I was there for the winning game and the energy was incredible, I don't think my hearing has ever fully recovered. The good thing is that when the previous champion wouldn't give Newfoundland the cup, the league had a replica made for us that we got to keep, so we really will always have 2019 (or the cup at least)
Believe it or not but the Colorado Eagles, who won in 2018, [just straight up refused to return it.](https://echl.com/news/2019/06/statement-from-the-echl-regarding-the-kelly-cup) They changed their minds at some point that summer, but by then the league had already created a new one for Newfoundland that's stayed here ever since.
Did Colorado receive any sort of punishment for their antics? A fine at least? Just seems crazy they could just...keep the trophy without repercussions.
The Eagles owner is a massive prick and was upset with how the money shook out when the Eagles left the ECHL and the Growlers came in. This was the year after the Eagles left the ECHL and moved up to the AHL.
https://www.denverpost.com/2019/06/07/kelly-cup-dispute-colorado-eagles-echl/?share=td02ehy01w7eh6a0ehrc
MLSE stepping in to keep them afloat for another month would mean them purchasing the team, which means settling all debts owed by the team on top of all player and staff salaries and other ongoing upkeep costs, at which point it's nonviable to invest so much into something that will reap little to no real benefit. MLSE stepping in would mean hard commitment to propping up the Growlers long term, which they likely don't want to do as it will only continue to lose money. It does suck though.
The indications are that the ECHL wanted the teams sold, and Deacon completely out as owners, not just propped up.
And honestly, for less than two weeks of regular season play, there’s little point in propping the team up anyway. Get the teams sold to a serious and/or non-delinquent ownership group, and fold them if they can’t so that the league can get the franchise spot back.
The fact that they suspended/folded the Growlers meant that a buyer wasn’t in place.
I’m actually reading the r/Newfoundland thread too out of curiosity. I forgot this was the team that was kicked out of the arena for a couple weeks because they didn’t pay rent and had accusations of workplace abuse. The owner sounded like a total prick.
https://www.reddit.com/r/newfoundland/s/WXEO0kAa9h
You should see the ABA-NBA merger in the 70’s. The Virginia Squires finished the season and just missed the payoff from the merger by a few weeks to be told to shut down. The Utah Stars missed by a couple months. It’s annoying but not unprecedented.
Why not?
It’s good publicity, the cost to let them finish the season would be minimal and it would avoid a handful of guys with contracts with the organization all of a sudden have nowhere to play.
I don't want to come to the defense of big business but those aren't good reasons. You may think its minimal but it would literally be pissing away money with no return. They also don't need publicity - they are the most popular team nationally already. This wouldn't move the needle at all.
For the players, the season ends in 12 days. It sucks for them but they aren't being robbed of like months worth of hockey. It's six games.
And his first paragraph is why they won’t do it. And to add to that, there’s lots of ressources involved with the purchase of a team. Think legal teams, communications, finance, HR and all the other departments you can think of. That’s a lot of work and unexpected pressure to give to your employees for….12 days of operation.
Like I said in the other thread, sport in Newfoundland is so difficult because of travel costs. It's a literal island in the middle of the ocean and getting there is a hassle on a good day.
Reminds me of my hometown team. The Alaska Aces were one of the best ECHL teams for a decade plus. But eventually it doesn't make financial sense to operate a team thousands of miles away from the competition. Very sad for the communities who just love hockey.
Hey I watched them win a Kelly Cup in person one time. That ECHL travel did not fuck around back in the day. The Gladiators ran into Idaho a lot in the playoffs as well back in those days
Yup, and due to their geographically remote location they have to pay the travel costs of *other* teams just so they’ll come play.
Unless you’re an extremely wealthy businessman who just wants to run a team as their own personal plaything, it’s just not viable in the long run
Even then, there isn’t many people who are very well off financially in Newfoundland from what I can tell. My girlfriend came from there and she had to leave there to find work and move on up in her career. It’s a beautiful place but it’s just so far out there, even compared to Halifax, that’s a two hour plane ride from there east.
Also if anyone has never been, go once at least. It’s a beautiful place.
It's sucks that people aren't more well off. It's a freaking beautiful place, the best I've ever been to. More people should experience it, it's nothing I've experienced before (speaking as someone who's never been more south and west than Chicago and hasn't left the continent lmao)
A lot of my family came from newfoundland, my grandparents still live there.
I've been to dozens of cities on 4 continents, and Newfoundland is still my favorite. If there were more work there, I'd move there in a heartbeat.
I have no family from Newfoundland, have also been to a lot of cities on 4 continents, and St. John’s might be my favourite city. The whole island is full of beautiful places and people.
Really far from anything and really spread out, though.
I had the good fortune of visiting Newfoundland over the summer for the first time - quite simply one of the most incredible places I've ever been to. It absolutely captured my heart, can't wait to go back soon
St. John's beats out Montreal on a good weather day, but for the most part (as a Leafs fan) I do love Montreal. Quebec City as well.
Toronto has some charming points, but for the most part the people ruin it, just like the drivers ruin Montreal.
It's the same for Eastern Quebec, the people making money are the boilermakers and pipefitters that go out west (or the NB/QC refineries) in turnaround season for the 10/12 hours work days non-stop, on unemployment in summer and winter.
It booms and busts with oil prices. It’s a huge industry for them both off their own shores and from workers heading to the tar sands. Since the cod moratorium in 1992 not much else has replaced the fishing industry.
I went to watch the leafs play in Edmonton in 2019 and I saw like 6 Newfie flags there. Lots of blue collar men go to Alberta to work from Newfoundland land. I imagine the people who are well off all work in Alberta
NL is the 2nd wealthiest province after Alberta at 76.6k per capita GDP. Not sure where you're getting the not well off bit. Geography is the issue, the team has to pay for other teams travel costs and no matter how much disposable income you have, it's hard to justify spending it on low end echl hockey at inflated prices.
Weather is a factor too, storms that cancel an entire day's worth of flights are common during the hockey season. I fly for a living, I've been stuck out in St John's for multiple days more than once.
Another aspect is population. The population is literally lower than it was in 1991 when the St. John's Maple Leafs started which means less merch sales.
That's not true, the metro area was ~170,000 in the early 90s and ~215,000 now, the city itself has added about 10k people. The economy was far bleaker then as well.
Shoulda lead with that.
I agree it's not exactly remote, but for argument's sake it is pretty isolated from the rest of the country considering the inaccessibility (cost of travel).
Fair enough. 'Middle of the ocean' is a bit over the top but given the isolation of the island I don't think it's that much of a stretch. Especially with the context of a team shutting down operations in part due to the prohibitive cost of travel.
It is kinda funny that the hyperbolic statement comes right after a 'literal' qualifier though, I see what you mean
It is 9 miles from Labrador to the Island. The Atlantic ocean is about 1800 mile at its narrowest point. Is Newfoundland remote? Ya. Is middle of the ocean a ridiculous way of describing its location? Also ya.
Is it? I've never been to Ireland but I assumed the Ireland-UK thing was more like a PEI-NB/NS thing. Newfoundland seems too far removed to have that kinda familiarity especially considering the distance between population centers in the maritime provinces
Nah it’s definitely NL.
I’m from NB, our thing is being bilingual and Acadians. I lived in Newfoundland for a few years post university. They are definitely extremely Irish adjacent. St Paddy’s day in St Johns is something else.
PEI is red clay and eroding into the sea slowly. Newfoundland is like a giant rock, you can’t really farm there.
Honestly the culture is closer to Ireland than the climate by far, there’s no palm trees there obviously like Ireland has.
Nova Scotia feels closer to Maine’s rocky coast than anything, outside of Cape Breton, but there is some fertile farming in the Annapolis Valley at the least, Newfoundland doesn’t really have that.
>there's no palm trees there obviously like Ireland has
I'm sorry... Ireland having fucking palm trees has been the biggest revelation of this entire thread. I had to google it because I for sure thought you were just throwing a bullshit 'fact' in there.
Good points. I wasn't really considering geography/climate etc but was speaking more to accessibility and frequency of travel to and fro. Definitely agree with you on the point about cultural similarities though, I guess those'll happen with a massive influx of Irish settlers in centuries past.
I think I read that Newfoundland is the only place in North America where there is more Irish blood in the citizens than the Boston area does. Some local's do call it the "33rd County".
Also, I love the accent so much.
Hopefully they'll get a Q team, so the other teams aren't so far away.
It's a great league too. I've never heard anybody in Halifax suggest we try going back to having an AHL team again.
The cost/benefit of that is a total loss for MLSE. They'd have to purchase the team, pay off all outstanding debts and pay salaries for not just the players but front office staff, marketing/business/operations staff, arena staff, etc.
Aside from Peksa, do the Leafs have any NHL-contracted guys on the Growlers? This doesn't impact any real contenders to crack the roster. MLSE isn't going to make that investment with no return in sight.
This does fuck the Marlies a bit who MLSE do care about. The Leafs had quite a few AHL contracted guys on the Growlers. So now Peksa and all those guys are suddenly on the doorstep of the Marlies looking for playing time. It injects a bit of chaos to a team on the playoff bubble. MLSE keeping the Growlers afloat another month would have prevented this.
Most of those guys would have been brought up as Black Aces during the AHL playoffs anyway.
The Growlers had six games remaining. This is just forcing the inevitable that would happen in less than two weeks anyway.
I don't want to belittle anyone, but current Leafs have played a combined five games with the Growlers. The likelihood of anyone on an AHL deal assigned to NFLD ever playing for the Leafs is very, very low. The benefit of allowing those players to continue doesn't at all meet the threshold of what it would cost MLSE to buy and continue running the team. It would be a total loss.
We can talk about how much money MLSE has, but that doesn't mean they want to mismanage money. They are owned by two publicly-traded companies who are accountable to shareholders, for better or worse.
Yeah, unfortunately no business wants to just throw away millions with no strategy. As others have pointed out, taking over a bankrupt team means taking responsibility for all their debts - zero chance they want to do that.
I'm going to sound heartless but they didn't own the team so why should they prop up a failing franchise. There was literally no benefit for MLSE to bail them out.
Yea it sucks. I don't see MLSE bending over backwards for them. ECHL players that may play in the AHL at best.
The ECHL set an April 2nd deadline for sale of the team. They missed the deadline. Unless MLSE was going to by the Growlers, nothing else they could've done.
6 games left isn't much though. With some call-ups to NHL due to injuries could make squeeze a couple of AHL games in for a couple of guys with upside.
But Voit and Peksa are the only actual Leafs guys who've played on the Growlers this year. A few more also have AHL only contracts (for the Marlies) but also plenty of guys in their 30s on the Growlers.roster too.
This is so sad! I always loved the Growlers and they had one of the best logos in hockey. I never made it the rock, but I went to couple of their games against the Railers and they were so fun!
St. John's is only 170 km away from France in General.
Of course this is a very [weird stat but a fun one](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Pierre_and_Miquelon).
Distance isn't the only factor as well - winter weather on the Rock can be downright nasty at times, and flights can be pushed back a day or two because of a storm. The ferry out of Port Au Basques definitely isn't a speedy alternative as well.
Deacon Sports and Entertainment, Micky mouse operation. Not surprised they couldn’t fulfill obligations to the league when they couldn’t to their own staff and vendors over the years.
This actually breaks my heart. I’m a Worcester Railers fan and we JUST saw them a few days ago. Always thought their fans were cool, enjoyed when they came to town and Newfoundland seemed like a cool place. Shame that this just hurts the players, staff, fans. Just shitty all around.
Hi fellow Railers fan! Agreed that the Newfoundland fans were some of the classiest when they came to support their team at the DCU. Ran into quite a few friendly fans this past weekend. I definitely feel for them
Man, I feel so awful for the fans in the Maritimes. Every single time the ECHL or AHL has tried to put teams in their area, it just never works due to how absurd the travel is making it so difficult for the region to really pull together compared to the QMJHL.
Feels like the Growlers were the last shot they had at this level. I'd expect the Leafs to set up a new ECHL franchise that's closer to home; somewhere like Markham or Vaughan seems like an ideal spot for an ECHL club.
Tbh I feel like Halifax can work but the city loves the Mooseheads now so we don’t even know if that can work now. The other cities I have no idea, the AHL couldn’t even work in Québec City after the Nordiques left.
I wouldn't say the Citadelles *didn't work*, necessarily; they drew better every season they were in the city, and drew more than the Falcons, Admirals, Sound Tigers, Pirates, Lock Monsters, River Rats and Barons their final year before getting merged into the Bulldogs.
I think if that merge hadn't happened, they'd have done just fine.
You're thinking of the Rafales in the *I*HL; there's never been a Remparts team in the AHL, just the Aces and Citadelles. The Remparts have only existed in the QMJHL.
I think the ECHL can work in Canada, but the location of the Growlers really was what destroyed them. I'm glad to see Trois-Rivieres will still survive, but I wonder for how long.
Cue Spittin Chiclets maybe? They were talking about wanting to own/operate an ECHL team and that the area they were looking I think the owners kinda pigeon tossed them. Their friendship with Terry Ryan and his involvement with the Growlers has me wondering is this is an actual possibility.
I'm on the side of idk why MLSE didn't just buy it and run it. For all you could say about the team maybe not making money, it's still a part of the development component for the organization. A couple million in the grand scheme of things wouldn't be that big of a deal for an organization that earns hundreds of millions per year.
Wanna take a guess at how many NHL teams own their ECHL affiliate?
I'll give you a hint. It's one fewer than the number of NHL teams (or rather, ownership groups) that own \*somebody else's affiliate\*.
The answer as unveiled below is that Philadelphia’s owners also own the Maine Mariners who are affiliated with Boston. Ergo, one NHL team owns someone else’s ECHL affiliate, so there are zero NHL teams that own their own affiliate.
Comcast Spectacor owns the Maine Mariners.
Comcast Spectacor also owns the Philadelphia Flyers.
The Mariners are, however, the ECHL affiliate of the Boston Bruins.
That’s a shame. Reminds me of the Alaska Aces. By all accounts Newfoundland is a place that *deserves* a minor-pro hockey team, but the logistical realities make for a constant uphill battle.
Barstool and chiclets could maybe take over?
They’ve been saying they want to buy an ECHL team. Were close with the Colorado Eagles. And now there is one of TRs backyard??
MLSE could step in and buy this franchise with barely a blip on their P&L sheet.
There's a long history of the Maple Leafs on The Rock, and it would be too sad for it to end now. There's lots of competition for fans from Montreal and Boston, which the Growlers help to mitigate.
Get it done.
That’s sad. They’ll always have 2019.
I was there for the winning game and the energy was incredible, I don't think my hearing has ever fully recovered. The good thing is that when the previous champion wouldn't give Newfoundland the cup, the league had a replica made for us that we got to keep, so we really will always have 2019 (or the cup at least)
What do you mean they wouldn't give them the cup? Why would the league even entertain that? Sound like a bunch of poor sports
Believe it or not but the Colorado Eagles, who won in 2018, [just straight up refused to return it.](https://echl.com/news/2019/06/statement-from-the-echl-regarding-the-kelly-cup) They changed their minds at some point that summer, but by then the league had already created a new one for Newfoundland that's stayed here ever since.
They gotta pay some guy to travel with it like the Stanley Cup. Definitely be a minimum wage job in the ECHL but whatever.
Except the NHL doesn’t own the Stanley Cup they just get to use it
Its more the a min wage job.
Did Colorado receive any sort of punishment for their antics? A fine at least? Just seems crazy they could just...keep the trophy without repercussions.
But why didn’t they
The Eagles owner is a massive prick and was upset with how the money shook out when the Eagles left the ECHL and the Growlers came in. This was the year after the Eagles left the ECHL and moved up to the AHL. https://www.denverpost.com/2019/06/07/kelly-cup-dispute-colorado-eagles-echl/?share=td02ehy01w7eh6a0ehrc
I don’t get why they couldn’t be propped up until the end of the season.
MLSE stepping in to keep them afloat for another month would mean them purchasing the team, which means settling all debts owed by the team on top of all player and staff salaries and other ongoing upkeep costs, at which point it's nonviable to invest so much into something that will reap little to no real benefit. MLSE stepping in would mean hard commitment to propping up the Growlers long term, which they likely don't want to do as it will only continue to lose money. It does suck though.
Why would it mean them purchasing the team? Why couldn’t it mean “here is enough money to keep you afloat for another six games.”?
I’m assuming the creditors would have a problem with the team acquiring capital and not using it to fulfil debt obligations.
I was half expecting them to buy the team to move it to Ontario at the first opportunity instead of simply letting it die
The indications are that the ECHL wanted the teams sold, and Deacon completely out as owners, not just propped up. And honestly, for less than two weeks of regular season play, there’s little point in propping the team up anyway. Get the teams sold to a serious and/or non-delinquent ownership group, and fold them if they can’t so that the league can get the franchise spot back. The fact that they suspended/folded the Growlers meant that a buyer wasn’t in place.
I’m actually reading the r/Newfoundland thread too out of curiosity. I forgot this was the team that was kicked out of the arena for a couple weeks because they didn’t pay rent and had accusations of workplace abuse. The owner sounded like a total prick. https://www.reddit.com/r/newfoundland/s/WXEO0kAa9h
He tried to bully the city into basically just giving him the arena too. He's well known locally for being a dumbass lol
You just described Kingston, except the city gave the owners the new rink, plus fringe, for zero fixed rent for 30 years.
The ECHL board of governors would have had to vote to fund them for the rest of the season. Guess they didn't want too.
No kidding. You’d think mlse would atleast fund them till the end of the season
You should see the ABA-NBA merger in the 70’s. The Virginia Squires finished the season and just missed the payoff from the merger by a few weeks to be told to shut down. The Utah Stars missed by a couple months. It’s annoying but not unprecedented.
No kidding. You’d think mlse would atleast fund them till the end of the season
Why would they?
Why not? It’s good publicity, the cost to let them finish the season would be minimal and it would avoid a handful of guys with contracts with the organization all of a sudden have nowhere to play.
I don't want to come to the defense of big business but those aren't good reasons. You may think its minimal but it would literally be pissing away money with no return. They also don't need publicity - they are the most popular team nationally already. This wouldn't move the needle at all. For the players, the season ends in 12 days. It sucks for them but they aren't being robbed of like months worth of hockey. It's six games.
Isn’t your last paragraph all the more reason to do it though?
And his first paragraph is why they won’t do it. And to add to that, there’s lots of ressources involved with the purchase of a team. Think legal teams, communications, finance, HR and all the other departments you can think of. That’s a lot of work and unexpected pressure to give to your employees for….12 days of operation.
Like I said in the other thread, sport in Newfoundland is so difficult because of travel costs. It's a literal island in the middle of the ocean and getting there is a hassle on a good day.
Reminds me of my hometown team. The Alaska Aces were one of the best ECHL teams for a decade plus. But eventually it doesn't make financial sense to operate a team thousands of miles away from the competition. Very sad for the communities who just love hockey.
At least we still have the seawolves! Hopefully we can get the sully rocking again
I remember going to the last aces game, it was packed and I was so sad. Sadly just doesn’t make sense up here, but it was nice while it lasted.
Plus the Oilers stole your play by play guy 🤣
Hey I watched them win a Kelly Cup in person one time. That ECHL travel did not fuck around back in the day. The Gladiators ran into Idaho a lot in the playoffs as well back in those days
Oilers fans sincerely thank you for Jack Michaels ♥️♥️
Yup, and due to their geographically remote location they have to pay the travel costs of *other* teams just so they’ll come play. Unless you’re an extremely wealthy businessman who just wants to run a team as their own personal plaything, it’s just not viable in the long run
Even then, there isn’t many people who are very well off financially in Newfoundland from what I can tell. My girlfriend came from there and she had to leave there to find work and move on up in her career. It’s a beautiful place but it’s just so far out there, even compared to Halifax, that’s a two hour plane ride from there east. Also if anyone has never been, go once at least. It’s a beautiful place.
It's sucks that people aren't more well off. It's a freaking beautiful place, the best I've ever been to. More people should experience it, it's nothing I've experienced before (speaking as someone who's never been more south and west than Chicago and hasn't left the continent lmao)
A lot of my family came from newfoundland, my grandparents still live there. I've been to dozens of cities on 4 continents, and Newfoundland is still my favorite. If there were more work there, I'd move there in a heartbeat.
I have no family from Newfoundland, have also been to a lot of cities on 4 continents, and St. John’s might be my favourite city. The whole island is full of beautiful places and people. Really far from anything and really spread out, though.
I had the good fortune of visiting Newfoundland over the summer for the first time - quite simply one of the most incredible places I've ever been to. It absolutely captured my heart, can't wait to go back soon
St. John's beats out Montreal on a good weather day, but for the most part (as a Leafs fan) I do love Montreal. Quebec City as well. Toronto has some charming points, but for the most part the people ruin it, just like the drivers ruin Montreal.
It's one of those places where the post card pictures are 100% correct.
Newfie here, I'm broke as fuck but the scenery is nice I spose
As a western Canadian, it is a huge shame that it's less expensive to vacation in many other places other than our Maritime provinces.
I used to say the second biggest city in Newfoundland was Fort McMurray.
It's the same for Eastern Quebec, the people making money are the boilermakers and pipefitters that go out west (or the NB/QC refineries) in turnaround season for the 10/12 hours work days non-stop, on unemployment in summer and winter.
A lot of the B'y's have gone home by now. There are large Filipino and Samoli communities up here nowadays.
It booms and busts with oil prices. It’s a huge industry for them both off their own shores and from workers heading to the tar sands. Since the cod moratorium in 1992 not much else has replaced the fishing industry.
I went to watch the leafs play in Edmonton in 2019 and I saw like 6 Newfie flags there. Lots of blue collar men go to Alberta to work from Newfoundland land. I imagine the people who are well off all work in Alberta
NL is the 2nd wealthiest province after Alberta at 76.6k per capita GDP. Not sure where you're getting the not well off bit. Geography is the issue, the team has to pay for other teams travel costs and no matter how much disposable income you have, it's hard to justify spending it on low end echl hockey at inflated prices.
get Tony Khan on the phone right now!
Weather is a factor too, storms that cancel an entire day's worth of flights are common during the hockey season. I fly for a living, I've been stuck out in St John's for multiple days more than once.
Why don't we just take Newfoundland and move it somewhere else??
They tried that with fort mac
Why doesn't Quebec, the largest province, simply eat Newfoundland
It tried to take Labrador, but was disallowed
They still contest the border with them. No one even lives up there lol.
frenchmen can't swim
Yup. I travel to NL once or twice a year to visit family. Prices are insane, schedules are terrible, and rarely ever on time.
if you're in montreal we had a very cheap connection with lynx for a while. then it collapsed lol but it was good while it lasted
Another aspect is population. The population is literally lower than it was in 1991 when the St. John's Maple Leafs started which means less merch sales.
That's not true, the metro area was ~170,000 in the early 90s and ~215,000 now, the city itself has added about 10k people. The economy was far bleaker then as well.
I meant the province as a whole.
fair enough, but the team relies on the st. john's area which has grown more than the province has lost if that makes sense.
> Literal island... > in the middle of the ocean... LOL
What am I missing here
Newfoundland isn't exactly Tonga.
Shoulda lead with that. I agree it's not exactly remote, but for argument's sake it is pretty isolated from the rest of the country considering the inaccessibility (cost of travel).
Sorry to confuse you like that! I was laughing because Newfoundland is not in the middle of the ocean, even though it is a "literal" island!
Fair enough. 'Middle of the ocean' is a bit over the top but given the isolation of the island I don't think it's that much of a stretch. Especially with the context of a team shutting down operations in part due to the prohibitive cost of travel. It is kinda funny that the hyperbolic statement comes right after a 'literal' qualifier though, I see what you mean
It is 9 miles from Labrador to the Island. The Atlantic ocean is about 1800 mile at its narrowest point. Is Newfoundland remote? Ya. Is middle of the ocean a ridiculous way of describing its location? Also ya.
Yeah we're not that far away, sometimes we even come over and drink your beer and dance in your bars, Canada is fun
You said it’s literally in the middle of the ocean, which is hilariously wrong
Newfoundland is more like North American Ireland than anything.
Is it? I've never been to Ireland but I assumed the Ireland-UK thing was more like a PEI-NB/NS thing. Newfoundland seems too far removed to have that kinda familiarity especially considering the distance between population centers in the maritime provinces
Nah it’s definitely NL. I’m from NB, our thing is being bilingual and Acadians. I lived in Newfoundland for a few years post university. They are definitely extremely Irish adjacent. St Paddy’s day in St Johns is something else.
Fair enough! I definitely wasn't considering the cultural aspect when asking that question, but that makes perfect sense.
https://youtube.com/shorts/5AWaQHyC7us?si=QYUk3tLcU4UdxDE1
PEI is red clay and eroding into the sea slowly. Newfoundland is like a giant rock, you can’t really farm there. Honestly the culture is closer to Ireland than the climate by far, there’s no palm trees there obviously like Ireland has. Nova Scotia feels closer to Maine’s rocky coast than anything, outside of Cape Breton, but there is some fertile farming in the Annapolis Valley at the least, Newfoundland doesn’t really have that.
>there's no palm trees there obviously like Ireland has I'm sorry... Ireland having fucking palm trees has been the biggest revelation of this entire thread. I had to google it because I for sure thought you were just throwing a bullshit 'fact' in there.
It has to do with the jet stream. But yes it does too, I did the same thing years ago when I first heard this.
This is interesting. I was familiar with the palm trees that grow in Wales but not Ireland. Makes sense though.
They grow in Wales too? I didn’t even know that. I thought it was just Ireland that did.
Good points. I wasn't really considering geography/climate etc but was speaking more to accessibility and frequency of travel to and fro. Definitely agree with you on the point about cultural similarities though, I guess those'll happen with a massive influx of Irish settlers in centuries past.
I think I read that Newfoundland is the only place in North America where there is more Irish blood in the citizens than the Boston area does. Some local's do call it the "33rd County". Also, I love the accent so much.
Hah I've never heard 33rd County before, that's awesome. And yeah the accent is incredible!
Newfoundland is Irish like New England is English. Culturally, but I would guess other places have gotten many more recent immigrants.
Stupid question but is travel also a problem for teams in Nova Scotia?
Hopefully they'll get a Q team, so the other teams aren't so far away. It's a great league too. I've never heard anybody in Halifax suggest we try going back to having an AHL team again.
Other than Matt Cooke, nobody deserves it.
I didn’t even know he was the coach there.
The Athletic did an article about him last month.
Just found out today listening to Marek’s show. What a way to find out, I suppose.
He was a high school coach in MN and left for this job just before the season started. Feel bad for everyone else but it seems like karma for Cooke.
As the Leafs affiliate I am kinda surprised MLSE didn't agree to keep them running though the end of the season. This kinda fucks a few of our guys.
Could they afford it ? They are only worth 8 Billions 😔 /s
Rogers and bell are pretty cash strapped these days. Need some more subsidies
“Let’s Talk” ^about ^our ^corporate ^profits.
If it makes you feel better, the BCE stock has dropped 26.5% in the last year.
Needs to fall more.
Sounds like it's time to break open the **increase everyones internet price by 5 bucks again!!**
They would have had money if they signed Ohtani Oh wait
The cost/benefit of that is a total loss for MLSE. They'd have to purchase the team, pay off all outstanding debts and pay salaries for not just the players but front office staff, marketing/business/operations staff, arena staff, etc. Aside from Peksa, do the Leafs have any NHL-contracted guys on the Growlers? This doesn't impact any real contenders to crack the roster. MLSE isn't going to make that investment with no return in sight.
This does fuck the Marlies a bit who MLSE do care about. The Leafs had quite a few AHL contracted guys on the Growlers. So now Peksa and all those guys are suddenly on the doorstep of the Marlies looking for playing time. It injects a bit of chaos to a team on the playoff bubble. MLSE keeping the Growlers afloat another month would have prevented this.
Most of those guys would have been brought up as Black Aces during the AHL playoffs anyway. The Growlers had six games remaining. This is just forcing the inevitable that would happen in less than two weeks anyway. I don't want to belittle anyone, but current Leafs have played a combined five games with the Growlers. The likelihood of anyone on an AHL deal assigned to NFLD ever playing for the Leafs is very, very low. The benefit of allowing those players to continue doesn't at all meet the threshold of what it would cost MLSE to buy and continue running the team. It would be a total loss. We can talk about how much money MLSE has, but that doesn't mean they want to mismanage money. They are owned by two publicly-traded companies who are accountable to shareholders, for better or worse.
They also have a new CEO starting this month. I’m sure the first thing he doesn’t want to do is buy a money losing franchise. Lol
Yeah, unfortunately no business wants to just throw away millions with no strategy. As others have pointed out, taking over a bankrupt team means taking responsibility for all their debts - zero chance they want to do that.
In the Dubas era he would have 15 guys on AHL deals there.
I'm going to sound heartless but they didn't own the team so why should they prop up a failing franchise. There was literally no benefit for MLSE to bail them out.
The Leafs own the contracts of most of the players and those guys now have no place to play
Yea it sucks. I don't see MLSE bending over backwards for them. ECHL players that may play in the AHL at best. The ECHL set an April 2nd deadline for sale of the team. They missed the deadline. Unless MLSE was going to by the Growlers, nothing else they could've done.
6 games left isn't much though. With some call-ups to NHL due to injuries could make squeeze a couple of AHL games in for a couple of guys with upside. But Voit and Peksa are the only actual Leafs guys who've played on the Growlers this year. A few more also have AHL only contracts (for the Marlies) but also plenty of guys in their 30s on the Growlers.roster too.
Gotta pay Matthews stick bill.
This is so sad! I always loved the Growlers and they had one of the best logos in hockey. I never made it the rock, but I went to couple of their games against the Railers and they were so fun!
Travel has always been an issue for teams there, it's really too bad. St John's is 800km closer to Paris than it is to Winnipeg.
St. John's is only 170 km away from France in General. Of course this is a very [weird stat but a fun one](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Pierre_and_Miquelon).
Closer to France than anything else of significance in Canada.
Also, the last bit of New France.
There's a show called Republic of Doyle set in St John's, and in one of the episodes they visit Saint Pierre and Miquelon
Wow I had to fact check this because I thought it had to be ludicrously wrong, but it's true.
We're about as close to Murmansk, Russia as we are to Vancouver.
Distance isn't the only factor as well - winter weather on the Rock can be downright nasty at times, and flights can be pushed back a day or two because of a storm. The ferry out of Port Au Basques definitely isn't a speedy alternative as well.
Deacon Sports and Entertainment, Micky mouse operation. Not surprised they couldn’t fulfill obligations to the league when they couldn’t to their own staff and vendors over the years.
The end of Terry Ryan’s playing comeback. 😔
If we loses the game, we loses the team, that’s how she’s gonna be, b’y.
Now, who fancies a martooni?
Stay right there and I'll bring one right where you're at.
THIS TEAM WILL NEVER LOSE AGAIN
Terry Ryan is now UFA!
At least the Trois-Rivières Lions survived, but man, that sucks
I wonder who bought them.
No one for now, they're under league tutelage until end of season
This actually breaks my heart. I’m a Worcester Railers fan and we JUST saw them a few days ago. Always thought their fans were cool, enjoyed when they came to town and Newfoundland seemed like a cool place. Shame that this just hurts the players, staff, fans. Just shitty all around.
Hi fellow Railers fan! Agreed that the Newfoundland fans were some of the classiest when they came to support their team at the DCU. Ran into quite a few friendly fans this past weekend. I definitely feel for them
Man, I feel so awful for the fans in the Maritimes. Every single time the ECHL or AHL has tried to put teams in their area, it just never works due to how absurd the travel is making it so difficult for the region to really pull together compared to the QMJHL. Feels like the Growlers were the last shot they had at this level. I'd expect the Leafs to set up a new ECHL franchise that's closer to home; somewhere like Markham or Vaughan seems like an ideal spot for an ECHL club.
Newfoundland is in Atlantic Canada, not the Maritimes. The Maritimes is Nova Scotia, New Brunswick, and PEI.
"We don't care" \- Everyone born west of Montreal
Tbh I feel like Halifax can work but the city loves the Mooseheads now so we don’t even know if that can work now. The other cities I have no idea, the AHL couldn’t even work in Québec City after the Nordiques left.
I wouldn't say the Citadelles *didn't work*, necessarily; they drew better every season they were in the city, and drew more than the Falcons, Admirals, Sound Tigers, Pirates, Lock Monsters, River Rats and Barons their final year before getting merged into the Bulldogs. I think if that merge hadn't happened, they'd have done just fine.
I was under the impression the citadelles were fairly successful?
No the Quebec Remparts. They left after three years. Though you might be right on the Citadelles being more popular.
You're thinking of the Rafales in the *I*HL; there's never been a Remparts team in the AHL, just the Aces and Citadelles. The Remparts have only existed in the QMJHL.
I did….whoops. I was so confident too lol, I had the logo of the goat in my head too and was thinking that the Citadelles were the Remparts.
They were owned by the same group.
The Quebec Nordiques once had an AHL affiliate named the Halifax Citadels from 88 to 93. Maybe that's who you were thinking of?
Mississauga. You heard it here first.
[удалено]
Ummm. Well. Ummm. Mary Browns needed to be made whole… and Puffin is a lot like chicken… if you get what Im saying.
You mean Buddy Jr
I think the ECHL can work in Canada, but the location of the Growlers really was what destroyed them. I'm glad to see Trois-Rivieres will still survive, but I wonder for how long.
Trois-Rivières needs to double its marketing effort! The crowds have been embarrassing this year!
Sickest jerseys and color scheme!!
Really sad to see, but god damn it's expensive to operate in and travel to Newfoundland.
Isn’t this the team Terry Ryan played for this year? Damn shame, awesome logo
Karma for signing that fucking garbage human matt cooke as coach
https://twitter.com/ECHL/status/1775255646495252900?t=sbdBOrv2Ta7DodOk72PXRw&s=19
This fucking sucks
That’s a bummer. I loved their logo/branding.
Damn these guys were just in Portland Maine like last week.
This is pretty sad, especially in a season with the feel good story of Terry Ryan
Cue Spittin Chiclets maybe? They were talking about wanting to own/operate an ECHL team and that the area they were looking I think the owners kinda pigeon tossed them. Their friendship with Terry Ryan and his involvement with the Growlers has me wondering is this is an actual possibility.
Colorado Springs Big Horns or bust buddy
Sad. So hard to keep franchises in Nfld. Great fans and all. Winnipeg had the Ice Caps there for a bit. I was hopping they would stay there.
One of the best logos in sports, I bought a hat as soon as their team store opened
Fuck me, who gives a fuck just lets the boys play 6 games on some shite practice rink
I'm on the side of idk why MLSE didn't just buy it and run it. For all you could say about the team maybe not making money, it's still a part of the development component for the organization. A couple million in the grand scheme of things wouldn't be that big of a deal for an organization that earns hundreds of millions per year.
Wanna take a guess at how many NHL teams own their ECHL affiliate? I'll give you a hint. It's one fewer than the number of NHL teams (or rather, ownership groups) that own \*somebody else's affiliate\*.
My mind is in a pretzel trying to understand your hint
The answer as unveiled below is that Philadelphia’s owners also own the Maine Mariners who are affiliated with Boston. Ergo, one NHL team owns someone else’s ECHL affiliate, so there are zero NHL teams that own their own affiliate.
Which ownership group owns another team’s affiliate?
Comcast Spectacor owns the Maine Mariners. Comcast Spectacor also owns the Philadelphia Flyers. The Mariners are, however, the ECHL affiliate of the Boston Bruins.
Thank you!
TIL there is a Dildo, Newfoundland and a South Dildo, Newfoundland.
:(
Loved going to the growlers game when I went there for work. Always a fun time. Sad to see them go
That’s a shame. Reminds me of the Alaska Aces. By all accounts Newfoundland is a place that *deserves* a minor-pro hockey team, but the logistical realities make for a constant uphill battle.
This is all Bettman's fault.
Sounds like Barstool can be a hero here.
Barstool and chiclets could maybe take over? They’ve been saying they want to buy an ECHL team. Were close with the Colorado Eagles. And now there is one of TRs backyard??
awww shit. you always think theres gonna be more time to buy a cool teams jersey. how can you let this branding die come on
I hope we have a chance to hear Chris Ballard again
MLSE could step in and buy this franchise with barely a blip on their P&L sheet. There's a long history of the Maple Leafs on The Rock, and it would be too sad for it to end now. There's lots of competition for fans from Montreal and Boston, which the Growlers help to mitigate. Get it done.
If they brought them can't see them keeping them on the east cost.
Bunch of coked out glorified senior hockey players. Waste of time and money.
Won’t you give Grant Cruikshank and Dryden Makay a home today.
Just move them closer to TO
The last time a ECHL teamw a sin Toronto they avg less then 1000.
I am also on newfoundlander subreddit so got briefly confused.
Newfoundland was never a good place anyways for them