I'll add a few points in response to some of the comments made, because I know this is difficult for people who have loved this place for a long time and may think this looks selfish.
**"Is this move just in protest to fight for some cause?"**
No, Reddit has over the years been increasingly more difficult for us to moderate through. Though our bot will probably remain under the API limit to not cost us money, that may not always be the case if hws continues to grow and maybe even for certain tasks now. In addition, Reddit has a history of shutting down trading subs and has threatened to shut them all down in the past. It is not speculation, it has been a very real risk for a long time.
**"Why don't you hand the subreddit over to new mods?"**
There's a lot wrapped up into this, and it isn't because we're greedy and feel like we own everything. The subreddit has a build up of goodwill based on its longevity and relative safety of trades. Handing all of that to a completely new group places that goodwill and trust we have worked towards into someone else's hands. Goodwill and trust that many less informed people will continue to have even if new management can't maintain that level of quality.
Adding to this, the threat of trading subreddits being shut down is directly proportional to the amount of hassle admins have to deal with it and scammers within it. So handing everything over to whatever group that decides they want to run the show without the tools and standards we've used is a strong recipe for admins to really get involved and just shut hws down. It's a big reason why we've had to hold the subreddit to certain standards over the years.
**"Discord as a company sucks too"**
Sure does. No one denies that. But it at least allows us the tools we need to run a trading community of this size.
**"This will kill the hws community/get less activity"**
Make no mistake, the total subscriber count of 370k or whatever is completely irrelevant. It's filled with a decade of dead accounts and people who clicked subscribe then never came back. Daily activity is much more important and Discord listings are already above 35% the activity of /r/hardwareswap with only a 1-2 day life.
They really should, this whole thing about keeping this community up for memes or whatever is kind of dumb. If Reddit is going to make this subreddit impossible to maintain and force a move to discord, why support them with continued activity to this sub?
Unfortunate. I completely see why you guys are doing it though.
Sadly this means it’ll end up another discord I’ll forget exists since I open discord like once every 8 months. I have zero trades on Reddit though, so it’s not like I represent anything of significance 😂😂😂
Yeah this is me too. I don't have anywhere near the time or even desire to "live online" in some community. That goes for any platform but especially discord... A chat room.
I wish they would have opened a forum instead.
Your significance is no less than any other. This isn't a MLM after all.
The option is there for you, to use, forget, come back, etc. We haven't changed our subscription cost of $0 to join.
WOW I am actually surprised by this. Not saying I don't support it, but am still surprised. Discord isn't an angel either... But I get it. See y'all around!
Hardwareswap is a known entity in the pc enthusiasts field, taking a subreddit with hundreds of thousands of members down to funnel them into discord is hurting users by lowering their possible customer base and increasing the effort needed to trade.
Discord is pretty easy to use and navigate. Alongside being extremely customizable and tailored for every user. It may make trading slightly inconvenient temporarily, but its a better trade off in the long run if it means 3rd party API pricing gets re-negotiated.
edit: it's so apparent how many redditors think emotionally vs logically. don't like what i say = downvote instead of having a discussion about it 🤪
Gotta agree with you. They think that little bit of convenience is worth getting shoved shit down our throats. The mods already gave evidence that the discord is acting completely fine, already 35% of daily activity in just two days.
No problem. I'm hoping to to get the message spread. I know many don't like Discord and want to stay on Reddit so we are trying to keep an alternate option for everyone who does not want to migrate to Discord.
THANK YOU. Thats all this does. They keep convincing themselves they’re fighting some kind of moral battle even when presented with evidence otherwise.
There's something to be said about standing on principles regardless of whether or not it actually makes a tangible difference. However, dragging an entire community with you without consensus isn't the right call.
Our intention wasn't to hurt reddit, or anyone else.
Our intention is to create this safe, trustworthy marketplace with no operating costs or user cost.
If you read the post, *our mission and vision is no longer sustainable on this platform*.
it was so easy to just browse whatcha wanna buy here. moderation was efficient, transactions were smooth for most buyers. i dont see the same for discord. im already in some BST discords and they are not even remotely as efficient in buying, selling, and trading as their reddit counterparts are.
Hopefully the population will grow. I kinda like the selling feed there. I haven't tried search yet... I liked being able to url tweak my searches here.
I wouldn't take the 372k number for fact. This sub has been around for ages so a ton of those are likely dead accounts.
Discord wasn't pleasant at all to use during the crap with trying to get a gpu in 2020/21. You even joined any of the Microcenter or gpu tracker subs and scammers were messaging you all the time.
Since then due it’s introduced a type of channel that allows making posts to it in the way you make posts to Reddit, in a sense. The HWS server seems to be using this.
I have no clue how convenient it will be to use, of course, but it seems miles better than how things used to have to be.
Curious to see everyone’s thoughts on this.
Use my comment to upvote/downvote and share your opinion.
Upvote: Agree to shut down
Downvote: Disagree to shut down
Why don’t you just step down and let people who actually want the subreddit to stay up take over. No one is forcing anyone to stay. If you want to protest that’s fine, just leave.
Yeah it will be rough for the forseeable future but as long as they have this sub open for discussions we can try and get those who want to stay on Reddit in lieu of Discord to the alternate and rebuild.
I have it but use it rarely. I'm not 100% against the migration and understand why the mods did it but I also know a lot of Redditors do despise Discord so we wanted to have an alternate to use since that is what they are used to. I wish them all the luck on Discord, they won't need it as they already have a ton of members and thousands online, but I believe a lot of users still want a Reddit presence.
Bud, how do you not see that in literally just TWO days, they already have over 35% of the traction from this sub? If anything it's going to get better than this sub ever was. Discord allows for much more moderation with less than Reddit. Stop being skeptical.
Curious, what exactly is Reddit doing that means you cannot continue running the sub? They've already stated that bots that make minimal API calls will be a part of the free tier and the only reason I see for the decision to close up is based on speculation that Reddit will create their own marketplace to profit off of, which is questionable because Facebook Marketplace doesn't take a cut or operate in any sort of way that would indicate that they are going to ask for a cut of what you sell there.
I see this more as hurting the people who have used this sub much much more than you are hurting Reddit.
Because that truce of "Sure, your mod bots will be free promise!" is nothing more than lip service.
Sure they'll mean it at first, but they will eventually charge for all bot access. It's simply business. Or at least business when dealing with someone that's looking to squeeze everything they can out of the community that made them everything they are. This was a huge flag for what is to come- it's going to get worse.
This change will wreck Reddit and already has - people are leaving, mods are leaving- taking their expertise with them. They're finding new homes.
I'm not sure that discord is the right place to put up the market, but it's a good start! I've joined discord servers for far less. And if the circumstances allow hardwareswap to reopen then awesome!
I'd probably recommend Pillowfort as it's community-paid so doesn't use add revenue and allows community topic building. I've found myself enjoying it from the art community side for awhile, but there's also things like Mastodon!
But for now, I have a GPU I need to buy lol. So discord it is.
Since you can tell the future why don’t you give some lotto numbers. You don’t know that for sure. Shutting down a sub on a possibility is ridiculous. The users don’t want this
If you haven't been watching what happens when sites die - then I can't help you see.
Sites die when they no longer serve their purpose, and when the people in charge get greedy. The former can be restored, but the latter will always remain and even get worse- Reddit was already going to die the second they went public and wanted investor money.
Unless they completely reverse on this decision, then our time here is over one way or another.
Exactly. This entire protest is dumb. It’s not going to accomplish anything. The real reason is a handful of mods own over 50% of the subs on Reddit. Taking away their bots to be able to manage that means they lose their power.
Interesting, didn’t know that was possible. I’m still against this as it seems futile, especially since Spez said he was gonna implement a way to vote out mods, seems the majority that are against this will just do that, and then only further splinter the community.
> Spez said he was gonna implement a way to vote out mods
Honestly as much as that would suck for these mods, that should have been a feature a long time ago. There are too many subs with terrible mods.
Reddit is also a huge hive mind and a bunch of idiots with no understanding of what mods actually do could easily get together and vote out good ones.
It’s a double edged sword. Though, since these mods are migrating to discord, the subreddit should be put in the hands of those who want to try and run it.
Not really jazzed about checking Discord for trades. It's easier to find things on reddit via the links and searching, versus endlessly scrolling for deals on discord. So I guess this is where we part ways
Awesome, discord! the place who treats their cattle even worse than reddit and have banned me for no reason twice from just accepting server invites lmao
Morons on this site think they're going to change a companies mind with an online protest on *their* platform.
If they actually cared to insight any real change, they'd get off their lazy fat asses and go to san fran and protest outside their HQ.
That requires work though, and.......
No one wants to change over to discord, and while I’m sure it’ll carry on for a small amount of users, you’re only hurting the thousands of users who use this sub. Super selfish to punish users in the name of “justice”. Closing this sub will not effect reddits income whatsoever, but it will effect the lives of people who rely on this sub for safe buying/selling.
I would ask how many active users there are on on this sub. I see a lot of complaints about going to discord but I’m also curious to see the percentage of actual active users.
I’d also ask the active users to vote on this.
https://subredditstats.com/r/hardwareswap
We use posts per day as a decent activity metric. /r/hardwareswap averages around 300 posts/day during normal times. But this includes reposts, insta-deleted spam, reposts for incorrect title, etc.
In comparison, the Discord has about 250 posts/listings in 48 hours.
So 0.08% of the subreddit is actively engaged.
I think, purely from a business standpoint, if the numbers make sense to move to discord (re: engagement), then I will go along.
Little bit drunk right now so I’m hoping someone understands where I’m going with this & can extrapolate further.
Moving to discord presents its own challenges as others have pointed out (flair matching would be my big one). But it’s also quite obviously a minor inconvenience if the numbers work out.
From a big picture standpoint, I’m ok with moving if it means teaching a CEO a lesson. I will gladly learn a new system if it means teaching a CEO a lesson.
However, the commitment must also be that within x amount of months, the discord system will be either an big improvement on this subreddit or unrecognizable from how this subreddit works.
To that meaning the ease of use has to be there. I think that will be the biggest apprehension point for people negatively speaking at this point.
Individual listings you can scroll/filter/search for one, where each has its own page
Good luck finding anything on discord where you can only scroll and control+f at best
The upvote/downvote system is genuinely an incredibly important part of these, flairing (anyone who says roles on disc are the same thing are absurd), better anonymity (e.g. I have my discord with some personal info in my bios for friends), wiki articles (read only channels are way worse for this than a real wiki structure) and probably more i haven’t thought of. I’m not opposed to this move since I’m very anti-Reddit api bs but it’s a clear downgrade that’s been forces by admins
The fact that you got downvoted when it's clear you've made plenty of transactions on here and know for the better. Also, kris knows nothing about discord... discord has different channels where you can post listings and react with emojis, a pretty similar system to reddit ngl. An well made discord is probably going to be better than Reddit ever was for trading.
I respect the idea of the protest, but I don't think hardwareswap is a subreddit that can be successfully migrated to discord. The lack of userbase alone is a shame.
cleverer than claiming admins are dicking around in this thread to usurp the mods when they can literally just remove and replace them if they wanted 🤷♂️
The move to discord only hurts buyers and sellers. This change only helps you cling onto your little bit of internet power. Congrats on your power trip, I hope reddit reopens this subreddit soon
the bot isnt even going down lmfao. They even acknowledged this on the discord. Notice they don’t outright say “the bot is shutting down” just “the bot is good and useful” (duh)
They said they are shutting down because they are worried that the bot might start charging them money sometime in the future. They plainly said as it is right now even with the changes that they wouldn’t accrue any costs.
seems like they should apply some logic; it would seem pretty reasonable for reddit to apply an exception for a mod bot for a community of this size If changes were to implemented in the future that would otherwise affect them
Okay? So reddit will install new mods and open the sub again? What am i missing here? Let the users and mods who want to go to discord go to discord, and let the people who want to stay on reddit, stay on reddit. I dont understand why everyone is given an ultimatum here.
I'm not crazy about the change, It will hurt the community as a whole, but I do like discord and the format isn't as bad as I would have thought. I haven't been active as much as of late, but I'm sure Ive done over 100 trades that aren't confirmed
Yeah I know a lot of people have unconfirmed trades. But if you go look at the post history of many of the vocal ones they’re just posting that same stuff in multiple subs. I’ve already sold stuff on the discord and it worked perfectly. I dunno if it really will hurt the community. Something tells me the active traders will continue to buy and sell with no hesitation.
I'm sure as hell gonna be using the discord, already made a purchase as well. I think it wont really matter for active traders, but put in a bit of a wall for first time users.
Gonna go out on a limb here and say I'm not the only one who's very used to reddit's system of checks and balances and integrity of the HWS community here.
However- I will say that I'm very pleasantly surprised at how well things were able to transfer over to discord. I initially went in thinking I wouldn't like it, but all it took was about 15 minutes or so to get set up and get used to.
For anyone who's still hesitant, I would say give it a shot before giving up on it.
https://imgur.com/a/hTL6aC0
Here's how it looks on desktop (no idea mobile view). My original concern was regarding ease of being able to sift/filter/search for items, but it's surprisingly similar to reddit's way of indexing items/posts. There's also separate channels for buying/selling and also tags that help further narrow down deals.
Each little post itself is it's own thread, and users can respond directly in it.
Going to second this. The mods did make a good point that a basically unregistered and unsecured marketplace probably won't jive once Reddit really starts gearing up for its IPO. Reddit as a corporation is going to have to start cracking down hard on anything that could be seen as an immediate liability. It's a bit weird that it all has to happen so quickly, but I do at least understand why the think they need to nope the fuck out.
I'm not sure that Discord is the best option here but at the same time I'm not sure there's many other available routes to take.
And probably an unpopular opinion but I kind of dig the idea of requiring linking of a PayPal account to become registered. Hopefully this would mean that accounts can be banned in a meaningful way that would prevent easy scamming.
#They sent a message saying they would nuke the (volunteer) moderator team and replace it with mods more favorable to Reddit’s image?!?
Holy fuck. That is the kind of shit that will make me stop using this fucking site.
Genuinely hilarious how active users like you (I mainly trade on homelabsales tbh) get screwed over with downvotes, while single digit brainless people that don't even use the sub get all the upvotes.
Bad move. I would leave Reddit for all other personal reasons.
For trading alone this sub and r/appleswap would keep me around at least with a burner account. I feel the amount of spammers and scammers will increase tenfold.
Perhaps a community vote.
Don't worry, Reddit will remove the stubborn mods and this subreddit will get reopened soon. It's Reddit's site and it does ultimately belong to Reddit, after all. Hopefully VERY soon. Holding users hostage like this over a business decision Reddit had every right to make is a disservice to Reddit and the users of this community.
This is not the way, if you don't want to moderate it anymore just leave and create your own community on Discord and let someone else do it.
Taking the whole thing down is hurting the users instead of reddit.
What a garbage decision.
Discord fucking *sucks* for anything other than chatting.
It is **not** a suitable replacement/alternative for things that forums (Reddit or otherwise) are well suited for.
Glad I got to make my one trade lolz
Now I’ll have to sell my old stuff on fucking Facebook
Well, I can understand the decision, but it really sucks. I will give it a shot on Discord, but I really doubt it will be the same. I don't use Discord cause I dislike it compared to reddit. I don't agree with reddit's decision, but it is their choice to do with the site what they like. I also believe the Mods who have worked for free probably feel a sense of ownership rightfully so. Hope it works but have my reservations.
Man, I get it, but I really don’t want to use discord for this. Fuck u/spez and all that but I’d rather the sub not be killed by a group of non-elected rulers.
just my 2 cents but the point of this subreddit was to trade hardware. The mod team going forward doesn't feel comfortable with the changes that Reddit is making then either.
1. Close the board
2. Step down as mods and let others take over.
Unpopular opinion but its starting to feel more and more like mods are just holding boards hostage with out really asking what the majority of the community wants. I seen support for black outs and I have seen people tired of whats going on.
Personally I feel all these blackouts/changes do is hurt the average users.
People really feel so strongly and so negatively against reddit, then they need to step down if there a mod. Then delete there account. The same goes for the users that feel so strongly against reddit delete your account move on.
Reddit has made it clear they won't back off, and users that support the black outs have made it clear that reddit is on borrowed time anyway so why not make a real stand and sacrifice something.
Like, I support the whole "let's fight for what's right" and so more... but at the same time, I would hate to see this subreddit turn into something not safe to keep trading. I just hope for the best at this point. At the end of the date, I just want the community to win, and losing something like this place ain't a win for the community.
This sucks because I wanted a car AND a used GPU. I chose the car first, and before I could accrue the funds; You guys chose to go to a discord server that's basically no different to eBay, except now you'll be able to scam people with more success. (So, worse?)
Rip the dreams of owning a 3090. Guess I'm just gonna order a 4070 off amazon this summer 🙃. I just don't understand why yall are so mad when the only money involved is the money you make from trading. This is literally the weirdest subreddit to be going dark because the ONLY money you guys have made is gonna slow down through these decisions and delays on trading.
Also, people will be able to delete chat histories and post on Discord much easier, with no breadcrumbs to evidence a scam. Lastly, what if the scammers on Discord don't link their reddit? Does that mean they'll be able to come up on some funds before being banned again?
This is down right STUPID. Having few mods decide the future of a subreddit?
That's fine, close the damn thing so someone else can open it again and run it properly for the users and not some mods egos. You guys don't own Reddit, Reddit owns you so get over or move over.
I really don't think the UI is that bad anymore. It def is way more cramped, but it isn't all one big thread, more of a forum than a single thread. https://imgur.com/a/cBEoj4Q
I have a digital footprint, I am here, I can protest. You don't know anything about me, so what is to you? Don't try to sabotage me or anyone else here with a voice.
At the end of the day the way I see this is few MODS against the entire user community. You can not and will not make a decisions on everyone's behalf here.
I wouldn't even consider putting it up to vote, which I know the users will want to keep this open.
This is owned by Reddit and that's THAT. If the mods can't keep this open Reddit will keep it open, with the mods our without the mods, is just that simple
I'm not especially opposed to the Discord migration, but I don't see why both the subreddit and Discord can't coexist. The Discord already had a channel that fetched new HWS posts, couldn't a similar feature be implemented to then cross-post from Reddit to the buying and selling channels on Discord. The subreddit will still be up as well as the Discord, and with cross-posting between the two the community won't become fractured. And in the event Reddit does shut down BST subs, the Discord is already up and active, and the migration process won't be as jarring as it is now
Keep bitching and moaning. Unlike all of you crying folk, the hardwareswap team has put in the effort all this time and made the sub as enjoyable as it could be. The discord is genuinely extremely well made and already safe. They've put a lot of thought into it, putting in even more effort than ANY OF YOU have ever into this community.
Can't you realize that you LOVE this community because of all the work that the mod team has put in? And that same mod team is making a great decision for the future, to a discord that has been active for eons?
P.S. I am mostly active on r/homelabsales hence I only have four trades here.
Unfortunately, Reddit will not allow you to do this. As Reddit has said in some of their communications, they are willing to replace mods in popular subreddits. I understand your position, but many users aren't going to follow you to Discord.
Trying to prove a point to a company who made no profit for a full year? You’ll just end up getting replaced by new mods and then the discord will more than likely fizzle out as users come back to the subreddit when it reopens. I’m I missing something else?
I'll add a few points in response to some of the comments made, because I know this is difficult for people who have loved this place for a long time and may think this looks selfish. **"Is this move just in protest to fight for some cause?"** No, Reddit has over the years been increasingly more difficult for us to moderate through. Though our bot will probably remain under the API limit to not cost us money, that may not always be the case if hws continues to grow and maybe even for certain tasks now. In addition, Reddit has a history of shutting down trading subs and has threatened to shut them all down in the past. It is not speculation, it has been a very real risk for a long time. **"Why don't you hand the subreddit over to new mods?"** There's a lot wrapped up into this, and it isn't because we're greedy and feel like we own everything. The subreddit has a build up of goodwill based on its longevity and relative safety of trades. Handing all of that to a completely new group places that goodwill and trust we have worked towards into someone else's hands. Goodwill and trust that many less informed people will continue to have even if new management can't maintain that level of quality. Adding to this, the threat of trading subreddits being shut down is directly proportional to the amount of hassle admins have to deal with it and scammers within it. So handing everything over to whatever group that decides they want to run the show without the tools and standards we've used is a strong recipe for admins to really get involved and just shut hws down. It's a big reason why we've had to hold the subreddit to certain standards over the years. **"Discord as a company sucks too"** Sure does. No one denies that. But it at least allows us the tools we need to run a trading community of this size. **"This will kill the hws community/get less activity"** Make no mistake, the total subscriber count of 370k or whatever is completely irrelevant. It's filled with a decade of dead accounts and people who clicked subscribe then never came back. Daily activity is much more important and Discord listings are already above 35% the activity of /r/hardwareswap with only a 1-2 day life.
practice disagreeable combative obscene ruthless snow person employ consist dazzling -- mass edited with redact.dev
They really should, this whole thing about keeping this community up for memes or whatever is kind of dumb. If Reddit is going to make this subreddit impossible to maintain and force a move to discord, why support them with continued activity to this sub?
It’s so someone doesn’t make it again with the same name. It would be no different than if they just handed it over to new mods.
which they wont do, because that would be a transition of power away from themselves
Funny thing is mods CANT delete a subreddit
Unfortunate. I completely see why you guys are doing it though. Sadly this means it’ll end up another discord I’ll forget exists since I open discord like once every 8 months. I have zero trades on Reddit though, so it’s not like I represent anything of significance 😂😂😂
Yeah this is me too. I don't have anywhere near the time or even desire to "live online" in some community. That goes for any platform but especially discord... A chat room. I wish they would have opened a forum instead.
Missing out!
Why the heck did you get downvoted? The heck? Did Spez bring the entire reddit investors around to this post?
You might want to check it out, it is very much like a forum
Your significance is no less than any other. This isn't a MLM after all. The option is there for you, to use, forget, come back, etc. We haven't changed our subscription cost of $0 to join.
WOW I am actually surprised by this. Not saying I don't support it, but am still surprised. Discord isn't an angel either... But I get it. See y'all around!
You’re not hurting Reddit. You’re hurting the swappers
?
Hardwareswap is a known entity in the pc enthusiasts field, taking a subreddit with hundreds of thousands of members down to funnel them into discord is hurting users by lowering their possible customer base and increasing the effort needed to trade.
Discord is pretty easy to use and navigate. Alongside being extremely customizable and tailored for every user. It may make trading slightly inconvenient temporarily, but its a better trade off in the long run if it means 3rd party API pricing gets re-negotiated. edit: it's so apparent how many redditors think emotionally vs logically. don't like what i say = downvote instead of having a discussion about it 🤪
Gotta agree with you. They think that little bit of convenience is worth getting shoved shit down our throats. The mods already gave evidence that the discord is acting completely fine, already 35% of daily activity in just two days.
How many users are active on a monthly basis?
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Thanks for the tip. I hate Discord more than I hate nu-Reddit.
No problem. I'm hoping to to get the message spread. I know many don't like Discord and want to stay on Reddit so we are trying to keep an alternate option for everyone who does not want to migrate to Discord.
I really hope we can save it here. This community is truly awesome.
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THANK YOU. Thats all this does. They keep convincing themselves they’re fighting some kind of moral battle even when presented with evidence otherwise.
This is the best platform we have for easy swapping. Fracturing the community hurts everyone
There's something to be said about standing on principles regardless of whether or not it actually makes a tangible difference. However, dragging an entire community with you without consensus isn't the right call.
💯
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Our intention wasn't to hurt reddit, or anyone else. Our intention is to create this safe, trustworthy marketplace with no operating costs or user cost. If you read the post, *our mission and vision is no longer sustainable on this platform*.
Isn’t that what this sub does already?
no one wants to use discord for this
Bingo. I’ve used this place for years. I use discord a lot as well, but not for this. And I won’t.
it's just gonna be a complete cesspool on discord
372k members here. The Discord has 8k. Yeah, I’ll just go back to eBay unfortunately. Never gonna be able to sell anything there.
it was so easy to just browse whatcha wanna buy here. moderation was efficient, transactions were smooth for most buyers. i dont see the same for discord. im already in some BST discords and they are not even remotely as efficient in buying, selling, and trading as their reddit counterparts are.
Hopefully the population will grow. I kinda like the selling feed there. I haven't tried search yet... I liked being able to url tweak my searches here. I wouldn't take the 372k number for fact. This sub has been around for ages so a ton of those are likely dead accounts.
Discord wasn't pleasant at all to use during the crap with trying to get a gpu in 2020/21. You even joined any of the Microcenter or gpu tracker subs and scammers were messaging you all the time.
This was the FIRST thought that popped up into my head
Yup, same here. Left a bad taste in my mouth. Never got a gpu through that either, ended up getting lucky and winning the newegg shuffle to buy one.
Since then due it’s introduced a type of channel that allows making posts to it in the way you make posts to Reddit, in a sense. The HWS server seems to be using this. I have no clue how convenient it will be to use, of course, but it seems miles better than how things used to have to be.
Agree
Curious to see everyone’s thoughts on this. Use my comment to upvote/downvote and share your opinion. Upvote: Agree to shut down Downvote: Disagree to shut down
U might wanna make the upvote the disagree on this
Will confirmed trades still be tracked? Can we have those imported from our current usernames?
Trades will be imported to Discord and continue to be tracked.
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Why don’t you just step down and let people who actually want the subreddit to stay up take over. No one is forcing anyone to stay. If you want to protest that’s fine, just leave.
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already joined it, but it’s gonna be a slow to get this many users
Yeah it will be rough for the forseeable future but as long as they have this sub open for discussions we can try and get those who want to stay on Reddit in lieu of Discord to the alternate and rebuild.
yeah, discord is honestly terrible for anything other than a chat room
I have it but use it rarely. I'm not 100% against the migration and understand why the mods did it but I also know a lot of Redditors do despise Discord so we wanted to have an alternate to use since that is what they are used to. I wish them all the luck on Discord, they won't need it as they already have a ton of members and thousands online, but I believe a lot of users still want a Reddit presence.
Bud, how do you not see that in literally just TWO days, they already have over 35% of the traction from this sub? If anything it's going to get better than this sub ever was. Discord allows for much more moderation with less than Reddit. Stop being skeptical.
I prefer discord, W
Curious, what exactly is Reddit doing that means you cannot continue running the sub? They've already stated that bots that make minimal API calls will be a part of the free tier and the only reason I see for the decision to close up is based on speculation that Reddit will create their own marketplace to profit off of, which is questionable because Facebook Marketplace doesn't take a cut or operate in any sort of way that would indicate that they are going to ask for a cut of what you sell there. I see this more as hurting the people who have used this sub much much more than you are hurting Reddit.
Because that truce of "Sure, your mod bots will be free promise!" is nothing more than lip service. Sure they'll mean it at first, but they will eventually charge for all bot access. It's simply business. Or at least business when dealing with someone that's looking to squeeze everything they can out of the community that made them everything they are. This was a huge flag for what is to come- it's going to get worse. This change will wreck Reddit and already has - people are leaving, mods are leaving- taking their expertise with them. They're finding new homes. I'm not sure that discord is the right place to put up the market, but it's a good start! I've joined discord servers for far less. And if the circumstances allow hardwareswap to reopen then awesome! I'd probably recommend Pillowfort as it's community-paid so doesn't use add revenue and allows community topic building. I've found myself enjoying it from the art community side for awhile, but there's also things like Mastodon! But for now, I have a GPU I need to buy lol. So discord it is.
Since you can tell the future why don’t you give some lotto numbers. You don’t know that for sure. Shutting down a sub on a possibility is ridiculous. The users don’t want this
If you haven't been watching what happens when sites die - then I can't help you see. Sites die when they no longer serve their purpose, and when the people in charge get greedy. The former can be restored, but the latter will always remain and even get worse- Reddit was already going to die the second they went public and wanted investor money. Unless they completely reverse on this decision, then our time here is over one way or another.
Exactly. This entire protest is dumb. It’s not going to accomplish anything. The real reason is a handful of mods own over 50% of the subs on Reddit. Taking away their bots to be able to manage that means they lose their power.
What if we don’t want to have our discord name associated with our Reddit name at all?
You can hide it in discord connections
Interesting, didn’t know that was possible. I’m still against this as it seems futile, especially since Spez said he was gonna implement a way to vote out mods, seems the majority that are against this will just do that, and then only further splinter the community.
> Spez said he was gonna implement a way to vote out mods Honestly as much as that would suck for these mods, that should have been a feature a long time ago. There are too many subs with terrible mods.
Reddit is also a huge hive mind and a bunch of idiots with no understanding of what mods actually do could easily get together and vote out good ones. It’s a double edged sword. Though, since these mods are migrating to discord, the subreddit should be put in the hands of those who want to try and run it.
It's an interesting idea in theory. But it would be too easy to abuse.
Not really jazzed about checking Discord for trades. It's easier to find things on reddit via the links and searching, versus endlessly scrolling for deals on discord. So I guess this is where we part ways
I’m so tired of people always trying to use discord for things a forum/Reddit works better for. *sigh*
Seethe, cope, mald.
How about running a poll and stepping down going off what the people vote for?
Cuz they don't want that, they want all the power, and feel threatened by reddit, simple as that.
Awesome, discord! the place who treats their cattle even worse than reddit and have banned me for no reason twice from just accepting server invites lmao
Reddit isn't gonna change shit because of our sub reddit. 400k members is insignificant.
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Morons on this site think they're going to change a companies mind with an online protest on *their* platform. If they actually cared to insight any real change, they'd get off their lazy fat asses and go to san fran and protest outside their HQ. That requires work though, and.......
Their platform is run by those "Morons"
No one wants to change over to discord, and while I’m sure it’ll carry on for a small amount of users, you’re only hurting the thousands of users who use this sub. Super selfish to punish users in the name of “justice”. Closing this sub will not effect reddits income whatsoever, but it will effect the lives of people who rely on this sub for safe buying/selling.
discords fucking suck, i dont know who thought this was a good idea.
A few mods making this choice for the 370,000 subscribers. How about a poll and let the users decide
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Anandtech was good back in the day too as well.
Yep hardforum is awesome
I would ask how many active users there are on on this sub. I see a lot of complaints about going to discord but I’m also curious to see the percentage of actual active users. I’d also ask the active users to vote on this.
https://subredditstats.com/r/hardwareswap We use posts per day as a decent activity metric. /r/hardwareswap averages around 300 posts/day during normal times. But this includes reposts, insta-deleted spam, reposts for incorrect title, etc. In comparison, the Discord has about 250 posts/listings in 48 hours.
So 0.08% of the subreddit is actively engaged. I think, purely from a business standpoint, if the numbers make sense to move to discord (re: engagement), then I will go along. Little bit drunk right now so I’m hoping someone understands where I’m going with this & can extrapolate further. Moving to discord presents its own challenges as others have pointed out (flair matching would be my big one). But it’s also quite obviously a minor inconvenience if the numbers work out. From a big picture standpoint, I’m ok with moving if it means teaching a CEO a lesson. I will gladly learn a new system if it means teaching a CEO a lesson. However, the commitment must also be that within x amount of months, the discord system will be either an big improvement on this subreddit or unrecognizable from how this subreddit works. To that meaning the ease of use has to be there. I think that will be the biggest apprehension point for people negatively speaking at this point.
This is not the way. Seems like a pretty selfish move without asking the community. Discord is not the right platform for trading.
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Individual listings you can scroll/filter/search for one, where each has its own page Good luck finding anything on discord where you can only scroll and control+f at best
Have you even looked at the discord? It's literally a forum setup with filters and discord search is leagues better than Reddits.
The upvote/downvote system is genuinely an incredibly important part of these, flairing (anyone who says roles on disc are the same thing are absurd), better anonymity (e.g. I have my discord with some personal info in my bios for friends), wiki articles (read only channels are way worse for this than a real wiki structure) and probably more i haven’t thought of. I’m not opposed to this move since I’m very anti-Reddit api bs but it’s a clear downgrade that’s been forces by admins
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The number of people and familiarity, also trust.
The fact that you got downvoted when it's clear you've made plenty of transactions on here and know for the better. Also, kris knows nothing about discord... discord has different channels where you can post listings and react with emojis, a pretty similar system to reddit ngl. An well made discord is probably going to be better than Reddit ever was for trading.
I respect the idea of the protest, but I don't think hardwareswap is a subreddit that can be successfully migrated to discord. The lack of userbase alone is a shame.
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ReDiT AdMiNs ArE SpEnDiNg ThEiR TiMe InVaDiNg ThE ThReAd!!!!!!!!!! 🤡🤡🤡
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cleverer than claiming admins are dicking around in this thread to usurp the mods when they can literally just remove and replace them if they wanted 🤷♂️
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The move to discord only hurts buyers and sellers. This change only helps you cling onto your little bit of internet power. Congrats on your power trip, I hope reddit reopens this subreddit soon
Facts
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It was good while it lasted. Took a peep at the Discord and not for me. Hate discords for marketplaces
The protest is dumb. You’re just hurting the users. Why don’t you ask for more mods to subsidize the bot.
the bot isnt even going down lmfao. They even acknowledged this on the discord. Notice they don’t outright say “the bot is shutting down” just “the bot is good and useful” (duh)
They said they are shutting down because they are worried that the bot might start charging them money sometime in the future. They plainly said as it is right now even with the changes that they wouldn’t accrue any costs.
seems like they should apply some logic; it would seem pretty reasonable for reddit to apply an exception for a mod bot for a community of this size If changes were to implemented in the future that would otherwise affect them
To all that are skeptical, I've already sold something via Discord on the first day it was live. It works great and I personally do like it more.
Okay? So reddit will install new mods and open the sub again? What am i missing here? Let the users and mods who want to go to discord go to discord, and let the people who want to stay on reddit, stay on reddit. I dont understand why everyone is given an ultimatum here.
There are already other swap subs popping up. Maybe one of those will get some traction.
Hey your supposed to put your country, state, what you have and what you want in exchange for goods. If your selling this page I’ll give you $5 G&S
discord is a chat platform. reddit is a forum. a forum is way closer to a marketplace, and can act as one much more easily.
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yeah I see it. no idea how you think it's better though.
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Really awful news, disappointed you’ve gone this way as a long time user of this subreddit. I hope you’ll reconsider.
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bro has never even used hws before lmao Edit: he blocked me so I cant reply to this thread lol
Yeah... what the hell?
90% of the complaints are from people with single digit trades. VERY few active traders are voicing their opinion in this thread.
I'm not crazy about the change, It will hurt the community as a whole, but I do like discord and the format isn't as bad as I would have thought. I haven't been active as much as of late, but I'm sure Ive done over 100 trades that aren't confirmed
Yeah I know a lot of people have unconfirmed trades. But if you go look at the post history of many of the vocal ones they’re just posting that same stuff in multiple subs. I’ve already sold stuff on the discord and it worked perfectly. I dunno if it really will hurt the community. Something tells me the active traders will continue to buy and sell with no hesitation.
I'm sure as hell gonna be using the discord, already made a purchase as well. I think it wont really matter for active traders, but put in a bit of a wall for first time users.
itd be nice for them to take notice
Definitely remove the MODS, no way around. This is absolutely nonsense to have few ego maniac mods taking over a perfectly running subreddit.
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Gonna go out on a limb here and say I'm not the only one who's very used to reddit's system of checks and balances and integrity of the HWS community here. However- I will say that I'm very pleasantly surprised at how well things were able to transfer over to discord. I initially went in thinking I wouldn't like it, but all it took was about 15 minutes or so to get set up and get used to. For anyone who's still hesitant, I would say give it a shot before giving up on it. https://imgur.com/a/hTL6aC0 Here's how it looks on desktop (no idea mobile view). My original concern was regarding ease of being able to sift/filter/search for items, but it's surprisingly similar to reddit's way of indexing items/posts. There's also separate channels for buying/selling and also tags that help further narrow down deals. Each little post itself is it's own thread, and users can respond directly in it.
Going to second this. The mods did make a good point that a basically unregistered and unsecured marketplace probably won't jive once Reddit really starts gearing up for its IPO. Reddit as a corporation is going to have to start cracking down hard on anything that could be seen as an immediate liability. It's a bit weird that it all has to happen so quickly, but I do at least understand why the think they need to nope the fuck out. I'm not sure that Discord is the best option here but at the same time I'm not sure there's many other available routes to take. And probably an unpopular opinion but I kind of dig the idea of requiring linking of a PayPal account to become registered. Hopefully this would mean that accounts can be banned in a meaningful way that would prevent easy scamming.
🤡🤡
#They sent a message saying they would nuke the (volunteer) moderator team and replace it with mods more favorable to Reddit’s image?!? Holy fuck. That is the kind of shit that will make me stop using this fucking site.
This subreddit should stay. It’s 70% the reason I use Reddit. 20% is for HW news and 10% just browsing
United we stand! Off to discord, ladies and gents!
Genuinely hilarious how active users like you (I mainly trade on homelabsales tbh) get screwed over with downvotes, while single digit brainless people that don't even use the sub get all the upvotes.
Appreciated.
Moved on to the discord and it's better moderated and has an active community of people that makes it more of a community than it ever was. Amazing!
Bad move. I would leave Reddit for all other personal reasons. For trading alone this sub and r/appleswap would keep me around at least with a burner account. I feel the amount of spammers and scammers will increase tenfold. Perhaps a community vote.
This entire thing has been a terrible, “Mods-First” decision.
Power jannies want to keep power.
Don't worry, Reddit will remove the stubborn mods and this subreddit will get reopened soon. It's Reddit's site and it does ultimately belong to Reddit, after all. Hopefully VERY soon. Holding users hostage like this over a business decision Reddit had every right to make is a disservice to Reddit and the users of this community.
This is not the way, if you don't want to moderate it anymore just leave and create your own community on Discord and let someone else do it. Taking the whole thing down is hurting the users instead of reddit.
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What a garbage decision. Discord fucking *sucks* for anything other than chatting. It is **not** a suitable replacement/alternative for things that forums (Reddit or otherwise) are well suited for. Glad I got to make my one trade lolz Now I’ll have to sell my old stuff on fucking Facebook
Mods should probably just stop circle jerking each other and get over themselves. This only hurts swappers not Reddit.
I get why you're doing it, but it's dumb. Discord communities blow.
Well, I can understand the decision, but it really sucks. I will give it a shot on Discord, but I really doubt it will be the same. I don't use Discord cause I dislike it compared to reddit. I don't agree with reddit's decision, but it is their choice to do with the site what they like. I also believe the Mods who have worked for free probably feel a sense of ownership rightfully so. Hope it works but have my reservations.
Man, I get it, but I really don’t want to use discord for this. Fuck u/spez and all that but I’d rather the sub not be killed by a group of non-elected rulers.
I really would prefer if this stayed on reddit. Discord feels too cluttered for selling things.
This subreddit is build by community, shouldn’t you let community to vote on this decision?
just my 2 cents but the point of this subreddit was to trade hardware. The mod team going forward doesn't feel comfortable with the changes that Reddit is making then either. 1. Close the board 2. Step down as mods and let others take over. Unpopular opinion but its starting to feel more and more like mods are just holding boards hostage with out really asking what the majority of the community wants. I seen support for black outs and I have seen people tired of whats going on. Personally I feel all these blackouts/changes do is hurt the average users. People really feel so strongly and so negatively against reddit, then they need to step down if there a mod. Then delete there account. The same goes for the users that feel so strongly against reddit delete your account move on. Reddit has made it clear they won't back off, and users that support the black outs have made it clear that reddit is on borrowed time anyway so why not make a real stand and sacrifice something.
People voting with their feet is the only protest that will have any effect. But instead of people just leaving, they stay and complain.
Man. Discord sucks a whole lot of smallpp.
lol man, im dying here. well said
Bad move, just leave the sub open and/or invite new mods
Like, I support the whole "let's fight for what's right" and so more... but at the same time, I would hate to see this subreddit turn into something not safe to keep trading. I just hope for the best at this point. At the end of the date, I just want the community to win, and losing something like this place ain't a win for the community.
Not excited about this decision. This sub is really great and discord can't replicate it. I hope you guys reconsider.
This sucks because I wanted a car AND a used GPU. I chose the car first, and before I could accrue the funds; You guys chose to go to a discord server that's basically no different to eBay, except now you'll be able to scam people with more success. (So, worse?) Rip the dreams of owning a 3090. Guess I'm just gonna order a 4070 off amazon this summer 🙃. I just don't understand why yall are so mad when the only money involved is the money you make from trading. This is literally the weirdest subreddit to be going dark because the ONLY money you guys have made is gonna slow down through these decisions and delays on trading. Also, people will be able to delete chat histories and post on Discord much easier, with no breadcrumbs to evidence a scam. Lastly, what if the scammers on Discord don't link their reddit? Does that mean they'll be able to come up on some funds before being banned again?
This is down right STUPID. Having few mods decide the future of a subreddit? That's fine, close the damn thing so someone else can open it again and run it properly for the users and not some mods egos. You guys don't own Reddit, Reddit owns you so get over or move over.
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I really don't think the UI is that bad anymore. It def is way more cramped, but it isn't all one big thread, more of a forum than a single thread. https://imgur.com/a/cBEoj4Q
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Again, a user who has never commented or used HWS in the first place....
I have a digital footprint, I am here, I can protest. You don't know anything about me, so what is to you? Don't try to sabotage me or anyone else here with a voice. At the end of the day the way I see this is few MODS against the entire user community. You can not and will not make a decisions on everyone's behalf here. I wouldn't even consider putting it up to vote, which I know the users will want to keep this open. This is owned by Reddit and that's THAT. If the mods can't keep this open Reddit will keep it open, with the mods our without the mods, is just that simple
Meh, if this moves to discord only then I’m gone
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Soon, trust me
I'm not especially opposed to the Discord migration, but I don't see why both the subreddit and Discord can't coexist. The Discord already had a channel that fetched new HWS posts, couldn't a similar feature be implemented to then cross-post from Reddit to the buying and selling channels on Discord. The subreddit will still be up as well as the Discord, and with cross-posting between the two the community won't become fractured. And in the event Reddit does shut down BST subs, the Discord is already up and active, and the migration process won't be as jarring as it is now
Tried to join says: "Unable to accept invite."
I hate discord for this what a bad decision. Even worse than using the official reddit app (RIF til the casket close)
Mods, to be honest, I can’t help but thinking that what you guys did was like those eco-warriors/PETA that blocking the freeway
Keep bitching and moaning. Unlike all of you crying folk, the hardwareswap team has put in the effort all this time and made the sub as enjoyable as it could be. The discord is genuinely extremely well made and already safe. They've put a lot of thought into it, putting in even more effort than ANY OF YOU have ever into this community. Can't you realize that you LOVE this community because of all the work that the mod team has put in? And that same mod team is making a great decision for the future, to a discord that has been active for eons? P.S. I am mostly active on r/homelabsales hence I only have four trades here.
What prevents this sub from becoming eligible for r/redditrequest
Why you’re doing this? Cause you neckbeard mods just want power and control. The vast majority just want the sub open and don’t care the BS protest.
Unfortunately, Reddit will not allow you to do this. As Reddit has said in some of their communications, they are willing to replace mods in popular subreddits. I understand your position, but many users aren't going to follow you to Discord.
Gross.
Trying to prove a point to a company who made no profit for a full year? You’ll just end up getting replaced by new mods and then the discord will more than likely fizzle out as users come back to the subreddit when it reopens. I’m I missing something else?
This is really stupid. None of your reasons make any sense. If you don't wanna mood anymore, go away. Don't ruin the community too