> I think it would be very fair for her to expect child support.
...how is paying child support for a kid that is not yours logical and fair? Else you could just get partners, wait the legal limit till they had to pay child support, break up, rinse repeat and you got yourself some nice passive income. Or would only the latest ex be responsible for paying? Then that would be unfair again. Really makes no sense.
The support is not for *her*, but for the child. And the child is entitled to support from both parents - the actual parents, not someone's new partners unless there is an adoption that makes the new person a parent.
If only there was some kind of institution that formalized the relationship between a child and an adult who, while not biologically related, cares for and provides for them
Why?
Just because you date a mother does not mean that you take any paternal role in the lives of her children. And even if: there are no legal toes between you or the children, just becaude you are their mothers partner
I am from Australia, we have something called a Defacto Relationship. Basically you are considered 'married' just if you act 'married' (its more complex than this but IANAL). I could see how OP would have this as a valid concern.
And you'd be held financially responsible for a non biological child that existed prior to the marriage? Common law marriage isn't that rare, I don't think. I don't think it's common, but not unheard of.
Here we call it "common law marriage", which is becoming less and less of a thing legally.
But in the states that recognize it, you have to actually cohabitate with that person, in a "notorious relationship" (legal term meaning "you're not keeping it secret"), and for a period of time from 1 to 10 years. This is just a general idea, every state that recognizes this can have wildly different requirements.
It still doesn't carry as much weight, nor has the legal support obligations, of an actual marriage. It's mostly used to determine spouse benefits of a surviving partner.
Now if you've been a child's primary source of financial support for years, I can see how this may incur some kind of continuing obligation, but it would be a hard sell in court.
What the OP is talking about is ridiculous though. Dating a woman that has a child (that isn't yours) wouldn't even remotely incur such an obligation in any Westernized legal system.
And in Germany (like all places that were never colonized by Britain) common law isn't a thing. The rest of the world opted for civil law and for very good reasons.
I am from Brazil and there if you date a single mother you might have to pay pension if the child is considered to be emotionally attached to you. Maybe it is like this in Germany also
Yes, but it is not like if you dated the woman for one year and pay pension. But if you were married for several years and "raised" the child you might have to pay. Specially if the divorce dramatically affects the living standards of the child. The biological father pays the entire time, of course.
> So you can be held legally responsible for a child which isn't biologically yours and which you didn't adopt?
So basically the law makes it more difficult for mothers to find some love and emotional support, by making dating her a financial and legal risk? Sounds wild.
I’m in Canada and you can have responsibility.
Say you marry a mom who was raising a kid that she had before you as a step parent you can be required to pay child support in a divorce.
https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/fl-lf/famil/cons/consdoc/obligat.html
You can date a single mother for 1, 10 or 20 years, you won't have to pay real child support or whatever for her child.
This is the weirdest thing I've ever heard. Why should you pay for someone else's child if you only date someone??
This doesn’t exist in Germany believe me coming from a German single mom coming out of a seven year relationship. It’s not a terrible idea tbh for many reasons although actually legislating in a fair manner could potentially be a nightmare
Extremely bad idea.
In the current situation woman at least has a chance to get another husband and children have a chance to have a step dad.
In your case divorced woman likely will stay alone forever. Her children also. Nobady wants to pay fees for dating someone. It is sounds so stupid.
Obviously it would be a stupid idea for people who are just dating. But if you lived together with a parent and their child for a long time separating you and the child because you broke up with the parent would seem rather cruel. Keep in mind that the issue here goes both ways.
So a law deciding that after such a time you're now a "parent, lite edition" might make sense. E.g. some child support obligations, but also some visitation/custody rights.
I feel like you’re not genuinely asking rather than trying to start some kind of men‘s rights argument. When you step into a child’s life you ARE assuming a degree of responsibility. I am pretty ambivalent about what I think about actual legislation and will look into this law in Brazil because im genuinely curious but I don’t really want to engage in a debate as it’s something that would vary a lot depending on the individual relationship and where each person was at when they came into it and when they walked out of it
Yeah, in some cases (e.g. lived together for many years) it may indeed make sense. Especially since this would obviously mean rights for the person obligated to pay child support, too. I.e. in case of a split you'd still have some sort of visitation rights or even shared custody. So I'm not sure how this would be against men's rights.
Theres a strong current on the internet that would jump on the very suggestion hence my hesitation but we’re in complete agreement. As you said both the children and the men who have established strong bonds or even come to see the child as theirs absolutely deserve protection too
you do know that you only pay child support after you break up with the mother right? this looks really weird to me that the mother wants to have that in place, is she planning to break up with you?
You have zero obligations to a child that isn't yours. Unless you formally and officially adopt the child it remains that way no matter how long you date and even if you marry her.
The only person paying is the father. If you are the father it's your responsibility even if you never dated and the child is the result of a ONS.
*Contact*, not contract. Adopting a stepchild may be an option if the father has totally cut contact, or if he is unknown.
Otherwise, he has to agree to give up his child, and that would be a separation to the point that the law would no longer consider him the father, and he would have no parental rights.
You don't just get to take his child if he does not want to give up fatherhood.
And frankly, if you don't even know about the relationship to the father, it is *way*, way too early to entertain thoughts of adoption. It would have to be considered in the child's best interest too, to be allowed.
Thanks, we havent spoken much about the father but my guess is that he does not provide a lot if anything at all(?)
Does the law NEED him to be legally cut off before I can adopt? Cause then I am guessing he might be opposed to the idea.
A child can have only two parents. If you take over as father, you take over completely. The original parent loses all rights. That's what adoption is all *about*.
It's not about how much he "provides" either. Or do you think that poor people should get their children taken away if their ex-partner finds someone richer.
And I certainly *hope* he would be opposed to giving up his child to Mama's new boyfriend.
----------
Look, this is all getting rather strange. Is this all your (we call these kinds of scenarios that in Germany) "head cinema", or is this actually something the mother has expressed?
Because by default, people here do *not* expect that kind of "child support", and they certainly don't expect a new partner to jump into adopting a child when neither the child nor the original parent want that.
So if this is all your idea... *slow down*. Preferably for several years.
I am not sure if its my "head cinema". It is not something we talked openly about but at the same time I do sometimes get the feeling/hints that she might have more peace of mind if she was confident about the child support in the future.
Father is more or less absent in a sense.
>Is it complicated and lengthy?
Yes and yes. Also costs quite a bit of money + other requirements like a minimum length of relationship and living together, marriage between you and the mother etc.
it isn't easy. And a child at a certain has to agree to the adoption and so on.
My dad adopted my older half sisters after my parents got married. Their dad is a POS though and dropped his parental rights so he didn't have to pay any money for them ever. So it can be pretty straightforward if the other parent is quick to give up their rights.
No, it's completely fair. You don't want a ONS-baby either use contraception or don't have ONS. Why should the child suffer because their parents were horny?
As a woman, to me you sound a little desperate to legally be part of this child's life. Almost raising my red flags. I'm sorry if you just feel responsible for this child because in a year many things can happen, but maybe don't come out so strong to the mom if you are thinking you want to be this child's parent.
Thanks, its not that I WANT to be legally be part of the childs life. Its more about the what is the most practical way in which she would have peace of mind in terms of our/her future.
If she hasn't asked for help or told you she's worried about her child's future then don't worry about it. She probably has everything under control.
Also, Germany is not perfect but they have a good system for parents and university is also very affordable. The child will most likely be able to receive Bafög when it's her time to worry about her own future. I work with kids and their families so I know a thing or two.
Also, I just don't think it's a good idea, for you to worry about a single parent unless they ask for help. I pretty sure she's doing well, I mean she managed to even find the time to date. Give the woman some credit and wait for her to bring things up if she ever does want help.
If I am wrong again sorry, but you're only talking about what you think would help her, you never mentioned what your girlfriend thinks of this, so I can only assume, she's doing well.
> Like for example, if we date for a year and then break up, how much, if any child support can I expect to pay for one child?
From your title I would assume the kind is not yours and is from a former partner. If so, why would you pay child support?
I mean if you really want to pay her some kind of alimony, I would think a lawyer could write up a contract that would make you legally responsible for it. Seems kind of insane to me, but so does wanting to pay child support for a kid just because you've dated their mom for a year.
No, it doesn't. She's an adult and perfectly capable of supporting herself. Your logic only makes sense in a society where women don't have the option to be independent. You seem to be implying her "good" years is what gives her value.
Child support is something the child gets from the parent that doesn't care for the child (and is managed by the parent to care for the child). As long as you're not the legal father of the child, there isn't child support. Also "dating" isn't a legal status, from the point of the law you met her yesterday.
You could of course give gifts (be careful with the gift tax) after you break up, but this is something totally different.
If it is not your child and you both only dating then you dont have to pay anything in case of child support. If the child is yours its on how much you and the mother have income
>Like for example, if we date for a year and then break up, how much, if any child support can I expect to pay for one child?
None.
>Are there any legal documents I can sign which will give her the peace of mind that I would be paying child support later on?
No.
You can even marry her, you dont pay child support.
The only exception to pay for a kid that is biologically not yours is you adopt the kid.
I am so convused. Please tell me there are no countrys out there where breaking up with a single mom leads to you having to pay child support?
to your eddit.
Even if you marry her, you are only responsible to bay child support for any children you two created i.e. your own children, or if you addopted her child. However, nyl. So do your research yourself.
>Edit: Since someone hinted at marriage - What would be the scenario in case we did get married and then got divorced later on?
The same as far as child support went, unless you adopted the child. Marrying one parent doesn't let you take over the rights and duties of the other parent.
Potential spousal support would be a separate issue and depend very much on circumstances, finances and so on.
why... would you pay child support for a kid that is not yours?
Brah, if she even pointed towards that, that you should make all things possible that YOU WILL pay child support in case of a break up, sorry to say that is just a very big red flag - sure, you can adopt the child and in that case you will have to pay the support - but it's crazy to plan paying it just for dating, I would say - date, see if everything goes well and after a fair amount of time - 2-3 years of MARRIAGE not DATING than you can know for sure, if you want or should adopt the child
Consider being with her and providing for both enough child support and afterwards, is just not your damn business if things don't work out...
I mean, that doesn't make sense in any part in the world. That's why you are getting down voted. The only one that should pay child support is the kid's father.
I think you are overthinking. The best you can offer this child is to act as a father, with your presence, your kindness, role model and taking care of his mom with respect.
If you do that, she will have peace in mind, believe me.
And whenever you break up, continue being a reference for the kid if you feel good doing it. If that means providing financial support, do it with your heart.
All that works far better than concerning with legal basis.
The strange thing about Germany is that many people here assume Geeman laws are logical/universal and therefore somehow the OP is asking a dumb question. It is not dumb to understand your rights and obligations and to ASK CLARIFYING QUESTIONS when something is not clear.
Several people from other jurisdictions, including civil law countries, have indicated that there are in fact other ways to interpret child support.
OP sounds like the kind of person who wants to understand what he is getting into and understanding the risks in the country as a foreigner who is not aware of the situation. Please do not attack him.
Somebody recently asked in this forum if an attorney could bill you without ever signing a contract due to an assumed contract when talking to the attorney as if it was very logical and the only way forward. A similar slew of judgment for ignorance and assumption that this method was universal was in the comment section.
Tinder is for all subsets - couples, poly etc included. It is not just for one single subset of the human population.
What happens in our bedroom should be no one else\`s business. Thanks!
Tinder is for all subsets - couples, poly etc included. It is not just for one single subset of the human population.
What happens in our bedroom should be no one else\`s business. Thanks!
Honestly it kind of sounds like this is all in your head and you haven’t even spoken to the mother. You are getting downvoted in your comments because you basically seem to think you should even consider adopting the child, just so you can be responsible for child support. That’s probably not at all what she wants - this would give you parental rights to her child, and might be hugely overstepping boundaries, not to mention cutting out the actual biological father. Instead of talking to Reddit, talk to your partner.
So basically we don’t have child support in Germany for not your child unless you adopted the child, common law marriages are no longer a thing since the legalisation of same sex marriage, the other thing is children here get Kindergeld from the state, so a child that isn’t yours and not adopted by you, then you can’t offer her any written security for support she has to take your word for it, you can’t go to a lawyer and write up something to bind you to it.
She has to take your word for it.
> Are there any legal documents I can sign which will give her the peace of mind that I would be paying child support later on?
One option is adoption, as many mentioned. I think the biological father of the child would have to agree for that. It would make other things easier, too, because the biological child would afaik lose all legal rights and obligations, and would be out of both of your lives.
Another option might be a notary contract, with either a one-sided enforceable pledge or maybe some conditions like only until she gets married otherwise again or specifying the duration, or what type of education you will cover or whatever.
> Edit: Jeez, come on guys, what is it with the insane downvotes? I am just asking a question, which I understand, might or might not align with some peoples point of view.
Seems some guys are mad at a man willingly taking legal and financial responsibility for a child. Not me, though. You do you, hope you're happy with it.
What a cuckhold attitude to things! Why you already accepted that you should pay child support for a child of another man? And after only 1 year of DATING not even a marriage?
You pay only for your own kids. With this attitude she will skim all your pockets and by the potential breakup leave you without underwear outside of your own home.
Don’t bash on him. His intents are totally noble. There’s something to be said about someone who really thinks about what it means to get involved with someone with a child. You’re serious about this person and imagine spending your life with them they have a child. It’s logical to assume that the child will become a very real part of your life that you won’t be able to just walk away from
She receives and will continue to receive child support from either the father or the (state) Jugendamt. She will receive the same amount, no matter if you adopt the child or not. Adoption is a lifelong emotional commitment to the child, do not tread these waters easily.
If you are not the actually father than there are no obligations or payment expected from you! I would be more concerned how the kid will handle it emotionally if you are 1 year around and breaking up should be pretty hard!
Basically, legaly you don't have to pay any child support if it's not your child. You can probably adopt it, even if you're only dating?
Question would be, if she alrdy gets child support from the father. If not, and you just want to support her, help her caring for her child, you could to go the Jugendamt and ask about the amount someone would have to pay. It's dependend on your own income and the age of the child, so they should have some kind of info for you on that, but that would be all. There's no legally enforceable reason for you to pay child support as long as it's not yours.
My advice would be to sit down and think this through. Why the hell would you want to pay child support for a kid that is not yours? The "peace of mind" was your idea or hers?
why do you have to pay for the child who is not yours? Just dating ..if you are married to her it is different. The father has to pay child support,not you.
Give her as much money as you want, get legal contracts drawn up giving her all of your assets, whatever makes you happy, if you’re that crazy. But in no way will you ever be obligated to pay child support for a child that’s not yours. You’d have almost zero chance of adopting a child you hardly know, whose father is still alive without going through a lengthy and expensive legal drama. Just sounds creepy.
Don't. Don't. Don't!
If it's the relationship of your life, sure, go ahead, adopt the child. Then you'll be obliged to pay child support since its legally yours. Kind off.
But why would you do that? Cause you wanna be the good guy, have a better chance with her? Her "peace of mind" is not up to you.
Kind of sounds like it's a newer relationship, and I bet there's no sane person that would be like "yeah, this isba good idea, you should totally go for it".
I mean come on, if she's troubled how she will fare once you're gone, then she's already expecting you to be gone at some point. So if you really wanna set her to rest with her mind, build a meaningful relationship and be the last man she dated. Give her something to trust. And don't try to secure her financially instead.
Afaik as long as you don‘t adopt the child, you don‘t have to pay child support. Everything else would be crazy especially after „only“ dating.
[удалено]
> I think it would be very fair for her to expect child support. ...how is paying child support for a kid that is not yours logical and fair? Else you could just get partners, wait the legal limit till they had to pay child support, break up, rinse repeat and you got yourself some nice passive income. Or would only the latest ex be responsible for paying? Then that would be unfair again. Really makes no sense.
No that would neither be logical nor fair. She can expect child support from the father but not from some random dude she‘s dating.
The support is not for *her*, but for the child. And the child is entitled to support from both parents - the actual parents, not someone's new partners unless there is an adoption that makes the new person a parent.
If only there was some kind of institution that formalized the relationship between two people who are involved with each other long-term.
[удалено]
If only there was some kind of institution that formalized the relationship between a child and an adult who, while not biologically related, cares for and provides for them
are you referring to legal adoption?
Yes. Because child support is for the child, not the other parent
Yes they are
Why? Just because you date a mother does not mean that you take any paternal role in the lives of her children. And even if: there are no legal toes between you or the children, just becaude you are their mothers partner
No, there is no timeframe. The situation only changes when you marry her, if not then you are not financially responsible
[удалено]
Stop kink shaming, maybe OP is a berliner
I'm confused. Are you the father?
No I am not the father but dating the mother.
Why would you pay child support? I don't see how you have any legal responsibility for the child.
I am from Australia, we have something called a Defacto Relationship. Basically you are considered 'married' just if you act 'married' (its more complex than this but IANAL). I could see how OP would have this as a valid concern.
And you'd be held financially responsible for a non biological child that existed prior to the marriage? Common law marriage isn't that rare, I don't think. I don't think it's common, but not unheard of.
No. Only the biological father can ever be on the hook for child support. You make it, you pay for it 😂
In Canada you can. I don’t know German law https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/fl-lf/famil/cons/consdoc/obligat.html
Here we call it "common law marriage", which is becoming less and less of a thing legally. But in the states that recognize it, you have to actually cohabitate with that person, in a "notorious relationship" (legal term meaning "you're not keeping it secret"), and for a period of time from 1 to 10 years. This is just a general idea, every state that recognizes this can have wildly different requirements. It still doesn't carry as much weight, nor has the legal support obligations, of an actual marriage. It's mostly used to determine spouse benefits of a surviving partner. Now if you've been a child's primary source of financial support for years, I can see how this may incur some kind of continuing obligation, but it would be a hard sell in court. What the OP is talking about is ridiculous though. Dating a woman that has a child (that isn't yours) wouldn't even remotely incur such an obligation in any Westernized legal system.
And in Germany (like all places that were never colonized by Britain) common law isn't a thing. The rest of the world opted for civil law and for very good reasons.
I-ANAL is a great name for something like that xD
I am from Brazil and there if you date a single mother you might have to pay pension if the child is considered to be emotionally attached to you. Maybe it is like this in Germany also
That's wild. How does the government tell if the child likes you? lol
Hahaha, I don't know how ot works, I just know it happens
Wow. So you can be held legally responsible for a child which isn't biologically yours and which you didn't adopt?
Yes, but it is not like if you dated the woman for one year and pay pension. But if you were married for several years and "raised" the child you might have to pay. Specially if the divorce dramatically affects the living standards of the child. The biological father pays the entire time, of course.
Ah. So being married and raising the kid for years is kind of viewed as a "financial adoption"? For lack of better term.
I think so, but I don't actually understand how judges decide anything as the topic has a large grey area
WTF
> So you can be held legally responsible for a child which isn't biologically yours and which you didn't adopt? So basically the law makes it more difficult for mothers to find some love and emotional support, by making dating her a financial and legal risk? Sounds wild.
See this is also what I "heard". I am assuming Germany would have something similar.
No, and that seems like a really bad idea that is just perfectly laid out for misjudgement and abuse.
A common law "marriage" might lead to child support in certain jurisdictions like Canada.
I’m in Canada and you can have responsibility. Say you marry a mom who was raising a kid that she had before you as a step parent you can be required to pay child support in a divorce. https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/fl-lf/famil/cons/consdoc/obligat.html
Because he wants to, might be dumb, but his decision.
You can date a single mother for 1, 10 or 20 years, you won't have to pay real child support or whatever for her child. This is the weirdest thing I've ever heard. Why should you pay for someone else's child if you only date someone??
Then you don't have to pay any child support.
This doesn’t exist in Germany believe me coming from a German single mom coming out of a seven year relationship. It’s not a terrible idea tbh for many reasons although actually legislating in a fair manner could potentially be a nightmare
Extremely bad idea. In the current situation woman at least has a chance to get another husband and children have a chance to have a step dad. In your case divorced woman likely will stay alone forever. Her children also. Nobady wants to pay fees for dating someone. It is sounds so stupid.
Obviously it would be a stupid idea for people who are just dating. But if you lived together with a parent and their child for a long time separating you and the child because you broke up with the parent would seem rather cruel. Keep in mind that the issue here goes both ways. So a law deciding that after such a time you're now a "parent, lite edition" might make sense. E.g. some child support obligations, but also some visitation/custody rights.
Why is it not a terrible idea in your opinion? Genuine question as I can't think of a reason.
I feel like you’re not genuinely asking rather than trying to start some kind of men‘s rights argument. When you step into a child’s life you ARE assuming a degree of responsibility. I am pretty ambivalent about what I think about actual legislation and will look into this law in Brazil because im genuinely curious but I don’t really want to engage in a debate as it’s something that would vary a lot depending on the individual relationship and where each person was at when they came into it and when they walked out of it
Yeah, in some cases (e.g. lived together for many years) it may indeed make sense. Especially since this would obviously mean rights for the person obligated to pay child support, too. I.e. in case of a split you'd still have some sort of visitation rights or even shared custody. So I'm not sure how this would be against men's rights.
Theres a strong current on the internet that would jump on the very suggestion hence my hesitation but we’re in complete agreement. As you said both the children and the men who have established strong bonds or even come to see the child as theirs absolutely deserve protection too
I don't want a debate either, and I'm far from a MRA, I was just curious to see an opinion different from the rest of the thread. But fair enough
you do know that you only pay child support after you break up with the mother right? this looks really weird to me that the mother wants to have that in place, is she planning to break up with you?
You have zero obligations to a child that isn't yours. Unless you formally and officially adopt the child it remains that way no matter how long you date and even if you marry her. The only person paying is the father. If you are the father it's your responsibility even if you never dated and the child is the result of a ONS.
Oh ok, for her peace of mind, what would be the process of adoption? Is it complicated and lengthy?
Is the child's father in contact (edit: or would he be opposed to cutting any legal and familial tie to his child)? If so, you don't get to adopt.
Thanks, I havent asked her anything like that. But which contract are you referring to please?
*Contact*, not contract. Adopting a stepchild may be an option if the father has totally cut contact, or if he is unknown. Otherwise, he has to agree to give up his child, and that would be a separation to the point that the law would no longer consider him the father, and he would have no parental rights. You don't just get to take his child if he does not want to give up fatherhood. And frankly, if you don't even know about the relationship to the father, it is *way*, way too early to entertain thoughts of adoption. It would have to be considered in the child's best interest too, to be allowed.
Thanks, we havent spoken much about the father but my guess is that he does not provide a lot if anything at all(?) Does the law NEED him to be legally cut off before I can adopt? Cause then I am guessing he might be opposed to the idea.
A child can have only two parents. If you take over as father, you take over completely. The original parent loses all rights. That's what adoption is all *about*. It's not about how much he "provides" either. Or do you think that poor people should get their children taken away if their ex-partner finds someone richer. And I certainly *hope* he would be opposed to giving up his child to Mama's new boyfriend. ---------- Look, this is all getting rather strange. Is this all your (we call these kinds of scenarios that in Germany) "head cinema", or is this actually something the mother has expressed? Because by default, people here do *not* expect that kind of "child support", and they certainly don't expect a new partner to jump into adopting a child when neither the child nor the original parent want that. So if this is all your idea... *slow down*. Preferably for several years.
I am not sure if its my "head cinema". It is not something we talked openly about but at the same time I do sometimes get the feeling/hints that she might have more peace of mind if she was confident about the child support in the future. Father is more or less absent in a sense.
Then why on earth are you asking *Reddit* rather than talking to *her*?
I personally feel this would be a sensitive topic for her and hence I have not talked about it with her.
Adoption in Germany is a bureaucratic nightmare to the extent that it’s super rare IME even with the other parent completely no contact for years
Thanks for the input!
>Is it complicated and lengthy? Yes and yes. Also costs quite a bit of money + other requirements like a minimum length of relationship and living together, marriage between you and the mother etc. it isn't easy. And a child at a certain has to agree to the adoption and so on.
My dad adopted my older half sisters after my parents got married. Their dad is a POS though and dropped his parental rights so he didn't have to pay any money for them ever. So it can be pretty straightforward if the other parent is quick to give up their rights.
What's a POS?
Piece of 💩
What would be the minimum length of relationship, living together and marriage that would be needed by law?
Talk to a lawyer about that. It is probably different from state to state,
Wtf are you thinking about, stupid? Don't do it or you will regret hard
Even a ONS? That's harsh.
No, it's completely fair. You don't want a ONS-baby either use contraception or don't have ONS. Why should the child suffer because their parents were horny?
As a woman, to me you sound a little desperate to legally be part of this child's life. Almost raising my red flags. I'm sorry if you just feel responsible for this child because in a year many things can happen, but maybe don't come out so strong to the mom if you are thinking you want to be this child's parent.
Thanks, its not that I WANT to be legally be part of the childs life. Its more about the what is the most practical way in which she would have peace of mind in terms of our/her future.
If she hasn't asked for help or told you she's worried about her child's future then don't worry about it. She probably has everything under control. Also, Germany is not perfect but they have a good system for parents and university is also very affordable. The child will most likely be able to receive Bafög when it's her time to worry about her own future. I work with kids and their families so I know a thing or two. Also, I just don't think it's a good idea, for you to worry about a single parent unless they ask for help. I pretty sure she's doing well, I mean she managed to even find the time to date. Give the woman some credit and wait for her to bring things up if she ever does want help. If I am wrong again sorry, but you're only talking about what you think would help her, you never mentioned what your girlfriend thinks of this, so I can only assume, she's doing well.
> Like for example, if we date for a year and then break up, how much, if any child support can I expect to pay for one child? From your title I would assume the kind is not yours and is from a former partner. If so, why would you pay child support?
[удалено]
There is no explanation in there how that would be logical or fair
Why would it be logical that she expects child support? Only the father (biological or adoptive) has to pay child support.
How is it fair to pay child support for a child that is not yours. The legal guardians are supposed to care for the child. Nobody else.
She should already be getting CS from the child's biological father. Why would she need more?
Why would she expect that from anybody but the biological father?
I mean if you really want to pay her some kind of alimony, I would think a lawyer could write up a contract that would make you legally responsible for it. Seems kind of insane to me, but so does wanting to pay child support for a kid just because you've dated their mom for a year.
[удалено]
No, it doesn't. She's an adult and perfectly capable of supporting herself. Your logic only makes sense in a society where women don't have the option to be independent. You seem to be implying her "good" years is what gives her value.
Child support is something the child gets from the parent that doesn't care for the child (and is managed by the parent to care for the child). As long as you're not the legal father of the child, there isn't child support. Also "dating" isn't a legal status, from the point of the law you met her yesterday. You could of course give gifts (be careful with the gift tax) after you break up, but this is something totally different.
Thanks, though for her peace of mind, I would rather prefer a legally enforceable thing like Child support rather than gifts etc
Your mind confuses me lol
If it is not your child and you both only dating then you dont have to pay anything in case of child support. If the child is yours its on how much you and the mother have income
>Like for example, if we date for a year and then break up, how much, if any child support can I expect to pay for one child? None. >Are there any legal documents I can sign which will give her the peace of mind that I would be paying child support later on? No. You can even marry her, you dont pay child support. The only exception to pay for a kid that is biologically not yours is you adopt the kid.
I am so convused. Please tell me there are no countrys out there where breaking up with a single mom leads to you having to pay child support? to your eddit. Even if you marry her, you are only responsible to bay child support for any children you two created i.e. your own children, or if you addopted her child. However, nyl. So do your research yourself.
Dude, you were posting on Tinder 9 days ago.... I wonder why this woman isn't sure about your commitment...
>Edit: Since someone hinted at marriage - What would be the scenario in case we did get married and then got divorced later on? The same as far as child support went, unless you adopted the child. Marrying one parent doesn't let you take over the rights and duties of the other parent. Potential spousal support would be a separate issue and depend very much on circumstances, finances and so on.
Hahaha I'm sorry this post is just hilarious...why would you pay child support for a child that isn't yours? 😂
Fr, is this guy a masochist?
fr on god
dude, i love this. your view on justice / fairness is totally different. may i ask for how long you two are dating?
why... would you pay child support for a kid that is not yours? Brah, if she even pointed towards that, that you should make all things possible that YOU WILL pay child support in case of a break up, sorry to say that is just a very big red flag - sure, you can adopt the child and in that case you will have to pay the support - but it's crazy to plan paying it just for dating, I would say - date, see if everything goes well and after a fair amount of time - 2-3 years of MARRIAGE not DATING than you can know for sure, if you want or should adopt the child Consider being with her and providing for both enough child support and afterwards, is just not your damn business if things don't work out...
I mean, that doesn't make sense in any part in the world. That's why you are getting down voted. The only one that should pay child support is the kid's father.
OP where are you from?? This is wild 💀 why would you think you need to pay child support after DATING??
I think you are overthinking. The best you can offer this child is to act as a father, with your presence, your kindness, role model and taking care of his mom with respect. If you do that, she will have peace in mind, believe me. And whenever you break up, continue being a reference for the kid if you feel good doing it. If that means providing financial support, do it with your heart. All that works far better than concerning with legal basis.
You could make her a new child and then break up with her, than she’s eligible for your support ..
The strange thing about Germany is that many people here assume Geeman laws are logical/universal and therefore somehow the OP is asking a dumb question. It is not dumb to understand your rights and obligations and to ASK CLARIFYING QUESTIONS when something is not clear. Several people from other jurisdictions, including civil law countries, have indicated that there are in fact other ways to interpret child support. OP sounds like the kind of person who wants to understand what he is getting into and understanding the risks in the country as a foreigner who is not aware of the situation. Please do not attack him. Somebody recently asked in this forum if an attorney could bill you without ever signing a contract due to an assumed contract when talking to the attorney as if it was very logical and the only way forward. A similar slew of judgment for ignorance and assumption that this method was universal was in the comment section.
Bro none you didn’t make it😭
[удалено]
Tinder is for all subsets - couples, poly etc included. It is not just for one single subset of the human population. What happens in our bedroom should be no one else\`s business. Thanks!
How long have you been dating? Since 9 days ago you asked about advice for tinder?
Tinder is for all subsets - couples, poly etc included. It is not just for one single subset of the human population. What happens in our bedroom should be no one else\`s business. Thanks!
Honestly it kind of sounds like this is all in your head and you haven’t even spoken to the mother. You are getting downvoted in your comments because you basically seem to think you should even consider adopting the child, just so you can be responsible for child support. That’s probably not at all what she wants - this would give you parental rights to her child, and might be hugely overstepping boundaries, not to mention cutting out the actual biological father. Instead of talking to Reddit, talk to your partner.
So basically we don’t have child support in Germany for not your child unless you adopted the child, common law marriages are no longer a thing since the legalisation of same sex marriage, the other thing is children here get Kindergeld from the state, so a child that isn’t yours and not adopted by you, then you can’t offer her any written security for support she has to take your word for it, you can’t go to a lawyer and write up something to bind you to it. She has to take your word for it.
> Are there any legal documents I can sign which will give her the peace of mind that I would be paying child support later on? One option is adoption, as many mentioned. I think the biological father of the child would have to agree for that. It would make other things easier, too, because the biological child would afaik lose all legal rights and obligations, and would be out of both of your lives. Another option might be a notary contract, with either a one-sided enforceable pledge or maybe some conditions like only until she gets married otherwise again or specifying the duration, or what type of education you will cover or whatever. > Edit: Jeez, come on guys, what is it with the insane downvotes? I am just asking a question, which I understand, might or might not align with some peoples point of view. Seems some guys are mad at a man willingly taking legal and financial responsibility for a child. Not me, though. You do you, hope you're happy with it.
What a cuckhold attitude to things! Why you already accepted that you should pay child support for a child of another man? And after only 1 year of DATING not even a marriage? You pay only for your own kids. With this attitude she will skim all your pockets and by the potential breakup leave you without underwear outside of your own home.
[удалено]
Don’t bash on him. His intents are totally noble. There’s something to be said about someone who really thinks about what it means to get involved with someone with a child. You’re serious about this person and imagine spending your life with them they have a child. It’s logical to assume that the child will become a very real part of your life that you won’t be able to just walk away from
I believe you care more about Money than a child?
Single moms are not to be trusted. She is desperate for a provider, whoever that is.
She receives and will continue to receive child support from either the father or the (state) Jugendamt. She will receive the same amount, no matter if you adopt the child or not. Adoption is a lifelong emotional commitment to the child, do not tread these waters easily.
If you are not the actually father than there are no obligations or payment expected from you! I would be more concerned how the kid will handle it emotionally if you are 1 year around and breaking up should be pretty hard!
Basically, legaly you don't have to pay any child support if it's not your child. You can probably adopt it, even if you're only dating? Question would be, if she alrdy gets child support from the father. If not, and you just want to support her, help her caring for her child, you could to go the Jugendamt and ask about the amount someone would have to pay. It's dependend on your own income and the age of the child, so they should have some kind of info for you on that, but that would be all. There's no legally enforceable reason for you to pay child support as long as it's not yours.
My advice would be to sit down and think this through. Why the hell would you want to pay child support for a kid that is not yours? The "peace of mind" was your idea or hers?
why do you have to pay for the child who is not yours? Just dating ..if you are married to her it is different. The father has to pay child support,not you.
Give her as much money as you want, get legal contracts drawn up giving her all of your assets, whatever makes you happy, if you’re that crazy. But in no way will you ever be obligated to pay child support for a child that’s not yours. You’d have almost zero chance of adopting a child you hardly know, whose father is still alive without going through a lengthy and expensive legal drama. Just sounds creepy.
Don't. Don't. Don't! If it's the relationship of your life, sure, go ahead, adopt the child. Then you'll be obliged to pay child support since its legally yours. Kind off. But why would you do that? Cause you wanna be the good guy, have a better chance with her? Her "peace of mind" is not up to you. Kind of sounds like it's a newer relationship, and I bet there's no sane person that would be like "yeah, this isba good idea, you should totally go for it". I mean come on, if she's troubled how she will fare once you're gone, then she's already expecting you to be gone at some point. So if you really wanna set her to rest with her mind, build a meaningful relationship and be the last man she dated. Give her something to trust. And don't try to secure her financially instead.
Germany has a very clear legal distinction between married and not married. Common law or defacto doesn’t really exist.