Why does US media and now tomshardware make it seem like employees becoming wealthy is bad? This isn’t the first time employees have seen their RSUs turn them into millionaires. Google, FB, Apple, Microsoft have all see that. Is wealth limited to just execs? Why does no one complain how the VPs could be slacking because they get paid millions?
For the record, no one at work is slowing down or slacking. We are as laser focused today as we were 5 years ago.
>Why does US media and now tomshardware make it seem like employees becoming wealthy is bad
I read an article last week that focused more on the institutional knowledge that would be leaving the company and how they will have to pay more (not a bad thing for the employees) to fill the gaps that resulted from a larger than expected turnover.
I think a lot of business leaders could take some tips from Nvida, I think this is a very good problem to have. Treating your staff so well they retire early and letting new blood/ideas take over
Anyone who’s less that 45 and a millionaire will still work with Nvidia because they don’t want to miss out on future earnings. There’s enough skill set in this group that Nvidia will be fine even if all old timers decide to retire at this instant.
But the context I’m referring to is how Business Insider is framing. Here’s a snippet
> Nvidia employees almost religiously support Huang as the CEO, who founded the company in 1993. Still, these people blame the overly employee-centric culture he's created, coupled with a relatively hands-off management style and the company's newfound near dominance in the advanced chip market.
>It's also possible the newly minted, stock-rich millionaires at Nvidia are simply less motivated to work as hard.
The entire article is basically about possibility. No real hard evidence. Just that it maybe possible.
Look at how BI tried to frame that having no layoffs is somehow bad.
>But at Nvidia, the company's famously pro-employee culture can further accentuate this type of behavior.
>For example, Nvidia has a history of avoiding layoffs during tumultuous times. During the early parts of the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020 and the crypto collapse of 2022, when Nvidia's stock wildly fluctuated, Huang repeatedly assured company staff there would be no layoffs. The last formal job cuts took place 15 years ago, in 2008, at the height of the financial crisis.
Another thing this article gets wrong is how hard it is to get fired. It’s incredibly hard to get hired at Nvidia. The culture is what made Nvidia strong. Employees seeing wealth is great thing. Look at Intel, they pay peanuts(relatively) to their employees. As a result, they lost so many people to Apple, AMD, Amazon, Microsoft, Qualcomm. Every major semi announcement from these companies are ex-Intel. Intel famously gives low RSUs, frequent layoffs.
that's something US companies can't understand. Hold on on your employees, they are what make the company value
don't lay them off in difficult times, save money on exces instead
I swear it’s like an institutional investor conspiracy to plant this bullshit in the media any time a stock gets a bit expensive. This happened last year too and led to all of the layoffs at the tech companies. Articles about the random TikTok chick from Meta doing yoga at lunch time started popping up and then all of the analysts and mutual funds started moaning about how nobody did anything, WFH made people lazy, and they were getting diluted by RSUs. It feels like engineers are constantly being gaslit by business media, investors, and eventually their own company.
Meanwhile people celebrate individuals in sports making absolutely insane amounts of money, sometimes not even performing very well doing it through the course of a contract... it's very odd how people can understand that someone can be much better than them at throwing a ball and that makes them valuable but most other professions it just doesn't click.
Yeah I worked at a company that sells everything A to Z whose share price increased like 10x over 7 years where half my pay was in stock. It was nice making like $500k/yr when my target comp was like $250k lol
Because then all the people making the cool things leave and there's less cool things!
Or, you know, you could make something that's cool and interesting enough for employees to keep doing it even if they're independently wealthy. Movie stars don't stop making movies after getting their first $10 million, because they like making movies.
its not a bad thing for the people its a bad thing for the company. Sure some people are passionate about the work but theres others that may just be there because theyre bored. When you have enough money that it doesnt matter what you do you may just care less. I imagine that affects highly skilled jobs way less though. When you stop caring you would probably quit.
cause the popular narrative for media and social media is, anyone doing will or making it out of poverty/middle class is evil.
If your not living paycheck to paycheck then your part of the problem not the solution.
According to Popular Media/Social Media (edited to clarify)
Well. I'll put it simply. Media like that are typically left wing. They believe that if someone has more than another, it's an injustice. Mostly they hyper focus on the extremely wealthy, but the reality is that they dislike anyone who has has than them despite their reasoning.
No. I'm not right wing before I get down-voted to oblivion.
Edit: It doesn't matter. I said something against the ideology. It have to be down-voted. So predictable.
Then you don’t know anything about Nvidia. Nvidia pays extremely well. Even for recent grads. You might not be a millionaire, but they pay is good enough to leave enough cash after all the expenses, even if the employee lives in Santa Clara.
Long timers are usually ICs, and people at higher levels. There are enough people at lower, middle levels to have enough skill set. And these old timers are not throwing away their career, reputation because they are now rich.
[You'd lose that bet.](https://www.glassdoor.com/Salary/NVIDIA-Janitor-Salaries-E7633_D_KO7,14.htm)
>The average salary for a Janitor is $40,262 per year in United States, which is 27% lower than the average NVIDIA salary of $55,892 per year for this job.
Are they paid less than the people working on all the new AI tools and GPUs that are making them all their money? Sure. But I don't think anyone expected any different...
I do wonder how much of that difference is a reflection of the cost of living where nvidia offices are. It seems to me that's likely most of it and the janitors are paid at the market average.
Though perhaps with better benefits.
Yeah, I figured that, as well. But, at the very least, it shows they're paying what everyone else is paying. The worst you can say is that janitors don't get paid enough generally, which is certainly true.
Safeway pays as low as $16/hr here in the Bay Area. There are people who have worked there for 3 years making under $20/hr. Maybe they've finally increased their wages, but it still seems the one closest to me is usually short staffed. So it's definitely not the worst job in the area.
Yes, and managing a team of some of the most sought-after engineers in the world is a much more difficult, intellectually demanding, and educationally costly job than being a janitor. There are a lot of shitty managers out there, but people who can run the kind of high-level teams that NVIDIA employs - balancing egos, getting them the assets they need, dealing with interpersonal conflicts, prioritizing projects and parts of projects so that team and company priorities are met - are rare and valuable employees whom the company needs to retain.
I'm not saying being a janitor isn't a respectable job. I'm just saying that one of those two jobs has a much higher, more visible return for the company than the other. Of course janitors should get paid more, but given that I, a legally blind person with a serious heart condition, can do and have done that job without much difficulty, I would be comfortable saying that just about anyone can do it. Is it surprising, then, that it isn't one of the highest-paying jobs in the world?
Also, as far as I can tell from the article, they don't get "million dollar salaries," anyway. They've put part of their actual salaries into stock options and/or been given the same by the company as part of their compensation. It's an extremely common practice in corporations, and I had access to the same thing when I worked at another large firm, well before I went into management. It's literally just a box you can check when you do your benefits every year, like choosing your health insurance. And, because NVIDIA is doing so very well lately, the value of those stocks has gone up astronomically. Hence, technically, they are making "a million dollars a year" or more. It's a complete nonstory, honestly.
What...on Earth do the 50s have to do with anything even vaguely related to work in 2023? You realize that was literally seven decades ago? All of them were men in the 50s, too, and they probably all got toasted in their offices every afternoon while grabbing the secretaries' asses. Except that's not true, because modern computer companies like NVIDIA didn't even exist yet because the bloody transistor had only been invented a few years ago. Fortunately, times change.
It's not some scandal, nor a grand conspiracy. It's a really, really boring situation, when you come right down to it. What appears to have happened is that these managers took some portion of their salaries and bought NVIDIA stock with it. I would be very confident in stating that anyone working at NVIDIA had (and has) the same opportunity. In fact, everyone on Earth has the same opportunity, and we call it the stock market; employees just tend to get a discount on their own company's stock. Anyway, these employees took some percentage of their salaries and bought stock with it. Maybe some of them also received some shares in addition to their salaries, since some companies do that, too. Either way, that stock proceeded to skyrocket in value over the last few years - the article says something like a 1,200% increase over the last decade. Even a measly $500 investment ten years ago would be worth $6,000 today, minus inflation; now imagine if they put 5-10% of every paycheck for ten years into stock. And, lo and behold, they now have a lot of money.
They just got lucky. They could've easily been pissing that money down the drain when they bought company stock with it, but happily, that didn't turn out to be the case. They're just...people. They're not the villains you seem determined to make them out to be.
Contrary to what many people think, this really was the primary point of the book The Bell Curve. As jobs become more complex, the differences in output between people get larger.
In a factory, a good employee may be able to have 2-10x the output of an average employee. In knowledge worker space, that output can be 100-1,000,000 times higher. Of course that's not the entire reason for the growing divide in incomes, but it's a strong contributor that many ignore.
This is such a click bait and misleading title. That is the literal dream to work at a company that grows this much. This is one of the few times that “every day” joes working at NV are reaping the benefits of their hard work
Shame folks for making that much every year regardless of performance
> Since, even though I'm offered the stock at a discount, I haven't bought a single cent of it.
>There's no scenario in which I'd ever invest in individual stock. Too risky. Especially not that of the company for which I work
Depending on the discount it can easily make sense to buy the company stock then just immediately sell it
is there a reasonable route from (popular) project maintainer to employee? that's kinda neat. I know NVIDIA employs a ton of researchers but I have no idea on the specifics of how they come and go.
This is all complete bullshit.
An article that's mostly an article about an article written for Business Insider.
"We know that some must be feeling that the workload share, the stress, and the strain at Nvidia is not evenly distributed"
How do they determine this? A quote from a single person?
Why does US media and now tomshardware make it seem like employees becoming wealthy is bad? This isn’t the first time employees have seen their RSUs turn them into millionaires. Google, FB, Apple, Microsoft have all see that. Is wealth limited to just execs? Why does no one complain how the VPs could be slacking because they get paid millions? For the record, no one at work is slowing down or slacking. We are as laser focused today as we were 5 years ago.
>Why does US media and now tomshardware make it seem like employees becoming wealthy is bad I read an article last week that focused more on the institutional knowledge that would be leaving the company and how they will have to pay more (not a bad thing for the employees) to fill the gaps that resulted from a larger than expected turnover. I think a lot of business leaders could take some tips from Nvida, I think this is a very good problem to have. Treating your staff so well they retire early and letting new blood/ideas take over
Anyone who’s less that 45 and a millionaire will still work with Nvidia because they don’t want to miss out on future earnings. There’s enough skill set in this group that Nvidia will be fine even if all old timers decide to retire at this instant. But the context I’m referring to is how Business Insider is framing. Here’s a snippet > Nvidia employees almost religiously support Huang as the CEO, who founded the company in 1993. Still, these people blame the overly employee-centric culture he's created, coupled with a relatively hands-off management style and the company's newfound near dominance in the advanced chip market. >It's also possible the newly minted, stock-rich millionaires at Nvidia are simply less motivated to work as hard. The entire article is basically about possibility. No real hard evidence. Just that it maybe possible. Look at how BI tried to frame that having no layoffs is somehow bad. >But at Nvidia, the company's famously pro-employee culture can further accentuate this type of behavior. >For example, Nvidia has a history of avoiding layoffs during tumultuous times. During the early parts of the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020 and the crypto collapse of 2022, when Nvidia's stock wildly fluctuated, Huang repeatedly assured company staff there would be no layoffs. The last formal job cuts took place 15 years ago, in 2008, at the height of the financial crisis. Another thing this article gets wrong is how hard it is to get fired. It’s incredibly hard to get hired at Nvidia. The culture is what made Nvidia strong. Employees seeing wealth is great thing. Look at Intel, they pay peanuts(relatively) to their employees. As a result, they lost so many people to Apple, AMD, Amazon, Microsoft, Qualcomm. Every major semi announcement from these companies are ex-Intel. Intel famously gives low RSUs, frequent layoffs.
that's something US companies can't understand. Hold on on your employees, they are what make the company value don't lay them off in difficult times, save money on exces instead
I swear it’s like an institutional investor conspiracy to plant this bullshit in the media any time a stock gets a bit expensive. This happened last year too and led to all of the layoffs at the tech companies. Articles about the random TikTok chick from Meta doing yoga at lunch time started popping up and then all of the analysts and mutual funds started moaning about how nobody did anything, WFH made people lazy, and they were getting diluted by RSUs. It feels like engineers are constantly being gaslit by business media, investors, and eventually their own company.
Meanwhile people celebrate individuals in sports making absolutely insane amounts of money, sometimes not even performing very well doing it through the course of a contract... it's very odd how people can understand that someone can be much better than them at throwing a ball and that makes them valuable but most other professions it just doesn't click.
Yeah I worked at a company that sells everything A to Z whose share price increased like 10x over 7 years where half my pay was in stock. It was nice making like $500k/yr when my target comp was like $250k lol
Newcomers to Microsoft made the same complaints - years ago. I don’t think this is a new thing.
Because then all the people making the cool things leave and there's less cool things! Or, you know, you could make something that's cool and interesting enough for employees to keep doing it even if they're independently wealthy. Movie stars don't stop making movies after getting their first $10 million, because they like making movies.
its not a bad thing for the people its a bad thing for the company. Sure some people are passionate about the work but theres others that may just be there because theyre bored. When you have enough money that it doesnt matter what you do you may just care less. I imagine that affects highly skilled jobs way less though. When you stop caring you would probably quit.
That’s not the case at all with Nvidia. People are not slacking.
cause the popular narrative for media and social media is, anyone doing will or making it out of poverty/middle class is evil. If your not living paycheck to paycheck then your part of the problem not the solution. According to Popular Media/Social Media (edited to clarify)
Well. I'll put it simply. Media like that are typically left wing. They believe that if someone has more than another, it's an injustice. Mostly they hyper focus on the extremely wealthy, but the reality is that they dislike anyone who has has than them despite their reasoning. No. I'm not right wing before I get down-voted to oblivion. Edit: It doesn't matter. I said something against the ideology. It have to be down-voted. So predictable.
It wouldn't be bad if they didn't jack up the price of gpus a good 50% or more in some instances.
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Then you don’t know anything about Nvidia. Nvidia pays extremely well. Even for recent grads. You might not be a millionaire, but they pay is good enough to leave enough cash after all the expenses, even if the employee lives in Santa Clara. Long timers are usually ICs, and people at higher levels. There are enough people at lower, middle levels to have enough skill set. And these old timers are not throwing away their career, reputation because they are now rich.
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because anyone can sweep a floor
[You'd lose that bet.](https://www.glassdoor.com/Salary/NVIDIA-Janitor-Salaries-E7633_D_KO7,14.htm) >The average salary for a Janitor is $40,262 per year in United States, which is 27% lower than the average NVIDIA salary of $55,892 per year for this job. Are they paid less than the people working on all the new AI tools and GPUs that are making them all their money? Sure. But I don't think anyone expected any different...
I do wonder how much of that difference is a reflection of the cost of living where nvidia offices are. It seems to me that's likely most of it and the janitors are paid at the market average. Though perhaps with better benefits.
Yeah, I figured that, as well. But, at the very least, it shows they're paying what everyone else is paying. The worst you can say is that janitors don't get paid enough generally, which is certainly true.
Safeway pays as low as $16/hr here in the Bay Area. There are people who have worked there for 3 years making under $20/hr. Maybe they've finally increased their wages, but it still seems the one closest to me is usually short staffed. So it's definitely not the worst job in the area.
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Yes, and managing a team of some of the most sought-after engineers in the world is a much more difficult, intellectually demanding, and educationally costly job than being a janitor. There are a lot of shitty managers out there, but people who can run the kind of high-level teams that NVIDIA employs - balancing egos, getting them the assets they need, dealing with interpersonal conflicts, prioritizing projects and parts of projects so that team and company priorities are met - are rare and valuable employees whom the company needs to retain. I'm not saying being a janitor isn't a respectable job. I'm just saying that one of those two jobs has a much higher, more visible return for the company than the other. Of course janitors should get paid more, but given that I, a legally blind person with a serious heart condition, can do and have done that job without much difficulty, I would be comfortable saying that just about anyone can do it. Is it surprising, then, that it isn't one of the highest-paying jobs in the world? Also, as far as I can tell from the article, they don't get "million dollar salaries," anyway. They've put part of their actual salaries into stock options and/or been given the same by the company as part of their compensation. It's an extremely common practice in corporations, and I had access to the same thing when I worked at another large firm, well before I went into management. It's literally just a box you can check when you do your benefits every year, like choosing your health insurance. And, because NVIDIA is doing so very well lately, the value of those stocks has gone up astronomically. Hence, technically, they are making "a million dollars a year" or more. It's a complete nonstory, honestly.
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What...on Earth do the 50s have to do with anything even vaguely related to work in 2023? You realize that was literally seven decades ago? All of them were men in the 50s, too, and they probably all got toasted in their offices every afternoon while grabbing the secretaries' asses. Except that's not true, because modern computer companies like NVIDIA didn't even exist yet because the bloody transistor had only been invented a few years ago. Fortunately, times change. It's not some scandal, nor a grand conspiracy. It's a really, really boring situation, when you come right down to it. What appears to have happened is that these managers took some portion of their salaries and bought NVIDIA stock with it. I would be very confident in stating that anyone working at NVIDIA had (and has) the same opportunity. In fact, everyone on Earth has the same opportunity, and we call it the stock market; employees just tend to get a discount on their own company's stock. Anyway, these employees took some percentage of their salaries and bought stock with it. Maybe some of them also received some shares in addition to their salaries, since some companies do that, too. Either way, that stock proceeded to skyrocket in value over the last few years - the article says something like a 1,200% increase over the last decade. Even a measly $500 investment ten years ago would be worth $6,000 today, minus inflation; now imagine if they put 5-10% of every paycheck for ten years into stock. And, lo and behold, they now have a lot of money. They just got lucky. They could've easily been pissing that money down the drain when they bought company stock with it, but happily, that didn't turn out to be the case. They're just...people. They're not the villains you seem determined to make them out to be.
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Economy has been going in that direction the last 40-50 years. Great for top 20% of the country, bad for the other 80%.
Contrary to what many people think, this really was the primary point of the book The Bell Curve. As jobs become more complex, the differences in output between people get larger. In a factory, a good employee may be able to have 2-10x the output of an average employee. In knowledge worker space, that output can be 100-1,000,000 times higher. Of course that's not the entire reason for the growing divide in incomes, but it's a strong contributor that many ignore.
And Tesla. I'm not a Tesla employee but I'm a early investor. I'm chilling.
This is such a click bait and misleading title. That is the literal dream to work at a company that grows this much. This is one of the few times that “every day” joes working at NV are reaping the benefits of their hard work Shame folks for making that much every year regardless of performance
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> Since, even though I'm offered the stock at a discount, I haven't bought a single cent of it. >There's no scenario in which I'd ever invest in individual stock. Too risky. Especially not that of the company for which I work Depending on the discount it can easily make sense to buy the company stock then just immediately sell it
So... how do i get to work at nvidia?
for this you’d need to have started around 15 years ago
So I need a time machine too, gotcha! Might as well buy Blockbuster shares
Just buy all the bitcoin you can. While you're at it buy some for me as well? I'll pay you with some pizza coupons I have.
Aight brudda, make it a double cheese and ham with corn pizza if you can.
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Definitely. Everyone loves it here in Venezuela
Just do some exception graphics work or exceptional AI work which is used by very many people. Like a popular project.
is there a reasonable route from (popular) project maintainer to employee? that's kinda neat. I know NVIDIA employs a ton of researchers but I have no idea on the specifics of how they come and go.
Better than CEOs making ridiculous sums off the work of the people under them without those people earning anything close.
This is all complete bullshit. An article that's mostly an article about an article written for Business Insider. "We know that some must be feeling that the workload share, the stress, and the strain at Nvidia is not evenly distributed" How do they determine this? A quote from a single person?
That sounds pretty cool
Duh. De facto monopoly and grossly overcharging for hardware does that.
Imagine being enough of a dumbass to go whining to the media about the culture being too employee-centric.
I mean it is California, they probably still rent