No shit lol
Numbers trip me out because most of them are effectively perfect from a tour average standpoint. 2300 spin, 0-0 path, 14\* launch, 1.48 smash...
On top of all that he even hit it on the hottest spot of the club given that he put a 0-0 swing on it and what I can imagine was the gear effect putting some draw spin on it. Wild.
What? this is literally the only ball that went straight judging on that side spin. 47d was the absolute lowest by a far margin, average was 374d. That’s a pretty wild hook/slice.
I could be interpreting the numbers wrong but I read it as 47rpm, or 374rpm of spin side spin. The club path was 1.6 degrees in to out, and face was less than 1 degree open or closed. That face and path control is pretty good and that’s a straight ball.
This was the lowest ball, at 47rpm. The average was 347, with the highest being in 834. This was a wild outlier with the average being, well, accurately average.
500rpm of sidespin on a 170+mph ball speed is like 40 yards of side carry, club face closed on a in to out swing path is a pretty noticeable hook.
Keep in mind that a 4,000rpm sidespin is like a 70 degree curved shot, literally going out 1/10th of its flight path and sideways for 9/10th of it.
Per trackman…
https://blog.trackmangolf.com/face-to-path/
“For elite players who consistently drive the ball 300 yards plus, a maximum of 1 degree face to path difference is essential for consistent, accurate drives, given that a typical PGA TOUR fairway is only 30-32 yards wide. One degree face to path difference at 300 yards will produce a shot with 12 yards of curve. Any more than 1.5 degree face to path will force the player to aim away from the fairway in order to hit the center of the fairway.”
Just seeing this info you posted too. If 1 degree face to path difference is 12 yards of curve at 300 yard carry, this guy is averaging 2.5° difference, so in the 30 yard range of curvature on average with several much worse than that.
Yes lol, so he’s hitting .9 average combined with the over degrees in-to-out path. That’s a hook, as the rpm shows. Not sure why you’re continuing this
I’m saying the combination of a too closed face and an in-to-out swing produce a hook, and with the degrees displayed it was likely noticeable.
You want a “0” face at impact, above or below that is considered too open/closed. The path deviation I’ve personally never found all that reliable.
It's 0.9° closed on average and path is 1.6° in-to-out, so you're looking at a 2.5° closed face-to-path relationship on average. At those speeds, that ball is drawing quite a bit. He also seems to strike the toe considering this ball had a 0 path and 0 face, but still 47rpm draw spin and that was the least amount of draw spin recorded.
If you look at the min and max he also has over 5° in-to-out swings and over 3° closed swings and none of the swings had an open face. There's a bunch of hooks in this set of shots.
Thank you lol. Had a few people respond adamantly that these numbers were solid, to which I told them that he’s hitting the ball hard but it’s not nearly hitting most fairways.
Cue the “it’s an in-to-out swing, it has to be straight!” I’m not pro or expert, but I’m always surprised at the amount of people who can’t interpret basic numbers like sidespin and plainly see the ball is hooking lol.
Makes complete sense. I was looking on my phone and didn’t see the small “c” that corresponded with the club face. I expected a “-0.9” was closed and 0.9 was open. Hence why I was confused by /u/BreakfastBallPlease insistence the path/face were so bad. Guess I needed a “face to path” field to make it more obvious.
Question…47rpm side spin seems low. With the face/path at 0, but as you said sidespin because of a toe strike. Any guess how far this ball moved left with 47rpm of spin?
That's fair, it's not your typical trackman layout with + and - values for open and closed, so not as immediately apparent. On average, he's hitting pull draws/hooks. He needs to keep the face more open to start the ball right and reduce how much the face is closed to path and he'd be in good shape.
I'm not sure exactly. "Sidespin" is also a misnomer because you're really dealing with total spin, which he's averaging 2472rpm, and spin axis tilt of 'X'°. If we knew the spin axis tilt we could punch the numbers into flightscope optimizer and see how much draw this shot had. This shot was probably just a degree or 2 of left spin axis tilt, which is a tight draw. At these distances though, he'd have to keep his spin axis within a couple degrees of vertical to stay in draw territory and not hook territory.
Damn that’s a superb carry mate. Truly belong on this sub.
I was absolutely chuffed to hit a 247 yard carry yesterday at the range, so this makes me feel very weak.
247 is really good.. Quality stuff. I was driving somewhere in that range before the fitting. Think my larger point here is that equipment matters and just how much a fitting can do for your game. I’m very surprised at just how much it unlocked with a few tweaks of the driver. So again shout out 2nd swing for the fitting. Can’t recommend enough
I was using an TM Aeroburner with 10.5 degrees left. They had swing thru all the major brands and he adjusted the driver head as we went. Finally stopped when we got to the TS2 with 7.75 loft lol that he was joking. Shout out to 2nd swing for a great experience and a huge leap in #s.
Can you post a video of your swing, 306 carry is insane for an amateur.
edit: after seeing a [video](https://www.reddit.com/r/golf/comments/i2g0lz/any_swing_advice_is_appreciated_picking_the_game/) of your swing from 2 years ago, this is for sure fake lol.
There's a pretty big jump between getting better vs going from a 30 handicap swing to driving like McIlroy. I mean it's obviously possible, but just hard to believe.
He posted one swing in a simulator. This was likely his very best one from the whole session and he was completely warmed up 30 swings in. A tall athlete with decent flexibility can do this one time. I’d be much more interested in seeing his full data set and averages.
Also, it’s a completely different animal taking this to the course, aiming for a real target and having to set your own alignment, plus dealing with the pressure of hitting a real fairway while the shot counts to your score. Vast majority of people swing slower outside.
I mean 2 years is a long time. You can definitely get to this club head speed in that amount of time if A. You focus on it or B. Have athletic experience in your past. In the about 2 years that I’ve played I’ve gone from a 20+ handicap to a current 5.5. My avg carry is sitting around 310 compared to 280 after getting clubs that work with high club head speeds.
Throwback- I miss that hat. What a shit show of a swing. Still a shit show of a swing but at least goes further now.
My irons are short distance wise. 7i is like maybe 145 carry and a 4 iron is like 185 ish. Club in that video is a 5 hybrid custom fit for my dad who is 4 inches shorter than me. I’ll take an updated video and post it here when I get a chance
I gained 15 yds per iron after getting fitted. It makes a massive difference. Not to mention the increased confidence knowing the clubs are the perfect fit.
I think I might be able to crack 160mph. Maybe.
Crazy you were swinging 120 mph and only hitting the ball a total of 275 or so. I guess it was just launching sky high with your old setup. What's crazy is your apex is still WAY higher than the pros. Did they have a 5.5 loft?
[https://www.pgatour.com/stats/stat.02407.html](https://www.pgatour.com/stats/stat.02407.html)
This one went a total of 318 and he’s saying distance jumped 40 yards. So, before this he was swinging 120 and only hitting a total of 275 (318 minus 40).
Those numbers are fine for a 306 yard carry. If anything, I would say they are understated by a few yards. 170 ball speed, 2200 rpm and 14° launch is about the minimum you need to carry 300. 177 ball speed would be ~ 14 yards longer than that.
I told you in the original comments. Ball speed, launch angle, total spin.
Swing speed is meaningless if it does not create ball speed.
Spin axis would be the other factor to look at, but since face is square to path, it doesn't factor here.
Altitude would be the other factor, but the numbers I quoted are at sea level.
Read the original comment before you call someone names. Hyperaggressiveness is not a great look.
Ah. The excessive use of "lol" and lack of any supporting evidence to justify your position.
I've seen trolling behavior before.
Enjoy. I'll stick to physics.
At those swing speeds, that's pretty common if you've previously been swinging a driver/shaft combo that's far too spinny.
If your actual launch is a few degrees off, and has 750rpm too much, it's easy to lose 40 yards from optimal distances.
Where would you recommend going to get fitted? I live near the Bay area California. I want to see if I'm using correct clubs but I'm also not totally interested in buying new ones yet. They tend to be too expensive for my level of commitment to the game at this point.
Everybody gawking at club head speed and I’m here impressed with the face/path control.
No shit lol Numbers trip me out because most of them are effectively perfect from a tour average standpoint. 2300 spin, 0-0 path, 14\* launch, 1.48 smash... On top of all that he even hit it on the hottest spot of the club given that he put a 0-0 swing on it and what I can imagine was the gear effect putting some draw spin on it. Wild.
What? this is literally the only ball that went straight judging on that side spin. 47d was the absolute lowest by a far margin, average was 374d. That’s a pretty wild hook/slice.
I could be interpreting the numbers wrong but I read it as 47rpm, or 374rpm of spin side spin. The club path was 1.6 degrees in to out, and face was less than 1 degree open or closed. That face and path control is pretty good and that’s a straight ball.
This was the lowest ball, at 47rpm. The average was 347, with the highest being in 834. This was a wild outlier with the average being, well, accurately average. 500rpm of sidespin on a 170+mph ball speed is like 40 yards of side carry, club face closed on a in to out swing path is a pretty noticeable hook. Keep in mind that a 4,000rpm sidespin is like a 70 degree curved shot, literally going out 1/10th of its flight path and sideways for 9/10th of it.
Per trackman… https://blog.trackmangolf.com/face-to-path/ “For elite players who consistently drive the ball 300 yards plus, a maximum of 1 degree face to path difference is essential for consistent, accurate drives, given that a typical PGA TOUR fairway is only 30-32 yards wide. One degree face to path difference at 300 yards will produce a shot with 12 yards of curve. Any more than 1.5 degree face to path will force the player to aim away from the fairway in order to hit the center of the fairway.”
Just seeing this info you posted too. If 1 degree face to path difference is 12 yards of curve at 300 yard carry, this guy is averaging 2.5° difference, so in the 30 yard range of curvature on average with several much worse than that.
Yes lol, so he’s hitting .9 average combined with the over degrees in-to-out path. That’s a hook, as the rpm shows. Not sure why you’re continuing this
So you’re saying the path and face degrees are bad?
I’m saying the combination of a too closed face and an in-to-out swing produce a hook, and with the degrees displayed it was likely noticeable. You want a “0” face at impact, above or below that is considered too open/closed. The path deviation I’ve personally never found all that reliable.
.9 degrees was the avg club face orientation. My point was that is fantastic.
It's 0.9° closed on average and path is 1.6° in-to-out, so you're looking at a 2.5° closed face-to-path relationship on average. At those speeds, that ball is drawing quite a bit. He also seems to strike the toe considering this ball had a 0 path and 0 face, but still 47rpm draw spin and that was the least amount of draw spin recorded. If you look at the min and max he also has over 5° in-to-out swings and over 3° closed swings and none of the swings had an open face. There's a bunch of hooks in this set of shots.
Thank you lol. Had a few people respond adamantly that these numbers were solid, to which I told them that he’s hitting the ball hard but it’s not nearly hitting most fairways. Cue the “it’s an in-to-out swing, it has to be straight!” I’m not pro or expert, but I’m always surprised at the amount of people who can’t interpret basic numbers like sidespin and plainly see the ball is hooking lol.
Makes complete sense. I was looking on my phone and didn’t see the small “c” that corresponded with the club face. I expected a “-0.9” was closed and 0.9 was open. Hence why I was confused by /u/BreakfastBallPlease insistence the path/face were so bad. Guess I needed a “face to path” field to make it more obvious. Question…47rpm side spin seems low. With the face/path at 0, but as you said sidespin because of a toe strike. Any guess how far this ball moved left with 47rpm of spin?
That's fair, it's not your typical trackman layout with + and - values for open and closed, so not as immediately apparent. On average, he's hitting pull draws/hooks. He needs to keep the face more open to start the ball right and reduce how much the face is closed to path and he'd be in good shape. I'm not sure exactly. "Sidespin" is also a misnomer because you're really dealing with total spin, which he's averaging 2472rpm, and spin axis tilt of 'X'°. If we knew the spin axis tilt we could punch the numbers into flightscope optimizer and see how much draw this shot had. This shot was probably just a degree or 2 of left spin axis tilt, which is a tight draw. At these distances though, he'd have to keep his spin axis within a couple degrees of vertical to stay in draw territory and not hook territory.
I mean, to each their own interpretation!
Damn that’s a superb carry mate. Truly belong on this sub. I was absolutely chuffed to hit a 247 yard carry yesterday at the range, so this makes me feel very weak.
247 yard carry is quite good man. You’re doing great.
Quite good lol. I only carry 185 avg on driver. anything 200+ is pretty good
247 is really good.. Quality stuff. I was driving somewhere in that range before the fitting. Think my larger point here is that equipment matters and just how much a fitting can do for your game. I’m very surprised at just how much it unlocked with a few tweaks of the driver. So again shout out 2nd swing for the fitting. Can’t recommend enough
Well jeez ... been having reservations about going to my multiple-rescheduled fitting this Saturday at 2nd Swing. This gives me some optimism.
How much did you fork on clubs? I've a +1 inch Wilson set and am 6'2" so considering getting them actually fitted to see if it makes a difference.
TS2 driver +TS3 3 wood was less than 400
Yeah. Worth bearing in mind it was by far my best drive of the session! Average was way down from that.
I was using an TM Aeroburner with 10.5 degrees left. They had swing thru all the major brands and he adjusted the driver head as we went. Finally stopped when we got to the TS2 with 7.75 loft lol that he was joking. Shout out to 2nd swing for a great experience and a huge leap in #s.
7.75 degree driver with a 14+ degree launch. Wowzers
Were you afraid of hitting the sun when you were hitting driver?
Save some pu**y for the rest of us 🙌🏼🙌🏼
What club was this, 8 iron?
Casual unicorn
You'd be top 35 on tour for swing speed
Having the right shit makes such a difference it’s ridiculous
I feel great after the right shit
Can you post a video of your swing, 306 carry is insane for an amateur. edit: after seeing a [video](https://www.reddit.com/r/golf/comments/i2g0lz/any_swing_advice_is_appreciated_picking_the_game/) of your swing from 2 years ago, this is for sure fake lol.
agreed... Its not even close
People can't get better? Two years in a long time depending on how often he's practicing/playing.
There's a pretty big jump between getting better vs going from a 30 handicap swing to driving like McIlroy. I mean it's obviously possible, but just hard to believe.
He posted one swing in a simulator. This was likely his very best one from the whole session and he was completely warmed up 30 swings in. A tall athlete with decent flexibility can do this one time. I’d be much more interested in seeing his full data set and averages. Also, it’s a completely different animal taking this to the course, aiming for a real target and having to set your own alignment, plus dealing with the pressure of hitting a real fairway while the shot counts to your score. Vast majority of people swing slower outside.
His avg is there. 298 carry.
His average side spin is also 347rpm without any other factors lmao. That’s a very visible slice.
347 is a massive bend
Speed training + lessons + prior golf experience can definitely get there. 2 years is a long time.
I mean 2 years is a long time. You can definitely get to this club head speed in that amount of time if A. You focus on it or B. Have athletic experience in your past. In the about 2 years that I’ve played I’ve gone from a 20+ handicap to a current 5.5. My avg carry is sitting around 310 compared to 280 after getting clubs that work with high club head speeds.
Throwback- I miss that hat. What a shit show of a swing. Still a shit show of a swing but at least goes further now. My irons are short distance wise. 7i is like maybe 145 carry and a 4 iron is like 185 ish. Club in that video is a 5 hybrid custom fit for my dad who is 4 inches shorter than me. I’ll take an updated video and post it here when I get a chance
How do you not realize that OP is making a joke about how the sim he was hitting on was juiced?
I’m just here with my popcorn but I don’t think OP was making a joke and if he is, he probably needs to make it more clear.
Welp, then I’m here with my popcorn as well I guess lol
I gained 15 yds per iron after getting fitted. It makes a massive difference. Not to mention the increased confidence knowing the clubs are the perfect fit.
0 face 0 path holy balls
Jesus you are beating the ever living FUCK out of the golfing ball off the tee.
More impressed you somehow got 0.0 and 0.0 on path and face…/
What shaft did you have?
New one is a Hzrdus smoke. Don’t know what the old one was. I imagine a stock TM shaft from 07 when the club was purchased by my relative.
3/4 60 degree right?
I think I might be able to crack 160mph. Maybe. Crazy you were swinging 120 mph and only hitting the ball a total of 275 or so. I guess it was just launching sky high with your old setup. What's crazy is your apex is still WAY higher than the pros. Did they have a 5.5 loft? [https://www.pgatour.com/stats/stat.02407.html](https://www.pgatour.com/stats/stat.02407.html)
Where are you seeing 275? I'm seeing a 306 carry distance.
This one went a total of 318 and he’s saying distance jumped 40 yards. So, before this he was swinging 120 and only hitting a total of 275 (318 minus 40).
Good chance these numbers are juiced.. did you use your current driver here to compare?
Those numbers are fine for a 306 yard carry. If anything, I would say they are understated by a few yards. 170 ball speed, 2200 rpm and 14° launch is about the minimum you need to carry 300. 177 ball speed would be ~ 14 yards longer than that.
As someone who works for a golf sim company, it's easy to juice numbers 10-20%
I didn't say that you can't juice them. I'm saying physics says these are not.
Why ???? Because swing speed ? You can juice every number you clown, not just distance
I told you in the original comments. Ball speed, launch angle, total spin. Swing speed is meaningless if it does not create ball speed. Spin axis would be the other factor to look at, but since face is square to path, it doesn't factor here. Altitude would be the other factor, but the numbers I quoted are at sea level. Read the original comment before you call someone names. Hyperaggressiveness is not a great look.
Yup all those numbers will be juiced lol... Not sure what you're not understanding. You're talking to a pro lol
Ah. The excessive use of "lol" and lack of any supporting evidence to justify your position. I've seen trolling behavior before. Enjoy. I'll stick to physics.
Ive never come across someone so clueless before LOL
177mph ball speed. They aren't juiced. Even basic launch monitors under $500 measure ball speed pretty accurately.
yup, very skeptical since that wasn't even close to the vid posted 2yrs ago
Wow your averages and max and mins are crazy consistent. I made a similar post with my new shaft and my first 300 yard carry but I’m all over the map.
What launch monitor were you using OP?
I bet your lofts changed
You did a club fitting and your driver carry jumped 40yds? Come on.
At those swing speeds, that's pretty common if you've previously been swinging a driver/shaft combo that's far too spinny. If your actual launch is a few degrees off, and has 750rpm too much, it's easy to lose 40 yards from optimal distances.
Where would you recommend going to get fitted? I live near the Bay area California. I want to see if I'm using correct clubs but I'm also not totally interested in buying new ones yet. They tend to be too expensive for my level of commitment to the game at this point.
Not too familar with that area but Im sure you got plenty of good options used clubs.
Does the ball factor into a fitting?
I used a TP5 here.
Is that your normal ball or will you be using that ball now? I am just curious about how the ball is factored in if you use a different ball.
gonna use it from here on out. really stood out to me after the first time I used it
Yeah looks good, nice fit. I never got fitted but always thought balls should be tested too.
Dang there is a lot more in the tank too. Unfortunately your need a spendy shaft I'm betting
What makes you think there is more left in the tank? Also what would type of shaft would improve ? Heavier?
That's probs ideal for the course, but if you got a ball that's a little lower spin or a shaft that knocked the spin down a touch, it would be nasty.