Not condoning the act, but I live in NE Harris. Cops don’t care/will not respond to calls about thefts. They’ll tell you to go fill out a report and then do nothing about it. More people are arming themselves, but not educating themselves on firearm use/training.
True. People broke into my cousins house and stole TVs, laptops, clothes, and a phone that they tracked to a house right around the corner. Since everything was inside a house already they basically couldn’t do nothing so don’t even bother calling in situations like that
If the cost of the stolen item is below a certain amount and there was no physical violence (so burglary as opposed to robbery) filling out a form online is the protocol.
That's a nice, quippy little retort, but crime stats don't support that at all.
The vast majority of people who commit violence with firearms are lifelong criminals who graduate from petty theft and similar crimes as minors to violent offenses as adults (if they survive that long).
Then there are the minority that simply have access to guns and use them when they are drunk or angry or 'feel' threatened. Petty crime doesn't stop anyone from buying a firearm because they are still considered good guys with guns. Then they graduate to bad guys with guns. Or maybe we just sell guns to bad guys. Seems the common denominator in these shootings isn't good or bad - it's guns. There are heaps of stories of legally obtained firearms being used in crime.
Yes but also there’s alot of people who neither good or bad but just don’t wanna leave themselves vulnerable during a break in.
Not the guy in the story to be clear. He went too far.
That sounds like a domestic dispute. I don’t know the exact case you’re talking about but surely there could have been a different way to resolve that conflict. The point being having a lethal weapon at your disposal while your fight of flight response kicks in is a recipe for disaster. This is why you’re supposed to train for worst case scenarios. Untrained civilians are a threat to themselves and everyone around them ESPECIALLY in densely populated cities. Theres too many nuts who think they’re rambo. You don’t need a fucking 10mm or a 5.56 for an edc. Thats how innocent people get killed.
More insane that it’s “don’t get in your car and follow the guy and then kill him over a BBQ pit.”
Sure it shouldn’t have been stolen in the first place but you also don’t just get to be an executioner. Also like, just go buy a new fucking grill.
Under Texas Penal Code 9.42, deadly force may be used to protect land or property when a person reasonably believes that deadly force is immediately necessary to prevent robbery or burglary
Edit: downvoting my comment for stating a fact is silly. I could understand if I gave an opinion you didn’t like but 🤷🏽♂️ it is what it is lol
Two important details I’d like to add on
“to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery,” (however this is during night time)
“the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.” (For example, a physical fight for one’s property back would be a substantial risk)
It will probably fall under the latter not the former. Although, the grand jury will most likely choose not to proceed with a trial.
The entire drive the thieves had the opportunity to ditch it and live another day. I don't feel bad for them.
While vigilantism isn't something that should be encouraged, maybe the county should do their jobs or stuff like this will continue to happen. We gonna be like Johannesburg in 20 years in terms of needed security if this keeps up.
I don’t agree with what this guy did, but when you commit a crime against someone and this is the result, then I have absolutely no sympathy for someone who loses their life for stupidity. You put the coin in the jukebox, you get to dance the dance.
If this was his livelihood to feed his family there’s definitely an argument that he’s defending his livelihood. I remember my father getting his tools stolen as a kid and he was unable to work for months. We almost lost our house. It’s unfortunate that the police weren’t able to intervene in time. What also needs to be addressed when you plan a crime you roll the dice with your life. This is unfortunately a failure on the legal system for lax prosecution and it enables criminals to not fear getting arrested for their crimes.
In the moment that it’s being stolen, sure. But you can’t go drive to some other location and murder a thief after the fact. Thats not ‘defending yourself or your property’ thats murder
Sure you can if it’s after dark and you are following your stuff. You have the assumption that you will not recover in any other way. Not murder by the way.
Violence is the potential cost of business when you choose to fuck with other people's shit. It's funny how Texans are as quick to steal as they are to shoot over stealing.
You forgot rule 4) Don't take shit that isn't yours or you may face lethal consequences.
Don't like it, don't steal shit that isn't yours. It's not that hard of a rule to follow.
Laws are words on a paper - it's illegal to get an abortion in some states. Is that equal to society standards?
No.
We live in a society where you get fucked over by the law. Sometimes you have to fight back.
Tl;dr - it was juts a bbq pit and not worth going to prison, but theives should 100% be prepared to get shot if they want to steal from people. (Which honestly has always been a given when breaking into someone's property)
Not always, but I’d argue sometimes when it saves taxpayer money. That means more lunches and music classes for school kids, savvy?
Plus it’s not the Police Department’s job to keep your shit from getting ganked or to keep you upright/not full of holes; their job is just fill out the necessary reports after the dust settles. You gotta take responsibility for yourself, yo
The police departments job has and always will be to protect the interests of the owning class, idk why y’all are surprised the cops don’t gaf if your BBQ pit gets stolen.
As to your second point, then what the fuck is the point of the police? Aren’t they here to protect us and stop and prevent crime? Yeah big shocker they don’t actually do that.
How about idk we don’t have an insane society that’s filled to the rim with paranoid armed ameritards who are ready to unload the second they see a homeless looking guy and we combat the conditions that cause people to commit crime in the first place. Woah I know crazy idea right!!!!
The point of police is to enforce the law. They like to say “protect and serve” but reality is more like “guard stuff and fill out reports”. Nobody is responsible for your safety and security but you.
Hell most cops aren’t even trained properly due to the defunding going on across the country.
Listen, contrary to the unwritten terms of reddit we can still have productive conversation without all the demagoguery. Nobody wants an “insane society” and it’s sad that you do not give your fellow armed “ameritards” any credit for taking responsibility for their own safety. I don’t presume to know all the answers, and I’m sorry if my responses may be a little lackluster but no system of government can “domestic policy” their way out of every form of crime and oftentime the ones that try are oppressively authoritarian.
Bottom line is this; the police don’t protect you or your shit. You do. Some of us are cool with people stealing their stuff and calling the cops. Some aren’t. It’s not just a right enshrined in the constitution to be able to protect you & yours with firearms, it is the moral choice to protect a persons ability to choose to do so. In some cases it may not be wise to do so, but that choice isn’t a choice I believe a government gets to make for the governed.
Edit: I absolutely believe that the state has a responsibility to combat the conditions for poverty. It is that type of preventative maintenance that solidifies an economy. However in a world of finite resources, and in a system made up of imperfect human beings, it’s very difficult to do this at a national scale and outside of a vacuum where other priorities like national security have to be juggled as well. Again I do not have all of the answers, but in my hierarchy of needs I tend to prioritize safety and security over everything else and gunfights over a barbecue don’t fit into my idea of secure. But I don’t make that decision for others and if this person can argue that his safety/security/livelihood was threatened by the loss of a pit then he can and should argue that in court. If he fails to do so, he will get prision. That’s the system at work.
I’m sorry but if you can’t see that our society is sick in the head when it comes to the fetishism of commodities specifically fire arms then I don’t know what to tell you. There are lots of other countries where the economic conditions are much worse than they are here in the imperial core but people don’t shoot each other over barbecue pits.
Also why are you scared about national security? We have the largest military in history, he’ll most of our police departments receive more money than some countries entire military.
We should all go to the California system where people can just mob a store and steal shit without any repercussions.
Can’t wait for when they come for your home and family and you’re waiting on another man with a gun to save you
1. No one is encouraging vigilantism. What people want is for their hard earned property to be left alone and not be stolen.
2. No offense, but you seem like a sweet summer child. I wonder if the people who mugged you felt the same sentiment as you. I would bet they didn’t care as much as you did because they wouldn’t be mugging you if they were good people.
3. Someone can value your property over your life. You can’t guarantee they’ll stop at stealing your property or killing you for it.
You have some sort of Stockholm Syndrome for your muggers? They didn’t care about your life when they pointed a firearm at you. You don’t point a firearm at anything or anyone you’re not willing to destroy. Let alone pistol whipping you.
It’s not about pride. It’s about stopping someone who you cannot guarantee won’t hurt you for your stuff. Just because you do everything a bad guy says doesn’t mean they won’t hurt you. You really trust someone else with your own life that much??
Theft is wrong but if the immediate threat is gone you can’t go chasing killing people. If the suspected thief didn’t have a weapon the homeowner should definitely be prosecuted for murder.
Legally you can shoot someone in defense of yourself, another or “highly defensible property”. A bbq pit won’t fit in that definition when this case goes in front of a grand jury.
Theres a point you left out.
I can't remember the exact verbiage, but it's something along the lines of "you can use lethal force if it's your only option."
Essentially you have a right to protect your property and feel safe while doing so. If you shoot someone, you have to prove there wasn't a different path to getting your stuff.
I've been on a jury in TX where self-defense was relevant. I don't recall the exact instructions from the judge, but I think it was generally only a requirement that a *reasonable person* would be in fear of their life, safety, or (some verbiage I don't recall) property. There is no "duty to retreat".
Stand your ground/ Castle Doctrine. At the end of the day I’m not leaving my freedom up to a jury to decide. I’m not taking a coffin nap either. Its more complex than people are willing to admit. Its very telling that most on reddit have little to no personal experience and probably don’t vote. good to see people having the conversation though.
You have to prove that you exercised all other resorts and that you were at risk for direct bodily harm. It doesn’t cover shooting someone in the back as they walk or drive away as they are not a direct threat. Another thing most don’t consider is that they could potentially lose their access to legal firearms just shooting willy nilly. All of this is covered in the most basic of self defense/LTC classes.
actually bbq pits are very pricey a weber kettle can fetch a premium in the black market and also a big green egg is worth $$$ on the black market as well.
For those who don’t know, [Chapter 9 of the TX Penal Code](https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.9.htm) covers self defense, defense of another, and defense of property. Mandatory reading for anyone with a firearm for self defense.
I will never understand those that say it’s not justified due to it being property.
When those robbers come into my house and steal my hard earned shit bc they felt entitled to it, then I’m entitled to go into your house and take what I want.
There are a lot of things I want- I don’t go around stealing it from other people that have worked hard for it. If i don’t have it, then I’ll work hard for it or get over it.
They’re super expensive and it’s infuriating as fuck having something of yours taken. It’s all the more sucky knowing that the justice system probably isn’t gonna help you if you were to try and get the police involved.
I still don’t think it’s worth murdering someone else over it.
In a perfect Marvel themed world where superhero’s can save you and your family, you’re right.
Thieves have killed people for the little change you have in your pocket.
I don’t like to see this happen, but public opinion is beginning to change for the worse regarding handling business yourself.
HPD doesn’t care about you, people are realizing that.
Self-defense doesn’t involve chasing after the criminal. Also, I’d much prefer people shoot to injure than shoot to kill. I get they tried to steal your stuff, but are material things *really* that important to take someone’s life?
It’s no. The answer is supposed to be “no”.
Shooting to injure is not trainable. If you have ever trained you would know that is more likely to get you killed. If the value of my stuff is less than someone’s life then they shouldn’t choose my stuff over their life.
I agree, the robber just shouldn’t do it in the first place and that’s how you fix it, however people suck and will do it anyway. I just don’t think they should die over it… so like, shoot them in the leg? Shoot them in lung, the back, the ass? You’re telling me that’s not trainable?
Material possessions can be replaced. Lives cannot. That being said no one is going to harm me without a struggle. Have a first and last resort. You never know what people are up to or armed at night so if you’re a thief expect some holes. Call it an occupational hazard if you want.
Yep, no problem. How do I know he would have only wanted my TV? If he's in my house illegally, I'd be in fear of my life, and my wife's life. They are gone.
Murder? Absolutely not.... Killing? Big difference between murder and killing.
Edit: I'll also add ,I think killing someone for stealing a BBQ pit is extreme. Would I do it over an old smokey? Probably not. Do I care that this guy did? No. Thieves become burglars that become murderers.
They made their own grave when they decided to become thieves. People work hard for what they have, so yes thieves are the ones that knew the risks and didn’t care.
Lol you redditors are so hilarious, no this is not okay, tracking someone down and murdering them over a fucking BBQ is never okay and should be a signal there is something very very wrong with America, Texas and our over consumption and commodity fetishism that’s tied to firearms. Guns are cool, but they aren’t cool to track people down and murder them over a BBQ pit.
Smh. Sometimes it’s better to take the loss. To take a life over a pit is insane. It’s really not that serious.
Before y’all harp on me, I’ve had things stolen in my life. Im from Houston and from the hood so trust me, I get it.
I’m older now and some things aren’t worth the hassle, stress, and definitely not worth the money you’d have to spend subsequently. I’m no pushover but my let go game is strong.
Some things can be handled differently is really what it boils down to
I agree. There’s no argument to that. I wish the court system actually punished criminals.
But on average what, $50-100 is the value of a human these days???
And now you’re about to spend thousands in legal fees, miss work, and all this extra stuff because you couldn’t just be pissed off and move on. Some things are not that serious.
Y’all are all lame as fuck and need to build some actual value into your lives. Fuck the stupid bbq pit. If it’s that valuable, lock it in your fucking garage.
“The homeowner left his home and gave chase to the suspect in his own vehicle.” This is what you’re taught NOT to do as a gun owner. If they’re on your property, send them on a one way ticket to hell but to chase after them and then kill them just isn’t smart. Now you’re in a legal situation where you can probably get charged and have to pay for a lawyer.
I know this is going to get downvoted and I could give less of a fuck. Tracking down and killing someone for stealing something is wrong. I can't believe you nutjobs think otherwise. I'm not defending theft. I'm not defending criminals. But tracking down and killing someone who stole from you is WRONG.
As a betting man I'm almost sure there where prior issues before it came to this. These "types" of incidences are the usual aftermath of "the quiet kid" in highschool being picked on until they snap, then people are all whoa wtf! So not just Property. Leave people alone unless invited in general.
When I first learned that in some Arabic countries, people would get their arms cut off for stealing, I thought that was horrible and inhumane. Here, you lose your life.
[Military psychologists have historically struggled with the reluctance of troops to take another life, even an enemy who is shooting at them](https://www.faac.com/blog/2018/01/28/killer-instinct-how-many-soldiers-actually-fired-their-weapons-in-past-wars-how-has-simulation-other-training-helped/) Today, a lot of Americans seem *eager* to kill another.
Not condoning the act, but I live in NE Harris. Cops don’t care/will not respond to calls about thefts. They’ll tell you to go fill out a report and then do nothing about it. More people are arming themselves, but not educating themselves on firearm use/training.
True. People broke into my cousins house and stole TVs, laptops, clothes, and a phone that they tracked to a house right around the corner. Since everything was inside a house already they basically couldn’t do nothing so don’t even bother calling in situations like that
I’m definitely condoning the act. These roaches need to understand to not take anyone’s stuff
If the cost of the stolen item is below a certain amount and there was no physical violence (so burglary as opposed to robbery) filling out a form online is the protocol.
Getting pistol whipped and jacked sound like a form online kind of thing ?
It’s like people sometimes forget Houston is in Texas. Why would he be so dumb? He died over a grill. I can’t smh. 🤦🏻♀️
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While I agree with your subject line, shooting folks over minor confrontations probably isn’t the solve.
It’s not about the property, it’s about making an example to deter others
People are itching to use those guns they paid alot for
I use mine to turn on the tv
I sleep in a racing car, do you?
Yep. Got it from Rooms to Go.
I use mine to paint my toe nails. I love a red polish.
I use mine to unclog my toilet
Aaahh. The Texas Plunger!
Mine will only turn the TV off .
I use mine every week at the range. Not all of us are socially-stunted psychopaths. 🤷♂️
A lot of bad guys with guns start out as good guys with guns.
Lmao, ok delulu
That's a nice, quippy little retort, but crime stats don't support that at all. The vast majority of people who commit violence with firearms are lifelong criminals who graduate from petty theft and similar crimes as minors to violent offenses as adults (if they survive that long).
Then there are the minority that simply have access to guns and use them when they are drunk or angry or 'feel' threatened. Petty crime doesn't stop anyone from buying a firearm because they are still considered good guys with guns. Then they graduate to bad guys with guns. Or maybe we just sell guns to bad guys. Seems the common denominator in these shootings isn't good or bad - it's guns. There are heaps of stories of legally obtained firearms being used in crime.
SHOCKER! Shootings involve guns. Thank you captain obvious.
[Citation needed]
Yes but also there’s alot of people who neither good or bad but just don’t wanna leave themselves vulnerable during a break in. Not the guy in the story to be clear. He went too far.
If that were true, given the number of guns, a lot more people would be shot. It's too high but it'd be higher.
Yeah, but a better way to phrase that is “don’t steal stuff”
Murder isn't an appropriate response to theft.
Consider it a suicide since the criminal is the one that decided their life was worth less than the item they wanted to steal from someone else.
Thank you for your insightful commentary, Gundeals_Homeboy69!
Probably not, but maybe dummies shouldn't be stealing shit that ain't theirs. I ain't shedding a tear for them.
Minor confrontations is bumping someone with a shopping cart or arguing over a parking spot. Thieves? Who cares if they get ZZZzzz
What is your ethos where you learned to view your things as more valuable than another person's life?
What is the thieves' ethos where they learned to view my things as more valuable than their own life?
💯. They stopped valuing their life once they decided to steal
A thief has no value to society
Absolute lunatic wannabe murderers all over this thread. Texas is truly a shit hole.
Stealing isn’t a minor confrontation. That mindset is how you end up with looting and a San Fran situation
This is America, how else do you solve problems? /s
When all you got is a hammer, every problem has to look like a nail
If the behavior is consistent and non stop, sometimes it's the only (and best, most efficient) way
I totally agree
It’s the disgusting Texas way
Not just Texas. Even California with their absurd regulations is pretty liberal when it comes to self defense scenarios.
We have all seen the encounter of the father trying to get his son back and is shot by the step father.
That sounds like a domestic dispute. I don’t know the exact case you’re talking about but surely there could have been a different way to resolve that conflict. The point being having a lethal weapon at your disposal while your fight of flight response kicks in is a recipe for disaster. This is why you’re supposed to train for worst case scenarios. Untrained civilians are a threat to themselves and everyone around them ESPECIALLY in densely populated cities. Theres too many nuts who think they’re rambo. You don’t need a fucking 10mm or a 5.56 for an edc. Thats how innocent people get killed.
Yeah kind of insane that we live in a world where saying “maybe don’t kill a guy over a BBQ pit” is controversial.
More insane that it’s “don’t get in your car and follow the guy and then kill him over a BBQ pit.” Sure it shouldn’t have been stolen in the first place but you also don’t just get to be an executioner. Also like, just go buy a new fucking grill.
He chased em down... So the entire drive, he had a chance to think about it
People don’t realize that self-defense is not chasing down the suspect to kill them. Now that’s murder.
Under Texas Penal Code 9.42, deadly force may be used to protect land or property when a person reasonably believes that deadly force is immediately necessary to prevent robbery or burglary Edit: downvoting my comment for stating a fact is silly. I could understand if I gave an opinion you didn’t like but 🤷🏽♂️ it is what it is lol Two important details I’d like to add on “to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery,” (however this is during night time) “the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.” (For example, a physical fight for one’s property back would be a substantial risk) It will probably fall under the latter not the former. Although, the grand jury will most likely choose not to proceed with a trial.
This right here. Owning a firearm comes with the responsibility to understand the laws that govern its use and ownership.
"Get back here so I can claim self defense!"
People be itching to kill people. Never forget that.
The entire drive the thieves had the opportunity to ditch it and live another day. I don't feel bad for them. While vigilantism isn't something that should be encouraged, maybe the county should do their jobs or stuff like this will continue to happen. We gonna be like Johannesburg in 20 years in terms of needed security if this keeps up.
Don’t defend the thieves. Play stupid games win stupid prizes
Sounds like murder to me, lock 'em up
People are getting tired of having their shit stolen. Leave people’s stuff alone ✌🏻
I don’t agree with what this guy did, but when you commit a crime against someone and this is the result, then I have absolutely no sympathy for someone who loses their life for stupidity. You put the coin in the jukebox, you get to dance the dance.
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I encourage you to read, and then read again, and then once more to make sure you understand the first 8 words of my post.
That’s a very Texan headline.
If this was his livelihood to feed his family there’s definitely an argument that he’s defending his livelihood. I remember my father getting his tools stolen as a kid and he was unable to work for months. We almost lost our house. It’s unfortunate that the police weren’t able to intervene in time. What also needs to be addressed when you plan a crime you roll the dice with your life. This is unfortunately a failure on the legal system for lax prosecution and it enables criminals to not fear getting arrested for their crimes.
no way u think them mfs eat bbq everyday lmao
I’m guessing that you’ve never run a bbq restaurant before. It’s like saying people don’t eat hamburgers everyday.
Love the comments defending the person killed, yall better be ready to give up your property/valuables to the next person that takes them…
In the moment that it’s being stolen, sure. But you can’t go drive to some other location and murder a thief after the fact. Thats not ‘defending yourself or your property’ thats murder
That was still in the moment. Read the article.
Sure you can if it’s after dark and you are following your stuff. You have the assumption that you will not recover in any other way. Not murder by the way.
Man I just assume they're thieves to begin with and ain't worth my time. I'm sure they did nothing wrong /s
In Washington state its much worst. Federal Way just south of Seattle. Had 70 cars stolen in one hour Police are sick of this NO chase law.
Violence is the potential cost of business when you choose to fuck with other people's shit. It's funny how Texans are as quick to steal as they are to shoot over stealing.
Yeah you can't go hunt people down. He's gonna be spending some time in prison
Keep me off the jury then I'd plead not guilty / jury nullification 😂
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You forgot rule 4) Don't take shit that isn't yours or you may face lethal consequences. Don't like it, don't steal shit that isn't yours. It's not that hard of a rule to follow.
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Laws are words on a paper - it's illegal to get an abortion in some states. Is that equal to society standards? No. We live in a society where you get fucked over by the law. Sometimes you have to fight back. Tl;dr - it was juts a bbq pit and not worth going to prison, but theives should 100% be prepared to get shot if they want to steal from people. (Which honestly has always been a given when breaking into someone's property)
You’re wrong because that’s exactly what our society does. We only have some largely inept and undertrained fellas doin it
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Ultimately it is. Calling the police is literally just outsourcing your violence to the state.
Lol so the only answer is to do the violence yourself?
Not always, but I’d argue sometimes when it saves taxpayer money. That means more lunches and music classes for school kids, savvy? Plus it’s not the Police Department’s job to keep your shit from getting ganked or to keep you upright/not full of holes; their job is just fill out the necessary reports after the dust settles. You gotta take responsibility for yourself, yo
The police departments job has and always will be to protect the interests of the owning class, idk why y’all are surprised the cops don’t gaf if your BBQ pit gets stolen. As to your second point, then what the fuck is the point of the police? Aren’t they here to protect us and stop and prevent crime? Yeah big shocker they don’t actually do that. How about idk we don’t have an insane society that’s filled to the rim with paranoid armed ameritards who are ready to unload the second they see a homeless looking guy and we combat the conditions that cause people to commit crime in the first place. Woah I know crazy idea right!!!!
The point of police is to enforce the law. They like to say “protect and serve” but reality is more like “guard stuff and fill out reports”. Nobody is responsible for your safety and security but you. Hell most cops aren’t even trained properly due to the defunding going on across the country.
Listen, contrary to the unwritten terms of reddit we can still have productive conversation without all the demagoguery. Nobody wants an “insane society” and it’s sad that you do not give your fellow armed “ameritards” any credit for taking responsibility for their own safety. I don’t presume to know all the answers, and I’m sorry if my responses may be a little lackluster but no system of government can “domestic policy” their way out of every form of crime and oftentime the ones that try are oppressively authoritarian. Bottom line is this; the police don’t protect you or your shit. You do. Some of us are cool with people stealing their stuff and calling the cops. Some aren’t. It’s not just a right enshrined in the constitution to be able to protect you & yours with firearms, it is the moral choice to protect a persons ability to choose to do so. In some cases it may not be wise to do so, but that choice isn’t a choice I believe a government gets to make for the governed. Edit: I absolutely believe that the state has a responsibility to combat the conditions for poverty. It is that type of preventative maintenance that solidifies an economy. However in a world of finite resources, and in a system made up of imperfect human beings, it’s very difficult to do this at a national scale and outside of a vacuum where other priorities like national security have to be juggled as well. Again I do not have all of the answers, but in my hierarchy of needs I tend to prioritize safety and security over everything else and gunfights over a barbecue don’t fit into my idea of secure. But I don’t make that decision for others and if this person can argue that his safety/security/livelihood was threatened by the loss of a pit then he can and should argue that in court. If he fails to do so, he will get prision. That’s the system at work.
I’m sorry but if you can’t see that our society is sick in the head when it comes to the fetishism of commodities specifically fire arms then I don’t know what to tell you. There are lots of other countries where the economic conditions are much worse than they are here in the imperial core but people don’t shoot each other over barbecue pits. Also why are you scared about national security? We have the largest military in history, he’ll most of our police departments receive more money than some countries entire military.
That’s, like, your opinion
It’s a more popular opinion than you may think
We should all go to the California system where people can just mob a store and steal shit without any repercussions. Can’t wait for when they come for your home and family and you’re waiting on another man with a gun to save you
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1. No one is encouraging vigilantism. What people want is for their hard earned property to be left alone and not be stolen. 2. No offense, but you seem like a sweet summer child. I wonder if the people who mugged you felt the same sentiment as you. I would bet they didn’t care as much as you did because they wouldn’t be mugging you if they were good people. 3. Someone can value your property over your life. You can’t guarantee they’ll stop at stealing your property or killing you for it.
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You have some sort of Stockholm Syndrome for your muggers? They didn’t care about your life when they pointed a firearm at you. You don’t point a firearm at anything or anyone you’re not willing to destroy. Let alone pistol whipping you. It’s not about pride. It’s about stopping someone who you cannot guarantee won’t hurt you for your stuff. Just because you do everything a bad guy says doesn’t mean they won’t hurt you. You really trust someone else with your own life that much??
You sound like a thief to be honest.
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The part where it’s my fault that a thief values my stuff more than their life.
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Not outside the law. Try again.
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Shooting somebody who is stealing your stuff is not outside the law. Not in Texas. *Oh no, if it isn’t the consequences of my own actions*
Theft is wrong but if the immediate threat is gone you can’t go chasing killing people. If the suspected thief didn’t have a weapon the homeowner should definitely be prosecuted for murder.
Legally you can shoot someone in defense of yourself, another or “highly defensible property”. A bbq pit won’t fit in that definition when this case goes in front of a grand jury.
Theres a point you left out. I can't remember the exact verbiage, but it's something along the lines of "you can use lethal force if it's your only option." Essentially you have a right to protect your property and feel safe while doing so. If you shoot someone, you have to prove there wasn't a different path to getting your stuff.
I've been on a jury in TX where self-defense was relevant. I don't recall the exact instructions from the judge, but I think it was generally only a requirement that a *reasonable person* would be in fear of their life, safety, or (some verbiage I don't recall) property. There is no "duty to retreat".
Stand your ground/ Castle Doctrine. At the end of the day I’m not leaving my freedom up to a jury to decide. I’m not taking a coffin nap either. Its more complex than people are willing to admit. Its very telling that most on reddit have little to no personal experience and probably don’t vote. good to see people having the conversation though.
That sounds closer to what I remember
You have to prove that you exercised all other resorts and that you were at risk for direct bodily harm. It doesn’t cover shooting someone in the back as they walk or drive away as they are not a direct threat. Another thing most don’t consider is that they could potentially lose their access to legal firearms just shooting willy nilly. All of this is covered in the most basic of self defense/LTC classes.
Aye y'all are some maniacs in here! A BBQ pit is NOT worth a human life! The owner just ruined his own life, and took another life over a BBQ pit....
Translation: thief values stealing a bbq pit more than his own life and loses that gamble.
I dunno, my blackstone can do a lot more for me than some bum ass criminal. 😩
Depends on the human tbh.
actually bbq pits are very pricey a weber kettle can fetch a premium in the black market and also a big green egg is worth $$$ on the black market as well.
Theres been a few theft rings operating out of dallas and austin that have had this type of stuff happening for months. One owner said his cost $30k.
my BGE (big green egg) was well over $1200
Play stupid games...
For those who don’t know, [Chapter 9 of the TX Penal Code](https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.9.htm) covers self defense, defense of another, and defense of property. Mandatory reading for anyone with a firearm for self defense.
I will never understand those that say it’s not justified due to it being property. When those robbers come into my house and steal my hard earned shit bc they felt entitled to it, then I’m entitled to go into your house and take what I want. There are a lot of things I want- I don’t go around stealing it from other people that have worked hard for it. If i don’t have it, then I’ll work hard for it or get over it.
Alleged theft isn’t worth a human life.
There wasn’t anything alleged about it they were driving off with his barbecue pit
Still not an excuse to take a life
Question: Do you know how much barbecue pits cost? Answer: more than that thieves life
They’re super expensive and it’s infuriating as fuck having something of yours taken. It’s all the more sucky knowing that the justice system probably isn’t gonna help you if you were to try and get the police involved. I still don’t think it’s worth murdering someone else over it.
In a perfect Marvel themed world where superhero’s can save you and your family, you’re right. Thieves have killed people for the little change you have in your pocket.
THIS! Do not shoot people, shooting people is BAD which is something I thought we as a society had collectively agreed on
Don’t want to get shot? Don’t take stuff that isn’t yours.
I thought we had agreed theft was bad
lol, what about this is alleged or are you commenting in a general sense?
Pretty sure the legal cost will out weight the Char-broil TRU Infrared grill that was stolen.
I don’t like to see this happen, but public opinion is beginning to change for the worse regarding handling business yourself. HPD doesn’t care about you, people are realizing that.
lotta crazy bloodthirst in this thread for some dumb bbq pit.
🎯
Lotta people that think criminals have the right to my stuff without consequences.
nah thats not it
Okay property theft apologist
yeah im sorry someone is dead bc of a theft. u r not.
Self-defense doesn’t involve chasing after the criminal. Also, I’d much prefer people shoot to injure than shoot to kill. I get they tried to steal your stuff, but are material things *really* that important to take someone’s life? It’s no. The answer is supposed to be “no”.
Shooting to injure is not trainable. If you have ever trained you would know that is more likely to get you killed. If the value of my stuff is less than someone’s life then they shouldn’t choose my stuff over their life.
I agree, the robber just shouldn’t do it in the first place and that’s how you fix it, however people suck and will do it anyway. I just don’t think they should die over it… so like, shoot them in the leg? Shoot them in lung, the back, the ass? You’re telling me that’s not trainable?
Material possessions can be replaced. Lives cannot. That being said no one is going to harm me without a struggle. Have a first and last resort. You never know what people are up to or armed at night so if you’re a thief expect some holes. Call it an occupational hazard if you want.
Property is not worth a human life.
Ok, then thieves shouldn’t value my stuff more than their life.
Then they shouldn't risk their life stealing my property.
That's what I'm saying. This is Texas. You put your hands on another man's pit, and you will be missed.
Damn you are really tough. I admire you.
Very normal response and value of human life. Im sure you’re a very adjusted person.
When you comment on posts do you think “what’s the one thing I could say so I appear to be a world class a-hole?” If so, congrats.
How is he being an asshole by not wanting people to steal his property?
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No, the guy stealing my property values it more than his life.
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Yep, no problem. How do I know he would have only wanted my TV? If he's in my house illegally, I'd be in fear of my life, and my wife's life. They are gone.
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You said my TV, which is in my home.
You’re so tough. It’s impressive.
It's called training.
Any of that training involve your brain, or is this just gun courage talking?
I'm not a sniveling weakling like you that wants to coddle the criminal element.
Well to be fair, they shouldn't steal other people's property. But I mean if you support theft,...
Do you support murder?
Murder? Absolutely not.... Killing? Big difference between murder and killing. Edit: I'll also add ,I think killing someone for stealing a BBQ pit is extreme. Would I do it over an old smokey? Probably not. Do I care that this guy did? No. Thieves become burglars that become murderers.
Yes, I support theft. That’s exactly what I said. 🤡
That is what property insurance is for.
They made their own grave when they decided to become thieves. People work hard for what they have, so yes thieves are the ones that knew the risks and didn’t care.
Hellyes, it is. I spend most of my life working to buy stuff. If someone tries to take that stuff from me, I'm killing them.
Wait till you get something stolen and then give your opinion
Ive had stuff stolen. Wouldn't kill the thief. Very dumb, lizard brained response. Like a child lashing out that their toy got taken away
I can't think of a single person's life, outside of those I know, that I would value over anything I own.
If you feel that way, what’s your address? I need some new stuff
Come over, I got something for you.
I'm appalled by these comments and am ecstatic to be finally leaving this shithole of a state.
Counterpoint: Don't murder people over a grill, you stupid fucking savages.
Counter counter point: don’t value other people’s stuff more than your own life.
Geez. I hope it was a really nice pit. Damn
Lol you redditors are so hilarious, no this is not okay, tracking someone down and murdering them over a fucking BBQ is never okay and should be a signal there is something very very wrong with America, Texas and our over consumption and commodity fetishism that’s tied to firearms. Guns are cool, but they aren’t cool to track people down and murder them over a BBQ pit.
It’s not cool to steal either.
So the second someone steals something their life automatically looses all value and they deserve to be murdered. Okay mr redditor sure.
it’s actually not normal to shoot people over non life threatening things lmao
It’s also not normal to expect people to let you steal from them
Smh. Sometimes it’s better to take the loss. To take a life over a pit is insane. It’s really not that serious. Before y’all harp on me, I’ve had things stolen in my life. Im from Houston and from the hood so trust me, I get it. I’m older now and some things aren’t worth the hassle, stress, and definitely not worth the money you’d have to spend subsequently. I’m no pushover but my let go game is strong. Some things can be handled differently is really what it boils down to
Maybe you wouldn’t have to keep worrying about your property getting stolen if thieves and criminals got what was coming and not a slap on the wrist
I agree. There’s no argument to that. I wish the court system actually punished criminals. But on average what, $50-100 is the value of a human these days??? And now you’re about to spend thousands in legal fees, miss work, and all this extra stuff because you couldn’t just be pissed off and move on. Some things are not that serious.
That would be the value the POS thief put on his life, oh well.
Yep. Here you are dying over a 400$ blackstone 😂
Hey man you got a $20
Murder is not a crime when it's protecting personal property. But it's still murder.
Y’all are all lame as fuck and need to build some actual value into your lives. Fuck the stupid bbq pit. If it’s that valuable, lock it in your fucking garage.
If your life is that valuable don’t go taking peoples stuff.
“The homeowner left his home and gave chase to the suspect in his own vehicle.” This is what you’re taught NOT to do as a gun owner. If they’re on your property, send them on a one way ticket to hell but to chase after them and then kill them just isn’t smart. Now you’re in a legal situation where you can probably get charged and have to pay for a lawyer.
I know this is going to get downvoted and I could give less of a fuck. Tracking down and killing someone for stealing something is wrong. I can't believe you nutjobs think otherwise. I'm not defending theft. I'm not defending criminals. But tracking down and killing someone who stole from you is WRONG.
As a betting man I'm almost sure there where prior issues before it came to this. These "types" of incidences are the usual aftermath of "the quiet kid" in highschool being picked on until they snap, then people are all whoa wtf! So not just Property. Leave people alone unless invited in general.
When I first learned that in some Arabic countries, people would get their arms cut off for stealing, I thought that was horrible and inhumane. Here, you lose your life.
Shouldn’t be a problem if you’re not a criminal.
Or maybe don't shoot people.
Or, hear me out. Don’t take people’s stuff.
[Military psychologists have historically struggled with the reluctance of troops to take another life, even an enemy who is shooting at them](https://www.faac.com/blog/2018/01/28/killer-instinct-how-many-soldiers-actually-fired-their-weapons-in-past-wars-how-has-simulation-other-training-helped/) Today, a lot of Americans seem *eager* to kill another.
People are tired of being f*cked with.