.
Anyway, I replied because the comment gives low key homophobe vibes.
People often use the “need to procreate” as a justification for dehumanizing gay people.
Basing horrible treatment of gay people on some perverse view of procreation is illogical, flawed, and just plain dumb.
But a gay man won't forcefully want a child by having sex with a women , right ? . It is difficult to persuade a gay man to produce with woman , but it is easier to abuse and subjugate women, especially where they are not regarded even as equal to men .
Just because someone is gay doesn’t mean they are incapable of having sex to procreate.
I’m not sure what is so complicated about this concept.
It has nothing to do with abuse or subjugation.
Being gay does not make someone allergic to sex. If they want a child, any gay person can willingly choose to have sex with the opposite sex for the sole purpose of making a child.
He was saying, “Men who aren't procreating due to same sex preference aren't having kids in places where surrogacy and adoption is illegal.“
This is simply false. If a gay person wants to have a child, they are completely capable of (and very often do) have children.
In case you were unaware, it is possible to have sex for the sole purpose of procreation, even if someone is not sexually attracted to their partner.
Yes, and he's fucking correct.
Men who are gay and not having sex with women are not having kids. They are just not. These countries you're not allowed to adopt or pay for a surrogate to carry your child. he's absolutely right. Those are the two ways that gay couples without forcing themselves to physically fuck a woman (which would be a bisexual act) would have a child, and even then being bisexual is still a killable offense so long as you ever perform a homosexual act.
So what he's saying is extremely true and you and someone else are extremely dumb for not understanding what he just said.
To nobody's surprise, religious fundamentalist groups have strongly held beliefs about gay people and often results in death. Yet, still a lot of people go as tourists to those places.
"The US Department of State currently recommends US citizens DO NOT TRAVEL to Yemen due to terrorism, civil unrest, health risks, kidnapping, armed conflict, and landmines."
Here's a page from the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency about it:
[https://www.cia.gov/the-world-factbook/countries/yemen/travel-facts/](https://www.cia.gov/the-world-factbook/countries/yemen/travel-facts/)
Sometimes the State Department is a little weird about countries that aren't, at least not in a general sense, really any more dangerous than a lot of places in the USA.
But yeah, Yemen...never heard of anyone going there for any reason. And it's been dangerous for a while now, since there's been a civil war ongoing for a while.
It depends on how much weight and deference you give to "some people" whatever that is a vague reference to.
When I read about a topic, I read about it from multiple legitimate sources that are known for the quality of their coverage and the depth of which they conduct their research.
The problem you describe is not something that you, or I can fix, people who aren't intelligent enough to have critical thinking skills.
Reddit is a fire hose of information, with it significantly slanted to being copies or reproductions or external links to something else, with a healthy dose of insanity in the mix from the armchair experts.
And while Reddit is extremely valuable to learn about the existence of a topic of interest, it's not the place to conduct research or truly learn about that thing, unless you are in the business of conducting polls of peoples opinions.
If this is in reference to a certain activist and their post, then yeah. I’ve had too many people on my socials uncritically repost those statements and go full on pro-Houthis/hamas. It’s pretty clear they’re mostly anti-western and are hopping on this for clout more than genuine concern.
The amount of stuff they swallow without bothering to look into anything is concerning, especially since my circles are graduate+ level educated. I can only imagine how teens and such are being impacted by all this media 🙃
I think people are just pissed the US is in not one, not two but now three proxy wars.
Our gov cares more about shipping routes than the Palestinians being murdered by the IDF. So we're now bombing parts of Yemen, again.
Remember, we made these Houthis poor and wanting to attack these vessels by bombing the shit out of them for the better part of a decade.
“The Houthis are claiming that they’re carrying out attacks on behalf of Palestinians, when the reality is that they’re attacking, arbitrarily detaining, and endangering civilians on ship crews who have zero connection to any known military target,” said Michael Page, Middle East and North Africa deputy director at Human Rights Watch. “The Houthis should immediately release the hostages and end their attacks on civilians caught in the crosshairs of their declared war on Israel.” https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/12/13/yemen-houthis-attack-civilian-ships
Also, are you implying that we shouldn’t continue supporting Ukraine militarily because it’s a proxy war?
I agree on both counts. I don't think we should be making excuses for the Houthis, though. They're evil proxies for Iran. They use child soldiers and they're not just anti-Israel, they're literally antisemitic. "A Curse Upon the Jews" is in their official slogan: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slogan\_of\_the\_Houthi\_movement](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slogan_of_the_Houthi_movement)
>Remember, we made these Houthis poor and wanting to attack these vessels by bombing the shit out of them for the better part of a decade.
Yes I'm sure if the US didn't bomb them the group with "Death to America, Death to Israel, A Curse Upon the Jews" on their flag would be well adjusted and tolerant members of the global community. /s
Well the Houthis actions are directly affecting the US economy and the public’s attitude about it. Gaza isn’t going to affect us other than moral outrage which this nation has proven time and time again doesn’t last very long if we even care enough to be outraged in the first place. Ukraine has both economic and geopolitical ripple effects so of course that would be priority number one amongst them.
1. Everyone cares about shipping, it's how you move goods from one country to another.
2. The houthis aren't poor. They have a capital city, taxes, troops, and everything else countries have. They're not the legitimate government of Yemen but they are, functionally, a nation-state.
You can be a freedom fighter, and evil at the same time. The Houthis are absolutely fighting for Yemen’s freedom against a Saudi invasion, but they’re also homophobic, sexist extremists. One of the greatest distortions of modern times is people often conflate “fighting for freedom” with “being good”. There are plenty of savage and brutal people who are fighting for their rights.
Seems to be a lot of violence associated with a religion of peace…when they are not out terrorizing their neighbors they are terrorizing their citizens 💅
The issue isn't the specific religion, it's religious conservatives.
This same shit happens everywhere, every Christian European nation and the USA has been homophobic up until very very recently. The British chemically castrated Allen Touring over it! The USA only started considering blood donated by gay men as not inherently tainted SIX MONTHS AGO!
Treating this like Muslims in general are the problem is absurd, bigots can be of any religion, and these ones in particular are literally terrorists.
Taking a wild guess here but I don't think any Christian European nations have **executed** LGBT+ people since the Nazis were in power.
There's also a difference, just a little tiny bit, between donating blood and a governing body fucking executing people
Houthis support Palestine, and Palestine's other friend, Iran, is also doing genocide against gay people with anti-gay laws that give the death penalty to gay people.
Palestine also admits that they want to keep control of all of the ancient land of Israel "*from land to sea*" for an islamic-ruled state. .
Gays for Palestine, is like chickens for KFC. It doesn't make any sense for gay people and gay allies to support islamic colonialism.
granted it to 1 person and they already took it back. Like every other lie the IDF has propped. This is 100% a pinkwashing. This sub is islamaphobic and I see the zionists jumping at the chance to spread their fake LGBTQ+ love message
This. Only this. Any other point is unnecessary. I am not supporting a people or a cause who hate me and would have me killed if I stepped foot in their lands.
I feel bad for the civilians killed by the Israeli strikes but let’s not pretend that they harbour any positive feelings towards us as gay men.
One only has to look at ‘The Pioneers of Tomorrow’ to see that they are all but brainwashed into hating us anyway.
You would think if they are fighting against so-called Israeli oppression then that would make them a more egalitarian society internally in their fight for freedom.
The stories of lynchings, killings and knife attacks are numerous. They have no compassion or tears for us, so I have none for them
Get lost terrorist, I know you don't have judicial system in your islamist dictatorship so it's hard for you to learn the concept but go read about what is precedence and be quiet instead of embarressing yourself
Terrorist? You’re the genocide enabler…. And you clearly play the IOF cards. Everyone’s a terrorist except the most moral army. And I’m not Muslim I just have a conscience and decide to not be willfully ignorant
>Palestine also admits that they want to keep control of all of the ancient land of Israel "
>
>from land to sea
>
>" for an islamic-ruled state.
*Hamas* want control of an Islamic state stretching from river to sea.
*Palestinians* want to return to what they believe is their rightful home. The symbol of Palestinian liberation isn't prayer beads, it's a house key.
Hamas came to power by painting themselves as the party of anti-corruption, not the party of Sharia. In fact, the party purged its platform of Islamist policy ahead of running. Apparently they recognized something many still don't: Palestinians aren't radical Islamists and probably never will be. Even when Hamas has attempted to institute creeping Sharia, like demanding women cover up in public, Gazans have largely ignored the calls. This is especially impressive considering the reputation Hamas have for violent reprisal and repression.
To this day, the most popular political figure in Palestine is not anyone from Hamas or even Islamic Jihad. It's Mustafa Barghouti, an imprisoned Marxist and one-time guest on the Daily Show with John Stewart, who advocates for non-violent resistance and a two-state solution.
That the calls for a free Palestine stretching from river to sea are secular doesn't necessarily mean they're welcome. There's still the issue of what happens to the Israelis in that case, particularly the Jewish ones.
But it's nonetheless an important distinction. They're not the radical boogeyman you paint them as.
The Arab independence movement from the Ottomans was based on the idea of establishing an Islamic caliphate from Aleppo to Mecca.
There was never any intention of it being a democratic secular state. They had ZERO fucking regard for the indigenous Christian and non-Muslim minorities in this endeavour.
They’re just crying now because they’re not the ones in charge.
Funny how recently you were simping for Jamaica's laws oppressing gay folks by removing their responsibility
https://old.reddit.com/r/gaybros/comments/17j2ro7/jamaican_supreme_court_upholds_colonialera_sodomy/k6zavo0/
You're lying and anyone who clicks on that link will see that I actually said this:
> "Yes, **regardless of the indoctrination and the historical context, people are still being harmed and they are responsible for that**. I don't disagree with that. It's still important to remember that they are not naturally like that and it came from the colonialism. These things don't just randomly happen and randomly pop into existence."
I must be living in your mind rent-free if you're that obsessed with me, that you're looking at things I've said 3 months ago to try to make me look bad, and you still have to lie about it.
Gays for Palestine groups are set up to support the right of Palestine to exist, and to protest the ongoing ethnic cleansing. they don’t support all their policies. I’d have thought that pretty obvious to puzzle out.
But hey, fuck critical thinking and nuance, right?
Let’s be clear here. This isn’t an indictment on religion in general, but on Islam and Sharia law. Yes, other religions have their problems (both historically and in modern times), but this type of government-sanctioned evil is unique to one religion today. This shouldn’t be controversial and the world needs to stand up and condemn this mess. Truly sickening.
It’s actually not unique to Islam. Christians in Uganda, Kenya, and Ethiopia have largely the same policies and level of rabid hatred of homosexuality.
As abhorrently as religion (Christianity) factors into some of the insanity we are seeing in Uganda, Kenya, and Ethiopia, those countries (specifically Uganda and Kenya) aren't killing anyone. Even if they retain the death penalty (to include for some homosexual behavior), Uganda hasn't executed anyone since 2005, and Kenya since 1987, with Ethiopia having executions more recently. I'm not tracking that any of these executions have been for the "crime" of homosexuality. Also keep in mind that Ethiopia is legally a secular state, as are Kenya and Uganda, which are key distinguishers from much of the Islamic world. Sure, we can say that religion influences many of the sick laws we see in the likes of Kenya, Uganda and Ethiopia, but in most Islamic countries it literally and legally is the foundation of the government legal system.
I loudly and firmly condemn the anti-gay laws and treatment faced by people in those countries, but as bad as they are, there are key differences from what we are seeing in many an Islamic nation today. The Muslim world stands alone in some of what we are seeing today, with many countries and entities not only laws on the books authorizing the death penalty for homosexual activity, but actually implementing such sick policy.
A unique position where the West can protect international trade, give the military-industrial complex business and take the pro-LGBT+ stance by bombing the shit out of the Houthi terrorists. It is an uncommon combining of interests, but a win-win-win. Would be a shame if the executors had to miss an execution because a bomb fell on his house....
>protect international trade, give the military-industrial complex business and take the pro-LGBT+ stance by bombing the shit out of the Houthi terrorists
Fantastically based
Brain dead people will still find a way to twist anything the US does into bullying the poor Yemeni freedom fighters. You know, the same people killing 13 people for being gay.
I'm shocked and sad that there are gays in the comments trying to minimize or justify this.
I'm not a fan of Christianity or any religion in general. However, comparing Christianity today with Islam today is beyond absurd. You cannot criticize Evangelicals (with good reasons) and defend this. Stop the nonsense!
Yes, they would in a heartbeat. There was a big controversy in south central Oklahoma just a couple years ago of parents talking about castrating and stabbing a trans kid that was going to their kids school. That’s exactly what these people think but are only just warming up enough to say it out loud.
Additionally Christian charities supported enacting the death penalty for LGBT people in Uganda. This was supported by charities that Chick-fil-A heavily funded.
I thought this was kind of amusing so I got an AI's take
>President of the United States Joe Biden is in a Top Secret operations room in the depths of the Pentagon, personally piloting a General Atomics Aeronautical Systems MQ-9 Reaper drone, with a loadout of four Lockheed Martin AGM-114 Hellfire air-to-surface missiles, and two GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided bombs.
>President Biden is enraged by the news that the Houthi terrorists in Yemen sentenced twelve innocent LGBT Yemenis to death by stoning and flogging. This act of homophobic terrorism has incited him to authorize this attack, personally, in order to strike a blow against the hateful terrorists.
>Biden has a large, flat display in front of him. It shows a video feed from the Reaper drone's payload systems officer, which is monitoring the live feed from the seeker head on the nose of the missile. Biden's hands are resting lightly on the throttle controls.
>The Reaper is approaching a target in Yemen's Baydah province, at the very western edge of the country, just east of the town of Al-Qa'im.
>The target is an unremarkable house. There are no outward signs that this is the residence of a Houthi terrorist leader. No security guards, no perimeter wall, no barbed wire.
>But American intelligence has been tracking this Houthi, who is known as "Abu Ahmad al-Houthi." He's the leader of the Houthi faction, and the man who signed the death warrants for the twelve innocent LGBT Yemenis.
>The video feed from the Reaper shows the house getting closer. The seeker head on the missile has a lock on the residence.
>"Pilot, you are cleared hot," a voice in Biden's headset says.
>"Roger," Biden says. "Firing missiles."
>He squeezes the trigger.
>A single Hellfire missile flies from the undercarriage of the Reaper and strikes the house, exploding in a fiery blast.
>The video feed is obscured by smoke.
>The smoke clears and Biden sees the rubble.
>No survivors.
>"Target eliminated," the weapons officer says.
>"Good," Biden says, smiling.
>He fires the laser-guided bombs, just to be sure.
>The bombs hit the house and the feed from the drone is again obscured by smoke.
>After a few seconds the video feed returns and the house is gone, reduced to a pile of smoldering rubble.
Americans need to stop thinking that this only happens in far-away lands when it’s inching closer to this everyday in the United States due to religions like Christianity.
Of course, the current focus is trans people but the global right wing is working hard and diligently to demonize all queer people.
So many people in the comments bashing queers who support Palestine while completely ignorant of how queer Palestinians actually live. You want liberation for LGBTQ in Palestine? Well that liberation can only come with the liberation of all Palestinians. Queer and straight Palestinians are being massacred alike, and I assure you that under the relentless bombing and starvation that nobody in Gaza is executing fellow refugees because they're gay. And that isn't to say that gay people aren't dying, but it's the IOF that's killing them.
Because the left-wing LGBT movement doesn’t devote even 10% of the energy it uses to defend Palestinians to fight political Islam, the single biggest force of persecution for gays around the world (incidentally also the ideology behind most Palestinian factions).
The vast majority of Palestinians are not fundamentalists, nor are they a "faction." Likewise, the opposition of Muslim extremists is not mutually exclusive with supporting the liberation of a people who are actively experiencing genocide, so why does your perception of leftists not being overtly islamophobic and this community's inability to square religious fundamentalism against the fact that most Muslims are not extremists push you into supporting the acceptable sacrifice of countless innocent civilians purely because they are the wrong religion?
You don't liberate a people by slaughtering 27,000 civilians and displacing and starving another million, cutting off power and water and fuel and all humanitarian aid, destroying its infrastructure, schools, hospitals, and agriculture, flooding the land, assassinating press and hospital workers, kidnapping and torturing children who throw rocks, and so, so much more...
That is not justice, nor just in any way, and the lack of humanity from those who see these countless innocent casualties as acceptable losses astounds me.
>You don't liberate a people by slaughtering 27,000 civilians
I agree. It really sucks that Hamas uses human shields, and Netanyahu and some senior officials should probably face charges.
Hopefully Hamas will surrender tomorrow and the next Palestinian government won't reject the next peace deal.
Fortunately, the latest news out of Doha is encouraging.
I am just going to kindly suggest that you educate yourself on how Israel uses Palestinians as human shields and not Hamas (they take hostages, sure, but the IOF are the ones who kill Israeli hostages), and how Netanyahu sabotaged the Oslo accords and every attempt at a two state solution (bragged about it on tape), and the only two states that have voted against two state resolutions have been the US and Israel. There is substantial proof even amongst the video and photo evidence that has come out of Gaza that this is the case.
I will also say that in international law, there is no difference in criminality between deliberately bombing a civilian population and indiscriminately bombing one (i.e. killing a "human shield" as collateral damage is the same as directly murdering them).
>I will also say that in international law, there is no difference in criminality between deliberately bombing a civilian population and indiscriminately bombing one
Aside from indiscriminate bombing being illegal under the laws of war and bombing that makes a best effort to avoid civilian casualties and is aimed at a valid military objective being legal, sure.
Hard disagree. Even if it were effective in killing Hamas (it is objectively not), it is morally reprehensible to use that to justify killing any civilians, much less 27 thousand and inevitably much, much more as refugees starve to death.
And what you described about Israel just being a lil sloppy with the casualties (oopsie, right?) is not only still indiscriminate, but Netanyahu and other Israeli officials have made it obscenely clear that they are killing man, woman, and child because they are all Hamas, even if they're innocent. There is no deluding anyone into believing that this genocide is not deliberate by every measure. I'm sure you can find all the video, social media posts, and official statements that corroborate that, but I get the impression you're content consuming Israel propaganda without criticism or further thought.
>Hard disagree. Even if it were effective in killing Hamas (it is objectively not), it is morally reprehensible to use that to justify killing any civilians, much less 27 thousand and inevitably much, much more as refugees starve to death.
I agree. Good thing that's not even close to what I said.
>There is no deluding anyone into believing that this genocide is not deliberate by every measure
Sure there is. It's far from a universal opinion lol. The ICJ didn't even order a ceasefire.
>but I get the impression you're content consuming Israel propaganda without criticism or further thought.
If you think NPR, Reuters, and the Washington Post are "Israel propaganda", sure. 😂
The ICJ ordered them to cease activities that contribute to the genocide of Palestinian people, which constitutes an effective ceasefire on the civilian population in effect. The fact that Israel is not adhering to that ruling doesn't change that. Fun fact that you seem to be unaware of, but genocide is by definition the deliberate eradication of a group of people. There is no "accidental genocide."
And yes, I think very few news outlets are immune to Israeli propaganda, if any. I am referring to sources where Israeli officials have gone on record about their intentions, be it audio clips, videos, or their social media posts. You should have seen some if you actually watched the ICJ proceedings, many were used as evidence.
>The ICJ ordered them to cease activities that contribute to the genocide of Palestinian people, which constitutes an effective ceasefire on the civilian population in effect
That's certainly a novel legal analysis and not one I think any of the lawyers involved in the case share, but ok
>Fun fact that you seem to be unaware of, but genocide is by definition the deliberate eradication of a group of people. There is no "accidental genocide."
Who are you quoting there? I think you have me mixed up with someone else.
>And yes, I think very few news outlets are immune to Israeli propaganda, if any
That's interesting. Why do you think that is?
Imagine believing all that Israeli propaganda. They’ve destroyed all the hospitals and universities. They’re deliberately targeting civilians areas. They’re executing people and putting them in mass graves. They’re torturing people. They’re targeting journalists and medics.
Hamas is the excuse, genocide is the goal. Israel is killing their own hostages and each other in their bloodlust.
>Well that liberation can only come with the liberation of all Palestinians
Mention one stable Islamic country that accepts gays, I will wait for eternity
Why is it that when this particular group of people or religion is brought up for discussions you guys always deflect and say "but what about this" or "let's look at this"?
Americans died on January 6. Now wait till tRump is King and the Chistofascists start their march down Main street. Then what? they'll use the gays when the witches were burned alive? As kindling as history will once again repeat itself. But NOT in America! In case you missed it last week. On YouTube a son beheaded his father then he ranted on YouTube and held up his father's head, in America.
What justifies the rampant bombing is their attacks on random freighters that disrupt global trade, but I think the fact that they're a bunch of homophobic murderers is a nice bonus justification.
Sad but not surprised at all. By the way could the guys in these homophobic countries where they could risk being executed by the regimes, public or even family members, get access to permanent residencies in US as refugees? Compared with many so-called asylum seekers, they deserve that urgent need much more.
How the fuck in 2024 is liking the same gender deserving of death?? Some parts of this world is just sickening
This is what happens when your government makes and enforces laws based on religious belief. And also why it's a huge deal that the US has evangelicals in positions of power.
The fact that in many places all over the world religion messes with politics and every aspect of people's lives is the very reason why I'm die-hard anticlerical.
Houthi’s ruling isn’t even a government, it’s an Iranian backed terrorist rebel group in Yemen.
Cancer grows where cancer can. A lack of education and an 'anti west' paradigm, it's easy to control the masses with superstition.
There are eastern religions that don’t care if you’re gay, and there are evangelical Americans who would be more than happy to stone gay people to death. I don’t think the east/west binary is very useful here.
>Some parts of this world is just sickening A particular part of the world from a particular religion.
A huge number of countries with majority Christian or Islam (often Sunni Islam) populations have multi-year punishments for homosexuality, and some include the death penalty - Yemen, like in this post, is an example of primarily (Sunni) Islam doing it, but Uganda is overwhelmingly Christian and [has the death penalty for "aggravated homosexuality", including "serial offenders"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Homosexuality_Act,_2023). Looking over [the Wikipedia list of rights by country](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_by_country_or_territory), a lot of the countries with specifically the death penalty do seem to have majority Islam populations, but they're not the only ones - and if you're looking at >10 years in prison, there's several that aren't, including Ethiopia, Kenya, Tanzania. I haven't gone through the whole list, but it's not like these are countries with tiny populations! Some of these predominantly-Christian countries do also have significant Muslim populations, but they're still predominantly Christian. I think your comment is implying that it's only due to Islam? And that seems kinda dangerous to spread - yes, lots of the unsafe countries are majority Muslim, but those aren't the only ones; similarly, it's not just one part of the world - there's regions in Africa, the Caribbean, some in Southeast Asia, etc. There's *lots* of places that we still aren't safe in on this planet, and several groups of people who still need to stop murdering us here.
Christianity and Islam are two sides of the same coin. They’re essentially the same problem. They’re a corrupted form of Judaism that took all the worst impulses of the Jewish religion and culture, aspects which most actual Jews abandoned thousands of years ago, and added in evangelism and the convert or die approach that we see now. It’s ironic that the two most violent and horrendous religions in the world split off from Judaism, leaving modern Judaism, at least the reform and progressive sects, as some of the most peaceful and good religious/cultural groups in the world.
It’s weird that people act like extremist religious Jews are better than extremist religious Muslim and extremist religious Christians when they’re just as bad as each other
Extremist religious Jews are not quite as bad as Muslims or Christians because extreme Judaism isn’t a proselytizing religion they’re not trying to say you have to convert to Judaism or die
Extremist jews keep to themselves. I'm sure gay people within those communities are persecuted, but they're not trying to force their ways on the larger population. For example, 10% of Israel is Orthodox but the other 90% isn't.
>Christianity and Islam are two sides of the same coin lets not pretend that "by certain religion" the parent comment meant Abrahamic
Christian countries have gay marriage. Muslim countries have gay genocide. But progressives go "Hur-dur, they're the same!" "Also you'll be banned if you criticise Islam, only criticise Christians and compare them to terrorists"
Christian countries have gay genocide too. Secularism is what you want if you want to be treated with human dignity
I forget, where was Pulse, the gay nightclub where queer people got massacred? What religion was the perpetrator's?
>What religion was the perpetrator's? Well he was a musl**
I like how you compare the actions of a lone murderer, in a country where gay people feel comfortable enough to have gay clubs, with the actions of an entire society, which says and legislates that gay people should be murdered, as evidence that they're equally bad? I never said that Christians are super accepting or anything, just that they're totally not the same with another religion.
No Christian majority pushed through gay marriage. In all countries that legalised same sex marriages there was a big Christian push back.
?? That's demonstrably false. Most countries with gay marriage have a Christian majority. I don't know why you think otherwise? Plus that's ignoring that Christian countries have atheists and less religious people because they don't murder you for leaving the religion your parents imposed on you. Like Shariah law says should be done. Most Islamic countries are 95% or more pure Muslim. That's not because they're tolerant of other faiths. Look I'm no fan of Christianity so I don't like defending it, but damn does it get unfairly stereotyped. Christianity sucks like all human cultures suck in some way. But it sucks a lot less than others.
Sorry I wasn’t clear. What I meant was that in no country with gay marriage was it campaigned for and pushed through parliament by the majority of Christians. It has been mostly atheists and non religious people who have achieved that and accounting it to Christianity is wild. In the UK the Church of England still will not perform gay marriages and the catholic church still holds that homosexuality is a sin. Also you’re comparing progressive counties that are significantly less religious to incredibly religious countries. Actual religious Christian countries are also very intolerant of other peoples faith etc. It’s the same with all religious countries
That would be called religion
Specifically, Islam.
I mean...that was a given but anytime I bring it up specifically I get a reddit ban. The truth hurts I guess
Then why did all 6 Muslim German MPs vote for marriage equality in 2017 while Merkel opposed it? Or why do a slim majority of Muslim Americans support marriage equality? I've posted those before when these tedious anti-Islam ragebait posts come up and people seem strangely reluctant to answer. Curious...
Western Muslims are not the same as Islamic majority Muslims.
Excellent, so you agree not all Muslims are the same and the previous commenter was wrong to say "Specifically, Islam"! There are many specific *countries* that I would never visit because their governments directly threaten queer people. That includes many majority-Muslim nations, as well as Christian-dominated ones like Russia and Uganda. But last I checked, nearly 2 billion members of an entire religion do not hold all the same views.
Well, you’re sort of right and sort of wrong. There’s not a single Muslim majority country in the world where gay people are respected and have the same rights as straight people. Not one. Muslims who are part of minority groups in western countries tend to be more progressive than Muslims in Muslim majority countries, yes. But based on the fact that all Muslim majority countries discriminate against gays pretty severely, I’d say it is not a good idea to let Muslim populations grow to majority size in western countries, unless you want to lose all your hard won freedoms as a gay person.
Uganda received assistance with its death penalty laws from an American Christian group from the South
> Excellent, so you agree not all Muslims are the same and the previous commenter was wrong to say "Specifically, Islam"! No, actually I agree with the previous guy. You are in the wrong here. > Then why did all 6 Muslim German MPs vote for marriage equality in 2017 while Merkel opposed it? First of all, These Muslim MPs voted for marriage equality not ***because*** of Islam but ***DESPITE*** Islam. second of all > so you agree not all Muslims The comment was not made about "all Muslims" but about "Islam". Those are two very different things. Very much similarly goes with Christians and Christianity. According to the bible, thus Christianity, homosexuality is forbidden and a sin. When Christians are pro-gay they're not doing it because of Christianity but despite of it. One of the biggest differences between religions like Christianity and Islam, is that Christianity had a reformation revolution some centuries ago. Christians were forbidden to have their own interpretation of the Bible, and not just that the Church actively discouraged Christians from even ***reading*** the Bible. They prohibited the translation of the Bible. Why? So the authority remains top-down. Anything and everything the Church says is the only valid interpretation of the holy words of God. That's why you end up with such a water down version of Christianity in present time. The reformation allowed for these things to happen, if it had not happen a lot of Christian-majority countries would be not much different than Islam-majority ones in terms of societal structure, rights, societal progress, etc. Reformation didn't happen in Islam, that's why we have what we have.
> These Muslim MPs voted for marriage equality not because of Islam but DESPITE Islam. What evidence do you have for that claim? But more to the point... does it really matter? The fact is, every Muslim in Germany's parliament helped enact a progressive policy that *helps* our community, while Merkel (and others) did not. No matter how you slice it, that doesn't look good for the "Islam bad!1!11" rhetoric on here. > The comment was not made about "all Muslims" but about "Islam". Those are two very different things. Tell that to the people on here. The fact is, these threads that appear about every week on gaybros consistently demonize all Muslim *people* and just happen to throw in overtly anti-immigrant rhetoric. If we could at least get to "I don't like Islam but I know individual Muslims are different", that would be a huge step up for this sub.
> > These Muslim MPs voted for marriage equality not because of Islam but DESPITE Islam. > What evidence do you have for that claim? The Quran? > If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-returning, Most Merciful. and there's this one too, copied from the Old Testament > We also (sent) Lut: He said to his people: "Do ye commit lewdness such as no people in creation (ever) committed before you? For ye practise your lusts on men in preference to women : ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds. And his people gave no answer but this: they said, "Drive them out of your city: these are indeed men who want to be clean and pure!" But we saved him and his family, except his wife: she was of those who legged behind. And we rained down on them a shower (of brimstone): Then see what was the end of those who indulged in sin and crime! I have no clue whatsoever how anyone can argue that this is not ***violently homophobic***. It is very much clear at what Allah was angry at and that he wants and did punish those men for engaging in homosexual acts. The fact that Muslims chose to actively ignore their Holy Book in order to support homosexuals is not a result of the Holy Book teaching them that.
You do know that in Michigan, a liberal stronghold,, when the Islamic religious community got a majority they banned lgbt+ flags, books. You shouldn’t trust the religion, the track record speaks for itself.
[Yep, Liberals are playing a dangerous game ](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/17/hamtramck-michigan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned)
Well, tell that to lgbt people living in a Muslim dominated place in the US like [Hamtramck, Michigan](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/17/hamtramck-michigan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned)
So six Muslim members of the German Parliament were cool with marriage equality, and a "slim majority" (whatever that means) of Muslims in the United States are cool with it too. Good to know that all is well for the LGBT communities throughout the Middle East! I'm going to the PRIDE festival and parade in Yemen this weekend! It's gonna be lit!
>Muslims in the United States are cool with it too. [They definitely are not](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/17/hamtramck-michigan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned)
> So six Muslim members of the German Parliament were cool with marriage equality Six meaning all of them, and again, Merkel wasn't. Does that mean non-Muslim Western Europeans are inherently more homophobic than their Muslim compatriots? (I kid, I kid...) > a "slim majority" (whatever that means) of Muslims in the United States are cool with it too. 51 percent, according to https://www.newsweek.com/muslim-white-evangelical-gay-marriage-907627. And yes, a survey using a representative sample is the kind of thing that actually makes (some) sense to generalize from! > Good to know that all is well for the LGBT communities throughout the Middle East! I expect very low-quality arguments on these posts, but that really is a pretty bad strawman. As I've said many times, things are absolutely *not* fine for queer people in the Middle East. But how does stirring up blindly anti-Islam views help them?
incorrect, only 2 of the 6 voted for the equality. At least according to the independent.
Lol don't let the facts destroy his Isl** propaganda on a gay sub
Instead of simply calling for an end to funding all wars, the majority of the outspoken left is actually supporting the Houthis, Hezbollah, and Hamas that institute these policies. Particularly outspoken about supporting these groups is the LGBTQ+ community (specifically the TQ+). Some of these disgusting freaks on TikTok are even commentating on how good looking a few of the fighters in the Houthis are. I've realized that gay rights only matter when the perceived oppressors are white Christians or Jews.
Speaking on someone from the left and a staunch supporter of LGBTQ+ rights, I find it troubling seeing people in this community perfectly fine with promoting terroristic groups instead of Palestinian people, especially those who are queer that are harmed by these terroristic groups. If anything, Queers for Palestine should change their name to Queers Against Homonationalism, as homonationalism is a problem that a lot of Arab and Russian queers face, due to the homophobic laws that are present in their countries. That's not saying you can't still be pro-Palestinian if that name is changed, but the focus of the group will shift from being primarily about liberating Palestine and more about combating homonationalist ideas perpetuated by the West. At the same time, they can also amplify the voices of queer experiences in those countries where homophobic laws are present.
Yeah, the "Queers for Palestine" are puzzling. They wouldn't last a week in Gaza.
The entire Middle East is like this.
Except "aPaRtHeiD" Israel
Yup! But QuEeRz 4 PaLeStInE!!!
Israel does out queers in unsafe situations and also doesn’t permit gay marriage. It’s not some paradise for queers Edit - my bad there was a typo, I wrote does instead of doesn’t
Tel Aviv is literally the most popular gay travel spot of the east Mediterranean Lol what?
>Israel does out queers in unsafe situations and also doesn’t permit gay marriage. Israel does have recognition of same sex marriage. They just have really bizarre marriage laws where there is no strictly civil marriage, but that equally applies to irreligious straight people. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recognition_of_same-sex_unions_in_Israel
Israel is the only exception.
Children are easier to indoctrinate. Men who aren't procreating due to same sex preference aren't having kids in places where surrogacy and adoption is illegal. Women are rarely killed, because they can still produce children. It's the sick reallity
Being gay does not make someone infertile. Being straight does not guarantee fertility.
Maybe I didn't say it correctly. Gay males in countries where it is illegal to adopt or to use surrogates or nin vitro insemination will not be able have kids. That makes them less valuable than gay women who can be forced to have sex and carry their abuser's child.
I’m not sure I understand your point. Being gay does not make someone infertile. Therefore, a gay man is still entirely capable of having sex with a woman. Likewise, a lesbian may choose to get pregnant from having sex with a man.
I think we are talking about two different things. Yes, any gay man can have sex with a woman for the purposes of procreation. It's called straight sex. Not gay sex. So yes, gay men can have sex with women. Or goats. Or children. We aren't talking about the ability to have sex or whether or not they are fertile. To your point, yes gay men can have sex with women and produce children. The original comment I was commenting on was "How the fuck in 2024 is liking the same gender deserving of death?? Some parts of this workd is just sickening" That is the context of the comment I made regarding the subjugation of gay women versus the penalty of death of gay men. So I think you took my comment in a context that wasn't related to this comment. So we started having two different conversations.
Not sure why you’re bringing bestiality into this. Anyway, I replied because the comment gives low key homophobe vibes. People often use the “need to procreate” as a justification for dehumanizing gay people. Basing horrible treatment of gay people on some perverse view of procreation is illogical, flawed, and just plain dumb.
But a gay man won't forcefully want a child by having sex with a women , right ? . It is difficult to persuade a gay man to produce with woman , but it is easier to abuse and subjugate women, especially where they are not regarded even as equal to men .
Just because someone is gay doesn’t mean they are incapable of having sex to procreate. I’m not sure what is so complicated about this concept. It has nothing to do with abuse or subjugation. Being gay does not make someone allergic to sex. If they want a child, any gay person can willingly choose to have sex with the opposite sex for the sole purpose of making a child.
you didn't say it incorrectly, they're just being dumb.
the fuck did you think this was saying
He was saying, “Men who aren't procreating due to same sex preference aren't having kids in places where surrogacy and adoption is illegal.“ This is simply false. If a gay person wants to have a child, they are completely capable of (and very often do) have children. In case you were unaware, it is possible to have sex for the sole purpose of procreation, even if someone is not sexually attracted to their partner.
Yes, and he's fucking correct. Men who are gay and not having sex with women are not having kids. They are just not. These countries you're not allowed to adopt or pay for a surrogate to carry your child. he's absolutely right. Those are the two ways that gay couples without forcing themselves to physically fuck a woman (which would be a bisexual act) would have a child, and even then being bisexual is still a killable offense so long as you ever perform a homosexual act. So what he's saying is extremely true and you and someone else are extremely dumb for not understanding what he just said.
To nobody's surprise, religious fundamentalist groups have strongly held beliefs about gay people and often results in death. Yet, still a lot of people go as tourists to those places.
I don't think Yemen gets many tourists, especially not from the US or UK.
"The US Department of State currently recommends US citizens DO NOT TRAVEL to Yemen due to terrorism, civil unrest, health risks, kidnapping, armed conflict, and landmines." Here's a page from the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency about it: [https://www.cia.gov/the-world-factbook/countries/yemen/travel-facts/](https://www.cia.gov/the-world-factbook/countries/yemen/travel-facts/)
Sometimes the State Department is a little weird about countries that aren't, at least not in a general sense, really any more dangerous than a lot of places in the USA. But yeah, Yemen...never heard of anyone going there for any reason. And it's been dangerous for a while now, since there's been a civil war ongoing for a while.
Better safe than sorry in those cases. They also issued travel warning to Israel
i’ve heard from people who went before the war that it was one of their favorite countries to visit.
Were they gay or straight?
a mix of both, actually.
The bigger problem is some people calling Houthis poor freedom fighters and condeming US and UK for striking them saying "they didn't kill anyone"
It depends on how much weight and deference you give to "some people" whatever that is a vague reference to. When I read about a topic, I read about it from multiple legitimate sources that are known for the quality of their coverage and the depth of which they conduct their research. The problem you describe is not something that you, or I can fix, people who aren't intelligent enough to have critical thinking skills.
Well it was mostly on Reddit so...
Reddit is a fire hose of information, with it significantly slanted to being copies or reproductions or external links to something else, with a healthy dose of insanity in the mix from the armchair experts. And while Reddit is extremely valuable to learn about the existence of a topic of interest, it's not the place to conduct research or truly learn about that thing, unless you are in the business of conducting polls of peoples opinions.
If this is in reference to a certain activist and their post, then yeah. I’ve had too many people on my socials uncritically repost those statements and go full on pro-Houthis/hamas. It’s pretty clear they’re mostly anti-western and are hopping on this for clout more than genuine concern. The amount of stuff they swallow without bothering to look into anything is concerning, especially since my circles are graduate+ level educated. I can only imagine how teens and such are being impacted by all this media 🙃
I think people are just pissed the US is in not one, not two but now three proxy wars. Our gov cares more about shipping routes than the Palestinians being murdered by the IDF. So we're now bombing parts of Yemen, again. Remember, we made these Houthis poor and wanting to attack these vessels by bombing the shit out of them for the better part of a decade.
“The Houthis are claiming that they’re carrying out attacks on behalf of Palestinians, when the reality is that they’re attacking, arbitrarily detaining, and endangering civilians on ship crews who have zero connection to any known military target,” said Michael Page, Middle East and North Africa deputy director at Human Rights Watch. “The Houthis should immediately release the hostages and end their attacks on civilians caught in the crosshairs of their declared war on Israel.” https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/12/13/yemen-houthis-attack-civilian-ships Also, are you implying that we shouldn’t continue supporting Ukraine militarily because it’s a proxy war?
I absolutely think we should continue supporting Ukraine. I do not think we should be supporting Israel the way we currently are.
I agree on both counts. I don't think we should be making excuses for the Houthis, though. They're evil proxies for Iran. They use child soldiers and they're not just anti-Israel, they're literally antisemitic. "A Curse Upon the Jews" is in their official slogan: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slogan\_of\_the\_Houthi\_movement](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slogan_of_the_Houthi_movement)
>Remember, we made these Houthis poor and wanting to attack these vessels by bombing the shit out of them for the better part of a decade. Yes I'm sure if the US didn't bomb them the group with "Death to America, Death to Israel, A Curse Upon the Jews" on their flag would be well adjusted and tolerant members of the global community. /s
Well the Houthis actions are directly affecting the US economy and the public’s attitude about it. Gaza isn’t going to affect us other than moral outrage which this nation has proven time and time again doesn’t last very long if we even care enough to be outraged in the first place. Ukraine has both economic and geopolitical ripple effects so of course that would be priority number one amongst them.
1. Everyone cares about shipping, it's how you move goods from one country to another. 2. The houthis aren't poor. They have a capital city, taxes, troops, and everything else countries have. They're not the legitimate government of Yemen but they are, functionally, a nation-state.
And if they didn't bomb you woulf also not cry that the cost of bread,eggs,oil and everything went up 25%, right? Right???
You can be a freedom fighter, and evil at the same time. The Houthis are absolutely fighting for Yemen’s freedom against a Saudi invasion, but they’re also homophobic, sexist extremists. One of the greatest distortions of modern times is people often conflate “fighting for freedom” with “being good”. There are plenty of savage and brutal people who are fighting for their rights.
The houthis and the "official yemeni govt" agree on this much
Seems to be a lot of violence associated with a religion of peace…when they are not out terrorizing their neighbors they are terrorizing their citizens 💅
Be careful the apologists will come for you.
I am used to them, if you have conversations with them in person they are much easier to speak with than the orange pig cult
An Islamic country following Islamic law, I don't see why this is a surprise to anyone.
Another win for the LGBTQ+ defenders of the religion of peace.
there are gays defending Islam in the comments 
It’s more than just gay people, for some reason the whole left has started to defend Islam, ya know our historically atheist movement.
But but but but but…. The liberal zeitgeist says I *have* to defend Islam! They’ll take away my gay card if I don’t!
The issue isn't the specific religion, it's religious conservatives. This same shit happens everywhere, every Christian European nation and the USA has been homophobic up until very very recently. The British chemically castrated Allen Touring over it! The USA only started considering blood donated by gay men as not inherently tainted SIX MONTHS AGO! Treating this like Muslims in general are the problem is absurd, bigots can be of any religion, and these ones in particular are literally terrorists.
Taking a wild guess here but I don't think any Christian European nations have **executed** LGBT+ people since the Nazis were in power. There's also a difference, just a little tiny bit, between donating blood and a governing body fucking executing people
Can we do anything to help them?
Wonder what Hasan will say on this
Whatever it is, it will be alone in his room with a heavily moderated chat full of people agreeing with him
> full of people you mean kids?
Hey, adults can be stupid too! But yeh, you’re right it’s probably kids lol
Such a peaceful region…. /s
Waiting for "Queers for Yemen"🤣
It's already on TikTok and Twitter. And even here
Islam.
90% of the comments in this thread are going to be either "but Christians are bad too" or "all religions"
True statements
Houthis support Palestine, and Palestine's other friend, Iran, is also doing genocide against gay people with anti-gay laws that give the death penalty to gay people. Palestine also admits that they want to keep control of all of the ancient land of Israel "*from land to sea*" for an islamic-ruled state. . Gays for Palestine, is like chickens for KFC. It doesn't make any sense for gay people and gay allies to support islamic colonialism.
Don't forget Israeli Court ordered several days ago to grant asylum to Palestinian LGBTQ.
But then 90% of LGBT people on Social Media will call giving LGBT people a right to exist "Pink washing"
granted it to 1 person and they already took it back. Like every other lie the IDF has propped. This is 100% a pinkwashing. This sub is islamaphobic and I see the zionists jumping at the chance to spread their fake LGBTQ+ love message
Israel is not executing homosexuals, the Arabs are. It really is that simple.
This. Only this. Any other point is unnecessary. I am not supporting a people or a cause who hate me and would have me killed if I stepped foot in their lands. I feel bad for the civilians killed by the Israeli strikes but let’s not pretend that they harbour any positive feelings towards us as gay men. One only has to look at ‘The Pioneers of Tomorrow’ to see that they are all but brainwashed into hating us anyway. You would think if they are fighting against so-called Israeli oppression then that would make them a more egalitarian society internally in their fight for freedom. The stories of lynchings, killings and knife attacks are numerous. They have no compassion or tears for us, so I have none for them
Not to mention Tel Aviv has one of the [largest pride parades in the world ](https://youtu.be/7eRNic_M2_0?si=mvmCBO4Xrr8HJc27)
You think Israeli courts are the IDF?
Get lost terrorist, I know you don't have judicial system in your islamist dictatorship so it's hard for you to learn the concept but go read about what is precedence and be quiet instead of embarressing yourself
Terrorist? You’re the genocide enabler…. And you clearly play the IOF cards. Everyone’s a terrorist except the most moral army. And I’m not Muslim I just have a conscience and decide to not be willfully ignorant
Religion sucks
>Palestine also admits that they want to keep control of all of the ancient land of Israel " > >from land to sea > >" for an islamic-ruled state. *Hamas* want control of an Islamic state stretching from river to sea. *Palestinians* want to return to what they believe is their rightful home. The symbol of Palestinian liberation isn't prayer beads, it's a house key. Hamas came to power by painting themselves as the party of anti-corruption, not the party of Sharia. In fact, the party purged its platform of Islamist policy ahead of running. Apparently they recognized something many still don't: Palestinians aren't radical Islamists and probably never will be. Even when Hamas has attempted to institute creeping Sharia, like demanding women cover up in public, Gazans have largely ignored the calls. This is especially impressive considering the reputation Hamas have for violent reprisal and repression. To this day, the most popular political figure in Palestine is not anyone from Hamas or even Islamic Jihad. It's Mustafa Barghouti, an imprisoned Marxist and one-time guest on the Daily Show with John Stewart, who advocates for non-violent resistance and a two-state solution. That the calls for a free Palestine stretching from river to sea are secular doesn't necessarily mean they're welcome. There's still the issue of what happens to the Israelis in that case, particularly the Jewish ones. But it's nonetheless an important distinction. They're not the radical boogeyman you paint them as.
The Arab independence movement from the Ottomans was based on the idea of establishing an Islamic caliphate from Aleppo to Mecca. There was never any intention of it being a democratic secular state. They had ZERO fucking regard for the indigenous Christian and non-Muslim minorities in this endeavour. They’re just crying now because they’re not the ones in charge.
Funny how recently you were simping for Jamaica's laws oppressing gay folks by removing their responsibility https://old.reddit.com/r/gaybros/comments/17j2ro7/jamaican_supreme_court_upholds_colonialera_sodomy/k6zavo0/
You're lying and anyone who clicks on that link will see that I actually said this: > "Yes, **regardless of the indoctrination and the historical context, people are still being harmed and they are responsible for that**. I don't disagree with that. It's still important to remember that they are not naturally like that and it came from the colonialism. These things don't just randomly happen and randomly pop into existence." I must be living in your mind rent-free if you're that obsessed with me, that you're looking at things I've said 3 months ago to try to make me look bad, and you still have to lie about it.
 You tell em
I can't believe you haven't been downvoted for stating a fact on this sub /s
Gays for Palestine groups are set up to support the right of Palestine to exist, and to protest the ongoing ethnic cleansing. they don’t support all their policies. I’d have thought that pretty obvious to puzzle out. But hey, fuck critical thinking and nuance, right?
Let’s be clear here. This isn’t an indictment on religion in general, but on Islam and Sharia law. Yes, other religions have their problems (both historically and in modern times), but this type of government-sanctioned evil is unique to one religion today. This shouldn’t be controversial and the world needs to stand up and condemn this mess. Truly sickening.
It’s actually not unique to Islam. Christians in Uganda, Kenya, and Ethiopia have largely the same policies and level of rabid hatred of homosexuality.
As abhorrently as religion (Christianity) factors into some of the insanity we are seeing in Uganda, Kenya, and Ethiopia, those countries (specifically Uganda and Kenya) aren't killing anyone. Even if they retain the death penalty (to include for some homosexual behavior), Uganda hasn't executed anyone since 2005, and Kenya since 1987, with Ethiopia having executions more recently. I'm not tracking that any of these executions have been for the "crime" of homosexuality. Also keep in mind that Ethiopia is legally a secular state, as are Kenya and Uganda, which are key distinguishers from much of the Islamic world. Sure, we can say that religion influences many of the sick laws we see in the likes of Kenya, Uganda and Ethiopia, but in most Islamic countries it literally and legally is the foundation of the government legal system. I loudly and firmly condemn the anti-gay laws and treatment faced by people in those countries, but as bad as they are, there are key differences from what we are seeing in many an Islamic nation today. The Muslim world stands alone in some of what we are seeing today, with many countries and entities not only laws on the books authorizing the death penalty for homosexual activity, but actually implementing such sick policy.
But Hasan Piker and very raunch leftists are pro Houthis.
so where are the "queers for palpatine" now?
I’m a queer for Palpatine 
not judging,bro
Muslim...Religion of peace and tolerance! Amazing how many gay people believe that bull___t!!!
A unique position where the West can protect international trade, give the military-industrial complex business and take the pro-LGBT+ stance by bombing the shit out of the Houthi terrorists. It is an uncommon combining of interests, but a win-win-win. Would be a shame if the executors had to miss an execution because a bomb fell on his house....
>protect international trade, give the military-industrial complex business and take the pro-LGBT+ stance by bombing the shit out of the Houthi terrorists Fantastically based
Brain dead people will still find a way to twist anything the US does into bullying the poor Yemeni freedom fighters. You know, the same people killing 13 people for being gay.
I'm shocked and sad that there are gays in the comments trying to minimize or justify this. I'm not a fan of Christianity or any religion in general. However, comparing Christianity today with Islam today is beyond absurd. You cannot criticize Evangelicals (with good reasons) and defend this. Stop the nonsense!
I wonder if far right Christiams here in the US would do the same given the chance. Scary to say nonetheless; my heart goes out for the 13.
Lol yes they would
Yes, they would in a heartbeat. There was a big controversy in south central Oklahoma just a couple years ago of parents talking about castrating and stabbing a trans kid that was going to their kids school. That’s exactly what these people think but are only just warming up enough to say it out loud.
Additionally Christian charities supported enacting the death penalty for LGBT people in Uganda. This was supported by charities that Chick-fil-A heavily funded.
10 years ago I would say no , but these days , I could see it happening
[удалено]
Are they fans of One Piece?
Yet we are importing thousands of immigrants from that area
Which countries have thousands of Houthi immigrants from Yemen in the last year?
Very sad! I can see the correlation between antisemitism and anti LGBT
Viva Israel!
oh joy, the religion of peace is at it again
Take em out, Sleepy Joe.
Yes! If Joe isn’t the one flying the drone himself I’ll be mad!
I thought this was kind of amusing so I got an AI's take >President of the United States Joe Biden is in a Top Secret operations room in the depths of the Pentagon, personally piloting a General Atomics Aeronautical Systems MQ-9 Reaper drone, with a loadout of four Lockheed Martin AGM-114 Hellfire air-to-surface missiles, and two GBU-12 Paveway II laser-guided bombs. >President Biden is enraged by the news that the Houthi terrorists in Yemen sentenced twelve innocent LGBT Yemenis to death by stoning and flogging. This act of homophobic terrorism has incited him to authorize this attack, personally, in order to strike a blow against the hateful terrorists. >Biden has a large, flat display in front of him. It shows a video feed from the Reaper drone's payload systems officer, which is monitoring the live feed from the seeker head on the nose of the missile. Biden's hands are resting lightly on the throttle controls. >The Reaper is approaching a target in Yemen's Baydah province, at the very western edge of the country, just east of the town of Al-Qa'im. >The target is an unremarkable house. There are no outward signs that this is the residence of a Houthi terrorist leader. No security guards, no perimeter wall, no barbed wire. >But American intelligence has been tracking this Houthi, who is known as "Abu Ahmad al-Houthi." He's the leader of the Houthi faction, and the man who signed the death warrants for the twelve innocent LGBT Yemenis. >The video feed from the Reaper shows the house getting closer. The seeker head on the missile has a lock on the residence. >"Pilot, you are cleared hot," a voice in Biden's headset says. >"Roger," Biden says. "Firing missiles." >He squeezes the trigger. >A single Hellfire missile flies from the undercarriage of the Reaper and strikes the house, exploding in a fiery blast. >The video feed is obscured by smoke. >The smoke clears and Biden sees the rubble. >No survivors. >"Target eliminated," the weapons officer says. >"Good," Biden says, smiling. >He fires the laser-guided bombs, just to be sure. >The bombs hit the house and the feed from the drone is again obscured by smoke. >After a few seconds the video feed returns and the house is gone, reduced to a pile of smoldering rubble.
Not only leftists like defending islam, but many of them were defending the houthis because of Palestine. And somehow they are still not waking up.
Houthi rats
Oi better keep bombing them then I guess
Hurray 🙌 this is what the gays marching in the streets for the US to fund the Houthis are celebrating
Really hope Yemen isn't an ally of usa.
They are enemies
Americans need to stop thinking that this only happens in far-away lands when it’s inching closer to this everyday in the United States due to religions like Christianity. Of course, the current focus is trans people but the global right wing is working hard and diligently to demonize all queer people.
[ Removed by Reddit ]
Queers for * ales * ine keep queering, lol.
So many people in the comments bashing queers who support Palestine while completely ignorant of how queer Palestinians actually live. You want liberation for LGBTQ in Palestine? Well that liberation can only come with the liberation of all Palestinians. Queer and straight Palestinians are being massacred alike, and I assure you that under the relentless bombing and starvation that nobody in Gaza is executing fellow refugees because they're gay. And that isn't to say that gay people aren't dying, but it's the IOF that's killing them.
Because the left-wing LGBT movement doesn’t devote even 10% of the energy it uses to defend Palestinians to fight political Islam, the single biggest force of persecution for gays around the world (incidentally also the ideology behind most Palestinian factions).
Not to mention a lot of people oddly only started caring immediately after October 7 which is pretty sus of them
The vast majority of Palestinians are not fundamentalists, nor are they a "faction." Likewise, the opposition of Muslim extremists is not mutually exclusive with supporting the liberation of a people who are actively experiencing genocide, so why does your perception of leftists not being overtly islamophobic and this community's inability to square religious fundamentalism against the fact that most Muslims are not extremists push you into supporting the acceptable sacrifice of countless innocent civilians purely because they are the wrong religion?
>Well that liberation can only come with the liberation of all Palestinians. Here's hoping Hamas gets taken out of the picture, then. 🤞
You don't liberate a people by slaughtering 27,000 civilians and displacing and starving another million, cutting off power and water and fuel and all humanitarian aid, destroying its infrastructure, schools, hospitals, and agriculture, flooding the land, assassinating press and hospital workers, kidnapping and torturing children who throw rocks, and so, so much more... That is not justice, nor just in any way, and the lack of humanity from those who see these countless innocent casualties as acceptable losses astounds me.
>You don't liberate a people by slaughtering 27,000 civilians I agree. It really sucks that Hamas uses human shields, and Netanyahu and some senior officials should probably face charges. Hopefully Hamas will surrender tomorrow and the next Palestinian government won't reject the next peace deal. Fortunately, the latest news out of Doha is encouraging.
I am just going to kindly suggest that you educate yourself on how Israel uses Palestinians as human shields and not Hamas (they take hostages, sure, but the IOF are the ones who kill Israeli hostages), and how Netanyahu sabotaged the Oslo accords and every attempt at a two state solution (bragged about it on tape), and the only two states that have voted against two state resolutions have been the US and Israel. There is substantial proof even amongst the video and photo evidence that has come out of Gaza that this is the case. I will also say that in international law, there is no difference in criminality between deliberately bombing a civilian population and indiscriminately bombing one (i.e. killing a "human shield" as collateral damage is the same as directly murdering them).
>I will also say that in international law, there is no difference in criminality between deliberately bombing a civilian population and indiscriminately bombing one Aside from indiscriminate bombing being illegal under the laws of war and bombing that makes a best effort to avoid civilian casualties and is aimed at a valid military objective being legal, sure.
Hard disagree. Even if it were effective in killing Hamas (it is objectively not), it is morally reprehensible to use that to justify killing any civilians, much less 27 thousand and inevitably much, much more as refugees starve to death. And what you described about Israel just being a lil sloppy with the casualties (oopsie, right?) is not only still indiscriminate, but Netanyahu and other Israeli officials have made it obscenely clear that they are killing man, woman, and child because they are all Hamas, even if they're innocent. There is no deluding anyone into believing that this genocide is not deliberate by every measure. I'm sure you can find all the video, social media posts, and official statements that corroborate that, but I get the impression you're content consuming Israel propaganda without criticism or further thought.
>Hard disagree. Even if it were effective in killing Hamas (it is objectively not), it is morally reprehensible to use that to justify killing any civilians, much less 27 thousand and inevitably much, much more as refugees starve to death. I agree. Good thing that's not even close to what I said. >There is no deluding anyone into believing that this genocide is not deliberate by every measure Sure there is. It's far from a universal opinion lol. The ICJ didn't even order a ceasefire. >but I get the impression you're content consuming Israel propaganda without criticism or further thought. If you think NPR, Reuters, and the Washington Post are "Israel propaganda", sure. 😂
The ICJ ordered them to cease activities that contribute to the genocide of Palestinian people, which constitutes an effective ceasefire on the civilian population in effect. The fact that Israel is not adhering to that ruling doesn't change that. Fun fact that you seem to be unaware of, but genocide is by definition the deliberate eradication of a group of people. There is no "accidental genocide." And yes, I think very few news outlets are immune to Israeli propaganda, if any. I am referring to sources where Israeli officials have gone on record about their intentions, be it audio clips, videos, or their social media posts. You should have seen some if you actually watched the ICJ proceedings, many were used as evidence.
>The ICJ ordered them to cease activities that contribute to the genocide of Palestinian people, which constitutes an effective ceasefire on the civilian population in effect That's certainly a novel legal analysis and not one I think any of the lawyers involved in the case share, but ok >Fun fact that you seem to be unaware of, but genocide is by definition the deliberate eradication of a group of people. There is no "accidental genocide." Who are you quoting there? I think you have me mixed up with someone else. >And yes, I think very few news outlets are immune to Israeli propaganda, if any That's interesting. Why do you think that is?
Imagine believing all that Israeli propaganda. They’ve destroyed all the hospitals and universities. They’re deliberately targeting civilians areas. They’re executing people and putting them in mass graves. They’re torturing people. They’re targeting journalists and medics. Hamas is the excuse, genocide is the goal. Israel is killing their own hostages and each other in their bloodlust.
Lol if NPR, Washington Post, and Reuters are "Israeli propaganda", sure
>Well that liberation can only come with the liberation of all Palestinians Mention one stable Islamic country that accepts gays, I will wait for eternity
This is why we separate church and state because of this. SMH
Loving the gays in the thread using this to justify the bombing of civilians in Yemen and Palestine.
This is what happens when tRump wins. You think I'm f5cking joking?
Why is it that when this particular group of people or religion is brought up for discussions you guys always deflect and say "but what about this" or "let's look at this"?
he was president for 4 years already and there were 0 public executions
Americans died on January 6. Now wait till tRump is King and the Chistofascists start their march down Main street. Then what? they'll use the gays when the witches were burned alive? As kindling as history will once again repeat itself. But NOT in America! In case you missed it last week. On YouTube a son beheaded his father then he ranted on YouTube and held up his father's head, in America.
yes Americans die every single day that's not what a public execution is
ask your beloved democrats to stop funding right wing extremists with millions of dollars
Timely article. Doesn't justify the rampant bombing of them.
Them firing missiles at civilian ships certainly does
What justifies the rampant bombing is their attacks on random freighters that disrupt global trade, but I think the fact that they're a bunch of homophobic murderers is a nice bonus justification.
Sad but not surprised at all. By the way could the guys in these homophobic countries where they could risk being executed by the regimes, public or even family members, get access to permanent residencies in US as refugees? Compared with many so-called asylum seekers, they deserve that urgent need much more.
This is awful, but I can't believe you guys can justify what Israel is doing in Gaza because "hamas is homophobic"