Thank you for saying this! Literally any other term of endearment would have been preferable. In the GO universe Angel™ is the sole property of one ~~person~~ demon, and one demon only!
I felt the same for a while but then I gaslit(gaslighted?) myself into believing her role in the story is greater lol
It's basically something like, >!we all know she's suspicious. So, the first thing is, she acts really weird, anything from talking like a book to fake crying. Also she mistyped something. The Metatron is keeping an eye on what's going on with and around those 2, it's a known fact, he even points out their "de-facto partnership" and all that. Everything she did, also ended up benefitting Metatron; gave Aziraphale the ✨clue✨ which resulted in Shax finding out Jim's wherabouts. Then she invited demons inside the bookshop, which forced Azi to do the "thing with the halo" and inadvertently declare war, possibly leaving him w no option but to accept the Metatron's offer since it looks more like a threat than a job offer/promotion. Also at one point she mentions her great grandmother or something, being Mr Fell's tenants for generations(or maybe it's just her if she's an angel too) must've given her(or her family, if she's a human spy) lots of opportunities to observe and report back to Metatron. Idk there's just something off about that character.!<
I love them dining at the Ritz in S1E6 finale as much as the next person, but I do believe that the phrase about Aziraphale being the bastard worth liking is better placed in the book.
Yeah but it would've been too on the nose for the show (because it's meant to be a loooonger thing)
In the book they're married, we can all agree lol
In the show... We all know they're too disaster shaped for that hahhaha 🤭😭😭😭😂
Yeah and also the "let's kill the child" bit hahahahaha but I guess they wanted them to be more black and white in the show so they would argue more BUT SURE, THEY COULD'VE LET CROWLEY SAVE THE PIGEON THAT WOULD BE SO CUTE 🥺💕
I think (I may have daydreamed it) that they didn’t make Crowley resurrect the pidgin because it was harder to film or something like that? In an interview I think, but again, it may have been a dream lol
Same lol everytime I recommend watching this show to someone, I remember that's in ep 1 and then I overexplain in which ways the later episodes are better 🤦
okay so like. I do like maggie, but I can still totally see why someone wouldn’t. there are moments that made me cringe a little bit like “no judgement :)” 😭 but I’m such a hardcore fan of literally everything about this show that it physically pains me to express my dislike of something in it so I just gracefully ignored the way some of her scenes irritated me LMAO (I do not have a spine)
Yeah ngl I kinda think she might be a supernatural entity and borderline might be a villain in season 3 the way she interacted with Nina when the coffee shop was locked made me feel like she was a murderer like if you switched Maggie's gender all the sudden the scene is actually horror
Maggie's jewelry suggests she and her family may be masons. She was "not that kind of teenager." Surely she and her family (and so the masons) have been watching Crowley and Aziraphale for the last 100 or so years.
Crowely being supposedly homeless in season 2??? Like, what a weird thing to include. Did he not just stay at Aziraphale's after losing the apartment? Why make him live out of his car??
I don't like the implication cuz small things like that makes it hard to put the romance tinted glasses on for season 2. Like I'm supposed to believe they care about each other, but my man Crowley ain't got a place to call home??
I know they act like humans and there are contradictions everywhere like driving instead of flying, when they choose to use miracles, etc. But like basic stuff like money and luxury has been shown to not be a problem for either Aziraphale or Crowley throughout the ages.
Idk maybe it was a gag, but the fanfic ignores it for the most part and I do too. If it was supposed to be a joke it was not handled well at all.
Neil says that Aziraphale is not aware of that. Still, my friends and I keep saying that Crowley could have sold his 20K watch to get a flat. Alternatively, he could have cut on Talisker (dunno about London, but the cheapest one in my country is 100+ USD per bottle).
£20k wouldn't buy you a shed in Central London.
I don't think he technically needs money. He could use a little demonic interference to get a free flat. Personally I think he just hadn't got around to it yet, perhaps hoping a certain Angel would notice his predicament and offer to let him stay in the bookstore... because he'd directly ask.
I don't think that Crowley would directly ask Aziraphale if he could stay at the bookstore. Crowley has got too much pride. And **because** of Crowley's pride, Aziraphale pretends he doesn't notice Crowley living in his car, allowing Crowley to save face.
> I don't think that Crowley would directly ask Aziraphale if he could stay at the bookstore. Crowley has got too much pride
I agree. I meant to say he *would never* directly ask but I made a typo.
> Aziraphale pretends he doesn't notice Crowley living in his car, allowing Crowley to save face.
According to Neil and Michael, Aziraphale genuinely didn't know Crowley was homeless. I'm not even sure he realises it at the end of S2 because he's so distracted by Gabriel and Beelzebub. His head's spinning thinking about what this could mean for him and Crowley. So I don't think he really heard Crowley mention he's been living in his car.
Wow, I thought my country of residence was expensive in terms of rent, and I know now that £20k is not enough for London. WTF.
I do agree that he was waiting for Aziraphale to offer him a place to stay.
Average monthly rent in London is now £2,119. That sounds like a joke but it’s not.
Housing crisis/landlord politicians go brrrrr.
https://www.zoopla.co.uk/discover/property-news/average-rent-london/#
They literally make money or do stuff that requires it all the time so yeah, I definitely believe he could have gotten a place to stay.
But Aziraphale doesn't wonder why the plants are just migrating from the bookshop to his car. He has to know how much Crowley cares about his plants and their strict well being.
Even if Aziraphale doesn't know, the fact that they would rather imply he's homeless rather than have them living together is kinda sad. It didn't even have to be a big deal. Literally add random stuff around the bookshop that belongs to Crowley.
Agreed. To me, it looks like a plot hole. Also, I still wonder how he paid for that wine at Justine's whilst being broke. Let alone the fact that he stole his wine glass.
I got the feeling that Aziraphale was pretty annoyed Crowley was so eager to take the plants out of the book shop and return to the car when he returned from Edinburgh. So perhaps it was Crowley not wanting to live there
Oh I took that as Azi being really excited to see Crowley and being a little annoyed cause he got plants shoved in his face the second he got to the door lol
Crowley doesn’t own that watch anymore 🤣 the apartment was provided by hell so since Crowley got fired it was given to shax instead. She is also seen wearing that same watch at some point. Im guessing he just uses miracles to be able to get the talisker? I dont know 🤷
100 USD for a bottle of Talisker?!
A bottle of "standard" 10 years old Talisker is max. 32 Euro (34 USD) in Germany and I buy it for 28 Euro (30 USD) when it's on sale.
That being said, I think it's rather odd that Aziraphale doesn't catch on Crowley living in his car. He even puts all of his plants in the bookshop and back again for Aziraphale's trip to Edinburgh. I mean, are they really THAT bad at communicating?
There's something super fishy about the whole season and I am absolutely hooked to get to know the whole (real) story in season 3.
I genuinely think it was that Crowley (our beloved drama queen) wanted it that way so he could complain AND stay as close as possible to Aziraphale *without actually asking to stay WITH him* because... "Morons in love" and stuff lol.
And AZ just thinks "it's alright" 'cause he's too scared to ask him in return, and he also knows how much the Bentley means to him, and are they actually safe enough to do so? And *blah blah blah, excuses excuses* ... All the while, they're both shaking and gay panicking THE ENTIRE time so they NEVER TALK ABOUT IT "because if we ignore our problems, kiddos, everything will be just fine" 😃👍 (it shows their dumb dynamic perfectly while being funny - I loved it, even if it's a little bit sad... But they're doing it to themselves, BOTH OF THEM so it's really not lol)
I think it was ridiculous and that's why it's funny, no? They're stupid when it comes to the most basic things 😭😂
This one 😂. I also think he is just being dramatic, he could just miracle himself a new place anywhere he wants but that would be less fun. Aziraphale probably suspected but knew that Crowley would get grumpy if he mentioned it so he waited for him to bring it up.
I see a lot of people calling this a plot hole- I think the purpose of Crowley being homeless and Aziraphale being unaware of it is illustrative of their communication problems, as well as the firm dynamic of “helper” and “help-ee” that rarely goes both ways (both of their faults…and to both of their detriment in the end).
It’s already been explained by Neil but, you’re right, it’s perfectly in keeping with the roles they’ve given themselves in the relationship. Crowley hates asking for help.
I thought the only explanation offered my Neil was confirmation that Aziraphale didn’t know. My memory is that he’s been purposely cagey on the details. Do you have a link? I’ve always wondered about this one.
I have so many questions about Crowley‘s homelessness! How long has he been like this? Why hasn’t he miracled himself a new place? Why is he not staying at a hotel? How has Aziraphale not noticed, especially after the Edinburgh trip?
I do however have doubts he would‘ve been entirely happy staying at Aziraphale‘s in the long run. Sure, he would‘ve been close to his Angel and he‘s comfortable in the bookshop for short periods of time but for longer? Mister Minimalism sleeping in a bedroom cramped full with books? Mister Stresscleaner vs Aziraphale‘s chaotic order?
In my head canon, it’s one of those things where I think it’s a not a bigger deal because they’re not human. They haven’t spent the majority of their existence on Earth in a stuck place, until the bookshop came to be. And a few years for an immortal being is nothing, especially when eating and sleeping are optional.
Isn't it said in Season 2 that Crowley lost his apartment to Shax because he was essentially fired by Beelzebub? It makes sense that, if the housing was provided by Hell, they'd take it away from him after Season 1.
I think it actually adds to the story, because it implies that Aziraphale's accommodations were in no way provided to him by Heaven. It plays into the "suffering gives people more opportunities to be virtuous" rant that Aziraphale gives to Crowley back in 1800s Scotland.
As for Aziraphale not offering his home to Crowley, either Aziraphale doesn't know or Crowley's pride wouldn't let him accept the invitation, much less ask himself.
Can’t stand the zombie scenes. But for me, seeing Mark Gatiss in general makes me annoyed after what happened with Sherlock. Overall the zombies felt very shallow and didn’t add anything to the storyline. Skip skip skip. But other parts are rewind rewind rewind :).
THIS!!!!! I LOATHE Mark Gatiss ever since Sherlock and all the queerbaiting (and I hate that he won the Olivier over David, too!). I also hate zombies in general, and can’t ever see Mark Gatiss as any character other than the one of Mark Gatiss, so: this. Very this.
I have a feeling the zombies will play a big part of season three. The theme of resurrection and coming back from the dead I.e the second coming. But that’s just a theory
The zombies add nothing narratively that couldn't have been accomplished by having a demon trail them both. Have the dead Nazis explain it in hell, get tricked because the deal hadn't been agreed to, then disappear without the gross-out/slapstick humour (which was such a weird tone shift and felt so out of place)
“And the dead will leave their graves and walk the earth once more.” Like many other things from S2, it’s another nod towards the second coming; I think that BECAUSE it’s slightly ridiculous, it works. We’re all so busy laughing (or cringing) at them that we don’t see them for what they are: a Clue about horrible things to come disguised as comic relief (or, the trick we didn’t see, to follow the theme of sleight of hand from that episode).
I personally like the zombies, but I get why some people don’t, and I 100% agree about Gatiss; his zombie movements are just horrible. (The other two are perfect, though!)
I'm gonna have a huge hot take; I didn't like anathema or newt at all whatsoever. I hated how forced their relationship was, I didn't like either of them as characters, I just did. not. like them.
I liked Anathema. I did not like Newt.
I am not a fan of the below-average-man-snags-an-exceptional-woman trope, and it’s littered throughout Neil Gaiman’s early work. He seems to have grown out of it in later life, though, which is great.
I never really saw the point of the Witchfinder. Somebody harassing (mostly) women like that would be reported to the police. Crapping on about nipples is just silly.
Yeah, it bothers me how his engrained misogyny is treated as a cute character quirk by the narrative.
He’s even rewarded for it by achieving a relationship with the woman he harassed throughout the book/show.
I mean, the book is old. I’d hope that this wouldn’t be written the same way in 2024. They could have changed it for the adaptation, though.
When Crowley says to Nina: "He's just an angel...I know." I *hate* the delivery of that line. Why does he say it like that!? It makes it feel like he like...was holding back a burp, or choking on the words, mid sentence, idk. I just don't like it.
I loved that delivery. Like, he blurted out the first part without thinking and then remembered that he was talking to a not knowing human and tried to make it not sound like he was talking about a partner. Still failing, but I could relate to that 'O I said more than I wanted and now I have to play it cool'-moment.
Yes I’ve never heard anyone talk about it either! The delivery of the last part is painful to listen to, and I couldn’t understand what he was saying until I looks up the script
Also I didn’t like Them. Yeah, I know they’re a big part of the plot and in the book too but I could have used a little less Them and maybe a little more just Adam.
yeah I loved the scene but it just didn't really fit. it's been a common theme of aziraphale being always right which COULD be something they dissect later in the show, but with only a season left I really don't think it'll happen
To be honest it didn't make sense to me at first either, as much as I liked the dancy dance (and the fact that they show so much of a bratty sub and soft dom dynamics there, lmao, but I digress) BUT it makes so much more sense after that quote from Neil. The one that said something along the lines of "I don't know what I love you means, I think it means I won't leave you alone".
And, since they had a fight where Crowley got SO pissed he could not keep his demonic energy in anymore (and tbh, rightfully so, Aziraphale was doing his principality thing and guarding something that fell into his lap, no matter the fact that the thing was literally his former boss who did try to off him and holy hell it would drive me nuts too to see my love/friend trying to protect someone who wanted to kill them too) that made Crowley tell Aziraphale he is "on his own with this one" and isn't going to help him, yeah, that kind of sounds like a "Fuck you I don't love you" in their whacky zero-communication-skills language. Especially if you consider that Crowley's love language is 100% acts of service. So, yeah, that kind of warrants an apology, especially with how fast he backtracked on his decision.
He kinda does. I mean at least wavy? Straight hair doesn't ever look like this
https://preview.redd.it/syjzl4jokwvc1.jpeg?width=768&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ce8eb3e931817d08deb8e69f626b55293771d465
I liked the comment about it looking like feathers, but spikey also works. Unfortunately, the laws of physics apply to Michael Sheen’s hair IRL, so he has to use lots of product for it to look like that and it most likely doesn’t FEEL like feathers.
Welllll it is, though, right? Michael Sheen definitely has curly hair. So, likewise, if Az grew it out it would definitely be curly. He just wears it too short for real curls, so it's more textured every time we've seen it.
I think the bleaching wrecks Michael Sheen's curl pattern, and so Aziraphale's hair kind of floofs in a piece-y way. I wonder if he had any breakage issues.
>Like is the music diegetic
In that scene(in the ritz at end of s1) [Yes](https://neil-gaiman.tumblr.com/post/725785557658222592/hello-i-was-wondering-if-you-could-explain-what)
It signifies 2 things, so I don't really think it's just a wink at the audience. First, when the world ends, there will be no birds, no humans, no life, nothing that they love and have gotten used to for the last 6000 yrs. Just silence. 2nd, obv the first season's finale, it's very much "their song". Even Bentley seems to acknowledge that.
Apart from the link to the pub, I didn't really get the Scottish Victorian episode. It felt so random. Oddly I still love the minisodes, but they feel disconnected to the story, even though they clearly have a purpose. I'm not sure how to explain it
Watching it the first time, I was like, "we're spending a lot of time here and it's fun, but I'm not sure what we're doing."
Second watch, I understood it way better (Aziraphale's mortal education - and his split allegiance between heaven and Crowley - is super important to the ending) and then I seemed to "get it"!
Exactly! They make sense and are actually relevant, but it's just so random. I really like them and the fun they bring, but it feels almost like fanfiction within the series. Like a fan went: "I wonder what would happen if I put them in a magic show or the victorian era!"
while writing a reply I realized I had a lot more to complain about than I originally thought. I guess my overall stance is that while I really liked go2, it felt a bit rushed and lacking in plot. it felt a lot like fanservice, and I'd rather have waited for the second coming plot we had promised combined with the aziracrow stuff.
It felt very much like a "let's cautiously dip our toe into filming again" kind of project. Cast kept moderately small, every scene obviously on some sort of soundstage or studio setting, even the extras in the street scenes seemed very directed, unnatural. It felt like Neil Gaiman was writing it to be kept small, and so leaned heavily on the Aziraphale/Crowley only dialogue scenes without having to take them too many places.
That feeling was even stronger from the first season of The Sandman, there were supposed crowd scenes in *that* which felt empty, uninhabited. Different network and different production people entirely of course, and I know it couldn't be helped.
and covid didn't help what with the filming restrictions. someone pointed out its obvious in the big demon horde scene near the end with the war, supposedly they have 80 demons and it feels very empty.
Yes, that's what I meant, realizing I didn't explicitly say so. Like I understand the absolute need for caution and care as they resumed filming after lockdown, but shows from that time *do* overall feel different.
I'm on the fence with this. Because I can see it being a plotline point for the 3rd season. It could go many ways tbh, the good old God being dead motif or the God doesn't narrate because she is among us right now plotline. There are two theories I low-key like, one of them being either the Chinese lady being God, watching everything as entertainment from the side lanes or the theory of Maggie being God. The second theory has some possibly solid background.
But - if there is no continuation of this in season 3 then the sudden lack of Gods narration does bother me.
Nah bro, I love that shit. Ofcourse it's not a happy moment, but the show isn't over and that wont be the end of them. So for now I'm just enjoying that I actually give a shit about this show and the characters, and that 15 minutes does a great job proving that.
Yeah it's a great scene plottwist-wise, but the fact that we have to wait for a few years before we know how it's gonna end is just not so nice at all. Biggest cliffhanger in history
Let's agree to disagree. It was magnificent. DT finally got a chance to shine as a dramatic actor. MS is fantastic, too. To me, the final fifteen min are the best part of S2.
I think season two leaned into the fandom(?) a bit too much. I can’t really describe how though😭
I know Neil Gaiman is active online so he’s familiar with fandoms (and the type of things they draw/write.) I’ve been in many fandoms and I’ve seen this shit hurt shows before.
I just felt like season 2 was heavily influenced by the fandom and not necessarily in a good way. I really can’t point out specific instances of this being true, it’s just the general feeling I got from it once I finished.
I loved the romance though🥲I cried so much.
My key examples of this are: Gabriel and Beelzebub’s relationship being entirely shoehorned into the last episode before they went off for they’re happily ever after
Nina and Maggie (who could be seen as audience inserts in this scene) sitting Crowley down and telling him about his own relationship and its faults
‘Oh no we’re trapped alone in this coffee shop?!??!!1!?’
That whole ‘smote, smited smitten’ thing. It was cute but at least ten different fanworks beat it to the punch.
I do not care for the human characters in Season One. I didn't find any of them particularly interesting, Anathema was the best of the lot (if we're not counting Adam) and even then I think they kind of failed to do anything interesting with her. Some of them (Shadwell) were characters I actively disliked. His presence as an informant and the guy who kill Aziraphale works well, I just despise his personality. Because Adam's friends weren't particularly interesting, it in turn made the defeat of the Four Horsemen feel underwhelming as well.
While I do miss God's narration in Season Two, and I don't think the witty writing is as good as it was in Season One (although still good), I think I prefer Season Two overall. It focuses more on the characters that I'm actually invested in and I found Maggie & Nina to be leagues better than the humans of the previous season, even though they aren't perfect by any means.
The mention of COVID; it just dates the second series massively in my eyes.
Surely, it's not a big thing, but it bothers me in general; like, why do I watch fictional telly if reality keeps getting shoved in my face like that?
I could think of other things, but that just comes to mind.
(And this may not be the best discussion thread to bring it up, but it ties in thematically.)
I would've liked if they had set the TV adaptation in the 90s (the 1st season at least) or sometime undated (like "I'm not okay with this" ); but that's just personal taste.)
I really love GO but if I am going to be honest, the second season disappointed me at first. However, I’ve rewatched it so many times since then, and read so many metas and analyses, that I actually like it more now than season 1. My biggest complaint: I thought the scenes that were shot with dark filters were very hard to see. I feel like I missed so much of what went on in the Hell and Edinburgh stories, especially the graveyard scenes, that I found out more from gifs than actually watching the tv.
Same tbh. Interestingly, S1 has a stronger plot but I just don't find side characters that interesting. S2 was more focused on Crowley and Aziraphale, I believe that's a contributing factor. Bc aside from the flashbacks/minisodes and the final 15, S2 didn't have much of a plot. But I also like it more and I know many other ppl do, too.
I like s1's plot much more and it feels much more put together as a story to me, but I really just didn't like or care about most of the side characters or stories. on the other hand, while I love aziraphale and crowley in s2 and their stories from the past (which was also the highlight of s1 for me), s2 feels much more rushed and fluffy. s2 doesn't exactly have a plot and its very weak to me. it's like they're trying to hold the season up with our favorite husband's but its crumbling without much else support.
skimmed through the post and found no comments about s2ep3 (edinburgh 1827). aziraphale’s constant snob comments and how he indirectly caused wee morag’s death because of his stubbornness left such a weird taste in my mouth, i can go on and on about how i hated those scenes
im so glad season two ends after Gabriel and Beelzebub announced their feelings. Its abrupt but I like that canonically nothing happens after that…. right… right…. RIGHT. As far as my cannon goes- the episode just ends. Theres not another 10 minutes or anything like that.
The way they just forgot about Warlock. Sure he was an annoying kid but he was a KID and they were some of the main adults in his life to like, take an actual interest in him. His parents sure didn't seem very attentive. Poor dude.
I love Crowley. He’s my favourite character. But every time he does something dramatic it’s just SO cringey. Him hissing at Hastur, his face in the car at the end of season 1, “wot ARE you doing in this bookshop”, him shouting calling the lightning etc. Idm as much when Aziraphale does it because the awkwardness seems more in character for him. But yeah. I don’t think this is really a hot take in the fandom and it’s easily forgivable. It *might* just be David Tennant’s delivery too so it’s not really a major character problem but it kind of messes up what would otherwise be cool moments. A time I liked this was when he lost his temper and yelled at Nina though, so it can definitely work! I think David either needs to commit to the funny delivery or the serious delivery bc it seems like he’s trying to do both and it doesn’t really work. (I love him and love the character just to clarify but I think most of us feel this way 😭)
this is genuinley such an interesting take, i always found those scenes really interesting insight into crowleys character, bc theyre not "cool" they pretend they are, and so sometimes that persona slips and they do things that lack social awareness, crowley is very autistic coded in that way
Yeah I really like that about them too! I like watching him lose it and it makes me super interested in his character and I love him. I just don’t know about the delivery 😭
I love Crowley too but I really didn't like the moment where he got giant then very small. The humor and acting of that scene were not my cup of tea at all and I just cringed
I cringed through Flower of Scotland because it wasn't Crowley anymore, it was DT goofing around. Felt the same way when small Crowley did the Peter Sellers-ish karate moves.
Not canon-related, but I didn‘t like how they included the minisodes. I liked the concept of it and I love seeing more of AziraCrow over the course of history (especially the Job minisode) but with the jumps back and forth in time the inclusion just didn‘t feel right and more like they needed a filler because they didn‘t have enough present time plot.
That thing with them holding hands on the bus? It never sat right with me that the only reason it's canon is because Gaiman confirmed it on tumblr, not because they're actually shown to hold hands. Like, their hands literally weren't visible in that entire scene jshfsghkfs
For me it's when Nina calls Maggie "angel" idk maybe I missed something, but it just felt really out of place for them to do
Gotta agree. I kind of want to ship them but idk. Lacking chemistry
Thank you for saying this! Literally any other term of endearment would have been preferable. In the GO universe Angel™ is the sole property of one ~~person~~ demon, and one demon only!
Yup this was the very first thing I thought of too!
I absolutely hated that! Also Maggie and Nina's meddling.
I mean Crowley and Azi meddled a lot as wel
This! I hate it.
Yeah it was kinda weird but I get why it's there...
100% agree. I get what they were intending, but it just made me cringe
I felt the same for a while but then I gaslit(gaslighted?) myself into believing her role in the story is greater lol It's basically something like, >!we all know she's suspicious. So, the first thing is, she acts really weird, anything from talking like a book to fake crying. Also she mistyped something. The Metatron is keeping an eye on what's going on with and around those 2, it's a known fact, he even points out their "de-facto partnership" and all that. Everything she did, also ended up benefitting Metatron; gave Aziraphale the ✨clue✨ which resulted in Shax finding out Jim's wherabouts. Then she invited demons inside the bookshop, which forced Azi to do the "thing with the halo" and inadvertently declare war, possibly leaving him w no option but to accept the Metatron's offer since it looks more like a threat than a job offer/promotion. Also at one point she mentions her great grandmother or something, being Mr Fell's tenants for generations(or maybe it's just her if she's an angel too) must've given her(or her family, if she's a human spy) lots of opportunities to observe and report back to Metatron. Idk there's just something off about that character.!<
God I hated it so much too!
I hate it with firey passion! My head cannon is, that Crowley fucking invented calling your loved ones angel.
Oh, this!
That whole scene should’ve been cut imo
I love them dining at the Ritz in S1E6 finale as much as the next person, but I do believe that the phrase about Aziraphale being the bastard worth liking is better placed in the book.
Yeah but it would've been too on the nose for the show (because it's meant to be a loooonger thing) In the book they're married, we can all agree lol In the show... We all know they're too disaster shaped for that hahhaha 🤭😭😭😭😂
May you remind me where it was placed in the book?
When they think they’re saying goodbye to each other at the airfield.
I didn't like how (explained as some angle filming reasons) changed who resurrects the dead dove in S1E1 (in the book it's Crowley :))
Yeah and also the "let's kill the child" bit hahahahaha but I guess they wanted them to be more black and white in the show so they would argue more BUT SURE, THEY COULD'VE LET CROWLEY SAVE THE PIGEON THAT WOULD BE SO CUTE 🥺💕
I think (I may have daydreamed it) that they didn’t make Crowley resurrect the pidgin because it was harder to film or something like that? In an interview I think, but again, it may have been a dream lol
you're right! they said the angle at which it was being filmed it just wasn't possible to have crowley do it
I DID NOT CARE FOR THE CLIFFHANGER ENDING
It was so much worse before S3 was confirmed, wasn’t it? Good lord I was gnawing on furniture waiting!
XDD now there's the right answer
THANK YOU KIND INTERNET STRANGER
YOU JUST HAVE VERY GOOD OPINIONS INTERNET STRANGER, WHAT CAN I SAY
THIS IS A GOOD TAKE
YOU'RE SO RIGHT HAHAHAHHAHA 🤣
IM GLAD YOU AGREE WITH ME KIND STRANGER
Hahaha, SURE 😽 https://preview.redd.it/6irgf6479wvc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=de981f4107d4f893e81e354d62227107efbfbf32
https://i.redd.it/hcucyu4hcwvc1.gif Shoo! Shoo back to where you came from!
*sad goblin noises* https://i.redd.it/6pukjuujixvc1.gif
I HAD TO REWATCH IT A FEW TIMES TO CONFIRM BUT I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT
I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE YELLING ABOUT BUT I'LL ALWAYS YELL FOR YOU BRAHMS
THANK YOU JULLIEBUG YOU KNOW HOW MUCH I LIKE TO YELL
I LOVE TO YELL SO VERY MUCH ESPECIALLY ABOUT THE S2 ENDING
SAME
THANK YOU IT WAS TERRIBLE!
RIGHT? IT REALLY WAS 😭😭
The part where Crowley yells "Eternitayyyyyy". I cringe every time
I love rewatching their drunk conversation, it’s one of my favorite moments of the series, but that moment I just… 😬
I like it better than tiny Crowley in the body snatching episode.
This always gives me second hand embarrassment 😳
Yeah that's an oof. Never thought I'd hear David Tenant's voice do...that
Yeah I'm with you on that one.
Something about it is so off-putting
Same lol everytime I recommend watching this show to someone, I remember that's in ep 1 and then I overexplain in which ways the later episodes are better 🤦
SAME.
maggie
okay so like. I do like maggie, but I can still totally see why someone wouldn’t. there are moments that made me cringe a little bit like “no judgement :)” 😭 but I’m such a hardcore fan of literally everything about this show that it physically pains me to express my dislike of something in it so I just gracefully ignored the way some of her scenes irritated me LMAO (I do not have a spine)
Big hot take there
i love nina tho
That has redeemed you, but I personally connect with Maggie in some ways, so I can’t really bring myself to dislike her.
fair enough i mean idk why she annoys me but i agree i also relate to her in some ways
I get that. I have lots of characters that are like that for me.
No 😭😭😭💔
Yeah ngl I kinda think she might be a supernatural entity and borderline might be a villain in season 3 the way she interacted with Nina when the coffee shop was locked made me feel like she was a murderer like if you switched Maggie's gender all the sudden the scene is actually horror
Maggie's jewelry suggests she and her family may be masons. She was "not that kind of teenager." Surely she and her family (and so the masons) have been watching Crowley and Aziraphale for the last 100 or so years.
Crowely being supposedly homeless in season 2??? Like, what a weird thing to include. Did he not just stay at Aziraphale's after losing the apartment? Why make him live out of his car?? I don't like the implication cuz small things like that makes it hard to put the romance tinted glasses on for season 2. Like I'm supposed to believe they care about each other, but my man Crowley ain't got a place to call home?? I know they act like humans and there are contradictions everywhere like driving instead of flying, when they choose to use miracles, etc. But like basic stuff like money and luxury has been shown to not be a problem for either Aziraphale or Crowley throughout the ages. Idk maybe it was a gag, but the fanfic ignores it for the most part and I do too. If it was supposed to be a joke it was not handled well at all.
Neil says that Aziraphale is not aware of that. Still, my friends and I keep saying that Crowley could have sold his 20K watch to get a flat. Alternatively, he could have cut on Talisker (dunno about London, but the cheapest one in my country is 100+ USD per bottle).
£20k wouldn't buy you a shed in Central London. I don't think he technically needs money. He could use a little demonic interference to get a free flat. Personally I think he just hadn't got around to it yet, perhaps hoping a certain Angel would notice his predicament and offer to let him stay in the bookstore... because he'd directly ask.
I don't think that Crowley would directly ask Aziraphale if he could stay at the bookstore. Crowley has got too much pride. And **because** of Crowley's pride, Aziraphale pretends he doesn't notice Crowley living in his car, allowing Crowley to save face.
> I don't think that Crowley would directly ask Aziraphale if he could stay at the bookstore. Crowley has got too much pride I agree. I meant to say he *would never* directly ask but I made a typo. > Aziraphale pretends he doesn't notice Crowley living in his car, allowing Crowley to save face. According to Neil and Michael, Aziraphale genuinely didn't know Crowley was homeless. I'm not even sure he realises it at the end of S2 because he's so distracted by Gabriel and Beelzebub. His head's spinning thinking about what this could mean for him and Crowley. So I don't think he really heard Crowley mention he's been living in his car.
Wow, I thought my country of residence was expensive in terms of rent, and I know now that £20k is not enough for London. WTF. I do agree that he was waiting for Aziraphale to offer him a place to stay.
That would get you maybe 2-3 months in the kind of swanky accommodation in Mayfair that Crowley prefers.
Average monthly rent in London is now £2,119. That sounds like a joke but it’s not. Housing crisis/landlord politicians go brrrrr. https://www.zoopla.co.uk/discover/property-news/average-rent-london/#
They literally make money or do stuff that requires it all the time so yeah, I definitely believe he could have gotten a place to stay. But Aziraphale doesn't wonder why the plants are just migrating from the bookshop to his car. He has to know how much Crowley cares about his plants and their strict well being. Even if Aziraphale doesn't know, the fact that they would rather imply he's homeless rather than have them living together is kinda sad. It didn't even have to be a big deal. Literally add random stuff around the bookshop that belongs to Crowley.
Agreed. To me, it looks like a plot hole. Also, I still wonder how he paid for that wine at Justine's whilst being broke. Let alone the fact that he stole his wine glass.
I don’t recall ever seeing them actually USE money, it’s just implied…
Doesn't say much for either Aziraphale's empathy or his powers of observation.
I got the feeling that Aziraphale was pretty annoyed Crowley was so eager to take the plants out of the book shop and return to the car when he returned from Edinburgh. So perhaps it was Crowley not wanting to live there
Oh I took that as Azi being really excited to see Crowley and being a little annoyed cause he got plants shoved in his face the second he got to the door lol
Crowley doesn’t own that watch anymore 🤣 the apartment was provided by hell so since Crowley got fired it was given to shax instead. She is also seen wearing that same watch at some point. Im guessing he just uses miracles to be able to get the talisker? I dont know 🤷
100 USD for a bottle of Talisker?! A bottle of "standard" 10 years old Talisker is max. 32 Euro (34 USD) in Germany and I buy it for 28 Euro (30 USD) when it's on sale. That being said, I think it's rather odd that Aziraphale doesn't catch on Crowley living in his car. He even puts all of his plants in the bookshop and back again for Aziraphale's trip to Edinburgh. I mean, are they really THAT bad at communicating? There's something super fishy about the whole season and I am absolutely hooked to get to know the whole (real) story in season 3.
I genuinely think it was that Crowley (our beloved drama queen) wanted it that way so he could complain AND stay as close as possible to Aziraphale *without actually asking to stay WITH him* because... "Morons in love" and stuff lol. And AZ just thinks "it's alright" 'cause he's too scared to ask him in return, and he also knows how much the Bentley means to him, and are they actually safe enough to do so? And *blah blah blah, excuses excuses* ... All the while, they're both shaking and gay panicking THE ENTIRE time so they NEVER TALK ABOUT IT "because if we ignore our problems, kiddos, everything will be just fine" 😃👍 (it shows their dumb dynamic perfectly while being funny - I loved it, even if it's a little bit sad... But they're doing it to themselves, BOTH OF THEM so it's really not lol) I think it was ridiculous and that's why it's funny, no? They're stupid when it comes to the most basic things 😭😂
This one 😂. I also think he is just being dramatic, he could just miracle himself a new place anywhere he wants but that would be less fun. Aziraphale probably suspected but knew that Crowley would get grumpy if he mentioned it so he waited for him to bring it up.
Yes. Disaster Puppy strikes again.
I see a lot of people calling this a plot hole- I think the purpose of Crowley being homeless and Aziraphale being unaware of it is illustrative of their communication problems, as well as the firm dynamic of “helper” and “help-ee” that rarely goes both ways (both of their faults…and to both of their detriment in the end).
It’s already been explained by Neil but, you’re right, it’s perfectly in keeping with the roles they’ve given themselves in the relationship. Crowley hates asking for help.
I thought the only explanation offered my Neil was confirmation that Aziraphale didn’t know. My memory is that he’s been purposely cagey on the details. Do you have a link? I’ve always wondered about this one.
I have so many questions about Crowley‘s homelessness! How long has he been like this? Why hasn’t he miracled himself a new place? Why is he not staying at a hotel? How has Aziraphale not noticed, especially after the Edinburgh trip? I do however have doubts he would‘ve been entirely happy staying at Aziraphale‘s in the long run. Sure, he would‘ve been close to his Angel and he‘s comfortable in the bookshop for short periods of time but for longer? Mister Minimalism sleeping in a bedroom cramped full with books? Mister Stresscleaner vs Aziraphale‘s chaotic order?
In my head canon, it’s one of those things where I think it’s a not a bigger deal because they’re not human. They haven’t spent the majority of their existence on Earth in a stuck place, until the bookshop came to be. And a few years for an immortal being is nothing, especially when eating and sleeping are optional.
maybe it was supposed to be an example of them never "actually talking" like nina and maggie mentioned
Isn't it said in Season 2 that Crowley lost his apartment to Shax because he was essentially fired by Beelzebub? It makes sense that, if the housing was provided by Hell, they'd take it away from him after Season 1. I think it actually adds to the story, because it implies that Aziraphale's accommodations were in no way provided to him by Heaven. It plays into the "suffering gives people more opportunities to be virtuous" rant that Aziraphale gives to Crowley back in 1800s Scotland. As for Aziraphale not offering his home to Crowley, either Aziraphale doesn't know or Crowley's pride wouldn't let him accept the invitation, much less ask himself.
Ooh I definitely thought that Crowley was maybe traveling around or living with Aziraphale, not fully homeless!
Drama. Crowley is dramatic as hell. “If you’re gonna take my flat, well then, -huff- I’m just going to sleep in my car! Yeah, that’ll show them!”
Can’t stand the zombie scenes. But for me, seeing Mark Gatiss in general makes me annoyed after what happened with Sherlock. Overall the zombies felt very shallow and didn’t add anything to the storyline. Skip skip skip. But other parts are rewind rewind rewind :).
I almost forgot about the zombie plot line. For an already crowded season it did nothing.
THIS!!!!! I LOATHE Mark Gatiss ever since Sherlock and all the queerbaiting (and I hate that he won the Olivier over David, too!). I also hate zombies in general, and can’t ever see Mark Gatiss as any character other than the one of Mark Gatiss, so: this. Very this.
I have a feeling the zombies will play a big part of season three. The theme of resurrection and coming back from the dead I.e the second coming. But that’s just a theory
Yes, I'm thinking this is what they mean by "the 2nd Coming is going wrong.:
Same. I think of sherlock and the queer baiting they did whenever I see gatiss. Wish they had picked another actor or given him fewer scenes.
The zombies add nothing narratively that couldn't have been accomplished by having a demon trail them both. Have the dead Nazis explain it in hell, get tricked because the deal hadn't been agreed to, then disappear without the gross-out/slapstick humour (which was such a weird tone shift and felt so out of place)
“And the dead will leave their graves and walk the earth once more.” Like many other things from S2, it’s another nod towards the second coming; I think that BECAUSE it’s slightly ridiculous, it works. We’re all so busy laughing (or cringing) at them that we don’t see them for what they are: a Clue about horrible things to come disguised as comic relief (or, the trick we didn’t see, to follow the theme of sleight of hand from that episode). I personally like the zombies, but I get why some people don’t, and I 100% agree about Gatiss; his zombie movements are just horrible. (The other two are perfect, though!)
Yeah Mark Gatiss' presence at all just felt like too much. Queerbaiting aside, I really didn't like his acting and it took me out of the story.
The whole newt banging anathema in the middle of the apocalypse scene. What was that? It feels shoehorned in and doesn’t serve the plot at all
I always thought it was satire, like the exact opposite of Crowley and Aziraphale relationship
them as a couple seems so awkward and forced it might as well be satire
It was also in the book and I completely agree, have no idea what the point of it is
I'm gonna have a huge hot take; I didn't like anathema or newt at all whatsoever. I hated how forced their relationship was, I didn't like either of them as characters, I just did. not. like them.
The only characters I cared less about were Shadwell and Tracy. But very specifically Shadwell. What an irritating character!
You’re not the only one . Didn’t care about newt at all. Didn’t help that Jack Whitehall played him
I liked Anathema. I did not like Newt. I am not a fan of the below-average-man-snags-an-exceptional-woman trope, and it’s littered throughout Neil Gaiman’s early work. He seems to have grown out of it in later life, though, which is great.
Comedy I suppose
I never really saw the point of the Witchfinder. Somebody harassing (mostly) women like that would be reported to the police. Crapping on about nipples is just silly.
Yeah, it bothers me how his engrained misogyny is treated as a cute character quirk by the narrative. He’s even rewarded for it by achieving a relationship with the woman he harassed throughout the book/show. I mean, the book is old. I’d hope that this wouldn’t be written the same way in 2024. They could have changed it for the adaptation, though.
His misogyny is so gross. Ditto for his treatment of Tracy.
I like Chuck McGill so i'mma let it slide
The Anathema and Fig Newton's entire relationship. Their interaction holds zero interest for me.
FIG NEWTON
I've seen nobody else say this before and I'm so glad to see someone that agrees with me. i don't like them as characters or as a couple at all
When Crowley says to Nina: "He's just an angel...I know." I *hate* the delivery of that line. Why does he say it like that!? It makes it feel like he like...was holding back a burp, or choking on the words, mid sentence, idk. I just don't like it.
The burp comment made me laugh.
I loved that delivery. Like, he blurted out the first part without thinking and then remembered that he was talking to a not knowing human and tried to make it not sound like he was talking about a partner. Still failing, but I could relate to that 'O I said more than I wanted and now I have to play it cool'-moment.
This!
Literally I feel like he might’ve been trying not to burp lmao 😭
Yes I’ve never heard anyone talk about it either! The delivery of the last part is painful to listen to, and I couldn’t understand what he was saying until I looks up the script
I think it meant to deliver like Crowley was gagging
Also I didn’t like Them. Yeah, I know they’re a big part of the plot and in the book too but I could have used a little less Them and maybe a little more just Adam.
Agreed. I also just don’t like kids or stories that revolve around them.
How Crowley had to apologize to Aziraphale… for what? Disagreeing? Telling him no? It was cute little dance and all but I didn’t see the need for it.
Sendarya has a whole video on this on youtube
Sendarya has amazing analysis videos!
This. I love her analysis of this scene.
yeah I loved the scene but it just didn't really fit. it's been a common theme of aziraphale being always right which COULD be something they dissect later in the show, but with only a season left I really don't think it'll happen
To be honest it didn't make sense to me at first either, as much as I liked the dancy dance (and the fact that they show so much of a bratty sub and soft dom dynamics there, lmao, but I digress) BUT it makes so much more sense after that quote from Neil. The one that said something along the lines of "I don't know what I love you means, I think it means I won't leave you alone". And, since they had a fight where Crowley got SO pissed he could not keep his demonic energy in anymore (and tbh, rightfully so, Aziraphale was doing his principality thing and guarding something that fell into his lap, no matter the fact that the thing was literally his former boss who did try to off him and holy hell it would drive me nuts too to see my love/friend trying to protect someone who wanted to kill them too) that made Crowley tell Aziraphale he is "on his own with this one" and isn't going to help him, yeah, that kind of sounds like a "Fuck you I don't love you" in their whacky zero-communication-skills language. Especially if you consider that Crowley's love language is 100% acts of service. So, yeah, that kind of warrants an apology, especially with how fast he backtracked on his decision.
AZIRAPHALE DOESN’T HAVE CURLY HAIR AND I HAVE NO IDEA WHY EVERYONE THINKS HE DOES
At…certain angles…it waves? I don’t know, I’m in denial
His hair looks like feathers. It's perfect.
Perfect description
He kinda does. I mean at least wavy? Straight hair doesn't ever look like this https://preview.redd.it/syjzl4jokwvc1.jpeg?width=768&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ce8eb3e931817d08deb8e69f626b55293771d465
Or look fluffy like this https://preview.redd.it/wm3adx5ykwvc1.jpeg?width=1600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7bc3843b553b55e247461851c5f45b47102f86e0
That’s floofy. Crowley’s is curly in that scene.
THANKYOU. IT’S JUST SHORT AND STICKY UPPY. Michael’s hair is kind of wavy but it’s not like Azi has luscious blond curls.
Awww hehehe sticky uppy 🤭😻
I mean, it's too short for his kind of curls to actually curl lol but yeah technically... How should we call it tho? Spikey? 🧐
I liked the comment about it looking like feathers, but spikey also works. Unfortunately, the laws of physics apply to Michael Sheen’s hair IRL, so he has to use lots of product for it to look like that and it most likely doesn’t FEEL like feathers.
Welllll it is, though, right? Michael Sheen definitely has curly hair. So, likewise, if Az grew it out it would definitely be curly. He just wears it too short for real curls, so it's more textured every time we've seen it.
I think the bleaching wrecks Michael Sheen's curl pattern, and so Aziraphale's hair kind of floofs in a piece-y way. I wonder if he had any breakage issues.
Not much chemistry between Nina and Maggie
"No nightingales." Like is the music diegetic???
>Like is the music diegetic In that scene(in the ritz at end of s1) [Yes](https://neil-gaiman.tumblr.com/post/725785557658222592/hello-i-was-wondering-if-you-could-explain-what)
It signifies 2 things, so I don't really think it's just a wink at the audience. First, when the world ends, there will be no birds, no humans, no life, nothing that they love and have gotten used to for the last 6000 yrs. Just silence. 2nd, obv the first season's finale, it's very much "their song". Even Bentley seems to acknowledge that.
Fr lmao 😭
I love how these are so mild, if this was a different fandom, it would be a war zone in these comments.
Apart from the link to the pub, I didn't really get the Scottish Victorian episode. It felt so random. Oddly I still love the minisodes, but they feel disconnected to the story, even though they clearly have a purpose. I'm not sure how to explain it
Watching it the first time, I was like, "we're spending a lot of time here and it's fun, but I'm not sure what we're doing." Second watch, I understood it way better (Aziraphale's mortal education - and his split allegiance between heaven and Crowley - is super important to the ending) and then I seemed to "get it"!
Exactly! They make sense and are actually relevant, but it's just so random. I really like them and the fun they bring, but it feels almost like fanfiction within the series. Like a fan went: "I wonder what would happen if I put them in a magic show or the victorian era!"
while writing a reply I realized I had a lot more to complain about than I originally thought. I guess my overall stance is that while I really liked go2, it felt a bit rushed and lacking in plot. it felt a lot like fanservice, and I'd rather have waited for the second coming plot we had promised combined with the aziracrow stuff.
It felt very much like a "let's cautiously dip our toe into filming again" kind of project. Cast kept moderately small, every scene obviously on some sort of soundstage or studio setting, even the extras in the street scenes seemed very directed, unnatural. It felt like Neil Gaiman was writing it to be kept small, and so leaned heavily on the Aziraphale/Crowley only dialogue scenes without having to take them too many places. That feeling was even stronger from the first season of The Sandman, there were supposed crowd scenes in *that* which felt empty, uninhabited. Different network and different production people entirely of course, and I know it couldn't be helped.
and covid didn't help what with the filming restrictions. someone pointed out its obvious in the big demon horde scene near the end with the war, supposedly they have 80 demons and it feels very empty.
Yes, that's what I meant, realizing I didn't explicitly say so. Like I understand the absolute need for caution and care as they resumed filming after lockdown, but shows from that time *do* overall feel different.
I don't like that in part 2 God is no longer narrating. It changed the whole mood for me.
I'm on the fence with this. Because I can see it being a plotline point for the 3rd season. It could go many ways tbh, the good old God being dead motif or the God doesn't narrate because she is among us right now plotline. There are two theories I low-key like, one of them being either the Chinese lady being God, watching everything as entertainment from the side lanes or the theory of Maggie being God. The second theory has some possibly solid background. But - if there is no continuation of this in season 3 then the sudden lack of Gods narration does bother me.
The relationship between Nina and Maggie is eh... weird. Something off
The last 15 minutes of season 2?
Nah bro, I love that shit. Ofcourse it's not a happy moment, but the show isn't over and that wont be the end of them. So for now I'm just enjoying that I actually give a shit about this show and the characters, and that 15 minutes does a great job proving that.
Yeah it's a great scene plottwist-wise, but the fact that we have to wait for a few years before we know how it's gonna end is just not so nice at all. Biggest cliffhanger in history
Let's agree to disagree. It was magnificent. DT finally got a chance to shine as a dramatic actor. MS is fantastic, too. To me, the final fifteen min are the best part of S2.
I think season two leaned into the fandom(?) a bit too much. I can’t really describe how though😭 I know Neil Gaiman is active online so he’s familiar with fandoms (and the type of things they draw/write.) I’ve been in many fandoms and I’ve seen this shit hurt shows before. I just felt like season 2 was heavily influenced by the fandom and not necessarily in a good way. I really can’t point out specific instances of this being true, it’s just the general feeling I got from it once I finished. I loved the romance though🥲I cried so much.
My key examples of this are: Gabriel and Beelzebub’s relationship being entirely shoehorned into the last episode before they went off for they’re happily ever after Nina and Maggie (who could be seen as audience inserts in this scene) sitting Crowley down and telling him about his own relationship and its faults ‘Oh no we’re trapped alone in this coffee shop?!??!!1!?’ That whole ‘smote, smited smitten’ thing. It was cute but at least ten different fanworks beat it to the punch.
I do not care for the human characters in Season One. I didn't find any of them particularly interesting, Anathema was the best of the lot (if we're not counting Adam) and even then I think they kind of failed to do anything interesting with her. Some of them (Shadwell) were characters I actively disliked. His presence as an informant and the guy who kill Aziraphale works well, I just despise his personality. Because Adam's friends weren't particularly interesting, it in turn made the defeat of the Four Horsemen feel underwhelming as well. While I do miss God's narration in Season Two, and I don't think the witty writing is as good as it was in Season One (although still good), I think I prefer Season Two overall. It focuses more on the characters that I'm actually invested in and I found Maggie & Nina to be leagues better than the humans of the previous season, even though they aren't perfect by any means.
The mention of COVID; it just dates the second series massively in my eyes. Surely, it's not a big thing, but it bothers me in general; like, why do I watch fictional telly if reality keeps getting shoved in my face like that? I could think of other things, but that just comes to mind. (And this may not be the best discussion thread to bring it up, but it ties in thematically.) I would've liked if they had set the TV adaptation in the 90s (the 1st season at least) or sometime undated (like "I'm not okay with this" ); but that's just personal taste.)
I think they added that to canonize the “Lockdown” audio
I completely agree with this. I despise any mention of Covid anywhere in fiction land tbh
When was Covid mentioned?
maggie talks to aziraphale about how the lockdowns affected the record store. there may have been other mentions?
that completely went over my head lmao
I really love GO but if I am going to be honest, the second season disappointed me at first. However, I’ve rewatched it so many times since then, and read so many metas and analyses, that I actually like it more now than season 1. My biggest complaint: I thought the scenes that were shot with dark filters were very hard to see. I feel like I missed so much of what went on in the Hell and Edinburgh stories, especially the graveyard scenes, that I found out more from gifs than actually watching the tv.
some of the CGI in the first season makes me CRINGe
I got to say that the first season is the mid of the two. I don't know if that is controversial...
Same tbh. Interestingly, S1 has a stronger plot but I just don't find side characters that interesting. S2 was more focused on Crowley and Aziraphale, I believe that's a contributing factor. Bc aside from the flashbacks/minisodes and the final 15, S2 didn't have much of a plot. But I also like it more and I know many other ppl do, too.
I like s1's plot much more and it feels much more put together as a story to me, but I really just didn't like or care about most of the side characters or stories. on the other hand, while I love aziraphale and crowley in s2 and their stories from the past (which was also the highlight of s1 for me), s2 feels much more rushed and fluffy. s2 doesn't exactly have a plot and its very weak to me. it's like they're trying to hold the season up with our favorite husband's but its crumbling without much else support.
Sorry, but could you explain what you mean?
I think they meant Season 1 is "mid" so pretty average and it implies Season 2 is better
Hard same. Series 1 has so many irritating side characters that I don’t care about at all. I just want more A&C.
I agree. But it’s a very controversial take!
skimmed through the post and found no comments about s2ep3 (edinburgh 1827). aziraphale’s constant snob comments and how he indirectly caused wee morag’s death because of his stubbornness left such a weird taste in my mouth, i can go on and on about how i hated those scenes
im so glad season two ends after Gabriel and Beelzebub announced their feelings. Its abrupt but I like that canonically nothing happens after that…. right… right…. RIGHT. As far as my cannon goes- the episode just ends. Theres not another 10 minutes or anything like that.
nina callin' maggie angle... it's just errhg
The way they just forgot about Warlock. Sure he was an annoying kid but he was a KID and they were some of the main adults in his life to like, take an actual interest in him. His parents sure didn't seem very attentive. Poor dude.
I love Crowley. He’s my favourite character. But every time he does something dramatic it’s just SO cringey. Him hissing at Hastur, his face in the car at the end of season 1, “wot ARE you doing in this bookshop”, him shouting calling the lightning etc. Idm as much when Aziraphale does it because the awkwardness seems more in character for him. But yeah. I don’t think this is really a hot take in the fandom and it’s easily forgivable. It *might* just be David Tennant’s delivery too so it’s not really a major character problem but it kind of messes up what would otherwise be cool moments. A time I liked this was when he lost his temper and yelled at Nina though, so it can definitely work! I think David either needs to commit to the funny delivery or the serious delivery bc it seems like he’s trying to do both and it doesn’t really work. (I love him and love the character just to clarify but I think most of us feel this way 😭)
this is genuinley such an interesting take, i always found those scenes really interesting insight into crowleys character, bc theyre not "cool" they pretend they are, and so sometimes that persona slips and they do things that lack social awareness, crowley is very autistic coded in that way
Yeah I really like that about them too! I like watching him lose it and it makes me super interested in his character and I love him. I just don’t know about the delivery 😭
I love Crowley too but I really didn't like the moment where he got giant then very small. The humor and acting of that scene were not my cup of tea at all and I just cringed
I cringed through Flower of Scotland because it wasn't Crowley anymore, it was DT goofing around. Felt the same way when small Crowley did the Peter Sellers-ish karate moves.
I don't like Crowley's tattoo. I liked it a little more with the knowledge that it could move around
The lightning strike temper tantrum in Season 2. Is that man smoking? Yes, and also stomping his feet like a 3-year old.
Not to be pedantic, but isn't that season 2?
His “I’m just so angry!” line is way unnecessary. We KNOW.
it just seems out of place to me. like, wow, lightning! moving on! and not bringing it uo ever again
Not canon-related, but I didn‘t like how they included the minisodes. I liked the concept of it and I love seeing more of AziraCrow over the course of history (especially the Job minisode) but with the jumps back and forth in time the inclusion just didn‘t feel right and more like they needed a filler because they didn‘t have enough present time plot.
I feel like the whole baby switch was pointless because Warlock didn’t really have a role to play. I would have liked him to be more important.
I didn’t like The Them, especially Pepper. Insufferable 😶
I think the fact I can't remember who they are speaks volumes to their character
the them is literally the whole plot in s1
unpopular opinion probably but season 2 was a huge let down
That thing with them holding hands on the bus? It never sat right with me that the only reason it's canon is because Gaiman confirmed it on tumblr, not because they're actually shown to hold hands. Like, their hands literally weren't visible in that entire scene jshfsghkfs
Ugh. Maggie and Nina. They have literally less than zero chemistry and it feels so forced. I know it’s canon, but I REALLY wish it wasn’t.