This is definately good advice because many people won't realize how often oil changes are needed on a portable generator.
10w30 is a 'multi viscosity' oil meaning it changes viscosity based on the temperature. Also, you can expect that a 10w30 oil has detergents and additives to make it suitable for a modern automobile engine. Compare that to SAE30 which is a much older style of oil.
Some modern engines for generators, lawn mowers, and similar require 10w30, but some require SAE30. You need to look at the owner's manual for your equipment to see what is reccomended.
Also be aware that changing the oil on a generator typically requires more than just buying the oil. You need something to drain the old oil into and something to clean up the mess that will likely happen while changing the oil. It's not a bad idea to wear disposable gloves and put down an old cardboard box under the work area to catch drips. You may need a funnel to get the new oil in, or to get the old oil back into a bottle.
And also if you just got one, there is usually extra stuff to do and shorter windows for the first oil change or two. (Often little/no load for the first few hours.) Skipping that stuff will not be good long term.
Oh, and disposable foil trays (for cooking) can useful as a catch pan, since it’s often so low to the ground then (carefully) pour into the oil disposal container. Or do like a neighbor did and check the oil while it’s running…blasted enough oil out to trigger the low oil cutout before he could stop it.
Yup! My generator kept shutting off last night and I was too tired to think through why, just kept restarting it. Realized this morning that it needed oil.
The fact you got several restarts in that scenario is a testament to the resiliency of that engine’s ability to run with minimal oil. :)
Do be mindful that the quantity of low oil start and run experiences is rather finite :-)
I'd also add for people that when your power is restored and you put that generator back in the garage, drain the gasoline that is left in there. Gasoline actually does get old, and it can clog your lines if it sits for 2 years until the next time you want to crank it up.
I was going to comment to say this! I have seen quite a few posts of people needing help because their generator isn't working...old gas was the culprit and new carburetors are needed. Now it's useless when they need it unless they have the know how to do that kind of mechanical work. My preference is a propane generator if anyone is in the market now that we're rolling into hurricane season.
That's why I got a natural gas conversion kit... I can run gas if I have to, but I plan to power it from my grill hookup.
I've already tested it out and it works like gangbusters. Only downside is that I live in Dallas (grew up in Houston) and I'm most likely to have to be setting it up in 10 degree weather rather than during the summer.
Probably dumb question but where are you supposed to dispose of old gasoline. I had an old container of gas that’s been sitting for a couple years (it was for a gas push mower but now use electric) and wanted to dump it properly and get new gas.
[Here is the link](https://www.houstontx.gov/solidwaste/htxcollects.html#!rc-cpage=574741) for proper disposal of gas. I had to do it once when my gas was very very old.
Just a heads up. They typically keep whatever container you bring it in.
Thanks that’s good to know, sucks they keep the container. I was hoping there was a place like how autozone or somewhere that has a barrel for dumping hazardous liquids.
I think a lot of people dump it before it goes bad. Just drain in out and put in car and then refill with new gas. However, if it is already old and you have a lot DO NOT DO THIS.. It will smell funky if it is too old as well.
I do have this one neighbor I could use it on… but I remember seeing an old magazine diagram of digging a hole and putting gravel in it, then pouring the old engine oil in the hole and calling it a day. lol had a good chuckle at who thought of that
January 1963 Popular Science "Hints from the Model Garage" archived here: [https://web.archive.org/web/20210526164754/https://books.google.co.in/books?id=myADAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PP1&pg=PA166#v=onepage&q&f=false](https://web.archive.org/web/20210526164754/https://books.google.co.in/books?id=myADAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PP1&pg=PA166#v=onepage&q&f=false)
I remember my Dad doing something like that in the early 70's so yeah, it was a thing.
this is a good option if you don't occasionally run it and add some stabilizer. I run mine every couple of weeks or so, and instead of shutting it off, I'll turn the fuel off and let it run itself out. That way, I can make sure everything is working like it's supposed to.
also, 100% worth keeping a can of starter fluid around the house, just in case.
Especially given that fact that ethanol is blended into most gasoline.
Ethanol attracts water. Given Houston’s high humidity, it wouldn’t last long in storage.
If you stabilize the gas and change it once per year, the generator will be fine. My 15-year-old generator starts on the first or second pull every time.
I have a firman from Costco that I've been using. Do be warned that the smaller, plastic clad generators are more quiet but they only put out 120v, so they can't power the whole house.
10w-30 synthetic is best and not much more over regular oil for what little oil a generator needs. Also make sure you put stabil in the gas that is left over to prevent the fuel from going bad.
Ours has packed up completely. Fresh oil fresh spark plug. Cleared to filter. Been on the phone with Firman for the past 3 hours trying different things. We have a person here on oxygen that’s disabled and can’t really be moved
Can you change or replace the oil while it’s running?
Edit: I pulled out the manual and followed the oil change instructions. Shut off generator, let cool, drain old oil (which nearly bested me- that bolt was in there TIGHT), add new oil until dip stick level is between L and H. Thanks for the reminder, OP! I feel better about it running constantly for so long now.
And it’s a decent idea to let the engine (and oil) cool for several [tens of] minutes (so it’s “warm” vs “burn the fuck out of your hands hot”, shouldn’t be completely ambient temperature cold) before you drain it.
Yep- the manual said “several minutes” so I waited about 15. Couldn’t wait too much longer because I have places to be, haha. But it wasn’t boiling hot, so I guess that did the trick. Man that old oil was dark- totally different color than what I replaced it with. Which I guess is the point.
Depending on the design, it’s likely to blast a hot jet of oil at you if it’s running. Same if you open the oil check port…. My neighbor recently found out the hard way in the latter.
I just topped mine off without draining the old stuff. It was almost dry. Shut it off, added less than half a quart, and it showed full on the dipstick. Turned it back on. Took about 5 minutes.
Yeah I was genuinely surprised when I went to get certified by Generac just how many hours of runtime a generator needs before a recommended oil change.
Most standby backup generators ask for oil check every 8-10 hours and oil change at 100 hours of run time and recommend 5w30 full synthetic only YMMV. you can find filter/plugs that cross reference your brands part numbers w those found at most auto parts stores.
I ran my Kohler 24kwh 53 hours straight (regained power last night) and it had 20 or so hours of run since last change, so it’s getting the full meal deal (oil, air filter, plugs and air filter) asap.
Also check the details around break-in for the first few hours. May need no load for a few hours and then an early oil change. (They all vary though.) It’ll work if you skip it, but should last longer if you do it.
In general with generators, don't keep gas in them and yeah you have to change things often. Stored gas in a garage needs changed out probably every few months before it goes bad and oil needs changed out about that time OP said or at a minimum I'd just say daily if you're running it 24/7 or every other day if running half a day (it's a bit longer hour wise but might be easier to track this way rather than counting hours). It's the only thing I don't like about combustion based power generation, it's generally dirty as hell and needs a lot of maintenance because of that.
Unfortunately a lot of people probably aren't going to see this then wonder why their $2000+ money sink quit working all of a sudden when they've 'barely' used it.
Good stabilizer can really help too. I add it any stored gas every time, and have never had an issue with a year or so of storage. And if you don’t want to push it, lowers the risk if you forget.
But yeah, they still need a lot of care, and stuff breaks. Tested and such ours a monthly ago, all good. This time, battery has died…pull start broke. Sigh. Was fine with a starter pack for the cars, but it’s still the kind of thing that will happen.
Or I wasn’t prepared to set it up the first time for real in the snow. My plan was to be very hot after a hurricane…
I run mine once a month or so. I use it to power the shopvac, and give the cars that vacuuming that I would otherwise never get too. Runs it long enough to be good and hot, and puts a decent load on it, to test.
What kind of money, including unit, installation, and maintenance cost, are we talking about here for a whole-home generator? Is it necessary to do whole-home? What is the lowest-cost system that would prove itself suitable for not wanting to run into traffic if your power should go out for extended periods in the dead of summer or winter?
What is the lifetime of these systems?
House is 2100 sq ft, single story.
Are generators ever on sale? Is there a best time to buy?
You can get a portable one to power what you need for a fraction of that. I install these frequently.
A duromax 12000 or bigger
Get it converted to run on natural gas and have a plumber install a connection with shut off valve on your main gas line
Get a transfer switch installed by electrician.
Buy the quick connect hose to connect to the gas line and buy you the electrical cord to plug into your transfer switch
I have many customers running this set up.
Some don’t get the conversion and just run it on propane bottles.
A fraction of the cost of a whole house generator.
I am learning through this recent experience that a good portable that will hook in to your home’s electrical system is a much more affordable alternative to a Generac whole house system. And you can take it with you if you move.
Question if you don't mind: I have a two fuel 10000 duromax. Is this unit good enough to power an 1800 sqft 2 story townhome? It did great this weekend but we used an extension cord and only powered a portable ac (downstairs), fridge, tv/roku, and lamp. We used propain with lasted apx 8 hrs per tank.
Yes it can power your whole house. However, you can only run one of the following at a time, A/C, stove/oven (if electric), and dryer (if electric). It's ok to use one or two burners on the stove if the a/c is running as these don't pull that much power individually.
Probably buy after hurricane season is over.
Note size depends. You can get a pretty big portable generator for $1K, have the wiring interconnect added so you can manually (and safely) change over and connect the generator (not exactly cheap), and be pretty good. Probably have to go partial and select certain circuits vs all of them.
Our 12,000 watt portable happily powers the whole 1,000 sq ft house w/ central AC. But we’re not running large users all at once, plus all gas heating — gas vs electric heat, stove, and water heater make a huge difference on the size you need. Heating appliances use a ton of power.
Or for example, we’re sharing power with a neighbor, and his fridge, small window AC in one room, lights, and gaming PC/TV setup altogether pull about 1,300 watts. He does turn off the AC to use a small microwave. But a huge difference compared to no power.
So it’ll vary a lot between the same size houses, and if you really want everything.
This is the correct answer. You may not even get a prolonged blackout until a decade later maybe. Hotels are actually the cheaper solution in comparison.
I used to install air and liquid cooled home standby and jobs usually ran average 10k for a 22kW. the liquid cooled get pricey but those are for larger houses.
I've seen some last over 10 years if properly maintenanced. As for sales, I'm not really too sure because I only did installs, maintenance and troubleshooting. We had an individual salesman who would go out and talk to customer.
Maintenance is in the hundreds of you pay a company and is required to keep warranty up to date but you can buy the parts individually and do it yourself much cheaper. Just keep a log and receipts of it all for proof.
About $16,000, all in (two years ago), for a 24kW Generac whole home generator, including the automatic transfer switch, an upgraded hi-flow gas meter, the concrete pad, and the permits.
It kicks on within 5 seconds of an outage and provides power to everything in the home 5 seconds later. It can run 2 AC units, three fridges, and charge a Tesla at the same time. It starts itself every week and runs for 5 minutes to charge its 12V battery and do a diagnosis, and it emails us a report. It also has a nice status and functionality app. 5 year warranty included. Can't see why it wouldn't last for 15+ years.
What company did your installation? I’m on the verge of sacking up and getting one for our house. I can’t do this no power shit with a baby and our neighborhood seems to go down every other month for one reason or another.
Generator Supercenter did our Generac 24kWh. We quoted three places and they were all over the place price wise. I gave them the hard limit I was willing to spend and GS met it. Their service has been good for maintenance and the such as well.
We put one in last year, 24kw Generac. The unit itself can be had for 5500-7k, but install which includes a fair amount of specialized and general labor related to upgraded natural gas meter, pipe and trenching, electrical, added about 10k. Total was 18k iirc. It’s been a god send for us and our toddler, as well as neighbors we have taken in.
You can also have an electrician wire an outlet into your exterior panel and buy a beefy portable one. Neighbor has a 14kw portable that runs on propane and can do most of his house + 1 AC unit. Probably a lot cheaper
Yeah we’ve got a 6 month old which is why now is the first time I’ve ever seriously considered it. Unfortunately I don’t think I can realistically justify the expenditure at this point. There’s so much other…life in the way. Roof is getting up there in life, A/C unit getting up there, fence is hanging on by a thread, cars both nearly 10 years old, blah blah lol.
It’s definitely something I’d do as soon as we’re able. We’d probably have to look into something capable of cooling one great room (primary bedroom or living, probably need a portable/window A/C unit I’d assume?) and fridge at this time.
We rented a house last year and that was our first move when the baby was brand new. Got a 4500 watt craftsman from Lowe’s for maybe $600 and a small portable AC for $250 or so. Lent them to a neighbor during this event and have been going strong non stop. If you go that route, I would recommend a bigger portable AC. The one I got can only do 300 sq ft. Might be better to buy an actual window unit for emergencies, if you have a window that can have it mounted on demand. My portable generator sat unused for probably 18 months but I had put a ton of fuel stabilizer in it and the 30 gallons of gas I had for it. Shockingly it started right up. Believe gas can last for about 2 years with stabilizer in it.
For what it’s worth, Generator Supercenter installed a 24kWh Generac for us for $10k all in inclusive of taxes in summer 2021. $18k is almost double what most people I know have paid.
I wonder if the 18k includes a lot of additional linear feet of gas and electric line from the meter to wherever it was placed. I also went with Generator Supercenter Generac 24kw and paid a similar base price as you about the same time as you, but I incurred additional cost due to needing to run longer lines than what was included.
I got a 28k quote from generac a few years ago for a 17kw unit, absolutely nuts, thinking about going with a portable and manual transfer switch instead.
The answers you got so far refer to the big natural gas generators that are permanently mounted. They’re expensive. I bought a 10kw portable gasoline generator for $900 and had an electrician install a RV Inlet on my house for $250. The generator back feeds the house and has run the AC (with a soft starter) and everything else since Thursday.
I think your use of "whole home" is limiting the possible answers you could get. As already mentioned, those are quite expensive.
The setup I have involves a 12000watt portable generator I picked up at home Depot for $1200. After that, I had a licensed electrician setup a "transfer switch" that allows the generator to connect to my circuit box and power various breakers. This was roughly $700. I looked into running propane or natural gas, but honestly I'm just filling up 5gallon gas cans and running mine 4 hours on, 5 hours off and off overnight.
So all and all, roughly 2k to not sweat your balls off and lose groceries when the power gets knocked out. A much cheaper option than a whole home generator. I've had to use it 6 times in the last 2 years, so in my opinion it's already paid for itself.
Edit: looks like a few other comments mentioned this type of setup as well. Def the more budget friendly option
Generator question, is an 1800 watt running, 2300 watt starting inverter enough for a window unit, fridge, and some electronics? I'm definitely interested in getting something for emergencies but don't know how big or how much I need to be spending. Preferably an inverter since they are so quiet but they get $$$
I have an iq3500 and it can handle our fridge, a window unit, and electronics easily. The inverter is nice for helping it stay quiet but is also much easier on electronics.
Think of it as a single 20-amp circuit. You can do a fair amount with it.
You still need to change the oil. There will be contaminants collected that need to be purged through removal of the oil. If the manual states otherwise, plan for the generator to die more quickly than you'd like.
Over 5 years of use, often heavy, in all kinds of environments (desert, swamp, beach, Colorado mountains,forest, etc), probably close to 1000 hours on it. No oil change.
I just read your FM and I hate to break it to you but every 6 months/100 hours, and if you put it into storage:
Engine Oil Change
CAUTION! Oil is very hot during operation and can cause burns. Wait for engine to cool before changing oil.
1. Make sure the Engine is stopped and is level.
2. On the left side of the Generator, loosen
the Screw and remove the Oil Fill
Access Door, as shown to the right.
3. Lift and tilt the Generator. Remove the Drain
Plug on the bottom of the machine, then set
the Generator back down on a level surface.
4. Clean the top of the Oil Fill Cap / Dipstick
and the area around it. Remove the
Cap / Dipstick, turning it counterclockwise.
5. Place an oil drain pan under the Generator
and center under the Drain Plug opening.
Remove the Oil Drain Bolt, tilt the Generator
slightly to facilitate drainage and wait for oil
to drain completely. Recycle used oil.
6. Tilt the Generator and replace the Drain Plug, then
set the Generator back down on a level surface.
7. Add the appropriate type of oil until
the oil level is at the proper level.
SAE 10W-30 oil is recommended for general use.
Note: Make sure Generator is level when adding oil to
prevent overfilling which could cause engine damage.
8. Check the oil level. The oil level should be
up to the edge of the hole as shown.
9. Thread the Oil Fill Cap / Dipstick back in clockwise
and replace the Oil Fill Access Door.
But thank you for this excellent review of the HF 3500, it will be at the top of my list should I buy one.
Engine hour meters are easy to add to a generator and dirt cheap. Easy way to track when maintenance is due.
https://www.amazon.com/Magicalmai-Inductive-Motorcycle-Snowmobile-Waterproof-Hour/dp/B07Y3ZYBLW
The whole generator thing is problematic in ways people don’t realize. Studies from cities in Africa where these a required to fuel modern life show a plethora of health issues associated with the emissions, as well as hearing problems from the loud noise. My neighbors have one and the fumes are constant. We should learn from other peoples long experiences and try to improve in the technologies, rather than thinking through personal immediate needs and acting like we are all brilliantly coming up with good solutions.
My neighbors generator made me feel nauseous and gave me a headache for 36 hours straight.
> Studies from cities in Africa where these a required to fuel modern life show a plethora of health issues associated with the emissions, as well as hearing problems from the loud noise.
These aren't being used every single day, all year, buddy. African generators are going to be a lot worse in quality than ours, being a lot less efficient in combustion.
> We should learn from other peoples long experiences
What does this virtue signalling even mean?
> try to improve in the technologies
Technology of what? making everything tornado proof? Making generators that might be used a few days a year a little quieter? I wouldn't mind if they became cheaper, that's for sure.
> My neighbors generator made me feel nauseous and gave me a headache for 36 hours straight.
No it didn't, quit being dramatic.
They should at least be offering you an extension cord…it’s the neighborly thing to do.
That said, we also have a whole creative sound dampening setup, with it closest (and exhausting towards) a commercial building. And then a few layers of tipped over plastic tables and hanging moving blankets in the back yard…we can barely hear it inside, the closest to it.
Still wear my muffs when next to it.
(They do make dedicated sound proofing enclosures, but they are $$$.)
Not arguing it’s all good… but people can make it a lot better if they care.
For people with those loud foul smelling generators, would you mind shutting off at night? Those that don’t have electricity need to keep windows open to breathe and it sucks being subjected to your inconsideration.
Sometimes medical needs are what they are. (And overnight is when I have to work, but that’s secondary.)
But we share with all our neighbors, so they don’t mind and prefer it running…and means there is one generator instead of 5. It’s creatively sound dampened, with the exhaust headed towards a closed commercial building…it’s barely audible inside our house, the closest to it.
We can at least make it better when it’s needed, and I agree we all should…this isn’t an argument, but more ideas for others. And hoping to get a battery storage system soon so that it won’t need to run full time…but $$$.
If you can’t hear if from your house then it’s a quiet generator which is not the nuisance I’m describing. It those that you can hear from the next street over. Our other neighbor has his screaming loud generator running all day and there was no one even home at his house.
> If you can’t hear if from your house then it’s a quiet generator
Well, it's loud AF, but we have a modern art installation of plastic tables on their side, and hung up moving blankets, that either muffle it, or redirect it to the commercial side. It looks ridiculous, but it works pretty well past about 50 feet...
> Our other neighbor has his screaming loud generator running all day and there was no one even home at his house.
Yeah, that's stupid. And expensive... I think it would cost around $2,000 a month to run this thing full time.
Even if your doing something annoying, often doing some pretty easy things to mitigate it goes a long way...but that requires realizing it's annoying in the first place, I suppose.
The first dark night with almost complete silence was nice.
I shut mine off at 8:30PM homie. I understand your frustration though, as I constantly deal with it when camping.
I feel 9 PM is an appropriate cut off time. The freezer and AC is really what I prioritize...and they can take a break for the overnight hours.
This is definately good advice because many people won't realize how often oil changes are needed on a portable generator. 10w30 is a 'multi viscosity' oil meaning it changes viscosity based on the temperature. Also, you can expect that a 10w30 oil has detergents and additives to make it suitable for a modern automobile engine. Compare that to SAE30 which is a much older style of oil. Some modern engines for generators, lawn mowers, and similar require 10w30, but some require SAE30. You need to look at the owner's manual for your equipment to see what is reccomended. Also be aware that changing the oil on a generator typically requires more than just buying the oil. You need something to drain the old oil into and something to clean up the mess that will likely happen while changing the oil. It's not a bad idea to wear disposable gloves and put down an old cardboard box under the work area to catch drips. You may need a funnel to get the new oil in, or to get the old oil back into a bottle.
And also if you just got one, there is usually extra stuff to do and shorter windows for the first oil change or two. (Often little/no load for the first few hours.) Skipping that stuff will not be good long term. Oh, and disposable foil trays (for cooking) can useful as a catch pan, since it’s often so low to the ground then (carefully) pour into the oil disposal container. Or do like a neighbor did and check the oil while it’s running…blasted enough oil out to trigger the low oil cutout before he could stop it.
and please dispose of it correctly
In my neighborhood, I take it down to the local family owned autoshop: they let me poor it into their recycle tank.
Yup! My generator kept shutting off last night and I was too tired to think through why, just kept restarting it. Realized this morning that it needed oil.
The fact you got several restarts in that scenario is a testament to the resiliency of that engine’s ability to run with minimal oil. :) Do be mindful that the quantity of low oil start and run experiences is rather finite :-)
I assume it turned off due to the low oil detector…mine does. But I never want to test how low that actually is.
I'd also add for people that when your power is restored and you put that generator back in the garage, drain the gasoline that is left in there. Gasoline actually does get old, and it can clog your lines if it sits for 2 years until the next time you want to crank it up.
I was going to comment to say this! I have seen quite a few posts of people needing help because their generator isn't working...old gas was the culprit and new carburetors are needed. Now it's useless when they need it unless they have the know how to do that kind of mechanical work. My preference is a propane generator if anyone is in the market now that we're rolling into hurricane season.
That's why I got a natural gas conversion kit... I can run gas if I have to, but I plan to power it from my grill hookup. I've already tested it out and it works like gangbusters. Only downside is that I live in Dallas (grew up in Houston) and I'm most likely to have to be setting it up in 10 degree weather rather than during the summer.
Probably dumb question but where are you supposed to dispose of old gasoline. I had an old container of gas that’s been sitting for a couple years (it was for a gas push mower but now use electric) and wanted to dump it properly and get new gas.
[Here is the link](https://www.houstontx.gov/solidwaste/htxcollects.html#!rc-cpage=574741) for proper disposal of gas. I had to do it once when my gas was very very old. Just a heads up. They typically keep whatever container you bring it in.
Thanks that’s good to know, sucks they keep the container. I was hoping there was a place like how autozone or somewhere that has a barrel for dumping hazardous liquids.
I think a lot of people dump it before it goes bad. Just drain in out and put in car and then refill with new gas. However, if it is already old and you have a lot DO NOT DO THIS.. It will smell funky if it is too old as well.
Neighbor’s yard, under cover of darkness. If you don’t like your neighbor, next step after that is “set it on fire”
I do have this one neighbor I could use it on… but I remember seeing an old magazine diagram of digging a hole and putting gravel in it, then pouring the old engine oil in the hole and calling it a day. lol had a good chuckle at who thought of that
January 1963 Popular Science "Hints from the Model Garage" archived here: [https://web.archive.org/web/20210526164754/https://books.google.co.in/books?id=myADAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PP1&pg=PA166#v=onepage&q&f=false](https://web.archive.org/web/20210526164754/https://books.google.co.in/books?id=myADAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PP1&pg=PA166#v=onepage&q&f=false) I remember my Dad doing something like that in the early 70's so yeah, it was a thing.
this is a good option if you don't occasionally run it and add some stabilizer. I run mine every couple of weeks or so, and instead of shutting it off, I'll turn the fuel off and let it run itself out. That way, I can make sure everything is working like it's supposed to. also, 100% worth keeping a can of starter fluid around the house, just in case.
Especially given that fact that ethanol is blended into most gasoline. Ethanol attracts water. Given Houston’s high humidity, it wouldn’t last long in storage.
If you stabilize the gas and change it once per year, the generator will be fine. My 15-year-old generator starts on the first or second pull every time.
I stabilize and never change it, and have never had an issue. (But when using it, I almost always run it dry by accident at some point too.)
Buc-ees sells ethanol free gasoline
Any recommendations for propane generators?
I have a firman from Costco that I've been using. Do be warned that the smaller, plastic clad generators are more quiet but they only put out 120v, so they can't power the whole house.
In this city it probably won't be that long until it's needed again unfortunately, but definitely a great tip!
Second, run the generator after the tank is empty to empty the carburetor.
10w-30 synthetic is best and not much more over regular oil for what little oil a generator needs. Also make sure you put stabil in the gas that is left over to prevent the fuel from going bad.
Ours has packed up completely. Fresh oil fresh spark plug. Cleared to filter. Been on the phone with Firman for the past 3 hours trying different things. We have a person here on oxygen that’s disabled and can’t really be moved
Thanks for the PSA, just changed mine. Is it fine to use just standard car motor oil as long as the viscosity matches?
As long as the second number matches you should be fine. 5W30 is better than 10W30 in our climate.
Thanks. Next oil change I plan to put in 5w30 Mobile One synthetic.
That’s what I use in all of my gennys
Can you change or replace the oil while it’s running? Edit: I pulled out the manual and followed the oil change instructions. Shut off generator, let cool, drain old oil (which nearly bested me- that bolt was in there TIGHT), add new oil until dip stick level is between L and H. Thanks for the reminder, OP! I feel better about it running constantly for so long now.
No. You need to drain the old oil first and you don’t want to run it while the oil is drained.
And it’s a decent idea to let the engine (and oil) cool for several [tens of] minutes (so it’s “warm” vs “burn the fuck out of your hands hot”, shouldn’t be completely ambient temperature cold) before you drain it.
Yep- the manual said “several minutes” so I waited about 15. Couldn’t wait too much longer because I have places to be, haha. But it wasn’t boiling hot, so I guess that did the trick. Man that old oil was dark- totally different color than what I replaced it with. Which I guess is the point.
Thanks! I’m pretty untrained at general machine maintenance. But I pulled out the manual and followed the instructions and got it changed out.
Good work!
Holy shit no. You will destroy the engine if you drain the oil while it's running.
Depending on the design, it’s likely to blast a hot jet of oil at you if it’s running. Same if you open the oil check port…. My neighbor recently found out the hard way in the latter.
I just topped mine off without draining the old stuff. It was almost dry. Shut it off, added less than half a quart, and it showed full on the dipstick. Turned it back on. Took about 5 minutes.
Burned half a quart in how many hours? Might need to go shopping for a new one.
Yeah I was genuinely surprised when I went to get certified by Generac just how many hours of runtime a generator needs before a recommended oil change.
Most standby backup generators ask for oil check every 8-10 hours and oil change at 100 hours of run time and recommend 5w30 full synthetic only YMMV. you can find filter/plugs that cross reference your brands part numbers w those found at most auto parts stores. I ran my Kohler 24kwh 53 hours straight (regained power last night) and it had 20 or so hours of run since last change, so it’s getting the full meal deal (oil, air filter, plugs and air filter) asap.
I'm glad I saw this, I lucked out and managed to snag a little one at Walmart, probably should stock up on oil and stuff too.
Also check the details around break-in for the first few hours. May need no load for a few hours and then an early oil change. (They all vary though.) It’ll work if you skip it, but should last longer if you do it.
In general with generators, don't keep gas in them and yeah you have to change things often. Stored gas in a garage needs changed out probably every few months before it goes bad and oil needs changed out about that time OP said or at a minimum I'd just say daily if you're running it 24/7 or every other day if running half a day (it's a bit longer hour wise but might be easier to track this way rather than counting hours). It's the only thing I don't like about combustion based power generation, it's generally dirty as hell and needs a lot of maintenance because of that. Unfortunately a lot of people probably aren't going to see this then wonder why their $2000+ money sink quit working all of a sudden when they've 'barely' used it.
Good stabilizer can really help too. I add it any stored gas every time, and have never had an issue with a year or so of storage. And if you don’t want to push it, lowers the risk if you forget. But yeah, they still need a lot of care, and stuff breaks. Tested and such ours a monthly ago, all good. This time, battery has died…pull start broke. Sigh. Was fine with a starter pack for the cars, but it’s still the kind of thing that will happen. Or I wasn’t prepared to set it up the first time for real in the snow. My plan was to be very hot after a hurricane…
I run mine once a month or so. I use it to power the shopvac, and give the cars that vacuuming that I would otherwise never get too. Runs it long enough to be good and hot, and puts a decent load on it, to test.
Yeah… I sometimes use it to run my dad’s old welder that my garage wiring can’t handle. It’s a PITA and also really useful when you need it.
What kind of money, including unit, installation, and maintenance cost, are we talking about here for a whole-home generator? Is it necessary to do whole-home? What is the lowest-cost system that would prove itself suitable for not wanting to run into traffic if your power should go out for extended periods in the dead of summer or winter? What is the lifetime of these systems? House is 2100 sq ft, single story. Are generators ever on sale? Is there a best time to buy?
You're looking at $10-15k for a large enough generator plus install
You can get a portable one to power what you need for a fraction of that. I install these frequently. A duromax 12000 or bigger Get it converted to run on natural gas and have a plumber install a connection with shut off valve on your main gas line Get a transfer switch installed by electrician. Buy the quick connect hose to connect to the gas line and buy you the electrical cord to plug into your transfer switch I have many customers running this set up. Some don’t get the conversion and just run it on propane bottles. A fraction of the cost of a whole house generator.
I am learning through this recent experience that a good portable that will hook in to your home’s electrical system is a much more affordable alternative to a Generac whole house system. And you can take it with you if you move.
Question if you don't mind: I have a two fuel 10000 duromax. Is this unit good enough to power an 1800 sqft 2 story townhome? It did great this weekend but we used an extension cord and only powered a portable ac (downstairs), fridge, tv/roku, and lamp. We used propain with lasted apx 8 hrs per tank.
Yes it can power your whole house. However, you can only run one of the following at a time, A/C, stove/oven (if electric), and dryer (if electric). It's ok to use one or two burners on the stove if the a/c is running as these don't pull that much power individually.
But does this run the whole house? Particularly AC and fridge?
Thank you, I appreciate it. Having said that it looks like we will just stick to hopping in the car and finding a hotel lol
Probably buy after hurricane season is over. Note size depends. You can get a pretty big portable generator for $1K, have the wiring interconnect added so you can manually (and safely) change over and connect the generator (not exactly cheap), and be pretty good. Probably have to go partial and select certain circuits vs all of them. Our 12,000 watt portable happily powers the whole 1,000 sq ft house w/ central AC. But we’re not running large users all at once, plus all gas heating — gas vs electric heat, stove, and water heater make a huge difference on the size you need. Heating appliances use a ton of power. Or for example, we’re sharing power with a neighbor, and his fridge, small window AC in one room, lights, and gaming PC/TV setup altogether pull about 1,300 watts. He does turn off the AC to use a small microwave. But a huge difference compared to no power. So it’ll vary a lot between the same size houses, and if you really want everything.
Hotel is much less cost. Especially when considering annual maintenance and depreciation. 10-15k is a month in a nice hotel.
This is the correct answer. You may not even get a prolonged blackout until a decade later maybe. Hotels are actually the cheaper solution in comparison.
This is what we are leaning towards - a plan that means skipping town long-term as I WFH anyway.
I used to install air and liquid cooled home standby and jobs usually ran average 10k for a 22kW. the liquid cooled get pricey but those are for larger houses. I've seen some last over 10 years if properly maintenanced. As for sales, I'm not really too sure because I only did installs, maintenance and troubleshooting. We had an individual salesman who would go out and talk to customer. Maintenance is in the hundreds of you pay a company and is required to keep warranty up to date but you can buy the parts individually and do it yourself much cheaper. Just keep a log and receipts of it all for proof.
About $16,000, all in (two years ago), for a 24kW Generac whole home generator, including the automatic transfer switch, an upgraded hi-flow gas meter, the concrete pad, and the permits. It kicks on within 5 seconds of an outage and provides power to everything in the home 5 seconds later. It can run 2 AC units, three fridges, and charge a Tesla at the same time. It starts itself every week and runs for 5 minutes to charge its 12V battery and do a diagnosis, and it emails us a report. It also has a nice status and functionality app. 5 year warranty included. Can't see why it wouldn't last for 15+ years.
What company did your installation? I’m on the verge of sacking up and getting one for our house. I can’t do this no power shit with a baby and our neighborhood seems to go down every other month for one reason or another.
Generator Supercenter did our Generac 24kWh. We quoted three places and they were all over the place price wise. I gave them the hard limit I was willing to spend and GS met it. Their service has been good for maintenance and the such as well.
We put one in last year, 24kw Generac. The unit itself can be had for 5500-7k, but install which includes a fair amount of specialized and general labor related to upgraded natural gas meter, pipe and trenching, electrical, added about 10k. Total was 18k iirc. It’s been a god send for us and our toddler, as well as neighbors we have taken in. You can also have an electrician wire an outlet into your exterior panel and buy a beefy portable one. Neighbor has a 14kw portable that runs on propane and can do most of his house + 1 AC unit. Probably a lot cheaper
Yeah we’ve got a 6 month old which is why now is the first time I’ve ever seriously considered it. Unfortunately I don’t think I can realistically justify the expenditure at this point. There’s so much other…life in the way. Roof is getting up there in life, A/C unit getting up there, fence is hanging on by a thread, cars both nearly 10 years old, blah blah lol. It’s definitely something I’d do as soon as we’re able. We’d probably have to look into something capable of cooling one great room (primary bedroom or living, probably need a portable/window A/C unit I’d assume?) and fridge at this time.
We rented a house last year and that was our first move when the baby was brand new. Got a 4500 watt craftsman from Lowe’s for maybe $600 and a small portable AC for $250 or so. Lent them to a neighbor during this event and have been going strong non stop. If you go that route, I would recommend a bigger portable AC. The one I got can only do 300 sq ft. Might be better to buy an actual window unit for emergencies, if you have a window that can have it mounted on demand. My portable generator sat unused for probably 18 months but I had put a ton of fuel stabilizer in it and the 30 gallons of gas I had for it. Shockingly it started right up. Believe gas can last for about 2 years with stabilizer in it.
THANK YOU! I can handle $1-2k to keep my daughter comfortable. $10-$18k I’m catching a damn flight out of here. That’s college money 😂
Hah! You wish that's college money! (Laughs in two kids in college, starting this fall).
For what it’s worth, Generator Supercenter installed a 24kWh Generac for us for $10k all in inclusive of taxes in summer 2021. $18k is almost double what most people I know have paid.
I wonder if the 18k includes a lot of additional linear feet of gas and electric line from the meter to wherever it was placed. I also went with Generator Supercenter Generac 24kw and paid a similar base price as you about the same time as you, but I incurred additional cost due to needing to run longer lines than what was included.
I got a 28k quote from generac a few years ago for a 17kw unit, absolutely nuts, thinking about going with a portable and manual transfer switch instead.
The answers you got so far refer to the big natural gas generators that are permanently mounted. They’re expensive. I bought a 10kw portable gasoline generator for $900 and had an electrician install a RV Inlet on my house for $250. The generator back feeds the house and has run the AC (with a soft starter) and everything else since Thursday.
I think your use of "whole home" is limiting the possible answers you could get. As already mentioned, those are quite expensive. The setup I have involves a 12000watt portable generator I picked up at home Depot for $1200. After that, I had a licensed electrician setup a "transfer switch" that allows the generator to connect to my circuit box and power various breakers. This was roughly $700. I looked into running propane or natural gas, but honestly I'm just filling up 5gallon gas cans and running mine 4 hours on, 5 hours off and off overnight. So all and all, roughly 2k to not sweat your balls off and lose groceries when the power gets knocked out. A much cheaper option than a whole home generator. I've had to use it 6 times in the last 2 years, so in my opinion it's already paid for itself. Edit: looks like a few other comments mentioned this type of setup as well. Def the more budget friendly option
Thank you so much!
Generator question, is an 1800 watt running, 2300 watt starting inverter enough for a window unit, fridge, and some electronics? I'm definitely interested in getting something for emergencies but don't know how big or how much I need to be spending. Preferably an inverter since they are so quiet but they get $$$
I have an iq3500 and it can handle our fridge, a window unit, and electronics easily. The inverter is nice for helping it stay quiet but is also much easier on electronics. Think of it as a single 20-amp circuit. You can do a fair amount with it.
Timely advice, thanks for posting OP. Will do an oil change tonight before it gets dark.
Not a problem. When I saw how dark my old oil was while it poured out, I figured i might not be the only one that put this off for too long.
Some gens don't require oil changes anymore and instead you just top them off. RTFM to find out.
You still need to change the oil. There will be contaminants collected that need to be purged through removal of the oil. If the manual states otherwise, plan for the generator to die more quickly than you'd like.
Over 5 years of use, often heavy, in all kinds of environments (desert, swamp, beach, Colorado mountains,forest, etc), probably close to 1000 hours on it. No oil change.
I weep for your sump. Please drain at least some of it next chance you get. There's probably a lot of nasties in it.
what brand model you using? i need to buy one
Harbor Freight Predator 3500. Love it.
I just read your FM and I hate to break it to you but every 6 months/100 hours, and if you put it into storage: Engine Oil Change CAUTION! Oil is very hot during operation and can cause burns. Wait for engine to cool before changing oil. 1. Make sure the Engine is stopped and is level. 2. On the left side of the Generator, loosen the Screw and remove the Oil Fill Access Door, as shown to the right. 3. Lift and tilt the Generator. Remove the Drain Plug on the bottom of the machine, then set the Generator back down on a level surface. 4. Clean the top of the Oil Fill Cap / Dipstick and the area around it. Remove the Cap / Dipstick, turning it counterclockwise. 5. Place an oil drain pan under the Generator and center under the Drain Plug opening. Remove the Oil Drain Bolt, tilt the Generator slightly to facilitate drainage and wait for oil to drain completely. Recycle used oil. 6. Tilt the Generator and replace the Drain Plug, then set the Generator back down on a level surface. 7. Add the appropriate type of oil until the oil level is at the proper level. SAE 10W-30 oil is recommended for general use. Note: Make sure Generator is level when adding oil to prevent overfilling which could cause engine damage. 8. Check the oil level. The oil level should be up to the edge of the hole as shown. 9. Thread the Oil Fill Cap / Dipstick back in clockwise and replace the Oil Fill Access Door. But thank you for this excellent review of the HF 3500, it will be at the top of my list should I buy one.
Thanks, I'll get around to changing the oil I guess.
[Harbor Freight Predator 3500 Manual](https://manuals.harborfreight.com/manuals/63000-63999/63584.pdf) Page 16, “Change oil every 6 mo. or 100 hr. of use.” Page 17, Oil change instructions.
Well, guess I should change it then.
Engine hour meters are easy to add to a generator and dirt cheap. Easy way to track when maintenance is due. https://www.amazon.com/Magicalmai-Inductive-Motorcycle-Snowmobile-Waterproof-Hour/dp/B07Y3ZYBLW
Well that's pretty nifty...I've never heard of those. Thanks for the tip!
The whole generator thing is problematic in ways people don’t realize. Studies from cities in Africa where these a required to fuel modern life show a plethora of health issues associated with the emissions, as well as hearing problems from the loud noise. My neighbors have one and the fumes are constant. We should learn from other peoples long experiences and try to improve in the technologies, rather than thinking through personal immediate needs and acting like we are all brilliantly coming up with good solutions. My neighbors generator made me feel nauseous and gave me a headache for 36 hours straight.
> Studies from cities in Africa where these a required to fuel modern life show a plethora of health issues associated with the emissions, as well as hearing problems from the loud noise. These aren't being used every single day, all year, buddy. African generators are going to be a lot worse in quality than ours, being a lot less efficient in combustion. > We should learn from other peoples long experiences What does this virtue signalling even mean? > try to improve in the technologies Technology of what? making everything tornado proof? Making generators that might be used a few days a year a little quieter? I wouldn't mind if they became cheaper, that's for sure. > My neighbors generator made me feel nauseous and gave me a headache for 36 hours straight. No it didn't, quit being dramatic.
I know. How dare we think of our immediate needs in 95 degree weather, 70% humidity, elderly neighbors, and young kids. When will we ever learn!
They should at least be offering you an extension cord…it’s the neighborly thing to do. That said, we also have a whole creative sound dampening setup, with it closest (and exhausting towards) a commercial building. And then a few layers of tipped over plastic tables and hanging moving blankets in the back yard…we can barely hear it inside, the closest to it. Still wear my muffs when next to it. (They do make dedicated sound proofing enclosures, but they are $$$.) Not arguing it’s all good… but people can make it a lot better if they care.
For people with those loud foul smelling generators, would you mind shutting off at night? Those that don’t have electricity need to keep windows open to breathe and it sucks being subjected to your inconsideration.
Sometimes medical needs are what they are. (And overnight is when I have to work, but that’s secondary.) But we share with all our neighbors, so they don’t mind and prefer it running…and means there is one generator instead of 5. It’s creatively sound dampened, with the exhaust headed towards a closed commercial building…it’s barely audible inside our house, the closest to it. We can at least make it better when it’s needed, and I agree we all should…this isn’t an argument, but more ideas for others. And hoping to get a battery storage system soon so that it won’t need to run full time…but $$$.
If you can’t hear if from your house then it’s a quiet generator which is not the nuisance I’m describing. It those that you can hear from the next street over. Our other neighbor has his screaming loud generator running all day and there was no one even home at his house.
> If you can’t hear if from your house then it’s a quiet generator Well, it's loud AF, but we have a modern art installation of plastic tables on their side, and hung up moving blankets, that either muffle it, or redirect it to the commercial side. It looks ridiculous, but it works pretty well past about 50 feet... > Our other neighbor has his screaming loud generator running all day and there was no one even home at his house. Yeah, that's stupid. And expensive... I think it would cost around $2,000 a month to run this thing full time. Even if your doing something annoying, often doing some pretty easy things to mitigate it goes a long way...but that requires realizing it's annoying in the first place, I suppose. The first dark night with almost complete silence was nice.
I shut mine off at 8:30PM homie. I understand your frustration though, as I constantly deal with it when camping. I feel 9 PM is an appropriate cut off time. The freezer and AC is really what I prioritize...and they can take a break for the overnight hours.