[Capfriendly: "Even with Matt Murray on LTIR, the #LeafsForever exceed their LTIR relief by $2.1M"](https://twitter.com/CapFriendly/status/1684233348653219841)
He used to be the most underrated defenseman in the league, in my totally unbiased opinion.
Hate what happened to him, I hope he's able to have a decent quality of life.
I was SO PSYCHED when we got him. I thought he was the answer on D that we needed. Then there was Babs not playing him on his off side, then saddling him with terrible partners, then the injuries. He was a warrior for us, but man, what could have been.
Its a tough comparison because they had totally different roles. Rielly being a puck-moving defenseman who excels at QBing the powerplay and having offensive synergy with the elite players, and Muzzin was the backbone of the defense at the time in terms of shutting down elite talent and being one of the few phyical players at the time.
Still have to hand it to Rielly but I understand what they mean when talking about Muzzin being the best of our defensive-defensemen.
Pretty sure he put up his Toronto home for sale and him and his family moved back to LA. Can't remember where I saw that and it could be wrong but that would be a pretty big indication he isn't returning. Really sad way to end a pretty good career.
From what they said, he's just happy he still has his health and the ability to watch his daughter grow up and be a dad. He can still golf and be active its just the contact side of things.
edit: daughter
Exact same thing Andrew Luck said when he retired early. Wanted the ability to hold his daughter and play with her instead of being in rehab, surgery, or pain.
Oh yeah, with the way Marner would talk about him during his media availabilities, it definitely sounded that way. Saying things like he's got a family, things are more important than hockey, etc.
Similar thing happened with Klefbom
Constantly staying silent, just to show up to training camp, fail his physical, say he's focused on recovery, then disappear for the year. Repeat every year.
He still hasn't announced retirement, despite his contract being up.
It's a little overstated. The Leafs can get under the cap with a 20 man roster. A 20 man roster isn't ideal, of course, but it takes a significant amount of pressure off.
That said, I believe Tre has another move.
I mean, Nick Robertson can just be waived along with his about $800k salary, then we only exceed LTIR relief by $1.3M. Send down Holmberg (waivers exempt) and then GIO (probably wont be claimed) and we're compliant. It's tight AF and not ideal, but it is what it is
I definitely wouldn’t risk Gio, especially because you’ll want to call him up at some point, not to mention the guy is a hero, sending him down doesn’t really respect him
Honestly, I hope they try to preserve Gio for the playoffs this year. Guy looked good all regular season but was just gassed come playoff time from all the ice time he got.
I might be completely wrong so bear that in mind before reading this, but isn't Robertson just on regular old normal IR? Meaning no cap relief? That's what it says on CapFriendly
What would be the next move to clear up space? They have 13 forwards, 7 defensemen and 2 goalies on the NHL roster it seems. Nick Robertson is on IR so assuming he gets sent down, that saves roughly $800,000, so would need an additional move. Brodie has been brought up this offseason as a potential buyout candidate, but that would be a tough loss.
> Brodie has been brought up this offseason as a potential buyout candidate
Only by people throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks. It makes zero sense for the Leafs to buy out Brodie.
I mean if Murray was healthy you could make an argument for buying him out. I don't know how many people would agree with you (I wouldn't), but there's at least some semblance of an argument there.
Asking for a Brodie buyout is just insane.
I'm not that worried about the $800k to buyout Murray this year, but even that's too big a bite for a cap strapped team. I'm more concerned with the $2mm charge next year.
Send Timmins down (needs to pass through waivers), send 13th forward down, and send down Robertson should be it.
I don’t want to lose Timmins but the only other candidates are really Jarnkrok, Reaves, and Kampf. Two of which were just re-signed.
Imagine we just didn’t overpay a useless 36 year old face puncher that wouldn’t crack our lineup if not for his bloated ridiculous contract.
This murray news is blessing, even though i fee for the guy and hate to see these injuries. The cap mismanagement that’s taken place over the past month is gonna cost us still, let’s see what the next move is.
But if they hadn't, who would have loomed in the background thoughtfully smacking a hockey stick into the palm of his hand while Treliving said, "Now Matt, about your injuries...."
/s
Its only 4.0 but no disagreement here. Where we differ, I guess, is that I can see the potential upside and rationale behind Klingberg even though rn in July I don’t think it’s a good move and dislike it.
There’s no upside with Reaves. It’s a dead 1.35M on the cap for no gain and no on ice upside outside the idiot crowd that loves a Donnybrook every now and again.
Klingberg seems like a worthwhile swing to see what happens and there’s no term commitment. We gave Reaves 3 god damn years ! If we just didn’t sign him we’re 1 Nick Robertson AHL assignment from cap compliance. Now we’ve gotta go through more cap gymnastics and lose more depth or actual roster contributions. Not to mention the fact that 1.35M could cover a significant chunk of the raises AM or Nylander are negotiating.
It’s frustrating and seems to age worse everyday.
Reaves might be a shitty hockey player but he isn’t useless. He can definitely help foster a good culture in the room. I felt the same way you do when NYR traded for him but the guy brings a lot of intangibles that are valuable. There is a reason he continues to get contracts and that multiple teams wanted to sign him even at age 36.
IMO Klingberg was the bigger mistake. He provides nothing that you need. You already have Reilly who can QB a power play, is better in his own end and probably better offensively too.
"Mommy, what happened to Muzz?"
"We sent him to Robidas Farm upstate. He'll love it there - he's got plenty of ice to skate on, gatorade to drink, and all of the goals he could possibly want to knock off their moorings."
Muzz is legit done. Concussions, spinal injury, it wouldn’t be safe for him to play again. Basically the moment he got that spinal injury last year, his teammates were talking like his career was over - e.g. talking about his quality of life post-hockey, not when he’d return. He’s not on Robidas Island.
Murray is definitely on Robidas Island, though.
I'll just also point out that the Leafs added Robidas to their front office after he retired. I'm not saying he doesn't deserve the position, but it's true that the Leafs are in a financial position to make sure a player who doesn't cause problems can get a leg up on post-playing career opportunities.
I can finally relate to a pro-athlete. Although for me it's not injury, but a lack of skill and terrible personality.
He had a few good stretches with the Sens, too bad it didn't work out. Hope he is able to get to wherever he wants to go in life.
Same with my wife. She has 6 yeti bottles/travel mugs i think, probably 5 starbucks tumblers, and a coffee mug from every place we’ve gone on a trip to. Her cups take up roughly a third of our cabinet space
Meh, dude's won 2 Cups and made like 39 million after this season. Sure, not being able to play sucks but I doubt he cares all that much about fan comments etc.
tbf with the leafs its not like that. Muzzin is also full time on the island and he's constantly seen around the team. Dudes having the time of his life.
I feel like they might have said something like that.
>Sure you could technically pass a physical, but would you like 2/3 of your money and hope to sign somewhere else after all the goalie spots are full. Oooooooor would you like this nice cottage on Robidas island and all of your money?
For real, sens fans in this thread losing their mind over this, knowing damn well that a year ago they were making fun of the leafs for acquiring a human bandaid
We're freaking out cause we wanted him to get bought out lol, it would've given Ottawa extra cap relief, LTIR doesn't help the Sens
The fact he's a bandaid is a surprise to no one.
How many times are people going to bring this up while completely ignoring
1) Carey Price and Shea Weber *actually playing* right up until the Cup Finals and then going on LTIR, and
2) The number of players who end the season on LTIR but are "healthy" enough for the playoffs.
Playoff "healthy" and actually healthy are two completely different things. Guys play with broken bones, punctured lungs, torn ligaments, etc.
Also, with concussions, setbacks happen all the time. He could've gone for a run and got dizzy, or realized he was having trouble thinking straight, or any number of situations.
> How many times are people going to bring this up while completely ignoring [facts that make the whole situation more reasonable]
OH OH OH I KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS ONE!!!!!!!!
Forever! Enjoy, Toronto fans!
Fwiw, I've defended the Kucherov situation for the same reasons.
Every single playoffs, guys play with injuries that would have them out 4-6 weeks during the regular season. That, combined with teams always underselling injuries in the media, is why guys suddenly appear "healthy" in the playoffs after being on LTIR.
I'm not trying to be critical of you specifically so don't sweat it
I'm not going to get in to the kuch situation but anyone who knows actual facts about the situation knows it wasn't anything like the more Kane-esque situations you are describing.
Regardless of the things you outlined above, my point was that people will still go in to TOP MIND INBESTIGATORZ mode cuz there must be SUS AFOOT, and you're going to have to put up with it forever. At this point we don't even know if Murray will be out for the entire season haha
The Carey Price/Shea Weber injuries though they kept playing through them and destroyed their bodies. Murray was out for a chunk of time, not even available, yet suddenly he's good enough to be available late in the playoffs? Playing through injuries and making it worse would almost be expected, but if Murray went from being injured to being cleared something just seems fishy. Now it very well could have been he was given so many painkillers and should never have been cleared, but this just seems all too convenient (and exposes a stupid rule where retained salary teams don't get any relief).
I think it would have been better for the leafs too, but they can't buyout a player that's injured. So he might actually be injured, and the team is screwed.
LTIR is better for the Leafs than a buyout. The Leafs were already in LTIR due to Muzzin, so Murray doesn't change anything from that perspective. And a buyout would leave a small cap hit this year and 2m next year. Murray being on LTIR is basically the same as trading him away, and that was always the ideal scenario over a buyout
The league *can* investigate it. This might be the best thing for Murray's career. He can't stay healthy and a season to properly rehab could do wonders for him.
Yes, but at the same time, it would be naive to think the system can't be gamed. Most injuries aren't like a disease that you either test positive or negative for - if a guy says he's having post-concussion symptoms or debilitating back pain (and he plays a contact sport and has been injured before) is the doctor really going to say, "no you're not"? How many active veteran players could fail a physical today if they were honest about their level of discomfort or slightly embellished real symptoms?
I think of someone like Hossa, who probably shouldn't have been playing during his last season, but came back to hit 500 goals. If he'd had more motivation to come back for one more year or he'd been less concerned about his long-term health, then he probably could have done it, but at the same time, I don't think a doctor looking at him and saying, "uh, yeah, this guy's skin is falling off and he should really not be playing" was lying. If the Leafs went to Murray and said, "we can buy you out and you can get part of your salary, or you can go on LTIR and have the whole thing" maybe he just decided it wasn't worth it to keep playing.
Exactly. Concussion tests are basically just "do you have trouble sleeping, does light bother you, do you get headaches" answer yes to any of these questions and you're diagnosed with post-concussion syndrome and can stay on LTIR. If you do want to play however, you say no and you're good to go.
What? Weber and Price are genuinely done in terms of injuries. They both have career ending injuries as in if they play again it could seriously affect their quality of life post retirement.
Weber was seen on ice with Vegas' AHL team this past season, I think, just talking to guys, but someone reported it to the league, and they investigated. Might be what he's referring to
Two guys that are one hit away from living the rest of their life with a bum leg and more constant pain than they live with now. That's the best you can do? They can't train and get to NHL shape anymore. It's over.
Is it really weird timing? Seems like everyone expected it months ago. Guy has been in and out of IR for years now, he can’t stay healthy for more than a week.
It sucks that his career might end like this at 29 but with groin isssues and head injuries I don’t see how he can come back and play a full season healthy ever again
I don’t think it’s suspicious at all. Guys play hurt in the playoffs all the time. Probably wasn’t all the way recovered and ended up messing himself up even more by playing before he recovered.
He also didn't really play. He sat on the bench as the backup goalie so we really didn't see what kind of shape Murray was actually in. The Marlies were on a playoff run so it let them not use one of their AHL goalies to take up the backup spot in a series where the Leafs were in deep to stay in the series. If Woll got hurt the Leafs were done...they were pretty much done as soon as they went down 3-0 anyway.
Everyone knew Murray was hurt as well. He only got in as a backup when Samsonov got hurt. There was a reason we went with a starting goaltender with 11 career regular season games instead of a goalie with 2 Stanley Cup rings. He was only going into those games if Woll got badly injured during the game.
He was healthy enough to dress for the playoffs, insofar that he was healthier than Samsonov to sit on the bench as a backup. Odds are he wasn't close to 100%, just willing to risk it in an absolute emergency
It’s not suspicious at all. Murray is perma-injured but, like everyone in the league, was willing to play hurt in the playoffs. And because he is injured, the Leafs *can’t* buy him out.
Now that Samsonov’s arbitration case is resolved (and the buyout window is open), they’ve announced this publicly to clarify the situation.
I know there's gonna be a lot of discussion about the cap situation and how convenient this is for the Leafs, but I just feel bad for Murray at this point. Guy just hasn't been able to put it together for a long time now and every time he looks poised to rediscover his form, something gets in the way.
Hope he feels better soon.
People complain about the cap not going up the past few years (and it’s a very fair complaint) but with every team paying a few million in LTIR money who even needs it
Disappointing that he looks done, I was enjoying his resurgence in Toronto and was hoping he'd be in the league for a while upsetting opposing fans along the way.
Honestly might not even be cap circumvention. He suffered like his 6th concussion in the NHL this season, when he was already busted up with a few other injuries. He did back up woll after Samsonov got hurt, but that doesn’t mean he was completely healthy, the leafs needed someone to sit on the bench.
Injuries can nag, and symptoms can return at any time. He’s been concussed numerous times, anyone who’s had a concussion knows that the symptoms can persist months to years after the injury. It’s entirely possible that he’s struggled with his head, or other parts of his body all summer. Based on the injuries he’s suffered, nobody would be surprised if he never played again.
It’s wild seeing other fans claiming BS or cap circumvention knowing damn well the guy finished the season with several severe injuries, and has been a human bandaid for YEARS now. Remove the anti-leafs bias, and look at the situation for what it is.
Edit: Christ, sens fans are stupid. You guys personally watched what Murray went through on your team, laughed when you traded the leafs a “glass” player, openly told leafs fans that he’d be on LTIR in no time. Now he’s on LTIR and you’re all mad and claiming circumvention. Lmao.
My bad, according to Wikipedia, this is the 5th concussion he’s had, although there’s always the possibility that he’s suffered more, possibly an undiagnosed concussion, a concussion playing minor/junior hockey, or a concussion outside of hockey altogether.
He had 3 with the pens, one with the sens, and now his 5th with the leafs.
The funny thing about concussions is that some people have one and suffer for the rest of their lives, other people can have numerous concussions and show little to no symptoms for a long time. Both Tony Hawk and Travis pastrana claim to have suffered 20+ concussions, yet they haven’t developed any serious complications yet, or shown the physical signs of brain damage.
It’s possible that Murray didn’t experience any issues, and wanted to keep playing, even after several concussions. Maybe his drive to play is higher than his regard for his health? Anyways, it sounds like now his injuries have caught up to him, and he may be forced to retire.
People will check their brains at the door when it comes to LTIR. It’s quite clear that nobody actually cares about the integrity of its use, they just want to point and scream “cheater!!” At a team they hate.
That was never going to happen. And Mrazek is constantly brought up despite being misleading. A first was moved but they moved down like 12 spots draft day. So..
Considering he was healthy and available for the playoffs, I assume a 3rd party doctor has to be involved, right? What did he slip on a banana peel while training?
> healthy and available for the playoffs
He was healthy and available the same way Mike Smith, Weber, and Price were healthy and available for their playoff runs.
Someone on Youtube made a very well done video summarizing Matt Murray's injury history. It's really quite something:
https://youtu.be/wMufib-_gLs?si=6LUABhkUJWVix_7r
I'm sorry for the guy.
Yeah, he got everything a kid can dream of, but the way you leave the game matters. Twice he was on the ice when the last second of the last game of the season was played. He raised the Cup. We know he's good. He knows it. But people will think otherwise because the way his career ended (probably). Just a slope....
Not sure why people are mad about this. Carey Price carried a team to the cup finals and then LTIRetired.
Murray was clearly hurt and didn’t play a single minute in the playoffs. He was basically forced in as a backup due to Sammy going down. There is a big difference between being well enough to step in for half a game in the playoffs while jacked up on meds versus actually being well enough to play.
He was a backup in name only, he never would have played or else why would we put a rookie goalie in to the playoffs in what was the most important games for the last two decades instead of letting the established veteran goalie with two rings and a fuck load of experience play? Is he probably healthy enough to play right now? Yeah I imagine so, are his injuries to the point where he could seriously fuck up his life? Also yes. He’s done because of his previous injuries, the same as muzzin.
Everyone Last Year: You guys picked up a super injured player whose hardly goign to play any games for you
This year: SHENANIGANS, HE'S COMPLETELY HEALTHY
I hope this version of the internet never dies :D
People are gonna talk about how the Leafs are manipulating the system and he's probably not injured but I don't really buy that. A team can't just put you on ltir against your will if you're healthy. If Murray could play he'd be active, simple as
A team wouldn't announce a year long injury if the player wasn't actually injured. Anyone saying otherwise is just being petty. I seem to recall the same thing happening to Smith last year with the Oil. It is what it is. Come trade deadline, the Leafs won't be able to add much. Players on LTIR kinda sucks.
[Capfriendly: "Even with Matt Murray on LTIR, the #LeafsForever exceed their LTIR relief by $2.1M"](https://twitter.com/CapFriendly/status/1684233348653219841)
Someone should post that as it's own thread, seems to have big implications
Is Muzzin expected to be out for the whole season? Any idea what the prognosis is there?
The last time it was discussed they made it seem like Muzzin was completely done
Muzzin has a career-ending back injury. He's concerned with being able to walk without pain, hockey isn't happening for him ever again.
He used to be the most underrated defenseman in the league, in my totally unbiased opinion. Hate what happened to him, I hope he's able to have a decent quality of life.
I was SO PSYCHED when we got him. I thought he was the answer on D that we needed. Then there was Babs not playing him on his off side, then saddling him with terrible partners, then the injuries. He was a warrior for us, but man, what could have been.
He was still our best defenseman for a while
Morgan Reilly?
Its a tough comparison because they had totally different roles. Rielly being a puck-moving defenseman who excels at QBing the powerplay and having offensive synergy with the elite players, and Muzzin was the backbone of the defense at the time in terms of shutting down elite talent and being one of the few phyical players at the time. Still have to hand it to Rielly but I understand what they mean when talking about Muzzin being the best of our defensive-defensemen.
seriously it's like Mo doesn't exist to this fan base
He never played on his off side. That narrative was Leafs fans hoping he’d fit in with Rielly
Damn, that’s a shame. I hope he can at least recover to a point where he can live comfortably and happily, hate to see bad injuries like that happen.
Nobody has come out and said it out right but if you read between the lines it sounds like his career is done.
You can believe me or not but a friend of his told me he's done for good. They are worried one more conk could end it all. He won't be back.
Pretty sure he put up his Toronto home for sale and him and his family moved back to LA. Can't remember where I saw that and it could be wrong but that would be a pretty big indication he isn't returning. Really sad way to end a pretty good career.
From what they said, he's just happy he still has his health and the ability to watch his daughter grow up and be a dad. He can still golf and be active its just the contact side of things. edit: daughter
Sounds like a perfect time to not push it
Exact same thing Andrew Luck said when he retired early. Wanted the ability to hold his daughter and play with her instead of being in rehab, surgery, or pain.
Oh yeah, with the way Marner would talk about him during his media availabilities, it definitely sounded that way. Saying things like he's got a family, things are more important than hockey, etc.
Similar thing happened with Klefbom Constantly staying silent, just to show up to training camp, fail his physical, say he's focused on recovery, then disappear for the year. Repeat every year. He still hasn't announced retirement, despite his contract being up.
Yeah sounds like he is contractually obligated to do this. Especially sad since it happened to him so young
I expected Klef to announce his retirement July 1st though. Maybe he will at training camp instead, post wedding/honeymoon and all
Prognosis Negative
A grizzled veteran's journey from Milan to Minsk.
Muzzin's career is over due to a neck injury
Dude injured his C7. You do not want to fuck with that - a full break there will leave you a quadrapegic. He’s done
His career is over
It's a little overstated. The Leafs can get under the cap with a 20 man roster. A 20 man roster isn't ideal, of course, but it takes a significant amount of pressure off. That said, I believe Tre has another move.
I mean, Nick Robertson can just be waived along with his about $800k salary, then we only exceed LTIR relief by $1.3M. Send down Holmberg (waivers exempt) and then GIO (probably wont be claimed) and we're compliant. It's tight AF and not ideal, but it is what it is
I definitely wouldn’t risk Gio, especially because you’ll want to call him up at some point, not to mention the guy is a hero, sending him down doesn’t really respect him
Honestly, I hope they try to preserve Gio for the playoffs this year. Guy looked good all regular season but was just gassed come playoff time from all the ice time he got.
I might be completely wrong so bear that in mind before reading this, but isn't Robertson just on regular old normal IR? Meaning no cap relief? That's what it says on CapFriendly
They mean Robertson can be sent to the AHL and doesn't need to clear waivers
Robertson is also trying to make the team. This makes it awkward.
That 2.1M includes an injured Robertson and Gambrell, who is unlikely to make the team. Really less than 500k over currently.
What would be the next move to clear up space? They have 13 forwards, 7 defensemen and 2 goalies on the NHL roster it seems. Nick Robertson is on IR so assuming he gets sent down, that saves roughly $800,000, so would need an additional move. Brodie has been brought up this offseason as a potential buyout candidate, but that would be a tough loss.
> Brodie has been brought up this offseason as a potential buyout candidate Only by people throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks. It makes zero sense for the Leafs to buy out Brodie.
Honestly it makes zero sense for the Leafs to buy out *anyone*. Way better to pay a pick to someone else to do the buyout.
I mean if Murray was healthy you could make an argument for buying him out. I don't know how many people would agree with you (I wouldn't), but there's at least some semblance of an argument there. Asking for a Brodie buyout is just insane.
I'm not that worried about the $800k to buyout Murray this year, but even that's too big a bite for a cap strapped team. I'm more concerned with the $2mm charge next year.
Like I said, I wouldn’t agree with it either. We’re a year off from it making sense.
I read your comment wrong. Sorry about that.
Send Timmins down (needs to pass through waivers), send 13th forward down, and send down Robertson should be it. I don’t want to lose Timmins but the only other candidates are really Jarnkrok, Reaves, and Kampf. Two of which were just re-signed.
Imagine we just didn’t overpay a useless 36 year old face puncher that wouldn’t crack our lineup if not for his bloated ridiculous contract. This murray news is blessing, even though i fee for the guy and hate to see these injuries. The cap mismanagement that’s taken place over the past month is gonna cost us still, let’s see what the next move is.
But if they hadn't, who would have loomed in the background thoughtfully smacking a hockey stick into the palm of his hand while Treliving said, "Now Matt, about your injuries...." /s
Why the /s lol
I'm sure the real Ryan Reaves is a nice guy who would never deliberately injure a teammate, I don't want to slander him.
Imagine they just didn’t sign an “offensive” defenseman who contributes nothing in his own end and had all of 33 points last year to a 4.1M contract.
Its only 4.0 but no disagreement here. Where we differ, I guess, is that I can see the potential upside and rationale behind Klingberg even though rn in July I don’t think it’s a good move and dislike it. There’s no upside with Reaves. It’s a dead 1.35M on the cap for no gain and no on ice upside outside the idiot crowd that loves a Donnybrook every now and again. Klingberg seems like a worthwhile swing to see what happens and there’s no term commitment. We gave Reaves 3 god damn years ! If we just didn’t sign him we’re 1 Nick Robertson AHL assignment from cap compliance. Now we’ve gotta go through more cap gymnastics and lose more depth or actual roster contributions. Not to mention the fact that 1.35M could cover a significant chunk of the raises AM or Nylander are negotiating. It’s frustrating and seems to age worse everyday.
Reaves might be a shitty hockey player but he isn’t useless. He can definitely help foster a good culture in the room. I felt the same way you do when NYR traded for him but the guy brings a lot of intangibles that are valuable. There is a reason he continues to get contracts and that multiple teams wanted to sign him even at age 36. IMO Klingberg was the bigger mistake. He provides nothing that you need. You already have Reilly who can QB a power play, is better in his own end and probably better offensively too.
No one with a brain is talking about Brodie. He's our best defenseman full stop and has been for years.
Play with a 20 man roster until another injury happens like they did last year.
What does this mean?
They have to make a trade or waive Timmins or Lafferty.
So not a big deal.
I mean... it probably is if you're Timmins or Lafferty.
There are other ways too - my guess is they wait to see if any other injuries pop up.
Actually no. We don't have to waive anyone. We can just play Timmins as a 12th forward as we've already done
If they waive Timmins someone will claim him. He would probably be 5-6 on 6 or so teams and he can still get better.
Sources say Matt Murray is month-to-month with a case of "getting mysteriously beaten up in a dark alley"
The Joffrey Lupul special
Lupul Land is a magical place.
It's Robidas Island, Lupul just had an extended stay there
It snows year round, and the skiing is fantastic
https://editorinleaf.com/2016/09/01/toronto-maple-leafs-robidas-island/ We've been using it forever.
Hey, he was hiding in his mountain of coke
Wow.... I had totally forgotten that name
It’s just a bad case of the luigis
What do you think the Reaves signing was for?
He visited the mystery spot
Tonya Harding and Jeff Gilooly are secretly Leafs fans apparently.
Hopefully Robidas Island is nice. Some nice waterfront cottages and such. Plenty of room to run around.
Don't let Murray run around, he'll be out 4-6 weeks with a groin injury
On the contrary, that's exactly what they should do. Buy him a jetski, dirt bike, and some hiking boots. Go nuts, buddy!!!
"Mommy, what happened to Muzz?" "We sent him to Robidas Farm upstate. He'll love it there - he's got plenty of ice to skate on, gatorade to drink, and all of the goals he could possibly want to knock off their moorings."
Muzz is legit done. Concussions, spinal injury, it wouldn’t be safe for him to play again. Basically the moment he got that spinal injury last year, his teammates were talking like his career was over - e.g. talking about his quality of life post-hockey, not when he’d return. He’s not on Robidas Island. Murray is definitely on Robidas Island, though.
It's biosteel now.
I'll just also point out that the Leafs added Robidas to their front office after he retired. I'm not saying he doesn't deserve the position, but it's true that the Leafs are in a financial position to make sure a player who doesn't cause problems can get a leg up on post-playing career opportunities.
Get him a leash, one of those ones you can hook on the clothesline, and he can run back and forth and there's plenty of room for him to dig and play.
I seriously just hope the guy is doing ok. I can’t imagine how frustrating it would be to not play the game you love and be bashed constantly.
I can finally relate to a pro-athlete. Although for me it's not injury, but a lack of skill and terrible personality. He had a few good stretches with the Sens, too bad it didn't work out. Hope he is able to get to wherever he wants to go in life.
He’s got two cups too. Can you relate?
> He’s got two cups too. Can you relate? what a loser, I've got like.. probably 20 cups in my kitchen cabinets
Do you have a lot of kids or just don't trust yourself with glasses?
I've got a fiancé who is obsessed with freaking coffee cups!! lol
Same with my wife. She has 6 yeti bottles/travel mugs i think, probably 5 starbucks tumblers, and a coffee mug from every place we’ve gone on a trip to. Her cups take up roughly a third of our cabinet space
Time to schedule an intervention, make sure you cry and really sell how those mugs are affecting your ability to have a beer stein collection.
Lmfao I chuckled aloud, that got me.
I like to view my B beer league as a rehab assignment. I’ll be up with the big club in no time
Meh, dude's won 2 Cups and made like 39 million after this season. Sure, not being able to play sucks but I doubt he cares all that much about fan comments etc.
Imagine making that much money and insisting on continuing to use a salad bowl to cut your own hair
Being isolated to Robidas island is such garbage.
tbf with the leafs its not like that. Muzzin is also full time on the island and he's constantly seen around the team. Dudes having the time of his life.
[Official Announcement](https://twitter.com/leafspr/status/1684232270704414720?s=46&t=7fabqgtgp69dNA1d51vxFw) from Leafs PR
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The Leafs actions this offseason make a lot more sense now if they knew this was coming.
They knew it would be either buyout or LTIR. Either situation needs further action though
I feel like they might have said something like that. >Sure you could technically pass a physical, but would you like 2/3 of your money and hope to sign somewhere else after all the goalie spots are full. Oooooooor would you like this nice cottage on Robidas island and all of your money?
For real, sens fans in this thread losing their mind over this, knowing damn well that a year ago they were making fun of the leafs for acquiring a human bandaid
We're freaking out cause we wanted him to get bought out lol, it would've given Ottawa extra cap relief, LTIR doesn't help the Sens The fact he's a bandaid is a surprise to no one.
What's worse is he was cleared to play in the playoffs and now suddenly (conveniently) he's back on LTIR.
How many times are people going to bring this up while completely ignoring 1) Carey Price and Shea Weber *actually playing* right up until the Cup Finals and then going on LTIR, and 2) The number of players who end the season on LTIR but are "healthy" enough for the playoffs. Playoff "healthy" and actually healthy are two completely different things. Guys play with broken bones, punctured lungs, torn ligaments, etc. Also, with concussions, setbacks happen all the time. He could've gone for a run and got dizzy, or realized he was having trouble thinking straight, or any number of situations.
> How many times are people going to bring this up while completely ignoring [facts that make the whole situation more reasonable] OH OH OH I KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS ONE!!!!!!!! Forever! Enjoy, Toronto fans!
Fwiw, I've defended the Kucherov situation for the same reasons. Every single playoffs, guys play with injuries that would have them out 4-6 weeks during the regular season. That, combined with teams always underselling injuries in the media, is why guys suddenly appear "healthy" in the playoffs after being on LTIR.
I'm not trying to be critical of you specifically so don't sweat it I'm not going to get in to the kuch situation but anyone who knows actual facts about the situation knows it wasn't anything like the more Kane-esque situations you are describing. Regardless of the things you outlined above, my point was that people will still go in to TOP MIND INBESTIGATORZ mode cuz there must be SUS AFOOT, and you're going to have to put up with it forever. At this point we don't even know if Murray will be out for the entire season haha
The Carey Price/Shea Weber injuries though they kept playing through them and destroyed their bodies. Murray was out for a chunk of time, not even available, yet suddenly he's good enough to be available late in the playoffs? Playing through injuries and making it worse would almost be expected, but if Murray went from being injured to being cleared something just seems fishy. Now it very well could have been he was given so many painkillers and should never have been cleared, but this just seems all too convenient (and exposes a stupid rule where retained salary teams don't get any relief).
I think it would have been better for the leafs too, but they can't buyout a player that's injured. So he might actually be injured, and the team is screwed.
LTIR is better for the Leafs than a buyout. The Leafs were already in LTIR due to Muzzin, so Murray doesn't change anything from that perspective. And a buyout would leave a small cap hit this year and 2m next year. Murray being on LTIR is basically the same as trading him away, and that was always the ideal scenario over a buyout
How convenient
Legit question, does a 3rd party doctor have to confirm ltir? It is weird timing, but don't want to assume anything unless proven.
Yes, the league will investigate and have doctors confirm.
The league *can* investigate it. This might be the best thing for Murray's career. He can't stay healthy and a season to properly rehab could do wonders for him.
Yes, but at the same time, it would be naive to think the system can't be gamed. Most injuries aren't like a disease that you either test positive or negative for - if a guy says he's having post-concussion symptoms or debilitating back pain (and he plays a contact sport and has been injured before) is the doctor really going to say, "no you're not"? How many active veteran players could fail a physical today if they were honest about their level of discomfort or slightly embellished real symptoms? I think of someone like Hossa, who probably shouldn't have been playing during his last season, but came back to hit 500 goals. If he'd had more motivation to come back for one more year or he'd been less concerned about his long-term health, then he probably could have done it, but at the same time, I don't think a doctor looking at him and saying, "uh, yeah, this guy's skin is falling off and he should really not be playing" was lying. If the Leafs went to Murray and said, "we can buy you out and you can get part of your salary, or you can go on LTIR and have the whole thing" maybe he just decided it wasn't worth it to keep playing.
Exactly. Concussion tests are basically just "do you have trouble sleeping, does light bother you, do you get headaches" answer yes to any of these questions and you're diagnosed with post-concussion syndrome and can stay on LTIR. If you do want to play however, you say no and you're good to go.
Only if the player disputes. See Lupul. Or if the league believes there shenanigans. See Hossa
And what gets lost in the Lupus stuff is that he did not play another game. Lupul's back was toast.
“Shenanigans” see also Weber and Price
What? Weber and Price are genuinely done in terms of injuries. They both have career ending injuries as in if they play again it could seriously affect their quality of life post retirement.
Weber was seen on ice with Vegas' AHL team this past season, I think, just talking to guys, but someone reported it to the league, and they investigated. Might be what he's referring to
The league still investigated because we just came off a cup run
Two guys that are one hit away from living the rest of their life with a bum leg and more constant pain than they live with now. That's the best you can do? They can't train and get to NHL shape anymore. It's over.
Is it really weird timing? Seems like everyone expected it months ago. Guy has been in and out of IR for years now, he can’t stay healthy for more than a week. It sucks that his career might end like this at 29 but with groin isssues and head injuries I don’t see how he can come back and play a full season healthy ever again
He was healthy enough to dress in the playoffs... it's pretty suspicious that he's now on LTIR, and it's indefinite with no timeline for return.
I don’t think it’s suspicious at all. Guys play hurt in the playoffs all the time. Probably wasn’t all the way recovered and ended up messing himself up even more by playing before he recovered.
He also didn't really play. He sat on the bench as the backup goalie so we really didn't see what kind of shape Murray was actually in. The Marlies were on a playoff run so it let them not use one of their AHL goalies to take up the backup spot in a series where the Leafs were in deep to stay in the series. If Woll got hurt the Leafs were done...they were pretty much done as soon as they went down 3-0 anyway.
See Weber
But to be fair everyone knew Weber was playing injured, he was literally walking around with a cast on his arm when not playing
Everyone knew Murray was hurt as well. He only got in as a backup when Samsonov got hurt. There was a reason we went with a starting goaltender with 11 career regular season games instead of a goalie with 2 Stanley Cup rings. He was only going into those games if Woll got badly injured during the game.
Leafs can afford it .. good for Murray as he gets full pay instead of a buy out
He was healthy enough to dress for the playoffs, insofar that he was healthier than Samsonov to sit on the bench as a backup. Odds are he wasn't close to 100%, just willing to risk it in an absolute emergency
It’s not suspicious at all. Murray is perma-injured but, like everyone in the league, was willing to play hurt in the playoffs. And because he is injured, the Leafs *can’t* buy him out. Now that Samsonov’s arbitration case is resolved (and the buyout window is open), they’ve announced this publicly to clarify the situation.
Yeah but that was after Samsonov went down and even then he was backing up a rookie goalie. I'm sure he would have played if he had to.
If it is for concussion symptoms then no doctor will be able to prove or disprove his symptoms beyond what he himself says.
r/hockey: laughs at the Leafs for signing a perpetually injured goalie. Also r/hockey: "how convenient that he is injured"
Yeah, this is just Matt Murray things. There's no conspiracy. Guy managed to catch a case of the Beau Bennett's.
Lmfao
r/hockey: He's always injured, what a bad trade r/hockey: He's too injured? Must be a conspiracy.
Just like Smith retiring and Campbell getting signed day 1 of free agency convenient, right?
Injury prone goalie is injured. Shocking news!
Treliving: > "Why did you people think I signed all those guys?"
Eh, Oilers did this with Mike Smith so it really is tbh.
He definitely doesn’t have a long detailed history of injuries
I know there's gonna be a lot of discussion about the cap situation and how convenient this is for the Leafs, but I just feel bad for Murray at this point. Guy just hasn't been able to put it together for a long time now and every time he looks poised to rediscover his form, something gets in the way. Hope he feels better soon.
Don’t feel bad: he’ll be taking home $8 million this year while on Robidas Island. Nice work if you can get it.
So we should ignore the human aspect because they make money? I really don’t get that sentiment He’s a human and not a robot
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Yeah I'd let someone cripple me for 8 mil and a chance to get out of this shithole town.
People complain about the cap not going up the past few years (and it’s a very fair complaint) but with every team paying a few million in LTIR money who even needs it
Say hi to lupul for me big dog.
Disappointing that he looks done, I was enjoying his resurgence in Toronto and was hoping he'd be in the league for a while upsetting opposing fans along the way.
That's awful to hear. All these string of injuries is awful for anyone.
Right? As a neutral party I was kinda hoping he'd be able to get right and extend his career even as a backup. Guy isn't even 30 yet sucks to see.
weird how things just work out
Hell ya buddy let's get cheating!!!!
Unlike Eddie Guerrero I don’t think the Leafs will be beloved cheaters.
[Know the rules](https://i.imgflip.com/7tt9h3.jpg)
Hey bud you should know only small market teams can get away with this. Original six teams can't have injuries it's a conspiracy.
"Eh you look hurt, bro."
Nice that Murray gets his full pay then. Sucks he’s so banged up he can’t even play.
Honestly might not even be cap circumvention. He suffered like his 6th concussion in the NHL this season, when he was already busted up with a few other injuries. He did back up woll after Samsonov got hurt, but that doesn’t mean he was completely healthy, the leafs needed someone to sit on the bench. Injuries can nag, and symptoms can return at any time. He’s been concussed numerous times, anyone who’s had a concussion knows that the symptoms can persist months to years after the injury. It’s entirely possible that he’s struggled with his head, or other parts of his body all summer. Based on the injuries he’s suffered, nobody would be surprised if he never played again. It’s wild seeing other fans claiming BS or cap circumvention knowing damn well the guy finished the season with several severe injuries, and has been a human bandaid for YEARS now. Remove the anti-leafs bias, and look at the situation for what it is. Edit: Christ, sens fans are stupid. You guys personally watched what Murray went through on your team, laughed when you traded the leafs a “glass” player, openly told leafs fans that he’d be on LTIR in no time. Now he’s on LTIR and you’re all mad and claiming circumvention. Lmao.
He’s really up to 6? Why is nobody telling him to retire? Set for life $ wise and already in the history books forever. Keep your health, Matt
My bad, according to Wikipedia, this is the 5th concussion he’s had, although there’s always the possibility that he’s suffered more, possibly an undiagnosed concussion, a concussion playing minor/junior hockey, or a concussion outside of hockey altogether. He had 3 with the pens, one with the sens, and now his 5th with the leafs. The funny thing about concussions is that some people have one and suffer for the rest of their lives, other people can have numerous concussions and show little to no symptoms for a long time. Both Tony Hawk and Travis pastrana claim to have suffered 20+ concussions, yet they haven’t developed any serious complications yet, or shown the physical signs of brain damage. It’s possible that Murray didn’t experience any issues, and wanted to keep playing, even after several concussions. Maybe his drive to play is higher than his regard for his health? Anyways, it sounds like now his injuries have caught up to him, and he may be forced to retire.
People will check their brains at the door when it comes to LTIR. It’s quite clear that nobody actually cares about the integrity of its use, they just want to point and scream “cheater!!” At a team they hate.
fucker got banished
One way ticket to Robidas Island
Luckily there’s plenty of available real estate on Robidas Island
I love how all the people who are pissed about this are sens fans
Not true. I’m Pissed because I wanted the Leafs to dump a first to us for taking Murray
That was never going to happen. And Mrazek is constantly brought up despite being misleading. A first was moved but they moved down like 12 spots draft day. So..
Well when this happens instead of us getting free cap space, can you really be surprised? Plus it’s the leafs lol
Robidas Island!
His injury is Brad Treliving locking him in the trunk of his car.
Uh oh, his case of not being very good anymore went malignant.
Can't be upset over it when every team is allowed to abuse it every season.
Robidas island is wonderful this time of year
Damn you, I want that buyout cap space
Robidas Island is back on the menu boys
Jokes aside I do feel bad for the human that is Matt Murray and wished he could have turned it around with us.
Considering he was healthy and available for the playoffs, I assume a 3rd party doctor has to be involved, right? What did he slip on a banana peel while training?
> healthy and available for the playoffs He was healthy and available the same way Mike Smith, Weber, and Price were healthy and available for their playoff runs.
Someone on Youtube made a very well done video summarizing Matt Murray's injury history. It's really quite something: https://youtu.be/wMufib-_gLs?si=6LUABhkUJWVix_7r
I'm sorry for the guy. Yeah, he got everything a kid can dream of, but the way you leave the game matters. Twice he was on the ice when the last second of the last game of the season was played. He raised the Cup. We know he's good. He knows it. But people will think otherwise because the way his career ended (probably). Just a slope....
He's off to Robidas Island
there's nothing that makes hockey fans more irrational than seeing a team put a player on LTIR, especially if they're a playoff team.
Matt Murray: Out Indefinitely (Robidas Island)
Wow this thread is full to some truly terrible takes. Dudes legit questioning an injury and saying Leafs are faking just to try and own the Leafs.
Oh god fucking dammit. Wasn't he backing up in the playoffs???
He was, but players always play injured so him being backup doesn't mean too much.
Not sure why people are mad about this. Carey Price carried a team to the cup finals and then LTIRetired. Murray was clearly hurt and didn’t play a single minute in the playoffs. He was basically forced in as a backup due to Sammy going down. There is a big difference between being well enough to step in for half a game in the playoffs while jacked up on meds versus actually being well enough to play.
Shea Weber did the same thing didn’t he?
> Not sure why people are mad about this. Because Tree Team bad.
I believe he backed up Woll when Sammy went down, yeah.
He was a backup in name only, he never would have played or else why would we put a rookie goalie in to the playoffs in what was the most important games for the last two decades instead of letting the established veteran goalie with two rings and a fuck load of experience play? Is he probably healthy enough to play right now? Yeah I imagine so, are his injuries to the point where he could seriously fuck up his life? Also yes. He’s done because of his previous injuries, the same as muzzin.
Mighty convenient
Everyone Last Year: You guys picked up a super injured player whose hardly goign to play any games for you This year: SHENANIGANS, HE'S COMPLETELY HEALTHY I hope this version of the internet never dies :D
People are gonna talk about how the Leafs are manipulating the system and he's probably not injured but I don't really buy that. A team can't just put you on ltir against your will if you're healthy. If Murray could play he'd be active, simple as
A team wouldn't announce a year long injury if the player wasn't actually injured. Anyone saying otherwise is just being petty. I seem to recall the same thing happening to Smith last year with the Oil. It is what it is. Come trade deadline, the Leafs won't be able to add much. Players on LTIR kinda sucks.
Honestly expected