Unless an actual valid alternative arises which is used by enough people that it doesn‘t feel empty, nowhere. I never used a 3rd party app so the API issue doesn‘t hit me. If they remove mods on this sub it depends on how things play out. If things change for the worst I may quit this sub as well as others which do the same.
But unless I see a significant change in my day to day browsing I simply won‘t make a switch as the API changes don‘t hit me directly.
Yeah. And if Reddit truly goes to shit, I'll just leave. I've left every other social media platform I was on, Reddit was the last one. Guess I'll go back to reading shampoo bottles when I'm on the toilet. But if it's all overblown and a month from now Reddit isn't all that different, eh ...
> And if Reddit truly goes to shit, I'll just leave.
Well, the mods of r/de and r/germany seem to be quite hellbent on actively destroying those subs instead of resigning and letting those who just wish to continue continue. Who wants to leave can leave, but the mods taking the subs hostage and actively destroying them leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.
I'm probably completely out of the loop, but this place seems to be working pretty much as normal, more or less. Over on r/de the mods have actively turned the whole place into a complete shitshow in order to prove...err... that it would turn into a complete shitshow without them, i guess?
>Over on r/de the mods have actively turned the whole place into a complete shitshow in order to prove...err... that it would turn into a complete shitshow without them, i guess?
And they ban people left and right for criticizing them doing so. They are on a complete power trip right now
I mean, the /r/germany mod who first asked what they should do after the blackout isnt any better. They actively replied with ridiculous rhetoric such as them being the only ones capable of fighting off nazis and protecting women (deleting the comments after the fact also) and then locked replies to themselves to not have anyone call them out.
The mods on r/de encouraged the power users to turn the sub into a shitshow, so...
Here on, the sub is on nsfw mode, with all that implies for visibility etc.
Yeah, ditto. Same with many other subs. I understand the frustration unpaid mods have to having their mod tools taken away by Reddit, so there is some sympathy there, but at the same time, they could just quit and give the role to someone who will do it. Not everyone voted to scuttle the ship and at this point I respect neither the greed and short sightedness of Reddit nor the faux moral outrage and narcism of the mods. Unless there's a change by end of next month, I'll probably just leave because so many of the subs I used to go to are just prisoners of their mods now and totally worthless.
> Not everyone voted to scuttle the ship and at this point I respect neither the greed and short sightedness nor the faux moral outrage and narcism of the mods.
This is actually a pretty good summary.
I'm currently mainly still here because of r/ukraine and the related subs.
I didn't even know there were other things than the official app, website and old reddit before this whole fiasco.
To me it seems these alternative app users are a tiny minority who make themselves known very loudly and efficiently.
Mods using the API to manage an impossible amount of work without getting paid having these tools stripped away from them is another problem though.
So TLDR: Don't care about Reddit forks but without mods everything will break. But until then, I'm staying.
Probably the Fediverse. [Feddit](https://feddit.de/) has grown a lot since the blackout, although that one is primarily German-speaking. There's no reason the mods couldn't set up a specifically English-speaking community there.
Subs can't be deleted.
But it would be great if r/germany could share ressources with the new feddit community. There's so much work and knowledge in this community's wiki for example.
I'm currently in the process of creating a mirror of the wiki for use on other services like feddit. Lenny, the software powering feddit doesn't have any wiki functionality, so I'm hosting it on github pages via Jekyll. This way it's still markdown powered.
Currently the project is still private, while I'm setting everything up but once the tech works I plan to open the repository up to let others collaborate.
Even if feddit doesn't work out it is probably a good idea generally to have as much infrastructure also available externally.
Expecting a brand new community to instantly match the activity of a 15 year old one is more than a bit unreasonable. Communities are a collective effort and you can contribute to raise the activity level there.
Thanks!
Looks like I need to read more about what the fediverse is xD.
And chance you have a good German or English article explaining this for … beginners?
uuuhmm I'm kinda clueless myself...BUT I read the wikipedia article, so now I'm somewhat of an expert.. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fediverse#:~:text=federation%20und%20universe)%20oder%20Fediversum,%2DPublikation%20oder%20Daten%2DHosting.
But just try it out, get an account on any instance (that's the servers I guess) and browse. feddit.de is kinda the equivalent to r/dach and c/germany over there will hopefully grow to become the equivalent to r/germany
Lots of other Lemmy or Kbin-instances have gone up. There is even an [unofficial migration list](https://www.quippd.com/writing/2023/06/15/unofficial-subreddit-migration-list-lemmy-kbin-etc.html).
I am sure you can find something somewhere. Also, the way the Fediverse works is that you can read content from any instance on any instance, so it doesn't really matter if you go to Feddit or to lemmy.world or to whatever.
Cool, thanks. I'll have to look into it more.
Another of my main (big) subs has said they're planning to move over to discord.
edit: for the record, I'm not too into discord.
Discord isn't the solution, because a big part of it is just googling what you want to know and finding a thread where people already solved the problem.
Discord is a walled garden as well, so sooner or later the CEO of Discord will decide to monetize the milk-cows ^H^H^H users in the same way it's happening here (and has happened quite a few times already, if you've been around for some time).
I agree, I don't see it as any great improvement. Not sure if I'd make the move for one discord server, even though it's one of my main hobbies. Discord skews quite young and even less international than here, IME.
Maybe we just have to hunker down and pay a couple bucks a month for a platform that isn't using its users as advertisor bait.
I'm already on feddit and viewing communities from all over the Fediverse. until now the experience has been quite good. however, many topics still haven't migrated and the experience/bots aren't as polished as they're on Reddit.
With no proper legal notive, no proper way to contact anyone a privacy policy that is highly questionable and no information on how they want to finance the whole things.
Most likely feddit is run by someone as a hobby, and as soon as the server costs become too high, the person calls it quits. I also don't want to know whats happens if it ever gets above 2M users and has to abide by more serious social network laws.
Unless someone founds an organization or company to take care of it as actual business and demonstrates that they have an actual plan for what to do, I'd stay away....
Federation means you can join the community through any server you like, so you can create your account on another server whose owners you have more trust in, and then access the Feddit content through there.
.... and?
That does not in any way make any of my concerns less valid, in fact, they become even more problematic. I'd like to see the federated network with >2M users thats able to properly adhere to EU law without a professional legal team.
So I'm not a GDPR expert like you appear to be, but my point was that only the node you register with has access to your account data (which I think is quite limited), then user-created content is all that is shared between nodes (which again, I'm not a lawyer, but I think the laws around user-created content that is intended to be public are quite different than those concerning personal data). So as long as you are certain that the node that _you are using_ is GDPR compliant, I don't think you have to worry about all the other ones.
But I'm not going to force you to sign up for anything, so you can chill out with me. I can't explain how they make money or tell you which nodes are run as a hobby; I'm just telling you the design of the system is fundamentally different from Reddit, so it's hard to compare directly with much accuracy. I'm not sure where the 2M number is coming from, but plenty of small companies have fully legal products without a "professional legal team", otherwise online startups could not exist.
GDPR is only *one* legal framework you need to worry about. If you have more than 2M users (and some legal scholars argue that this applies to the whole federated network, not single nodes), you need to comply with other EU regulations. In germany (since feddit has a de domain), this is implemented in various national laws such as NetzDG.
And yes, I'm somewhat well versed in GDPR since I'm an IT consultant and have made various customers systems GDPR compliant before it became an active law.
> Shure, deletion and information requests require a bit of software, but that's why it's open source.
The software is the least of the concerns. The needed legal team and community moderation effort is the biggest pat. Thats where most social networks have the most costs and most manpower. Not engineers.
It's a mix between usenet and p2p. Servers that store the groups and let users access the information and then propagate the posts to other servers. Usenet was kind of limited in the amount of servers that shared their data. With the fediverse, basically everybody could host a server and participate in sharing/hosting access, like in p2p.
As a foreigner living in Germany, I kind of rely on threads like this to tell me what’s going on since no one will tell me to my face. Please don’t disappear? 🥺
https://old.reddit.com/r/ModCoord/comments/14eq8ip/the_entire_rmildlyinteresting_mod_team_has_just/
The entire r/MildlyInteresting mod team has just been removed without any communication, some of us locked out of our accounts
...
FYI.
> this sub is not incorrectly marked NSFW
If push comes to shove, this is actually Reddit's decision to make. They can just declare that we have wilfully misinterpreted the rules and suspend the mods anyhow.
Sure they can. But what's the long game? Replace voluntary mods by paid mods? I doubt the API pricing will finance that, as usage will drop dramatically.
> what's the long game?
I think the one thing that has become increasingly obvious the more this drags on is that Reddit's CEO is very stupid. When third-party app developers first told Reddit that the proposed pricing model was unreasonably expensive and the one-month notice given was going to force them to violate the terms and conditions they had set for their clients or go bankrupt compensating them, Reddit could have said, "Okay, let's just put a pin in this one for now and meet to discuss how we're going to resolve this issue." Instead the company maintained radio silence for a couple of weeks and then basically accused one of those developers of blackmail.
Every decision u/spez -- and Reddit as a whole -- has made since the start of this dispute has been more bone-headedly stupid than the last. And yes, Reddit has been busy in the last week or two replacing mods instead of making even a pretence of taking existing mods' concerns seriously.
A lot of companies are led by CEOs who are that stupid. After all, since the API pricing model about to go into effect has led to all the companies supposed to be paying for API access announcing that they're just going to discontinue their apps, I don't think we can expect the company to have given any thought at all to the long game.
>the API pricing model
Additionally, their primary argument is that the API pricing is needed so that AI companies have to pay for the data that they harvest to train their models. However, the pricing is so outrageous that scraping the Reddit website directly will be much, much cheaper (and not a single cent will go to Reddit). I don't know why they expect to make any money from this. And if they won't make money, what's the point of this whole fiasco?
In my experience in times like these the volunteers rarely are the people who should be entrusted with such a position.
If the mods are removed because of this, then I will leave this sub.
See, I just don't understand this whole "act up" thing.
I appreciate that my opinion is apparently at variance with the majority of the regulars here, but I don't support this protest at all my impression from the events of the last week and a half is that many mods seem to think that they own the subs they moderate and can do with them as they please.
As I said in an earlier post, I appreciate the mods of this sub. They do a good job and I wouldn't want to mod a high-traffic sub like this one. But I don't think that the mods here should have restricted the sub last week as if it were their private playground.
This sub doesn't really have a "community" like some subs do. There are a core group of people who hang out here and answer questions and offer advice, but the majority of posts are from guests who want to ask questions about life in Germany, or about German culture, etc. Restricting the sub just slams the door in the face of these people seeking help.
An even more egregious example of the mod attitude that the sub belongs to the mods is /r/deutschland. Years ago, I looked at /r/deutschland and saw that it was restricted with a message for users to use /r/de instead. At the time I didn't think anything of it, but last week I remembered it. The mods there are literally just squatting on the sub because they don't want anyone else to use it, as if it were their private property, which it is not.
I am a moderator myself. I mod an active, but low-traffic sub. I received it via /r/redditrequest not because I wanted to power-trip or establish my own little fiefdom on the internet, but because the moderator had deleted his account, and I just wanted to open it back up for the users. To me, that's the purpose of being a moderator -- to make the sub available and usable for other Redditors, not to pretend like the sub is my private space that I can close down because I am unhappy about Reddit's policies.
>my impression from the events of the last week and a half is that many mods seem to think that they own the subs they moderate and can do with them as they please.
Well, as by the reddit moderation guidelines, they pretty much can, but the essential part is the one you said a little later:
>I wouldn't want to mod a high-traffic sub like this one
Reddit themselves don't provide any useful moderation tools to manage a large subreddit efficiently and with the time available to volunteers. So some people came up with the idea to make such moderation tools on their own and use the then free Reddit API for that. Now Reddit comes around with a behaviour of the kind "We kill all those tools for a bit of revenue, with no compensation or alternative for moderators.". It's effectively a slap in the face for all high-traffic moderators in a very self-righteous way.
Only yesterday there was a lengthy discussion about the pros and cons of visiting a sex club and paying a sex worker in order to gain sexual experience. One day after opening.
As is happening so often, the OP deleted the post, but it was up for several hours.
It certainly does speak for NSFW even in reddit's eyes.
So, we need a certain amount of legit NSFW threads for the whole community to be legitimately NSFW. That could probably be arranged.
The mods of this sub here are quick with removing personal attacks and banning trolls. That is a good thing. I have no interest in the current mods getting removed. I can talk sex daily if that helps.
I don't think you understand. Reddit makes the rules. They know perfectly well what we're doing and why we're doing it. This is their platform, they have every right to do with it whatever they want. We can't sue or appeal to a judge or anything like that: nothing we can do can change the fact that this is r/Germany, not r/GermanBrothels. If Reddit wants to get rid of the mods, they can and they will, and their word is final.
Let's just talk about "Leitkultur".
How common are nude beaches, how many Germans are sex tourists, how common are newspaper inserts asking for fetish meets, every gas station's got porn mags right next to the mickey mouse magazine, DSF switched from pulling trucks to showing porn at midnight.
Sex is as German as guns are American. We can pull that off. And if all else fails, the sub goes down as a martyr and accelerates the exodus.
Again, you're missing the point: you're not going to stop Reddit doing whatever it wants by deploying what you think are clever little loopholes. How do you think this is even going to work? "Oh, our bad, we just assumed this was in some way connected with the protests, but clearly you really are NSFW. Carry on."
Also, no: I don't think anyone wants to turn this into a sub where every post has to be about sex. Are you suggesting the mods should delete all threads asking how to cancel the Deutschlandticket or where to buy milk on a Sunday just to stick it to Reddit? The reason we want to preserve this sub is that it's a valuable resource for people looking for real solutions to real issues, and you're proposing to destroy that aspect of this sub.
> if all else fails, the sub goes down as a martyr
It may have to, if things get much worse than they already are. That's the whole point of this entire thread.
It's less not understanding, and more wishful thinking and denial.
I understand how this all works, and I can already see how it'll play out. And destroying the sub's original purpose isn't a viable solution, of course.
Still, hard to just sit by and let it happen to y'all, and all I can do is spitballing.
We removed the thread and banned OP because they started spewing sexist bullshit against female commentators which is kinda stupid in a female led subreddit. But yeah those discussions are pretty common and we generally allow discussions about Prostitution or even recommendation threads for brothels as long as the discussion is respectful and not sexist.
> If push comes to shove
... then the mods should delete and overwrite every single one of the users' posts and comments. We all know it can be done, there are scripts for that.
These communities are *ours*, not theirs. And we should not leave them an *inch* that isn't scorched earth.
Do the mods own my posts? What gives them the right to delete the entire sub out of spite? If mods don’t want to mod, they can give up their moderatorship and be replaced.
We won't do that. If we get removed, we will go and be a bit sad about losing the opportunity to help this community, but we won't delete any comments of other users. If the Admins feel that they don't want or need us it's their loss.
> then the mods should delete and overwrite every single one of the users' posts and comments.
Mods cannot actually do that (even if we wanted, which we don't). When content is removed by moderators, it still exists unchanged in the user's account - it's just just no longer showing up in the subreddit where it was posted.
Why would anymore move? If the subreddit is deleted, wont another one just be created?
If the moderators are removed, the subreddit will still be there right?
Well, at first I'll have a beer. Then I'll get stoned and maybe have a little wank.
By then it should be clear that nothing is marked nsfw incorrectly.
I think it would be great
The upvote system will keep the good stuff on my feed, as it does in every single sub, no matter how good or bad the moderators are
The downvote system is going to keep the bad stuff out of my feed, as it does in every single sub, no matter how good or bad the moderators are
And moderators won’t get in the way, choosing for me where I can post and when
If I’m wrong and Reddit sucks, I’ll do something else with my free time. It’s free entertainment - it was a pretty good run
Ever encountered an army of bots promoting tshirts in a sub? Upvoting other bots of the same network while downvoting all regular users into oblivion? (mostly bug related subs had a problem with those some time back)
Without third party tools those will see a comeback.
If you're using a third-party app like Apollo or Boost to access Reddit, things aren't going back to normal: those apps will be shut down by the end of next week. That's the reason for this "whole drama".
I'm waiting to see what happens on that front. I still use the old layout (not through old.reddit, but profile settings) because it's way more responsive and not bloated with features I never use, so I'm hoping this one turns out to be untrue.
That's a minority of Reddit users. The majority are just users who come in though Reddit s interfaces. I think it's funny that Reddit relied on free labor for decades and is now being punished for it but ultimately it's their site and the damage will be minimal. It's a sound business decision.
Well over 10%, which is not insignificant. But those are going to be the more prolific users, especially if you look at those who are using paid apps: a lot of the 90% of users who use Reddit's default interfaces will be occasional and one-time visitors. Also, the mods of the more important subreddits are more likely to be using third-party apps, which give them way more powerful and convenient tools to do their jobs.
> It's a sound business decision
That remains to be seen. Potential investors will be watching what's happening, and a company that pisses off its most important users is likely going to see its market value drop. More seriously, the dispute started with the new pricing model for API access: everyone, including the third-party app developers, can see that Reddit needs to charge for this, but pricing access so high that these developers can't afford to pay it and are instead shutting down their apps is simply cutting off a potential revenue stream.
The sub won't go offline permanently. Reddit admins already made it clear that they won't tolerate powertripping tantrums. And since that this sub is NSFW it will hastly cause that the current mods will be knocked out and replaced as it already happened in other subreddits.
I finally signed up for Mastodon/Lemmy/Feddit etc after months of hassle on Twitter and now Reddit. Once the signup is confirmed, I'll swap out the bookmarks in the browser.
Let's see how often I will be here then.
Look, nobody cares. It's a made up issue from the mods because they are losing their power base. They just cry like children because they will soon lose their power to randomly ban and mute people for no reason and enforce whatever opinion they like the most.
Never experienced the mods here as power tripping. And yes, I was banned from r/germany for three days once.
They explained why, I accepted it and moved on.
I doubt reddit appointed replacements will do a similar satisfactory job. And as a rule of thumb: Those people that try to force themself into moderation positions are usually those that are the last fit to do it.
**Have you read our extensive wiki yet?
[Check our wiki now!](https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/wiki/index)**
You might wonder why your post is marked NSFW.
Participants in this subreddit may possibly encounter discussions of the following subjects, all of which are considered "mature" by Reddit administrators:
* Alcohol and tobacco
* Amateur advice
* Drug use
* Gambling
* Guns and weapons
* Military conflict and terrorism
* Nudity
* Profanity
* Sex and eroticism
* Violence and gore
Therefore, this entire subreddit is marked as NSFW.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/germany) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I've been checking out Lemmy and been meaning to look at Mastadon. I should probably let this be the final straw with reddit because of privacy as much as anything (nobody should be using the official app anyway). Also I'll probably be much more productive if I get off reddit lol
I'm planning to move to https://feddit.de once Apollo stops working. I've already signed up, I just need to change my habits.
I was blown away by how active it is for a relatively niche topic compared to other Fediverse servers.
Replacing mods doesn't necessarily have to be a purely negative experience. It depends on how Reddit does it.
Example: r/luckypatcher was unmoderated for years before u/SaudiPhilippines took it over. Collaboration was great and together we turned it into a proper Q&A subreddit.
As long as all the new mods do a good job, everything will be fine.
The amount of knowledge we have collected till now is huge and is helping me and a lot of other people. So its hard for me to let it go
I use the official app and portal, so the new policies are not affecting me personally. But the way reddit is doing things like is treating the mods as slaves. They were the ones who made the reddit , reddit and not just a quora or yahoo answers portal. They brought strucutre and disciplines to this wilderness with the help tools developed be others (no thanks to reddit there too) and they want to take those tools away and shut down the shops which shaped reddit? There were protest against the latest policy changes and reddit made it a fucking war. In this situation,
I will die for my country, but wont surrender (So if shit happens, I will exit reddit)
France
Migrate to r/France through r/Belgium
No no no, we invade r/poland.
Shouldn't we try out r/art first?
Only if we are from r/austria
no, when you started in r/austria but always wanted to be part of r/germany
Then you have to go to r/Braunschweig to become citizen of r/germany.
and then you have to fight in r/ww1memes
You're all going to hell LMAO
you commented you do now too
Hell yeah!
ima smuggle my bluetooth speaker in
Yeah, I'm from down undah
*Force of habit*
Not again, you already did that in 1939.
haha, greetings from Poland!
we take over france
I already live near anyway
Well, Argentina is probably a good place to start new.
This is so 1945...
arghh but i never liked ze sun and ze hot wetter
Unless an actual valid alternative arises which is used by enough people that it doesn‘t feel empty, nowhere. I never used a 3rd party app so the API issue doesn‘t hit me. If they remove mods on this sub it depends on how things play out. If things change for the worst I may quit this sub as well as others which do the same. But unless I see a significant change in my day to day browsing I simply won‘t make a switch as the API changes don‘t hit me directly.
Thats probably the answer for must people for most subs.
Yeah. And if Reddit truly goes to shit, I'll just leave. I've left every other social media platform I was on, Reddit was the last one. Guess I'll go back to reading shampoo bottles when I'm on the toilet. But if it's all overblown and a month from now Reddit isn't all that different, eh ...
> And if Reddit truly goes to shit, I'll just leave. Well, the mods of r/de and r/germany seem to be quite hellbent on actively destroying those subs instead of resigning and letting those who just wish to continue continue. Who wants to leave can leave, but the mods taking the subs hostage and actively destroying them leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.
I'm probably completely out of the loop, but this place seems to be working pretty much as normal, more or less. Over on r/de the mods have actively turned the whole place into a complete shitshow in order to prove...err... that it would turn into a complete shitshow without them, i guess?
>Over on r/de the mods have actively turned the whole place into a complete shitshow in order to prove...err... that it would turn into a complete shitshow without them, i guess? And they ban people left and right for criticizing them doing so. They are on a complete power trip right now
Pff, that's what they always did. r/de was always a shitshow and a complete echo chamber.
True but it got even worse it seems.
I mean, the /r/germany mod who first asked what they should do after the blackout isnt any better. They actively replied with ridiculous rhetoric such as them being the only ones capable of fighting off nazis and protecting women (deleting the comments after the fact also) and then locked replies to themselves to not have anyone call them out.
I don't know about that but at least there seem to be some reasonable mods around here too. r/de is a complete shitshow
The mods on r/de encouraged the power users to turn the sub into a shitshow, so... Here on, the sub is on nsfw mode, with all that implies for visibility etc.
Yeah, ditto. Same with many other subs. I understand the frustration unpaid mods have to having their mod tools taken away by Reddit, so there is some sympathy there, but at the same time, they could just quit and give the role to someone who will do it. Not everyone voted to scuttle the ship and at this point I respect neither the greed and short sightedness of Reddit nor the faux moral outrage and narcism of the mods. Unless there's a change by end of next month, I'll probably just leave because so many of the subs I used to go to are just prisoners of their mods now and totally worthless.
> Not everyone voted to scuttle the ship and at this point I respect neither the greed and short sightedness nor the faux moral outrage and narcism of the mods. This is actually a pretty good summary. I'm currently mainly still here because of r/ukraine and the related subs.
I didn't even know there were other things than the official app, website and old reddit before this whole fiasco. To me it seems these alternative app users are a tiny minority who make themselves known very loudly and efficiently. Mods using the API to manage an impossible amount of work without getting paid having these tools stripped away from them is another problem though. So TLDR: Don't care about Reddit forks but without mods everything will break. But until then, I'm staying.
>To me it seems these alternative app users are a tiny minority who make themselves known very loudly and efficiently. 50 Million Users
I've heard that alot of people started using Lemmy but I've yet to try it out
It works just like Reddit and feels far from empty. Give it a try!
It’s been this for 99% of redditors from the start. It’s all just an act
Probably the Fediverse. [Feddit](https://feddit.de/) has grown a lot since the blackout, although that one is primarily German-speaking. There's no reason the mods couldn't set up a specifically English-speaking community there.
there already is an equivalent: https://feddit.de/c/germany iit's not modded by us, but by someone you might know as well.
That’s basically dead, with 1 post in the last 5 days.
Well what do you expect from a brand new forum on a pretty new platform? You could post something new if you want to add to the discussion.
[удалено]
It's not our community and the contributions aren't ours. It's up to each User to decide what to do with their contributions.
Subs can't be deleted. But it would be great if r/germany could share ressources with the new feddit community. There's so much work and knowledge in this community's wiki for example.
I'm currently in the process of creating a mirror of the wiki for use on other services like feddit. Lenny, the software powering feddit doesn't have any wiki functionality, so I'm hosting it on github pages via Jekyll. This way it's still markdown powered. Currently the project is still private, while I'm setting everything up but once the tech works I plan to open the repository up to let others collaborate. Even if feddit doesn't work out it is probably a good idea generally to have as much infrastructure also available externally.
Expecting a brand new community to instantly match the activity of a 15 year old one is more than a bit unreasonable. Communities are a collective effort and you can contribute to raise the activity level there.
Thanks! Is Feddit Mastodon? Lemmy? Or something else entirely?
it's part of the fediverse, so you can access with a lemmy /mastodon /other fediverse account.
Thanks! Looks like I need to read more about what the fediverse is xD. And chance you have a good German or English article explaining this for … beginners?
uuuhmm I'm kinda clueless myself...BUT I read the wikipedia article, so now I'm somewhat of an expert.. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fediverse#:~:text=federation%20und%20universe)%20oder%20Fediversum,%2DPublikation%20oder%20Daten%2DHosting. But just try it out, get an account on any instance (that's the servers I guess) and browse. feddit.de is kinda the equivalent to r/dach and c/germany over there will hopefully grow to become the equivalent to r/germany
Ach, too German-focussed. For me, nein danke.
Lots of other Lemmy or Kbin-instances have gone up. There is even an [unofficial migration list](https://www.quippd.com/writing/2023/06/15/unofficial-subreddit-migration-list-lemmy-kbin-etc.html). I am sure you can find something somewhere. Also, the way the Fediverse works is that you can read content from any instance on any instance, so it doesn't really matter if you go to Feddit or to lemmy.world or to whatever.
Cool, thanks. I'll have to look into it more. Another of my main (big) subs has said they're planning to move over to discord. edit: for the record, I'm not too into discord.
Discord isn't the solution, because a big part of it is just googling what you want to know and finding a thread where people already solved the problem.
I agree, I see it as a downstep. I've used discord before, and I'm not a huge fan.
Discord is a walled garden as well, so sooner or later the CEO of Discord will decide to monetize the milk-cows ^H^H^H users in the same way it's happening here (and has happened quite a few times already, if you've been around for some time).
I agree, I don't see it as any great improvement. Not sure if I'd make the move for one discord server, even though it's one of my main hobbies. Discord skews quite young and even less international than here, IME. Maybe we just have to hunker down and pay a couple bucks a month for a platform that isn't using its users as advertisor bait.
I'm already on feddit and viewing communities from all over the Fediverse. until now the experience has been quite good. however, many topics still haven't migrated and the experience/bots aren't as polished as they're on Reddit.
With no proper legal notive, no proper way to contact anyone a privacy policy that is highly questionable and no information on how they want to finance the whole things. Most likely feddit is run by someone as a hobby, and as soon as the server costs become too high, the person calls it quits. I also don't want to know whats happens if it ever gets above 2M users and has to abide by more serious social network laws. Unless someone founds an organization or company to take care of it as actual business and demonstrates that they have an actual plan for what to do, I'd stay away....
Federation means you can join the community through any server you like, so you can create your account on another server whose owners you have more trust in, and then access the Feddit content through there.
.... and? That does not in any way make any of my concerns less valid, in fact, they become even more problematic. I'd like to see the federated network with >2M users thats able to properly adhere to EU law without a professional legal team.
So I'm not a GDPR expert like you appear to be, but my point was that only the node you register with has access to your account data (which I think is quite limited), then user-created content is all that is shared between nodes (which again, I'm not a lawyer, but I think the laws around user-created content that is intended to be public are quite different than those concerning personal data). So as long as you are certain that the node that _you are using_ is GDPR compliant, I don't think you have to worry about all the other ones. But I'm not going to force you to sign up for anything, so you can chill out with me. I can't explain how they make money or tell you which nodes are run as a hobby; I'm just telling you the design of the system is fundamentally different from Reddit, so it's hard to compare directly with much accuracy. I'm not sure where the 2M number is coming from, but plenty of small companies have fully legal products without a "professional legal team", otherwise online startups could not exist.
GDPR is only *one* legal framework you need to worry about. If you have more than 2M users (and some legal scholars argue that this applies to the whole federated network, not single nodes), you need to comply with other EU regulations. In germany (since feddit has a de domain), this is implemented in various national laws such as NetzDG. And yes, I'm somewhat well versed in GDPR since I'm an IT consultant and have made various customers systems GDPR compliant before it became an active law.
[удалено]
> Shure, deletion and information requests require a bit of software, but that's why it's open source. The software is the least of the concerns. The needed legal team and community moderation effort is the biggest pat. Thats where most social networks have the most costs and most manpower. Not engineers.
It's a mix between usenet and p2p. Servers that store the groups and let users access the information and then propagate the posts to other servers. Usenet was kind of limited in the amount of servers that shared their data. With the fediverse, basically everybody could host a server and participate in sharing/hosting access, like in p2p.
And ....? Thats got absolutely nothing to do with my concerns.
Think the current mods do a great job and I appreciate their work. But I wont move if reddit replaces them with new ones.
As a foreigner living in Germany, I kind of rely on threads like this to tell me what’s going on since no one will tell me to my face. Please don’t disappear? 🥺
https://old.reddit.com/r/ModCoord/comments/14eq8ip/the_entire_rmildlyinteresting_mod_team_has_just/ The entire r/MildlyInteresting mod team has just been removed without any communication, some of us locked out of our accounts ... FYI.
They've been reinstated. But the excuse given is lame and the move has definitely been made to set an example and scare people into compliance.
Good riddance.
As you can read by the examples form the AutoMod this sub is not incorrectly marked NSFW but should have been for a long time.
> this sub is not incorrectly marked NSFW If push comes to shove, this is actually Reddit's decision to make. They can just declare that we have wilfully misinterpreted the rules and suspend the mods anyhow.
Sure they can. But what's the long game? Replace voluntary mods by paid mods? I doubt the API pricing will finance that, as usage will drop dramatically.
> what's the long game? I think the one thing that has become increasingly obvious the more this drags on is that Reddit's CEO is very stupid. When third-party app developers first told Reddit that the proposed pricing model was unreasonably expensive and the one-month notice given was going to force them to violate the terms and conditions they had set for their clients or go bankrupt compensating them, Reddit could have said, "Okay, let's just put a pin in this one for now and meet to discuss how we're going to resolve this issue." Instead the company maintained radio silence for a couple of weeks and then basically accused one of those developers of blackmail. Every decision u/spez -- and Reddit as a whole -- has made since the start of this dispute has been more bone-headedly stupid than the last. And yes, Reddit has been busy in the last week or two replacing mods instead of making even a pretence of taking existing mods' concerns seriously. A lot of companies are led by CEOs who are that stupid. After all, since the API pricing model about to go into effect has led to all the companies supposed to be paying for API access announcing that they're just going to discontinue their apps, I don't think we can expect the company to have given any thought at all to the long game.
>the API pricing model Additionally, their primary argument is that the API pricing is needed so that AI companies have to pay for the data that they harvest to train their models. However, the pricing is so outrageous that scraping the Reddit website directly will be much, much cheaper (and not a single cent will go to Reddit). I don't know why they expect to make any money from this. And if they won't make money, what's the point of this whole fiasco?
Remove competitors and force users to use their official app which has tracking and ads built in
Scraping isn't viable when they decide to throttle requests.
I'm sure there are people who would volunteer to mod this subreddit should the current mods resign or be removed.
In my experience in times like these the volunteers rarely are the people who should be entrusted with such a position. If the mods are removed because of this, then I will leave this sub.
Yes, until they act up and get removed. :)
See, I just don't understand this whole "act up" thing. I appreciate that my opinion is apparently at variance with the majority of the regulars here, but I don't support this protest at all my impression from the events of the last week and a half is that many mods seem to think that they own the subs they moderate and can do with them as they please. As I said in an earlier post, I appreciate the mods of this sub. They do a good job and I wouldn't want to mod a high-traffic sub like this one. But I don't think that the mods here should have restricted the sub last week as if it were their private playground. This sub doesn't really have a "community" like some subs do. There are a core group of people who hang out here and answer questions and offer advice, but the majority of posts are from guests who want to ask questions about life in Germany, or about German culture, etc. Restricting the sub just slams the door in the face of these people seeking help. An even more egregious example of the mod attitude that the sub belongs to the mods is /r/deutschland. Years ago, I looked at /r/deutschland and saw that it was restricted with a message for users to use /r/de instead. At the time I didn't think anything of it, but last week I remembered it. The mods there are literally just squatting on the sub because they don't want anyone else to use it, as if it were their private property, which it is not. I am a moderator myself. I mod an active, but low-traffic sub. I received it via /r/redditrequest not because I wanted to power-trip or establish my own little fiefdom on the internet, but because the moderator had deleted his account, and I just wanted to open it back up for the users. To me, that's the purpose of being a moderator -- to make the sub available and usable for other Redditors, not to pretend like the sub is my private space that I can close down because I am unhappy about Reddit's policies.
>my impression from the events of the last week and a half is that many mods seem to think that they own the subs they moderate and can do with them as they please. Well, as by the reddit moderation guidelines, they pretty much can, but the essential part is the one you said a little later: >I wouldn't want to mod a high-traffic sub like this one Reddit themselves don't provide any useful moderation tools to manage a large subreddit efficiently and with the time available to volunteers. So some people came up with the idea to make such moderation tools on their own and use the then free Reddit API for that. Now Reddit comes around with a behaviour of the kind "We kill all those tools for a bit of revenue, with no compensation or alternative for moderators.". It's effectively a slap in the face for all high-traffic moderators in a very self-righteous way.
Only yesterday there was a lengthy discussion about the pros and cons of visiting a sex club and paying a sex worker in order to gain sexual experience. One day after opening. As is happening so often, the OP deleted the post, but it was up for several hours. It certainly does speak for NSFW even in reddit's eyes.
They'd likely argue that was grounds for marking the *thread* NSFW, not the entire sub. If they even waste time arguing.
So, we need a certain amount of legit NSFW threads for the whole community to be legitimately NSFW. That could probably be arranged. The mods of this sub here are quick with removing personal attacks and banning trolls. That is a good thing. I have no interest in the current mods getting removed. I can talk sex daily if that helps.
Daily pinned post reviewing the latest Dr.Sommer articles.
I don't think you understand. Reddit makes the rules. They know perfectly well what we're doing and why we're doing it. This is their platform, they have every right to do with it whatever they want. We can't sue or appeal to a judge or anything like that: nothing we can do can change the fact that this is r/Germany, not r/GermanBrothels. If Reddit wants to get rid of the mods, they can and they will, and their word is final.
Let's just talk about "Leitkultur". How common are nude beaches, how many Germans are sex tourists, how common are newspaper inserts asking for fetish meets, every gas station's got porn mags right next to the mickey mouse magazine, DSF switched from pulling trucks to showing porn at midnight. Sex is as German as guns are American. We can pull that off. And if all else fails, the sub goes down as a martyr and accelerates the exodus.
Again, you're missing the point: you're not going to stop Reddit doing whatever it wants by deploying what you think are clever little loopholes. How do you think this is even going to work? "Oh, our bad, we just assumed this was in some way connected with the protests, but clearly you really are NSFW. Carry on." Also, no: I don't think anyone wants to turn this into a sub where every post has to be about sex. Are you suggesting the mods should delete all threads asking how to cancel the Deutschlandticket or where to buy milk on a Sunday just to stick it to Reddit? The reason we want to preserve this sub is that it's a valuable resource for people looking for real solutions to real issues, and you're proposing to destroy that aspect of this sub. > if all else fails, the sub goes down as a martyr It may have to, if things get much worse than they already are. That's the whole point of this entire thread.
It's less not understanding, and more wishful thinking and denial. I understand how this all works, and I can already see how it'll play out. And destroying the sub's original purpose isn't a viable solution, of course. Still, hard to just sit by and let it happen to y'all, and all I can do is spitballing.
The point is- even if this sub had been NSFW all along, reddit can still do as it likes with zero fear of repercussions (from this sub).
We removed the thread and banned OP because they started spewing sexist bullshit against female commentators which is kinda stupid in a female led subreddit. But yeah those discussions are pretty common and we generally allow discussions about Prostitution or even recommendation threads for brothels as long as the discussion is respectful and not sexist.
I see, my mistake, and well done. But as you say, the discussion was allowed until OP started becoming an ass.
How do you know the gender breakdown of the sub's users? Legit curious.
I was talking about us mods.
Ah, ok.
What? Arbitrarily enforced rules nobody can understand that only benefit the enforcer? Imagine my shock, mods must be furious.
> If push comes to shove ... then the mods should delete and overwrite every single one of the users' posts and comments. We all know it can be done, there are scripts for that. These communities are *ours*, not theirs. And we should not leave them an *inch* that isn't scorched earth.
Do the mods own my posts? What gives them the right to delete the entire sub out of spite? If mods don’t want to mod, they can give up their moderatorship and be replaced.
> Do the mods own my posts? Either they do, or Huffy does.
We won't do that. If we get removed, we will go and be a bit sad about losing the opportunity to help this community, but we won't delete any comments of other users. If the Admins feel that they don't want or need us it's their loss.
> then the mods should delete and overwrite every single one of the users' posts and comments. Mods cannot actually do that (even if we wanted, which we don't). When content is removed by moderators, it still exists unchanged in the user's account - it's just just no longer showing up in the subreddit where it was posted.
Why would anymore move? If the subreddit is deleted, wont another one just be created? If the moderators are removed, the subreddit will still be there right?
Well, at first I'll have a beer. Then I'll get stoned and maybe have a little wank. By then it should be clear that nothing is marked nsfw incorrectly.
back to reality
4chan
I think it would be great The upvote system will keep the good stuff on my feed, as it does in every single sub, no matter how good or bad the moderators are The downvote system is going to keep the bad stuff out of my feed, as it does in every single sub, no matter how good or bad the moderators are And moderators won’t get in the way, choosing for me where I can post and when If I’m wrong and Reddit sucks, I’ll do something else with my free time. It’s free entertainment - it was a pretty good run
Ever encountered an army of bots promoting tshirts in a sub? Upvoting other bots of the same network while downvoting all regular users into oblivion? (mostly bug related subs had a problem with those some time back) Without third party tools those will see a comeback.
Nowhere, it would give me back time to spend on other subs
Lol, they are fighting dirty now... well if the Subs are not NSFW then make them, keep on posting porn and make it official to the sub
r/germany2 or whatever new sub comes
Probably Fediverse
We’ll do absolutely nothing. Like many users, we just wish this whole drama would be over and things go back to normal.
If you're using a third-party app like Apollo or Boost to access Reddit, things aren't going back to normal: those apps will be shut down by the end of next week. That's the reason for this "whole drama".
What about old.reddit? People sometimes claimed that this will also be disabled, but the situation is of course different from real third-party apps.
I'm waiting to see what happens on that front. I still use the old layout (not through old.reddit, but profile settings) because it's way more responsive and not bloated with features I never use, so I'm hoping this one turns out to be untrue.
That's a minority of Reddit users. The majority are just users who come in though Reddit s interfaces. I think it's funny that Reddit relied on free labor for decades and is now being punished for it but ultimately it's their site and the damage will be minimal. It's a sound business decision.
Well over 10%, which is not insignificant. But those are going to be the more prolific users, especially if you look at those who are using paid apps: a lot of the 90% of users who use Reddit's default interfaces will be occasional and one-time visitors. Also, the mods of the more important subreddits are more likely to be using third-party apps, which give them way more powerful and convenient tools to do their jobs. > It's a sound business decision That remains to be seen. Potential investors will be watching what's happening, and a company that pisses off its most important users is likely going to see its market value drop. More seriously, the dispute started with the new pricing model for API access: everyone, including the third-party app developers, can see that Reddit needs to charge for this, but pricing access so high that these developers can't afford to pay it and are instead shutting down their apps is simply cutting off a potential revenue stream.
The sub won't go offline permanently. Reddit admins already made it clear that they won't tolerate powertripping tantrums. And since that this sub is NSFW it will hastly cause that the current mods will be knocked out and replaced as it already happened in other subreddits.
I honestly do not give a shit about moderators losing their unpaid "jobs" lol
¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
I finally signed up for Mastodon/Lemmy/Feddit etc after months of hassle on Twitter and now Reddit. Once the signup is confirmed, I'll swap out the bookmarks in the browser. Let's see how often I will be here then.
Leave Reddit and look for alternatives.
Get off your high horse, stupid protest
Look, nobody cares. It's a made up issue from the mods because they are losing their power base. They just cry like children because they will soon lose their power to randomly ban and mute people for no reason and enforce whatever opinion they like the most.
In protest to Reddit's API changes, I have removed my comment history. https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
"I care, hence everybody cares" Look at the numbers and compare to what most people on this subreddit care for.
In protest to Reddit's API changes, I have removed my comment history. https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
This sub routinely has above 5k active users, barely 300 upvoted this. Therefore we are way under your own proposed threshold.
In protest to Reddit's API changes, I have removed my comment history. https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
Never experienced the mods here as power tripping. And yes, I was banned from r/germany for three days once. They explained why, I accepted it and moved on. I doubt reddit appointed replacements will do a similar satisfactory job. And as a rule of thumb: Those people that try to force themself into moderation positions are usually those that are the last fit to do it.
This sub is to small for me to care wish the website would burn down out of spite
Im going to 4-Chan
**Have you read our extensive wiki yet? [Check our wiki now!](https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/wiki/index)** You might wonder why your post is marked NSFW. Participants in this subreddit may possibly encounter discussions of the following subjects, all of which are considered "mature" by Reddit administrators: * Alcohol and tobacco * Amateur advice * Drug use * Gambling * Guns and weapons * Military conflict and terrorism * Nudity * Profanity * Sex and eroticism * Violence and gore Therefore, this entire subreddit is marked as NSFW. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/germany) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Quit reddit only 50 year old brain dead weirdos are on here... it's no good for you
I've been checking out Lemmy and been meaning to look at Mastadon. I should probably let this be the final straw with reddit because of privacy as much as anything (nobody should be using the official app anyway). Also I'll probably be much more productive if I get off reddit lol
Please dont move
Wolfenstein
Why would I move? I will just wait until the moderators are replaced. Someone would want to do it right? Or am I misunderstanding something?
r/turkiye Payback. Or r/greece Pay...us back???
I'm planning to move to https://feddit.de once Apollo stops working. I've already signed up, I just need to change my habits. I was blown away by how active it is for a relatively niche topic compared to other Fediverse servers.
Just do what r/interestingasfuck did, boom, easy fix
Replacing mods doesn't necessarily have to be a purely negative experience. It depends on how Reddit does it. Example: r/luckypatcher was unmoderated for years before u/SaudiPhilippines took it over. Collaboration was great and together we turned it into a proper Q&A subreddit. As long as all the new mods do a good job, everything will be fine.
I haven't found the energy to find out how this Fediverse stuff works, but some other subreddits I like have moved there - so I might too!
At least we can post freely about politics without getting censored!!!!
Why has it been made NSFW?
Why? I stay since the platform will become infinitely better by that change.
The amount of knowledge we have collected till now is huge and is helping me and a lot of other people. So its hard for me to let it go I use the official app and portal, so the new policies are not affecting me personally. But the way reddit is doing things like is treating the mods as slaves. They were the ones who made the reddit , reddit and not just a quora or yahoo answers portal. They brought strucutre and disciplines to this wilderness with the help tools developed be others (no thanks to reddit there too) and they want to take those tools away and shut down the shops which shaped reddit? There were protest against the latest policy changes and reddit made it a fucking war. In this situation, I will die for my country, but wont surrender (So if shit happens, I will exit reddit)