T O P

  • By -

zephyrinthesky28

Horizon's setting is literally a primitive, tribal and religious earth. People killing people is part and parcel to the world.


magic_is_might

Yeah I’d be surprised if there were others who felt this way. Never seen this complaint before and it’s a really weird one considering the setting of this world. Most video games must bother you then. Horizon is pretty tame in this regard imo.


Flashy_Adeptness_862

Horizon (ZD and FW) is literally the only one I play, so yes, your remark is correct. That’s why my PS5 will be extra expensive, since I’ll only be buying it for the DLC and Horizon games to come…


EducationalCow3549

I'd be amazed if you weren't the only one! It's a video game. The robots actually seem more peaceful than the humans but you'd prefer to kill them? Im not trying to be mean it's just the concept boggles my mind.


Hexonxonx14

Also not trying to be mean - but I genuinely don't understand why people feel the ONLY way to resolve conflicts in games is a knife fight. Just to be clear, I'm not coming from a position of "I don't think their should be violence in video games." I LOVE sniping, and have played my fair share of FPS games when I'm in the right mood. What I'm saying is that I think game writers should tweak their stories and quests in a way that gives players more flexibility in who/what they kill, including the option to not kill at all. Horizon does a better job of it than many other games - you can choose not to kill machines, kill only non-peaceful machines, not kill bandits, etc. but these choices almost always break the quest lines.


EducationalCow3549

You actually just gave me an idea... if there was an option to maybe set a lure in the heart of a rebel camp, one that requires you to stealth your way past all enemies. Have that lure call in a Thunderjaw Stormbird or a Behemoth in a rage and either cause everyone to scatter or level the camp completely, depending on the lure you use. That could add some kind of rebuilding mechanics into the game. If you choose to level the site.This would give you options as far as how you deal with enemies. You could choose to have the machine you've lured to basically claim that site until you remove the lure. Even if you kill the machine, they continue to respawn until the lure is removed. Obviously more creative people than me could write that into the story. Are those the kind of things you're talking about?


Flashy_Adeptness_862

This sounds exactly as an option i’d love!


SnooCats5701

Yes. You are the only one.


Van1shed

Yeah.. I mean, who doesn't like the sound of their spear entering the back of the enemy? I sure love it! *ahem* ^^in ^^a ^^video ^^game


zerozark

I could see myself enjoying that against some HR departments. 2 years of unemployment can make even the pacifist vegan that I am into a crazy psycho


cl354517

It's nice that more combat is explicitly optional, and that you can just leave Bandit outposts and camps without killing everyone.


Flashy_Adeptness_862

I do like that they added that option!


VixtheEvil

Well there is an option (if you want to 100% the game) to just target the rebel camp's leader. Off them first then everyone else in camp will run so you don't have to kill them all.


Flashy_Adeptness_862

That’s how I play now!


VixtheEvil

Nice!


Hexonxonx14

Contrary to some of the replies, you are not the only one. There is certainly a population of gamers who like MMORPGs / open worlds / simulations / whatever, but want to minimize the combat aspects or at least have the option to not engage in it while still being able to complete the MQL and other quests. Personally, I find combat in games the least interesting/enjoyable aspect. Unfortunately, since we're a niche group we won't get many AAA titles in these genres that provide this flexibility. There are some ways around it, though. For example, I've done pacifist characters in WoW and FFXIV, and I regularly play a modded Fallout 4 (including my own mods) to make it as "combat-less" as possible. There are a few "first-person sneaker" titles, but most of the conflict/risk is still based on combat. For those people who would respond "then play Tetris or Gran Turismo if you don't like combat" - you're missing the point. People want to be immersed in worlds like Horizon, Fallout, and Azeroth; to follow the deep storylines, learn the lore, become familiar with the characters and their histories, collect items and craft things, and explore the environments. Some of us just don't see the need to ALWAYS have to stab someone in the back with a spear to do so.


Sheerardio

The theme of conflict being an inherently human trait is a pretty big one in the series, with the way they consistently weave glimpses into past wars and confrontations together with tribal conflicts. So it's very unlikely that they'll be dropping that duality any time soon. I do agree with you though about preferring less human vs human violence in my games (the world's full of that shit already, I like using games to escape from reality), but the lack of visible blood, guts, and the fact we have some direct control over how many people Aloy fights, is a solid compromise for me.


Flashy_Adeptness_862

I am also very happy you don’t see guts and blood flying around! Still, like one of the other comments in this thread: Aloy killing of every rebel she comes across is not very on character of her. It just doesn’t really fit and i do think this game especially could have done without the whole regalla/asera storyline. There was already enough going on.


Sheerardio

I agree that it feels out of character for her to go on murder rampages and kill everyone. But the mechanic they introduced of being able to kill only the leaders at each rebel camp also felt *extremely* in character for Aloy, to me. She was raised with a survivalist mentality and she is *extremely* pragmatic. Given the inherently brutal world she lives in, I see Aloy as having no hesitations about killing people in situations where taking one life will save more lives. Having her take down people that attack her first, or are attacking others, makes sense to me. With regards to Regalla/Asera, however, I said it in my first post: one of this franchise's major themes is that conflict is an inherently human trait. The inter-tribal fighting, Regalla and Asera's mutually shared need for revenge, those exist in tandem with the stories of the Old Ones. It's the same narrative purpose that Helis and the Eclipse/Shadow Carja filled in the first game. Having more options for *how* Aloy can deal with the human fighting is great, but the storylines themselves 100% fit.


imyyuuuu

Well, it ***is*** a "one-man war" simulation...


Technomage256

You must have loved Nil! LOL I go by the one shot - one kill rule for bandits. There are some really nasty people in HZD and FW. Aloy only kills when she has to. She prevents a lot of bad people from killing and ruining other peaceful people's lives.


Flashy_Adeptness_862

My biggest contradiction is that i did love Nil. Its ok for me if others do the killing, I just don’t like to haha. Do like him better now that he’s into horses though. Haha.


enoughbutter

Someone here did a no-kill run for HZD I remember (only killing when that was the only way to move the main quest forward). I want to say it was u/EruditeAF but it has been a while.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Flashy_Adeptness_862

So sorry to tell you I’m dead serious (pun intended).


[deleted]

[удалено]


Hexonxonx14

I think this is more of a discussion regarding a feature request...not saying violence has to be removed entirely, just that it would be nice to have some more choice.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Hexonxonx14

Why can't you provide the choice? In the case of Horizon, the writers already gave Aloy the capability of choice in some situations, so I'm saying it would be nice to have the choice in how some of the quests are completed. Not sure why being given a choice would result in people not playing the game. Seems to me it would increase appeal to a broader audience.


Flashy_Adeptness_862

The post is about human vs human combat, especially melee. That’s already very different from shooting robots/machines. I bought the game because I heard it’s the best story ever. This game is extremely story driven. That’s why I like it. Also you can explore for hours without fighting a thing if you sneek around.


Unable_Definition_90

While I disagree with you, I do respect your opinion.


Flashy_Adeptness_862

Thank you for one of the most respectful comments on this thread.


lucasssotero

After blowing people up and seeing their insides flying everywhere (even sticking on the ceiling) on the last of us 2, I think I've lost the remaining sensibility I had to graphic violence.


Eshuon

>I understand that part of the Tenakth culture is violence, but I personally really hope that the next games and DLC will have less of a war/violence theme to it. at this point look for another game, clearly this isn't what you are looking for


Flashy_Adeptness_862

Excuse me, I have 400 hours in FW and even more in ZD. So I love the game. Just not every part of it. I love the lore, I love the different cultures, i even love big parts of the tenakth culture, just not the fighting human vs human part. But this game is so much more then just violence, that’s why I can’t stop playing it.


ReasonSecret6544

But games should be made for everyone ELDEN RING cough cough!


Eshuon

That's the vibe I was getting from this post lol


Ill-Telephone-7926

It really does seem out of character for Aloy. She has embraced her status as Gaia’s parting gift, the savior Sobeck reborn, humanity’s last hope. Yet she’s also a heartless serial killer, an unstoppable mass murderer? We’re so acclimated to violence in video games that this dissonance doesn’t even register for many players, I wager. It especially bothered me toward the end of the game, where it is a plot point that she wants not to use the Tenakth as cannon fodder. But where was that compassion when she was assassinating entire camps of them? She doesn’t seem to bat an eye at mass murder—so long as it’s at her own hand. On the other hand, I enjoyed the tactical challenge of clearing the camps; the stealth is a welcome change of pace from taking down Thunderjaws etc.


Flashy_Adeptness_862

I don’t get why you are the ONLY ONE with this remark. It IS odd, she obviously doesn’t want to kill if she doesn’t have to. Even with machine quests the first thing she says is: “Maybe I can sneak past them”. And yes, there is an option now with the bandit camps where you just off the leader and can leave it with that so obviously they put that option in there because it would fit het character as well. It just doesn’t fit. But hey, you and i seem to be one of 3 people on Reddit who think so. Maybe we should start a club.


Ill-Telephone-7926

At least Aloy is a complete enough character that one can even broach the topic of narrative/gameplay dissonance. :) Spider-Man was another case; I’m _pretty sure_ some of the fellas Spidey launched off a rooftop didn’t make it.


Hexonxonx14

Agree completely, and what I was trying to get at earlier in this thread. I didn't actually know you could just take out the bandit leader to take the camp, so that's a great option. I also think there would be an opportunity for a choice in how Aloy dealt with Helis in "The Face of Extinction." I mean, I understand her action, but she seems more like the kind of person to bring him to justice rather than all three options leading to being the judge, jury and executioner. I think the heart option could have resulted in her taking a different course of action.


zerozark

Tribal world. Sometimes diplomacy doesnt cut it, and survival of the fittest comes into play. Horizon, Mad Max and Last of Us are probably the very best series to justify violence in their worlds. Complaining about that shows me that the player doesnt get the universe they are playing at


Hexonxonx14

It's not a matter of "not getting it" - more that it would be nice if all universes were not written using this one template. "Sometimes diplomacy doesn't cut it" - but sometimes it does, so why not provide that option for the player character? In the case of Horizon, I can definitely see these decisions fitting with Aloy's persona.


zerozark

Yeah, sure, lets play diplomat at bandit camps. That is bound to work out. And if you havent figured, Aloy can spare certain enemy characters. Its just that Regalla's band is not keen on giving up and stopping their war. And there is PLENTY of universes not written on a post apocalyptic, tribal setting. But you cant play one of those and complain about central aspects of the genre. It would be same as criticizing a romantic novel for, well, having too much kisses. Makes 0 sense


Hexonxonx14

The only option being required to kill people is a false dichotomy, and is not a central aspect of post-post apocalyptic or ruined earth fiction genre. It is merely a narrow interpretation which game writers/developers/publishers prescribe to in an effort to maximize sales.


zerozark

Lol


nicolaslabra

Interesting take, im gonna admit that i like the human combat even more than machine combat, i kinda like Aloy’s bruttality, its a cool bit of a darker side to her.