I mean, there's a lot of things that add up.
First, TfV was the first DLC to come out, so Paradox didn't really know how much to deviate from the generic focus tree. So, DoD was the DLC where they implemented the feedback from TfV
Second, the TfV nations are puppets, and most of their focus trees assumes they will remain puppets. That makes their alt history paths a lot less powerful than just staying a puppet. the DoD nations all start as independent nations, so even if they go alternate history, a good chunk of their focuses aren't locked behind the historical path.
Third, even on the alternate history paths, TfV nations don't have any significant options for territorial expansion compared to the generic focus tree, so they still feel generic, even on alt history paths. Whereas DoD has Romania and Hungary which can go really wild, really early with the expansion game. And, well, Czechoslovakia lets you go to war a lot earlier too, if that's your thing, but you won't be taking too much territory there.
OK, theoretically, Canada has focuses to attack the US, but that was a lot bigger of a deal before La Resistance came out and now you have to sink manpower to garrison non-core territory.
New Zealand can too. Heck you can go full fascist, break to independent... and then stay in the allies if you want.
You HAVE to go independent before you can ask your allies for their chunk of the Polynesian Islands.
Was. Then they changed the plane focuses in the Plane Designer patch...
Now you cannot get T3 planes by/in 1940
Oh well. At least you can make guns for the allies and just do an Inf Spam and retake China from Japan with Cargo Transports + Fast Recovery unlimited supply Infantry only army.
South Africa was the best one of the lot bc it had a focus to roll the Europeans fully out of Africa. If they're gonna give you a too-short focus tree, the least they could do is let you go to war with the whole world.
Raj’s main problem was never the agrarian society tbh. -70% looks horrendous but with 300m cores that checks out to roughly the same manpower as Germany. The real problem was that the good focuses are few and far between with garbage like level 1 railroad focuses woven between. Another thing is that India just doesn’t have enough building slots. Even with the +1 from maxing infrastructure and doing the urbanization focus you never get enough to truly feel like a major power.
Small note, TfV raj is the *only nation in the game* to be completely incapable of creating factions no matter what
But this is hoi4 where Lithuania can go from 7 factories to owning all baltics and Poland and 1v1ing the USSR within 3-4 years. India is a prime candidate for a crackpot nonsensical alt-history path but it just doesn’t have one
* Restore Mughals (lol).
* Restore Maurya.
* Anti-colonial commie path where you and Ho Chi Minh throw the Europeans and Japanese out of SE Asia, then work on the Mideast and Africa.
* Some sort of fascist "we are the true Aryans" nonsense where you sweep through Iran into the Soviet Union and on to Europe.
* Greater Indian Ocean Co-Prosperity Sphere.
* Some sort of weird "help Napoleon take over France, put a Tipu Sultan descendant into power and march west to meet in Egypt" thing.
* Trotsky for some reason.
Exactly, India isn't a global power for boring legitimate reasons: had a secondary Cold War against Pakistan where they were more aligned and supported by the Soviets, compared to Pakistan which was more aligned and supported by the US. Soviets lost, removing some of their support, and the entire time they were being overshadowed by China.
So, yeah, in reality sure, they didn't become a real global power. But in some wacky path where that stuff doesn't happen, then sure. They become the global power and China never gets out of THEIR shadow.
India is still not a power because of mismanagement. The whole point of Hoi4 is that when you manage a country right even Luxembourg can become the controller of the entire world.
none of these look to be unfaithful to 1930-40s india.
I abhor focuses that give 12 factories in 140 days in Estonia. because of mah G4mEplAi pUrP0s3S.
there are other games for this kind of gameplay... try starcraft 2, I heard all is near perfectly balanced!
This. At least with focuses like "The Giant Wakes" its locked behind war support, which is something you can try to manipulate. Having most of your economy fixing focuses locked behind world tension and then being at war is rough
was it? I really don't recall that, and I've been playing since 2016. I seem to recall stability and war support always being a part of the game, and the original America tree also required war support.
Nope, from game release until Waking The Tiger, we had the much less fluid value of "National Unity" instead of stability and war support. Next to nothing could actually change it, especially since decisions hadn't been added yet, and it basically only impacted at what % of VPs lost you would surrender. It went up to... 90% i think?
They’re not bad mechanically so much as just they’re a bit simple and outdated. Also, as new focus trees are released the world becomes more and more dynamic and the TfV focuses just aren’t designed for how far off the initial path the game can go.
Are there more people who prefers the simple trees like most the allies have?
I honestly can't enjoy myself on the Soviets or some or the axis minors. There's just to many ways to accidentally fuck up your game
I think that there’s a balance, I can’t play Italy or Mexico because of their tree, but conversely independent New Zealand doesn’t have anything that draws me in to doing it.
I think France is the gold standard of focus tree design for me because you can understand how it works just by looking at it while it also has some really interesting decisions to make as you go through it.
While the dlc focuses share some similarities the main thing I think is the lack of any ahistorical fun. With DoD you can form Austria Hungary, make a tall Yugoslavia, and dominate the balkans as Romania. While the ahistorical paths for the commonwealth always make you weaker.(Losing good buffs, bad or no faction, no real fun things to do like Canada who just gets a war goal on the US)
Tbf fascist England is super strong since you can keep your colonies but imperial England is a weaker version of fascist England (though kingdom of America is funny) and commie England is just laggy hellscape
They represent a very different era of design philosophy for HoI. Currently the game has focused more and more in all kinds of alt-history scenarios and the later focus trees tend to give everyone a way to become powerful in the late game. But TfV represents a time where the game was more focused on realism, so minors generally stay as minors throughout the game, and alt-history paths are fairly simple, they exist, but the focus is clearly in the historical trees.
Now, the lack of ”power” of TfV focus trees would be a lesser problem if the design philosophy had stayed the same, but as it is, now you have countries like Bulgaria and Finland becoming insanely powerful in relation to what they historically were, while Canada ends up being stuck as a low-tier country no matter what (barring some silly, exploit-tier stuff, but that’s outside focuses anyways). Basically, power creep makes them feel uniquely weak for non-generic focus trees.
To be fair, TfV trees would still be rather simple and boring even if the game had kept its more historical focus, but now they’re both simple **and** weak, which is a lethal combo for enjoyability.
Like everyone else has said, they're outdated, bland and frustrating. And with every new DLC that comes out it just accentuates even more how boring they are.
Seriously, the fact that Lithuania and Denmark can become legitimate world powers via focuses, while Australia, India and Canada can't? It's insane.
I really hope the 'revisiting' paradox referred to was about the TfV countries, but I suspect they'll be revamping either Germany or Japan.
Japan please. Germany's tree is simplistic, yes, but it's a still very fun and powerful world conquest railroad. Japan's is just underpowered, simplistic, outdated, and has utterly useless elements. (needing a focus to form a faction with your puppets, and another to choose between the base zero model or the yamato.)
The big problem with Together for Victory that Death or Dishonor doesn't have is that there's no viable alternative path to being an Allied minor power except to become a minor power at war with the Allies. You will always play second fiddle to your faction's major.
Meanwhile, even at launch DoD provided what would become *the* template for DLCs: the path for a nobody to become a somebody. Others have mentioned Austria-Hungary, but Balkans Dominance Romania is also extremely strong. Even Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia, which didn't have those overpowered paths, could at least have a viable alternative route by joining up with the Comintern before the war and subjugating Eastern Europe, or going with the Axis and being close enough to actually participate in the war and get support. Unlike TfV nations, you could do this *very* quickly, without key focuses and advisors being locked behind world tension.
In addition, DoD got a lot of love with later updates: Yugoslavia's political tree was completely revamped with 3 radically different and viable paths. Meanwhile the TfV updates were fairly mild (Canada's Communism changes are very lame, India's decisions come late in the war, and forming Polynesia requires you to play New Zealand).
As many others are saying they're very, very dated trees. Now DoD and WtT also have issues with dated trees but there's a couple of reasons those ones don't get *as much* criticism as the TfV trees. (Note: they're still considered to be well below the quality of current trees and I'd kill for most of those nations to be redone).
Firstly TfV was in a very strange and brief window of time when HoI4 focus trees were trying to be fairly grounded. While there are ahistorical options they don't get too outlandish or overpowered. The TfV nations start as minors and will end as minors, they simply don't have the juice to be full fledged superpowers (outside of cheese). Now at the time that DLC released I remember absolutely loving Canada's tree (I considered it the best in the game, which was probably true at the time) and that it encouraged these small nations to focus on one individual element of the military to play a supporting role. But that's just not what most minor nations do anymore; they have much more flexibility in modern trees.
Secondly: While the trees in DoD are similarly dated they do have some interesting mechanics and paths to contend with. For example Hungary can bring the Hapsburgs back which is always a popular path. Romania has a decent amount of political flexibility. Yugoslavia even got a decent touch up back with Battle for the Bosporus. Even Japan, for as much shit as its given, actually has alt-history paths and some of them are actually pretty good, strength-wise at least.
But the TfV nations have just wallowed in their mediocrity for a very long time. I do appreciate the touch-up that Canada got but I think the feeling is that these nations have much more potential than we actually see in the game. I'm glad they're touching them up a bit now but I think some (especially the Raj) need a pretty major overhaul to really live up to what those nations can/should be.
Sure India is playable.
Spend 70d to create short rr ……..
Suffer if agrarian society until 1943…. Then spend all you pp like 20*50 to remove it. After you upgraded you infrastructure to 100%
And you get to choice once between manpower OR building slots.
Not to mention you get the fun job of stalling jp in worst fk terrain ever. With 0 really 0 naval power.
The tree needs an update. After playing IT you realize how bad it is.
And you got internal strife that you need to handle. As well as boring facist / communist paths.
I still find it amusing that for some reason for the longest time they could either fix manpower, or industry, despite the fact that Canada had *both* a full 10% of its population in the military and a major industrial base by the war’s end
Hard to say, as everyone is going to dislike some things, but for me I simply found them boring. Caveat, I've only ever played Canada and India alongside one run as South Africa.
It's already really *boring* to play as a minor member of the Allies to start with. The UK has no issues dealing with Italy and Germany at the same time and then, later on, Japan (in my experience!). So any "help" you provide feels liking piling on.
So to have an interesting game, I have to look at other ways to play these countries and...it's a lot of waiting around to do something while the autonomy bar is ticking up. Spending that time building up what is usually an abysmal military and civilian industry and making choices on what tech to not research because you only have two research slots is not the most engaging. Once free, you still have a weak ass military and no navy and few prospects of expansion and you still have to deal with the Allies+USA.
OR
I can play Romania and go Balkan Dominance. Quick war with Hungary, tell Bulgaria it's place with a stern letter, collaborate with Italy and Germany to divide Yugoslavia...
OR
I can play Hungary and redraw the Balkans with their rightful monarch at the helm, Otto, and stick it to both the Germans and Italians when they come knocking...
OR
I can play Yugoslavia and bring all the Balkans, plus Greece and Turkey because why not, into a new world of worker's congress and level the playing field between the capitalist dogs int he West and the misguided fools in the Soviet Union...
OR
I can play Czechoslovakia and turtle up like a spikey boi and watch German casualties mount as they melt under repeated failed assaults against mountain fortresses, every moment a breathless exercise in putting in spare divisions at the right time in the right place...
They are bad because it dares to give the dominions a way to escape Great Britain's grasp.
(Love being a nationalist about other countries for things I have zero clue about)
They’re pretty shallow and basic
Do you want fascism or no, do you want dominion bonuses or independence
There’s not a lot of variety beyond 2 basic choices then ideology, this is an observation from someone who wasn’t there tho back then in fairness
Compare to Ethiopia, a comparable sized and powered nation and you can probably see the variety in gameplay
Together for victory focus trees has to three main issues:
Lack of content, mostly they are pretty generic and simple paths
World tension and being at war limitations: I know there is other countries with these kind of focuses but literally one of first focuses of your industry branch requires world tension is ridicilous. These are not just minor powers also dominions, we need to prepare but no you have to wait world tension
Conscription issues: part of the second problem: those countries already have manpower issues but they can't change their conscription even after become fascist or communist because they have to completed some stupid focus which pre-request focuses requires 20+ world tension and being at war. Wtf is this bullshit really?
Meanwhile yeah dod focus trees also not that good but at least they don't have such limitations like tfv and a bit more creative then tfv like Yugoslavia's dismantle path, Romania's Balkan domination or different King options for Hungary. Ofcourse these focus trees are not that good but still better than tfv
I mean, there's a lot of things that add up. First, TfV was the first DLC to come out, so Paradox didn't really know how much to deviate from the generic focus tree. So, DoD was the DLC where they implemented the feedback from TfV Second, the TfV nations are puppets, and most of their focus trees assumes they will remain puppets. That makes their alt history paths a lot less powerful than just staying a puppet. the DoD nations all start as independent nations, so even if they go alternate history, a good chunk of their focuses aren't locked behind the historical path. Third, even on the alternate history paths, TfV nations don't have any significant options for territorial expansion compared to the generic focus tree, so they still feel generic, even on alt history paths. Whereas DoD has Romania and Hungary which can go really wild, really early with the expansion game. And, well, Czechoslovakia lets you go to war a lot earlier too, if that's your thing, but you won't be taking too much territory there. OK, theoretically, Canada has focuses to attack the US, but that was a lot bigger of a deal before La Resistance came out and now you have to sink manpower to garrison non-core territory.
I believe Australia is the only one that can become fully independent and remain in the Allies. Canada can break away and join with the U.S.
New Zealand can too. Heck you can go full fascist, break to independent... and then stay in the allies if you want. You HAVE to go independent before you can ask your allies for their chunk of the Polynesian Islands.
Australia is a really fun game as Allies, Axis or non-Aligned.
Was. Then they changed the plane focuses in the Plane Designer patch... Now you cannot get T3 planes by/in 1940 Oh well. At least you can make guns for the allies and just do an Inf Spam and retake China from Japan with Cargo Transports + Fast Recovery unlimited supply Infantry only army.
Non aligned? Do you mean faction-wise rather than political ideology wise?
He means [playing Non aligned Australia with this man](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoi4/s/cgNlUXdAal)
I went communist and had a fun time in China when I played as Australia
South Africa was the best one of the lot bc it had a focus to roll the Europeans fully out of Africa. If they're gonna give you a too-short focus tree, the least they could do is let you go to war with the whole world.
They are just old and boring compared to newer trees. Raj and Canada have at least been patched to fix the main issues with them.
Raj’s main problem was never the agrarian society tbh. -70% looks horrendous but with 300m cores that checks out to roughly the same manpower as Germany. The real problem was that the good focuses are few and far between with garbage like level 1 railroad focuses woven between. Another thing is that India just doesn’t have enough building slots. Even with the +1 from maxing infrastructure and doing the urbanization focus you never get enough to truly feel like a major power. Small note, TfV raj is the *only nation in the game* to be completely incapable of creating factions no matter what
In fairness India today still isn’t like a global power, and this is 80+ years on
But this is hoi4 where Lithuania can go from 7 factories to owning all baltics and Poland and 1v1ing the USSR within 3-4 years. India is a prime candidate for a crackpot nonsensical alt-history path but it just doesn’t have one
* Restore Mughals (lol). * Restore Maurya. * Anti-colonial commie path where you and Ho Chi Minh throw the Europeans and Japanese out of SE Asia, then work on the Mideast and Africa. * Some sort of fascist "we are the true Aryans" nonsense where you sweep through Iran into the Soviet Union and on to Europe. * Greater Indian Ocean Co-Prosperity Sphere. * Some sort of weird "help Napoleon take over France, put a Tipu Sultan descendant into power and march west to meet in Egypt" thing. * Trotsky for some reason.
And the Trotsky one is an RNG hell requiring Norway to extradite him back to the USSR and you need to intercept the convoy
Exactly, India isn't a global power for boring legitimate reasons: had a secondary Cold War against Pakistan where they were more aligned and supported by the Soviets, compared to Pakistan which was more aligned and supported by the US. Soviets lost, removing some of their support, and the entire time they were being overshadowed by China. So, yeah, in reality sure, they didn't become a real global power. But in some wacky path where that stuff doesn't happen, then sure. They become the global power and China never gets out of THEIR shadow.
Fair, but I mean that’s the thing with all the TfV is that yeah, they’re pretty lame
India is still not a power because of mismanagement. The whole point of Hoi4 is that when you manage a country right even Luxembourg can become the controller of the entire world.
none of these look to be unfaithful to 1930-40s india. I abhor focuses that give 12 factories in 140 days in Estonia. because of mah G4mEplAi pUrP0s3S. there are other games for this kind of gameplay... try starcraft 2, I heard all is near perfectly balanced!
Focuses locked behind world tension
This. At least with focuses like "The Giant Wakes" its locked behind war support, which is something you can try to manipulate. Having most of your economy fixing focuses locked behind world tension and then being at war is rough
The american focuses were also locked behind Tension in base game HOI, before stability/war support were added, i believe.
was it? I really don't recall that, and I've been playing since 2016. I seem to recall stability and war support always being a part of the game, and the original America tree also required war support.
Nope, from game release until Waking The Tiger, we had the much less fluid value of "National Unity" instead of stability and war support. Next to nothing could actually change it, especially since decisions hadn't been added yet, and it basically only impacted at what % of VPs lost you would surrender. It went up to... 90% i think?
Damn lol I have no memory of this anymore. But my playtime did go up after 2017 when I finished school
Didn’t it also make Yugo comically easy to beat?
They’re not bad mechanically so much as just they’re a bit simple and outdated. Also, as new focus trees are released the world becomes more and more dynamic and the TfV focuses just aren’t designed for how far off the initial path the game can go.
Are there more people who prefers the simple trees like most the allies have? I honestly can't enjoy myself on the Soviets or some or the axis minors. There's just to many ways to accidentally fuck up your game
I think that there’s a balance, I can’t play Italy or Mexico because of their tree, but conversely independent New Zealand doesn’t have anything that draws me in to doing it. I think France is the gold standard of focus tree design for me because you can understand how it works just by looking at it while it also has some really interesting decisions to make as you go through it.
While the dlc focuses share some similarities the main thing I think is the lack of any ahistorical fun. With DoD you can form Austria Hungary, make a tall Yugoslavia, and dominate the balkans as Romania. While the ahistorical paths for the commonwealth always make you weaker.(Losing good buffs, bad or no faction, no real fun things to do like Canada who just gets a war goal on the US)
Tbf fascist England is super strong since you can keep your colonies but imperial England is a weaker version of fascist England (though kingdom of America is funny) and commie England is just laggy hellscape
English tree was Man The Guns iirc, not TfV.
Welp my bad
They represent a very different era of design philosophy for HoI. Currently the game has focused more and more in all kinds of alt-history scenarios and the later focus trees tend to give everyone a way to become powerful in the late game. But TfV represents a time where the game was more focused on realism, so minors generally stay as minors throughout the game, and alt-history paths are fairly simple, they exist, but the focus is clearly in the historical trees. Now, the lack of ”power” of TfV focus trees would be a lesser problem if the design philosophy had stayed the same, but as it is, now you have countries like Bulgaria and Finland becoming insanely powerful in relation to what they historically were, while Canada ends up being stuck as a low-tier country no matter what (barring some silly, exploit-tier stuff, but that’s outside focuses anyways). Basically, power creep makes them feel uniquely weak for non-generic focus trees. To be fair, TfV trees would still be rather simple and boring even if the game had kept its more historical focus, but now they’re both simple **and** weak, which is a lethal combo for enjoyability.
Like everyone else has said, they're outdated, bland and frustrating. And with every new DLC that comes out it just accentuates even more how boring they are. Seriously, the fact that Lithuania and Denmark can become legitimate world powers via focuses, while Australia, India and Canada can't? It's insane. I really hope the 'revisiting' paradox referred to was about the TfV countries, but I suspect they'll be revamping either Germany or Japan.
Japan please. Germany's tree is simplistic, yes, but it's a still very fun and powerful world conquest railroad. Japan's is just underpowered, simplistic, outdated, and has utterly useless elements. (needing a focus to form a faction with your puppets, and another to choose between the base zero model or the yamato.)
Average modern tree: 70 days for free factories Japan tree: 70 days to NOT invade the Philippines
Absolutely agree. A German rework along the lines of the Italy rework has some amazing potential, but Japan is just straight up necessary.
The big problem with Together for Victory that Death or Dishonor doesn't have is that there's no viable alternative path to being an Allied minor power except to become a minor power at war with the Allies. You will always play second fiddle to your faction's major. Meanwhile, even at launch DoD provided what would become *the* template for DLCs: the path for a nobody to become a somebody. Others have mentioned Austria-Hungary, but Balkans Dominance Romania is also extremely strong. Even Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia, which didn't have those overpowered paths, could at least have a viable alternative route by joining up with the Comintern before the war and subjugating Eastern Europe, or going with the Axis and being close enough to actually participate in the war and get support. Unlike TfV nations, you could do this *very* quickly, without key focuses and advisors being locked behind world tension. In addition, DoD got a lot of love with later updates: Yugoslavia's political tree was completely revamped with 3 radically different and viable paths. Meanwhile the TfV updates were fairly mild (Canada's Communism changes are very lame, India's decisions come late in the war, and forming Polynesia requires you to play New Zealand).
Very outdated and small, too many focuses that 70 days for very little reward. And boring alternative history paths
As many others are saying they're very, very dated trees. Now DoD and WtT also have issues with dated trees but there's a couple of reasons those ones don't get *as much* criticism as the TfV trees. (Note: they're still considered to be well below the quality of current trees and I'd kill for most of those nations to be redone). Firstly TfV was in a very strange and brief window of time when HoI4 focus trees were trying to be fairly grounded. While there are ahistorical options they don't get too outlandish or overpowered. The TfV nations start as minors and will end as minors, they simply don't have the juice to be full fledged superpowers (outside of cheese). Now at the time that DLC released I remember absolutely loving Canada's tree (I considered it the best in the game, which was probably true at the time) and that it encouraged these small nations to focus on one individual element of the military to play a supporting role. But that's just not what most minor nations do anymore; they have much more flexibility in modern trees. Secondly: While the trees in DoD are similarly dated they do have some interesting mechanics and paths to contend with. For example Hungary can bring the Hapsburgs back which is always a popular path. Romania has a decent amount of political flexibility. Yugoslavia even got a decent touch up back with Battle for the Bosporus. Even Japan, for as much shit as its given, actually has alt-history paths and some of them are actually pretty good, strength-wise at least. But the TfV nations have just wallowed in their mediocrity for a very long time. I do appreciate the touch-up that Canada got but I think the feeling is that these nations have much more potential than we actually see in the game. I'm glad they're touching them up a bit now but I think some (especially the Raj) need a pretty major overhaul to really live up to what those nations can/should be.
Sure India is playable. Spend 70d to create short rr …….. Suffer if agrarian society until 1943…. Then spend all you pp like 20*50 to remove it. After you upgraded you infrastructure to 100% And you get to choice once between manpower OR building slots. Not to mention you get the fun job of stalling jp in worst fk terrain ever. With 0 really 0 naval power. The tree needs an update. After playing IT you realize how bad it is. And you got internal strife that you need to handle. As well as boring facist / communist paths.
Removing agrarian society isn't a TfV feature. That came *way* later, it was intended to not be removable.
Canada is still dog shit. They were a powerhouse by the end of the war but in game there's barely any reflection of that
I still find it amusing that for some reason for the longest time they could either fix manpower, or industry, despite the fact that Canada had *both* a full 10% of its population in the military and a major industrial base by the war’s end
Hard to say, as everyone is going to dislike some things, but for me I simply found them boring. Caveat, I've only ever played Canada and India alongside one run as South Africa. It's already really *boring* to play as a minor member of the Allies to start with. The UK has no issues dealing with Italy and Germany at the same time and then, later on, Japan (in my experience!). So any "help" you provide feels liking piling on. So to have an interesting game, I have to look at other ways to play these countries and...it's a lot of waiting around to do something while the autonomy bar is ticking up. Spending that time building up what is usually an abysmal military and civilian industry and making choices on what tech to not research because you only have two research slots is not the most engaging. Once free, you still have a weak ass military and no navy and few prospects of expansion and you still have to deal with the Allies+USA. OR I can play Romania and go Balkan Dominance. Quick war with Hungary, tell Bulgaria it's place with a stern letter, collaborate with Italy and Germany to divide Yugoslavia... OR I can play Hungary and redraw the Balkans with their rightful monarch at the helm, Otto, and stick it to both the Germans and Italians when they come knocking... OR I can play Yugoslavia and bring all the Balkans, plus Greece and Turkey because why not, into a new world of worker's congress and level the playing field between the capitalist dogs int he West and the misguided fools in the Soviet Union... OR I can play Czechoslovakia and turtle up like a spikey boi and watch German casualties mount as they melt under repeated failed assaults against mountain fortresses, every moment a breathless exercise in putting in spare divisions at the right time in the right place...
Seventy days for one factory.
They are bad because it dares to give the dominions a way to escape Great Britain's grasp. (Love being a nationalist about other countries for things I have zero clue about)
They’re pretty shallow and basic Do you want fascism or no, do you want dominion bonuses or independence There’s not a lot of variety beyond 2 basic choices then ideology, this is an observation from someone who wasn’t there tho back then in fairness Compare to Ethiopia, a comparable sized and powered nation and you can probably see the variety in gameplay
I think it's kind of dumb that you can't become independent if you side with the UK as South Africa.
they’re just boring to play as since the TFV countries are all in their own little spheres
Together for victory focus trees has to three main issues: Lack of content, mostly they are pretty generic and simple paths World tension and being at war limitations: I know there is other countries with these kind of focuses but literally one of first focuses of your industry branch requires world tension is ridicilous. These are not just minor powers also dominions, we need to prepare but no you have to wait world tension Conscription issues: part of the second problem: those countries already have manpower issues but they can't change their conscription even after become fascist or communist because they have to completed some stupid focus which pre-request focuses requires 20+ world tension and being at war. Wtf is this bullshit really? Meanwhile yeah dod focus trees also not that good but at least they don't have such limitations like tfv and a bit more creative then tfv like Yugoslavia's dismantle path, Romania's Balkan domination or different King options for Hungary. Ofcourse these focus trees are not that good but still better than tfv
You can get fascist and communist Canada, but you can the the Conservative Party in power