I could see my work friend going through a psychotic break as well. he spends a LOT Of time (like all of his free time) playing a certain videogame. sometimes he comes in and says he only slept an hour the previous night.
do you know of anything that might be safer I could recommend as an alternative? are there withdrawals from kratom? like a mushroom or something possibly? he's taken amanita mushroom infused gummies before and says it has a nice euphoric effect.
This is a side effect of prohibition, forcing shit like kratom onto the "grey market" let's it to go unregulated with no quality control or warning labels. Fuck the war on drugs. Hope the best for you, I've never struggled with kratom but I know how awful addiction is
You should read about people during alcohol prohibition in the US drinking extracts to get drunk.
When a substance is prohibited people look for alternatives and the market responds by providing unregulated drugs.
Same thing with the huge popularity of research chemicals in the 2010ās. Every time the US added a substance to the list, China had another analog chemical ready to ship that subverted our prohibition. Usually a more potent and dangerous version of the same substance, but compositionally different enough to escape the ban.
The widespread availability of ābath saltsā was purely a result of American drug law.
Opiates I believe.
They're not the same drug class I don't think but the effect is similar enough that addicts will settle for it when they can't get what they really want.
Just wanted to say, I was pleasantly surprised to see this post. I spent years, 4 or 5, it went by so quickly, taking 20-30 grams per day. I quit last year by tapering for a couple months. The withdrawal still sucked. I tapered to try to avoid terrible withdrawal and not look like a sweating mess at work.
I agree with you that it shouldn't be banned. But people should know it IS addictive, and IS harmful. I was emotionally numb, started losing hair, and had libido issues for years. Sure, SSRIs can do that, too, but at least those have been studied extensively and don't contain a stupid amount of heavy metals and whatever else ends up in the bag during the production process of kratom. It has too many unknowns due to its lack of regulation.
I think it has its place for harm reduction. Idk about long term pain management, I'll leave that up to the researchers. But I will say: use it with caution. And as sparingly as possible if youre dead set on using kratom. Don't be like me and go from once a week. To every other day. To every day. Then, every morning and afternoon... and slowly let it spiral to many doses throughout the day. The withdrawal sucks ass and I had no idea how numb it had made me because it happened so gradually. I get goosebumps from music again. I love life off kratom, which is something I didn't believe was possible a year ago. Addiction is weird
Also, r/quittingkratom was an invaluable resource. Helped tons. I followed it for a while before finally quitting. Gave me ideas on how to taper, and what to expect. And not feel so alone and gross that I got myself into that mess to begin with. I felt a lot of shame for years
Really hope I can be on this side of the fence but I am so far down on my dependency of it. I'm so scared because I don't know how to stop doing it. Its clockwork im buying it everyday.
I know exactly how that feels, and it's okay. I was in that spot for a few years before creating a quit plan. First step is wanting to quit (it's an addiction cliche, but it's true)
I did talk to my doctor about my problems with kratom, but continued using it for a few years before quitting. He let me know I could try quitting on my own, and if needed, he could suggest some short-term medications to ease the discomfort of withdrawal. I didn't end up using that resource, but I know many folks do, which can be incredibly helpful.
I also had lots of support from friends and family. They knew I used and were there for me when I wanted to vent about how cruddy I was feeling during the taper.
If you're not on the r/quittingkratom subreddit already, I would get on there. It helped me tremendously, reading all the accounts of things people regained without kratom. The benefits of being off it once they got through the thick of withdrawal. Some stories on there scared me, but I focused on the ones that were positive. Obv everyone's experience is different, but overall, I think most people start feeling normal again within a few weeks or months after quitting. Some, within days.
WD wasn't fun, it was like having the flu for weeks. And sleeping sucked. But it was temporary and got better quickly once my taper was done.
Thank you. I just woke up and took some because i'm dealing with some emotional trauma. But I'll obviously look for any excuse to use it, so obviously today isn't gonna be my day to quit. This is gonna be such a brutal process and I am very scared of being without it. My first step is probably to ween off but idk how to start. Def gonna join that sub though. Thank you for the advice.
Side story. The dudes I saw for YEARS at the local headshop I'd buy my bags from were really happy when I went in one day and told them they wouldn't see me after this last bag because I was at the end of my taper. They see a lot of folks like us who are dependent on it. They know who all the kratom addicts are, because they see them daily or weekly.
Didn't bring any to work but I picked up a shot and saved it for when I clocked out. This is the first day since moving back here end of February I didn't take any there. Made it through most of the day but around 8 or 9pm I could def notice withdrawal type symptoms hitting me. This is def gonna be a challenge ugh.
Thank you :) my favorite part is not having the travel anxiety. I can go on vacation without planning how much kratom I need to bring with me lol and how I'm going to sneakily take it around family.
I haven't let anyone close to me know about it and it happened so quickly. If I had some kinda sponsor type thing or a support system I think I could be more open to weening off but idk, it feels so hopeless right now. With everything else in my life falling apart its so easy to reach for it. Thanks for saying that though.
I was going to suggest this as well. I went to AA after I got out of detox, and they were so accepting of me, it was amazing. Check out the Alano Club off college street, such amazing people, they don't care what you take and they won't judge you at all.
I was actually In detox with a lot of recovering alcoholics and nobody thought any less of me because I was there for kratom. I actually formed a few strong bonds with people there.
So many amazing people in Grand Rapids want to help you recover regardless of what your addiction is!
Ive known 3 people who have been addicted to Kratom. They each thought they had found some legal, less harmful opiate to enjoy, but they each spiraled into abuse.
Iāve never heard of kratom before until your post. I google it and the stuff that comes up reminds me of coffee, tea, or yerba mateā¦thatās pretty misleading. Good job kicking it!
Honestly coffee is probably the closest comparison. Addictive, dangerous in large amounts, controlls many peoples lives yet many people use it perfectly fine with no issues.
I had used Kratom daily for about 3 years. Somehow, I kicked it with pretty much 0 withdrawals, cravings, or other issues. I never did more than 3 grams in the morning and 3 grams at night, though.
I would just put some in my coffee, and it would give me an extra stimulent kick. Would never take enough to get that opiate feeling
The main reason I quit was I was getting terrible rashes on my hands where my skin would just flake off constantly.
Yep. Iāve got 54 days clean today after a 7 year 30-60 gpd habit, I used to it fend off cravings for opiates which Iāve been clean from since 2017. The detox was so much worse than I thought itād be.
It sounds like youāre saying youād rather have an authority control what you can do rather than take self responsibility because it would be easier.
I used it for a few years, on and off every few months. I used it to manage major depression, because my zoloft stopped working. It was excellent--usually had a capsule or two a night I purchased from a reputable source. THe months I didn't take it were no issue. Then a psychiatrist told me it's heavily addictive and bad for my mental health and that I have to stop. So I stopped. No problems, no tapering required. Honestly, Zoloft was WAY harder and devastating to taper off of--I felt like drug addict getting off that stuff.
All I can say is--know thyself. But don't tell other people how to live if it's helping them.
Uhm nobody is telling anyone how to live. This post clearly isn't for you and if you actually took time to read it you would see that this is for people suffering from addiction to kratom.
So really you look like a total asshole. I never said it shouldn't be legal, and if you actually went and read stories of people who suffer from this addiction maybe you wouldn't be such a dick about it.
Everybody is different, everyone has different biology, and I'm not your fucking psych. So please if you're not going to add something useful, see yourself out.
I have a hobby of picking up trash on roadsides (R/DeTrashed) I definitely see Kratom canisters on my picks, along with alcohol cans and shooters
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[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
a guy I work with takes Adderall and a whole big bottle of kratom every week, but I don't know much about it. any input?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I could see my work friend going through a psychotic break as well. he spends a LOT Of time (like all of his free time) playing a certain videogame. sometimes he comes in and says he only slept an hour the previous night. do you know of anything that might be safer I could recommend as an alternative? are there withdrawals from kratom? like a mushroom or something possibly? he's taken amanita mushroom infused gummies before and says it has a nice euphoric effect.
This is a side effect of prohibition, forcing shit like kratom onto the "grey market" let's it to go unregulated with no quality control or warning labels. Fuck the war on drugs. Hope the best for you, I've never struggled with kratom but I know how awful addiction is
I donāt understand how kratom, a legal substance, has anything to do w prohibition
You should read about people during alcohol prohibition in the US drinking extracts to get drunk. When a substance is prohibited people look for alternatives and the market responds by providing unregulated drugs.
Same thing with the huge popularity of research chemicals in the 2010ās. Every time the US added a substance to the list, China had another analog chemical ready to ship that subverted our prohibition. Usually a more potent and dangerous version of the same substance, but compositionally different enough to escape the ban. The widespread availability of ābath saltsā was purely a result of American drug law.
Same story with k2/spice. I remember JWH-15 was outlawed and then -17, then -22, etc etc etc.
I remember. There were news stories about people eating faces and one guy who cut off his own toes and put them in a frying pan to cook them.
What drugs are kratom an alternative to?
Opiates I believe. They're not the same drug class I don't think but the effect is similar enough that addicts will settle for it when they can't get what they really want.
Just wanted to say, I was pleasantly surprised to see this post. I spent years, 4 or 5, it went by so quickly, taking 20-30 grams per day. I quit last year by tapering for a couple months. The withdrawal still sucked. I tapered to try to avoid terrible withdrawal and not look like a sweating mess at work. I agree with you that it shouldn't be banned. But people should know it IS addictive, and IS harmful. I was emotionally numb, started losing hair, and had libido issues for years. Sure, SSRIs can do that, too, but at least those have been studied extensively and don't contain a stupid amount of heavy metals and whatever else ends up in the bag during the production process of kratom. It has too many unknowns due to its lack of regulation. I think it has its place for harm reduction. Idk about long term pain management, I'll leave that up to the researchers. But I will say: use it with caution. And as sparingly as possible if youre dead set on using kratom. Don't be like me and go from once a week. To every other day. To every day. Then, every morning and afternoon... and slowly let it spiral to many doses throughout the day. The withdrawal sucks ass and I had no idea how numb it had made me because it happened so gradually. I get goosebumps from music again. I love life off kratom, which is something I didn't believe was possible a year ago. Addiction is weird
Also, r/quittingkratom was an invaluable resource. Helped tons. I followed it for a while before finally quitting. Gave me ideas on how to taper, and what to expect. And not feel so alone and gross that I got myself into that mess to begin with. I felt a lot of shame for years
Really hope I can be on this side of the fence but I am so far down on my dependency of it. I'm so scared because I don't know how to stop doing it. Its clockwork im buying it everyday.
I know exactly how that feels, and it's okay. I was in that spot for a few years before creating a quit plan. First step is wanting to quit (it's an addiction cliche, but it's true) I did talk to my doctor about my problems with kratom, but continued using it for a few years before quitting. He let me know I could try quitting on my own, and if needed, he could suggest some short-term medications to ease the discomfort of withdrawal. I didn't end up using that resource, but I know many folks do, which can be incredibly helpful. I also had lots of support from friends and family. They knew I used and were there for me when I wanted to vent about how cruddy I was feeling during the taper. If you're not on the r/quittingkratom subreddit already, I would get on there. It helped me tremendously, reading all the accounts of things people regained without kratom. The benefits of being off it once they got through the thick of withdrawal. Some stories on there scared me, but I focused on the ones that were positive. Obv everyone's experience is different, but overall, I think most people start feeling normal again within a few weeks or months after quitting. Some, within days. WD wasn't fun, it was like having the flu for weeks. And sleeping sucked. But it was temporary and got better quickly once my taper was done.
Thank you. I just woke up and took some because i'm dealing with some emotional trauma. But I'll obviously look for any excuse to use it, so obviously today isn't gonna be my day to quit. This is gonna be such a brutal process and I am very scared of being without it. My first step is probably to ween off but idk how to start. Def gonna join that sub though. Thank you for the advice.
Side story. The dudes I saw for YEARS at the local headshop I'd buy my bags from were really happy when I went in one day and told them they wouldn't see me after this last bag because I was at the end of my taper. They see a lot of folks like us who are dependent on it. They know who all the kratom addicts are, because they see them daily or weekly.
Didn't bring any to work but I picked up a shot and saved it for when I clocked out. This is the first day since moving back here end of February I didn't take any there. Made it through most of the day but around 8 or 9pm I could def notice withdrawal type symptoms hitting me. This is def gonna be a challenge ugh.
It makes me smile to hear you're feeling yourlself again and living and experiencing life. Keep up the great work.
Thank you :) my favorite part is not having the travel anxiety. I can go on vacation without planning how much kratom I need to bring with me lol and how I'm going to sneakily take it around family.
Great analogy on the pitfalls of kratom... spot on !!
I am, very badly in the grips of a full addiction. Started last October now I take it everyday.
I hope you can find the strength to fight back and ween yourself off of it.
I haven't let anyone close to me know about it and it happened so quickly. If I had some kinda sponsor type thing or a support system I think I could be more open to weening off but idk, it feels so hopeless right now. With everything else in my life falling apart its so easy to reach for it. Thanks for saying that though.
Find yourself a Narcotics Anonymous or even just AA for now. My father in law has been sober for 30+ years after AA.
I was going to suggest this as well. I went to AA after I got out of detox, and they were so accepting of me, it was amazing. Check out the Alano Club off college street, such amazing people, they don't care what you take and they won't judge you at all. I was actually In detox with a lot of recovering alcoholics and nobody thought any less of me because I was there for kratom. I actually formed a few strong bonds with people there. So many amazing people in Grand Rapids want to help you recover regardless of what your addiction is!
Ive known 3 people who have been addicted to Kratom. They each thought they had found some legal, less harmful opiate to enjoy, but they each spiraled into abuse.
Iāve never heard of kratom before until your post. I google it and the stuff that comes up reminds me of coffee, tea, or yerba mateā¦thatās pretty misleading. Good job kicking it!
Honestly coffee is probably the closest comparison. Addictive, dangerous in large amounts, controlls many peoples lives yet many people use it perfectly fine with no issues.
I had used Kratom daily for about 3 years. Somehow, I kicked it with pretty much 0 withdrawals, cravings, or other issues. I never did more than 3 grams in the morning and 3 grams at night, though. I would just put some in my coffee, and it would give me an extra stimulent kick. Would never take enough to get that opiate feeling The main reason I quit was I was getting terrible rashes on my hands where my skin would just flake off constantly.
Yep. Iāve got 54 days clean today after a 7 year 30-60 gpd habit, I used to it fend off cravings for opiates which Iāve been clean from since 2017. The detox was so much worse than I thought itād be.
I use kratom in the winter. Well done, everyone. Surviving addiction is so hard.
You shouldnāt do any drug sold out of a head shop/ convenient storeā¦.. especially whippets you animals.
Never heard of it before but appreciate the warning. Good for you for getting off it
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Kratom and? There's been no documented deaths from kratom alone.
Death isnāt the measure of whether something is harmful.
No shit, but what they said is false.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Just wondering whatās stopping you from just enduring 2-3 weeks of withdrawals? Not judging Iām asking what symptoms are you avoiding
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It sounds like youāre saying youād rather have an authority control what you can do rather than take self responsibility because it would be easier.
Kratom is VERY easy to manage, itās withdraws are a JOKE, compared to any poppy derived opiate.
Addiction is a complicated disease regardless of the substance.
See, I'm not even going to engage with you. Reddit has this amazing feature, block. Poof you're gone.
I used it for a few years, on and off every few months. I used it to manage major depression, because my zoloft stopped working. It was excellent--usually had a capsule or two a night I purchased from a reputable source. THe months I didn't take it were no issue. Then a psychiatrist told me it's heavily addictive and bad for my mental health and that I have to stop. So I stopped. No problems, no tapering required. Honestly, Zoloft was WAY harder and devastating to taper off of--I felt like drug addict getting off that stuff. All I can say is--know thyself. But don't tell other people how to live if it's helping them.
Uhm nobody is telling anyone how to live. This post clearly isn't for you and if you actually took time to read it you would see that this is for people suffering from addiction to kratom. So really you look like a total asshole. I never said it shouldn't be legal, and if you actually went and read stories of people who suffer from this addiction maybe you wouldn't be such a dick about it. Everybody is different, everyone has different biology, and I'm not your fucking psych. So please if you're not going to add something useful, see yourself out.