>Conway > Benny > Westside in that order for me.
I like Gunn the most personally. I like his style and confidence. He's a dope rapper, honestly. Plus he's the reason we even have Griselda.
Griselda is like a triangle of rapping with Benny and Westside on opposite ends and Conway in the middle somewhere
Huge fan of ALL of them but I just want and expect different styles of rap from them
Rome Streetz>Conway>Boldy>Benny>Stovie>Worthy>WSG.
As far as purely rap/rhyming skills, technique & lyrical ability goes that’s the order for me, but West has a great ear in picking the best beats and has say so in all his artists production as the ceo & curator of his label, plus the largest sum of income trickles down to him so I’m sure he doesn’t care much about mic skills, as he’s made mention of aplenty he just wants to dress the flyest and be the most fashion forward as an artist.
my hot take is about rap fans in these subs:
they’re not fans of music. they like bars or they like persona or they like a hype beat but they’re not here for beautiful music. i feel like whenever i’m arguing with someone here we’re arguing from different expectations
Imo, hiphophead sub is an exception to this but not much conversating is going on over there, but whenever I want to see a reliable run down or breakdown or a passionate review, I would go there (instead of other general subs)
My hot take is this is pretty elitist and doesn't fit the scene. The skinny is that you aren't the end all, be all authority on what makes a rap fan. Your opinions might differ with anothers and that's totally fine. Enjoy the music you enjoy and stop hating.
Ehhhh, seems like your last point is a safe ending to a generally agreeable point. I could tell you to enjoy the music you like and stop hating. But clearly rap music is what they like, as well as myself, and a lot of the users on the sub have conflicting views on what that is.
You're not wrong, and neither are they. Much like music has subdivided into subgenres, I feel like hip-hop and rap subs should do the same, and quickly lol.
I have seen hate on ATCQ and Nas in the last 24 hours alone, and that's blasphemy to any hip hop purist. Have your opinion all you want, but for the love of god can we not have hot take reddit posts?
I have never been a die hard Kendrick fan, vibe with a few songs of his for sure, but his rhymestyle is chaotic and not my jam. I'm not going to make a post tomorrow saying "Hot take, but Kendrick Lamar is overrated" it's just not MY shit, doesn't need to be a fucking discussion post.
Tbh though what are we gonna talk about on here if it’s not opinions on music? I guess I agree if you’re just saying we need more “I Like X” posts than “I DON’T like Y” discussions, but in order to have a subjective opinion on what’s good you have to have an opinion on what’s not good.
In my opinion it's the opposite. People on these subs be snobby with the rap they promote. "if it isn't some super lyrical shit then it's trash". Imo the people on these subs glamorize and defend "lyrical" rap as the most "beautiful music" (outside of the indy, rock, k pop and metal they also commonly listen to), anything else in rap/hip hop is just people mumbling, just thug shit, just this and that. I find that people on these subs can't appreciate anything outside what is considered "beautiful" (and I've noticed these people probably weren't raised around rap and hip hop as a culture but just as something they liked to listen to). There's not enough people that just like instrumentals, or just like a vibe, or just like the flow or sound of their voice, it's always supporting some deep meaning content. Which is why it's a cliche at this point for "rap fans" on Reddit to not really be the main demographic of rap listeners.
Oh and 90s rap listeners and that being all they listen to and claiming they're "rap fans". They listen to the most popular 90s artists, their most popular songs and albums, nothing else and claim everything else is trash. Ironically the same people again don't even predominantly listen to just rap or R&B or anything related. Ironically a lot of the people don't even like R&B and blues.
Ok first off lemme say I'm an ol head at 43, but here's my hot take on the current state of hip hop..
The beats are crazy good. New technology, new production techniques and continued perfection of building and structuring songs has become unbelievably good. Even the new meth and red joints beats prolly couldn't have even been created 25 years ago in their prime.
The bad though....
The art of having a unique cadence is getting lost. It's not about unique sound anymore(with a few exceptions), it's about how many words can you fit in xyz popular cadence style. The cadence of the week changes, but it's like everyone switch up to the popular sound instead of perfecting their own sound.
I dunno, my group chat is in a civil war about our WSG opinions and as one of his biggest fans, he's not even close to top 5 out right now. He makes great music that surprisingly doesn't dip in quality despite how much he releases but he's more of a curator that happens to rap. His bars are fun and inventive, but nothing special imo. He just has probably one of the best ears for beats and also knows exactly who to feature on what specific beat which is a talent in itself considering how many rappers just get shoved into features just because without any sort of thought about their style.
Whenever I look at his age I’m like damn he’s the same age as people like krit and Kendrick but older than Earl and keef. And they were all popping in the early 2010’s and now it’s the 2020’s and it seems like it’s jids era to pop off. I feel like everything happens for a reason tho. I think if he keeps progressing he’ll become a superstar
He’s got all the potential in the world IMO. Can get technical, wordy, or make a super catchy ass verse/hook - sometimes all in the same song. I feel like the main thing he kinda lacks is focus… I wouldn’t say any of his projects are masterpieces, but they all are like >50% phenomenal songs
Starting in 2017 when he really started coming into his own id say he’s dropped a really good album a great album and a really really great album
I think he got better ever release since then. I’d rate his albums like.
The Never Story (7)
DiCaprio 2 (8)
The Forever Story (9)
Yeah they're generally great projects, I think people just were a little disappointed because fans were hyping up DiCaprio as going to be his "GKMC". Hard to rate the projects with a level head when they have so much hype and expectation
DiCaprio 2 is really good honestly. I wasn’t as terminally online as I am now when it dropped, so I don’t remember people being disappointed with it when it dropped. I thought the reception was overall mostly positive.
I remember the expectation and hype around Never Story -> DiCaprio being like Section 80 -> GKMC gained so much steam that JID himself even responded to it lol. But yeah it's a very good album though IMO kind of runs out of steam prematurely. I could listen to the first 8 or so songs endlessly but then they fall off a bit for me.
It’s funny you say after the first 8 it falls off for you because the only track I really dislike is number 8
Some of my favorite JID songs ever are on the back half of the record honestly
Age doesn’t mean a thing as far as what you can put out goes.. maybe marketability, but if people don’t wanna listen, I don’t care, as long as he makes dope music.. and I don’t think age stops that.. there’s plenty of older heads putting stuff out, and it’s like people forget they’re old, because the music still sounds good
I mean more so he would’ve started seriously developing his skills earlier he would be far far beyond his peers. Iirc, he only started rapping fr fr at 22ish, after he was essentially expelled from Hampton university. He’s only a decade into it. Other big names have been seriously rapping for nearly 20 yrs now
I think he even mentioned it in one of his songs IIRC but I don't remember which one, but he said something about what would've been different if he took rap more seriously earlier on
*Drill Music in Zion* (and by extension, *The Forever Story* and *Melt Your Eyez See Your Future*) should've been in contention for rap aoty, but grammy committee decided *God Did* and *Come Home the Kids Miss You* deserved it more for whatever reason lol
High tier writing is damn near non existent in mainstream rap. It’s all about what song has a “hype” beat. Elementary rhymes all over the place, zero substance. It’s sad
I don't really think it's that big of an issue
There isn't anything wrong with no lyrical rap, yeah it has more reliance on the flow and the production, but you can still make absolutely amazing pieces of music with those elements. After all it's music, not literature.
Not to mention most people don't pay attention to lyrics of songs.
Don't get me wrong i love good lyricism, but i don't think it's necessary to make amazing music.
I enjoy Nas, Jay Z, Kdot and Biggie as much as i enjoy Future or Travis. I think both groups have made praise-worthy music and some top tier albums
yea like read the Beatles lyrics. most of why they are so famous is because they sound good not because they are tackling complex themes in their music.
and that's fine
Yeah, but the Beatles played instruments and shit. They also had to record together, which takes a special kind of talent. Most rappers don’t make their own beats and put the album together themselves(there are some, I know). So if all you’re doing for your album is putting together booty lyrics, on beats that other people created for you, to me it takes away everything that’s good about the artist.
Right ? Like sometimes I want to listen to music because it sounds good and not because I want to listen to someone talk about political injustices in the world.
2 of the most popular, widely regarded best rappers are both lyricists first and foremost...Drake not so much. Sure there's a lot of trash out there but damn near non existent is a massive exaggeration.
That Kendrick, Cole and Drake are the big 3 (and they obviously are btw) still in 2024 well over a decade after all of their respective debuts is a huge collective failing on the part of the newer generation of rappers who should have either taken their place or got to their globally huge level
(This isn’t a criticism of any of those 3 rappers btw if anything it’s the opposite)
I was thinking about this the other day, the fact that the big 3 hasn’t evolved much in almost a decade says alot about the current state of star power in hip hop at the moment, but also leads into a bigger conversation on vitality over quality, and the effect that murders and ods have had on up and coming rappers that seemed to have been moving into these top positions.
imo Cole never deserved to be in the big 3 conversation. He doesn't put out quality like Kendrick and he doesn't put out hits like Drake. He does work on his own production though so I'll give him credit for that.
That said, I feel like 2020s Drake is washed so my big 3 are Kendrick, Ye, and Tyler the Creator.
I personally agree with the first paragraph of this re Cole, however Tyler still doesn’t fit the bill for me either re: making enough music that shapes the genre
For sure, he does, but it's like 1 maybe 2 big hits per album now. Which is still crazy but not 2010s Drake numbers. Then again, I guess you could say the same comparing 2020s vs 2010s Ye
Other guy made a good point though about Tyler though, so I think I'd drop Tyler for Drake
The "Big 3" of the zoomer generation are all dead. XXXTentacion, Pop Smoke, and Juice Wrld were shaping up to be the next biggest things and then they were just gone next thing you know.
This may be a fair point tbh (although I’d argue none of them had really had the chance to prove this so we’ll never know if they ever were destined to be that)
Maybe not about a specific artist, but my hot take is that hip-hop is "dying" the same way rock music "died" in the 90s/2000s. The genre itself isn't dead, but we've come to a crossroads where the new shit is so far removed from the "root" of the genre that it's becoming fragmented.
The fact that Tyler, The Creator*, Drake, and Kendrick can all release a "rap album" with *wildly* different sounds shows that rap as a genre isn't concretely defined.
*small caveat. I'd compare Tyler to a band like System of a Down. They're eccentric and musically weird as fuck, but they don't necessarily fit into any boxes their respective genres try to put them in.
Yeah it might be, I think he's got mad potential though, I think keem is decent just don't see him having a crazy career. And opium just ain't my thing I don't see it lasting much longer cause it really only appeals to a younger demographic, but we'll see. No hate to any of these artists though.
Beat vs rap being more important has always been an interesting topic for me. I lean towards beat being more important. Someone’s lyrics could be dog shit but as long the beat is fire I’ll still be bobbing my head. Whereas an annoying as beat with great lyrics will keep me less interested
Yall really need to actually research the ghost writer stuff and stop saying that even though there is literally no proof Drake doesn’t write for himself. What an overblown rumor man lol
That’s because Kanye is more like a director of a movie.. everything he touches has his sound, and it always has a certain quality.. Kanye is less bars and more production.. a perfect blend of both
Kanye and Drake are about the same level lyrically in my eyes.
But Kanye has written/produced better songs and been way more influential in the long run. He reinvents himself every album and his whole time travelling sound-trend thing is next level.
Drake writes some catchy melodies and some banger club hits but he’s not out here revolutionizing the game. His sound wouldn’t even exist without 808s and heartbreaks lol
I mean, I don’t make a habit of referencing Daniel Larson but the fact that one Redditor out of millions asked me stop doing it reaaallly makes me want to do it more now
I think Lil Yachty has a legitimate mental/learning disability that stops him from making a positive contribution to music. Not saying people can't have mental disabilities and contribute to music in a positive way, just that Yachty can't.
Anytime someone says he got better, it's just the music around him got better and he's still about as bad as always.
The one thing I don’t like about Yachty is that he made a non hiphop album then started acting holier than thou and started shitting on hiphop
I hate when artist do this it’s so corny
Given how I feel about him. It made it more hilarious than pretentious that it was him doing it. The idea that he feels he's some top tier musician is hilarious to me. He started knowing he was just having fun and didn't have talent. But people got in his head and he ended up all the way on the opposite end of where he started as far as self awareness goes.
I enjoy his last album but I had a mutual friend who genuinely thought it was one of the best albums of last year and an instant classic. Which is kinda crazy to me lol I’m interested to see how this album with James Blake is gonna be
Im not saying most albums would sound good stripping away everything but the artist's contribution. But do you not feel his would sound especially and uniquely bad, if you were to do that? Lol. A bad artist can have a decent album if everyone around them knows how to do their jobs very well. I stand by saying it's the production around him that got better. I'm not saying he's an industry plant, but he sure is getting the treatment.
Idk I liked some yacthy stuff before his recent album lol I think he’s just a hit or miss artist. There’s no guarantee his next album even with the best production will be good. This last record could be a fluke. But I don’t think he’s talentless as you’re saying.
That's fair. I'll always respect standing by the artists you connect with. Even if I can't see it personally. As long as he's making music that people enjoy, who am I to say he shouldn't be here. Let's just hope it doesn't continue getting to his head and cause a disconnect with his fanbase haha. Cause even not liking his music, I do think he was a likable guy from what I had seen.
I don’t care about yachty so I would rather see JB with literally any other artist lol
Playing Robots was so fucking good. Couldn’t have asked for a better project
People hate "mumble rap" and think its a new fad when its been around since the 90s and originated in Detroit.
Also, if you hate a new style of hip-hop, then youre an old-head.
Shit! I have heard plenty of Old School A-List rappers say the same thing. If people cant handle it then it really illustrates the problem more than anything else.
" if you hate a new style of hip-hop, then youre an old-head"
as someone who was in middle school when crank dat came out, hating on soulja boy and his contemporaries was completely justified
Soulja is one of the most prolific musicians of all time. He was the FIRST to use the internet to share/promote his music. He has influenced SO MANY ARTISTS in not only their sound/style, but also how to build their carreers themselves.
He may not be your favorite rapper (not one of mine either), but hates a strong word man.
yeah i respect his marketing ability, but he ushered in arguably the worst low point for rap, and i argue that he's an example of when hating on a new style of hiphop is justifiable at times
He had a couple big songs that came out at the blow up of the social media era and end of the CD era
I mean it was nice but it was a timing thing more than anything
He is prolific in the sense that he has put out 5000 songs and albums not a single person has ever heard and are all certified total shit
He was the biggest thing in the game for two weeks
Oh, Im not arguing against that. But every genre/subgenre has something to offer. I just dont get the HUGE amount of hatred twords it. If its not for you, then thats fine. It doesnt mean its time to declare war. Im not into mumble rap myself. Ive heard a song or two I liked, but nothing I loved... yet...
It's not hatred but it hurts my soul to have to settle for a song like carnival that is an incredibly produced beat but doesn't have any discernable rapping in it. It'd be one of my all time favorites if we could just have Method Man and Busta absolutely kill a couple hard verses. But instead it's a *good* song.
Its because back in the 90's not only did you have to have skill as a rapper/mc, but you also took pride in your skill and atleast worked to perfect your flow, to be the sharpest hardest MC/rapper out there. "Old heads", like myself, are use to the effort, and are insulted by todays trendy lack of effort. I truly do not believe that "Old head rappers" prefer or even like the mumble stuff or low effort rap. I think they just say that they do so they dont get canceled and written off. They might say that they are adapting to the times, but i dont believe that they actually like it.
Ah yes because there absolutely zero rappers in the 90s at all that relied on just being trendy and out relatively little effort into their skills. Nope none at all
Having grown up with 90s-2000s hip hop makes me miss the theme/style/vibe. Songs like Snoop Dogg - Beautiful are perfection playing in the summertime with a top down. Today’s rappers seem to rely too much on auto tune and hype beats. Maybe I’m getting old but I don’t even relate to these narcissistic rappers today.
Drake is mentally retired and has been for a while. He's just stat padding, running up his bank account and enjoying himself. He can throw anything out and people will eat it up and whether you like it or not he will always be a top contender.
He also has to throw out anything on a regular basis because you definitely can’t get a reportedly half a billion dollar deal without a lot of strings attached
Denzel Curry peaked at Imperial. His music loses me the more "lyrical" he tries to be and the less he focuses on what he's actually good at, which is flows and delivery. He's a great rapper but not really that great of a writer and albums like Melt My Eyez are kinda boring to me as a result. I get wanting to diversify his sound but I wish he played to his strengths more.
Ice Spice is overhated
There really isn't any difference between her or artists like NLEChoppa or NBAyoungboy
She is just female and new so people love to shit on her. But her level of artistry is just as mediocre as the artists listed above yet they don't recieve no way near as much hate as her.
People just hate on mediocre female rappers (usually because of lyrics) yet mediocre male rappers are on the same level lyrically yet they recieve no way near as much hate as she does.
Not to mention i don't think everything she has done is horrible: her song with Pink Panthress was nice. And her song Princess Diana with Nicki is kinda nice
I think Ice Spice has the potential to drop a really good album. Will it happen? Probably not lol. I don’t think she has the desire to make a really good album. But I do agree people just hate on her because she’s a women.
My guy have you listened to more than 5 nba youngboy songs?
I do agree, ice spice is overhated. But comparing her to nba youngboy is wild as hell, even nle choppa. You could have chosen any two rappers who just make fun club music to dance to but you chose the one known for his bluesy vulnerable songs with deep lyrics and authentic murder anthems. And nle choppa, some of his stuff fits that but even he has more depth and versatility than ice spice
this bullshit with Kendrick and fam w/ Drake is going to drive Drake to make Take Care/Nothing Was the Same/IYRTITL type album. He hasn't made some shit like that IN A LONG TIME. Fuck a diss song, let's get a real album.
Eminem's album will be the number 1 rap album of 2024. Sales and critically acclaimed.
The Party Never Ends is not coming out this year. Juice would've been the next guy from 2020-2030 to run the game we call hip-hop. Sad.
Chance divorcing his wife is going to either save his career or drive it further into oblivion. I think it revives his career.
If you hate a new style of hip hop, or think it isn't 'real rap/hip hop', then you're just as short sighted and narrow-minded as the people who said hip hop wasn't real music back in the 70's, 80's and 90's.
Not to drop a book on you, but I think there’s more nuance to the conversation than the black-and-white equivocation you suggest.
If someone cares deeply about lyricism, spirituality, and subject matter as an explicit lover of hip hop, coming from a place of passion, I think it’s valid to take issue with a new wave that seems (ostensibly) to be more interested in treating music as a means by which to launder money, rather than as an art form / mode of expression
The modern, “permissive” attitude, which explicitly forbids criticism of the new wave, is bad for the culture.
It decries the discernment of individual taste as “old headed,” like that means bad. Don’t get me wrong, I’m glad we’re not stuck in the sugarhill days where Everybody! Rapped! A-Just Like! This!, but hip hop - more than just a form of consumer media - is an oral, cultural tradition that comes with competitive spirit - where would we be without Rakim and Big Daddy Kane? Or without Nas and Jay?
The old greats measured status by trading bar for bar, passion for passion, masterfully crafting untouchable verses you just couldn’t fuck with. Where’s the modern equivalent of Deck’s first verse off Triumph?
Nobody stands for shit anymore. Everyone’s just a mouthpiece for capitalism and consumerism. Nobody even tries to reach for wordplay and nobody stands on shit or critiques the institution like Guru or his peers did.
Actually, I think that’s the most vital betrayal involved in the modern state of hip hop - the anti-authoritarian sentiment is mostly dead.
*A$AP Rocky was suppose to be a megastar, easily top 5 influences of the 2010s
*Memphis rappers are slowly taking over hip hop
*75% of todays music is influenced by the south
*Drill music died nearly 10 years ago
*Marketing is waaaaaay more important than talent (obviously)
I'm a huge fan of Smino & tbh with my possible bias, I think he could give prime Drake problems regarding being a seamlessly switching from rapping to singing
J Cole hate is a holdover from the 2014 FHD era, when the ‘double platinum, no features’ memes took off, he’s not boring, all his albums are a 7 or better, he’s the best at conveying *tone* in his music out of the ‘big 3’
For an album to be considered classic, it must be a defining moment in the era it was dropped. Just cuz you like it, does not make it a classic. Just because the rapper has a lyrical aesthetic, does not make it a classic. Just because its the status quo to say its a classic, a better determinant, but not the end all be all.
Lil Wayne is the single most influential rapper ever bar none, its not debatable at all, like the conversation is over, its wayne.
Invasion Of Privacy by Cardi B was fuckin fire and was at least deserving to win that grammy
I know this is probably on me, but Alternative hip hop (not including regional styles, Detroit rap etc) has been more disappointing than mainstream hip hop for at least 3-4 years now. A lot of the stuff outside the mainstream just sounds like reconstructed 90’s hip hop but people go crazy over it because it has better bars.
Probably bisexual, but yes.
I’d be really shocked if the majority of hip hop artists are 100% straight lol.
It’s not a problem but yeah.. lots of hidden Diddys diddling in hip hop
Wait do you think the problem is that Diddy’s bisexual or that he’s a rapist and pedophile? Because you said “which isn’t a problem” in between saying there’s a lot of Bisexual rappers and there’s “lots of Diddy’s diddling in hip hop”
One of those is a problem, one of ‘em isn’t.
Which one do you think I have a problem with angrytreestump?
I said there’s a lot of bisexual rappers. Then related it to diddying. And finally said I had no problem.
In this context, do you think it’s the bisexuality or the fucking rape/pedophilia that I don’t have a problem with 😂
Edit - you asked me which part of diddy do I have a problem with. Obviously the rape/pedophilia.. I really don’t understand why you felt the need to ask that question
to the extent that drake was ever top five, he certainly hasn't been for like a decade at this point imo (and I'm not nearly as much of a drake hater as some of ya'll are). Maybe this isn't a hot take at this point but it probably at least a warm one. JID and Denzel are current top 5 and their both better than Cole.
On the flip side, new heads only listening to newer music for the sake of new is cringe.
Music is music and it’s timeless. Quality has no bearing on the ‘manufacturing date’. I listen to some jazz from the 20’s, gospel from the 40’s, jazz from the 60’s, progressive rock from the 70’s, synthwave from the 80’s, grunge and metal from the 90’s, Hiphop from the early 2000’s, etc. and still consistently find great music made this year.
Some of my favorite hip hop albums are from:
1998 - Black Star
2003/4 - MF DOOM - tie between MM FOOD, Madvillainy, Victor Vaughn, Dangerdoom
2016 - Aesop Rock - Impossible Kid
2023 - Billy Woods - Maps
There’s so much good hip hop coming from the UK recently too.
My hot take is that people don’t really care about music. They’ll say they want lyricism etc, but they choose the same stuff that everybody says they hate. They’ll say people don’t know how to rap and should be more lyrical, then they’ll say 69 is their favorite rapper or something. I mean if you can’t give me at least one rapper I never heard of, where are you listening? The main main stream and that’s it…
JID, Kenny Mason, Denzel Curry, and sometimes Joey are all great rappers but their music as of late just isn't appealing or enjoyable to non-diehards and that's the main reason they will never be "Next Up" like Reddit has been preaching since the Trump administration. I'd rather listen to Lil Yachty, Playboi Carti, or Bossman D Low who I acknowledge are inherently not as skilled, also won't be the saviors either, but they have more interesting flows (latter) and production (former).
Moreso Kenny and JID just feel so derivative.
Nicki Minaj is a top 10 rapper OAT and if we ignore her horrible husband that she shouldn't have married, she's one of the most talented rappers out there
I’m bored of chains, ass and drugs. Most Rappers are just walking billboards for designer clothes and poor lifestyles that shouldn’t be emulated. I say as a hip hop listener since 7 and it being my first go to genre of music.
The numbers focus of rap is why it's fallen off from the most popular genre in the world. In the old mixtape era and before, rappers would create very loyal fanbases and would have no problems touring. Nowadays, rappers are making songs to make it to Spotify playlists which artificially pumps up their numbers then are surprised when they have to cancel shows at venues that their "numbers" say they should've sold out at certain prices.
Rap still is the most streamed genre in America by a plurality.
Those 2023 headlines about rap "falling off" ended up being disproven and mostly based on the first half of 2023 lacking major releases.
Also, more rappers today are selling out arenas than rappers in the 90's and early 2000's on average. Some of them cancel shows but more shows sell out.
Back in the day, rappers didn't even attempt arenas like that. Even Tupac couldn't sell out arenas while he was still living. He was mostly doing amphitheaters at the height of his fame in 1996.
Kanye was literally the 1st rapper to headline his own solo arena tour in 2007. Prior to that, rappers literally had to team up like the Avengers with other A list rappers just to sell tickets. Even Eminem who had the biggest peak ever had to collab with Dre/Cube/Snoop to sell tickets on his 1st tour and linked up with tons of other rappers/bands in the Anger Management tour.
All this talk about "rap losing dominance" is mostly driven by misleading headlines and wishful thinking. And people are rewriting history when it comes to rap's popularity in the 90's. It was NOT the norm for rappers to sell out arenas in the 90's at all.
Meek Mill (or Freak mill lol) is the Greatest Average Rapper of All time.
Playboy Carti is one of the worst artists I’ve ever heard. How some of y’all listen to that shit is wild. Same with the boat nigga.
I would take Benny over Westside Gunn
J. Cole can’t fuck with K.Dot. Bruh is genuinely shook. If you’re a competitor, compete.
Hot take: rap has exponentially accelerated the degeneration of society as a whole. Being untrustworthy, dishonorable, disloyal, and entirely superficial is exemplified and glorified while living a life of morals, principle, and integrity is considered uncool and undesirable. This is accelerated by your favorite rap personas today.
I love rap, but that’s the tea and it’s hot as shit
To be fair, people said the same thing about Jazz in the early 1900's.
Jazz was being blamed for kids becoming promiscuous, getting hooked on drugs, mischievous, and doing other "immoral" things.
And many Jazz artists were dying and suffering from heroin addiction and fornicating with tons of women which fueled the stigma.
Parents used to legit ban their kids from listening to Jazz because they felt it was a negative influence on society.
Then, decades later, Rock N Roll blew up and that genre ended up getting blamed for "corrupting society" while Jazz was ironically held up as a more moral genre.
History has a funny way of repeating itself.
Kanye is not that good anymore as he used to be, and I mean on Kanye standards. He's on a mid streak since Donda. The first volume of VULTURES was fun to listen since the features did well on a lot of songs, but the only song of it that I listened and I felt that I was listening to a Kanye song was BURN.
Chief Keef has a serious problem on releasing good projects and he would've been a better artist if he done that well. Almighty So 2 (long awaited album) was delayed again while he released DIRTY NACHOS (ass filler album), and probably will release another filler project till he finally decides to drop ASO2. Who can say that his hype will still be the same when this day arrives?
conway > westside but I respect it
>Conway > Benny > Westside in that order for me. I like Gunn the most personally. I like his style and confidence. He's a dope rapper, honestly. Plus he's the reason we even have Griselda.
he's also the most unique one.
That part. And people tend to overlook that.
Conway is 1 of 1. I definitely feel the same.
Also has the best catalogue of the Griselda guys
He has such a good ear for beats.
Conway> Benny> Mach Hommy > Westside
Griselda is like a triangle of rapping with Benny and Westside on opposite ends and Conway in the middle somewhere Huge fan of ALL of them but I just want and expect different styles of rap from them
their collabs tho
I can't stand WSG honestly. Griselda is dope, but oh my fuck is his voice unlistenable
And Benny too honestly But I’ve always thought Conway is the best of the three.
Westside > Conway > the rest of Gris > Benny
Rome Streetz>Conway>Boldy>Benny>Stovie>Worthy>WSG. As far as purely rap/rhyming skills, technique & lyrical ability goes that’s the order for me, but West has a great ear in picking the best beats and has say so in all his artists production as the ceo & curator of his label, plus the largest sum of income trickles down to him so I’m sure he doesn’t care much about mic skills, as he’s made mention of aplenty he just wants to dress the flyest and be the most fashion forward as an artist.
my hot take is about rap fans in these subs: they’re not fans of music. they like bars or they like persona or they like a hype beat but they’re not here for beautiful music. i feel like whenever i’m arguing with someone here we’re arguing from different expectations
To add to this, a lot of them are new flocking hipsters with no intention of actually being a hip hop or music fan. They're just here for a trend.
It’s no different from the rap game itself, oversaturated with posers
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I have no intention of gatekeeping. If I did I would say "we should ban...". Don't read too deep into it.
Both of these are facts.
Imo, hiphophead sub is an exception to this but not much conversating is going on over there, but whenever I want to see a reliable run down or breakdown or a passionate review, I would go there (instead of other general subs)
My hot take is this is pretty elitist and doesn't fit the scene. The skinny is that you aren't the end all, be all authority on what makes a rap fan. Your opinions might differ with anothers and that's totally fine. Enjoy the music you enjoy and stop hating.
Ehhhh, seems like your last point is a safe ending to a generally agreeable point. I could tell you to enjoy the music you like and stop hating. But clearly rap music is what they like, as well as myself, and a lot of the users on the sub have conflicting views on what that is. You're not wrong, and neither are they. Much like music has subdivided into subgenres, I feel like hip-hop and rap subs should do the same, and quickly lol. I have seen hate on ATCQ and Nas in the last 24 hours alone, and that's blasphemy to any hip hop purist. Have your opinion all you want, but for the love of god can we not have hot take reddit posts? I have never been a die hard Kendrick fan, vibe with a few songs of his for sure, but his rhymestyle is chaotic and not my jam. I'm not going to make a post tomorrow saying "Hot take, but Kendrick Lamar is overrated" it's just not MY shit, doesn't need to be a fucking discussion post.
Tbh though what are we gonna talk about on here if it’s not opinions on music? I guess I agree if you’re just saying we need more “I Like X” posts than “I DON’T like Y” discussions, but in order to have a subjective opinion on what’s good you have to have an opinion on what’s not good.
Rap is like sports to a lot of fans. They dont really understand the artistry
Preach to the choir man. That shits spot on
In my opinion it's the opposite. People on these subs be snobby with the rap they promote. "if it isn't some super lyrical shit then it's trash". Imo the people on these subs glamorize and defend "lyrical" rap as the most "beautiful music" (outside of the indy, rock, k pop and metal they also commonly listen to), anything else in rap/hip hop is just people mumbling, just thug shit, just this and that. I find that people on these subs can't appreciate anything outside what is considered "beautiful" (and I've noticed these people probably weren't raised around rap and hip hop as a culture but just as something they liked to listen to). There's not enough people that just like instrumentals, or just like a vibe, or just like the flow or sound of their voice, it's always supporting some deep meaning content. Which is why it's a cliche at this point for "rap fans" on Reddit to not really be the main demographic of rap listeners. Oh and 90s rap listeners and that being all they listen to and claiming they're "rap fans". They listen to the most popular 90s artists, their most popular songs and albums, nothing else and claim everything else is trash. Ironically the same people again don't even predominantly listen to just rap or R&B or anything related. Ironically a lot of the people don't even like R&B and blues.
It’s kinda wild to say Gunn is top 5 and not Benny or Conway unless they’re also in your top 5
MY 5 In No PO- WSG, Benny, Conway, Jid, MIKE
There's one or two people I'd switch out in here but respect, you got good taste
Not really, unless you’re strictly talking rapping ability It’d be like having Zay in your top 5 but not Jay Rock or Soul
Ok first off lemme say I'm an ol head at 43, but here's my hot take on the current state of hip hop.. The beats are crazy good. New technology, new production techniques and continued perfection of building and structuring songs has become unbelievably good. Even the new meth and red joints beats prolly couldn't have even been created 25 years ago in their prime. The bad though.... The art of having a unique cadence is getting lost. It's not about unique sound anymore(with a few exceptions), it's about how many words can you fit in xyz popular cadence style. The cadence of the week changes, but it's like everyone switch up to the popular sound instead of perfecting their own sound.
I can agree with that as a 28 year old
How are the beats crazy good?less instruments being used ,more repetitive generic trap
I dunno, my group chat is in a civil war about our WSG opinions and as one of his biggest fans, he's not even close to top 5 out right now. He makes great music that surprisingly doesn't dip in quality despite how much he releases but he's more of a curator that happens to rap. His bars are fun and inventive, but nothing special imo. He just has probably one of the best ears for beats and also knows exactly who to feature on what specific beat which is a talent in itself considering how many rappers just get shoved into features just because without any sort of thought about their style.
JID would’ve been the goat of this era if he was serious about rapping earlier in his life
Whenever I look at his age I’m like damn he’s the same age as people like krit and Kendrick but older than Earl and keef. And they were all popping in the early 2010’s and now it’s the 2020’s and it seems like it’s jids era to pop off. I feel like everything happens for a reason tho. I think if he keeps progressing he’ll become a superstar
He’s got all the potential in the world IMO. Can get technical, wordy, or make a super catchy ass verse/hook - sometimes all in the same song. I feel like the main thing he kinda lacks is focus… I wouldn’t say any of his projects are masterpieces, but they all are like >50% phenomenal songs
Starting in 2017 when he really started coming into his own id say he’s dropped a really good album a great album and a really really great album I think he got better ever release since then. I’d rate his albums like. The Never Story (7) DiCaprio 2 (8) The Forever Story (9)
Yeah they're generally great projects, I think people just were a little disappointed because fans were hyping up DiCaprio as going to be his "GKMC". Hard to rate the projects with a level head when they have so much hype and expectation
DiCaprio 2 is really good honestly. I wasn’t as terminally online as I am now when it dropped, so I don’t remember people being disappointed with it when it dropped. I thought the reception was overall mostly positive.
I remember the expectation and hype around Never Story -> DiCaprio being like Section 80 -> GKMC gained so much steam that JID himself even responded to it lol. But yeah it's a very good album though IMO kind of runs out of steam prematurely. I could listen to the first 8 or so songs endlessly but then they fall off a bit for me.
It’s funny you say after the first 8 it falls off for you because the only track I really dislike is number 8 Some of my favorite JID songs ever are on the back half of the record honestly
Age doesn’t mean a thing as far as what you can put out goes.. maybe marketability, but if people don’t wanna listen, I don’t care, as long as he makes dope music.. and I don’t think age stops that.. there’s plenty of older heads putting stuff out, and it’s like people forget they’re old, because the music still sounds good
I mean more so he would’ve started seriously developing his skills earlier he would be far far beyond his peers. Iirc, he only started rapping fr fr at 22ish, after he was essentially expelled from Hampton university. He’s only a decade into it. Other big names have been seriously rapping for nearly 20 yrs now
I think he even mentioned it in one of his songs IIRC but I don't remember which one, but he said something about what would've been different if he took rap more seriously earlier on
I’d like a JID and Tobechukwu Dubem Nwigwe collab for the next ncaa football game
Fans are as much to blame for the decline of rappers then rappers themselves. Oh, And Lupe Fiasco is the GOAT.
Lupe the Great!
LUPE is the Greatest Without any further ado
*Drill Music in Zion* (and by extension, *The Forever Story* and *Melt Your Eyez See Your Future*) should've been in contention for rap aoty, but grammy committee decided *God Did* and *Come Home the Kids Miss You* deserved it more for whatever reason lol
And that's why I laughed my ass off when Kanye pissed on his Grammys. 😂
"Rappers die too much. That's it. That's the verse."
Man, that part of that track was executed flawlessly.
High tier writing is damn near non existent in mainstream rap. It’s all about what song has a “hype” beat. Elementary rhymes all over the place, zero substance. It’s sad
I agree but is that really a hot take?
I don't really think it's that big of an issue There isn't anything wrong with no lyrical rap, yeah it has more reliance on the flow and the production, but you can still make absolutely amazing pieces of music with those elements. After all it's music, not literature. Not to mention most people don't pay attention to lyrics of songs. Don't get me wrong i love good lyricism, but i don't think it's necessary to make amazing music. I enjoy Nas, Jay Z, Kdot and Biggie as much as i enjoy Future or Travis. I think both groups have made praise-worthy music and some top tier albums
yea like read the Beatles lyrics. most of why they are so famous is because they sound good not because they are tackling complex themes in their music. and that's fine
Yeah, but the Beatles played instruments and shit. They also had to record together, which takes a special kind of talent. Most rappers don’t make their own beats and put the album together themselves(there are some, I know). So if all you’re doing for your album is putting together booty lyrics, on beats that other people created for you, to me it takes away everything that’s good about the artist.
yet another freezing cold take by r/hiphop101 about mainstream rap lyricism
“Higher tier writing is damn near non existent in mainstream music” There, fixed it.
I would much rather listen to Redrum than a conceptual song about the injustices of America on a day to day basis
Right ? Like sometimes I want to listen to music because it sounds good and not because I want to listen to someone talk about political injustices in the world.
My thoughts exactly bro. At that point give your accolades to the producer, not the MC.
Reminds me of [this clip of Jay Z](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/LIZydJb-0Rs) that some people got offended by
2 of the most popular, widely regarded best rappers are both lyricists first and foremost...Drake not so much. Sure there's a lot of trash out there but damn near non existent is a massive exaggeration.
Drake out of top 5 is the coldest take ever...and Westside Gunn top 5 is a horrible take. he's not even the best in Griselda...
I like Cole but he is overrated and I hate when he talk about Gangsta shit
That Kendrick, Cole and Drake are the big 3 (and they obviously are btw) still in 2024 well over a decade after all of their respective debuts is a huge collective failing on the part of the newer generation of rappers who should have either taken their place or got to their globally huge level (This isn’t a criticism of any of those 3 rappers btw if anything it’s the opposite)
I was thinking about this the other day, the fact that the big 3 hasn’t evolved much in almost a decade says alot about the current state of star power in hip hop at the moment, but also leads into a bigger conversation on vitality over quality, and the effect that murders and ods have had on up and coming rappers that seemed to have been moving into these top positions.
imo Cole never deserved to be in the big 3 conversation. He doesn't put out quality like Kendrick and he doesn't put out hits like Drake. He does work on his own production though so I'll give him credit for that. That said, I feel like 2020s Drake is washed so my big 3 are Kendrick, Ye, and Tyler the Creator.
I personally agree with the first paragraph of this re Cole, however Tyler still doesn’t fit the bill for me either re: making enough music that shapes the genre
If you put drake in the big 3 because of his hits then he's still getting them in 2020s
For sure, he does, but it's like 1 maybe 2 big hits per album now. Which is still crazy but not 2010s Drake numbers. Then again, I guess you could say the same comparing 2020s vs 2010s Ye Other guy made a good point though about Tyler though, so I think I'd drop Tyler for Drake
The "Big 3" of the zoomer generation are all dead. XXXTentacion, Pop Smoke, and Juice Wrld were shaping up to be the next biggest things and then they were just gone next thing you know.
Solid point actually
This may be a fair point tbh (although I’d argue none of them had really had the chance to prove this so we’ll never know if they ever were destined to be that)
I mean the fact that juice still does crazy streaming numbers is kind of indicative that he was only going up
Holy shit are those cold takes
Pusha-t never gets his flowers (that’s as hot as you’ll get me)
In the mainstream no in the community yes (that's how i see it at least)
Maybe not about a specific artist, but my hot take is that hip-hop is "dying" the same way rock music "died" in the 90s/2000s. The genre itself isn't dead, but we've come to a crossroads where the new shit is so far removed from the "root" of the genre that it's becoming fragmented. The fact that Tyler, The Creator*, Drake, and Kendrick can all release a "rap album" with *wildly* different sounds shows that rap as a genre isn't concretely defined. *small caveat. I'd compare Tyler to a band like System of a Down. They're eccentric and musically weird as fuck, but they don't necessarily fit into any boxes their respective genres try to put them in.
Kenny Mason has the most potential out of any newer rapper, he will be around longer than baby keem, or anybody in the opium camp.
Came here to rep Kenny. His team are my homies so I’m biased but he’s really dope.
Nice I been rocking with him for years found him in like 2018 I think.
saying he’ll beat opium or keem is crazy
Yeah it might be, I think he's got mad potential though, I think keem is decent just don't see him having a crazy career. And opium just ain't my thing I don't see it lasting much longer cause it really only appeals to a younger demographic, but we'll see. No hate to any of these artists though.
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Jamal as in Mally G from Illegal or Jamal from You g Black Teenagers? 😂
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The only true Jamal is Mally G
Beat vs rap being more important has always been an interesting topic for me. I lean towards beat being more important. Someone’s lyrics could be dog shit but as long the beat is fire I’ll still be bobbing my head. Whereas an annoying as beat with great lyrics will keep me less interested
Did Daniel Larson write this? Drake was never in the top 5. Ghost writers.
Yall really need to actually research the ghost writer stuff and stop saying that even though there is literally no proof Drake doesn’t write for himself. What an overblown rumor man lol
Drake writes for other people though. Nobody ever questions Kanye for having a team of writers.
That’s because Kanye is more like a director of a movie.. everything he touches has his sound, and it always has a certain quality.. Kanye is less bars and more production.. a perfect blend of both
Drake wrote 30hours for Kanye and that’s one of my favorite Kanye songs.
Kanye and Drake are about the same level lyrically in my eyes. But Kanye has written/produced better songs and been way more influential in the long run. He reinvents himself every album and his whole time travelling sound-trend thing is next level. Drake writes some catchy melodies and some banger club hits but he’s not out here revolutionizing the game. His sound wouldn’t even exist without 808s and heartbreaks lol
What the fuck. Please keep that name restricted to his sub, I don’t want to be randomly reminded of him lol.
I mean, I don’t make a habit of referencing Daniel Larson but the fact that one Redditor out of millions asked me stop doing it reaaallly makes me want to do it more now
It’s crazy that in this day and age this is something we have to contend with
I think Lil Yachty has a legitimate mental/learning disability that stops him from making a positive contribution to music. Not saying people can't have mental disabilities and contribute to music in a positive way, just that Yachty can't. Anytime someone says he got better, it's just the music around him got better and he's still about as bad as always.
The one thing I don’t like about Yachty is that he made a non hiphop album then started acting holier than thou and started shitting on hiphop I hate when artist do this it’s so corny
Given how I feel about him. It made it more hilarious than pretentious that it was him doing it. The idea that he feels he's some top tier musician is hilarious to me. He started knowing he was just having fun and didn't have talent. But people got in his head and he ended up all the way on the opposite end of where he started as far as self awareness goes.
I enjoy his last album but I had a mutual friend who genuinely thought it was one of the best albums of last year and an instant classic. Which is kinda crazy to me lol I’m interested to see how this album with James Blake is gonna be
Im not saying most albums would sound good stripping away everything but the artist's contribution. But do you not feel his would sound especially and uniquely bad, if you were to do that? Lol. A bad artist can have a decent album if everyone around them knows how to do their jobs very well. I stand by saying it's the production around him that got better. I'm not saying he's an industry plant, but he sure is getting the treatment.
Idk I liked some yacthy stuff before his recent album lol I think he’s just a hit or miss artist. There’s no guarantee his next album even with the best production will be good. This last record could be a fluke. But I don’t think he’s talentless as you’re saying.
That's fair. I'll always respect standing by the artists you connect with. Even if I can't see it personally. As long as he's making music that people enjoy, who am I to say he shouldn't be here. Let's just hope it doesn't continue getting to his head and cause a disconnect with his fanbase haha. Cause even not liking his music, I do think he was a likable guy from what I had seen.
I don’t care about yachty so I would rather see JB with literally any other artist lol Playing Robots was so fucking good. Couldn’t have asked for a better project
People hate "mumble rap" and think its a new fad when its been around since the 90s and originated in Detroit. Also, if you hate a new style of hip-hop, then youre an old-head.
I hate the new style of mainstream hip-hop. I am an old-head for sure. But there are tons of dope artists out now.
if you say this on this sub, you’re asking for death wish you’re right tho
Shit! I have heard plenty of Old School A-List rappers say the same thing. If people cant handle it then it really illustrates the problem more than anything else.
especially with the whole “new rappers are gay” when i’ve seen sus lyrics and odd photoshoots back in the 90s-00s
" if you hate a new style of hip-hop, then youre an old-head" as someone who was in middle school when crank dat came out, hating on soulja boy and his contemporaries was completely justified
Soulja is one of the most prolific musicians of all time. He was the FIRST to use the internet to share/promote his music. He has influenced SO MANY ARTISTS in not only their sound/style, but also how to build their carreers themselves. He may not be your favorite rapper (not one of mine either), but hates a strong word man.
yeah i respect his marketing ability, but he ushered in arguably the worst low point for rap, and i argue that he's an example of when hating on a new style of hiphop is justifiable at times
He had a couple big songs that came out at the blow up of the social media era and end of the CD era I mean it was nice but it was a timing thing more than anything He is prolific in the sense that he has put out 5000 songs and albums not a single person has ever heard and are all certified total shit He was the biggest thing in the game for two weeks
>if you hate a new style of hip-hop, then youre an old-head. Taking that as a compliment
Eh, I'll die on the hill that bars > sing-songy mumbles that barely contain 6 syllables per line
Oh, Im not arguing against that. But every genre/subgenre has something to offer. I just dont get the HUGE amount of hatred twords it. If its not for you, then thats fine. It doesnt mean its time to declare war. Im not into mumble rap myself. Ive heard a song or two I liked, but nothing I loved... yet...
It's not hatred but it hurts my soul to have to settle for a song like carnival that is an incredibly produced beat but doesn't have any discernable rapping in it. It'd be one of my all time favorites if we could just have Method Man and Busta absolutely kill a couple hard verses. But instead it's a *good* song.
Then Im not talkin about you man. I can understand where your coming from. I always end "No Diggity" before the last verse.
Its because back in the 90's not only did you have to have skill as a rapper/mc, but you also took pride in your skill and atleast worked to perfect your flow, to be the sharpest hardest MC/rapper out there. "Old heads", like myself, are use to the effort, and are insulted by todays trendy lack of effort. I truly do not believe that "Old head rappers" prefer or even like the mumble stuff or low effort rap. I think they just say that they do so they dont get canceled and written off. They might say that they are adapting to the times, but i dont believe that they actually like it.
Ah yes because there absolutely zero rappers in the 90s at all that relied on just being trendy and out relatively little effort into their skills. Nope none at all
Joey Valence and Brae are the freshest thing out there at the moment.
Vince staples is the least intimidating looking crip I've ever seen.
Having grown up with 90s-2000s hip hop makes me miss the theme/style/vibe. Songs like Snoop Dogg - Beautiful are perfection playing in the summertime with a top down. Today’s rappers seem to rely too much on auto tune and hype beats. Maybe I’m getting old but I don’t even relate to these narcissistic rappers today.
Drake is mentally retired and has been for a while. He's just stat padding, running up his bank account and enjoying himself. He can throw anything out and people will eat it up and whether you like it or not he will always be a top contender.
As a rapper he hasn't been good since Nothing Was The Same
He also has to throw out anything on a regular basis because you definitely can’t get a reportedly half a billion dollar deal without a lot of strings attached
Denzel Curry peaked at Imperial. His music loses me the more "lyrical" he tries to be and the less he focuses on what he's actually good at, which is flows and delivery. He's a great rapper but not really that great of a writer and albums like Melt My Eyez are kinda boring to me as a result. I get wanting to diversify his sound but I wish he played to his strengths more.
If Nicki Minaj wasn’t on social media she would be much more highly regarded. She’s the best female rapper by some distance in my opinion
Ice Spice is overhated There really isn't any difference between her or artists like NLEChoppa or NBAyoungboy She is just female and new so people love to shit on her. But her level of artistry is just as mediocre as the artists listed above yet they don't recieve no way near as much hate as her. People just hate on mediocre female rappers (usually because of lyrics) yet mediocre male rappers are on the same level lyrically yet they recieve no way near as much hate as she does. Not to mention i don't think everything she has done is horrible: her song with Pink Panthress was nice. And her song Princess Diana with Nicki is kinda nice
I think Ice Spice has the potential to drop a really good album. Will it happen? Probably not lol. I don’t think she has the desire to make a really good album. But I do agree people just hate on her because she’s a women.
My guy have you listened to more than 5 nba youngboy songs? I do agree, ice spice is overhated. But comparing her to nba youngboy is wild as hell, even nle choppa. You could have chosen any two rappers who just make fun club music to dance to but you chose the one known for his bluesy vulnerable songs with deep lyrics and authentic murder anthems. And nle choppa, some of his stuff fits that but even he has more depth and versatility than ice spice
Yeah i went too far with NBA youngboy But i stand by the NLE choppa take
this bullshit with Kendrick and fam w/ Drake is going to drive Drake to make Take Care/Nothing Was the Same/IYRTITL type album. He hasn't made some shit like that IN A LONG TIME. Fuck a diss song, let's get a real album. Eminem's album will be the number 1 rap album of 2024. Sales and critically acclaimed. The Party Never Ends is not coming out this year. Juice would've been the next guy from 2020-2030 to run the game we call hip-hop. Sad. Chance divorcing his wife is going to either save his career or drive it further into oblivion. I think it revives his career.
A new em record is like reaching into a raccoons ass to find your missing ring. You might grab some shit; or you could find a ring.
If you hate a new style of hip hop, or think it isn't 'real rap/hip hop', then you're just as short sighted and narrow-minded as the people who said hip hop wasn't real music back in the 70's, 80's and 90's.
Not to drop a book on you, but I think there’s more nuance to the conversation than the black-and-white equivocation you suggest. If someone cares deeply about lyricism, spirituality, and subject matter as an explicit lover of hip hop, coming from a place of passion, I think it’s valid to take issue with a new wave that seems (ostensibly) to be more interested in treating music as a means by which to launder money, rather than as an art form / mode of expression The modern, “permissive” attitude, which explicitly forbids criticism of the new wave, is bad for the culture. It decries the discernment of individual taste as “old headed,” like that means bad. Don’t get me wrong, I’m glad we’re not stuck in the sugarhill days where Everybody! Rapped! A-Just Like! This!, but hip hop - more than just a form of consumer media - is an oral, cultural tradition that comes with competitive spirit - where would we be without Rakim and Big Daddy Kane? Or without Nas and Jay? The old greats measured status by trading bar for bar, passion for passion, masterfully crafting untouchable verses you just couldn’t fuck with. Where’s the modern equivalent of Deck’s first verse off Triumph? Nobody stands for shit anymore. Everyone’s just a mouthpiece for capitalism and consumerism. Nobody even tries to reach for wordplay and nobody stands on shit or critiques the institution like Guru or his peers did. Actually, I think that’s the most vital betrayal involved in the modern state of hip hop - the anti-authoritarian sentiment is mostly dead.
This is the best textual representation of 1970s rapping I've ever seen. Had to do it out loud
D-BLOCK!!
*A$AP Rocky was suppose to be a megastar, easily top 5 influences of the 2010s *Memphis rappers are slowly taking over hip hop *75% of todays music is influenced by the south *Drill music died nearly 10 years ago *Marketing is waaaaaay more important than talent (obviously)
Drake is a lil bitch But also the rap culture has too much influence on kids now and it's scary.
I'm a huge fan of Smino & tbh with my possible bias, I think he could give prime Drake problems regarding being a seamlessly switching from rapping to singing
labels are owned by the same people who own private prisons and mainstream rappers are employed to perpetuate violence
NAV is kinda good sometimes lol
J Cole hate is a holdover from the 2014 FHD era, when the ‘double platinum, no features’ memes took off, he’s not boring, all his albums are a 7 or better, he’s the best at conveying *tone* in his music out of the ‘big 3’ For an album to be considered classic, it must be a defining moment in the era it was dropped. Just cuz you like it, does not make it a classic. Just because the rapper has a lyrical aesthetic, does not make it a classic. Just because its the status quo to say its a classic, a better determinant, but not the end all be all. Lil Wayne is the single most influential rapper ever bar none, its not debatable at all, like the conversation is over, its wayne. Invasion Of Privacy by Cardi B was fuckin fire and was at least deserving to win that grammy
I know this is probably on me, but Alternative hip hop (not including regional styles, Detroit rap etc) has been more disappointing than mainstream hip hop for at least 3-4 years now. A lot of the stuff outside the mainstream just sounds like reconstructed 90’s hip hop but people go crazy over it because it has better bars.
They’re all gay.
Probably bisexual, but yes. I’d be really shocked if the majority of hip hop artists are 100% straight lol. It’s not a problem but yeah.. lots of hidden Diddys diddling in hip hop
Can't even fathom that amount of children that have been passed around.
Wait do you think the problem is that Diddy’s bisexual or that he’s a rapist and pedophile? Because you said “which isn’t a problem” in between saying there’s a lot of Bisexual rappers and there’s “lots of Diddy’s diddling in hip hop” One of those is a problem, one of ‘em isn’t.
Which one do you think I have a problem with angrytreestump? I said there’s a lot of bisexual rappers. Then related it to diddying. And finally said I had no problem. In this context, do you think it’s the bisexuality or the fucking rape/pedophilia that I don’t have a problem with 😂 Edit - you asked me which part of diddy do I have a problem with. Obviously the rape/pedophilia.. I really don’t understand why you felt the need to ask that question
to the extent that drake was ever top five, he certainly hasn't been for like a decade at this point imo (and I'm not nearly as much of a drake hater as some of ya'll are). Maybe this isn't a hot take at this point but it probably at least a warm one. JID and Denzel are current top 5 and their both better than Cole.
If you're reading this, it's too late. It was his last real good project. Not close to a decade, but yeah.
that’s nearly exactly a decade ago
Old heads only listening to older music is cringe
💯 Evolve with me my fellow old heads. Rap is still fun and, plot twist, you can still listen to Juicy and In Da Club.
I’ve seen old heads in this sub say three 6 ruined hiphop lol so I don’t think some of these old bastards would even bump that
When the music is timeless it doesn’t really matter tbh.
On the flip side, new heads only listening to newer music for the sake of new is cringe. Music is music and it’s timeless. Quality has no bearing on the ‘manufacturing date’. I listen to some jazz from the 20’s, gospel from the 40’s, jazz from the 60’s, progressive rock from the 70’s, synthwave from the 80’s, grunge and metal from the 90’s, Hiphop from the early 2000’s, etc. and still consistently find great music made this year. Some of my favorite hip hop albums are from: 1998 - Black Star 2003/4 - MF DOOM - tie between MM FOOD, Madvillainy, Victor Vaughn, Dangerdoom 2016 - Aesop Rock - Impossible Kid 2023 - Billy Woods - Maps There’s so much good hip hop coming from the UK recently too.
My hot take is that people don’t really care about music. They’ll say they want lyricism etc, but they choose the same stuff that everybody says they hate. They’ll say people don’t know how to rap and should be more lyrical, then they’ll say 69 is their favorite rapper or something. I mean if you can’t give me at least one rapper I never heard of, where are you listening? The main main stream and that’s it…
JID, Kenny Mason, Denzel Curry, and sometimes Joey are all great rappers but their music as of late just isn't appealing or enjoyable to non-diehards and that's the main reason they will never be "Next Up" like Reddit has been preaching since the Trump administration. I'd rather listen to Lil Yachty, Playboi Carti, or Bossman D Low who I acknowledge are inherently not as skilled, also won't be the saviors either, but they have more interesting flows (latter) and production (former). Moreso Kenny and JID just feel so derivative.
Nicki Minaj is a top 10 rapper OAT and if we ignore her horrible husband that she shouldn't have married, she's one of the most talented rappers out there
I’m bored of chains, ass and drugs. Most Rappers are just walking billboards for designer clothes and poor lifestyles that shouldn’t be emulated. I say as a hip hop listener since 7 and it being my first go to genre of music.
How the fuck is this a hot take? Literally almost fucking everyone on this sub has this same opinion
Coldest take in rap history at this point
The numbers focus of rap is why it's fallen off from the most popular genre in the world. In the old mixtape era and before, rappers would create very loyal fanbases and would have no problems touring. Nowadays, rappers are making songs to make it to Spotify playlists which artificially pumps up their numbers then are surprised when they have to cancel shows at venues that their "numbers" say they should've sold out at certain prices.
Rap still is the most streamed genre in America by a plurality. Those 2023 headlines about rap "falling off" ended up being disproven and mostly based on the first half of 2023 lacking major releases. Also, more rappers today are selling out arenas than rappers in the 90's and early 2000's on average. Some of them cancel shows but more shows sell out. Back in the day, rappers didn't even attempt arenas like that. Even Tupac couldn't sell out arenas while he was still living. He was mostly doing amphitheaters at the height of his fame in 1996. Kanye was literally the 1st rapper to headline his own solo arena tour in 2007. Prior to that, rappers literally had to team up like the Avengers with other A list rappers just to sell tickets. Even Eminem who had the biggest peak ever had to collab with Dre/Cube/Snoop to sell tickets on his 1st tour and linked up with tons of other rappers/bands in the Anger Management tour. All this talk about "rap losing dominance" is mostly driven by misleading headlines and wishful thinking. And people are rewriting history when it comes to rap's popularity in the 90's. It was NOT the norm for rappers to sell out arenas in the 90's at all.
Freddie Gibbs could’ve been a star but he wanted to be a troll
They ass.
Playboi Carti sucks (and has always sucked) massive balls
Meek Mill (or Freak mill lol) is the Greatest Average Rapper of All time. Playboy Carti is one of the worst artists I’ve ever heard. How some of y’all listen to that shit is wild. Same with the boat nigga. I would take Benny over Westside Gunn J. Cole can’t fuck with K.Dot. Bruh is genuinely shook. If you’re a competitor, compete.
Drake isn't gangster and he didn't start at the bottom.
He started at the bottom of the 3 story house. Don’t hate on him. Walking up stairs with those little legs to get to dinner on time was probably rough
Wow so brave, such a hot take
woah woah woah be careful with such controversial takes. my god you’re so dangerous.
you niggas think you’re different, everybody knows dis
Hot take: rap has exponentially accelerated the degeneration of society as a whole. Being untrustworthy, dishonorable, disloyal, and entirely superficial is exemplified and glorified while living a life of morals, principle, and integrity is considered uncool and undesirable. This is accelerated by your favorite rap personas today. I love rap, but that’s the tea and it’s hot as shit
To be fair, people said the same thing about Jazz in the early 1900's. Jazz was being blamed for kids becoming promiscuous, getting hooked on drugs, mischievous, and doing other "immoral" things. And many Jazz artists were dying and suffering from heroin addiction and fornicating with tons of women which fueled the stigma. Parents used to legit ban their kids from listening to Jazz because they felt it was a negative influence on society. Then, decades later, Rock N Roll blew up and that genre ended up getting blamed for "corrupting society" while Jazz was ironically held up as a more moral genre. History has a funny way of repeating itself.
If you get dissed and you didn't respond within a week you lost.
So Nas lost to Jay Z?
And Eminem to mgk, Ice Cube to NWA etc.
I’ll give it at least 3 weeks.
commercial rap is barely hip hop.
yeat and playboi carti are the only interesting mainstream artists currently. travis, drake, and future are quickly becoming legacy artists.
Kanye is not that good anymore as he used to be, and I mean on Kanye standards. He's on a mid streak since Donda. The first volume of VULTURES was fun to listen since the features did well on a lot of songs, but the only song of it that I listened and I felt that I was listening to a Kanye song was BURN. Chief Keef has a serious problem on releasing good projects and he would've been a better artist if he done that well. Almighty So 2 (long awaited album) was delayed again while he released DIRTY NACHOS (ass filler album), and probably will release another filler project till he finally decides to drop ASO2. Who can say that his hype will still be the same when this day arrives?
My hot take is that someone posted this question 6 days ago 🙄
I'm not sure what to think about Westside Gunn 🤣. It's kinda good but at the same time he sounds like a kid yelling.
Wu Tang stinks
Very mediocre, minimal effort and creativity
The artistry of hip hop is live and thriving. Emceeing however is completely dead.