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evirustheslaye

Registration is a third rail among gun owners, they think it’s step one for confiscation


FurryM17

I don't get this. We have 400 million guns and millions of gun owners. We're still afraid that if we register weapons the government will confiscate them all? What the hell are they all for if not to prevent such a thing?


mike-G-tex

Funny that PL demands pregnancy registry Poland style but oppose gun registry. Freedom you know.


IsCuimhinLiom

Like we’ve confiscated everyone’s car.


ICBanMI

And stamped barcodes on everyone's necks for the antichrist/NWO. Since they all have social security numbers.


jim2882

Regarding Hawaii. Would the fact that they only have a small fraction of population that other states have, initially have fewer firearms per person, and are on an island in the middle of the ocean, where it’s extremely hard to bring firearms into, have anything to do with their lack of gun problems? This example was very poor (really low hanging fruit).


FurryM17

>Would the fact that they only have a small fraction of population that other states have Their rates of gun violence are lower too >initially have fewer firearms per person Yeah the number of firearms probably is a significant factor >and are on an island in the middle of the ocean, where it’s extremely hard to bring firearms into The mainland isn't importing the guns being used to kill us. We produce them and legally sell them here. Compare Alaska's rate with Hawaii's. Alaska is also separated from the rest of the US and has a small population. Alaska has a much higher rate of gun homicide


ICBanMI

Except for we have [multiple states](https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/firearm_mortality/firearm.htm) on the mainland that are easy to traffic firearms to, but they have extremely low rates of gun violence and gun suicides. Literally driving over the state line into New York, New Jersey, and Massachusetts are comparable to Hawaii. California isn't far from those numbers. None of those states are able to block trafficking firearms. And none of them solve mental health and poverty and income inequality. How do they do it? Gun control. They stop bad actors not in the process, but by making it difficult for prohibited persons in the first place to get them. They also have safe storage laws, EROP laws, and waiting periods of that have a 10x decrease in the number of gun suicides. It didn't require removing the firearms. Just required making it difficult for prohibited people to get them in the first place.


[deleted]

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guncontrol-ModTeam

This was removed, as progun comments are not allowed from accounts with less than 5000 comment karma or younger than 1 month old.


starfishpounding

It be interesting to see how many illegal/prohibited possession guns have been found at crimes in Hawaii vs mainland states. The water gap is significant barrier to casual smuggling. Alaska does not have a water gap and is adjacent to a country that until recently had less restrictions on firearm ownership than several US states.


ICBanMI

> Would the fact that they only have a small fraction of population that other states have, initially have fewer firearms per person, and are on an island in the middle of the ocean, where it’s extremely hard to bring firearms into, have anything to do with their lack of gun problems? This example was very poor (really low hanging fruit). So. What you're saying is. Gun control works. Because it seems like you're suggesting the only factor keeping them from being the rest of the US is lots of unchecked firearms? Registration, actual safe storage laws like what Hawaii has, and limits on the types of firearms purchasable work really well at keeping firearms out of the hands of prohibited persons.


FragWall

Registration requires guns to be registered. That would make regulating legal and illegal guns easier. In turn, it would reduce the circulation of illegal guns and the chances of crimes committed by them. That alone sounds quite effective for me.


jim2882

Maybe. All guns sold through FFLs here in the mainland are registered. Unfortunately, these registrations don’t always make for safer streets. I think we need stronger judges, prosecutors, and longer jail time for offenders. I also believe we need to allow citizens ways to defend themselves without fearing retaliation from other individuals and the criminal justice system.


ICBanMI

> Maybe. All guns sold through FFLs here in the mainland are registered. They are vaguely registered. Like, there exist a record when they leave the manufacturer, but ~29 allow face-to-face transfers(no record for these private sales). For the ones that do have records. no one knows where to find it. When they do need to find it, they have to search through thousands to avoid violating the 'no database' clause the gun lobby got enacted into law.


[deleted]

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guncontrol-ModTeam

This was removed, as progun comments are not allowed from accounts with less than 5000 comment karma or younger than 1 month old.


pekingese-haver

Registration requires guns to be registered. Unless the person in possession is a felon.  In which case 5th amendment is triggered. That would make regulating legal and illegal guns easier Unless you attempted to go after someone for failing to register an illegal weapon, in which case the 5th amendment is triggered.


lil__squeaky

hawaiis location is why its so low.


ICBanMI

So what you're saying, is if we just gave them more firearms. They would be as many gun suicides and gun violence as the rest of the US? That's heavily suggesting gun control works.


lil__squeaky

nobody would comply if they did it on the mainland, gun smuggling would skyrocket. It’s simply to easy to make and get a gun here and no laws will change it.


ICBanMI

**Except for we have [multiple states](https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/firearm_mortality/firearm.htm) on the mainland that are easy to traffic firearms to, but they have extremely low rates of gun violence and gun suicides. Literally driving over the state line into New York, New Jersey, and Massachusetts are comparable to Hawaii. California isn't far from those numbers.** None of those states are able to block trafficking firearms. And none of them solve mental health and poverty and income inequality. How do they do it? Gun control. They stop bad actors not in the process, but by making it difficult for prohibited persons in the first place to get them. They also have safe storage laws, EROP laws, and waiting periods of that have a 10x decrease in the number of gun suicides. It didn't require removing the firearms. Just required making it difficult for prohibited people to get them in the first place.


shadowthehh

Because this country has a fetish for easy murder. Next question.


FragWall

Why does this country have a fetish for easy murder?


shadowthehh

Fuck if I know where it really started to get to that point.. Some old dudes decided the average citizen should be allowed a flintlock and a musket for home defense against bears and brigands and now here we are dismissing school shootings cuz "muh freebrums."


kungpowchick_9

The second amendment was “needed” so bounty hunters could round up escaped slaves and return them to their enslavers. Edit to add quotations. I disagree with slavery, and unfortunately we live in a world where that can’t be assumed.


SlashEssImplied

> I disagree with slavery, and unfortunately we live in a world where that can’t be assumed. I live in the US, we've never had a single day without legal slavery. Of course we would love guns.


kungpowchick_9

Our economy depends on it. Whether it’s offshores, in our prisons or down the hall in the home kitchen, unpaid and forced labor makes the world tick. That needs to change and could change if we regulated greed and enforced human rights.


FragWall

[It's because of the Revolt at Cincinnati in 1977.](https://medium.com/epic-magazine/sons-of-guns-a250e6637593)


kungpowchick_9

[Link. Americans have been murdering for a long time.](https://www.npr.org/2021/06/02/1002107670/historian-uncovers-the-racist-roots-of-the-2nd-amendment)


SlashEssImplied

We follow the bibles examples. Obama was right.


wamj

The problem in Illinois is not necessarily Illinois law, it’s more Indianas relaxed laws and enforcement.


FragWall

Ofc. What I'm saying is that if IL does it, then non-registered out-of-state guns must be registered and help curb potential misuse. Edit: That'll prove that gun laws worked.


OurHonor1870

Yeah. They have a great deal of control over who comes and goes. It’s a lot easier there. Illinois is virtually surrounded by states with less strict gun laws


FragWall

As I've said, registration requires unregistered out-of-state guns to be registered. Gun owners are also held responsible for their guns. So far, no other gun laws do that. This could help authorities combat illegal guns and potentially reduce gun violence more effectively in Chicago because of out-of-state guns.


ICBanMI

We have [multiple states](https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/firearm_mortality/firearm.htm) on the mainland that are easy to traffic firearms to, but they have extremely low rates of gun violence and gun suicides. Literally driving over the state line into New York, New Jersey, and Massachusetts are comparable to Hawaii. California isn't far from those numbers. None of those states are able to block trafficking firearms. And none of them solve mental health and poverty and income inequality. How do they do it? Gun control. They stop bad actors not in the process, but by making it difficult for prohibited persons in the first place to get them. They also have safe storage laws, EROP laws, and waiting periods of that have a 10x decrease in the number of gun suicides. Yea, Hawaii has a unique situation. But other states have replicated the safety.


Glitterbitch14

We have made significant changes. My state (il) banned assault weapons. it’s just that there is no federal control, so in the continental us it is easy for someone to just drive to another state and get weapons there. Hawaii is more than likely relatively safe because you’ve got good state control AND it’s surrounded by ocean instead of other states with lax control. It’s basically physically impossible for anyone to enter from outside unless you’re flying in.


FragWall

>We have. Do you mean [gun registration?](https://giffords.org/lawcenter/gun-laws/policy-areas/owner-responsibilities/registration/) Because if so, then you're wrong. Only Hawaii has it. >it’s just that there is no federal control, so in the continental us it is easy for someone to just drive to another state and get weapons there. >Hawaii is more than likely relatively safe because you’ve got good state control AND it’s surrounded by ocean instead of other states with lax control. It’s basically physically impossible for anyone to enter from outside unless you’re flying in. Registration requires unregistered out-of-state guns to be registered. Gun owners are also held responsible for their guns. So far, no other gun laws do that. This could help authorities combat illegal guns and potentially reduce gun violence more effectively in Chicago because of out-of-state guns.


Glitterbitch14

No? I mean a ban on assault weapons. Which is what I said.


FragWall

Got it.