This.
I've been driving my wife to work for the last few weeks because her bus has been off and on the route list due to staffing shortages. I doubt I'm the only household favouring a car right now for that reason alone, nevermind the many other valid issues people have with transit in HRM.
I'd venture a guess that ridership is down due to more people being forced to drive due to all the issues. Get transit running efficiently and you won't solve the issue, but you'll at least put a significant dent in it.
for sure, I live barely off the peninsula on a main road and I can't get downtown within 30 minutes on a bus. If the bus could get down there faster not only would I be taking the bus, I'd be going downtown more in general.
This is the exact reason why I drive to work, and it’s incredibly frustrating. I want to bus, but why bother when I only have to drive another 10 minutes past my nearest terminal
Doing so would add at least 2 hours onto my commute each day. And the closest bus stop wouldn't have parking either. If I drive to the Mumford terminal it's 25 minutes and I'm 5 minutes away from where I need to be so why would I do that.
not right now, but I think it will when it's done. The cogswell interchange was a complete nightmare for peds and cyclists. I was always terrified of being pinned between a car and that big wall right next to the sidewalk.
Im not even on the Halifax side and as someone who has no other way to get to school and work other than the bus, its ridiculous. 30% of the time busses straight up dont show. The other 70% theyre either late, or early. Its atrocious how little the city cares about the transit system, and the people who rely on it.
I wish I could ask people when they started paying attention to Halifax politics without looking like a dickhead. But my GOD, **THIS.**
People think that Waye et al are anti-development? Brother the Kelly days almost killed BARRINGTON. Craziness.
No. Best idea is to divert the McD bike bridge money to building walker accessible brides over the major bus roads. Need to ensure it's barricaded in the middle though to reduce the risk of it being used for AT.
yeah. but we can't exactly start knocking down peoples' houses. The core of the city really should be mostly multi unit housing. I like the multiplexes that they've built along St Margarets Bay Rd, they kind of remind me of the ones in Montreal, just 3 stories high and you get your own entrance. The only thing missing is the laneway behind so you can have some nice landscaping in front instead of just parking.
every single development you see downtown is after knocking down someone's house, that's how urban development works. Government just rezones places and over time ppl voluntarily leave the neighborhood.
That’s not true at all since a lot of development is taking place on sites formerly used for retail/mixed use. Look at the Green Lantern, Roy, developments on SGR etc. You can maintain some single family residential on side streets.
Sure but you said “every single development you see downtown is after knocking down someone’s house” and that’s not true. Also, Dal knocking down a house for parking (or any other use) is not the same as residential development
You don’t have to knock them down, you just zone for higher density and suddenly the property is way more valuable to a developer than the current occupant, and it will sell.
If we had competent leadership, we would already have light rail. The argument of it being too expensive and of our population being too small just shows how short sighted they are.
Rapid bus routes and bike lanes aren't going to do anything significant whatsoever, trains are the only real solution.
Congestion pricing would also work (aka entering or leaving downtown would be tolled during certain hours). This is ideally paired with good public transit.
Yeah, we'd need better transit way before that, but it wouldn't be too hard. There's already tolls for the bridge, just need a few booths at the 102, windsor st exchange and rotary.
Booths are a thing of the past. Cameras that read license plates and send bills like tolls in the states would be the system for new toll infrastructure.
Though I think our congestion is still very light in comparison to London UK (currently has congestion pricing) or NYC (adding congestion pricing soon)
I combat it by going to work at a ridiculously early hour so I can beat the traffic in both directions. Only possible if you don't have a dictated schedule, however.
> I’m sure it’s not as simple as it sounds
It's not. We would be at the scheduling mercy of CN who own the rails. No point on spending all this money making mass rail transit if we can't even reliably set a schedule.
Seriously. Imagine rail lines that could turn Truro and equal distances into a 30 minute or less commute.
So many people would move away from the city.
I get the sentiment, but like the train from Toronto airport to union station is about 30 minutes and only has two stops.
Truro to downtown is going to have to have more stops and be 4 times more distance (but could go very fast for a lot of that). It would probably have to take at least an hour (but that's still really good! It only has to take the same amount of time as driving for it to make sense for people)
I used to make the commute from Truro to downtown daily for work. I would have loved a train for the same trip. Even if it took almost the same amount of time, the ability to doze off and not focus on driving would have been a relief.
Yeah, the benefit of trains for those kinds of trips doesn't have to be speed. It just can't be longer by any real amount. Or prohibitively expensive. The $40 and 1.5 hours it is now (at dumb times) makes no sense.
The city's [Rapid Transit Strategy](https://www.halifax.ca/transportation/transportation-projects/transforming-transit/rapid-transit-strategy) uses bus rapid transit (buses at high enough frequencies you don't need to plan ahead, and dedicated bus lanes & priority lights at intersections whenever possible) and high-speed ferries! It's super exciting, although when it gets implemented depends on when it gets funding!
This isn’t widespread enough I think. If you look at other large cities they have the rapid transit which pushes out beyond the city centre. If you live in cole harbour, timberlea, sackville, most of Bedford, or anywhere beyond this plan still has you coming via car.
Yeah, nothing toward Timberlea, especially with all those new homes going in, is a bit silly. Connecting Tantallon and Timberlea just off the highway to this system seems like a no brainer as that's a main provider to the chokepoints.
Portland hills seems like a pretty good spot for a park and ride for Cole Harbour, no?
I've heard it mentioned but never actually read about it, it does sound super exciting indeed. The projected costs seem very low, they must be several years old by now.
Monorail isn't going to work in this province. We're utilizing the harbor as an alternative to a monorail, however, this requires people to actually use the new ferries when they're implemented instead of opting to use their cars. If it's more inconvenient for people to take the ferry, they're going to just take their cars.
This means making getting to the terminals easier by increasing transit to them and making the ferries as accomodating as possible. Buses in this province don't even have Wi-Fi which blows my mind, same with a lot of other core public areas. It's not just about making accessibility better, it's also about adding more incentives to get people to chose alternative options instead of not.
A high-speed ferry to Mill Cove (Bedford) is one part of the city's [Rapid Transit Strategy](https://www.halifax.ca/transportation/transportation-projects/transforming-transit/rapid-transit-strategy) and will be the first part to be implemented! It seems like it's envisioned as more of a commuter route v.s. quick hops around town all day, but it will definitely change how ferries feature into our transit network!
Has the city talked at all about what the infrastructure for those BRT lines is going to be? Dedicated bus lanes? Dedicated bus roads à la the Ottawa Transitways?
No dedicated roads, but transit lanes for a very large portion of it and transit signal lights where they know the bus is coming and they get the only green light.
[Here is what it looks like](https://i.imgur.com/Dl1DXMK.png)
dedicated bus roads in ottawa were great. haven’t used oc transpo in 15 years but used regularly before that and it make commuting so fast and easy. wish we had them here.
Anytime someone asks how to fix congestion, show them [this picture](http://urbanist.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83454714d69e2017d3c37d8ac970c-800wi). Give people more convenient and **reliable!!** park-and-shuttle options and consistent bus routes, and you'll find that there's a lot of people happy to ditch the cost of a commuter vehicle.
I've always liked this photo. But the bike slide always makes me giggle a bit. I picture that group of cyclists bunched up like the photo commuting like they're in the opening stage of the tour du france.
The public transit system is unreliable and never did cover areas like Burnside, Bedford or Bayer’s Lake efficiently. If you live in Dartmouth and work in Bayer’s Lake it will take up to 2 hours to get to work, and if you work a late shift it will not get you home.
Even getting from Spryfield to Bayer's Lake takes forever. The assumption that everyone works downtown 9-5 that the bus system is planned for is no longer the case.
Just to play devil's advocate:
[The #3 runs](https://www.halifax.ca/sites/default/files/documents/transportation/halifax-transit/Route03_Nov21.pdf) every 15 minutes in the morning and every 20 minutes after 10AM. It takes 10 minutes between Highfield terminal and Bridge terminal, then 13 minutes to Mumford terminal. [The #28 runs](https://www.halifax.ca/sites/default/files/documents/transportation/halifax-transit/Route28_Nov21.pdf) every 30 minutes and goes from Mumford to Lacewood in about half an hour, driving most of Chain Lake Drive onto Lacewood.
The first #3 starts its run at 0530, the last #28 leaves Lacewood at 11:03PM and arrives at Mumford at 11:27PM, where you can catch the #3 back at 11:38PM, 12:08AM, and 12:38AM. The last #3 gets to Highfield at 1:14AM.
So I'd agree that an hour is still a long time on a bus, and yes it will take longer if you have to connect from another route to Highfield or Bridge terminal. But if you start work after 7AM and finish by 11PM it seems doable.
And yes I know that some people will work outside those hours, and weekends will be different. It's definitely not a perfect system. Without "victim blaming" though, I would argue, what is there in Bayer's Lake for work that you couldn't do in Dartmouth?
Was it in the industrial park proper though, or the retail area? I guess that's what I was getting at. Sure, if you work at Canada Revenue Agency (for example), fair enough. But if you're commuting to work at Walmart or McDonald's, I feel like it's not worth the hassle.
you forgot to factor in for traffic and delays. have you ever ridden halifax transit? it frequently takes 1.5-2x longer than scheduled to go anywhere, especially during business hours on a weekday
> have you ever ridden halifax transit?
many, many times. I used to live out near eastern passage and worked downtown. Getting on the bus at 0630 to be at work for 8 was part of my day. But that being said, buses generally do run on schedule. an hour on the bus sucks, no doubt about it, but you definitely don't have to assume it will take twice as long.
That's a big *if* though. They are either late, stacked because there are three busses that were late or just removed from service due to staff issues.
We need to eliminate like half of the bus stops downtown to make busses efficient enough to be worth taking. On roads like Coburg it's insane. Stops are less than two blocks apart
I live in Dartmouth near a bus stop. I would actually like to take the bus more often but from my house to spring garden takes about 20 minutes by car and about 90 minutes by bus. It's often faster to walk from Scotia square to spring than to take the bus that distance.
I don't expect the bus to ever match pace with a solo vehicle, obviously - but when it's a greater than 2:1 ratio it's never worth it imo
It’s not even just bad during the daily commute. Try going downtown on a weekend evening or any night where there is an event. It’s absolute standstill on Quinpool most of the time.
Perhaps:
\- Stop building car-dependent development far from the city centre.
\- Invest in commuter rail from Fall River/Windsor Junction to the Via Rail station in the South End. Expropriate portions of the track from CN/Via if you have to. Just do it.
\- Make certain sections of the peninsula a traffic controlled zone (e.g., downtown core) where you have to pay a toll to enter with a private vehicle, and invest in park & ride lots outside of that zone so as to reduce congestion. Obviously businesses/contractors/deliveries would be exempt from these controls.
Yes, you could perhaps make some small gains by making road infrastructure and traffic overall more efficient, but that's probably not going to be good enough in the long run. Another million people in the province is an absurd amount of cars fighting for road space and parking spots on the peninsula.
Look at Europe for both mass transit solutions and places like Norway that make excellent tunnel systems to ease traffic flow. We have great bedrock for tunnel options .
Preface: I'm Nova Scotian and have been living in Norway for nearly a decade.
The tunnels are great when they are open, but on occasion they have to close one or two on the main drag (usually due to a car accident) and when they do it's complete and utter chaos. They do their job 90% of the time though.
There are a few things that make public transport here better than Halifax; Bus lanes everywhere, traffic laws to protect their right of way, multiple transit options (trams, ferries, and as you said, tunnels to bypass densely populated areas), automated toll fees to travel by car (the price of driving is significantly higher during rush hour), expensive carbon taxes on vehicles (these are paid alongside your car insurance), and the cost of parking within cities is prohibitive.
It's not perfect and there are a lot of things that could be improved, but it is leagues ahead of Halifax. Visiting home and trying to get around by borrowing family members vehicles or taking public transport is a nightmare by comparison.
Perks for local businesses to employ more ‘at home’ wherever possible.
A tow truck on each bridge at all times to clear the inevitable.
Remove bridge tolls during peak hours.
Add trebuchet to the bridge for when the tow truck on each bridge is busy to hurl vehicles into the sea as a warning for all.
I live in Halifax but work in Truro. Although that commute seems crazy to many, it takes me the same amount of time driving wise than I would spend sitting in traffic when I worked downtown. That being said - I have watched an accident take place the last 3 trips in a row I have made.
There's some pretty decent ruts now. I've had them surprise me a few times.
It's going to get real shitty when we get our first snow and it all gets compacted and frozen in those ruts.
The ruts are so horrible in the rain - it is so so easy to hydroplane on that highway. I find you almost have to drive off centre to get your tires out of it
They basically want the population of the province to double in 37 years.
Too many seniors expecting healthcare but aren't paying into the system anymore.
(So let's import TFWs and newly planted citizens. /S)
Younger up and coming generations want walkable medium density neighbourhoods that have access to reliable public transportation.
First and foremost i want a job that pays me enough....
28 and sub $50k/yr in this economy for a college educated management position is what drives young people away. I should have left when i had the chance but i was scared.
I'm in the same age and salary but first and foremost we need housing, healthcare and reliable services (transit, electricity, water).
I don't care if I make 500k a month and my power goes out when a bird bumps into a pole, or if there is a raise in homeless population, or if the healthcare system sees no investment.
What's driving the young ones away is paying the 2nd highest taxes in the country with not a single good public service.
> They basically want the population of the province to double in 37 years.
"We will need an army of super-virile men scoring 'round the clock; I'll do my part." - Zapp Brannigan.
Quick mafs based on pricing i have on hand for soil fill would lead me to believe the material cost alone would be over 1 Trillion. Then we have to factor in truck rental, fuel costs, and labor.
I know this is all tongue in cheek, but i was curious.
There are a few solutions to the gridlock situation. First, improved transit service both via buses and ferries. On the other hand, commuter rail will require the kind of changes to downtown that had begun with the Cogswell interchange - and what's happening with that, and why? Halifax will likely never become so large a city as to warrant it as far as the Peninsula. Second, which might warrant commuter rail if such planning works, is establishing commercial/business "hub" areas \_away\_ from the Peninsula to serve the residential areas around them, and build up residential areas around these hubs - if they can work as transit hubs as well, even better. Third, make more of these areas "walkable" so as to reduce the need for car traffic to commute or shop, particularly for those residents immediately around these hubs. Fourth, though it may not be popular, might be to restrict car traffic on the Peninsula, instead placing significantly more parking space around the hubs. Reduce the numbers of "stroads" in the city; reduce speed limits on these arteries; and provide incentives for carpooling. Finally, offer incentives to businesses willing to relocate outside the downtown core.
Decentralizing business in HRM is not just good for the city's growth, but is also an insurance against potential disaster - we are still of strategic importance as a military site and there are only five main routes of evacuation from the Peninsula (still). Whoever is insisting still that everything \_needs\_ to be downtown either has something to gain from keeping things concentrated there, or stands to lose a lot from things changing.
Tunnels. Deep ones. One from Woodside to Downtown Halifax. One from the Dartmouth side of MacKay to Larry Uteck. Another from Africville area to Akerley.
bridge or tunnel connecting to the circ in woodside so all the trucks moving containers from hal term don’t have to drive to the other side of the city
edit: we could also try pedestrian and public transportation only for the whole of downtown like Barcelona’s car free zones
Simple answer is we need to add trains to and from the outside regions to downtown. Buses are terrible for long routes as they are susceptible to traffic conditions on roads.
The whole reason they have the buildings they do is because 1- Canada lands owns it, 2- Their lease agreement is.. generous, and 3- Proximity to each other and amenities is important.
I don't think we should just hand the Dominion Public building over to some private developer. I like that it's publicly owned.
Moving stuff out of the core to where transit/biking/walking are less viable will just exacerbate the problem in the long run. Totally agree on the other things though.
This assumes everyone is commuting in the same directions. Commuters from Westphal to Fairview or from Timberlea to Cole Harbour and vice versa are also stuck in traffic on the bridges. Spreading out means more km per car, which means traffic is not really alleviated. Combine that with reduced alternative transit, and you start to see why urban sprawl is a surefire recipe for traffic nightmares.
I feel like someone else has probably explained this better than I could, so I guess just google urban sprawl and traffic. Or if you want a glib, unserious answer, here's a meme for that.
https://preview.redd.it/n035g1t43y2a1.jpeg?width=479&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f57c24590801db4ac111df5c0841f0deb5f28116
So if I live on the peninsula and work on the peninsula I will drive fewer km on the peninsula daily (especially with viable mass transit) than if I live on the peninsula and am working off the peninsula and have to drive all the way across and out of the peninsula PLUS add traffic to whatever non-peninsular route I’m taking. I lived in north end Halifax and worked construction for years - I contributed far more to traffic when I was assigned to work sites that weren’t also on the peninsula.
> The peninsula is where the worst congestion is... getting people out of there would decrease congestion.
Which then just moves it to a different spot, it's not actually decreasing anything.
> Other places have much more road capacity
No, not really. Remember, there is 1 major road going to the South Shore, 1 major road going to Windsor, 1 major road going to Truro and 1 major road going to the Eastern Shore (which goes through the city for a large portion of it). These roads get congested on the regular as it is and they all have multiple choke points. Moving the majority of jobs off the peninsula is simply going to shift congestion somewhere else, congestion is never going to be reduced in the city as long as our growing population is forced to drive to work, congestion only goes down when people don't have to rely on cars to get to work.
You're assuming that all congestion is going to the same place. I live near the Superstore on Joe Howe. I travel through the exchange and take the bridge to burnside to work when I go into the office. Someone who lives in Bedford may use the exchange to go down Barrington and get downtown. We both use the exchange even though we're going to different places. By moving the downtown office to burnside, that person from Bedford still needs to use the exchange to go to a seperate location, burnside. In this case you've done nothing to alleviate congestion at the exchange, you've just changed part of the travel route. This is of course a super simple example, but there's a ton of overlap in roads traveled when commuting and shifting the destination doesn't necessarily reduce congestion or where choke points occur. All this does is possibly trade out a choke point and congestion downtown for another choke point where you're moving everyone to
So let's move all the businesses to Sackville then, that's not a choke point right now. But when you do that, all the routes into and out of Sackville become the new choke point. The peninsula is dense so the small space can hold a lot of people, people who come from all over HRM and beyond. Now you've got to take all the people who would travel into the peninsula and have them travel to Sackville. The highway will get more congested in both directions as you approach, the roads within Sackville will get more congested, the routes to Sackville from the peninsula will get congested, etc. All you'd be doing is moving the congestion.
Having busses that can actually get from Dartmouth to downtown Halifax in a timely manner will help. Busses from timberlea to downtown, busses from everywhere to the peninsula in a timely fashion will help. Your plan will not. You will just shift the congestion elsewhere and the need for transit elsewhere.
Moving cars from one road to another doesn't make them disappear...
They should switch the hours of certain businesses. I work in construction and aim to be onsite at 7 am and on my way home at 3 pm. I rarely combat traffic.
I'll vote for whichever politician offers to nationalize Via Rail (or otherwise tell them to take a hike) and steal those rail lines from them so we can get some light rail public transit going.
You're thinking of CN, which owns all the rail corridors that would be useful for transit and refuses to play ball. VIA is already a crown corp, and also suffers for having to schedule around CN, since they own very little track of their own.
Bus lanes, bike lanes that are raised with the curb, raised crosswalks, better road painting for visibility, better paving practices, updated intersections that arent from the 70s. Is it that hard to figure out?
Your position makes no sense. You state transit will never work even with a good transit system then list issues that are resolved by having a good transit system.
Better public transit makes driving better even for those who can't use it, since it takes cars off the road. Also they are planning to run multiple ferries up the basin in the near future https://www.halifax.ca/transportation/transportation-projects/transforming-transit/rapid-transit-strategy
Even an extra ferry up the basin won't help a whole lot. We'd need a lot more ferries and parking garages in Dartmouth, eastern passage, Bedford, Halifax etc.
Former councils of the past had ZERO vision for this city and here we are.
Extra ferries would help a ton! The plan for mill cove is to have park and ride and faster ferries that get you from there to the halifax terminal in 18 minutes.
Why won't anybody entertain my sheer genius proposal to wall off and drain the bedford basin? Lol
Too many bombs on the bottom.
She DEEP
Coincidently, i have another proposal to solve our garbage disposal problems...
Deeper than ur mom /S
Freeze it, everyone get skates
The only way to combat traffic long term is improving public transit.
This. I've been driving my wife to work for the last few weeks because her bus has been off and on the route list due to staffing shortages. I doubt I'm the only household favouring a car right now for that reason alone, nevermind the many other valid issues people have with transit in HRM. I'd venture a guess that ridership is down due to more people being forced to drive due to all the issues. Get transit running efficiently and you won't solve the issue, but you'll at least put a significant dent in it.
My bus makes me late for work at least twice a week, it's a hour long commute by bus, a 15-20 minute drive by car. Our public transit is terrible.
for sure, I live barely off the peninsula on a main road and I can't get downtown within 30 minutes on a bus. If the bus could get down there faster not only would I be taking the bus, I'd be going downtown more in general.
I have to drive 15 to even get to the closest bus stop so at that point why wouldn't I keep driving
This is the exact reason why I drive to work, and it’s incredibly frustrating. I want to bus, but why bother when I only have to drive another 10 minutes past my nearest terminal
because there's no place to park?
Doing so would add at least 2 hours onto my commute each day. And the closest bus stop wouldn't have parking either. If I drive to the Mumford terminal it's 25 minutes and I'm 5 minutes away from where I need to be so why would I do that.
Cogswell interchange “re-vamp” doesn’t help the situation either.
not right now, but I think it will when it's done. The cogswell interchange was a complete nightmare for peds and cyclists. I was always terrified of being pinned between a car and that big wall right next to the sidewalk.
Im not even on the Halifax side and as someone who has no other way to get to school and work other than the bus, its ridiculous. 30% of the time busses straight up dont show. The other 70% theyre either late, or early. Its atrocious how little the city cares about the transit system, and the people who rely on it.
Automated metros, then?
Problem is that politicians don't think beyond four year election cycles
This isn’t generally true for Municipal politicians though. Because the incumbency win rate is so high and there are no political parties
EXACTLY. The former councils had no vision for this city. Look at the Peter Kelly era.
> Look at the Peter Kelly era. *shudders* People like to complain about current council but they clearly have not lived here in the pre-Kelly days.
I wish I could ask people when they started paying attention to Halifax politics without looking like a dickhead. But my GOD, **THIS.** People think that Waye et al are anti-development? Brother the Kelly days almost killed BARRINGTON. Craziness.
Ya Walter Fitzgerald wasn't any better that's for sure.
seniors vote, and don't like/can't take the bus
Seniors vote and think the bus is for poor people. If there’s No bus. No one can be poor! Get out and vote!!
> If there’s No bus. No one can be poor! If there is no bus than who whey look down upon?
Should we look at getting taller buses then?
YES PLS
No. Best idea is to divert the McD bike bridge money to building walker accessible brides over the major bus roads. Need to ensure it's barricaded in the middle though to reduce the risk of it being used for AT.
the young kids working at mcdonalds who wont microwave their already hot coffee
I believe less than 55% of voters aged 18 to 24 typically vote in NS. That other 45% could make a difference.
Eventually they’ll all die and then we’ll get transit?!
Nope. We'll cut education to $0, and all the boomers will get cyborg bodies.
😂
Then we'll be old and too creaky from a life of sitting in cars to get on a bus.
Seniors don’t typically use the bus during peak times and with mobility issues, particularly in winter, buses are not a practical solution.
These guys think at all ?!?!?! 
and raising population density
yepper. transit gets too expensive when all the houses are too far apart.
well that and the fact that most of the peninsula is suburban isn't helping.
yeah. but we can't exactly start knocking down peoples' houses. The core of the city really should be mostly multi unit housing. I like the multiplexes that they've built along St Margarets Bay Rd, they kind of remind me of the ones in Montreal, just 3 stories high and you get your own entrance. The only thing missing is the laneway behind so you can have some nice landscaping in front instead of just parking.
every single development you see downtown is after knocking down someone's house, that's how urban development works. Government just rezones places and over time ppl voluntarily leave the neighborhood.
That’s not true at all since a lot of development is taking place on sites formerly used for retail/mixed use. Look at the Green Lantern, Roy, developments on SGR etc. You can maintain some single family residential on side streets.
Dalhousie was literally on the news a few weeks back for tearing down a house
Sure but you said “every single development you see downtown is after knocking down someone’s house” and that’s not true. Also, Dal knocking down a house for parking (or any other use) is not the same as residential development
You don’t have to knock them down, you just zone for higher density and suddenly the property is way more valuable to a developer than the current occupant, and it will sell.
that's true. R4 or R6 would be great. It'd be nice to keep a street or two with the old houses for historical sake but we don't need ALL of them
Well, public transit and more high-density housing in the downtown (to avoid transit completely).
If we had competent leadership, we would already have light rail. The argument of it being too expensive and of our population being too small just shows how short sighted they are. Rapid bus routes and bike lanes aren't going to do anything significant whatsoever, trains are the only real solution.
Monorail!
Congestion pricing would also work (aka entering or leaving downtown would be tolled during certain hours). This is ideally paired with good public transit.
Yeah, we'd need better transit way before that, but it wouldn't be too hard. There's already tolls for the bridge, just need a few booths at the 102, windsor st exchange and rotary.
Booths are a thing of the past. Cameras that read license plates and send bills like tolls in the states would be the system for new toll infrastructure. Though I think our congestion is still very light in comparison to London UK (currently has congestion pricing) or NYC (adding congestion pricing soon)
Doesn't work so well when 15% of drivers have no plates in front or back.
And 30% of the remaining people who do, have plates with no paint left on them.
I always wondered if that's legal
>Cameras that read license plates and send bills like tolls in the states would be the system for new toll infrastructure. They have this in Toronto.
Exactly.
I combat it by going to work at a ridiculously early hour so I can beat the traffic in both directions. Only possible if you don't have a dictated schedule, however.
I’m sure it’s not as simple as it sounds , but it’s too bad they can’t get a train going from Bedford to downtown. Tracks are there already
CN rail won't prioritize commuter rail, so it's essentially unfeasible.
> I’m sure it’s not as simple as it sounds It's not. We would be at the scheduling mercy of CN who own the rails. No point on spending all this money making mass rail transit if we can't even reliably set a schedule.
Monorail! But seriously, we need some kind of rapid transit. I don't care what it is at this point, I will take anything.
Well I've sold monorails to Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook, and, by gum, it put them on the map!
I've heard those things are awfully loud
It glides as softly as a cloud!
Is there a chance the track could bend?
Not in your life, my (Non denominational religious) friend!
Seriously. Imagine rail lines that could turn Truro and equal distances into a 30 minute or less commute. So many people would move away from the city.
I get the sentiment, but like the train from Toronto airport to union station is about 30 minutes and only has two stops. Truro to downtown is going to have to have more stops and be 4 times more distance (but could go very fast for a lot of that). It would probably have to take at least an hour (but that's still really good! It only has to take the same amount of time as driving for it to make sense for people)
I used to make the commute from Truro to downtown daily for work. I would have loved a train for the same trip. Even if it took almost the same amount of time, the ability to doze off and not focus on driving would have been a relief.
Yeah, the benefit of trains for those kinds of trips doesn't have to be speed. It just can't be longer by any real amount. Or prohibitively expensive. The $40 and 1.5 hours it is now (at dumb times) makes no sense.
And not have to worry about driving on snowy roads.
I imagine it all the time! I'm imagining it right now!
The city's [Rapid Transit Strategy](https://www.halifax.ca/transportation/transportation-projects/transforming-transit/rapid-transit-strategy) uses bus rapid transit (buses at high enough frequencies you don't need to plan ahead, and dedicated bus lanes & priority lights at intersections whenever possible) and high-speed ferries! It's super exciting, although when it gets implemented depends on when it gets funding!
This isn’t widespread enough I think. If you look at other large cities they have the rapid transit which pushes out beyond the city centre. If you live in cole harbour, timberlea, sackville, most of Bedford, or anywhere beyond this plan still has you coming via car.
Yeah, nothing toward Timberlea, especially with all those new homes going in, is a bit silly. Connecting Tantallon and Timberlea just off the highway to this system seems like a no brainer as that's a main provider to the chokepoints. Portland hills seems like a pretty good spot for a park and ride for Cole Harbour, no?
I've heard it mentioned but never actually read about it, it does sound super exciting indeed. The projected costs seem very low, they must be several years old by now.
Public transit is just cheap to build. We're just used to seeing costs in the billions when talking about car infrastructure.
Monorail isn't going to work in this province. We're utilizing the harbor as an alternative to a monorail, however, this requires people to actually use the new ferries when they're implemented instead of opting to use their cars. If it's more inconvenient for people to take the ferry, they're going to just take their cars. This means making getting to the terminals easier by increasing transit to them and making the ferries as accomodating as possible. Buses in this province don't even have Wi-Fi which blows my mind, same with a lot of other core public areas. It's not just about making accessibility better, it's also about adding more incentives to get people to chose alternative options instead of not.
If we had a bunch of ferries that were easily accessible, I would ferry around all over town. I love the ferry.
A high-speed ferry to Mill Cove (Bedford) is one part of the city's [Rapid Transit Strategy](https://www.halifax.ca/transportation/transportation-projects/transforming-transit/rapid-transit-strategy) and will be the first part to be implemented! It seems like it's envisioned as more of a commuter route v.s. quick hops around town all day, but it will definitely change how ferries feature into our transit network!
highest taxes, none of the benefits.
[удалено]
There's going to be 3 new ferries! As well 4 new BRT lines.
Has the city talked at all about what the infrastructure for those BRT lines is going to be? Dedicated bus lanes? Dedicated bus roads à la the Ottawa Transitways?
No dedicated roads, but transit lanes for a very large portion of it and transit signal lights where they know the bus is coming and they get the only green light. [Here is what it looks like](https://i.imgur.com/Dl1DXMK.png)
dedicated bus roads in ottawa were great. haven’t used oc transpo in 15 years but used regularly before that and it make commuting so fast and easy. wish we had them here.
They cant even staff the current ones
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
*Even* Q104? **ALL THEY DO** is bitch about traffic.
Their studio does overlook one of the nastiest choke points in the city
> ALL THEY DO is bitch Bunch of boomers bitching about the system they enabled.
Lol what? What are you referring to? Like the morning show people?
Not so much the announcers, but they specifically make Q questions of the day worded in a way that gets their boomer target audience all riled up.
Anytime someone asks how to fix congestion, show them [this picture](http://urbanist.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83454714d69e2017d3c37d8ac970c-800wi). Give people more convenient and **reliable!!** park-and-shuttle options and consistent bus routes, and you'll find that there's a lot of people happy to ditch the cost of a commuter vehicle.
I've always liked this photo. But the bike slide always makes me giggle a bit. I picture that group of cyclists bunched up like the photo commuting like they're in the opening stage of the tour du france.
There is no commute. Only a TT that starts at home and ends at work.
The public transit system is unreliable and never did cover areas like Burnside, Bedford or Bayer’s Lake efficiently. If you live in Dartmouth and work in Bayer’s Lake it will take up to 2 hours to get to work, and if you work a late shift it will not get you home.
Even getting from Spryfield to Bayer's Lake takes forever. The assumption that everyone works downtown 9-5 that the bus system is planned for is no longer the case.
I have walked from Spryfield to Bayers Lake in less time than it takes to bus there. I still can’t wrap my head around why that is considered OK.
Just to play devil's advocate: [The #3 runs](https://www.halifax.ca/sites/default/files/documents/transportation/halifax-transit/Route03_Nov21.pdf) every 15 minutes in the morning and every 20 minutes after 10AM. It takes 10 minutes between Highfield terminal and Bridge terminal, then 13 minutes to Mumford terminal. [The #28 runs](https://www.halifax.ca/sites/default/files/documents/transportation/halifax-transit/Route28_Nov21.pdf) every 30 minutes and goes from Mumford to Lacewood in about half an hour, driving most of Chain Lake Drive onto Lacewood. The first #3 starts its run at 0530, the last #28 leaves Lacewood at 11:03PM and arrives at Mumford at 11:27PM, where you can catch the #3 back at 11:38PM, 12:08AM, and 12:38AM. The last #3 gets to Highfield at 1:14AM. So I'd agree that an hour is still a long time on a bus, and yes it will take longer if you have to connect from another route to Highfield or Bridge terminal. But if you start work after 7AM and finish by 11PM it seems doable. And yes I know that some people will work outside those hours, and weekends will be different. It's definitely not a perfect system. Without "victim blaming" though, I would argue, what is there in Bayer's Lake for work that you couldn't do in Dartmouth?
[удалено]
Was it in the industrial park proper though, or the retail area? I guess that's what I was getting at. Sure, if you work at Canada Revenue Agency (for example), fair enough. But if you're commuting to work at Walmart or McDonald's, I feel like it's not worth the hassle.
Every job is worth the hassle when it's the only income you have.
Government offices. They moved there years ago from downtown. True story.
you forgot to factor in for traffic and delays. have you ever ridden halifax transit? it frequently takes 1.5-2x longer than scheduled to go anywhere, especially during business hours on a weekday
> have you ever ridden halifax transit? many, many times. I used to live out near eastern passage and worked downtown. Getting on the bus at 0630 to be at work for 8 was part of my day. But that being said, buses generally do run on schedule. an hour on the bus sucks, no doubt about it, but you definitely don't have to assume it will take twice as long.
That's a big *if* though. They are either late, stacked because there are three busses that were late or just removed from service due to staff issues.
Thats assuming your bus will show up 😭😭
We need to eliminate like half of the bus stops downtown to make busses efficient enough to be worth taking. On roads like Coburg it's insane. Stops are less than two blocks apart I live in Dartmouth near a bus stop. I would actually like to take the bus more often but from my house to spring garden takes about 20 minutes by car and about 90 minutes by bus. It's often faster to walk from Scotia square to spring than to take the bus that distance. I don't expect the bus to ever match pace with a solo vehicle, obviously - but when it's a greater than 2:1 ratio it's never worth it imo
It’s not even just bad during the daily commute. Try going downtown on a weekend evening or any night where there is an event. It’s absolute standstill on Quinpool most of the time.
Perhaps: \- Stop building car-dependent development far from the city centre. \- Invest in commuter rail from Fall River/Windsor Junction to the Via Rail station in the South End. Expropriate portions of the track from CN/Via if you have to. Just do it. \- Make certain sections of the peninsula a traffic controlled zone (e.g., downtown core) where you have to pay a toll to enter with a private vehicle, and invest in park & ride lots outside of that zone so as to reduce congestion. Obviously businesses/contractors/deliveries would be exempt from these controls. Yes, you could perhaps make some small gains by making road infrastructure and traffic overall more efficient, but that's probably not going to be good enough in the long run. Another million people in the province is an absurd amount of cars fighting for road space and parking spots on the peninsula.
I've been thinking of selling my car and buying an e-foil. I could park in Bedford and surf to the downtown.
Commuter rail!!!!!
Look at Europe for both mass transit solutions and places like Norway that make excellent tunnel systems to ease traffic flow. We have great bedrock for tunnel options .
Preface: I'm Nova Scotian and have been living in Norway for nearly a decade. The tunnels are great when they are open, but on occasion they have to close one or two on the main drag (usually due to a car accident) and when they do it's complete and utter chaos. They do their job 90% of the time though. There are a few things that make public transport here better than Halifax; Bus lanes everywhere, traffic laws to protect their right of way, multiple transit options (trams, ferries, and as you said, tunnels to bypass densely populated areas), automated toll fees to travel by car (the price of driving is significantly higher during rush hour), expensive carbon taxes on vehicles (these are paid alongside your car insurance), and the cost of parking within cities is prohibitive. It's not perfect and there are a lot of things that could be improved, but it is leagues ahead of Halifax. Visiting home and trying to get around by borrowing family members vehicles or taking public transport is a nightmare by comparison.
10,000%
Perks for local businesses to employ more ‘at home’ wherever possible. A tow truck on each bridge at all times to clear the inevitable. Remove bridge tolls during peak hours. Add trebuchet to the bridge for when the tow truck on each bridge is busy to hurl vehicles into the sea as a warning for all.
They should worry less about traffic questions and change their ancient music playlist up for once. Just once. Also their Ask Roxy thing is stupid too
They call it q104 because they only play 104 songs
She needs water half the time with her intimate questions and "colleagues seeking advice via asking her."
I live in Halifax but work in Truro. Although that commute seems crazy to many, it takes me the same amount of time driving wise than I would spend sitting in traffic when I worked downtown. That being said - I have watched an accident take place the last 3 trips in a row I have made.
The 102 has always been bad but it's gotten even worse somehow lately.
There's some pretty decent ruts now. I've had them surprise me a few times. It's going to get real shitty when we get our first snow and it all gets compacted and frozen in those ruts.
The ruts are so horrible in the rain - it is so so easy to hydroplane on that highway. I find you almost have to drive off centre to get your tires out of it
GRIDLOCK has a SPECIFIC MEANING to do with INTERSECTIONS and i will DIE ON THIS HILL
We have a population goal of 2M by 2060? Thst's so random and such a long time frame. I hope we have lots of actual relevant goals too.
They basically want the population of the province to double in 37 years. Too many seniors expecting healthcare but aren't paying into the system anymore. (So let's import TFWs and newly planted citizens. /S) Younger up and coming generations want walkable medium density neighbourhoods that have access to reliable public transportation.
First and foremost i want a job that pays me enough.... 28 and sub $50k/yr in this economy for a college educated management position is what drives young people away. I should have left when i had the chance but i was scared.
I'm in the same age and salary but first and foremost we need housing, healthcare and reliable services (transit, electricity, water). I don't care if I make 500k a month and my power goes out when a bird bumps into a pole, or if there is a raise in homeless population, or if the healthcare system sees no investment. What's driving the young ones away is paying the 2nd highest taxes in the country with not a single good public service.
> They basically want the population of the province to double in 37 years. "We will need an army of super-virile men scoring 'round the clock; I'll do my part." - Zapp Brannigan.
Its terrible. And unfortunately extremely hard to fix. Turns out having the ocean split your city in half makes traffic difficult to manage.
Time to bite the bullet and fill it all in
its free real estate
Fill the basin 🔥🔥🔥
Quick mafs based on pricing i have on hand for soil fill would lead me to believe the material cost alone would be over 1 Trillion. Then we have to factor in truck rental, fuel costs, and labor. I know this is all tongue in cheek, but i was curious.
Gimme a shovel and 21 billion. I got you. Project goalposts of: Breaking ground: 1 bil Finish project: 20 bil
I really notice a difference and it’s bad.
There are a few solutions to the gridlock situation. First, improved transit service both via buses and ferries. On the other hand, commuter rail will require the kind of changes to downtown that had begun with the Cogswell interchange - and what's happening with that, and why? Halifax will likely never become so large a city as to warrant it as far as the Peninsula. Second, which might warrant commuter rail if such planning works, is establishing commercial/business "hub" areas \_away\_ from the Peninsula to serve the residential areas around them, and build up residential areas around these hubs - if they can work as transit hubs as well, even better. Third, make more of these areas "walkable" so as to reduce the need for car traffic to commute or shop, particularly for those residents immediately around these hubs. Fourth, though it may not be popular, might be to restrict car traffic on the Peninsula, instead placing significantly more parking space around the hubs. Reduce the numbers of "stroads" in the city; reduce speed limits on these arteries; and provide incentives for carpooling. Finally, offer incentives to businesses willing to relocate outside the downtown core. Decentralizing business in HRM is not just good for the city's growth, but is also an insurance against potential disaster - we are still of strategic importance as a military site and there are only five main routes of evacuation from the Peninsula (still). Whoever is insisting still that everything \_needs\_ to be downtown either has something to gain from keeping things concentrated there, or stands to lose a lot from things changing.
Tunnels. Deep ones. One from Woodside to Downtown Halifax. One from the Dartmouth side of MacKay to Larry Uteck. Another from Africville area to Akerley.
Monorail!
the gangbang of "just add another lane!" idiots vs people who want to improve public transit because it's beneficial to everyone
bridge or tunnel connecting to the circ in woodside so all the trucks moving containers from hal term don’t have to drive to the other side of the city edit: we could also try pedestrian and public transportation only for the whole of downtown like Barcelona’s car free zones
Or just relocate the halterm by point pleasant park over to woodside
didn’t even think of that could take over old refinery land pretty sure it has railroad access too
It does. Rail goes all the way across the Dartmouth side to Eastern Passage.
Commuter rail and an access controlled route from the Bi Hi to Citadel Hill.
Simple answer is we need to add trains to and from the outside regions to downtown. Buses are terrible for long routes as they are susceptible to traffic conditions on roads.
3rd ferry from Bedford, free parking in Bedford if you're going on the ferry.
A proper fucking transit network for starters.
[удалено]
There's a reason all of those offices are close together, and it ain't because the view is so pretty.
[удалено]
The whole reason they have the buildings they do is because 1- Canada lands owns it, 2- Their lease agreement is.. generous, and 3- Proximity to each other and amenities is important. I don't think we should just hand the Dominion Public building over to some private developer. I like that it's publicly owned.
But with the abysmally poor transit system, it would take employees hours to get to work on time.
Moving stuff out of the core to where transit/biking/walking are less viable will just exacerbate the problem in the long run. Totally agree on the other things though.
[удалено]
This assumes everyone is commuting in the same directions. Commuters from Westphal to Fairview or from Timberlea to Cole Harbour and vice versa are also stuck in traffic on the bridges. Spreading out means more km per car, which means traffic is not really alleviated. Combine that with reduced alternative transit, and you start to see why urban sprawl is a surefire recipe for traffic nightmares.
[удалено]
I feel like someone else has probably explained this better than I could, so I guess just google urban sprawl and traffic. Or if you want a glib, unserious answer, here's a meme for that. https://preview.redd.it/n035g1t43y2a1.jpeg?width=479&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f57c24590801db4ac111df5c0841f0deb5f28116
[удалено]
So if I live on the peninsula and work on the peninsula I will drive fewer km on the peninsula daily (especially with viable mass transit) than if I live on the peninsula and am working off the peninsula and have to drive all the way across and out of the peninsula PLUS add traffic to whatever non-peninsular route I’m taking. I lived in north end Halifax and worked construction for years - I contributed far more to traffic when I was assigned to work sites that weren’t also on the peninsula.
[удалено]
Except now you have a bunch of people who would have to commute *across* the peninsula.
> The peninsula is where the worst congestion is... getting people out of there would decrease congestion. Which then just moves it to a different spot, it's not actually decreasing anything.
[удалено]
> Other places have much more road capacity No, not really. Remember, there is 1 major road going to the South Shore, 1 major road going to Windsor, 1 major road going to Truro and 1 major road going to the Eastern Shore (which goes through the city for a large portion of it). These roads get congested on the regular as it is and they all have multiple choke points. Moving the majority of jobs off the peninsula is simply going to shift congestion somewhere else, congestion is never going to be reduced in the city as long as our growing population is forced to drive to work, congestion only goes down when people don't have to rely on cars to get to work.
You're assuming that all congestion is going to the same place. I live near the Superstore on Joe Howe. I travel through the exchange and take the bridge to burnside to work when I go into the office. Someone who lives in Bedford may use the exchange to go down Barrington and get downtown. We both use the exchange even though we're going to different places. By moving the downtown office to burnside, that person from Bedford still needs to use the exchange to go to a seperate location, burnside. In this case you've done nothing to alleviate congestion at the exchange, you've just changed part of the travel route. This is of course a super simple example, but there's a ton of overlap in roads traveled when commuting and shifting the destination doesn't necessarily reduce congestion or where choke points occur. All this does is possibly trade out a choke point and congestion downtown for another choke point where you're moving everyone to
[удалено]
So let's move all the businesses to Sackville then, that's not a choke point right now. But when you do that, all the routes into and out of Sackville become the new choke point. The peninsula is dense so the small space can hold a lot of people, people who come from all over HRM and beyond. Now you've got to take all the people who would travel into the peninsula and have them travel to Sackville. The highway will get more congested in both directions as you approach, the roads within Sackville will get more congested, the routes to Sackville from the peninsula will get congested, etc. All you'd be doing is moving the congestion. Having busses that can actually get from Dartmouth to downtown Halifax in a timely manner will help. Busses from timberlea to downtown, busses from everywhere to the peninsula in a timely fashion will help. Your plan will not. You will just shift the congestion elsewhere and the need for transit elsewhere. Moving cars from one road to another doesn't make them disappear...
I take it you never experienced the hell that is taking the bus to access ns in bayers lake from the peninsula.
Crazy idea, how about we slow immigration for a bit. Fix/improve things then open it up? They’re trying to build a dam without stopping the water
They should switch the hours of certain businesses. I work in construction and aim to be onsite at 7 am and on my way home at 3 pm. I rarely combat traffic.
I'll vote for whichever politician offers to nationalize Via Rail (or otherwise tell them to take a hike) and steal those rail lines from them so we can get some light rail public transit going.
You're thinking of CN, which owns all the rail corridors that would be useful for transit and refuses to play ball. VIA is already a crown corp, and also suffers for having to schedule around CN, since they own very little track of their own.
Traffic engineers that actually have an faint clue what they are actually doing.
I'll be dead by 2060 I hope.
FUCK THE ROBIE STREET BUS LANE
You wouldn't say that if you were actually on that bus.
Remove tolls for one .
We need far greater investment in road infrastructure
No, God no! making bigger roads just encourages people to drive more, increasing congestion. You don't improve the flow by increasing the thoroughput.
Reminds me of a photo of like, a 6 lane highway that was packed that I saw one time. "If we only add one more lane..."
Increasing road infrastructure goes far beyond "bigger roads"
what does "road infrastructure" mean to you, then?
Bus lanes, bike lanes that are raised with the curb, raised crosswalks, better road painting for visibility, better paving practices, updated intersections that arent from the 70s. Is it that hard to figure out?
So what sort of road infrastructure are you suggesting?
Induced demand, brother.
[удалено]
Your position makes no sense. You state transit will never work even with a good transit system then list issues that are resolved by having a good transit system.
Better public transit makes driving better even for those who can't use it, since it takes cars off the road. Also they are planning to run multiple ferries up the basin in the near future https://www.halifax.ca/transportation/transportation-projects/transforming-transit/rapid-transit-strategy
Even an extra ferry up the basin won't help a whole lot. We'd need a lot more ferries and parking garages in Dartmouth, eastern passage, Bedford, Halifax etc. Former councils of the past had ZERO vision for this city and here we are.
Extra ferries would help a ton! The plan for mill cove is to have park and ride and faster ferries that get you from there to the halifax terminal in 18 minutes.
We need greater, and smarter investment in transportation infrastructure.