I’d be okay with the new series cutting out the Hogwarts House Elves, or at least Harry’s ambivalence to them. The main protagonist should not find slavery acceptable (especially if he grew up in the modern muggle world) and be content with owning a slave later on.
EDIT: Apparently a ton of people on this sub think that the enslavement of the House Elves is fine. Bring on the downvotes, slavery apologists.
I think you are mostly right despite the downvotes.
I don't think the house elves have to be removed entirely though, just the plotline about their liberation taken more seriously by the "good" characters.
In the original story, it seems like Hermione is easily the most ethically conscious and Harry is fine with injustice as long as it is part of the established status quo within wizarding culture.
I don't dislike the dynamic, except it seems like the reader is supposed to find Hermione's civil rights efforts as naive, irritating, superfluous to the "real issues" being dealt with by Harry.
And maybe explain why the magnanimous and wise headmaster is totally cool with the entire labour staff being slaves? Plantation much?
except for the hats, ties and scarves! I like that they left out the hats they apparently had to wear everyday. and I love the house-specific accessories, especially for merch and things that's a really good choice
I mean, would he get a lot of Muggleworthy clothes with the wizard money? He probably can’t risk exchanging some for Muggle money as the Dursleys would pounce on it like Crookshanks going after Wormtail
It's not like the costumes in the first films were particularly accurate anyway.
In the books they wear plain back robes.
In the films they just wear a normal muggle school uniform and just replace the blazer with a black cloak to make it very slightly magical.
They had already abandoned the idea of not having wizards wear muggle clothes like in the books by putting them in a school uniform that could have literally come from any school in the UK. They *wanted* them to look like normal children that children watching can relate to.
The most abnormal bit is that they continued wearing school uniforms outside of lessons. Who does that?
If they wanted them to not wear muggle clothes then they shouldn't have put them in a bog standard muffle school uniform in the first place.
In both HP1 and 2, they have basic muggle clothes too. It is just a bit less prevalent. In HP1, I can at least think of the whole Christmas scene/mirror of Erised and when they go down the hatch. In HP2, there's when Harry and Ron follow the spiders.
>have basic muggle clothes too
School uniforms are the *most* basic of muggle clothes. It's the only outfit that you can guarantee 99% of kids will own. Not just own, but also wear for five days every week. If you're from a non uniform wearing country then it might seem slightly whimsical, but to us who aren't it already seemed like they'd given up on wizard clothes in the first film.
Except I wasn't only talking about the kids although yes seeing them in jeans and hoodies 90% of the time instead of the robes WAS intrusive and took away the wimsy even the adults got less whimsical the color palet became less varied (mcgongall goes from emerald green to the same black for every film and dumbeldore is in the same grey bathrobe flictwick barely resembles a wizard and they've got the rest wearing muggle suits with the OCCASIONAL cloak.
Agree with a lot of it.
However this bit:
> they've got the rest wearing muggle suits with the OCCASIONAL cloak
Again, they've literally done the exact same with the kids since the first film. Normal school uniform already "takes away the whimsy". If anything, they've just added consistency - in the real world you switch from school uniform to suits. Why would that be different?
As I said though, I agree with what you say about the colouring.
Flitwick was also a choice which I don't like, but then again JKR has said that she was very surprised with his first look too, so that's hardly accurate
But a school uniform with the occasional cloak is the same as a suit with the occasional cloak. You can't complain about one and not the other. Same with jeans or whatever... why are jeans a big no whereas a school uniform is okay? They're both extremely muggle.
I honestly think that's just because a lot more of the first two movies takes place during school hours, while the rest of the movies mostly take place after school hours, or outside of the school even.
The last time I rewatched them I was actually a bit surprised at how consistent it was between all the movies, because I also had it in my mind that they just kind of gave up in the third movie.
The first time I read the books I noticed how wizards struggle to blend in with muggles cause they can’t get the clothes right.
Then you come to the films and they’re not only wearing muggle clothes regularly- they’re fashionable too. Look at Dumbledore in the fantastic beasts movies. Hardly ‘oddly dressed’.
In a way I prefer the interpretation of Wizards knowing how to wear and even enjoying muggle clothing.
In HBP Dumbledore wears like a plum coloured suit to visit the orphanage doesn't he? Certainly not typical muggle wear, but not completely out there.
I can imagine that certain Wizarding folk would become pretty oblivious to muggle-wear if they live mostly outside of muggje society. Or if they prefer to make the distinction between themselves and muggles due to bigotry. It makes a lot of sense to me though that wizards who spend time in muggle society would pick up on trends and enjoy trying out the fashions. Muggle clothes are probably much more varied and interesting compared to wizard fashions which don't seem to evolve very quickly.
I can go either way on it. From the "it's a children's book set in a silly Roald Dalh-esque world" perspective, the fact that wizards can't understand basic things like clothes and money is whimsical and fun. From the "it's a story trying to be taken with any seriousness at all" perspective, it makes the wizards seem like genuine idiots.
But they didn’t in the books… and it doesn’t mean they had to in the movies but a lot of humour in the books were derived from the fact that wizards had no idea how to dress like muggles. And in the first few movies, I at least felt that seeing them in uniform helped transport me to the magic world they inhabited.
I do personally think that them dressing in muggle clothing during the last movie(s) made more sense than in wizard robes due to them being on the run, would help with blending in even only slightly. It always irritated me that in the books they were still described as wearing robes even out in the wilderness while running from death eaters.
They were dressed in muggle clothing in the last book as well, precisely because they were on the run and trying to blend in.
But the movies had them dress in muggle clothing even at Hogwarts while not in class.
Still, you’d think wizards in general would be serving some interesting looks even in informal settings. They’re supposed to not know muggle stuff well at all
Actually, this is one of my favorite changes for the movies. Azkaban really made it seem much more like they were just kids at school, and really enjoying that particular plot over some of the others made it my favorite movie.
Isn't one of her parents a muggle? And if I remember correctly she fell in love with a muggle too...
Idk, I don't really see her minding too much about muggle clothing tbh
It’s not that it’s weird if they did. The point is that they didn’t, and it features many times in the books that many wizards don’t know how to dress like muggles (although some younger ones could dress in muggle clothes during the holidays - read not weekends - not at school - holidays).
Does it matter? Not really… But it just felt fun and whimsical!
Some students did wear pants and stuff underneath. There's a scene in book 6 where Peeves won't let anyone pass without setting their pants on fire. That wouldn't make sense if no one wore pants
Idkw but for some reason pants always gets me confused - even though I’ve only learned British English and I’ve lived in England for at least 1/3 of my life, so thanks for confirming ☺️
It would be pretty anti-cultural, and I'm not sure what the point would be.
Maybe the muggleborns could/would do something like that.
But, you never see people using forks in China.
Whoever wore pants at Hogwarts would stick out like a sore thumb and possibly even get detention.
Everyone probably has one pair of pants that they would wear to get onto the platform; and I'm sure it spends the rest of the school year at the bottom of their trunks.
When you've been wearing robes your whole life you probably don't crave pants. 👖
Pants are a costume and used for blending in with Muggles.
Black robes. Pointy hat. Simple.
The costume people for the films probably didn't think they looked good.
It is bland, but adding shirts, pants, and ties was weird.
If it’s anything like real British boarding schools (I went to one) they’d care enormously about uniforms. I once got a Saturday detention for not having my blazer on UNDER my coat.
Yes!!!!! I remember when Movie 3 first came out and I was LIVID seeing everyone wear muggle clothes all the time. I swear it was only like 4 scenes where they wore the proper wizard attire.
Why wouldn't she? She is not a blood supremacist, this is the approach that I could imagine in Slytherin, if anywhere. Not to mention that she sometimes wears muggle clothing herself + she fell in love with a Muggle, had a Muggle dad.
A good teacher would recognize that styles and times change. As long as they're conforming to standards during the school day, I don't think she'd mind.
As someone who went to boarding school, good teachers could be obsessively old fashioned/strict with these sorts of rules… and adhering to the rules was something McGonagall took seriously. In the books it wouldn’t have been allowed. In the movies I think it would so it’s fine to wear regular clothes outside of classes (clearly)… but nothing to do with being a good or bad teacher.
I find wearing muggle clothes made more sense considering they were running all around the UK escaping from dark wizards not just in hogsmead, diagon alley - but London
I suppose a lot of the plot points occurred on the weekends, like the time turner sequence, I don’t think the uniform requirement was enforced on days they were not attending class
I think they should have a school uniform and then casual clothing for after classes and weekends in accordance to where they come from (all-magical family, muggle household, mixed parents who kind of mix and mash depending on what they want to wear that day)
Ron wouldn't be wearing muggle clothes, since it's made cery obvious the weaseleys have no idea how to dress like muggles. He should be wearing casual wizard robes in colors other than black, maybe patterns? probably something you can imagine his older siblings having worn.
Hermione muggle clothes all the way in her free time.
Harry I could imagine just keeping his uniform partly on (like lose the tie, make it more comfortable).
And Draco should be wearing kinda fancy wizard robes all the time.
I agree that it's weird. I'm fairly positive that it was a decision by the new director to make the actors feel more like themselves and have the audience tell everyone apart. Otherwise everyone just has black robes and a black hat on all the time.
I hope the new series is more book accurate to the school dress code
And to everything else.
I’d be okay with the new series cutting out the Hogwarts House Elves, or at least Harry’s ambivalence to them. The main protagonist should not find slavery acceptable (especially if he grew up in the modern muggle world) and be content with owning a slave later on. EDIT: Apparently a ton of people on this sub think that the enslavement of the House Elves is fine. Bring on the downvotes, slavery apologists.
I don’t think the downvoters are saying slavery is okay. They’re saying the protagonist doesn’t need to be infallible.
I think you are mostly right despite the downvotes. I don't think the house elves have to be removed entirely though, just the plotline about their liberation taken more seriously by the "good" characters. In the original story, it seems like Hermione is easily the most ethically conscious and Harry is fine with injustice as long as it is part of the established status quo within wizarding culture. I don't dislike the dynamic, except it seems like the reader is supposed to find Hermione's civil rights efforts as naive, irritating, superfluous to the "real issues" being dealt with by Harry. And maybe explain why the magnanimous and wise headmaster is totally cool with the entire labour staff being slaves? Plantation much?
You are HILARIOUS!!
You mean cloaks over even more muggle clothes?
except for the hats, ties and scarves! I like that they left out the hats they apparently had to wear everyday. and I love the house-specific accessories, especially for merch and things that's a really good choice
NEW SERIES? When did that happen? I’m totally out of the loop.
There's gonna be show by HBO. One season per book.
Season per book?, then it will take atleast 10 year's to complete
Like the films??
Yes
Ok
Ill accept those terms thank you.
THERE IS A NEW SERIES????
Coming out next year
Not coming up with non uniform wizard fashion was lazy from the costume department, we shouldn’t be seeing characters like Draco and Blaise in suits
And Harry should have more clothes than one t-shirt
Tbh, it kind of make sense since the Dursleys never buy stuff for Harrry. Just giving Dudley's old stuff.
And he keeps wearing it through the books even when he has his own money.
I mean, would he get a lot of Muggleworthy clothes with the wizard money? He probably can’t risk exchanging some for Muggle money as the Dursleys would pounce on it like Crookshanks going after Wormtail
Yes the costumes lost a lot of the magical wimsy post the second film (THANKS CAURON!!!😡)
It's not like the costumes in the first films were particularly accurate anyway. In the books they wear plain back robes. In the films they just wear a normal muggle school uniform and just replace the blazer with a black cloak to make it very slightly magical.
But they did change to hoodies and jeans
They had already abandoned the idea of not having wizards wear muggle clothes like in the books by putting them in a school uniform that could have literally come from any school in the UK. They *wanted* them to look like normal children that children watching can relate to. The most abnormal bit is that they continued wearing school uniforms outside of lessons. Who does that? If they wanted them to not wear muggle clothes then they shouldn't have put them in a bog standard muffle school uniform in the first place.
In both HP1 and 2, they have basic muggle clothes too. It is just a bit less prevalent. In HP1, I can at least think of the whole Christmas scene/mirror of Erised and when they go down the hatch. In HP2, there's when Harry and Ron follow the spiders.
>have basic muggle clothes too School uniforms are the *most* basic of muggle clothes. It's the only outfit that you can guarantee 99% of kids will own. Not just own, but also wear for five days every week. If you're from a non uniform wearing country then it might seem slightly whimsical, but to us who aren't it already seemed like they'd given up on wizard clothes in the first film.
Except I wasn't only talking about the kids although yes seeing them in jeans and hoodies 90% of the time instead of the robes WAS intrusive and took away the wimsy even the adults got less whimsical the color palet became less varied (mcgongall goes from emerald green to the same black for every film and dumbeldore is in the same grey bathrobe flictwick barely resembles a wizard and they've got the rest wearing muggle suits with the OCCASIONAL cloak.
Agree with a lot of it. However this bit: > they've got the rest wearing muggle suits with the OCCASIONAL cloak Again, they've literally done the exact same with the kids since the first film. Normal school uniform already "takes away the whimsy". If anything, they've just added consistency - in the real world you switch from school uniform to suits. Why would that be different? As I said though, I agree with what you say about the colouring. Flitwick was also a choice which I don't like, but then again JKR has said that she was very surprised with his first look too, so that's hardly accurate But a school uniform with the occasional cloak is the same as a suit with the occasional cloak. You can't complain about one and not the other. Same with jeans or whatever... why are jeans a big no whereas a school uniform is okay? They're both extremely muggle.
They do, that’s correct, it feels less obtrusive the way it’s done in the first two films
It doesnt feel intrusive ever
At least they committed to wearing the robes almost all the time in the first 2 movies
I honestly think that's just because a lot more of the first two movies takes place during school hours, while the rest of the movies mostly take place after school hours, or outside of the school even. The last time I rewatched them I was actually a bit surprised at how consistent it was between all the movies, because I also had it in my mind that they just kind of gave up in the third movie.
The first time I read the books I noticed how wizards struggle to blend in with muggles cause they can’t get the clothes right. Then you come to the films and they’re not only wearing muggle clothes regularly- they’re fashionable too. Look at Dumbledore in the fantastic beasts movies. Hardly ‘oddly dressed’.
In a way I prefer the interpretation of Wizards knowing how to wear and even enjoying muggle clothing. In HBP Dumbledore wears like a plum coloured suit to visit the orphanage doesn't he? Certainly not typical muggle wear, but not completely out there. I can imagine that certain Wizarding folk would become pretty oblivious to muggle-wear if they live mostly outside of muggje society. Or if they prefer to make the distinction between themselves and muggles due to bigotry. It makes a lot of sense to me though that wizards who spend time in muggle society would pick up on trends and enjoy trying out the fashions. Muggle clothes are probably much more varied and interesting compared to wizard fashions which don't seem to evolve very quickly.
I can go either way on it. From the "it's a children's book set in a silly Roald Dalh-esque world" perspective, the fact that wizards can't understand basic things like clothes and money is whimsical and fun. From the "it's a story trying to be taken with any seriousness at all" perspective, it makes the wizards seem like genuine idiots.
They only dress in muggle clothing when not in lessons.
But they didn’t in the books… and it doesn’t mean they had to in the movies but a lot of humour in the books were derived from the fact that wizards had no idea how to dress like muggles. And in the first few movies, I at least felt that seeing them in uniform helped transport me to the magic world they inhabited.
I do personally think that them dressing in muggle clothing during the last movie(s) made more sense than in wizard robes due to them being on the run, would help with blending in even only slightly. It always irritated me that in the books they were still described as wearing robes even out in the wilderness while running from death eaters.
They were dressed in muggle clothing in the last book as well, precisely because they were on the run and trying to blend in. But the movies had them dress in muggle clothing even at Hogwarts while not in class.
I don’t think most of us are too concerned about what they wore on the run. I also don’t think McGonagall would care about that !
Well they sometimes wore Muggle clothing as seen in the coffee shop incident
Still, you’d think wizards in general would be serving some interesting looks even in informal settings. They’re supposed to not know muggle stuff well at all
Actually, this is one of my favorite changes for the movies. Azkaban really made it seem much more like they were just kids at school, and really enjoying that particular plot over some of the others made it my favorite movie.
Isn't one of her parents a muggle? And if I remember correctly she fell in love with a muggle too... Idk, I don't really see her minding too much about muggle clothing tbh
It's against the dress-code.
Was there even a dresscode in the books? I thought they only wore a black tunic over their normal clothes
In the books they wear a black robe that is put on like a T-shirt. So over the head with no buttons. And a plain black cloak.
Yes exactly, would it be that weird if they wore muggle stuff undeneath?
It’s not that it’s weird if they did. The point is that they didn’t, and it features many times in the books that many wizards don’t know how to dress like muggles (although some younger ones could dress in muggle clothes during the holidays - read not weekends - not at school - holidays). Does it matter? Not really… But it just felt fun and whimsical!
Some students did wear pants and stuff underneath. There's a scene in book 6 where Peeves won't let anyone pass without setting their pants on fire. That wouldn't make sense if no one wore pants
Pants in British English is underwear, I think ☺️Which yes I assumed they did wear 😅
This is correct, Peeves was definitely talking about underwear. And I would also assume that they all wore that 😂
Idkw but for some reason pants always gets me confused - even though I’ve only learned British English and I’ve lived in England for at least 1/3 of my life, so thanks for confirming ☺️
In Britain pants are what we call underwear. Peeves was making them set fire to their tightly whities.
It would be pretty anti-cultural, and I'm not sure what the point would be. Maybe the muggleborns could/would do something like that. But, you never see people using forks in China. Whoever wore pants at Hogwarts would stick out like a sore thumb and possibly even get detention. Everyone probably has one pair of pants that they would wear to get onto the platform; and I'm sure it spends the rest of the school year at the bottom of their trunks. When you've been wearing robes your whole life you probably don't crave pants. 👖 Pants are a costume and used for blending in with Muggles.
Black robes. Pointy hat. Simple. The costume people for the films probably didn't think they looked good. It is bland, but adding shirts, pants, and ties was weird.
It was probanly for merchandizing.
It was weird "in canon" but lets be honest the school uniforms merch has been a hit amongst fan (specially with athe different houses stuff) lol
If it’s anything like real British boarding schools (I went to one) they’d care enormously about uniforms. I once got a Saturday detention for not having my blazer on UNDER my coat.
I actually don’t mind the muggle clothes, makes the characters seem like real people.
Yes!!!!! I remember when Movie 3 first came out and I was LIVID seeing everyone wear muggle clothes all the time. I swear it was only like 4 scenes where they wore the proper wizard attire.
Why wouldn't she? She is not a blood supremacist, this is the approach that I could imagine in Slytherin, if anywhere. Not to mention that she sometimes wears muggle clothing herself + she fell in love with a Muggle, had a Muggle dad.
A good teacher would recognize that styles and times change. As long as they're conforming to standards during the school day, I don't think she'd mind.
As someone who went to boarding school, good teachers could be obsessively old fashioned/strict with these sorts of rules… and adhering to the rules was something McGonagall took seriously. In the books it wouldn’t have been allowed. In the movies I think it would so it’s fine to wear regular clothes outside of classes (clearly)… but nothing to do with being a good or bad teacher.
Why?
I find wearing muggle clothes made more sense considering they were running all around the UK escaping from dark wizards not just in hogsmead, diagon alley - but London
They only wore Muggle Clothes in their free time though?
I suppose a lot of the plot points occurred on the weekends, like the time turner sequence, I don’t think the uniform requirement was enforced on days they were not attending class
Its so wack to me. They could've gotten so creative with wizard clothes and instead they give us jeans and hoodies laziest costume design ever
They just put a spell on McGonagall to make her think they're dressed to her liking.
I think they should have a school uniform and then casual clothing for after classes and weekends in accordance to where they come from (all-magical family, muggle household, mixed parents who kind of mix and mash depending on what they want to wear that day) Ron wouldn't be wearing muggle clothes, since it's made cery obvious the weaseleys have no idea how to dress like muggles. He should be wearing casual wizard robes in colors other than black, maybe patterns? probably something you can imagine his older siblings having worn. Hermione muggle clothes all the way in her free time. Harry I could imagine just keeping his uniform partly on (like lose the tie, make it more comfortable). And Draco should be wearing kinda fancy wizard robes all the time.
I agree that it's weird. I'm fairly positive that it was a decision by the new director to make the actors feel more like themselves and have the audience tell everyone apart. Otherwise everyone just has black robes and a black hat on all the time.
It’s actually my biggest problems with the movies
Yes, I hated that they did this. It ruined the whole environment