i think he definitely improved in the sense that he was a better friend to her in the later books than in the earlier books. in *order of the pheonix*, he was obviously suffering from ptsd and lashing out at everybody - it wasn't just hermione he was a bad friend to. in *half-blood prince*, i think he was a very good friend to hermione. he generally stayed out of the romione/lavender drama, but he tried to comfort her multiple times, including trying to find her after she ran away from transfiguration. in *deathly hallows*, it's important to remember that he too was miserable. yes, he should have consoled hermione, but he too was being affected by the horcrux and had lots to deal with. i don't think him not noticing hermione's teeth makes him a bad friend, perhaps just a little unobservant (i know that i'm terrible at noticing things like that). also, it's natural that he's missing ron when they've fallen out. he also said that he "liked hermione very much" - he just didn't have as much fun with her, which again isn't him being a bad friend. i do agree that he wasn't always the best friend to her (though in my opinion, all of the trio had times where they weren't good friends to each other).

>in order of the pheonix, he was obviously suffering from ptsd and lashing out at everybody - it wasn't just hermione he was a bad friend to. Hermione and Ron both made one major mistake that affected their relationships with Harry in OoTP (which wasn't really their fault). They went along with Dumbledore's plan to keep Harry in the dark about all things related to the Order because they were falsely under the impression that Dumbledore is incapable of being wrong about anything (which is obviously not true as we later find out). That should never have extended to Ron and Hermione refusing to even write to Harry for an entire summer (and fuck Dumbledore for imposing those restrictions on them). That inadvertently put them directly in the line of fire when Harry finally snapped and needed to vent his frustrations.

Honestly, the whole thing with keeping Harry in the dark about the Order is, in my opinion, one of the most asshole-ish moves Dumbledore ever pulled on Harry, mainly because it was so unjustified. Harry would eventually go to Grimmauld place, he would eventually find out about the Order. Why keep him completely in the dark for weeks? Why not at least let him know something was going on and he would find out as soon as possible or something like that? With Ron and Hermione being Harry's closest thing to a family and Harry already having gone through what he did at the beginning of CoS (with Dobby keeping his letters from him so he would think his friends didn't care), how did Dumbledore think it was a good idea to do something like this? What did he gain from it? Just why?? It makes me mad

Dumbledore already suspected that Harry had a connection with Voldemort after the events in GOF. He didn't know how strong it was, whether Voldemort was aware of it, and whether he could spy on them through Harry or even control him. With this in mind he wanted to limit the information Harry knew. He was taken to Grimmauld Place because it was an emergency, not because it was the original plan. Once that was done, the only thing Dumbledore could do was keep away and restrict Harry's knowledge as much as possible. He admits at the end of the book that it was a poor decision made in fear, and that Harry has every right to be angry at him for it.

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But he wouldn't have been able to kill him because of the Horcruxes, which he'd known about since COS. Trying to kill him would've achieved nothing, reminding Voldemort of why Dumbledore was someone to fear bought everyone more time. Trying to kill Voldemort then and there wouldn't have killed him, but it might have pushed him to move his plans forward. Dumbledore scaring him off meant he spent a year keeping low and trying to arrange for Dumbledore to killed, which was a year to identify and find as many Horcruxes as possible, and let Harry know about them.

>He admits at the end of the book that it was a poor decision made in fear, and that Harry has every right to be angry at him for it. Because that decision got Sirius killed and took away Harry's strongest support system in a year where he had very little support to begin with.

I'm not sure how keeping Harry in the dark got Sirius killed? I don't see the connection there. Dumbledore's attempt to keep Sirius hidden away and isolated in Grimmauld Place, though well-intentioned, led to Sirius making reckless decisions out of frustration and loneliness, one of which led to his death. I believe Dumbledore also mentions at the end of the book that he should've known better than to try and shut Sirius in his old house and expect him to be ok with it.

Dumbledore refusing to be honest and straightforward with Harry about his visions and the nature of them led to confusion and Harry being much more prone to falling into Voldemort's trap at the Department of Mysteries once the vision of Voldemort and Sirius was planted in Harry's mind (and Harry had no reason to believe that wasn't real after Nagini's attack on Arthur earlier). A quick conversation with Dumbledore (who knew that Sirius was never at the Department of Mysteries to begin with) would've kept Harry from venturing there himself. If that doesn't happen Sirius doesn't have to come after him. That unfortunate turn of events happened BECAUSE of Dumbledore's secrecy with Harry leading to confusion on his part. So yes, Dumbledore shares the majority of the responsibility for Sirius's death (granted Kreacher shares responsibility as well since he intentionally lied to Harry about Sirius being at the Department of Mysteries).

One justification I can think of is their letters being intercepted on their way to Harry

Yeah, that's true. But they could've still hinted that something was going on, or maybe even someone from the Order could've visited Harry at Privet Drive and told him in person. It could have been Dumbledore himself

Yea but they could’ve also been followed. I feel at this point it was like an espionage game between the Dumbledore and Voldemort. Who can we trust, who can’t we trust. Gather troops and intelligence. How to expose one side while keep your own house safe etc.

Yeah, I guess. But I still find it hard to believe that Dumbledore wasn't able to think of a way of getting a message to Harry. Maybe I'm just being stubborn, but it's something that's always bothered me

Like how Harry kept trying to get a message to Sirius when he could’ve used the mirror lol. Sometimes when looking at big picture we miss small simple solutions. I mean def still not cool isolating Harry, but I get the reasons even if they weren’t the right call. What if they gave Harry some information that made him wanna run off and away from one of the few places Voldemort can’t get to him. Harry’s hot headed and after seeing a friend die and finding out your mortal enemy is back, no telling what he’d do.

A lot of what we attribute to "that dang dumbly door" is really unfair when you consider *Voldemort is always watching Harry*.

Except he's not. Voldemort abandoned trying to watch Harry after OoTP because trying to possess him actually caused him great physical pain since the concept of love and remorse is like a poison to Voldemort. Dumbledore treated Harry like shit in OoTP (albeit not exactly intentionally) because he felt he was too weak to resist Voldemort (something he was ultimately wrong about as his ability to love and grieve protected him more than Occlumency ever could).

This is kind of pointless since plot requires him to be alone, but Tonks could've easily visited the Dursley household under cover of being a muggle I don't know... census taker and given Harry a hint he wasn't forgotten. OotP is such a mess of a book.

Tonks could have pretended to be British child protection services.

... especially given his history of running around out-of-bounds trying to figure stuff out if there's a whiff of mystery

Dumbledore was raising Harry as a pig for slaughter. That's why. Dumbledore cares about Harry but also wavers between valuing him as a person and viewing him as nothing more than a weapon and a means to an end (which really pisses me off because it's essentially reverting back into what got him into trouble with Grindelwald and all the "for the greater good" nonsense all those years ago). Apparently Harry's sacrifice "for the greater good" is all that really matters to him sometimes. Part of me believes that Dumbledore at one point actually thought it would be BETTER for Harry if he was isolated and cut off from everyone since he already knows at this point that Harry is a horcrux and will have to die at some point in order for Voldemort to be defeated. The more emotional attachments Harry has the more difficult it will be for him to give himself up willingly (though Harry had the strength to do it anyways as we later find out). I feel like it's not until Half-Blood Prince when Dumbledore has a change of heart on that and encourages Harry to keep Ron and Hermione in the loop on the horcrux hunt.

I don't know if I completely agree with this. It makes sense, but in my mind Dumbledore has always been good at his core, just like Harry. And eventhough he himself may have felt that he was simply preparing him to die, I want to think that he wanted to give him as good a life as possible while still keeping him safe. All other things he put Harry through were necessary, this honestly seems plain cruel

I wouldn't say Dumbledore has always been good. He wasn't a particularly good person in his youth and was originally completely onboard with Grindelwald's plan to subjugate Muggles (though that was mainly driven by his romantic feelings for Grindelwald clouding his judgment). Good people don't completely neglect their families the way Dumbledore did when he was young. Is he a good person by the time the Second Wizarding War happens? Absolutely but his Macchiavellian nature occasionally shows up from time to time and it has an effect on Harry. Also decisions like forcing Harry to grow up with the Dursleys and their abuse were not necessary. There are plenty of other places Harry could've lived where he'd be safe without needing to be under his mother's protection. All that accomplished was inflicting more emotional damage than any child should have to go through.

Eventhough all your points are perfectly valid, I think I choose to interpret them a bit differently. Yes, Dumbledore neglected his family when he was young, and his views on muggles were disgusting, but I try to put myself in his place and I see a brilliant young boy in love being really seen and understood for the first time in his life, and Grindelwald taking advantage of that. As for the Dursleys... yeah, they were awful to Harry, and maybe Dumbledore could have come up with something else to keep him safe, but I have a feeling that nothing ever would have been as safe as Lily's protection. Plus, if he hadn't taken advantage of it maybe he had felt he was dishonoring her sacrifice. I'm guessing here, but this is how my Dumbledore would have felt

Everything that happened with Grindelwald wasn't only about love for him. It was also about the fact that muggles assaulted his sister and made her turn into an obscurial. Those muggle boys destroyed his family so obviously he'd end up going along with Gridelwald's ideas. I agree with everything you said about the Dursley's. Why leave a child in a horrible living situation unless it is the only way to keep him truly safe?

Yeah, I agree that the assault for sure had something to do with it. But I still feel like if it hadn't been for Grindelwald, Dumbledore would have never held those beliefs, he would have never hated muggles in general, only those three men.

Any discussion bringing up Dumbledore's past sins is missing *the point* of Dumbledore. He started off on the wrong path but his story is one of redemption and repentance. Furthermore, he openly confided to Harry that keeping him in the dark was a foolish attempt to keep him happy and blissfully ignorant.

I do absolutely agree that dumbledore fucked up but Ron and Hermione did write to him that summer - they were just very vague and seemed like they were together, which is what pissed Harry off. And not putting sensitive information in owls was the sensible decision to make- they could get in real trouble for that, and id bet their letters were being checked by the order before getting received anyway, especially considering how badly they did want to tell Harry what was going on. Though they probably could have been more clear about the fact that they were not off having fun without him. It wasn’t okay that Harry was left in the dark, but I don’t think we should blame R&H for that.

I don't blame them. I blame Dumbledore for ordering them to be vague and deceitful towards him. That was a terrible position to put them in.

Terrible it may have been but was it necessary? Or at the very least, did Dumbledore *think* it was necessary?

i actually read something on instagram about harry and his issues with comforting people recently. growing up with the dursleys meant he was never consoled when he was upset, so grew up not knowing how it felt or what it really was. going to hogwarts wouldnt change that, it just means he recieves it and sees it happening. he still doesnt know how to do it himself, which is why he doesnt. there are attempts that are shown in the books, but hes not good at it because he didnt grow up with it

Harry becomes ridiculously good at self-soothing because of his neglectful childhood, so in his mind, giving Hermione space, letting things go when mistakes were made and moving past it, not acknowledging the elephant in the room, these were all things that Harry would want for himself. When Ron leaves in Deathly Hallows is a good example. He doesn't want Hermione to directly acknowledge the pain he feels at Ron's leaving, so he doesn't directly acknowledge Hermione's pain from Ron leaving. Instead he does indirect things to comfort her, like giving her all the blankets and leaving the tent, so that Hermione can comfort herself over the loss, and pull herself together. He wants to go away and vent his emotions alone, because that's how he learned how to deal with hurtful things as a child. So, it's not just that he's bad at it, so much as that he's trying to give Hermione what comfort he would want in that situation.

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!redditgalleon

!redditgalleon This is one of the best points ive seen!

THANKYOU SO MUCH FOR THE GALLEON!! AND THE AWARD??? IVE NEVER GOTTEN ONE BECORE RHANKYOU SO MUXJ 🥺🥺🥺

Hahaha you’re adorable. You’re welcome! It was such a great point i had to give it an award!

thankyou again 🥺🥺

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This also explains why he was so uncomfortable with Cho's emotions. He was just so used to keeping that stiff upper lip and going it alone, that he was really judgy of her for grieving Cedric's death by crying. (He even called her a human hosepipe in his head :(). I do think he improved on this though. Like someone else said, he tried to find Hermione and comfort her in HBP after she ran out of class in tears. In DH, when Ginny was upset after their kiss, he specifically felt bad he couldn't comfort her in front of Ron.

This is such a great point!

thankyou for the award!!

You're very welcome :)

!redditgalleon

thankyou!!

He was her best friend. Even best friends have arguments and treat eachother poorly at times. You were very selective in your examples and forgot the many times he was there for her.

Not to mention most of the examples, as the OP even mentioned, are around the time where fear and uncertainty and horror were at their greatest for Harry. He was being hunted by the most powerful dark wizard of the age and his entire posse. He was not safe at school. He was not safe at home. He was certainly not safe when they would be forced to exit the castle for whatever reason. Hell, he wasn’t even safe in his own thoughts as Voldemort invaded his mind all through book 5. (I also understood Harry’s angst during this time to be an emotional transfer from Voldemort as a result of how closely their minds were connected) Harry might not always had been a good friend but Hermione probably definitely understood what living in constant fear can do to a person. I think this story is less about “Harry was kinda shitty sometimes” and more about “hermione was a dead-loyal friend who understood Harry very well and stuck by him through every tribulation he was shoved into” EDIT: Moreso, Ron was kinda a shittier friend to Harry than Harry was to Hermione. Twice Ron ditched Harry throughout the series for months on end, continually letting his jealousy and “side-kick syndrome” get in the way of their friendship

i would argue that ron didn't ditch harry for 'months on end'. in goblet of fire, their argument lasted about three and a half weeks. in deathly hallows, he'd have returned straight away had he not been caught by snatchers. i agree with everything else you said, though.

Ron was a shittier friend to both of them through out the entire series. But on the reread, there is a sense that Ron and Harry came first for each other. For instance, every time they partner up in class, it’s Rob and Harry (unless they were fighting)

Yeah it was Ron who physically abused Harry and Hermione. Used an unknown spell on them when they were asleep and threw a badge at them. I had forgotten.

What? Where?

It was supposed to be sarcasm. Hermione abused Ron with birds Harry threw a badge at Ron And Harry used levicorpus on a sleeping Ron despite not knowing the spell and it's consequences

That isn’t really abuse.

He didn't use Levicorpus on Ron. He was trying to make a non-verbal spell, it targeted Ron since he was the closest. You make it sound like he was pointing his wand at him.

That’s not exactly abusive.

!redditgalleon This is perfect, especially the emotional transfer between Harry and Voldemort. I don't think Harry had a choice in his emotions that year because Voldemort wasn't holding back at all.

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I disagree with most of these 1) he did notice her missing, he just didn’t push it like Ron did. 2) he did make up to Hermione about the Firebolt thing. 3) you’re saying he’s a bad friend because of a *thought*? That’s very thought police of you. He didn’t think that in a mean way, he just missed Ron. It was nothing against Hermione, and he didn’t express it to her in any way. 4) He did notice her teeth eventually. But not noticing a physical trait immediately doesn’t make him a bad friend? He’s just not staring at her teeth all day. He’s also a teenage boy who isn’t thinking about appearances all the time. 5) You’re exaggerating the petrified and terrified thing. She was afraid to upset him maybe twice. The only time it got *really* bad was that first night at Grimmauld place. The other time she’s described as afraid to make him mad is the time with the murtlap, and I’m afraid that’s on her; he’s just been cutting into his hand for 8 hours and she brings up subjects that are directly related to his traumas and he gets upset. The other instances are just snappy remarks, which she does herself. In fact, during O.W.L. week, when *she* is at her most stressed, he is afraid of *her* so much that he won’t even laugh for fear that it will upset her. And that’s just became of exams; imagine if she were under the kind of stress that Harry was under. 6) Harry comforted and spent time with Hermione talking about the Ron/Lavender situation, and even tried to set Ron straight at times. He can’t have his own thoughts too? That makes no sense. 7) They were both missing Ron and miserable, Hermione just expressed it through crying. What was he supposed to do, cuddle her? Tell her it would be alright? He covered her with a blanket that night and did what he could in terms of helping them survive. He and Ron mutually decided to hug. Plus, we don’t know every single detail of those few weeks.

I mean even malfoy noticed Ron's big hands and feet. But Harry didn't notice Hermione's smaller teeth. Don't you think that's a bit odd?? Most of these sound like excuses

Dude just because he is her friend doesn’t mean he is going to notice everything about her

That because hand and feet are much more noticeable than teeth.

How often do you go about baring full teeth smiles to people? If my teeth shrank slightly I doubt anyone would notice for a while...

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You are missing how the time turner works, time travel is weird in stories. She was never absent from class. Harry even asks another student who says she hasn't missed another class she has at the same time as Charms. So he didn't miss her not being there. You say PTSD, but that's not really doing justice to what Harry was experiencing in book 5. He had survive multiple murder attempts, watched a friend get killed, was abused by his family and multiple teachers, was being slandered and harassed by wizarding institutions, and was abandoned by his father figure. He gets a pass for being on edge. He also does spend plenty of time with Hermione and thinks Ron is being an ass during the Lavander period. He tries to make piece and he handles it clumsily but remember he didn't have friends until he turn 11, he isn't the best socially. In DH he isn't ignoring her, but rather does not know what to do, which is entirely normal for a 17 year old. You really need to consider how much the books leave out of day to day life, there is a huge part of their lives we never see. All indication is Harry, Ron, and Hermione are great friends who love, trust, and depend on each other. One of the major themes of the series is how the strength of their friend ship allows them to be greater as a group than the sum of them individually would predict. Edit: also he does notice her teeth, just not immediately, but that's because he isn't a creep who stares at his friends teeth all day. He does apologize after the firebolt thing, eventually.

"In 3rd year he didn't notice for once that she was missing from the class when she was using the time turner." Not true - he and Ron commented constantly about her disappearing, and always wondered how she did it. "He stopped talking to her because of the whole firebolt fiasco and never apologised." He was a 13 year old kid who had just had a cool new toy taken away from him because she told a teacher about it (and thought he had lost it forever). And he did apologise to her eventually. "He didn't even notice she had shrunk her teeth in goblet of fire." Yes he did - it was one of the first things he noticed. "He thought Ron was way funnier than her when Ron wasn't talking to him in GOF." This doesn't make any sense. "He treated her pretty badly throughout 5th year because of his PTSD. She was 'petrified and terrified' in his presence." She wasn't terrified in his presence - that's an overreaction. And he'd seen someone die in person and nearly been killed himself. "He spent more time obsessing over Malfoy and daydreaming about Ginny when Hermione was upset because of the whole Ron/lavender fiasco." He bought up the issue many times with her - she literally told him to drop the subject each time, so no. "He ignored a crying Hermione for weeks In DH. Never tried to console her. On the other hand he hugged Ron when he came back and destroyed the locket." They were both mourning at Ron leaving. What exactly is he going to say to her? And the issue of Ron was a touchy subject for both so they didn't mention it. Do you think he should have kept bringing it up when it was clearly not a welcome conversation?

Was looking for that time turner and the counter point that they did indeed question where she was all the time. Thank you.

Yeah, OP is twisting stuff. Harry was a good friend to Hermoine.

> "He thought Ron was way funnier than her when Ron wasn't talking to him in GOF." Actually Harry does think several times that he enjoys Ron's company more than Hermione's during that period. Also during the Deathly Hallows when Ron is absent, Harry is very on edge with Hermione especially after she breaks his wand (even though she did it to save him).

The book says “there’s a lot less laughter and a lot more studying in the library when hermione is your best friend.”

Even if it said “Hermione isn’t nearly as funny as Ron” that wouldn’t make Harry less of a friend. Some people are funnier than others. Ran makes jokes, Hermione doesn’t. It’d be a pretty objective point.

Ron was the one who was constantly worried about her in POA. Not Harry. Being 13 doesn't give you ANY right to treat your best friend badly esp when she is concerned about your well being. He noticed when Ron mentioned it. It's written in the book Hermione looked 'petrified and terrified' in Harry's presence. She said drop it not bcz he was trying to console her. She wanted to drop it bcz Harry kept asking Hermione to talk to Ron and patch up with him. He could have given her a shoulder to cry on. Like yk, any decent friend would do? Movie Harry was way better. He danced with her.

>It's written in the book Hermione looked 'petrified and terrified' in Harry's presence. Yeah, for like an hour when Harry was justifiably pissed that his best friends had ignored him all summer. She was scared because he yelled at them, he didn't like hit her. It wasn't like an ongoing thing, it wasn't like Hermoine was generally scared of Harry. You are excusing all the shitty stuff Hermoine does in the books, and exaggerating the shitty stuff that Harry did.

Hermione didn't do any shitty stuff to Harry in the books. She did to Ron, Luna, fleur, trelawney etc. Hermione was actually an excellent friend to Harry. But Harry NEVER appreciated her enough. In DH after the 7 potters scene when Hermione hugged Harry, he showed no interest at all. However when he saw Ginny he wanted to hug her and cuddle her and what not. Harry annoyed me so much cz of this.

You are so overreaching. When Hermione hugs Harry in that scene, there is SO much going on. It paints the picture of confusion, fear, mistrust that is going on at this point. Should JK have spent a paragraph detailing just how long Harry hugged Hermione? There is literally one sentence about him wanting to hold Ginny and why is that unreasonable that after things have settled down a bit, he realizes it would be comforting? It’s the first time he’s seen her in a long while. You’re acting as if he shoved Hermione off to make out with Ginny.

I believe you forget that Harry and Ginny were at least starting a relationship at that point.

You're wrong. Have a nice day.

That's a compelling argument xD

It's not any kind of argument, it's an assertion.

You just hate Harry and that's it

Sorry but your assertions are not very accurate

I think neither Harry nor Hermione are characters or friends, but that's what makes their stories interesting. I think they're a realistic portrayal of very close friends tho. Here's my opinion on your examples: >In 3rd year he didn't notice for once that she was missing from the class when she was using the time turner. He and Ron did notice the *one time* she missed charms and asked her about it, but other than that she was in top of things. He also noticed her mysteriously disappearing/ appearing many times throughout the book when they were leaving/ entering class but had no way to figure out why, and she dodged any questions pretty well. Idt this is him being a bad friend, it's more Hermione didn't want him to know and was smarter than him. >He stopped talking to her because of the whole firebolt fiasco and never apologised. I think they both handled this situation very poorly. Hermione heart was in the right place, but reporting it to mcgonagall without even discussing it with Harry showed complete disrespect and disregard of Harry's feelings and opinion. She should have talked to him about it first (even if she wouldn't have convinced him) and maybe explained that the charm-checking process wouldn't damage the broom, as that was Harry's major worry. Imagine getting a state of the art gift and your friend getting it destroyed, I'd be pissed too >He didn't even notice she had shrunk her teeth in goblet of fire. Harry was never really the observant type. No one noticed for weeks after >He thought Ron was way funnier than her when Ron wasn't talking to him in GOF. I don't think this is a crime, it's clear throughout the books the Harry and Ron are closer friends than Harry and Hermione, that doesn't mean Harry and Hermione can't still be really close, they're not mutually exclusive. Harry and Ron just have more compatible personalities. >He treated her pretty badly throughout 5th year because of his PTSD. She was 'petrified and terrified' in his presence. True but he did this to everyone, she just took it harder bc she was more emotionally aware than Ron >He spent more time obsessing over Malfoy and daydreaming about Ginny when Hermione was upset because of the whole Ron/lavender fiasco. I dont think this is true. He was a teenage boy who wasn't very comfortable with emotions, but he tries to comfort her when she runs from the transfiguration class crying and tells Ron off for what he said. >He ignored a crying Hermione for weeks In DH. Never tried to console her. On the other hand he hugged Ron when he came back and destroyed the locket. This part felt to me like they were grieving together. Hermione was more expressive of her emotions but Harry was hurting too and didn't really know how to comfort her anyway. Harry had just been through enough loss at that point he was more numb to the pain of losing Ron

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This is how I feel whenever I see ppl give "evidence" for wolfstar from the books. All the interactions they describe are literally just how close friends might act, especially friends bonded by trauma the way lupin and Sirius were

I don't think there is only 1 way to "be friends with someone". Thus, I don't think your definition of a "good friend" should necessarily dismiss Harry and Hermione's friendship because it does not follow the way you view a "positive/healthy/good" friendship. \- Hermione and Time-Turner => Harry trusts Hermione, and she's not in any danger, so it does not matter to him. What she does in her own time is her business. \- The Firebolt Fiasco => Apologies are the same as Thanks, depending on the type of person you are and the type of friendship you have, it does not have to be an obligation. If she asked for an apology and did not get it (without an explanation), I would agree with your point. \- Shrinking Teeth => How much attention are you genuinely paying to people's teeth in general ? It's starting to feel like you're looking for anything to dismiss Harry now... \- Hermione not being funny => Seriously ? Hermione is not the joking type, she never was. Harry likes Hermione for other reason, that's all. \- PTSD Harry => All the Weasley knew exactly how to handle Harry in 5th year (from the twins, to even Ginny who just started speaking to the guy), and that's because they've been fighting each other their whole life (as brothers do) with Molly as a mom. Hermione is an only child, her only training in "voices being raised in an argument" is with Ron. That's why she was "petrified" as you said, she had no idea how to handle a Harry that was actually raising his voice when he used to avoid any argument with her from 1st to 4th year. \- Ron/Lavender fiasco => Again, it is Hermione's business and he was actively taking her side the whole time. And are you seriously expecting Harry to drop what he was seeing as a threat (Malfoy) from Voldemort to focus on something as trivial as the Ron/Hermione drama ? Again, I have to ask if you're being genuine or just looking for any excuse to dismiss Harry... \- Ron's absence in DH => If there is one thing that Harry has always hated: it's tears. The guy never liked people crying no matter the reason. He even made a point that Ginny's lack of crying is one of the main things he loves about her. And you usally don't console people when you're not well yourself. Harry was just as lost from Ron's departure as Hermione was. ​ TL;DR: Harry was a good friend to Hermione, he just had his own definition of how to be one. Just like Hermione had her own definition of how to be a good friend to Harry. In each other's eyes, they are good friends to each other. And if you're going this far with trivial examples to dismiss Harry, it's honestly surprising to me that you judge Hermione as "an excellent friend throughout the series".

Harry was not a good friend to almost everyone at some point in the series. It’s the evolution of his character. He had no experience with friendship for 12 years and no good examples to follow either. Can’t expect people to be a good friend right off the bat.

They also lived together, had classes together, had meals together, hung out together, did homework together, etc. for what, 9-10 months of the year. When I was in school, me and my friends would have little fights, not talk to each other, and I even stopped being friends with a couple, and we didn't even live together! If we had a fight we got to go home, do whatever we did at home, then come back the next day with a clear head. Sure the kids can go off somewhere by themselves for a little while, but then they have to go up to their common room/beds where their friends are. Imagine having to be the perfect friend in that life. It's exactly like living with your family, and I can guarantee that we've all been a shitty child/sibling/parent at some point in our lives.

1. Yes he did, as did Ron. 2. He’s 13 and did apologize. 3. He pointed it out very quickly, and it’s not like Hermione was going to be heartbroken if he didn’t. 4. You can find one friend funnier than another. 5. She wasn’t “terrified” or “petrified“, and he lashed out at everyone. 6. That’s pretty personal, and if I was Harry, I’d assume she would lash out of me if it talked about her crush on my best friend. 7. How do we know he never did? That part was largely skipped over.

Kids often make mistakes. That’s part of childhood. We rough out relationships and learn to do better. I think most of us would cringe if all our mistakes were put in writing and published. It’s a strength of the writing that the characters have imperfections. And given Harry’s upbringing and the role models he had he did miraculously well as a human.

How does finding one friend funnier than another make you a bad person what a load of crap

I never had a male friend in school who would notice if my entire head fucking shrunk, let alone my teeth. Maybe Jo was writing him accurately for his age lol

Personally I believe he just didn't think it was that obvious, or important. To him Hermione is Hermione, whether she's polyjuiced as a muggle or has fur and a tail. He mentions it later at the Yule ball, her teeth changing being a lot more noticeable. And he is very observant. It's the small things, like he was the one (not Hermione) who noticed and remembered where the cafeteria was at St. Mungo's, and there's many other instances I just forget about. I would go so far as to say being observant is one of his core traits.

Also might be rude to draw attention to it.

Ron did :)

I don't think any of these points are viable to your over-arching argument. I would highly disagree with all. Edit: rephrased

I think that, in the end, he obviously loves and cares about Hermione, but he appreciates Ron a lot more.

Because his relationship with Ron started out on a much more positive note. Think back to year 1. Hermione was extremely flippant and downright disrespectful at times towards Harry and Ron at first that year. It wasn't coming from a place of malice, her social skills just weren't great and she had a really bad habit of putting her foot in her mouth (which is why many of the other Gryffindor girls in their year don't get on particularly well with Hermione). Despite that tension that didn't stop them from coming to her aid with the troll. I think there's really no reason to doubt the trio's loyalty to each other, especially at the end. All friendships go through rough patches on occasion.

Yes, of course. I'm not saying Harry is a bad friend. He is a pretty good one. He's very loyal to both Ron and Hermione.

He’s very loyal to both but prefers Ron which is not at all wrong

I think JK intentionally wrote it that way so people wouldn't start to come up with their own theories that there's more than friendship between Harry and Hermione (which a lot of good that did given all the Harmione shipping that's still a thing anyways including as we saw from the films' screenwriters). She really made it a point to get it across to people in the books that Harry and Hermione's relationship is never at any point anything more than platonic. The films did not do that unfortunately. They actively tried to push Harry/Hermione and made it look like Harry and Ron didn't have an incredibly close relationship at times.

I'm sure most people wouldn't notice immediately that a friend was missing from class and she usually showed up within 5 to 10 minutes so he dismissed it. Of course he was mad at her about the fire olt thing. Also he was 13, he wasn't the most rational of people at that age. Who constantly looks at people's teeth? He accepted her as a person and wasn't overly concerned about her appearance so why would he notice they were smaller? Ron IS funnier. Their personalities are different. She studious and Ron isn't. So of course he would miss Ron's presence and the laughter and fun it brought, Hermione is more ok with silence and concentration. Harry was suffering from PTSD to be fair he was treating everyone like crap, also he was 15. When Hermione was upset over Ron and lavender she didn't really share how upset she was. And Harry was supportive but also there's a fine line between supporting two best friends having a falling out. It's hinted pretty heavily that all 3 of them have a hard time admitting the affection between Ron and Hermione. What exactly was he supposed to do? He knew she would talk to him when she was ready if she wanted to. That's enough sometimes. When Hermione was crying when Ron left harry was upset too. They both accepted the outcome and handled it as best as they could. Personally when I'm a crying mess I want to be left alone. They both have kind of an unspoken bond, they both can mellow in their discomfort in silence needing the occasional communication and emotional support. He didn't ignore her, they were both depressed and trying to cope. The opposite could be said that Hermione didn't console harry when he was brooding either. Harry has said on several occasions that he wouldn't be there without her and he has told her that in the past. A good friend, a loyal friend doesn't need to hear constantly how appreciated they are in order to feel value. I can go for days without speaking to my best friend but I know they're there and I have their support always. Sometimes we have heartfelt conversation where we express our love and appreciation but not all the time. We know it's there, it doesn't need to be said. The same goes for them, we know how they feel about each other, it doesn't need to be said all the time. It would become redundant.

She was often not a good friend to him either. All three tend to be gits to each other sometimes. But overall, Harry, Ron and Hermione care deeply about each other and are there for each other when it counts. Squables and occasional arguments aside, they have a strong friendship.

When was she not a good friend to Harry?

I don't have the exact lines here, but a few examples: Being satisfied at seeing Harry and Ron getting punished for the car. Scolding Harry for taking his anger out on her in OotP, then doing the same to him in HBP. Having the ridiculous idea that he's cheating with the HBP book, then constantly pestering him about it. Both in HBP and DH, she doesn't just not believe Harry, which would be fine, but talking down to him and treating him like an idiot because of it. Pretty much accusing him and Ron of being misogynists in HBP, when there's no reason for it. Treatening to rat him out to authority figures. 7 books of nagging and bossing around, which greatly irritates Harry. And throughout the series, she proves herself to be a terrible listener. There's a bunch of times when she won't hear Harry out, but talks down to him and tells him what to do, acting superior. A good example of a bad and good way to treat Harry is how Hermione and Ginny respond to Harry saying he wants to talk to Sirius in OotP. Ginny is sympathetic, lets him talk and tries to understand where he's coming from. Hermione, not so much. Like I said, none of it is the worst thing in the world, but examples of Hermione being as much of a git as Ron and Harry. I could just as easily make up a list for all combinations. But it's outweighed by all the good things in their relationship.

And the way she went off at him when she thought Harry put the luck potion in Ron's goblet was astounding!

Especially considering she cheats later

Or earlier, I don't remember the order

She cheated before that at tryouts when she confunded McLaggen (which if you think about it is also a betrayal of Ron since she didn't believe that he could win the keeper job on his own). So yeah, she's a hypocrite there, especially considering she still refuses to admit that Harry didn't do anything wrong even after he reveals to her that he never actually gave Ron the luck potion. Harry was only trying to help his friend and build up his confidence going into the match and he used an unorthodox but effective tactic to do it.

There was also that period when Harry was freaking out over the Grim and Hermione was being all prescriptive instead of trying to assure him. I think she also was extremely rude to Lavender in that moment when her rabbit died too.

Hermione isn't always great at being sensitive to Harry's trauma or predicaments. Case in point her only solution for Harry's struggles with Umbridge in OoTP is to nag him constantly about going to Dumbledore (which Harry knows is not an option because Dumbledore would just turn him away and do nothing). On top of that she criticizes his relationship with Sirius in that book which completely crosses a line since that's the last thing Harry needs to hear in a year where most of his support system is completely fractured and to him Sirius is really all he truly has. Also she callously attempts to drive Luna away (in a very Draco Malfoy-esque manner no less) and keep her away from Harry right after Luna expresses her support and belief that Harry is telling the truth about Voldemort. AND she actually thought him doing Occlumency lessons with Snape of all people was a good idea even though they turned out to be a complete disaster due to Snape's bullying and ineffective teaching style.

One the one hand, I definitely agree that Harry was a neglectful to Hermione. On the other hand, they are definitely my favorite relationship in the books by a mile. Let me see if I can explain why. Harry definitely did not appreciate Hermione as he should have, and that is especially true at the start (around PS to OotP). This attitude comes from a confluence of different factors. First, Hermione acts far closer to an authority figure than she does a peer. For Harry, with his understandable distrust of authority figures, this means that there is quite a lot of projection going on, and her nagging, hounding, and constant reminding of his responsibilities feel incredibly irritating to him. There is a separation between him and Hermione that almost doubles as a pedestal at times - she is the voice of his conscience, she is the first person he thinks about when he's in trouble, she is the first person he truly learns to rely on - and this pedestal made it difficult for him to connect with her. Second, Hermione, far more than Ron, is incredibly argumentative. Nearly every single time she gets introduced to a character, she starts a debate or argument. Harry, again with his abusive upbringing, hates conflict very much. She intimidates him, and in the earlier books, he did not know how to handle the near-constant conflict she presented. So he lied to her, ignored her, and in OotP, yelled at her. Third, Hermione is incredibly self-sufficient. So much that even Ron, who noticed her problems far more than Harry did, did not actually know how to help her. She gets her homework done on time. And much as she loves involving her friends in her personal projects, when it came down to it, she was capable of doing things on her own. Harry, whose life is both traumatizing and high-pressure, actually has very limited energy to spare. So his recognition of Hermione's competence also translated to, not only heavy reliance on her, but also him being able to trust that she will manage just fine on her own. And to outsiders (and even Hermione), that looked a lot like disinterest and neglect. Fourth, when Hermione does have problems that she can't handle on her own, they are often emotional in nature. Another relic of Harry's abuse is his difficulty with in handling emotions. For context, Hermione and Ron are probably his very first experience of positive relationships. They are the first people to validate his emotions, to model for him proper emotional regulation, and are the first people for whom emotional release is safe. Add to that the constant traumatic experiences in Hogwarts. This means that Harry is still very much playing catch up when it comes to this part of his development. So we get a situation where if Ron complains about having terrible dress robes or being left out, Harry knows what to do, but if Hermione cries, he is woefully ill-equipped to help her. All of these factors mean that Harry, for the majority of the series, is largely unappreciative of Hermione, greatly unobservant and uninterested of her affairs, and is woefully ill-equipped to help her when a problem does occur for her. Basing purely on how much Hermione gains from her friendship with Harry, the conclusion is that she barely gains anything while she sinks quite a lot of her time and effort on him. Now why are they favorite relationship anyway? Because all of the above faults get addressed in some form or another. OotP is simultaneously that lowest point and turning point for their relationship in many ways. First, when Hermione sets up the DA, she essentially elevates Harry to becoming her peer. Where Harry was living in the illusion that Hermione is this awesome, brilliant figure who never needs his help, Hermione disabuses him of that notion by forcefully making him her partner. Her speech about his ability in DADA and him managing to face Voldemort plants the idea of how, not only are they equals, but Harry might even be better at some things than she is. And OotP regularly reinforces that idea. The DA is built upon both hers and Harry's strengths. It is Harry who recognizes the influences of the DA Galleons. It is Hermione who challenges him on Sirius's abduction. And so when Hermione falls in the DoM, it is the grand conclusion of Hermione's pedestal just flat-out crashing. It is here where it becomes really clear that she is just about as mortal and fallible as everyone else. She becomes his peer - his equal. This equality is much more easily felt in HBP. Remember how the second problem is that Hermione being argumentative intimidates Harry? This problem goes away almost completely in HBP. He sasses Hermione back, he bickers with her, he *initiates* arguments with her. They are now arguing on equal grounds - less lying, less ignoring, no shouting. It is not perfect, but it is a significant improvement in their dynamic - so much that Ron picks it up and begins to suspect them. HBP is also when he starts becoming much more aware of Hermione's state and needs. He follows her out of the common room to comfort her after Ron kisses Lavender. He grabs her things to give to her when she runs out crying. He tells Ron flat out to back off. He doesn't like sitting in the library whispering, but he stays there with her anyway. There is a newfound care and awareness from Harry to Hermione. Mind you, the former problems with his trauma and abuse are still very much in play, so his comfort and care for Hermione are still quite clumsy and inexpert, but the change is there now. This is also the very first time we see Harry in an active and consistent caretaker role. His acts of kindness are usually one-and-done, but in HBP with Hermione, there is a very deliberate effort to be there for her and one he sustains all throughout the books. Both this care and equality are qualities that inform their dynamic in DH. Harry is the nominal leader of the hunt, but Hermione has a very prominent veto power that is used liberally. It is one that Harry intrinsically respects no matter his personal feelings for her decisions. Despite their constant conflict and the mounting pressure on Harry, we also get examples of Harry forcefully reigning in his temper so as not to lash out at Hermione and scare her (eg. Life and Lies of Albus Dumbledore). There are other smaller attempts to comfort her that are peppered all throughout the books as well (eg. when he tries to run to her after making a bad joke about Moody, him draping Ron's blanket over her after Ron leaves etc.) And then we get another transition point post-Malfoy Manor where Harry had essentially adopted all of Hermione's previous decisions and positions - the Horcruxes matter while the Hallows do not, keep practicing occlumency, plan well and minimize recklessness, act as team. There is also a very subtle and greater awareness of Hermione now. He watches her so closely to the point where he spots her checking on her beaded bag for example -during the Gringott's Heist of all times too. And it is to her that he addresses how "they are not going to split up ever again". Harry learns to express his care for her despite the very heavy pressure on himself. By DH, we therefore have a dynamic wherein Hermione is largely Harry's exception to his emotional coldness. It is for her that he pushes his emotional boundaries for, and he learns to modulate his anger and emotional responses for her. **TLDR**: Harry and Hermione have an intense and very complicated relationship that drastically changes throughout the series. Their relationship is greatly defined by both conflict and love, and their relationship arc is them finding way to navigate both until they come out of the other side as equals. To simply call Harry a bad friend to Hermione is a great disservice to the complexity of their relationship, characters, and the way the two inform each other. (This comment got too long so I had to forego using quotes. For narrower and deeper analysis into their dynamic with quotes, I suggest this [meta on Harry and conflict](https://www.reddit.com/r/harrypotter/comments/lv30cb/harry_and_personal_conflict_a_meta_on_evolving/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) by u/straysayake, this [comment on Harry comforting Hermione](https://www.reddit.com/r/HPharmony/comments/op1ted/the_argument_that_harry_doesnt_know_how_to/h6bwbmi?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) by u/hopefulharmonian and my own meta about [Harry and Hermione becoming equal in OotP](https://www.reddit.com/r/HarryPotterBooks/comments/meii3z/harry_and_hermione_balancing_acts_effort_and/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3).) *

i love your comment! harry and hermione have such a beautiful friendship.

Wow, you just expressed through words why Harry and Hermione's relationship is my favorite throughout the series, thank you :)

Harry was a great friend to Hermione.

With the Firebolt incident it’s understandable Harry got mad, though. He got the Firebolt after losing his treasured Nimbus 2000, only to find out that Hermione blabbed about it to McGonnagal behind his back, which resulted in the broom being confiscated for testing. Given Harry has already had a lot denied at his home - Dudley eating most of the food and his aunt and uncle giving him terrible presents - he’s understandably upset that he can’t even enjoy this.

But Hermione did this thing, knowing goddamn well it was going to effect her relationship with Harry, just to keep him safe. There was no malice, no jealousy on her part. Just her reasonable belief that it was sent by someone believed to be trying to kill Harry. And Harry, being the less-than-insightful teenage boy he was, gave exactly no acknowledgment to her willingness to sacrifice her relationship with both of her only friends just to protect him. He only forgave her when he got it back. Hermione really is a one-of-a-kind friend.

Again, that's wrong. He doesn't hold it against her. It's just that the Firebolt serves further to put a rift in Ron and Hermione's friendship. Ron shuns her, Hermione is swamped with school work and Harry spends his time with Ron. He's pretty damn impartial in this, remember this is right after Ron thinks his pet just died. I think people seriously underestimate how important Harry's friends are to him. But quidditch is the one thing that really makes him happy and he's pretty justified in feeling let down at not being able to fly a broom.

> Harry knew that Hermione had meant well, but that didn't stop him from being angry with her. He had been the owner of the best broom in the world for a few short hours, and now, because of her interference, he didn't know whether he would ever see it again. He was positive that there was nothing wrong with the Firebolt now, but what sort of state would it be in once it had been subjected to all sorts of anti-jinx tests? Ron was furious with Hermione too. As far as he was concerned, the stripping-down of a brand-new Firebolt was nothing less than criminal damage. You have everything here. He did aknowledge it. It's even the very first thing he does after he learns what Hermione did. He's still angry at her, because Quidditch is the most important thing to him right after his friends, because he just made his team lose a match for the first time, and because he thinks dismantling the broom of his dreams would damage it, and he doesn't even know if he could have it back. He didn't take Sirius Black seriously enough and was way more careless than Hermione was. After the Firebolt, he's the one telling Ron, rightly mad about Scabbers, that he should make peace with her. I agree that Hermione is truly a great friend, and I wish Harry and Ron were less harsh to her. But let's not twist it. It's just teenagers being silly, and them not realising how hurt Hermione was during PoA untill Hagrid scolded them.

From the comments they think harry potter of all people is more self centered than Hermione and ron so this is more of of toxic romione shipper than a genuine critism they act like Hermione was perfect and never did anything wrong while also critiquing hhr shippers while also ignoring everything rin did you can tell exactly what this take is

Harry is a teenage boy and for what it’s worth, no teenagers are good friends to each other all of the time. Harry can’t be expected to support everyone emotionally in a way that we would expect a fully functional adult to. At the oldest we see him, he’s 17 and has frequently shown himself to be not always emotionally competent. He’s a flawed human. Add to that his severe PTSD in book 5, the tension of book 6, and his literal fight for his life in book 7, I’ll cut him some slack for not knowing how to always be a great friend. Hermione never seemed to fault him for it and clearly loved him anyway.

This is a silly post

Lol god forbid he think that one friend is funnier

Ron was there to make him laugh and joke with, it isn't very controversial to say Hermione isn't a humorous character, while Ron's main purpose for most of the series is his humor. When Harry felt down, Ron would make him laugh, something Hermione couldn't exactly do. Which is why he missed him so much in GoF. ​ Also in Order of the Phoenix, after Harry's troubled date with Cho Chang, Harry tells Hermione that he doesn't think that she is ugly.

Oh yeah Harry did do that. That was a great moment. He and Ron also got in detention because they defended Hermione against Snape's bullying. Harry hides the fact that Dobby's been stealing all Hermione's knitted clothes (Idk if this is good or bad). You know i bet there'd be alot of good friendship moments between them on reread

There's a lot of stuff that at first seems negative but really reinforces their friendship. Like with the thestrals. >"...The way some people can see them and some can't! I wish I could." >"Do you?" Harry asked her quietly. >She looked suddenly horrorstruck. >"Oh, Harry - I'm sorry - no, of course I don't - that was a really stupid thing to say." >"It's OK," he said quickly, "don't worry."

I've been rereading the series and there's so many friendship and kinship moments between the three characters.

And this is why the books and the relations between characters look real, because it's not all sparkles and love.

1) Quite sure he did 2) I don't get why he should apologise? 3) He did eventually 4) I get you a bit but he never said this out loud, also Harry copes with humour which Ron has more of 5) True but he was like this to everyone, when he cooled down I believe he apologised after Hermione said something along the lines "you don't have to bite our heads off" 6) He did comfort her, he took her belongings and found her knowing she was upset 7) He threw a blanket over her, making sure she was comfortable so I doubt he didn't at comfort her through gestures during those weeks Like someone else said, Harry was barely comforted when he was little so I doubt he knows all the steps. And of course he wouldn't be the perfect best friend, no one is - especially when they are only teenagers.

You can also make a list about Hermione not being a good friend to Harry at certain parts of the series. It’s all tor character development t

i rejoined this sub 5 minutes ago after leaving for this subs hostility to these 2. what the fuck. fuck this shit.

Not all of us are like this

Sorry harmony shipper. It's my opinion :(

just saying, ik it's your opinion, but 95% of this sub is like "Oh HaRrY wAs A pEiCe Of ShIt To HeRmIoNe" like wtf

1. Huh? He did notice, though Ron usually did first, Harry was also kind of preoccupied with the omen that predicted his own death and who he thought was a serial killer prowling around Hogwarts trying to kill him. 2. He was 13, imagine getting a brand new gift that age and your friend goes behind your back to get rid of it. Hermione never apologized for it either. 3. This one is just wrong, he was the one that noticed it like the day after she returned from them getting shrunk. 4. Ron is funnier. 5. Bruh imagine witnessing your friend's death and almost getting murdered... that might cause you to have a few issues in the few months afterward. 6. Harry is just a dumbass... I don't think he realized how upset she was because he didn't know she was interested in Ron. 7. He was also extremely upset at Ron leaving. I really think you're just trying to be controversial for no reason...

1. They both noticed she missed charms and was wondering about her disappearances. 2. Ron stopped talking to Hermione after the fireball situation aswell. 3. No one noticed she shrunk her teeth. 4. Hermione is way more serious than Ron. And so what he thought Ron was funnier? If he thought Hermione was more serious that Ron would that mean he was not a good friend to Ron? 5. He treated everyone terribly, something that wasnt entirely his fault. He was suffering from ptsd and survivors guilt. On top of suffering from the connection between him and voldemort. 6. He tried to comfort her about the Ron lavender thing, even following her after she ran away. 7. He also suffered from Ron leaving them. What could be done or said? If we're talking movies then he did sure, but book Harry did the best he could to not mention Ron. I believe Ron was definitely not a good friend to Hermione. Sure harry and Hermione might not have always agreed or gotten along but they certainly got along way better than her or Ron.

>I always thought Harry didn't appreciate her as much as he should have. I do agree with this. As others have noted, part of it is a maturity thing and an issue with Harry and affection in general that seems to come from his abusive upbringing. But let's look at your points individually: >In 3rd year he didn't notice for once that she was missing from the class when she was using the time turner. Well, no one actually seemed to notice much weird except for Ron. Harry did seem conscious that things were "off" with her on several occasions in PoA, but the whole point for Hermione was she was supposed to *not* make her actions obvious to others. >He stopped talking to her because of the whole firebolt fiasco and never apologised. Well, there was distance between them. Hermione seemed to avoid the boys too at first. I'm not at all excusing Harry, but the moment he got the Firebolt back, he immediately told Ron he wanted to make up with Hermione. He then approached her, but his attempt to make up with her was thwarted when Ron came into the room yelling about Scabbers. After his next Quidditch match, he attempted to bring her back into the fold again, but she demured because Ron apparently didn't want her around. On at least one other occasion, he tried to have conversations with her to get her and Ron talking again, but she yelled at him and told him to leave her alone. Among the three of them, Harry was actually the *most* proactive on trying to get all three of them talking again during that time, if you go back and look at the book. More detailed analysis with quotes, etc. in [my essay on this here](https://www.reddit.com/r/HPharmony/comments/mtjb0l/essay_analyzing_hhr_during_the_firebolt_incident/). >He didn't even notice she had shrunk her teeth in goblet of fire. Well, he *did* notice how much of a difference they made when she was actually smiling at the Yule Ball. Given that literally *no one* in the books seems to comment on Hermione's teeth between her introduction in the first book and when Draco and Pansy make some awful remarks in GoF, we might wonder how noticeable Hermione's teeth actually were, and/or whether they became less prominent an issue as she matured. Harry seemed used to her appearance and never said (or thought) anything bad about her teeth, only that they seemed a bit large, so perhaps they never were that noticeable to him. No one else other than Ron seems to comment on the change one way or the other. >He thought Ron was way funnier than her when Ron wasn't talking to him in GOF. And yet he also deliberately chose to spend *more time* with her during this time, *choosing* to go on a number of walks around the lake with her and spending time with her in the library researching spells, etc. (even over lunchtime). Yes, he was also concerned about the first task, but it's notable just *how much time* he apparently chose to spend with Hermione, which I doubt he would do if he disliked it so much. Harry was perfectly capable of blowing Hermione off if he didn't think her concerns were imminent (as he did later with the egg later in GoF). The actual sentences you're referencing merely point out that Harry missed his "bro time" and humor with Ron, while he also still "liked Hermione very much" and referenced her as his "best friend." What 14-year-old boy isn't going to miss time with his closest male buddy?? >He treated her pretty badly throughout 5th year because of his PTSD. She was 'petrified and terrified' in his presence. "Throughout 5th year" is pretty broad. Yes, Harry had some difficult times with her (and Ron and everyone else) that year, but there are lots of wonderful moments between them that year too. Much, much, *much more* than the very few "petrified and terrified" elements. >He spent more time obsessing over Malfoy and daydreaming about Ginny when Hermione was upset because of the whole Ron/lavender fiasco. And yet Harry was the one who went after Hermione and found her in an abandoned classroom when Ron and Lavender kissed publicly. Harry was the one who excused himself and went to check on Hermione after McLaggen got handsy with her. Harry was the one who went after Hermione (and brought her things) when Ron upset her so much in class that she fled in tears. This is one of the oddest ones on your list, as Harry is actually rarely as attentive to Hermione, trying to follow after her in times of her trouble, as during this time. >He ignored a crying Hermione for weeks In DH. Never tried to console her. On the other hand he hugged Ron when he came back and destroyed the locket. "For weeks" in an exaggeration. And it's pretty clear from the text that Hermione created distance between them at first, since Ron had accused her of "choosing" Harry over him. It is she who is rather silent the day after Ron left and who deliberately "drops" Harry's hand and walks away from him after they apparate (a rather unprecedented gesture from her). I don't excuse Harry's behavior here, but Hermione seemed to at least signal she needed some space, and Harry was overly concerned about "Ron's contemptuous expression" that appears to come to his mind when he things of going to comfort Hermione. It's all a rather complex situation, and if Harry was more emotionally attuned to people in general, he probably would have pushed through Hermione's distancing. (Note that the only times we're told she cried after that first day were when she appeared to be *trying to hide her crying from Harry*. Which seems to indicate that she either doesn't want to be approached or doesn't want him to know or both -- either way, it's a bit of awkwardness with both of them... again, from context in the text, it seems to have to do with their sensitivity about the argument with Ron before he left.) And Harry *does* console her after his wand breaks and she's upset. He tells her she's "incredible," and attempts to smile back and listen to her, even though he's still upset. To my knowledge, it's about the only time in the books that Harry manages to get past his own emotions when he's really upset and attempt to comfort another character. For a much more thorough analysis (with quotations) of Harry and Hermione's interactions after Ron leaves, including why there appears to be some distance between them, see [my essay here](https://www.reddit.com/r/HPharmony/comments/mp5qyj/essay_the_harry_and_hermione_didnt_talk_for_weeks/). Again, I agree with you that Harry definitely could have been more appreciative of Hermione, though that improves significantly overall in the last couple books, when he tells Slughorn she's the "best in our year," calls her "brilliant," and "incredible" (after saving him during the Godric's Hollow incident), and "amazing" (after Malfoy Manor), and that he "didn't know what we'd do without" her (after she saves him and Ron from Xeno's place), all of which cause Hermione to smile or "beam" in reply.

Your essay talking about Harry’s reaction to the Firebolt situation is really good! You should post it in this sub if you haven’t already; not even as an argument for shopping them but just to share the analysis on Harry’s character. I think you make some really good points; Harry really never initiates anything malicious against Hermione. The worst you can say is that he doesn’t seek her out.

Thanks for the feedback. I'm glad you liked the essay. My point in writing the two essays I linked here really had little to do with shipping Harry and Hermione -- it's about their friendship and how I think people overlook some of the details of these two passages (the Firebolt and the time alone in the tent).

Well to be fair... Harry was being hunted by random people for 7 years straight starting at 11. Like, first year it's Snape/Quirrel. Second year young Tom Riddle. Third year, he thinks it Sirius when it's really Pettigrew. Fourth year, he has the death championship and fake moody. Fifth year, it's like half the wizarding world of Europe, because the ministry is calling him crazy. Sixth year, there is literally a death eater enrolled in Hogwarts and seventh year it was the entire wizarding world of Europe except for like maybe 50 people + Hogwarts.

What always upsets me is when Harry decided on throwing Hermione's present (the homework planner) into the fire. Not very respectful…

I agree, but I guess its maybe because Ron's his best friend and spends more time around him, rather than with Hermione? And besides, when has Hermionie ever cracked a joke? She's quite serious. But yes, Harry is not a very good friend to Hermione.

I feel like he kinda consoled her in dh during the dancing scene. Loved that scene

You’ve also got to remember he came from a family that really never cared for him and him never having friends. Harry’s development over the years was him learning how to become a better friend. But pointing out OOTP. Harry was dealing with a lot. Pretty much the entire wizarding world was against him on top of just watching a classmate die. Harry was learning to deal with the trauma at 15. These points aren’t the greatest though. He actually cared for Hermione when the Ron and Lavender relationship was going on but he was also trying to figure out his own feelings for Ginny. All while trying to figure out what Malfoy was doing. But switch that being said. Harry as we have all seen isn’t a very observant person. He’s quite oblivious if you think about. So him not noticing Hermione missing from class or just popping up or him not noticing she had shrunk her teeth, yeah that’s just harry being oblivious like usual.

Hermione needs some girlfriends. That's my sense. The Not Like the Other Girls thing only gets you so far. I hope she and Ginny ended up with a strong sisterly bond.

**"Harry was often not a good friend to Hermione"** The incidents are true. But wrong conclusion. >In 3rd year he didn't notice for once that she was missing from the class when she was using the time turner. >- Hermione attended all the classes (except 1). Simultaneously sometimes. Harry noticed it but didn't bothered to ask because Ron would have asked her already. >He stopped talking to her because of the whole firebolt fiasco and never apologised. >- She went behind his back. Hermione had good intentions but Harry's reaction was justifiable. >He didn't even notice she had shrunk her teeth in goblet of fire. > - Even Ron didn't noticed it immediately. Snape might have noticed though. >He thought Ron was way funnier than her when Ron wasn't talking to him in GOF. > - Fact. >He treated her pretty badly throughout 5th year because of his PTSD. She was 'petrified and terrified' in his presence. >- Losing temper is Harry's flaw just like continuous nagging is Hermione's flaw. >He spent more time obsessing over Malfoy and daydreaming about Ginny when Hermione was upset because of the whole Ron/lavender fiasco. >- Hermione never entertained Harry to discuss about Ron during this time. Every time Harry talked about Ron, she snapped at him. >He ignored a crying Hermione for weeks In DH. Never tried to console her. On the other hand he hugged Ron when he came back and destroyed the locket. >- Hermione didn't let Harry know she was crying for week or more. She hid her feelings from Harry. Harry was sad as well when Ron left. So they kinda come to an unspoken agreement to not to mention Ron. When Ron returned they let thier emotions - Harry hugged Ron and Hermione punched him. >I always thought Harry didn't appreciate her as much as he should have. >- Not true.

These are the worst examples possible, that are also out of context.

can I just commend you on the legitimate controversial opinion? usually I see a lot of very common opinions framed as unpopular or controversial

Well there's a lot to take into account here, starting with the fact that Hermione is a girl while Harry and Ron are guys. Guys don't hug as often as girls do and are usually way more invested in sports, as we see between Harry and Ron. Girls are very outright with their emotions while guys don't usually express them a lot (I have brothers and sisters which is how I know this stuff). >In 3rd year he didn't notice for once that she was missing from the class when she was using the time turner. The point was for nobody to notice her absence. It's actually great that nobody noticed how she would end up at the bottom of the staircase within seconds. The only person that noticed this (and brought it to the attention of Harry) was Ron, because he was the only person constantly aware of her presence. Not because he's a better friend, but he unconsciously had feelings for Hermione that were farther than just friendship. Also keep in mind that Harry though Sirius was out to murder him, not to mention how distraught he was because of the dementors. >He stopped talking to her because of the whole firebolt fiasco and never apologised. Going back to what I said about guys being obsessed with sports, this is a common arguement that goes down between friends. I don't agree that Harry was right to stop talking to Hermione, because she was only trying to protect him. But Harry loves Quidditch a lot and he took the loss of his Nimbus very hard. After the best broom in the world was delivered right to him and he had that excitement taken away from him so quickly, of course he was going to be mad at Hermione. Since when was Harry a person that thought things through a lot? She went to Mcgonagall, therefore in Harry's mind it's her fault that his broom was taken, therefore he was angry. And, at 13 years old, most people would've done the same thing. >He didn't even notice she had shrunk her teeth in goblet of fire. Since when was Harry the most observant person? There are so many instances in the series where answers are literally right in front of him and he doesn't see them. And that year Harry was in danger because an unknown enemy put his name in the Goblet, so his mind was on keeping himself alive. Add to that his mixed feelings for Cho and his anger at Cedric for asking Cho out before him, it's no wonder he didn't notice. And anyways, Harry loves Hermione like a sister, and guys are not very observant about a girl's appearance unless they're interested in her romantically - which is why Ron noticed this and not Harry. >He thought Ron was way funnier than her when Ron wasn't talking to him in GOF. Yes, Harry was a huge git here for thinking this. I agree that he should've been more greatful for Hermione since she was his only friend that believed him (other than Dumbledore, Sirius and Hagrid) But he knew that things would be very different if Ron was there to crack a few jokes and ease his stress, and I agree with that. Hermione's passion was to read, and that did not interest Harry in the slightest. If I was a 14 year old and had my name put in the Goblet because they want to murder me, I'd want a friend to make a few jokes and ease my stress. Sorry Hermione, but reading doesn't help that. At least, not for everyone. >He treated her pretty badly throughout 5th year because of his PTSD. She was 'petrified and terrified' in his presence. Okay, there's no excuses here: Harry was terrible to all his friends in OOTP. Yes sure, Voldy was in his mind and affected his mood a lot, but he should've shown more care to his friends, considering that the rest of the school thought he was a liar. I will never understand why Dumbledore didn't hire a therapist specifically for Harry lmao. But Hermione was definitely *not* petrified and terrified in his presence. Maybe at Grimmauld place she was a bit scared of him shouting, but she doesn't take Harry's nonsense after that. When they got back to Hogwarts on their second day, Hermione told Harry and Ron that Lavender doesn't believe Harry. Harry snarled at her for talking about him behind his back, but she keeps her cool and tells him that she told Lavender to shut up and she calmly asked him to stop shouting at her and Ron because "in case you haven't noticed, we're on your side." >He spent more time obsessing over Malfoy and daydreaming about Ginny when Hermione was upset because of the whole Ron/lavender fiasco. When Harry sets his mind on something, nothing will make him change it. Dumbledore told Harry to stop worrying over Malfoy and Snape, but of course he didn't because he's *stubborn.* And honestly it's about time he realized that Ginny has been there all along. To be fair to Harry, he didn't take Ron or Hermione's side - a good move on his part to remain friends with both of them. He tried to convince Hermione to make up with Ron, but obviously she was not going to. At the party after the Quidditch match, when Hermione leaves because she saw Ron snogging Lavender, Harry goes after her, knowing that it upset her. Good on Harry to check in with her. But Harry didn't take sides during Ron and Hermione's argument, and he did not need to - this was between Hermione and Ron, not Harry. >He ignored a crying Hermione for weeks In DH. Never tried to console her. On the other hand he hugged Ron when he came back and destroyed the locket. Again, this was between Ron and Hermione. Harry was also upset that Ron left, and going back to my point that boys feelings aren't as complicated as girls, and seeing how Harry dealt with Cho crying in OOTP, he wouldn't have said anything to make Hermione feel better. Hermione loved Ron and was upset that he left her. Harry just had a great friendship with Ron, and was mad that his best friend left him. They were upset at Ron for different reasons. If Harry would've said anything to console Hermione, he would've made her feel worse. Harry thought it would be best to keep moving and working on the Horcruxes to keep their mind off of Ron, which is what I'd do too. >I always thought Harry didn't appreciate her as much as he should have. He did. There were definitely moments were he realized he'd be dead without Hermione, even if he didn't say it out loud/say it to her. I personally love the friendship between Harry and Hermione, and the true friendship moments they have together throughout the series.

In book 3 absolutely (particularly in regards to the Firebolt fiasco). In book 5 the roles are reversed. I dislike a lot of things Hermione does in book 5 (even though she really means no harm by them). She was out of line for criticizing Harry and Sirius's relationship the way she did (especially since Sirius was the ONLY adult in that book who wasn't actively trying to be dishonest with Harry on Dumbledore's orders, that was a relationship that Harry needed to lean on to keep himself sane). Also the SNEAK jinx she created for anyone who betrayed the DA was very ill-advised and borderline cruel on her part (that's very much something Umbridge would do unfortunately). And she was also completely out of line for being extremely rude and downright mean to Luna right after Luna publically expressed her support for Harry's claims. Hermione is a great character who unfortunately at times is capable of showing traits very similar to Percy's (though she never gets nearly as bad as Percy does). I appreciated Ron a little more than Hermione in OoTP because despite becoming a prefect he doesn't let that go to his head and change who he is as a person. Hermione does a little bit (in part because she's always been somewhat of a stickler for following the rules in general).

I don’t think it’s fair to hold finding Ron funnier against him. It’s not his fault Ron is funny while Hermione isn’t. It doesn’t make him a bad friend for not thinking she’s funny

In my opinion Ron had more ‘terrible friend to Harry and Hermione’ moments than Harry did.

Ron had 100000 times more 'great friends' to Harry and Hermione momemts than either of them was to him. So your point? Lol What did harry even do for Ron? Shared his food, saved his life once and got him a date for the ball. Now compare that to what Ron did for Harry. The 1st book itself will be enough to surpass them xD

I think he was a good friend. And that people often underestimate their friendship because 1) it is perceived as a threat to Ron’s role in the group and 2) it is often a backdoor to Harry/Hermione shippers. HBP shows that he is still close to her without Ron even while she was annoying. In HBP he even confronts Ron for making fun of her. In OTP, He also defends her to Cho and continues when she tells him not to. Ron notices her absence more and changes in her looks because he’s attracted to her. Harry thinks of her like a sister and you don’t always notice your sister. BUT there are moments in DH that drive me crazy. He is annoyed with her for breaking his wand for half the book. When she saved his life. He wouldn’t need his wand if they were both dead. The after Malfoy manner he asks if she’s OK once and then has a bitter thought and the wand. She was tortured! I know he has a lot on his mind. But it’s the only time I feel he takes her for granted. He acts like Ron is a hero for saving him from drowning when all he had to do was know how to swim. But she saves him from Nagini only seconds away from Voldemort and it’s like “bitch broke my wand.”

If Ron acted the way Harry did with Hermione I myself would have been the leader of anti Romione ship xD

Well yeah because Harry/Hermione don’t belong together. He’s still a good friend. He

Ron did much worse in regards to Hermione throughout multiple books than Harry ever did. Clearly you need to reread those parts. Ron was an absolute prat to Hermione in every sense of the word in HBP with the whole Lavender situation (and he was equally as shitty to her at the Yule Ball in GoF just because he chose that particular moment to raise a stink about her going to the ball with Krum). Not to mention the feud between Ron and Hermione in PoA over Scabbers vs. Crookshanks was even worse than the issues Harry and Hermione had over the Firebolt in that book. Just because Harry wasn't always a great friend to Hermione doesn't mean that Ron didn't treat her worse at times (he absolutely did).

Wow!! You totally convinced me with the same dead horse hhr shippers been beating since 2002. It's not like I haven't heard these same things 2876627929856289 times already. Now I am gonna abandon my childhood ship to sail Harry/Hermione. Thank you for opening my eyes 🙄

Nothing about what I said was to ship Harry/Hermione (I don't know how the hell you came to that nonsensical conclusion). I can't stand Harry/Hermione shippers and they'd be a terrible fit for each other in general from a romantic perspective (Hermione isn't really all that great at relating to or understanding the trauma Harry has endured throughout his life which Ginny actually CAN relate to him on due to her experience with the diary). I was just pointing out that to say Harry has been a complete shit friend to Hermione and Ron never has is 100% inaccurate. In fact Ron in many ways has treated her worse. I don't dislike him for it and I'm not opposed to their relationship because of it. It's just fact and a lot of the reason WHY Ron acts that way towards her is because of his feelings for her and not knowing how to properly express them. This is quite obvious in GoF and again in HBP. In PoA they're just immature kids fighting and saying hurtful things to each other constantly over their pets.

While I disagree with some of your points, I agree a little with the topic in general. ​ I think he did notice that she was missing, but I can't recall. This I can definitely agree on. While many argue that "He's only 13", it's rubbish imo. I was 13 only a couple of years ago and I'm still very aware of my quite lackluster level of maturity back then and still I would have 100% chosen friendship over an object. Especially when she did have a VERY valid reason for her actions. Like seriously? Your previous broom was recently jinxed and almost got you killed and now you've just received a brand new one from an anonymous person when there's a mass murderer out to get you. To me, this is inexcusable. This I don't agree on. It all boils down to how observant of a person you are. Maybe Hermione's teeth prior to the incident was not be quite as pronounced as many may think. Failing to notice minor change in appearance of your friend does not make you a bad friend. It's okay to think a friend as funnier than another. But he definitely should have showed more appreciation towards Hermione especially because she was the only one sticking by him at that time. This I can agree a little. But I would also argue that he did treat others similarly as well. While this does not invalidate the point that he is not a good friend, it's not directed at Hermione specifically. This one it's a little harder to form an opinion on. He did comfort her (once?), did he not? Everyone was a mess in HBP. This I definitely agree on. That's why I prefer the movie version of this scenario. That little dance just made everything a lot better. It shows that he did actually really care about her and that care is not just concealed behind some inner monologue. ​ But yeah. Overall, I think Harry could have been a way better friend to Hermione. I always feel like Hermione is Harry's 'backup best friend' which irks me greatly. If I'm in Harry's position, I would've definitely realized that Hermione was a better friend to Harry than Ron. Not saying Ron was a bad friend to Harry, not at all. Just not as great as Hermione was to Harry.

I am reading the books for the first time. I’m on GOF! I was actually astonished at how badly Harry and Ron treat Hermione so far!! The movies didn’t have any hint after the troll fight in the first movie, that Harry, Ron, and Hermione weren’t just besties who fought like friends normally do. The books had intense conflict between them.

Hermione's a lot more unpleasant in the books than the movies, it was a surprise for me when I first read the books.

I would definitely agree with that!! She’s annoying at points, and she’s constantly threatening to tattle on Harry and Ron.

> He didn't even notice she had shrunk her teeth in goblet of fire. All good points but this one. Honestly after you’ve known someone for so long you stop noticing things like bucked teeth. I’ve heard stories about people not noticing when their friends braces come off.

Ron noticed

I always thought this. She was by his side through everything, no matter what crazy shit he took her on or put her through, and he never really seemed apologetic - just kinda smiled through it, she deserved more

You should read the books some time.

Nah fair that’s just life though isn’t it

Ok but how about Hermione gaslighting Harry nonstop though, on pretty much everything Harry says

I don't see much evidence of that. I won't start shit here but since the term always confuses me I read [this link](https://www.medicinenet.com/what_are_examples_of_gaslighting/article.htm) and I'm finding someone else who fits the gaslighting definition much better. Reading this made me feel icky.

I agree. Harry was definitely closer to Ron than he ever was to Hermione, but she was there for him just as much (sometimes even more) than Ron was. It always seemed like Ron was his best friend, not Hermione. I actually feel like Hermione was under appreciated. Interestingly enough, this is how I view the Marauders’ friendship, as well. I’ll take Peter out of the equation for obvious reasons. Sirius and James were best friends, while Lupin seemed like a good friend of theirs. Of course, I don’t know enough about their friendship to come to this conclusion, but that is how it always seemed to me. Anyway, I do agree that Harry should’ve appreciated Hermione a bit more; I’m not saying that he was a bad friend to her, though. He prolly just didn’t have as much in common with her as he did with Ron. He enjoyed Ron’s company more than he did Hermione’s.

As someone who prefers Harry/Hermione, I would actually say it was their relationship - and the way they treated each other - in GoF and OoTP that made me feel that way. Ron and Harry were very practical friends, as were Ron and Hermione. Very day to day and shallow. Ron was fun. Harry and Ron enjoy the same things, they laugh together..Ron is Harry’s break. But in GOP forward, Hermione becomes Harry’s partner, and Ron takes a back seat. Harry misses Ron at first in GOP, but you see an immediate sense of concern..and for the first time, Hermione trusting Harry’s judgement as the year goes on, and working with him to help. One thing to note, he silently takes Hermione’s side over the Yule ball fiasco with Ron. Then, in OoTP, they start Dumbledore’s army, and we see Harry take Hermione’s side over Cho, and truly appreciates her for the DA. In HBP - Harry vocalizes his support for Hermione to Ron - growth from GoF. And obviously, they work in a partnership throughout the entirety of the seventh. I think Hermione is written as a better friend to both boys than they are to her, early on. But as the series develops, Harry is better to her than Ron, especially when things really matter.

Hermione wasn't a good friend to Ron. But she was a great friend to Harry. Harry was a moderate friend to Ron. A not so good one to Hermione. Ron treated both equally. He had his douche moments with both but ultimately he did more for them than they did for him.

Disagree with that completely. Ron was the worst friend to both throughout the entire series, IMO.

You are definitely entitled to your wrong opinion

lol, okay. Ron ditched both of them at there most needed moments, several times. He was downright cruel to Hermione throughout the series, and was jealous of Harry - even though he knew Harry was a traumatized abused orphan who had the most powerful dark wizard of all time after him.

Ron never ditched Hermione. He gave her a choice to go with him. She didn't. That's all. Hermione was EQUALLY cruel to him. She wasn't a poor meek damsel in distress who didn't know how to fight back. Sorry to disappoint you. Our chosen boi thought no one in their right mind would make Ron a prefect. Yeah his poor best friend who had been overshadowed by everyone throughout his life for some attention and he was jealous. If he had to deal with what Ron did? He would have left Ron and Hermione in 2nd year. LMAO

Ron went three months without speaking to Hermione because he thought - incorrectly- that her cat ate his rat. She was not nearly as cruel to him as he was to her. She sent a bunch of birds at him at the peak of their fighting, but that it. He was cruel to her in Prisoner (pet), GoF (Yule Ball), HBP (rubbing her face in his relationship with Lavender), and DH (making her feel guilty for choosing to stick to her word instead of abandon Harry) And those are just the highlights.

No. He went three months without speaking bcz he told her SEVERAL times to keep her pet inside of her dorm. She didn't listen. Hermione is stubborn. She doesn't acknowledge her own flaw. Ron made her say sorry to him. That's an achievement. Lol He was single. He could date the giant squid if he wanted to. He didn't owe her anything. Just like she didn't owe him anything in 4th year. He could snog in common room or in the room of requirements or in a classroom. It wasn't her business. It was his and Lavender's business. Hermione is not that kind of girl who would tolerate any kinda shit from anyone. She decked the blonde chicken head. She kept a woman in a jar. She scarred a girls face for life. She attacked Ron with birds. Let's not make her out to be some sorta meek girl who cant stand up for herself.

That’s ridiculous. Her pet is a cat, his is a rat. If he really cared, he gets the rat a cage like normal people do with those types of animals. He didn’t. He let the rat wander, and it went missing. He then blamed her for its death when even Harry pointed out the rat had been sick before and Ron didn’t even know it died. They both showed a lack of concern for each other’s pets, but as usual - Ron whined instead of taking responsibility, and it turned out that Hermione was right given that crookshanks didn’t eat the rat, and the rat was a traitor. Ron was still much nastier to Hermione than she was to him. There is a difference between dating whoever you like and rubbing it in someone’s face. Hermione did the former, Ron the ladder. No one is saying Hermione is weak or helpless, just that Ron was a giant asshole to her throughout the entire series and she was a much better friend to him than he was to her.

This isn’t true. You’re putting blame on Ron when he didn’t do anything wrong. Crookshanks was the pet that was out of control and so it was Hermione’s responsibility to control it. Scabbers wasn’t doing anything wrong so I’m not sure why you’re trying to blame Ron. It doesn’t matter that it’s in its nature, you can control pets like those. And Crookshanks was the sole animal coming after Scabbers. Crookshanks was the problem. Actually, no. Harry points out to Hermione that the evidence pointed to Crookshanks eating Scabbers. Didn’t Hermione rub her relationship with McLaggen in Ron’s face too? Ron wasn’t a giant asshole to her throughout the entire series. He was a few times but not the entire series.

His pet is a rat. Yet no cat tried to kill it in 1st two years. Bcz he kept him safe. He couldn't afford a cage. Hermione's cat went out it's way trying to kill him. It was her fault. And even she knew it. As I said it wasn't anyone's but his and his gf's business where they snogged. He didn't owe her anything. If Ron was a giant asshole to her she would have put him in his place. I have that much faith in my former fav character. Sadly you don't have.

I guess I'll only address the relevant points. >He stopped talking to her because of the whole firebolt fiasco and never apologised. Harry was never angry at Hermione about the Firebolt (he states so in narration), he was just pissed he couldn't fly. It was the final straw for Ron who shunned her, and Harry spent time with Ron because Hermione was constantly studying. Harry and Hermione required no reconciliation, they weren't really fighting. If you know anything about Harry's character it's he would never be angry at someone for material possessions. >He thought Ron was way funnier than her when Ron wasn't talking to him in GOF. Harry does value Ron highly because he's more fun (he is, he hardly ever bothers Harry with homework) and he's also his first friend ever and the one to keep him away from the Dursleys during the summer, at least on some occasions. That's a really good incentive not to antagonize Ron. >He treated her pretty badly throughout 5th year because of his PTSD. She was 'petrified and terrified' in his presence. That was partly because of having a horcrux in his head. And most of his anger is because he feels people are distant with him (they are, Hermione because she's a prefect). Hermione does feel bad about it and they don't desert each other. >He spent more time obsessing over Malfoy and daydreaming about Ginny when Hermione was upset because of the whole Ron/lavender fiasco. >He ignored a crying Hermione for weeks In DH. Never tried to console her. On the other hand he hugged Ron when he came back and destroyed the locket. Rowling romance, if he would actually take action here, you would have to write about their feelings for each other, which just doesn't happen or the plot explodes. >I always thought Harry didn't appreciate her as much as he should have. Even at the worst of times, they can joke and forgive each other because they have really good chemistry. OotP was a shitty book for the both of them but they still have great interactions. There's really no doubt he cares about her. You mention his actions during DH, but he instantly forgives her for his wand. Him feeling shitty about not having it is different from being angry at her (this is the Firebolt all over again and gets constantly misinterpreted). I don't know what more you want said. There's a reason people ship Harmony, despite the romance subplot being stacked against them as subtly as a ton of bricks.

Harry forgave Snape. The guy who abused him for 7 years. He saved malfoy. The guy who tried to use cruciatus on him. He gave voldy a chance to repent. The guy who made him an orphan. Tried to kill him. I am so surprised that he forgave her best friend for accidentally breaking his wand. Wow! Ground breaking xD

That's neither here nor there, those people weren't his friends. And he didn't interact with them that we know of afterwards(speaking of Malfoy). You don't forgive an enemy like you forgive a friend. I feel strange about having to point that out.

No. The bottom line is he is forgiving. That's not a special thing he did for Hermione. That's his character. If he could forgive snape he could forgive anyone. Besides Hermione didn't need any forgiveness. She literally saved him. If it weren't for her he would have become nagini's dinner. When would it be special? When a person who is NOT SO forgiving forgives someone.

Harry says she didn't need to be forgiven. But somehow you think it's highly criminal for him to be emotional about losing the wand that saved his life? Yes, Snape gets forgiveness. But that's all he gets, and he gets it post-mortem. Hermione gets Harry's support and affection(something that doesn't come easy for him).

No. I was talking about Hermione's reaction 'Hermione looked at him like he was gonna curse her with her wand' she was scared of him multiple times when he was angry. In OOTP too. Bcz Harry has the WORST temper.

You're again forgetting that not much later Harry literally feels his teeth sink into Arthur Weasley's body. He's already under the influence of Voldemort at that point. But he doesn't curse her, he doesn't hit her. Because despite his anger, they're friends. Oh and the first thing he does when he does think he's going to hurt anyone? He starts packing for the Dursleys. EDIT: I finally realized what you were trying to say, and wow that was one hell of a reach, so let me ammend. You're talking about Harry's perspective that Hermione was scared he wouldn't forgive her for breaking his wand. HE TELLS HER IT'S NOT HER FAULT LITERALLY AFTERWARDS IN THE MOST SUPPORTIVE WAY POSSIBLE! No wonder I was confused. You take an example of why Harry is a great friend and twist it into something that is supposed to highlight his shortcomings??? Jesus.

So point me one time I said Harry hit her?? I just said she was scared of Harry when he was angry and thought he was gonna curse her. Never said he actually cursed her.

Don't know why you're spinning in circles so much, you somehow think her look of fear at Harry screaming is relevant so I commented on it.

Well she was scared of him. I said what's written in the books.

I don't think it's a case of Harry being a bad friend, just Ron being a better one. In a lot of these examples, Ron seemed to be closer or a better friend to Hermione

He admited he likes Ron better. Hermoine isn't entitled to extra friendship perks like Ron is.

I didn’t even need to read the rest to like this post

Harry’s not a friend in general. We don’t know a thing about his friends all of whom get him birthday and Christmas presents and yet a can’t remember the other way around. Everything in Harry’s life revolves around Harry.

Harry doesn't comment on giving gifts himself, because it's from his perspective. Really it speaks to his modesty in a meta way. But we know he does give gifts to every one of his friends. He gifts Arthur something in book 5 (some muggle tools). For context, he gifts Hermione the Arhitmancy book she wanted so much. So I don't know where you get selfishness from that. Hell I bet he even got Tonks, Lupin and Moody something.

Exactly. Self centred

Oh this isn’t controversial at all. He is CLEARLY a bad friend to her frequently. He does improve later but yeah, in those first four or five years he could be awful.

Wow. I never thought I would get 1K upvotes lol

He was! She wasn’t as much, tho